[MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 0

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

https://charleston.craigslist.org/pts/d/charleston-2005-mercedes-benz-whole-car/7006278155.html

--
--FT


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[MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 1

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

https://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/pts/d/myrtle-beach-2006-mercedes-been-wrecked/6999596770.html

--
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] Nuts

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

The court consists of nuts

If the car was roadworthy when it went in, it should be as roadworthy or 
MORE when it leaves the shop.


Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:20 PM:

Does Tire Rotation Include Tightening Lug Nuts? Michigan Court Thinks About It 
For Awhile, Concludes 'No'

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/does-tire-rotation-include-tightening-lug-nuts-michigan-court-thinks-about-it-for-awhile-concludes-no/ar-AAJcuaB





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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

THeisen's farm store uses the torque wrench, and I have seen them look 
up the spec.   Once in Wallyland, I think maybe the one up in Mitch's 
part of the world, i saw them use a torque wrench.


Peter Frederick via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:25 PM:

I recommended my favorite tire shop (and he plans to replace all the studs on 
the front, both sides).  I've been using my tire place for about 20 years now, 
putting tires on four cars on a regular basis, so does my brother -- they know 
us by name now.

Firestone dealer, although they will get anything you want.  Sold me on their service two 
ways -- once I wanted a particular tire and their response was "we don't like those 
much, too many complaints".  Nuff said, if they keep coming back to the dealer I 
don't want them either.  Second reason is that I've never had any difficulty at all 
removing lug bolts with the short wrench supplied with the car.  They use a torque wrench 
to put them on, properly.






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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

I sent ya off for research, huh?  Good job!

BTW the book "12 is Enough" is entertaining.  It is about the Gilbreth 
family.


Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:36 PM:

On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 20:46:43 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:


Q: Why are many of the US built wretched ricebox cars better
built/reliable than American iron and the Alabama spawn of of DBAG?

A:  Because W Edwards Deming was asked by the Japanese to help them
build better products.  He taught them well.  He also taught the
Americans during WWII.  After the war, the American companies threw out
what he taught them and the women who did the SPC in the plants.   They
went back to therbligs.   The american bean counters liked therbligs.
They were still using therbligs in the 70s and into the 80s.  The
Japanese listened well,  learned well, and did NOT throw out the
systems, but improved on them.   Look up the case of the Ford
transmissions built by mazda in the 80s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therblig




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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

My tire guys use a torque wrench *and* a second tech to verify the torque, both 
of which sign off on the work order.

-D

> On Oct 25, 2019, at 9:14 AM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> THeisen's farm store uses the torque wrench, and I have seen them look up the 
> spec.   Once in Wallyland, I think maybe the one up in Mitch's part of the 
> world, i saw them use a torque wrench.
> 
> Peter Frederick via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:25 PM:
>> I recommended my favorite tire shop (and he plans to replace all the studs 
>> on the front, both sides).  I've been using my tire place for about 20 years 
>> now, putting tires on four cars on a regular basis, so does my brother -- 
>> they know us by name now.
>> 
>> Firestone dealer, although they will get anything you want.  Sold me on 
>> their service two ways -- once I wanted a particular tire and their response 
>> was "we don't like those much, too many complaints".  Nuff said, if they 
>> keep coming back to the dealer I don't want them either.  Second reason is 
>> that I've never had any difficulty at all removing lug bolts with the short 
>> wrench supplied with the car.  They use a torque wrench to put them on, 
>> properly.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
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[MBZ] OT Nice looking Jagyoowahhhh

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

Not a bad price

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2604774982922001/

1984 Jaguar XJ
Myrtle Beach, SC· 20 hours ago 
· 


$1,800

 * About This Vehicle

 *
 o

 o Driven 97,300 miles
 *
 o

 o Automatic transmission
 *
 o

 o Exterior color: Green · Interior color: Tan
 *
 o

 o Very good condition
   

Seller's Description

*runs & drives great! *clean title *new tires *new radiator *new gas 
tank *new stereo *new belts *cold a/c *everything works great. * if 
still posted, i still have it. *daily driver *beautiful car ASKING $1800 
or best offer. LOCATION: 1020 s. Poplar drive Surfside Beach SC, 29575 
Less 


--
--FT

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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

What sold me on German machinery is the "crack" noise of the high 
quality DIN bolt when you loosen it.  I had just worked on a stinking 
hondog 305 engine, is which every phillips bolt was soft, rounded off or 
broke.    I don't believe the ISO bolts forced on the Germans by the 
frogs are as good.


Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:59 PM:

I worked on several MBs over the years, all of them decades old, and
never broke a bolt with hand tools.

Allan



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Re: [MBZ] OT Nice looking Jagyoowahhhh

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Tan leather and green paint would be perfect.
If the engine conks out, do you still have Wilton's showroom perfect OM603?

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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

At my Wallyworld, they aren't necessarily the sharpest tools in the shed.

Let's say your torque spec is 90 ft-lb.
They get out the rattle wrench and the 90 ft-lb springy socket.
They don't know or care if the wrench is more powerful than the torque limiter 
was made for. 
They hammer the lugs down nice and tight. 
They get out the clicker torque wrench and it clicks on every lug without 
moving any of them. 
Then they go out in the parking lot and do some autocross.
Bring the car back in and use the torque wrench again. 
Nope of the lugs move during torquing. Perfect! Every lug is exactly torqued to 
90 ft-lb, and their torque wrench proved it. I talked to the girl doing the 
torquing and she truly believed it. 

The system works for them, because it's impossible to break a lug with the 
limiter, and it's impossible to undertorque and have the lugs fall off unless 
you skip multiple steps in the procedure. So it's superior to the procedure 
used at every Chevy dealer when they do oil change&rotation.
Thanks, but no thanks. Next time I'll just bring you the wheel.


> On October 25, 2019 at 9:14 AM Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> THeisen's farm store uses the torque wrench, and I have seen them look 
> up the spec.   Once in Wallyland, I think maybe the one up in Mitch's 
> part of the world, i saw them use a torque wrench.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Nice looking Jagyoowahhhh

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Price is about right.  My ex sold her perfect condition low miles XJ for
$2800 8 years ago.  The jumbo leaping cat hood ornament is an upgrade.

On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 9:33 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>
> Tan leather and green paint would be perfect.
> If the engine conks out, do you still have Wilton's showroom perfect OM603?
>
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Re: [MBZ] Nuts

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

A new user for the term "Nuts to you!".

Max Dillon
Charleston SC

Thu Oct 24 23:21:13 EDT 2019 Mitch Haley via Mercedes :
 
> Does Tire Rotation Include Tightening Lug Nuts? Michigan Court Thinks About 
> It For Awhile, Concludes 'No' 
> 
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/does-tire-rotation-include-tightening-lug-nuts-michigan-court-thinks-about-it-for-awhile-concludes-no/ar-AAJcuaB
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Car fun for the day

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 I think that might be what I'm fighting on Angie's Golf. Something in the 
turbo control circuit has gone wrong, it'll have turbo sometimes and its a 
rocketship, then no turbo and its a slug.I need to put the computer on it, I'm 
hoping for just a vacuum leak. I did test the actuator on the turbo and that 
both moves and holds vacuum which is a good thing.
-Curt

On Thursday, October 24, 2019, 11:37:00 PM EDT, Peter Frederick via 
Mercedes  wrote:  
 
 Finally got around to putting the new N75 turbo boost control vacuum solenoid 
on the Golf.  Naturally, while it's the correct design, it's not the correct 
part, the hose connections for vac source and turbo actuator line are on the 
wrong side, and the wire isn't long enough to put it on backwards.

For some reason, VW used the same valve in a different physical configuration 
on the ALH engine (injection pump) than on the BEW (unit injector or PD) 
engine.  Same turbo, same valve in the same spot, different vac line 
configuration, and I wasn't willing to find vac line and barbs to cobble up 
something.  So I had to order another one with the fittings on one side.  Same 
valve, just has the cap crimped on 180 degrees out.

Old one is definitely shot, I can blow through it so it's both not operating 
the turbo AND venting the vac off for the EGR and anti-backrunning valve.  

Hope to have the new one on Sat, but it may be Monday.  Another weekend with a 
very sluggish car
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Re: [MBZ] Nuts

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

On a related note, Anybody know where to buy the little black nylon nut
that holds the fuel pump shield onto the bottom of a w124 ahead of the
right rear wheel?

On Fri, Oct 25, 2019, 6:54 AM Max Dillon via Mercedes 
wrote:

>
> A new user for the term "Nuts to you!".
>
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
>
> Thu Oct 24 23:21:13 EDT 2019 Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com>:
>
> > Does Tire Rotation Include Tightening Lug Nuts? Michigan Court Thinks
> About It For Awhile, Concludes 'No'
> >
> >
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/does-tire-rotation-include-tightening-lug-nuts-michigan-court-thinks-about-it-for-awhile-concludes-no/ar-AAJcuaB
> >
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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

I know many of you are not fond of Asian cars, but I have to defend them 
somewhat. We have a 2007 Honda Accord that has served us very well so 
far. It is my wife's car and she drives it hard. We acquired it a year 
old in 2008 with 23K miles on it and it now has about 80K miles on it - 
almost all of which are short in town trips. We have done pretty much 
nothing but things like tires, brakes, a battery, and a starter (and I 
am not truly convinced it needed the starter). There is no rust. It 
basically looks like it did when we acquired it. The body is tight - no 
rattles and the interior is standing up very well. Some little plastic 
latch has given up in a swing up door in the center console but I cannot 
think of anything else in the interior that is not like it was when we 
got it. Things like the struts still appear to be fine.


I think that is good service.

Randy


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Re: [MBZ] OT Nice looking Jagyoowahhhh

[Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes]

Yeah max still has it. I have a 350 in the garage!

--FT
Sent from iPhone

> On Oct 25, 2019, at 9:32 AM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Tan leather and green paint would be perfect.
> If the engine conks out, do you still have Wilton's showroom perfect OM603?
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Nuts

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Ace Hardware or a dealer. Get a handful, they use them all over the place, 
mostly under the car and in the wheel wells on later models.

-D

> On Oct 25, 2019, at 11:35 AM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> On a related note, Anybody know where to buy the little black nylon nut
> that holds the fuel pump shield onto the bottom of a w124 ahead of the
> right rear wheel?
> 
>> On Fri, Oct 25, 2019, 6:54 AM Max Dillon via Mercedes 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> A new user for the term "Nuts to you!".
>> 
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> 
>> Thu Oct 24 23:21:13 EDT 2019 Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com>:
>> 
>>> Does Tire Rotation Include Tightening Lug Nuts? Michigan Court Thinks
>> About It For Awhile, Concludes 'No'
>>> 
>>> 
>> https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/does-tire-rotation-include-tightening-lug-nuts-michigan-court-thinks-about-it-for-awhile-concludes-no/ar-AAJcuaB
>>> 
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>>> 
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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

I am not a brand snob by any sense. I’ve owned several Asian cars (Nissan, 
Mazda) and been quite pleased with them and would not hesitate to buy another 
should the need for a basic, “gas and go” reliable low maintenance surface.

Our 2005 Mazda 6 went 160k in around 10 years time. Other than a couple of COPs 
and normal maintenance I never had to do a thing to that car. The wife drive 
it, so it got thrashed severely, too.

2001 Altima was bought new and lasted until 2010 with around 120k on the clock. 
Grandpa in a little truck T-boned it and it got totaled out. Other than 
maintenance I never had to repair a thing on it that I recall.

I would buy another current model of either without a second thought.

-D

> On Oct 25, 2019, at 11:39 AM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I know many of you are not fond of Asian cars, but I have to defend them 
> somewhat. We have a 2007 Honda Accord that has served us very well so far. It 
> is my wife's car and she drives it hard. We acquired it a year old in 2008 
> with 23K miles on it and it now has about 80K miles on it - almost all of 
> which are short in town trips. We have done pretty much nothing but things 
> like tires, brakes, a battery, and a starter (and I am not truly convinced it 
> needed the starter). There is no rust. It basically looks like it did when we 
> acquired it. The body is tight - no rattles and the interior is standing up 
> very well. Some little plastic latch has given up in a swing up door in the 
> center console but I cannot think of anything else in the interior that is 
> not like it was when we got it. Things like the struts still appear to be 
> fine.
> 
> I think that is good service.
> 
> Randy
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

Not all lug bolts are junk. You might recall my story of a year or more 
back relating to my 2013 F150 Supercrew. Someone removed all of the lug 
nuts on one side of the truck except for the locking lug nuts. I guess 
trying to steal the wheels and tires. They did not get the locking lugs 
off but they took all of the lug nuts that they removed. They also tried 
to get the spare tire as they pried out the locking doo-dad in the rear 
bumper. Obviously amateurs who came unprepared or they would have either 
had the right tools or would have looked for a vehicle without the 
locking lug nuts. In any event, I drove the truck about 150 miles at 
highway speeds with only 1 lug holding on each of the driver's side 
wheels. They did not break thankfully.


Randy



On 24/10/2019 10:59 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote:

Peter Frederick via Mercedes  writes:


Speaking of junk, a friend of mine had the wheel fall off of his 07 Pontiac G6 
(same as a Chebbie Malibu, a car I destest) the other day.  Lug bolts. all 5, 
broke off.  In the nearly 50 years I've been driving and paying attention to 
cars, I've never seen all five lug bolts fail that way, in fact I have NEVER 
seen a broken lug bolt that wasn't severely abused by using a 10ft cheater bar 
or something similar.

Seems this isn't at all uncommon, all the parts places stock replacement lug 
studs!  How did we unlearn how to make decent lug studs?

Interesting you bring that up, as it's the current (and maybe last)
battle I'm engaged in with the Focus. Started with a flat tire on the
driver's side rear wheel. Boy drove it about a mile before realizing
something "didn't feel right," so tire ruined. Trying to loosen the lug
nuts (with the stock tire wrench), and one of the lug studs breaks
off. Get the other three off (barely) and put the donut on with the
three nuts to get home.

On the Focus, the lug studs are pressed into the brake drum. So tried to
remove the drum, thinking I'd press out the broken stud and press in a
new one ($1.99 part, that tells you something right there).

Youtube make it look easy: remove the center nut, pull the drum
off. Only it doesn't come off. Not even a little bit. With the help of a
wheel puller and a hammer I finally get it off, to find that the bearing
has come apart. The inner bearing race is still siezed to the spindle
shaft. So, bearing ruined, and drum effectively ruined, because the
bearing is integral to the drum. The spindle is galled where the bearing
was siezed. So I decide to replace the spindle as well. It's held on
with four bolts. In taking those out with a hand ratchet wrench with a
short (10") pipe on the handle, one of those bolts breaks.

So now, a flat tire results in needing a new drum, new lug nuts, new
spindle, and new spindle bolts. Not to mention the new tire. Only
consolation is that had the car gone to the shop I'd probably be looking
at a bill that would excede the value of the car.

I worked on several MBs over the years, all of them decades old, and
never broke a bolt with hand tools.

Allan






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[MBZ] Okie S430

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Bottom feeder time...

https://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/cto/d/valrico-2002-mercedes-s430/7006862271.html

-D
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Re: [MBZ] Nuts

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 08:34:23 -0700 Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
 wrote:

> On a related note, Anybody know where to buy the little black nylon nut
> that holds the fuel pump shield onto the bottom of a w124 ahead of the
> right rear wheel?

Searching on Amazon, both with their search engine and with DuckDuckGo,
was an exercise in frustration. All they wanted to present were steel
nuts with nylon locking inserts.

I found this place:

https://www.plasticnutsandbolts.com/fastenerkitsz.html
https://www.plasticnutsandbolts.com/metricnylonhexnutsz.html


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 1

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 09:02:52 -0400 Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
 wrote:

> https://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/pts/d/myrtle-beach-2006-mercedes-been-wrecked/6999596770.html

At first, I thought there was something wrong with the tire in
https://images.craigslist.org/00m0m_fyl0USUgJrh_600x450.jpg,
but they are all like that!

Rubber-band tires, indeed!


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 1

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

The cool factor
Dwight E. Giles Jr.
Wickford RI


On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 2:12 PM Craig via Mercedes 
wrote:

> On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 09:02:52 -0400 Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
>  wrote:
>
> >
> https://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/pts/d/myrtle-beach-2006-mercedes-been-wrecked/6999596770.html
>
> At first, I thought there was something wrong with the tire in
> https://images.craigslist.org/00m0m_fyl0USUgJrh_600x450.jpg,
> but they are all like that!
>
> Rubber-band tires, indeed!
>
>
> Craig
>
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 1

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 14:14:23 -0400 Dwight Giles 
wrote:

> The cool factor
> Dwight E. Giles Jr.
> Wickford RI

But how cool is it to have to put up with lots of road noise and then pay
to replace the rims, which are undoubtedly quite expensive, because you
went over a bump too fast?


Craig


> On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 2:12 PM Craig via Mercedes
>  wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 09:02:52 -0400 Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> >
> > https://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/pts/d/myrtle-beach-2006-mercedes-been-wrecked/6999596770.html
> >
> > At first, I thought there was something wrong with the tire in
> > https://images.craigslist.org/00m0m_fyl0USUgJrh_600x450.jpg,
> > but they are all like that!
> >
> > Rubber-band tires, indeed!

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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 08:18:46 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:

> I sent ya off for research, huh?  Good job!

Thank you.

What all this shows is the Gilbreths were interested in making things more
efficiently and faster.

What Deming was interested in was making quality things.

All the difference in the world! I will take quality over faster.


I'm struggling with that right now on our Kenworth W900. After 18 years,
the rubber tubing in the water valve for the cab's heater failed. I
purchased the "replacement" for it last year when The Shop in Moriarty
fixed the no-heat problem. That valve has now failed.

The original valve had a durable non-metallic material body onto which
the copper inlet and outlet hose barbs (with square flanges of the same
type durable non-metalic material) fastened to the body with four screws.

The "replacement" was all made of some type of hard plastic, with one of
the plastic water barb molded to the body and the other plastic water barb
pressing into the body and an internal molded neoprene "o-ring". I'm not
sure how it was supposed to be fastened into the body, since I have only
looked closely at it since it failed: The separate plastic hose barb came
loose from the body and started leaking profusely.

I can take and send pictures if y'all are interested.

I'm still looking for a good solution.


Craig


> BTW the book "12 is Enough" is entertaining.  It is about the Gilbreth 
> family.
> 
> Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:36 PM:
> > On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 20:46:43 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> >
> >> Q: Why are many of the US built wretched ricebox cars better
> >> built/reliable than American iron and the Alabama spawn of of DBAG?
> >>
> >> A:  Because W Edwards Deming was asked by the Japanese to help them
> >> build better products.  He taught them well.  He also taught the
> >> Americans during WWII.  After the war, the American companies threw
> >> out what he taught them and the women who did the SPC in the plants.
> >>   They went back to therbligs.   The american bean counters liked
> >> therbligs. They were still using therbligs in the 70s and into the
> >> 80s.  The Japanese listened well,  learned well, and did NOT throw
> >> out the systems, but improved on them.   Look up the case of the Ford
> >> transmissions built by mazda in the 80s.
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therblig

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Re: [MBZ] My crack-addled brain made my finger add an extra 1

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Looks like that car spun out, damaged left front corner, and then right
rear tire impacted something (curb?) which destroyed that rim/tire and also
bent the suspension components.

Wonder if the suspension was modified to fit those wagon wheels, which
caused a reduction in grip and drive-ability, which contributed to the
spin-out?  Or maybe a fellow driver was so enamored of those wheels they
became distracted and caused the collision?
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 2:21 PM Craig via Mercedes 
wrote:

> On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 14:14:23 -0400 Dwight Giles 
> wrote:
>
> > The cool factor
> > Dwight E. Giles Jr.
> > Wickford RI
>
> But how cool is it to have to put up with lots of road noise and then pay
> to replace the rims, which are undoubtedly quite expensive, because you
> went over a bump too fast?
>
>
> Craig
>
>
> > On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 2:12 PM Craig via Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 09:02:52 -0400 Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
> > >  wrote:
> > >
> > >
> https://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/pts/d/myrtle-beach-2006-mercedes-been-wrecked/6999596770.html
> > >
> > > At first, I thought there was something wrong with the tire in
> > > https://images.craigslist.org/00m0m_fyl0USUgJrh_600x450.jpg,
> > > but they are all like that!
> > >
> > > Rubber-band tires, indeed!
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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[MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

How big is the hose in and out from this valve?  How is the valve 
operated?  How much space is available?  is alternate space available by 
rerouting adding/cutting hose?


If it is air or vacuum operated, (or mechanical or electrons) you should 
be able to find an industrial valve and an appropriate operator made out 
of durable materials, like brass/bronze, with brass hose barbs. That 
will last longer than the truck...


Will a solenoid valve work, (on/off) or does it need to be regulated? 
(globe, ball or butterfly valve?)


Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/25/19 1:28 PM:

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 08:18:46 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:


I sent ya off for research, huh?  Good job!

Thank you.

What all this shows is the Gilbreths were interested in making things more
efficiently and faster.

What Deming was interested in was making quality things.

All the difference in the world! I will take quality over faster.


I'm struggling with that right now on our Kenworth W900. After 18 years,
the rubber tubing in the water valve for the cab's heater failed. I
purchased the "replacement" for it last year when The Shop in Moriarty
fixed the no-heat problem. That valve has now failed.

The original valve had a durable non-metallic material body onto which
the copper inlet and outlet hose barbs (with square flanges of the same
type durable non-metalic material) fastened to the body with four screws.

The "replacement" was all made of some type of hard plastic, with one of
the plastic water barb molded to the body and the other plastic water barb
pressing into the body and an internal molded neoprene "o-ring". I'm not
sure how it was supposed to be fastened into the body, since I have only
looked closely at it since it failed: The separate plastic hose barb came
loose from the body and started leaking profusely.

I can take and send pictures if y'all are interested.

I'm still looking for a good solution.


Craig



BTW the book "12 is Enough" is entertaining.  It is about the Gilbreth
family.

Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/24/19 10:36 PM:

On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 20:46:43 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:


Q: Why are many of the US built wretched ricebox cars better
built/reliable than American iron and the Alabama spawn of of DBAG?

A:  Because W Edwards Deming was asked by the Japanese to help them
build better products.  He taught them well.  He also taught the
Americans during WWII.  After the war, the American companies threw
out what he taught them and the women who did the SPC in the plants.
   They went back to therbligs.   The american bean counters liked
therbligs. They were still using therbligs in the 70s and into the
80s.  The Japanese listened well,  learned well, and did NOT throw
out the systems, but improved on them.   Look up the case of the Ford
transmissions built by mazda in the 80s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therblig

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Re: [MBZ] wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

> I drove the truck about 150 miles at highway speeds with only 1 lug holding 
> on each of the driver's side wheels.

The accepted/recommended practice is to pull a few from the other side, so that 
_all_ wheels have
a reasonable number of lugs, and drive carefully until you can get it up to the 
full complement, ASAP.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 13:47:18 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:

> How big is the hose in and out from this valve?

5/8"


> How is the valve operated?

Cable actuated, pull to close.


> How much space is available?

Quite a bit.


> Is alternate space available by rerouting adding/cutting hose?

Yes, but that is unnecessary and would be difficult because of the
limited length of the actuating cable.


> If it is air or vacuum operated, (or mechanical or electrons) you
> should be able to find an industrial valve and an appropriate operator
> made out of durable materials, like brass/bronze, with brass hose
> barbs. That will last longer than the truck...

I have been looking; I should widen my search field as you suggest.
Maybe there will be something on Zoro, Grainger, or McMaster-Carr.


> Will a solenoid valve work, (on/off) or does it need to be regulated? 
> (globe, ball or butterfly valve?)

It needs to be regulated. This is the old-fashioned arrangement of a
sideways-moving lever on the dash actuating the center wire of a cable
with a closely-spirally-wrapped wire outer shield/stationary force
reference point. When the center wire is pulled, the valve is closed.
When the center wire is moved away from closed, the valve progressively
opens more to increase the amount of heat the heater puts out.

I'm thankful this problem serviced when I was having other work done on
the truck and not out on the road. I could have lost the majority of
twelve gallons of coolant before I noticed.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On October 25, 2019 at 4:14 PM Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> Call around, 
> and see if you have find a heater valve for a 66 Bronco.

Interesting idea.
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B001B7BUAU

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B001B7BUAU


Oops, that one was 5/8" pull to open

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Pull to close examples.
Need to verify that they're 5/8"
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0031GUM5S
https://www.amazon.com/Four-Seasons-74655-Heater-Valve/dp/B001B7DOEA

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 16:40:26 -0400 (EDT) Mitch Haley via Mercedes
 wrote:

> 
> Pull to close examples.
> Need to verify that they're 5/8"
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0031GUM5S
> https://www.amazon.com/Four-Seasons-74655-Heater-Valve/dp/B001B7DOEA

But both of those are plastic.

The valve on our KW which failed is like
https://www.amazon.com/Four-Seasons-74627-Heater-Valve/dp/B000C2UVVO

The hose barb pipe which came loose and caused the leak is on the right
of the picture.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

On 25/10/2019 4:10 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

One Amazon review for a steel valve said he went all metal and it soon leaked, 
so he bought plastic body and found it much higher quality. A couple of reviews 
for plastic ones complained they leaked.
So I'm not sure which is best, or if you should just avoid Four Seasons.

___



But they are reasonably priced, so buy one and install it and keep 
looking for something better.


Randy


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Re: [MBZ] Okie S430

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/173971256876
> On October 25, 2019 at 1:30 PM Dan--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Bottom feeder time...
> 
> https://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/cto/d/valrico-2002-mercedes-s430/7006862271.html
>

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

https://tinyurl.com/y6gufrnx

Amazon - where else?

Randy


On 25/10/2019 3:14 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes wrote:
Those were used in 1960s Fords.  All steel construction.   Call 
around, and see if you have find a heater valve for a 66 Bronco.  I 
think mustang used the same valve.  I think My 66 van had the same 
valve too.


Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/25/19 2:16 PM:

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 13:47:18 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:


How big is the hose in and out from this valve?

5/8"



How is the valve operated?

Cable actuated, pull to close.



How much space is available?

Quite a bit.



Is alternate space available by rerouting adding/cutting hose?

Yes, but that is unnecessary and would be difficult because of the
limited length of the actuating cable.



If it is air or vacuum operated, (or mechanical or electrons) you
should be able to find an industrial valve and an appropriate operator
made out of durable materials, like brass/bronze, with brass hose
barbs. That will last longer than the truck...

I have been looking; I should widen my search field as you suggest.
Maybe there will be something on Zoro, Grainger, or McMaster-Carr.



Will a solenoid valve work, (on/off) or does it need to be regulated?
(globe, ball or butterfly valve?)

It needs to be regulated. This is the old-fashioned arrangement of a
sideways-moving lever on the dash actuating the center wire of a cable
with a closely-spirally-wrapped wire outer shield/stationary force
reference point. When the center wire is pulled, the valve is closed.
When the center wire is moved away from closed, the valve progressively
opens more to increase the amount of heat the heater puts out.

I'm thankful this problem serviced when I was having other work done on
the truck and not out on the road. I could have lost the majority of
twelve gallons of coolant before I noticed.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Those were used in 1960s Fords.  All steel construction.   Call around, 
and see if you have find a heater valve for a 66 Bronco.  I think 
mustang used the same valve.  I think My 66 van had the same valve too.


Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/25/19 2:16 PM:

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 13:47:18 -0500 Curley McLain via Mercedes
 wrote:


How big is the hose in and out from this valve?

5/8"



How is the valve operated?

Cable actuated, pull to close.



How much space is available?

Quite a bit.



Is alternate space available by rerouting adding/cutting hose?

Yes, but that is unnecessary and would be difficult because of the
limited length of the actuating cable.



If it is air or vacuum operated, (or mechanical or electrons) you
should be able to find an industrial valve and an appropriate operator
made out of durable materials, like brass/bronze, with brass hose
barbs. That will last longer than the truck...

I have been looking; I should widen my search field as you suggest.
Maybe there will be something on Zoro, Grainger, or McMaster-Carr.



Will a solenoid valve work, (on/off) or does it need to be regulated?
(globe, ball or butterfly valve?)

It needs to be regulated. This is the old-fashioned arrangement of a
sideways-moving lever on the dash actuating the center wire of a cable
with a closely-spirally-wrapped wire outer shield/stationary force
reference point. When the center wire is pulled, the valve is closed.
When the center wire is moved away from closed, the valve progressively
opens more to increase the amount of heat the heater puts out.

I'm thankful this problem serviced when I was having other work done on
the truck and not out on the road. I could have lost the majority of
twelve gallons of coolant before I noticed.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

One Amazon review for a steel valve said he went all metal and it soon leaked, 
so he bought plastic body and found it much higher quality. A couple of reviews 
for plastic ones complained they leaked.
So I'm not sure which is best, or if you should just avoid Four Seasons.

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Re: [MBZ] Long Life

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

There was one in HI that I wished someone would do that to it!  But it 
was steady income for the guy I worked for.  Every time they burned up 
people, they didn't cool it down properly, so roasted the controls.   He 
sold them lots of controls and labor.


Yes, it is funny!

Craig via Mercedes wrote on 10/25/19 4:07 PM:

Taking a momentary aside from my heater water valve problem, I'm sending
an email Shirley got today.


Craig


Long Life
  
An elderly, but hardy cattleman from Texas once told a young

female neighbor that if she wanted to live a long life, the
secret was to sprinkle a pinch of gunpowder on her oatmeal
each morning.  She did this religiously and lived to the age
of 103.  She left behind 14 children, 30 grandchildren, 21
great-grandchildren, five great-great-grandchildren and a
40 foot hole where the crematorium used to be.

_



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[MBZ] Long Life

[Craig via Mercedes]

Taking a momentary aside from my heater water valve problem, I'm sending
an email Shirley got today.


Craig


Long Life
 
An elderly, but hardy cattleman from Texas once told a young
female neighbor that if she wanted to live a long life, the
secret was to sprinkle a pinch of gunpowder on her oatmeal
each morning.  She did this religiously and lived to the age
of 103.  She left behind 14 children, 30 grandchildren, 21
great-grandchildren, five great-great-grandchildren and a
40 foot hole where the crematorium used to be.

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Re: [MBZ] KW VALVE WUZ: Re: wretched ricebox WUZ: Re: (no subject)

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Well, I used to use MB parts where ever I could on my 66 bronco and 66 
van.   So I guess using a frod part to fix a KW is ok.


I used pickup parts to convert the bronco from single circuit brakes to 
dual circuit.


I found some hondog compressor to convert to one for the SDL

You can learn a lot by wandering junkyards.  I wandered one a lot when I 
was in kolledge.


That is were I found a REO Speedwagon hood badge in the brush by the 
fence.   When it was pushed in the bushes, there was no band by that 
name.  When I found it, there was.



Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote on 10/25/19 3:29 PM:


Interesting idea.
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B001B7BUAU





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Re: [MBZ] OT: Everybody loves Raymond

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 22:48:50 -0400 (EDT) Mitch Haley via Mercedes
 wrote:

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSR3pvvDkGo

Thank you for the chuckles.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Everybody loves Raymond

[OK Don via Mercedes]

Groundhog day? I thought we saw this one last year?

On Fri, Oct 25, 2019 at 5:25 PM Craig via Mercedes 
wrote:

> On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 22:48:50 -0400 (EDT) Mitch Haley via Mercedes
>  wrote:
>
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSR3pvvDkGo
>
> Thank you for the chuckles.
>
>
> Craig
>
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>
>

-- 
OK Don

"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to
pause and reflect." Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Everybody loves Raymond

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 23:25:45 -0500 OK Don via Mercedes
 wrote:

> Groundhog day? I thought we saw this one last year?

There is a date on the video; I don't recall what it was.
Is eight months long enough to be mentally considered last year?

In any event, this was the first time I saw it.


Craig

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