Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

I'm going to bypass all wiring, put power directly to the starter.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On June 12, 2016 7:12:38 PM EDT, MG via Mercedes  wrote:
>Check the wire going to the starter and see if it is grounding 
>out through a cut from a bolt or sheetmetal due to crash.
>
>Manfred
>
>
>- Original Message -
>From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" 
>
> > > Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed. 
>Big click,
> > > battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the 
>motor she
> > > ain't turnin'.
> > >
> > > I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor 
>isn't seized.
> > >
> > > Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no 
>change.  Ran
> > > the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the 
>crank position,
> > > the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
> > >
> > > Any other ideas?
> > > --
> > > Max Dillon
> > > Charleston SC
> > > '87 300TD
> > > '95 E300
>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[MG via Mercedes]

Check the wire going to the starter and see if it is grounding 
out through a cut from a bolt or sheetmetal due to crash.


Manfred


- Original Message -
From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" 

> > Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed. 
Big click,
> > battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the 
motor she

> > ain't turnin'.
> >
> > I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor 
isn't seized.

> >
> > Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no 
change.  Ran
> > the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the 
crank position,

> > the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
> >
> > Any other ideas?
> > --
> > Max Dillon
> > Charleston SC
> > '87 300TD
> > '95 E300

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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

With car-part.com you can often get a starter or alt for close to the 
u-pull price, but don't need to waste your time and the part is 
delivered to your door.  Since for your plan you will need a starter 
anyway, if the original can't be resurrected, you will need another starter.



Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
June 11, 2016 at 9:55 AMvia Postbox 


That's a thought. I'm thinking about a visit to local LKQ to see if I can
get a compatible starter, which I could then keep as a spare.

Long term plan for the engine / drivetrain is transplant into a '95 124
wagon, replacing the gasser with a real engine.

-
Max
Charleston SC



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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

That's a thought.  I'm thinking about a visit to local LKQ to see if I can
get a compatible starter, which I could then keep as a spare.

Long term plan for the engine / drivetrain is transplant into a '95 124
wagon, replacing the gasser with a real engine.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 10:44 AM, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> If the starter is fubar, you might try car-part.com for a used one.  I
> got one there for $25.  To me, that is  cheap enough that i would not pull
> a starter from a working car.   The bonus is that you will be able to sell
> the engine for more $$$ AND you can end up with a spare on the shelf, or
> sell it with the engine for an extra $50
>
> Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>> June 11, 2016 at 8:40 AM<
>> https://www.postbox-inc.com/?utm_source=email_medium=sumlink_campaign=reach
>> >
>>
>> If no repair is possible, I'll consider swapping the starter from my wagon
>> into the sedan, but the cost / benefit analysis to this exercise is
>> becoming a consideration. If I had a spare starter on the shelf...
>>
>> -
>> Max
>> Charleston SC
>>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

If the starter is fubar, you might try car-part.com for a used one.  I 
got one there for $25.  To me, that is  cheap enough that i would not 
pull a starter from a working car.   The bonus is that you will be able 
to sell the engine for more $$$ AND you can end up with a spare on the 
shelf, or sell it with the engine for an extra $50



Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
June 11, 2016 at 8:40 
AM


If no repair is possible, I'll consider swapping the starter from my wagon
into the sedan, but the cost / benefit analysis to this exercise is
becoming a consideration. If I had a spare starter on the shelf...

-
Max
Charleston SC


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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[WILTON via Mercedes]

I suspect that impact shifted something that interrupts normal electric path 
and/or mechanically prevents rotation.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Meade Dillon via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>

To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Cc: "Meade Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2016 9:40 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D



I'm going to try Kaleb's idea first, and try jumping it directly from the
battery, see if it will spin with no solenoid engagement and then see if
12.5 VDC directly to the solenoid will kick it over.

If that fails, then I'll pull the starter, take it apart and see what's
going on.  Maybe it can be revived.

If no repair is possible, I'll consider swapping the starter from my wagon
into the sedan, but the cost / benefit analysis to this exercise is
becoming a consideration.  If I had a spare starter on the shelf...

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 8:24 AM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

Seized starter is one failure mode -- happened to me.  Solenoid would 
work

(you could hear it engage) but starter was locked up.

Peter


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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

I'm going to try Kaleb's idea first, and try jumping it directly from the
battery, see if it will spin with no solenoid engagement and then see if
12.5 VDC directly to the solenoid will kick it over.

If that fails, then I'll pull the starter, take it apart and see what's
going on.  Maybe it can be revived.

If no repair is possible, I'll consider swapping the starter from my wagon
into the sedan, but the cost / benefit analysis to this exercise is
becoming a consideration.  If I had a spare starter on the shelf...

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 8:24 AM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Seized starter is one failure mode -- happened to me.  Solenoid would work
> (you could hear it engage) but starter was locked up.
>
> Peter
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

Seized starter is one failure mode -- happened to me.  Solenoid would  
work (you could hear it engage) but starter was locked up.


Peter

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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

I suppose that's possible, need to remove the starter to know for sure.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On June 10, 2016 11:12:00 PM EDT, WILTON via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
wrote:
>Could impact have caused starter-to-flywheel alignment to shift
>slightly and 
>"jam" (prevent) rotation?
>
>Wilton
>
>- Original Message - 
>From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>To: "Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>Cc: "Max Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
>Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:33 PM
>Subject: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D
>
>
>> Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big
>click, 
>> battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she
>
>> ain't turnin'.
>>
>> I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't
>seized.
>>
>> Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change. 
>Ran 
>> the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank
>position, 
>> the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
>>
>> Any other ideas?
>> -- 
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '87 300TD
>> '95 E300
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
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>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[WILTON via Mercedes]

Could impact have caused starter-to-flywheel alignment to shift slightly and 
"jam" (prevent) rotation?


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>

To: "Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Cc: "Max Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:33 PM
Subject: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D


Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click, 
battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she 
ain't turnin'.


I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.

Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran 
the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, 
the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.


Any other ideas?
--
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Thanks Kaleb, that is worth a shot.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On June 10, 2016 10:40:38 PM EDT, "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes" 
 wrote:
>Try jumping the starter directly. If still no go replace it
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jun 10, 2016, at 9:33 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes
> wrote:
>> 
>> Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big
>click, battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the
>motor she ain't turnin'.
>> 
>> I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't
>seized.
>> 
>> Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change. 
>Ran the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank
>position, the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
>> 
>> Any other ideas?
>> -- 
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '87 300TD
>> '95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Your battery was removed and fully charged, in my garage.  Circumstances 
prevented me from taking that to the car, so I moved the battery from my wagon 
to the sedan, then back to my wagon which started just fine after trying to 
start the sedan.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On June 10, 2016 10:47:05 PM EDT, WILTON via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
wrote:
>'Don't know; never had that starter fail me - never any hesitation,
>well, 
>'cept with dead battery.
>Have ya tried jump with known good battery?  The car hasn't run (bat 
>charged) since 1200 Apr 30.
>
>Wilton
>
>- Original Message - 
>From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>To: "Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>Cc: "Max Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
>Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:33 PM
>Subject: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D
>
>
>> Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big
>click, 
>> battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she
>
>> ain't turnin'.
>>
>> I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't
>seized.
>>
>> Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change. 
>Ran 
>> the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank
>position, 
>> the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
>>
>> Any other ideas?
>> -- 
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '87 300TD
>> '95 E300
>> ___
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[G Mann via Mercedes]

Just re-read the OP.. "big click" would be solenoid, sending current to
starter motor.. so brush or brush holder out of position making ground
contact would fail to rotate motor..

Either way.. starter is coming out.. I'm guessing..

Sure is easier fixing your car setting at the computer.. hahaha..

HTH,
Grant...

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On Fri, Jun 10, 2016 at 7:47 PM, WILTON via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> 'Don't know; never had that starter fail me - never any hesitation, well,
> 'cept with dead battery.
> Have ya tried jump with known good battery?  The car hasn't run (bat
> charged) since 1200 Apr 30.
>
> Wilton
>
> - Original Message - From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: "Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: "Max Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:33 PM
> Subject: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D
>
>
>
> Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click,
>> battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she ain't
>> turnin'.
>>
>> I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.
>>
>> Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran
>> the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, the
>> neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
>>
>> Any other ideas?
>> --
>> Max Dillon
>> Charleston SC
>> '87 300TD
>> '95 E300
>> ___
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>>
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>>
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[G Mann via Mercedes]

Perhaps the force of impact caused the starter brush's to unseat, or the
brush holders to move enough to ground out. If that were the case,
energizing the starter would go directly to ground, make the cables hot
[quickly] and fail to rotate the starter..

Remove starter and open it to check brush status.. could be where the issue
lays..

Just a thought..


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On Fri, Jun 10, 2016 at 7:40 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Try jumping the starter directly. If still no go replace it
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jun 10, 2016, at 9:33 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click,
> battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she ain't
> turnin'.
> >
> > I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.
> >
> > Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran
> the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, the
> neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
> >
> > Any other ideas?
> > --
> > Max Dillon
> > Charleston SC
> > '87 300TD
> > '95 E300
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
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> >
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[WILTON via Mercedes]

'Don't know; never had that starter fail me - never any hesitation, well, 
'cept with dead battery.
Have ya tried jump with known good battery?  The car hasn't run (bat 
charged) since 1200 Apr 30.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Max Dillon via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>

To: "Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Cc: "Max Dillon" <dillonm...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 10:33 PM
Subject: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D


Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click, 
battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she 
ain't turnin'.


I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.

Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran 
the gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, 
the neutral safety switch is operating correctly.


Any other ideas?
--
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Try jumping the starter directly. If still no go replace it

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 10, 2016, at 9:33 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click, 
> battery cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she ain't 
> turnin'.
> 
> I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.
> 
> Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran the 
> gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, the 
> neutral safety switch is operating correctly.
> 
> Any other ideas?
> -- 
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300
> ___
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> 
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[MBZ] Starting Wilton's wrecked 124 300D

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Tried tonight, failed.  Looks like the starter has failed.  Big click, battery 
cables get very warm so current is flowing, but the motor she ain't turnin'.

I turned the engine over by hand just fine, so the motor isn't seized.

Tried tapping on the starter a bit with my breaker bar, no change.  Ran the 
gear shift up and down while holding the key in the crank position, the neutral 
safety switch is operating correctly.

Any other ideas?
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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