Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree
Hi Rob and thanks for sharing the photos. The low resolution X-ray tomography images are a bit difficult to interpret. Perhaps you could post some high res images? From what I can see, there do not appear to be very many annual growth rings. How many do you count? What year were these harvested? Also two of the other 'branches' on your site look to me more like root balls (burls) with the roots cut off as David Vann has previously pointed out about Anne's example. They don't appear to have very many annual growth rings either...how many do you count? Personally, I suspect that the ones that look root-like may be examples of trees that grew on top of a meteorite sometime after the 1947 fall as opposed to examples of 1947 impacts. Still pretty cool though! Anyone else have any thoughts or different interpretations about Rob's images? -John - Original Message From: Rob Wesel nakhla...@comcast.net To: impact...@aol.com; m...@mhmeteorites.com; drv...@sas.upenn.edu; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 9:26:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Hello all I picked up Matt Morgan's piece a couple years ago and did have it CT'd. Quite striking resolution and a non-destructive way to analyze the ring formation. I have not taken the images to any horticulturist to weigh in on but I'm willing to make the CT disc available to science for evaluation upon request. I was given the source by Matt and have no concerns regarding it's authenticity. http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com/catalog/sikhot-tree.htm Two more tree specimens can be seen here and one of them is headed for CT due to purchaser request. I left them up but both are sold. Same source for all of these specimens including Anne's. http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com/catalog/SA.htm Rob Wesel www.nakhladogmeteorites.com www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: impact...@aol.com To: m...@mhmeteorites.com; drv...@sas.upenn.edu; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 6:43 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Thank you Matt. And yes, OOoppps. I did write twice the same link, so here is the real link to the picture of the 2 Vernadsky Sikhote-Alin. _http://www.impactika.com/images/2s-alin.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/2s-alin.jpg) Sorry! Anne M. Black _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/) _IMPACTIKA@aol.com_ (mailto:impact...@aol.com) President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) In a message dated 1/12/2011 6:26:26 PM Mountain Standard Time, m...@mhmeteorites.com writes: I saw Anne's on display at the Denver show and was convinced it was the real deal. Plus the dealer who had it is an impeccable source and also a geologist. I bought one from him a couple of years ago and sold it to another dealer (don't want to drop names) who had it examined by an MRI at a well-known University. The University, if I recall, said the tree was old enough and the meteorite did in fact alter the tree growth structure (I.e. It wasn't hammered into a crack in the tree). Maybe he can chime in... Matt Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites http://www.mhmeteorites.com P.O. Box 151293 Lakewood, CO 80215 -Original Message- From: impact...@aol.com Sender: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 20:04:10 To: drv...@sas.upenn.edu; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree WOW! Thank you Dr. Vann, Dr. Ted, Dolores, everybody, for all the great posts! I have learned a lot about trees today!;-) Dr Vann, if I was a little closer to Philadelphia, I would be driving right over to show it to you. Your analysis and interpretation is amazing, and very helpful. If more pictures could help in any way just say so, I would be delighted to send you some close-ups. And just in case, I posted this one to my site: _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg) Please do let me know what you see there. Thank you very much. And for everybody else, and since some did ask, here is a picture of the two Sikhote-Alins from the Vernadsky Institute: _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg) Enjoy. And again, Thanks everybody! Anne M. Black _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/) _IMPACTIKA@aol.com_ (mailto:impact...@aol.com) President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree
Count the annual growth rings in the base of the branchif a tree was alive in 1947 there should be more than 64. -J - Original Message From: Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com To: impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, January 11, 2011 8:35:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Hi, While I am not challenging the integrity of Anne's specimen, there is something I should share: about a decade ago I was informed by an unimpeachable source as to the existence of what is basically a nursery outside of Vladivostok where SAs have been wedged into the knots and the forked limbs of a rapidly growing specie of tree for later harvest. I was informed that branches are frequently bound around the meteorite to assist in the embedment. I saw one such example and it was...impressive. Little scary, right? In an effort that provides a faster turnaround, I was recently informed lightning rods are being inserted into strategic locations in Saharan sands in the effort to produce and harvest flared saharite---the beautifully flanged Saharan fulgurites. Certainly less scary as there is no effort to deceive. Clever, actually---and yet bothersome as well. d, On Jan 11, 2011, at 8:23 PM, impact...@aol.com wrote: Hello, Since Michael Blood mentionned Sikhote-Alins embedded in trees in his latest Market Trends article, and warned everybody against them. And since I have received a few questions about the one I aquired a few months ago, let me try to set the record straight: First, here are 2 pictures, the whole thing, and a close-up: _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg) _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg) It is much bigger than any I have seen before, and the Sikhote-Alin is truly inside the tree. And a member who happens to be an hoticulturist looked at the pictures and wrote: Looks pretty real to me Anne! It probably impailed itself into the tree and then the tree grew around it, which explains the bark around it. (Thank you Craig!) Also I counted the rings, not easy, but there are at least 45. And I trust the Russian dealer I bought it from. So, yes I believe that it is the real/authentic deal, not a scam. And if you want to have a better look at it, it will be in my room in Tucson (Hotel Tucson City Center, Formerly InnSuites, Room 322). Speaking of Sikhote-Alin, you will also see there two Sikhote-Alins in as found condition that I obtained from the Vernadsky Institute. Yes, with all the paperwork! See you all there very soon. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ impact...@aol.com President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree
One year's growth should be represented by a light colored early growth band AND a dark colored late growth band... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendrochronology - Original Message From: John Birdsell johnbirds...@yahoo.com To: Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com; impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 10:04:33 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Count the annual growth rings in the base of the branchif a tree was alive in 1947 there should be more than 64. -J - Original Message From: Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com To: impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, January 11, 2011 8:35:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Hi, While I am not challenging the integrity of Anne's specimen, there is something I should share: about a decade ago I was informed by an unimpeachable source as to the existence of what is basically a nursery outside of Vladivostok where SAs have been wedged into the knots and the forked limbs of a rapidly growing specie of tree for later harvest. I was informed that branches are frequently bound around the meteorite to assist in the embedment. I saw one such example and it was...impressive. Little scary, right? In an effort that provides a faster turnaround, I was recently informed lightning rods are being inserted into strategic locations in Saharan sands in the effort to produce and harvest flared saharite---the beautifully flanged Saharan fulgurites. Certainly less scary as there is no effort to deceive. Clever, actually---and yet bothersome as well. d, On Jan 11, 2011, at 8:23 PM, impact...@aol.com wrote: Hello, Since Michael Blood mentionned Sikhote-Alins embedded in trees in his latest Market Trends article, and warned everybody against them. And since I have received a few questions about the one I aquired a few months ago, let me try to set the record straight: First, here are 2 pictures, the whole thing, and a close-up: _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg) _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg) It is much bigger than any I have seen before, and the Sikhote-Alin is truly inside the tree. And a member who happens to be an hoticulturist looked at the pictures and wrote: Looks pretty real to me Anne! It probably impailed itself into the tree and then the tree grew around it, which explains the bark around it. (Thank you Craig!) Also I counted the rings, not easy, but there are at least 45. And I trust the Russian dealer I bought it from. So, yes I believe that it is the real/authentic deal, not a scam. And if you want to have a better look at it, it will be in my room in Tucson (Hotel Tucson City Center, Formerly InnSuites, Room 322). Speaking of Sikhote-Alin, you will also see there two Sikhote-Alins in as found condition that I obtained from the Vernadsky Institute. Yes, with all the paperwork! See you all there very soon. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ impact...@aol.com President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree
Hi Tedgood point. If a tree branch was collected many, many years ago, it could have fewer growth rings, and might also be expected to show some signs of its age. -J I have seen three specimens that exceed 80 years and several that are too young, so be careful. A Russian dealer friend of mine says that all of the genuine specimens were gathered years ago, but some may have been kept for future sale as we know the Arab dealers do with meteorites. Be careful out there. Ted Bunch - Original Message From: John Birdsell johnbirds...@yahoo.com To: John Birdsell johnbirds...@yahoo.com; Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com; impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 10:25:22 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree One year's growth should be represented by a light colored early growth band AND a dark colored late growth band... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendrochronology - Original Message From: John Birdsell johnbirds...@yahoo.com To: Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com; impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 10:04:33 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Count the annual growth rings in the base of the branchif a tree was alive in 1947 there should be more than 64. -J - Original Message From: Darryl Pitt dar...@dof3.com To: impact...@aol.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, January 11, 2011 8:35:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree Hi, While I am not challenging the integrity of Anne's specimen, there is something I should share: about a decade ago I was informed by an unimpeachable source as to the existence of what is basically a nursery outside of Vladivostok where SAs have been wedged into the knots and the forked limbs of a rapidly growing specie of tree for later harvest. I was informed that branches are frequently bound around the meteorite to assist in the embedment. I saw one such example and it was...impressive. Little scary, right? In an effort that provides a faster turnaround, I was recently informed lightning rods are being inserted into strategic locations in Saharan sands in the effort to produce and harvest flared saharite---the beautifully flanged Saharan fulgurites. Certainly less scary as there is no effort to deceive. Clever, actually---and yet bothersome as well. d, On Jan 11, 2011, at 8:23 PM, impact...@aol.com wrote: Hello, Since Michael Blood mentionned Sikhote-Alins embedded in trees in his latest Market Trends article, and warned everybody against them. And since I have received a few questions about the one I aquired a few months ago, let me try to set the record straight: First, here are 2 pictures, the whole thing, and a close-up: _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree.jpg) _http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg_ (http://www.impactika.com/images/satree2.jpg) It is much bigger than any I have seen before, and the Sikhote-Alin is truly inside the tree. And a member who happens to be an hoticulturist looked at the pictures and wrote: Looks pretty real to me Anne! It probably impailed itself into the tree and then the tree grew around it, which explains the bark around it. (Thank you Craig!) Also I counted the rings, not easy, but there are at least 45. And I trust the Russian dealer I bought it from. So, yes I believe that it is the real/authentic deal, not a scam. And if you want to have a better look at it, it will be in my room in Tucson (Hotel Tucson City Center, Formerly InnSuites, Room 322). Speaking of Sikhote-Alin, you will also see there two Sikhote-Alins in as found condition that I obtained from the Vernadsky Institute. Yes, with all the paperwork! See you all there very soon. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ impact...@aol.com President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing
Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree
Good call David! Now that you mention it, those do look more like roots to me than branches. -John - Original Message From: David R. Vann drv...@sas.upenn.edu To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 1:54:32 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree I would like to add that the picture, as I interpret it, is a tree *stump*. It is upside-down in Anne's picture. The 'branches' are departing the trunk in the pattern typical of roots. The age of the tree would be determined based on the rings in the piece laying on the table. It appears to me that the tree grew around the SA piece as it lay buried, consequently an age less than or near to the SA would be expected. There seems to be very little to no disruption (shattering) of the wood that I can see -only bending as one might see in a root growing around a rock. Thus, this may have been a fragment that hit soil, followed by enclosure in the growing tree. If you invert the photo (it will look more like a tree trunk), the placement of the fragment is below the main trunk. A moving piece would have come in on a very low angle to penetrate the tree in the *apparent* manner. Additionally, I would expect the oxidation patterns for meteorites that imbedded in wood to be different from that in soil (not possible to evaluate in a photo). At least, there should be iron staining or increased iron in the wood after impact due to natural organic acids in the tree sap as it repaired the wound. Conversely, a piece in the soil would be enclosed by roots similar to way they would enclose rock, and the root would have bark covering the wood at the interface with the fragment at all times, so there would be no iron staining. Interpretation is complicated by the fact that a second tree (probably a second trunk of the main tree) has grown roots that are interlaced with those of the larger trunk. If you invert the photo, the pear-shaped form on the right (with a circle in the center) is the remnants of the second trunk, which died and fell away from the tree years ago. The two yellowish ovals are two roots that were cut to fell the tree or after felling to better show the fragment. The pinkish area around the fragment is a larger root (that was plunging into the soil) that was split when the tree was uprooted. This split revealed the fragment. The split root shows a rotted, hollow area toward the right, which when combined with the cluster of three smaller roots (under the yellow ovals), provided a weak point for the split to begin. There is a crescent-shaped area of bark departing the fragment; this is the fusion/grafting line between the two large roots that are in the lower left of the (inverted) photo. This provides another point of weakness. I would love to see this in life, for a better evaluation, but am afraid that I cannot make the Tucson show. Someday perhaps. David R. Vann, Ph.D. Forest Biogeochemistry and Physiology Department of Earth and Environmental Science THE UNIVERSITY of PENNSYLVANIA 240 S. 33rd St. Philadelphia, PA 19104-6316 drv...@sas.upenn.edu office: 215-898-4906 FAX: 215-898-0964 | -Original Message- | From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com | [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On | Behalf Of Dolores Hill | Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 1:54 PM | To: John Birdsell | Cc: impact...@aol.com; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com | Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD(?) - Sikhote-Alin in tree | | | Dear meteorite-list, | | I cannot resist commenting on this issue. I have studied | dendrochronology and I am very familiar with the UA Tree-Ring Lab | (LTRR). It is much more complicated than one might realize. In | addition to number of tree-rings/years, the growth _/pattern/_ is | extremely important in cross-dating a tree sample according to a | particular regional chronology. Depending on the species and/or | environmental conditions, there may even be missing rings or double | rings. The number of rings also depends on when the tree | first started | growing and when it died (naturally or was cut down) or was | sampled by | increment core. | | I have seen fascinating photos of supposed Sikhote-Alin | meteorites stuck | in trees and invited the owners to allow LTRR experts to | examine them. | So far the owners seem to get cold feet. LTRR has scientists and | visiting researchers who have first-hand experience with | Russian trees | and forests. They are happy to provide assistance: | http://ltrr.arizona.edu/ If authentic, the samples might aid | studies of biological effects of meteorite impacts. It would | be best if | the original location of the tree is known; another case for careful | documentation. | | Regards, | Dolores Hill | Lunar Planetary Laboratory | University of Arizona | | | John Birdsell wrote: | Hi Tedgood point. If a tree branch was collected many, | many years | ago
Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - May 19, 2010
Very interesting Chondrite! Never seen so many small, well-defined thumb-prints on a chondriteIt would be interesting to see a cut face (if there is one)? -J From: Michael Johnson mich...@rocksfromspace.org To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, May 19, 2010 4:43:58 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - May 19, 2010 http://www.rocksfromspace.org/May_19_2010.html - - - __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Congratulations to Mike Miller on his NEW Arizona Meteorite!!!
Hi Mike and congratulations on your new find! Please post some photos when you get a chance. Cheers -John Dawn __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
RE: [meteorite-list] Fukang Pallasite Chinga Ungrouped?
Hi Christian and thanks for the Update! -John --- Christian Anger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Mike, look at http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php click what's new and you will see the new entry in the metbull #90. Fukang is a main group pallasite. Cheers, Christian I.M.C.A. #2673 at www.imca.cc website: www.austromet.com Ing. Christian Anger Korngasse 6 2405 Bad Deutsch-Altenburg AUSTRIA email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:meteorite-list- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Fowler Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 8:20 PM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Cc: Mike Fowler Subject: [meteorite-list] Fukang Pallasite Chinga Ungrouped? Hi List, I have a Chinga Iron in my collection listed as IVB Anomalous. According to this abstract, Chinga is Ungrouped. Is this the latest consensus? If so I will need a different meteorite to represent the IVB group in my collection. Lunar and Planetary Science XXXVII (2006) sess454.pdf Honesto J. * McDonough W. F.Walker R. J. Corrigan C. M. McCoy T. J.Chabot N. L.Ash R. D. 187 Re-187Os Isotopic and Highly Siderophile Element Systematics of Group IVB Irons, and Ungrouped Irons Chinga, Tishomingo and Willow Grove [#1374] IVB irons and the ungrouped irons Chinga, Tishomingo and Willow Grove were analyzed for HSE abundances and 187Re-187Os systematics. Chinga and Willow Grove cannot be related to the IVBs by igneous fractionation. Tishomingo is more ambiguous. Regarding the Fukang Pallasite, Arizona Skies states on their web site that Fukang is Ungrouped. This is news to me. I searched the internet and could find no info. Can any one confirm the official classification of this pallasite? Of course, if it is ungrouped, I'll have to add it to my collection as well! Mike Fowler Chicago 55 unique planetary bodies represented in my collection and counting! PS Of course, I went to David Weir's Meteorite Studies site first to get his take on these two irons, but neither one is listed yet! __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite
Hi Bernd...Yes, if it is paired to our new Acapulcoite NWA 2714 and NWA 2656, then the provisional write-up in MB90 states that the TKW is accounted for by a single ~ 7.5 kilogram stone which was apparently broken into pieces and sold. Cheers -John --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All ! I've just purchased my 3.7-gram, extremely metal- and troilite-rich slice of NWA 2989 (Item #6605571076 - just in case you care to take a look ;-) that Adam is offering on EBay. Look at it and you'll know what I mean! Adam writes: ...TKW of 77 grams is recorded for NWA 2989. This weight does not reflect any pairings since I do not have accurate figures. It is probably paired with NWA 2656, of which I own a beautiful slice weighing 0.29 grams. Adam also writes: ... the lowest price you will find on EBay. And right he is! I paid $290 for my little, beautiful NWA 2656 (which I do not regret!). Go figure and do the maths what I would have had to pay for more than 10 times the weight (3.7 grams) of my 0.29-gram ACAP. The specimen that comes closest to the one I purchased seems to be the 2.55-gram part slice - also very metal-rich and almost like my little NWA 2656 with all its delicate veins and veinlets. It doesn't show those slender troilite inclusions but this part slice would be my choice no. 2. I'd buy both of them if I could afford it! What makes acapulcoites, and especially this one, so interesting is their achondritic, granular texture and, at the same time, they have an ordinary chondrite mineralogy. That's why you find both abundant metal (similar to H chondrites!) and sulfide in them. Another interesting feature is the rare occurrence of relict chondrules, and, as they do not plot too far away from both angrites, brachinites on the one hand, and from ureilites on the other, you will also find grain boundaries meeting in triple junctions (120°). Best Acapucoitic wishes, and Good Night, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite
Hi Adam...the classification write-up usually states whether it is likely paired to other meteorites. What did your write up state? If it is a complete individual, and it is paired to NWA 2656 and NWA 2714 and others, then I would think the TKW for this grouping must be over 7.5 kilos. Did the write up describe it as a whole stone? Is it surrounded by fusion crust like a whole stone? If so, could you maybe post some pics for the list? Thanks! -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi List, I believe it is paired to others but mine came as an individual not broken from another piece as far as I can tell. Anyway you look at, this new Acapulcoite is one great looking meteorite, especially when polished to a mirror finish. Take Care, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite
Hi Adam...We were just curious, because in your ebay ad you stated that you didn't have any accurate figures on the TKW of pairings, and yet, the TKW of ~7.5kg has been publicly available on the internet for months now, and in the Meteorite Bulletin data base it states the following: [Provisional text] Northwest Africa 2656 Morocco or Algeria Find: Purchased 2003 Achondrite (acapulcoite) History: A 386 g broken stone with weathered fusion crust (part of a larger ~7.5 kg mass found in 2003) was purchased in Erfoud, Morocco in 2004 for N. Oakes. Petrography (T. Bunch and J. Wittke, NAU; A. Irving, UWS): The specimen is recrystallized into homogeneous polygonal and subhedral grains with a grain size of 1 mm and a somewhat equal distribution of phases. Composition: Olivine Fa8.0 FeO/MnO = 16-19 (N = 25); Orthopyroxene Fs8.4Wo2.4, N = 17; Plagioclase An18.3Ð21.0Or2.8Ð3.4; Chromite, (Cr/Cr+Al) = 0.85, Mg/(Mg+Fe) = 0.41. Troilite, schreibersite and kamacite are also present. Oxygen Isotopes (D. Rumble, CIW): Replicate analyses by laser fluorination gave d17O = 1.71, 1.69ä, d18O = 5.05, 5.04ä, D17O = -0.953, -0.973ä, respectively. Classification: Achondrite (acapulcoite) with minor shock and moderate weathering. Specimens: A 21 g specimen and one polished thin section are on deposit at NAU. Oakes holds the main mass. --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi John and List, As I stated in my auction, the nomenclature is provisional. I do not have an image of the whole stone but I do have a receipt stating the weight of 77 grams. As I mentioned in my auction, this weight was attributed to NWA 2989 only and not any other pairings. It was also mentioned to the List that I believed it to be paired to NWA 2656 which has an official weight of 386 grams. If somebody claimed a false weight on NWA 2656 that is not my problem. I got a good deal on the complete stone so I released my material at a reasonable price. If somebody is complaining about paying $40.00/50.00 a gram for this beauty when others are selling it at 10 times this amount then there truly is a problem regardless of how much weight is out there. I reported what I had correctly. I cannot keep track of other pairings and nobody else can either. You made this argument when we were talking about what constitutes a main mass. If others knew there was more weight and the other pieces came from a single large stone then they should have reported it. Kind Regards, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite Hi Adam...the classification write-up usually states whether it is likely paired to other meteorites. What did your write up state? If it is a complete individual, and it is paired to NWA 2656 and NWA 2714 and others, then I would think the TKW for this grouping must be over 7.5 kilos. Did the write up describe it as a whole stone? Is it surrounded by fusion crust like a whole stone? If so, could you maybe post some pics for the list? Thanks! -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi List, I believe it is paired to others but mine came as an individual not broken from another piece as far as I can tell. Anyway you look at, this new Acapulcoite is one great looking meteorite, especially when polished to a mirror finish. Take Care, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update
Hi Stan and thanks for your email. Ok, I think that this Acapulcoite TKW thing really needs to get nailed down before the next Met Bulletin comes out. Can everyone that has a significant amount of this material write us either on or off list so that we can add up all of the pieces and get the correct TKW. Stan, am I correct in assuming that between you and Nelson, you had 7500 grams of NWA 2656? We had 1666 grams of NWA 2714, so that brings the TKW weight up to at least 9166 grams, plus Adam's 77 grams = 9243 grams...Any more out there? -John --- stan . [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: for those that might be curious the mass of 2656 was broken into 'pieces' - as in 2 pieces. Nelson Oaks has one and I have the other, with a few slices being sold off here and there. If Adam's piece is paired then the bueaty of this stuff really cant be understated - it's gorgeous material. IF anyone wants a piece and 4 or 5 grams isnt enough then wirte Nelson, I belive his piece is up for grabs - or at least it was listed in Lang's auction at tucson... From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2006 15:21:11 -0800 (PST) Hi Bernd...Yes, if it is paired to our new Acapulcoite NWA 2714 and NWA 2656, then the provisional write-up in MB90 states that the TKW is accounted for by a single ~ 7.5 kilogram stone which was apparently broken into pieces and sold. Cheers -John --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All ! I've just purchased my 3.7-gram, extremely metal- and troilite-rich slice of NWA 2989 (Item #6605571076 - just in case you care to take a look ;-) that Adam is offering on EBay. Look at it and you'll know what I mean! Adam writes: ...TKW of 77 grams is recorded for NWA 2989. This weight does not reflect any pairings since I do not have accurate figures. It is probably paired with NWA 2656, of which I own a beautiful slice weighing 0.29 grams. Adam also writes: ... the lowest price you will find on EBay. And right he is! I paid $290 for my little, beautiful NWA 2656 (which I do not regret!). Go figure and do the maths what I would have had to pay for more than 10 times the weight (3.7 grams) of my 0.29-gram ACAP. The specimen that comes closest to the one I purchased seems to be the 2.55-gram part slice - also very metal-rich and almost like my little NWA 2656 with all its delicate veins and veinlets. It doesn't show those slender troilite inclusions but this part slice would be my choice no. 2. I'd buy both of them if I could afford it! What makes acapulcoites, and especially this one, so interesting is their achondritic, granular texture and, at the same time, they have an ordinary chondrite mineralogy. That's why you find both abundant metal (similar to H chondrites!) and sulfide in them. Another interesting feature is the rare occurrence of relict chondrules, and, as they do not plot too far away from both angrites, brachinites on the one hand, and from ureilites on the other, you will also find grain boundaries meeting in triple junctions (120°). Best Acapucoitic wishes, and Good Night, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update
Hi Adam. Yes, we completely understand your confusion over all of the different TKW's reported. That is why we are attempting to clarify this issue once and for all. The important thing to note is that the TKW now stands at over 10kg. NAU's website will eventually need to be corrected as will the provisional Met Bulletin once we get this TKW issue sorted out. The TKW of NWA 2714 is 1666g, not 100g. According to the classifying Scientist, our NWA 2714 came from the 7.5kg whole stone that now appears to be wholly accounted for by Stan's and Nelson's portions. Therefore, since that obviously is incorrect, our 1666 grams of NWA 2714 either came from a larger stone that was broken into fragments which were then sold to Stan, Nelson, us, some others and perhaps you, or perhaps it was a separate individual (I doubt the latter). We try to keep our website updated to reflect the new TKW as we understood it 40 minutes ago. Of course we will now need to further update it once we tabulate the additional masses of other pairings kindly provided to us by list members. We'll be happy to share this total with you once we get it so that you can update your ebay auctions too, but for now I think it is safe to say there is more than 10kg of this beautiful material in existance. It is important to properly report the TKW so that the collectors know the facts as we currently understand them. Cheers -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear John and List, I applaud trying to nail down the TKW but as Stan stated NWA 2656 was divided among two owners. I was not supplied by either one of them. You claim NWA 2714 with a reported TKW of 100 grams according to NAU's documents was part of this same mass. Stan claims it was divided between Nelson Oaks and himself with a claimed weight 386 grams. Now you claim the weight of NWA 2714 is 1,666 grams on your recently updated web-site. The cached website results for your site from google make no mention of the weight. It was brought in to question whether my stone was a fragment of this one and I responded it was not. I was then dragged through the ringer on TKWs which make absolutely no sense since parts of the same stone have been claimed under different numbers. Since I had to explain my position, maybe you can explain the website discrepancy and the 100 gram recorded weight on NAU's site below. I am sure everybody would like to know about NWA 2714. http://www4.nau.edu/meteorite/Meteorite/PrimitiveAchondrite.html I was sincere in my statements regarding the nature of tracking TKWs on pairings. As you can see, this is a mess! Kind Regards, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: stan . [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 6:39 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update Hi Stan and thanks for your email. Ok, I think that this Acapulcoite TKW thing really needs to get nailed down before the next Met Bulletin comes out. Can everyone that has a significant amount of this material write us either on or off list so that we can add up all of the pieces and get the correct TKW. Stan, am I correct in assuming that between you and Nelson, you had 7500 grams of NWA 2656? We had 1666 grams of NWA 2714, so that brings the TKW weight up to at least 9166 grams, plus Adam's 77 grams = 9243 grams...Any more out there? -John --- stan . [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: for those that might be curious the mass of 2656 was broken into 'pieces' - as in 2 pieces. Nelson Oaks has one and I have the other, with a few slices being sold off here and there. If Adam's piece is paired then the bueaty of this stuff really cant be understated - it's gorgeous material. IF anyone wants a piece and 4 or 5 grams isnt enough then wirte Nelson, I belive his piece is up for grabs - or at least it was listed in Lang's auction at tucson... From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Adam's NWA 2989 Acapulcoite Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2006 15:21:11 -0800 (PST) Hi Bernd...Yes, if it is paired to our new Acapulcoite NWA 2714 and NWA 2656, then the provisional write-up in MB90 states that the TKW is accounted for by a single ~ 7.5 kilogram stone which was apparently broken into pieces and sold. Cheers -John --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All ! I've just purchased my 3.7-gram, extremely metal- and troilite-rich slice of NWA 2989 (Item #6605571076 - just in case you care to take a look ;-) that Adam is offering on EBay. Look at it and you'll know what I mean! Adam
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update
Dear Adam. Please stop trying to place the blame for your problems elsewhere. If you had read our website before we updated it, we clearly stated that NWA 2714 comes from the same ~7.5 kilo stone as NWA 2656. This is what the classifying scientist stated in his write up. We didn't tell him that, he told us. We also didn't try to pretend that there was only a few grams of this Acapulcoite like a certain other dealer we know. We clearly stated that there was 7.5 kg of this Acapulcoite. According to the Met Base, 7.5kg was the TKW of the Acapulcoite when you made your ebay listings. In fact, 7.5kg was the TKW of the Acapulcoite until a few hours ago when Stan clarified the situation with NWA 2656 on this list. Now, with the recent additions by list members the TKW for this Acapulcoite stands at over 10kg. The real question here is why didn't you report the TKW in your ebay listings and why are your current ebay ads are still running with the incorrect information? Come on Adam. Don't you think your customers deserve to know the truth about how much of your Ultra Rare Acapulcoite there is out there? Good night -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi John, This does not explain why you had no weight listed at all on your web-site according to the cached version in google.com which is only one day old if you knew there was 1,666 grams plus a 7.5 kilogram stone. You asked me to back up my claims with pictures and said you were curious because I didn't report an unknown and unreported mass weight. It seems you are guilty of the same thing to a larger extent even though you apparently knew more than I did when this string started. Here is your statement putting me under the thumb-screws. Can we ask you the same questions? Did the write up describe it as a whole stone? Is it surrounded by fusion crust like a whole stone? If so, could you maybe post some pics for the list? We were just curious, because in your ebay ad you stated that you didn't have any accurate figures on the TKW of pairings, and yet, the TKW of ~7.5kg has been publicly available on the internet for months now, and in the Meteorite Bulletin data base it states the following: * I will ask Jim Witke about the reported weight of NWA 2714 which stands at 100 grams since he is a stickler for accuracy. Still waiting to hear why you recently added the weight to your web-site when it was not there before this string started or should I state Sting? Take Care, Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 8:22 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update Hi Adam. Yes, we completely understand your confusion over all of the different TKW's reported. That is why we are attempting to clarify this issue once and for all. The important thing to note is that the TKW now stands at over 10kg. NAU's website will eventually need to be corrected as will the provisional Met Bulletin once we get this TKW issue sorted out. The TKW of NWA 2714 is 1666g, not 100g. According to the classifying Scientist, our NWA 2714 came from the 7.5kg whole stone that now appears to be wholly accounted for by Stan's and Nelson's portions. Therefore, since that obviously is incorrect, our 1666 grams of NWA 2714 either came from a larger stone that was broken into fragments which were then sold to Stan, Nelson, us, some others and perhaps you, or perhaps it was a separate individual (I doubt the latter). We try to keep our website updated to reflect the new TKW as we understood it 40 minutes ago. Of course we will now need to further update it once we tabulate the additional masses of other pairings kindly provided to us by list members. We'll be happy to share this total with you once we get it so that you can update your ebay auctions too, but for now I think it is safe to say there is more than 10kg of this beautiful material in existance. It is important to properly report the TKW so that the collectors know the facts as we currently understand them. Cheers -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear John and List, I applaud trying to nail down the TKW but as Stan stated NWA 2656 was divided among two owners. I was not supplied by either one of them. You claim NWA 2714 with a reported TKW of 100 grams according to NAU's documents was part of this same mass. Stan claims it was divided between Nelson Oaks and himself with a claimed weight 386 grams. Now you claim the weight of NWA 2714 is 1,666 grams on your recently updated web-site. The cached website results for your site from google make no mention of the weight. It was brought in to question whether my stone
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update
Yes Adam...whatever you say... Hey Dean, I think this must correspond to your Rule #3, what do you think? Cheers -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: John and List, This string is getting old. I have not updated my auctions and did not pretend to know about all of the pairings. I stated these exact phrases in my auctions: Since it's publication a few more have come out of Oman and Northwest Africa including the pairings to this one. A Total Known Weight (TKW) of 77 grams is recorded for NWA 2989. This weight does not reflect any pairings since I do not have accurate figures. How much more can be said? There is still no consensus on TKW of all of the pairings, if indeed they are paired. looks like you got caught with your pants down, being guilty of what you are accusing me of. It seems that the pairings to this might have been misreported from the beginning which is not my problem. NWA 2989 is clean with an accurate weight reported. It is up to dealers to police themselves. I only report what I know to be accurate. Time to walk on this tired Sting Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update Dear Adam. Please stop trying to place the blame for your problems elsewhere. If you had read our website before we updated it, we clearly stated that NWA 2714 comes from the same ~7.5 kilo stone as NWA 2656. This is what the classifying scientist stated in his write up. We didn't tell him that, he told us. We also didn't try to pretend that there was only a few grams of this Acapulcoite like a certain other dealer we know. We clearly stated that there was 7.5 kg of this Acapulcoite. According to the Met Base, 7.5kg was the TKW of the Acapulcoite when you made your ebay listings. In fact, 7.5kg was the TKW of the Acapulcoite until a few hours ago when Stan clarified the situation with NWA 2656 on this list. Now, with the recent additions by list members the TKW for this Acapulcoite stands at over 10kg. The real question here is why didn't you report the TKW in your ebay listings and why are your current ebay ads are still running with the incorrect information? Come on Adam. Don't you think your customers deserve to know the truth about how much of your Ultra Rare Acapulcoite there is out there? Good night -John --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi John, This does not explain why you had no weight listed at all on your web-site according to the cached version in google.com which is only one day old if you knew there was 1,666 grams plus a 7.5 kilogram stone. You asked me to back up my claims with pictures and said you were curious because I didn't report an unknown and unreported mass weight. It seems you are guilty of the same thing to a larger extent even though you apparently knew more than I did when this string started. Here is your statement putting me under the thumb-screws. Can we ask you the same questions? Did the write up describe it as a whole stone? Is it surrounded by fusion crust like a whole stone? If so, could you maybe post some pics for the list? We were just curious, because in your ebay ad you stated that you didn't have any accurate figures on the TKW of pairings, and yet, the TKW of ~7.5kg has been publicly available on the internet for months now, and in the Meteorite Bulletin data base it states the following: * I will ask Jim Witke about the reported weight of NWA 2714 which stands at 100 grams since he is a stickler for accuracy. Still waiting to hear why you recently added the weight to your web-site when it was not there before this string started or should I state Sting? Take Care, Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 8:22 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Acapulcoite TKW Update Hi Adam. Yes, we completely understand your confusion over all of the different TKW's reported. That is why we are attempting to clarify this issue once and for all. The important thing to note is that the TKW now stands at over 10kg. NAU's website will eventually need to be corrected as will the provisional Met Bulletin once we get this TKW issue sorted out. The TKW of NWA 2714 is 1666g, not 100g. According to the classifying Scientist, our NWA 2714 came from the 7.5kg whole stone that now appears to be wholly accounted for by Stan's and Nelson's
Re: [meteorite-list] fukang meteorite pallasite
Steve...ancient chinese proverb say... Better to get your information straight from horse's mouth than from horse's other end. Cheers -John --- Steve Arnold, Chicago!! [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was told that there is over 900 kilo's of this pallasite.At the munich show I was also told that there was over 100 kilo's of this there.So there is alot to go around.I was also told that a certain meteorite dealer has over 400 kilo's.So I guess there is alot to go around.So where is it all?And when the flood gates open,how much per gram will this be going for?It will be interesting to see how this turns out.I also hear that this is bigger than esquel.WOW!!!But it is also a ruster!I do need to know more about this pallasite.I will be listening. steve arnold,chicago Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD-Announcing NWA 3368 a pink Eucrite containing Diogenite Clasts!
Hello all. We are please to announce another spectacular new achondrite-NWA 3368(prov.). This is a particularly showy and beautiful Eucrite, having diogenite clasts and extremely fine grained basaltic clasts embedded in a light matrix having a pink hue! Many of the larger slices also have sizeable pieces of metal showing! This is a visually striking eucrite, and the scientists that classified it dubbed it the pink eucrite. Specimens are now up on the website. Enjoy! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Mars VISION Meteorite on Ebay
That is a smoking DEAL! I'd jump on it if I were you. A few weeks ago he was asking $30,000,000.00 for it! -John --- Matt Morgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wanna laugh hysterically? http://cgi.ebay.com/A-HUGE-METEORITE-FROM-MARS_W0QQitemZ6570668791QQcategoryZ3239QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem -- Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites http://www.mhmeteorites.com http://www.mrmeteorite.com P.O. Box 151293 Lakewood, CO 80215 USA eBay user id: mhmeteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Fukang
Hi Michael. Yes, what you said was that: It [Fukang] was being offered at less than 10Euros a gram in large chunks, I saw pieces from 100 grams to 2 kilos. I believe the operative phrase here is 'LARGE chunks', not beautiful, 10-20g translucent part slices, but LARGE chunks. 2000g x 10 Euro/gram = ~$24,000.00 That is pretty much the wholesale price for that quantity of Esquel, isn't it? I'm betting that there is currently more Esquel available for the market than Fukang, and most collectors already have Esquel. Almost no one has any Fukang and there are very few places that one could purchase it if they wanted to. We can each make up our own minds as for what that means for the market, but if you think the market is going to be flooded with Fukang, then by all means wait. Cheers -John --- Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I thought I made it clear that it was being offered here at less than 10 euros per gram, if you have some esquel for that price, chunks, slices, or endcuts, you let me know, I will buy, but thus Fukang pallasite, while gorgeous, if fukang huge, and with 900 kilos, or 300 kilos, the market cant hold up a high fukang price. Bob Haag and I were discussing it over many beers at the Hofbrauhaus saturday night, and we both know what is going to happen. High price on market, low sales, then panic and offers very cheap. It has happened to many times before. Mike Farmer -- John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Rob...My personal opinion is that Fukang will not be selling for any less that it has been selling for, and my bet is that, if anything it will be selling for more. When you say Mike saw a whole bunch in Munich, I'm assuming it was less than or equal to 7.7 kilos of mostly end-pieces. In any case, it is pretty clear to me that the majority of the Fukang pallasite will not be hitting the market, and considering that it is the only best looking pallasite out there, I don't think that any of the very few people that have any will be in any big hurry to sell it for less than say...Esquel. If anything my prediction would be that it will be priced well above Esquel. Cheers -John --- Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, to sum up: There isn't a whole lot of fukang meteorite to go round so don't expect the fukang price to go down. If you're looking for a fukang deal you may not a get a fukang specimen. But then Mike saw a whole bunch of fukang meteorites in Munich so the whole fukang market is in question. Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Fukang
Mike Farmer Wrote: Also there was a lot of the ´Fuking` Pallasite from China. It was being offered at less than 10Euros a gram in large chunks, I saw pieces from 100 grams to 2 kilos. Apparently the buyers have divided the massive pallasite up and are now going to flood the market. Looks like a good buying opportunity when the price collapses. It is beautiful stuff, but with over 900 kilos, coming on the market, we know where this goes. Actually, there was probably at most 7.7 kilos of Fukang end-pieces at the Munich show. There is another ~480 kilos at the University of Arizona which is, as far as we know, not ever going to reach the market, and there is another ~480 kg which is destined to be sold as full slices to very wealthy members of the art community at somewhere around $250,000.00 per slice. If anyone thinks there is going to be a flood of Fukang hitting the market, I wouldn't hold my breath. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Fukang
Hi Rob...My personal opinion is that Fukang will not be selling for any less that it has been selling for, and my bet is that, if anything it will be selling for more. When you say Mike saw a whole bunch in Munich, I'm assuming it was less than or equal to 7.7 kilos of mostly end-pieces. In any case, it is pretty clear to me that the majority of the Fukang pallasite will not be hitting the market, and considering that it is the only best looking pallasite out there, I don't think that any of the very few people that have any will be in any big hurry to sell it for less than say...Esquel. If anything my prediction would be that it will be priced well above Esquel. Cheers -John --- Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, to sum up: There isn't a whole lot of fukang meteorite to go round so don't expect the fukang price to go down. If you're looking for a fukang deal you may not a get a fukang specimen. But then Mike saw a whole bunch of fukang meteorites in Munich so the whole fukang market is in question. Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Seymchan, Muonionalusta, other Ebay Listings-Ad
Hello everyone! Thanks to the many of you that made it to Tucson this year. We enjoyed meeting a number of new friends and hope to see you here again next year! We have some very nice meteorite auctions ending on ebay shortly. These include a beautiful Muonionalusta with No Reserve, a huge 367g Seymchan pallasite end-cut w/ no reserve and a ton of other wonderful specimens. Please feel free to check out these and our other auctions at: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZarizona_skies_meteorites_power_sellersQQhtZ-1 Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Did Gibeons Collide?
Hi RubenI think that it may reflect the progression of cooling from different regions which resulted in different crystaline patterns intersecting. I'm sure someone on the list will have a good explanation. We had one with three distinct patterns which was pretty cool too! Check it out: http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com/AZ_Skies_Links/Etched_Meteorites/Etched_Gibeon/3130gEtched_Gibeon/index.html Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Ruben Garcia wrote: Hi All, Can someone explain this... Is it as simple as two Gibeons colliding in space? Or is there some other explanation? This is the 1st cut on a larger Gibeon meteorite. It is common practice for me to etch the 1st piece immediately after it is cut. I do this without any sanding or polishing. Its done for the purpose of checking the etch ( I like to make sure it is a rich brilliant etch before slicing and dicing the entire meteorite.) When this beautiful etch began to appear I started to see two completely different widmanstatten patterns appearing. when the etch was complete after only a few minutes this is what I saw. I've cut and etched hundreds of iron meteorites and etched thousands of slices and never before seen such a distinct separation in two patterns on the same meteorite. Has anyone else ever seen ( outside of a museum) something like this? http://www.geocities.com/meteoritemall/gib1.JPG http://www.geocities.com/meteoritemall/gib2.JPG http://www.geocities.com/meteoritemall/gib3.JPG http://www.geocities.com/meteoritemall/gib4.JPG http://www.geocities.com/meteoritemall/gib5.JPG Thanks, Ruben __ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Nice CAI in a CV3
Hello Martin and MatteoThose are definitely nice CAIs, but definitely check out the CAI at this link!!! http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com/AZ_Skies_Links/NWA_2364/index.html Cheers -John M come Meteorite Meteorites wrote: This is others nice CAI's in my NWA CV http://it.geocities.com/mcomemeteoritecollection/NWA1807.JPG http://it.geocities.com/mcomemeteoritecollection/NWA2180gr.8.9.JPG Matteo --- Martinh [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Hi All, At the Tucson show, I picked up a nice NWA end section with a wonderful CAI. I know, I know, its not an historic L6, but it is pretty cool anyway. When I do talks about the solar system, I like to pass around a CAI for the obvious reasons. Now I can hold one up in front of a class and everyone can see it. Here are some pics of the piece: http://challenge.isu.edu/nwa2086.html Notice the smaller CAI island that drifted off the mainland, looking somewhat like Madagascar off the east coast of Africa. Any thoughts on the CAI would be appreciated. Happy viewing. Martin H __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list = M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info International Meteorite Collectors Association #2140 MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Nuovo Yahoo! Messenger: E' molto pi divertente: Audibles, Avatar, Webcam, Giochi, Rubrica Scaricalo ora! http://it.messenger.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Nice CAI in a CV3
Hi Martin, Rob and everyone! Yes, it could be a crucible shaped CAI with chondritic material within the bowl shaped depression. The American Museum of Natural History is studying this specimen and they think it may be a radically deformed crucible shaped CAI. I will try to post a copy of the abstract on the website as soon as possible. They have not yet performed X-ray tomography, but I am told that this will be one of the analyses performed, and this could reveal whether it is crucible shaped or spherical. Having cut the series of slices accross this CAI I believe that it could definitely be spherical. I think that this may be a more likely scenerio than a fluke dissection for another reason-there are more than one donut shaped CAIs having chondritic material within it in this same stone. It would be very unlikely for me to have accidentally cut two different CAIs to produce this same very unusual effect. Cheers -John Martinh wrote: Hi all CAI lovers, Looking at the jelly doughnut (chondrule-filled CAI), I wondered if the appearance could be misleading. I have seen some CAIs that are rather convoluted meaning in a 3-D view, they might form a cone or other shape where if cut along the right plane, it would appear as if the CAI was completely surrounding the chondrules, but in reality, the chondrule material is actually inside more of a CAI pipe or ice cream cone. Therefore in a cross-section, say through the top of an ice cream cone, it would appear that the cone material was completely encasing the ice cream, but in reality, it is not. Just some thoughts when looking at a wonderful collection of CAIs from around the world. This is what makes this list fun! Cheers, Martin H On Feb 8, 2005, at 8:25 PM, Rob Wesel wrote: I have enjoyed every one of these as NWA 3118 is a favorite of mine but John's in particular begs the question: If CAI's are the oldest things out there then how does chondritic material get completely encapsulated inside of one? We have a lot to learn from this meteorite. Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2005 12:34 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Nice CAI in a CV3 Hello Martin and MatteoThose are definitely nice CAIs, but definitely check out the CAI at this link!!! http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com/AZ_Skies_Links/NWA_2364/ index.html Cheers -John M come Meteorite Meteorites wrote: This is others nice CAI's in my NWA CV http://it.geocities.com/mcomemeteoritecollection/NWA1807.JPG http://it.geocities.com/mcomemeteoritecollection/NWA2180gr.8.9.JPG Matteo --- Martinh [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: Hi All, At the Tucson show, I picked up a nice NWA end section with a wonderful CAI. I know, I know, its not an historic L6, but it is pretty cool anyway. When I do talks about the solar system, I like to pass around a CAI for the obvious reasons. Now I can hold one up in front of a class and everyone can see it. Here are some pics of the piece: http://challenge.isu.edu/nwa2086.html Notice the smaller CAI island that drifted off the mainland, looking somewhat like Madagascar off the east coast of Africa. Any thoughts on the CAI would be appreciated. Happy viewing. Martin H __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list = M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info International Meteorite Collectors Association #2140 MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Nuovo Yahoo! Messenger: E' molto pi divertente: Audibles, Avatar, Webcam, Giochi, Rubrica Scaricalo ora! http://it.messenger.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite
Re: [meteorite-list] Nice CAI in a CV3
Hi GregThat first one sure looks like it could have been a spherical CAI having chondritic material in it. It would be interesting to slice the other one open and study its structure! Cheers -John Greg Hupe wrote: Hello all CAI lovers, Here are a couple of links to some monster sized CAI's from two different NWA 3118 specimens I brought back from a Morocco trip last summer. I have since sold them and they reside in a great home: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa3118/nwa3118a.jpg http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa3118/nwa3118b.jpg Happy viewing, Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection naturesvault meteoritelab [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Martinh [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2005 2:59 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Nice CAI in a CV3 Hi All, At the Tucson show, I picked up a nice NWA end section with a wonderful CAI. I know, I know, its not an historic L6, but it is pretty cool anyway. When I do talks about the solar system, I like to pass around a CAI for the obvious reasons. Now I can hold one up in front of a class and everyone can see it. Here are some pics of the piece: http://challenge.isu.edu/nwa2086.html Notice the smaller CAI island that drifted off the mainland, looking somewhat like Madagascar off the east coast of Africa. Any thoughts on the CAI would be appreciated. Happy viewing. Martin H __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal in Mike's new find from Oman
Congratulations to Mike! Way to go big guy! I think we have all holding our breaths hoping that it would be confirmed soon and now that it has been, it's time to celebrate (and maybe pick up a slice or two ;-) ! Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All, I just got this message from an overjoyed Mike Farmer. Overjoyed and freaking out because of the following message. Sincerest congrats, you lucky one !!! Bernd, I am at the tucson show and from this hotel no posts go out to the list. Can you please post that I have just received confirmation on my find from Oman, it is a LUNAR, highlands microbreccia full of impact melted clasts of both mare and highlands componants! It is likely to be a uniqe lunar, certainly not paired with any Oman finds! Oh my god Bernd, I am just freaking out that I found my own moon rock with my own eyes and hands! Thanks, Mike __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fractal Etch In New East African Iron
Hello all...we would like to share a photo of a new east African Iron meteorite that has an amazing fractal-like etch pattern. When we showed this to John Wasson at UCLA he said that he had never seen a pattern like it before. We have posted a high resolution image which can be viewed at the following link: http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com/New_Iron/index.html Be patient as it is a very high resolution image and may take a minute or two to download on dial ups. Once the page loads, click on the image and zoom in and then zoom in further. You will see etch patterns within etch patterns within etch patterns-really amazing! Hope you enjoy and we'll see you here in Tucson. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New Primative Achondrite paired w/ NWA 3133 Available! Ad
Hello everyone...we are looking forward to seeing many of you here at the Tucson show and are pleased to announce that we will be offering beautiful (and comparatively large) part slices from a newly classifed primative achondrite NWA 2643 in the near future at very reasonable prices. NWA 2643 has been provisionally paired with NWA 3133 of which we have heard so much hoopla on the list and which one dealer has been selling for $375 per gram! We will be offering our slices for a fraction of that price! This is a really interesting and unique primative achondrite fall in that it has been referred to as the first known CV7 and is thought to have formed through metamorphic or igneous processes deep within the parent CV body. For an abstract further describing one member of this fall see: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/nph-bib_query?bibcode=2004AGUFM.P31C..02Iamp;db_key=AST If you are interested in adding some of this very unusual primative achondrite to your collection at a reasonable price contact us as we are taking pre-orders now and can cut to your specifications. Also, be sure to contact us while you are in Tucson to make arrangements to see some of our other spectacular new meteorites including our new Chinese Pallasite, several extremely rare and unique new irons and numerous other chondrites and achondrites including our planetary NWA 2373. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NWA 3133 Real Deal-blah blah blah
Dear Greg and Adam...Please stop trying to start trouble on this list and save your sale pitches for the used car lot. If either of you had any class you wouldn't try to butt in on other dealers ads right after they had been posted and you wouldn't make reckless comments impugning Ted Bunch or other meteorite dealers. As far as our primitive achondrite NWA 2643 is concerned, it has been microprobed and was paired to NWA 3133 by Ted Bunch. No second guessing involved whatsoever. So Adam and Greg if you want to continue to argue about this topic please take it off the list and take it up with Dr. Bunch as we are really not the least bit interested in any of your opinions. As for the collectors that are interested in our newly classified primitive achondrite NWA 2643, we are sure that we will be able to offer expertly prepared part slices for a fraction of the price that other dealers are offering similar over priced materials for. Kindest regards -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com Greg Hupe wrote: Dear list members, We start the Official NWA 3133 material out at just 99 cents every week on ebay and let the market determine the value. NWA 3133 has several published abstracts, is official and its provenance is unquestionable because of oxygen isotope testing. Get a piece of the meteorite that started it all and is the only official CV7 in existence, no need for second guessing. We have seen too much material that is close to the real deal, but no comprehensive testing was completed of the others and/or microprobe data has proven them not to be paired. We are currently taking orders for Complete Slices , Part Slices or what ever type of specimen you would like. We will cut thin and diamond lap polish BOTH sides to meet the high standards set for material from The Hupe Collection. Why buy second guess material when you can have the one that started it all, Official NWA 3133! Accepting custom orders now at [EMAIL PROTECTED] where you will not be disappointed in ANY aspect of the deal. Best regards, Greg and Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection [EMAIL PROTECTED] naturesvault meteoritelab IMCA 2185 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] boy, am I lucky!
Hi Michael...Sorry to burst your bubble, but I think that Tom has already laid claim to that rare, one of a kind beauty (see thread earlier this week on the Wow-NEW Meteorite from Kenya-Sounds Great! Michael L Blood wrote: Boy, am I ever lucky! Look what I just got offered: -- Dear Sir. am pleased to write to you about a wonderful stone that seems to have live in it..the following are its characteristics. a] it powerfully radiates alot of light.sort of rainbow colours-very beautiful b] it disables mobile phones or anything electronic around it. c] it moves by itself on exposure to sunlight to where there is shade. d] if there is no shade it digs wanting to bury itself in the sand or soil. e] its untouchable it paralyses the body or the hands in contact if you near it or touch it. f] its so powerful you cannot look at it with your naked eyes.the eyes get dizzily on wearing gas goggles g] its the size of a human head-10kg __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Wow-NEW Meteorite from Kenya-Sounds Great!
Just received this URGENT email. If anyone is interested in the meteorite described below I'll forward the seller's contact information- ;-) -John Dear Sir, Am very pleased to write to you this evening about a meteorite on sale by us in Nairobi Kenya east Africa.the following are its characteristics. 1.it radiates /emits allot of light--rainbow colors 2.it moves by itself on exposure to sunlight to where there is a shade 3..if there is no shade it digs wanting to bury itself in the ground 4.its untouchable it paralyzes the body or the hands in contact/if you near it or touch it 5.its so powerful you cannot look at it with your naked eyes 6. its the size of a human head--about 10kg. sir i believe this thing is straight from heaven cos its so wonderful.i request you with the above characteristics to tell me how much you would buy it per gram or per kilogram.a number of embassies have shown allot of interest but the highest binder takes it. waiting to hear from you,as soon as it can be possible, for Afrique Jewels regards, Philip. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Magnetic meteorites
Hi Doug, Steve allDoug I think you may have really hit on something- Refrigerator Meteor-Magnets! Every refrigerator should have a coupleYou can etch them and use them to hold up your shopping list, chore list, etc. I think we'll start offering them on ebay in the near future! Even better...Tom might be able to etch a picture of Granny on the meteorite and we could have etched-granny-meteorite-magnets for everyone's refrigerator! Cheers thanks for a great idea! -John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve, you're fine. Generally with meteorites the more strongly magnetic the specimen the more iron metal. There are some many uses of the word magnetic in exactly the way you use it, in the Cambridge Encyclopedia of Meteorites that it sounds like you might be able to give Bob Evans some help on the concept. Saludos, Doug PS I have a meteorite that is a magnet. It's easy to make them from most magnetic metals like your new meteorite. Just store it with a strong magnet attached for a while and even just filing it can make a magnetic iron a permanent magnet right away. It'll be weaker thanthe original magnet, though. Mu Toluca got so magnetic it sticks to the refrigerator door. I was thinking sending a certain person one of these as a peace offering:) Other magnetic metals in the same sense as iron, are, nickel, cobalt and gadolinium...the actual term is ferromagnetic. Chromium and Maganese are actually antiferromagnetic. When someone says magnetic they are referring to any kind of magnetic property at all, not just the ability to sustain magnetic poles like a permanent magnet. The correct word to describe that is that the material is magnetized. Magnetized means it has the properties of a permanent magnet/ Magnetic means whatever the users wants remotely related to magnets, the metals they attract, of the fields they produce, etc. etc. Hope this clears it up until the next round... Congrats on the new acquisition! Saludos, Doug En un mensaje con fecha 01/19/2005 5:49:27 PM Mexico Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribe: With all due respect Steve You claimed that your new meteorite is very magnetic. That's about as annoying as the oriented - orientated debate. From what I understand Magnetic means having the properties of a magnet. Does your new meteorite attract Iron like a magnet? Probably not !! I see this used all of the time, so, am I missing something ? Is there some meteorite out there that I've never heard of that can attract Iron magnetically? Thanks Bob Evans __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: . . . Things to see near Tucson
Hi Walter...you've got to check out the SR-71 here in Tucson! It's gorgeous! They've also got a superb F-4U Corsair, a beautiful B-24 and numerous other amazing aircraft! -John Walter Branch wrote: Hi Geoff, the Saturn 5 booster to Cape Kennedy) and one of two actual B-52s that launched the X-15 to the edge of space. Not to mention JFK's private plane, a B-17, an immaculate B-29, a family of MIGs and . . . well, Man, I have got to get out to Tucson one day! I recently took a trip to the Museum of Aviation at Warner Robbins Air Force Base in Warner Robbins, Georgia. I specifically went to see an actual SR71 Blackbird, all of which no longer fly. Unfortunately, the Air Force was having some sort of ceremony in the hanger in which it is stored and I could not get in. ARGH! Want to see the coolest aviation history website? Check this out: http://www.museumofaviation.org/home.htm Oh, almost forgot meteorite -Walter __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Mundrabilla designation question
Hello Martin and List. According to Wasson and Kallemeyn (2002) Geochimica et Cosmochimica Acta, Vol. 66, No. 13, pp. 24452473. The members of the Mundrabilla duo, Waterville (1.63) and Mundrabilla (1.64), are FeS-rich irons, closely related to each other in structure and composition. They are within the sLL scatter field on most diagrams, but plot slightly low on the Ga-, Ge-, and W-Au diagrams. Because of these discrepancies and their very high FeS contents, we list them as ungrouped but they could also be designated anomalous members of the sLL subgroup. Hope this helps! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Martin Altmann wrote: Sal list, in painting my specimen chits, I ask myself, how to denominate Mundrabilla correctly. Old Catalogue has simply IRANOM, 2000er Grady Catalogue says IIICD and anomalous, now with the finer Au-stuff and the subgroups, I read, that Mundrabilla and Waterville are close to sLL. Shall I write now IAB-ANOM? Will the anomalous disappear, if the five-of-a-kind-rule for the subgroup is fullfilled and beside Waterville, three other Mundrabilla-like irons will habe been found? Or refers the anom to the troilites, silicates or to the smallness of the taenite crystals (which make etched Mundrabillas to the most beautiful irons, one can imagine. One of my favourites)? Thanks! Martin __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Exqusite New Iron -Ad
Hello everyone! We have just listed an exqusite, full slice of an extremely rare new North African Iron on ebay. You can take a look at the following link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=6505705347ssPageName=ADME:B:LC:US:1 Enjoy! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Announcing NEW Iron Meteorite w/ extremely unusual etch pattern-Ad
Hello all. We are very pleased to announce a truly amazing new iron meteorite. A single mass of 1650g was found in 2004 in the western sahara. This iron had a very unusual appearance and when we cut a sample for analysis we were amazed by the bizarre etch pattern. It has a micro-etch pattern consisting of thousands of tiny, brilliant individual crystals which shimmer like tiny diamonds in the light. It has a nickel content of 11.8% and a high gold content. To check out this exquisite new desert iron go to our website and click on the NWA 2428 link-it is definitely worth a look! Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Etch Pattern of New Chinese Pallasite -Ad
Hello everyone. We've been wondering what if any Windmanstatten our new Chinese pallasite would have, but up until now, have not had time to check it out. We have finally started getting caught up following the holidays and have etched several pieces. It has a very cool etch reminescent of Toluca. If you are interested in seeing some examples they can be found at the following link: http://search.ebay.com/china-pallasite_W0QQsokeywordredirectZ1QQfromZR8 Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] gmails
It is really beyond me why anyone would be trying to pawn off Free Gmail accounts on behalf of Google. First of all nothing is Free. If someone tells you otherwise they are lying. Secondly, why would anyone waste their time trying to promote Google unless they were a Google employee and were paid to do so? I wouldn't! Thirdly, as Mike pointed out, this is a meteorite list and not a forum for promoting Google freebies. Finally, if anyone bothers to take the time to perform even a perfunctory search on Gmail you will find numerous reasons Not to sign up for a Gmail account. Stop and ask yourself why Google would be offering this service for free. For instance: http://forums.techguy.org/t219388.html -John Michael Farmer wrote: What the hell are you talking about? I am not an AOL user. I am sick of reading about stupid free email accounts. This is a meteorite list. If someone wants GMAIL account, let them find it themselves. I have a pile of free pet food samples to give away. Want some? Michael Farmer - Original Message - From: J. Hirschmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] gmails Mike, I have also some to give away, you as a aol user stay in the aol worldHa, never mind. Joachim and anyway, YOU might not want to, but there are others who had asked me to advise when I had more. Just delete Mike, just delete. ---Original Message--- From: Michael Farmer Date: 01/05/05 17:03:25 To: Dave Harris; metlist Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] gmails Why do you people keep advertising that crap. everyone here seems to have an email account, so please, I don't want to hear about GMAIL again. Mike Farmer - Original Message - From: Dave Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: metlist meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] gmails Hi, I suspect that you are probably all gmailed out but... I have another 4 gmail accts to give away! 1st come c. best! dave Sec.BIMS IMCA #0092 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] gmails
Probably Not, but for a nominal fee you can get 2 MB of email storage from other reliable vendors and not have Google reading through your emails, storing the content and selling the information to third parties. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/04/03/google_mail_is_evil_privacy/ -John Darren Garrison wrote: On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 10:29:28 -0700, Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If someone wants GMAIL account, let them find it themselves. I have a pile of free pet food samples to give away. Want some? Do your free pet food samples provide you with one gigabyte of free on-line storage (suitable for file swapping) and is available by invitation only? If so, I'll take some of those wonderous magical pet food samples. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] gmail warning
For those of you so interested in saving a buck, here is something to read BEFORE you sign up for Free gmail. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/04/03/google_mail_is_evil_privacy/ -John Darren Garrison wrote: On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 10:29:28 -0700, Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If someone wants GMAIL account, let them find it themselves. I have a pile of free pet food samples to give away. Want some? Do your free pet food samples provide you with one gigabyte of free on-line storage (suitable for file swapping) and is available by invitation only? If so, I'll take some of those wonderous magical pet food samples. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] GREAT NEWS FOR COLLECTORS DEALERS ALIKE!
Hi everyone! Some of you may already be aware of this, but the US postal service has a recently introduced a new service by which you can mail an item of any weight for a flat rate of $7.70 to anywhere in the US via priority mail! For dealers and collectors alike this is fantastic news! You can fit a 45+ pound meteorite into this new flat rate box and ship it to New York from the west coast for just $7.70 via priority mail! The old rate would have been $80 or more! Take advantage of this service while it lasts! Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] More NEW Chinese Pallasites! -Ad
Hello everyone and Happy New Year! All but one of our new Chinese Pallasite specimens that we listed on ebay have sold. For those of you that missed the opportunity to add one of these lovely new pallasites to your collection, we have listed several more specimen on ebay. We are also taking requests if there is a particular size, shape or cut that you're looking for just let us know and do our best to provide if for you. Even if you're not currently in the market for a new pallasite, take a look. http://search.ebay.com/china-pallasite_W0QQfromZR40QQsojsZ1 Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] More NEW Chinese Pallasites! - TKW????
Hello Bernhard and Mike. Yes, that is correct, there is a large mass that is estimate to weigh about 1500 kg +/- 300 kg. Unfortunately, it is unlikely that this mass will be leaving China any time soon, and it may never be available. We do have some small pieces from this mass which we are making available in the form of slices, end-cuts and intact pieces, so if you are interested in adding a really nice new pallasite you can wait and see whether any more the 1500kg piece ever becomes available or you can get a piece now for sure. Cheers -John Dawn Michael Farmer wrote: A whopping ~1,500 kilos! Yes, this is the largest pallasite in the world. Mike Farmer - Original Message - From: Bernhard Rems [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'John Birdsell' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 3:17 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] More NEW Chinese Pallasites! - TKW BTW, what's the TKW of this Pallasite? You don't mention it on ebay... Bernhard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Birdsell Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 11:13 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] More NEW Chinese Pallasites! -Ad Hello everyone and Happy New Year! All but one of our new Chinese Pallasite specimens that we listed on ebay have sold. For those of you that missed the opportunity to add one of these lovely new pallasites to your collection, we have listed several more specimen on ebay. We are also taking requests if there is a particular size, shape or cut that you're looking for just let us know and do our best to provide if for you. Even if you're not currently in the market for a new pallasite, take a look. http://search.ebay.com/china-pallasite_W0QQfromZR40QQsojsZ1 Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Look Here ! Best Chondrules I have seen .
Hi Steve and thanks for posting that oneIt's GORGEOUS!!! What is it? -John Steven Drummond wrote: Hi List, I forgot to put the weight of this slice , it is 2.15 grams . Slice is 1 1/4 by 7/8 . The link... http://www.strufe.net/IMG_0317.jpg Regards, Steven __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] How to help Tsunami Victims
Hello Pierre and Bernhard. Actually most of the reputable aid organizations allow you to make donations to the Tsunami releif effort directly online using you credit card. This would be a much more effective way to help as there would not be any deduction in paypal fees and you can choose your favorite organization. For a list of organizations giving aid to the Tsunami victims click on the link below: http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/international/earthquake/tsunami122604.aspx It is a good idea to check out how much of your donation will actually be used to help victims. For example, 'Save the Children.org' uses 90% of donations to help victims. Some organizations use ~ 85% and some probably less. Now is a great time to help out the vicitms of this devastating natural disaster. Happy New Years all! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Pelé Pierre-Marie wrote: Hello Bernhard, In fact, I didn't think of it when I wrote my email. Usually, Paypal takes a fee on every payment received. (that's how they earn money... mainly) So, I've written to Paypal to ask for them if they accept to not collecting this fee for each payment sent. I hope to have a positive answer as soon as possible. Pierre --- Bernhard Rems [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Does paypal stay away from collecting fees fort he donations? Bernhard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pelé Pierre-Marie Sent: Saturday, January 01, 2005 8:33 PM To: MeteoriteList Subject: [meteorite-list] ** Call to the Meteorite Community for helpingAsia ** Hello to the List. New Year is ordinary a time of enjoyment but this year was an awful tsunami in Asia. Because I think we can get much money from the Meteorite Community, I'm opening a financial support on my Paypal account. You can send money on my Paypal account ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) in euros or dollars and in 15 days I'll give this money to the french association Medecins sans frontiere (a big independant medical aid agency) for helping asian countries. I ask you to write in Paypal HELP FOR ASIA as statement. Regularly, I'll tell you total amount collected on this account. DATE LIMIT : 15 JANUARY 2005 PAYPAL ACCOUNT : [EMAIL PROTECTED] I thank you in advance for your help. That's the way I've found for collecting a large amount of money because together we can make surely more that individually. Pierre-Marie PELE www.meteor-center.com Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d'espace de stockage pour vos mails ! Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur http://fr.mail.yahoo.com/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d'espace de stockage pour vos mails ! Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur http://fr.mail.yahoo.com/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NEWLY DISCOVERED CHINESE PALLASITE FINALLY AVAILABLE!!! Ad
Hello Everyone! We hope you all had a wonderful holiday. We are please to announce that we have finally finished preparing a number of our specimens of gorgeous new Pallasite from China. This pallasite has amazing, large orange olivine crystals and appears to be very stable along the lines of Imilac, Esquel or Glorieta Mountain. Our specimens have been polished to a mirror-like finish, and are even more gorgeous than the photos reveal. To see our available specimens click the following link: http://stores.ebay.com/Arizona-Skies-Meteorites We also have a number of beautiful Al Mahbas pallasite specimens still available on our website, and we will be announcing several more very interesting new meteorites shortly. Cheers Happy New Year! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Over $20, 000 of Meteorites Listed on Ebay Now!!! Ad
Hello everyone...we have over $20,000 worth of gorgeous meteorites listed on ebay. Many of these would make fantastic Christmas Gifts. The listings include planetary meteorites, 4 types of pallasite, achondrites, and numerous irons including a huge 520g Henbury full slice! To view these simply click on the following link: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQgotopageZ1QQsassZarizonaQ5fskiesQ5fmeteoritesQ5fpowerQ5fsellersQQsorecordsperpageZ50QQsosortpropertyZ1 Thanks for looking! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] If I was not so poor!
Tom...If I were you, I'd save my money up and get a NEW one. ;-) -John Tom AKA James Knudson wrote: Boy, I wish I could get this one! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemcategory=3239item=2294923999; rd=1 Thanks, Tom peregrineflier IMCA 6168 http://www.frontiernet.net/~peregrineflier/Peregrineflier.htm __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Last 5 Slices of NEW IIICD IRON NWA 2677 posted!!! Ad
Hi everyone! Well we finally managed to get the last five slices of the new IIICD NWA 2677 posted on the website. It took a bit longer than we had hoped, but they're up. They have a beautiful etch and a nickel content of 12.8%. These are the last five slices that will be available for sale to the public, so take a look at the photos and if you're planning on picking up a full slice of this lovely new iron now is the time to do so. Take care! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] John's Interesting Iron Meteorite, NWA 2677
Hi Mark and List. Thanks for posting your photo of our new IIICD (IAB sLM). Actually, I think that it would plot within the old IIIC grouping which Wasson Kallemyne (2000) have now placed in the IAB iron complex, subgroup LM. The 'L' stands for Low Au content and the 'M' stands for 'medium' nickel content. In this meteorite, the nickel content is 12.8%. If anyone would like to read about the new IAB groupings, the reference is: Wasson, J.T. and Lakkemeyn, G. W. IAB iron-meteorite complex: A group, five subgroups, numerous grouplets, closely related, mainly formed by crrystal segregation in rapidly cooling melts. Geochimica et Cosmochimica Acta, Vol. 66, No. 13, pp. 2445-2473, 2002 If you can not find this reference anywhere, just email us and we'll send you a pdf. We will put up our last few slices of this lovely new IIICD this afternoon. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites MARK BOSTICK wrote: Hello John and list, I recently picked up a small piece of NWA 2677 from John Birdsell. An interesting iron meteorite of 100g. It has been provisionally classified as a ?IICD (aka: IAB subclass LM).? noted from John? website. I am not really an iron expert, but I guess that means fine octahedrite. The meteorite itself is somewhat confusing, as the nickel content doesn? seen to line up well with any of the IIICD? except the Ataxites I suppose, but this has a obvious bold octahedrite pattern. I managed a pretty good photo of my slice on my collection page. (I now have studio lights and equipment...which also of course means, my camera is giving me problems now...:-( http://www.meteoritearticles.com/colnwa2677.html Also, John asked about possible pairs. Doing a little research on the iron I have found the following meteorite classified somewhat close and location of find possibly close. Could this be a possible pair? Hassi-Jekna, IIICD, found El Golea, Algeria in 1890, TKW 1890, Bandwidth .47mm. Clear Skies, Mark Bostick www.meteoritearticles.com www.kansasmeteoritesociety.com www.imca.cc __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] More Al Mahbas Pallasites New Photos Added-Ad
Hello everyoneWe have added several more specimens of the extremely rare Al Mahbas pallasite to our website along with new photos of the previous specimens. These specimens range from around 3 up to over 6 grams and are loaded with gorgeous olivine crystals. The interesting thing about this pallasite is the tiny size of many of the olivine crystals, which makes it look like a miniture version of a normal pallasite-quite unusual. Time permitting, we will hopefully be adding a new Ureilite tomorrow, so please check back. Also don't miss out on the beautiful new IIICD Iron NWA 2677. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] call me a naughty boy
Hi Steve and congratulations on your new digital Camera! Can I have the old one that you received last year for Christmas (it would fit nicely into my Christmas stocking and make me really happy too!). Thanks! -John Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! wrote: I just found out that I am getting a samsung 4 megapixel digital camera for christmas.I guess santa will give me coal for christmas for being a naughty boy for peeking.Hell, digital pictures are right around the bend.HE---HW!! A NAUGHTY BOY!! = Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 I. M. C. A. MEMBER #6728 Illinois Meteorites website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/illinoismeteorites/ __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Morocco new fall news.
Hello Mike and Welcome home! Dawn and I are both releived to hear that you made it back safely. No meteorite is worth taking that kind of risk! One may get lucky once or twice, but by tempting fate like that, fate will eventually catch up with you. Sounds as though the military is probably staking out that area and sending regular patrols to try to catch the meteorite hunters. Anyone that takes you up on your offer is totally nuts! Take care -John Dawn Michael Farmer wrote: Hello everyone, I have just arrived back in Tucson after one of the most difficult and dangerous trips I have ever done. I was in Morocco for the last week to investigate the new fall and a new Pallasite. Everything that could have gone wrong on this trip, did, so I left Morocco very quickly and returned home. I will make a very long story short but it should serve as a warning to all. I got some of the new Pallasite last month in Morocco, and planned a trip to go to the site of the meteorite find. It is in Western Sahara, right on the Algeria/Morocco/Mauritania borders. This is the same Pallasite that John Birdsell has some of. I was assured that it was no problem to go to the area, but when I got to Assa, we changed into a very old military vehicle, this is when I should have realized that something was wrong. When we got to Zag, we detoured off road for about 20 kilometers to avoid the town and police/military checkpoints. The meteorite is 30 kilometers south and east of Al Mahbas Western Sahara, and when we got about 20 kilometers from the area, we went off-road. That is when the Moroccans told me that this was a military-only, prohibited zone, and that we were not allowed there! I of course got a little concerned (especially when we saw several mine-fields. We were driving cross-country at night with no lights, only by full moonlight, (not a safe thing in an old war zone where mine-fields are still around). The next morning we arrived at the tent of the nomad who found the pallasite. He led us there, over the berm and military fighting emplacements to the site, Algeria was only about 2 kilometers away. The place is a small area about 10 meters across, many pieces, mostly shale fragments full of olivine crystals, and some small individuals. I searched it for about an hour and found many pieces, and one of the other Moroccans found a piece about 80 grams, just metal, no crystals. We had planned a careful search, but one of the Moroccans spotted a military patrol coming so we packed up quickly and fled. It is very flat there, nowhere to hide. They chased us for about 2 hours but we were too far ahead and they could not catch up, but it was close enough for me. An American with Metal-detectors, GPS,s, video cameras, and Satellite phones, is not welcome in a closed military zone. I had to hide as much as possible, dressed like a Moroccan, under blankets, until we left Western Sahara and got back to Assa. It was not a fun trip, and when we got to Assa, the hotel owner found out we had been in Al Mahbas and called the local military colonel, who promptly arrived to find out why we were in a prohibited area, and demanded a large bribe to allow us to avoid some very serious problems. The bribe was paid needless to say, but they had my information and copy of my passport from the hotel. I immediately demanded to get back to civilization and get the hell out of the country, which I did. I will give everyone the coordinates of the Pallasite, and anyone with the cajones to go there can be my guest. I have been around the world many times, and to worse places than this, but there is nothing that will put the fear of god in you like driving as fast as the vehicle will go for hours with military chasing you through mine-fields! This business can get dangerous as I just found out. On the second note, we also dealt with the new fall there, and it is a total disaster. I did not bother to go to the site, as all of my guys were there and none of them got any of the meteorite, and the people who had it offered it to them for $6 to $10 gram! I think that is absolutely ludicrous and anyone who pays that will seriously regret it as I expect it will be $1.00 gram soon enough, like Amgala and Bensour, the price will spike at the beginning, and collapse when more and more comes out. There is a lot of it, many kilos and it will be available. I had other problems to deal with there and the new fall was the least on my list. There is a lot more to this entire story, but this is the gist of it. For me, the Moroccans have become far to untrustworthy lately and I am likley done with that mess over there. Michael Farmer __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo
[meteorite-list] TWO NEW PALLASITES AVAILABLE! FROM CHINA, SAHARA!!!-Ad
Hello Meteorite List members. We are very please to announce that we have not one, but two new, previously unclassified Pallasites available. One is from the Sahara and the other is from China. If you are interested please feel free to contact us off list for more information. We will be posting both in the coming weeks. We will also be announcing several other very exciting new meteorites in the coming weeks, so stay tuned... Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] NWA's
Hi Larry, Mike and list. Yes, at first this sounds like good advice, however this can lead to numerous problems as well. For instance I obtained a beautiful large chunk of NWA 482 in a trade with you Mike, and I know that numerous other dealers also have NWA 482 for sale. If we were only to purchase from the dealer who had the meteorite classified then this would pretty much eliminate such trades as all such traded pieces would become worthless. Another example is Dhofar 019. There must be 20 dealers all legitimacy selling this shergottite, which they themselves purchased wholesale. Now if everyone were only to buy from the individual that had Dhofar 019 classified (Serge), then Serge would be stuck with around a kilo of Martian rock with no market for it except for the retail market. He would be relegated to selling off 200 mg here and 300 mg there for the next forty years. This would make the acquisition of large, rare rocks retarded unless someone wanted to spend 40 years recouping their initial investment. The same can be said for hundreds of other meteorites. This also screws the collector who may want to sell one of his expensive meteorites to buy something else. If everyone only purchases from the person that originally had the meteorite classified then the resale value of these meteorites would be zero. I don't think that the collectors are going to appreciate paying top dollar for some expensive planetary meteorite and then being told that Oh yeah, by the way don't try to sell that expensive meteorite that we just sold you because you are not the one that had it classified and no one will buy it from you. This would really piss me off if I were the collector that had spent my hard earned money on an expensive and rare meteorite specimen. The best thing for dealers to do is to get their meteorites classified by a legitimate research institution, and to use their own numbers. If they want, they can say my NWA XXX is probably paired to NWA YYY or my NWA is paired to NWA ZZZ depending upon the provisional or final classification respectively. For those buyers that want to be sure they are getting properly classified and named specimens, they should keep track of which dealers do follow the Nom. Com. guidelines and avoid those that do not. Fortunately the overwhelming majority of dealers are honest and play by the rules. Unfortunately, there is a lot of BS being put on the meteorite-list by certain meteorite dealers of the my meteorite is better than yours sort. Don't be fooled by this non-sense either-it is just a transparent attempt at self promotion. There are a lot of very reputable meteorite dealers out there that do not engage in these types of sales tactics, and I would prefer to support these honest, reputable dealers. Cheers -John Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com Michael Farmer wrote: Larry, this is the problem I was getting at. I will tell you the simple solution, buy the meteorite from the dealer who had it classified, then there can be no error. Mike Farmer - Original Message - From: Larry Harrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:54 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA's Greetings List, I am but a small time collector (200 specimens). However, I cherish my small example of the evolution of the solar system. I am also an astronomy educator. I always include meteorites in my lectors AND I am always asked how do you know if it is really a meteorite? My answer: Irons are simple to recognize, and I explain the widmanstatten figure and how it forms. Stones on the other hand require analysis especially when chondrules (I explain chondrules) are not easily visible. In those cases it is very important to know your source. I have always made it clear that I only deal with reputable dealers. The posts of late have put a very large question in my mind about who is reputable. The saddest part is that many reputable dealers are being scamed by the Nomads. I prefer to collect the rarest of the rare. And this is where most of the scams are being made. My absolute certainty of the authenticity of my collection is now in question! I do not question that any piece in my collection is or isn't a meteorite, but that it is not the specimen type that I think it is. I have always been more than excited about the immense number of new and rare meteorites coming out of the Sahara. If not for these finds I could never afford as many representations of the early solar system or of the achondrites of lessor differentiated bodies. I am crushed, uncertain and totally confused! What to do? Since I am not a big time buyer, my reluctance to purchase further NWA's will not hurt any of you. However, I feel that I am Mr. Average. If this mess curbs my desire to purchase more meteorites, I assure you it is doing the same to many more. This is the saddest moment in my 20
Re: [meteorite-list] NWA's, Dealers, Science, NomCom
Hi Doug and thanks for the interesting idea. I suppose that could work
if every dealer kept perfect records of every piece, slice, part slice,
and part, part slice that they ever bought or sold. The question then
would be, who would be the Meteorite Auditors to track down the few
offending dealers that may decide to fake a meteorite ID number, say
NWA 123,9,25,3,2 and track it through all the hands that is has passed
and sub-divisions that it has been cut into to verify that it is
really NWA 123,9,25,3,2? What happens if someone along the chain of
custody accidentally transposed the 3 and the 2 in the ID number, and
this got passed down the line? Some end recipient could then be accused
by the Meteorite Auditors of faking the piece after an audit exposed
the problem. Who is going to spend their time trying to resolve this
inevitable issues? I can just see our friends on the Meteorite-List
bickering over whether they have proper claim to NWA 123,9,25, 3,2 or
NWA 123,9,25,2,3!
Cheers
-John
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hello John, Larry, Mike, Michael, List,
I want to respond to John's point of view on Mike's dramatic suggestion that we acquire
NWA's only from the dealer that classified it.
Mike - good post. My only wincing is that the dealer doesn't classify it. A
Met Soc approved researcher does mi cuate. I know you know that but it won't hurt to
remind you, I think, with my respects, as always to you for a bang-up job. I am in
agreement with the spirit of your post and with that of John's with has me thinking you
are both way too right, extreme and impractical. What you have done IMHO is make a
perfect combined argument to get all the dealers off their alleged lazy and greedy duffs
to do the right thing.
John - Your post was good as usual, but more jaded than I am accustomed to coming from
you. This Trust argument alternative holds no water personally since folks
like me and I assume like Larry are not interested in doing credit and background checks
on dealers. And without folks like me and I assume like Larry all you dealers will be
soon stuck in a pyramid scheme with each other on Meteorite pricing which everyone's
free-for-all neglect of scientific protocol has created and sales have happily fomented.
So Listen, please and stop blaming the nomads gangs (wow that was a laugher)
or Habibi or Hupe or whoever and distancing yourselves - this is a collective problem,
period.
John, other than the trust monopoly exclusive club smelling thing you
suggest, I think you have not added your usual eye-opening value to Mike's post. The
answer [I think] here is to add the stone and fragment numbers to conserve the
classification process. Like NWA 6000, 2, 4 {...}. And keep a copy of the original
classification card. In this hypothetical exaple case, the NWA 6000 stone #2 slice 4. I
stole the idea from Dr. Grossman and NASA curators. It works. Then if you cut the slice
in half and give your partner the second half, she has NWA 6000,2,4,2. Don't make this
confusing. sheesh, it is just adding a number and only when necessary to your little
piece of heaven, not cataloging the entire stone.
Larry, let me give you the reason I think no one has done this. It isn't some far flung
idea - there is a great scientific precedent now and for years. My opinion is that
meteorite dealers just don't want to deal with the paperwork. What a
PATHETIC excuse of theirs. They know enough to know who they bought the piece from and
how much they sold it to you for. And the tax authority probably requires it anyway,
too, but let's let the tax authority police them on that. The other half is that they
don't want you to know where they got it from. Another pathetic excuse to sacrifice the
science you buy for their blindly greedy benefits.
The elementary school library has the Dewey Decimal system, what a great model,
and first graders can handle it, but not us. Ho Hum. I bet a German cat could
handle it. It is the same no-brainer thing.
So no one is asking from John for his new esquisite Sahara iron these numbers, and he won't send them to you
(or will he:)). So let's not just blame the dealers, but take our ownership as well. No more
I don't know what to do, it's a meteorite jungle out there. Just a courteous question to the
dealer. Can you tell me the fragment number I am buying? If they squeal on that one you know
you are dealing with a pig. If they are honest you're not buying a pig in a poke.
Dealers, well now that I'm in boiling water, how is this: We are not
interested in your name or your competitors original card. It should just be the MetSoc
approved researcher's card. OK scientists, taxonomists, Jeff and committe members. Here
is your chance to shine...can you suggest a simple card filled out by the researcher when
classifying all specimens of a #?. No dealers need apply. How handsome my collection
of 50 meteoritic scraps (and one nice
[meteorite-list] Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!
Hi EveryoneWe just wanted to wish everyone a happy thanksgiving and a safe Holiday! Special thanks to Michael Blood for sharing his thanksgiving parrot joke ;-) Cheers -John Dawn __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: New IIICD Iron Meteorite Available!
Hello Everyone! We are happy to announce a NEW Saharan Iron-NWA 2677 (prov.)! This exceptional little iron is a new, and particularily beautiful iron from the Saharan desert. It has been provisionally classified as a IIICD (it appears to group closely to the IAB subclass LM). Classification data will be submitted to the Nom. Com. shortly. Saharan irons are rare and this one is particularly rare with a total known weight prior to cutting of just 100 grams. After accounting for the 21 grams being donated to Science as type specimens and cutting losses, there are only about 60-65 grams available for collectors. This lovely little iron has moderately high nickel content of 12.8% and is quite stable. It has a very attractive etch! Please feel free to check out the photos! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] My Eyes Are Glazing Over- Need Scorecard
Hi PaulThere is an easily usable seach engine for the lists archives located at the bottom of the Meteorite-List archives. (http://www.meteoritecentral.com/archives.shtml) If, when you click on the email of interest it says Not found just click on cashed and you be able to read even the old email posts to the list. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Paul H wrote: It is hard to search back through the innumerable posts, given the lack of a search engine specifically for the archives, to find out the details behind each specific number is being talked about... Yours, Paul Baton Rouge, LA __ Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today! http://my.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Enjoy this beauty
Bernhard-Congratulations! That is a Gorgeous piece! Well worth a look for those that haven't yet! -John Arizona Skies Meteorites Bernhard Rems wrote: http://www.meteoritegallery.com/gallery/viennametcoll/757_dho_535_1 My latest acquisition - I just LOVE ungrouped meteorites :-). Bernhard __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers
Hi Matt and list. I'm not an expert on the topic, but I think that part of the problem may also be that meteorites such as those belonging to the HED group are quite heterogeneous. If one sample contains a slightly higher diogenite component it may come back as a howardite while a sample with a lower diogenite component may come back as a eucrite. I would imagine that two samples from the same stone could conceivably come back with a different classification. If anyone can comment on this and correct me if I'm wrong I would appreciate it! Cheers -John Matt Morgan wrote: Just to add a note... There is a fundamental scientific problem of classifying meteorites. Try sending two pieces of the same meteorite to different labs. Chances are you will get different results. For instance, I have L5's that came back as L4's and L6's. Regolith this and Primitive that. I heard the same situation happening for NWA 1929, either howardite OR eucrite. I understand some of it is interpretive. The system itself is flawed. Ideally, we need an NWA consortium of labs to correct this and have type specimens on hand. This SEEMS to be an easy fix, but university politics plays a huge role. So all you scientists who study NWA's, how about a network for meteorite data sharing? It will make ALL our lives easier... Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rob Wesel Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 2:38 AM To: Michael Farmer; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers While I truly believe this practice is ultimately costly to the collector, truer words have never been spoken. Thanks Mike: Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is guilty of this, we are in the process of correcting the situation and to start people MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we see tonight. So, for now, we make it right. We follow the rules and pay out to prove pairings. We wait longer to get to market and costs go up because repeat lab fees and repeat type specimens factor into prices per gram. I don't like it one bit but that's what we do. I will be finishing off my likely paired howardite as such but new specimens are already off to the lab, specimens I know are paired. While I seriously doubt the law has any holding here, the NomCom asks this of us. Bottom line, if two folks buy bread from the same baker...they're eating the same bread. The full weight of this ruling will soon be felt by all as we bog down institutions who want to study meteorites with incessant pairings, not much grant money in pairings, not much recognition. But this is what we do...for now. Rob Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 7:56 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers To clarify something that is obviously causing some problems in the meteorite world right now, I want everyone to know that NWA 788, 787, and NWA 482 are numbers that came from rather large or meteorites with hundreds of pieces bought during one of my expeditions. The Hupes and many other people have the right to those numbers. Now, there are other numbers being widely used without proper title (as Dr Grossman has stated publicly and with finality that people do not own numbers, but numbers are assigned to specific meteorite specimens and must not be used with other meteorites just because you heard or someone told you it is the same). Let's all please stop this practice as it is really hurting our business and hobby. Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is guilty of this, we are in the process of correcting the situation and to start people MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we see tonight. I perused eBay today and it is still rampant with sellers using numbers they seem to have drawn from a hat. So please ask you seller next time you buy something, how they got that number, who it was assigned to and if not them, just how they came to call it that. Mike Farmer __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers
Hello Jeff and thanks for your email. I think a repository of high quality photos of type specimens would be extremely useful for the entire meteorite community. Cheers -John Jeff Grossman wrote: There are several reasons for this result. Among these are: 1) Not all scientists are equally skilled at classifying meteorites. 2) Not all samples are representative of the whole. It used to be that a lab would have the entire mass to examine and could see the entire structure. With meteorites in commercial hands, they often just get a small chip. Given that lots of chondrites and achondrites are breccias, this can be a problem. 3) Some meteorites are borderline between types. Many of us try to make a decision as to which it is, and two people might come down on opposite sides of the line. If it actually matters, somebody will do careful work and publish on the subject. In most cases the error doesn't matter. Researchers all know that classification errors of this sort happen. 4) Nobody has ever standardized the way that brecciated meteorites should be described. Someday this will be fixed. 5) Some areas of meteorite classification are controversial (e.g., the use of type 7). We already have a consortium of labs... it is all of those labs that agree to house type specimens and make them available for research whenever an important scientific question arises. We already have a network for data sharing... it includes the Meteoritical Bulletin and the numerous scientific journals that publish abstracts and peer-reviewed research. If there is a need for a repository of photos, for example, one could be set up in short order. Is there? On the question of pairing... for most meteorites, pairing studies are of little scientific interest and not worth taking the time to do. Visual pairings are almost worthless. For the important meteorites, pairings get worked out in the scientific literature over time. This may be unsettling for some dealers, but that's the way it is. jeff At 11:11 AM 11/21/2004, Matt Morgan wrote: Just to add a note... There is a fundamental scientific problem of classifying meteorites. Try sending two pieces of the same meteorite to different labs. Chances are you will get different results. For instance, I have L5's that came back as L4's and L6's. Regolith this and Primitive that. I heard the same situation happening for NWA 1929, either howardite OR eucrite. I understand some of it is interpretive. The system itself is flawed. Ideally, we need an NWA consortium of labs to correct this and have type specimens on hand. This SEEMS to be an easy fix, but university politics plays a huge role. So all you scientists who study NWA's, how about a network for meteorite data sharing? It will make ALL our lives easier... Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rob Wesel Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 2:38 AM To: Michael Farmer; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers While I truly believe this practice is ultimately costly to the collector, truer words have never been spoken. Thanks Mike: Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is guilty of this, we are in the process of correcting the situation and to start people MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we see tonight. So, for now, we make it right. We follow the rules and pay out to prove pairings. We wait longer to get to market and costs go up because repeat lab fees and repeat type specimens factor into prices per gram. I don't like it one bit but that's what we do. I will be finishing off my likely paired howardite as such but new specimens are already off to the lab, specimens I know are paired. While I seriously doubt the law has any holding here, the NomCom asks this of us. Bottom line, if two folks buy bread from the same baker...they're eating the same bread. The full weight of this ruling will soon be felt by all as we bog down institutions who want to study meteorites with incessant pairings, not much grant money in pairings, not much recognition. But this is what we do...for now. Rob Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 7:56 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers To clarify something that is obviously causing some problems in the meteorite world right now, I want everyone to know that NWA 788, 787, and NWA 482 are numbers that came from rather large or meteorites with hundreds of pieces bought during one of my expeditions. The Hupes and many other people have the right to those numbers. Now, there are other numbers being widely used without proper title (as Dr Grossman has stated publicly and with finality that people do not own numbers, but numbers are
Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer...
AdamI think you meant your pieces were looked at by Dr. Irving as this is what you have told the list repeatedly. You could not possibly have had every piece microprobed as all the pieces we have seen sold by you on ebay did not even have a window polished into them. Further, no one in their right mind would microprobe each and every little piece of shergottite that you bought in Morocco. I think we can all move on from this NWA 1110 thread as it is getting rather old. We have NWA 2373 which has been provisionally classified as being paired with NWA 1068, so if anyone is still interested in purchasing a classified shergottite that has been properly tested and for which a type specimen has been submitted, please feel free. Thanks all! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Adam Hupe wrote: Microprobed, read the abstract: http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/snc/nwa1110.html How else can you get ratios to support a Martian origin? Adam - Original Message - From: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 5:00 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Looked at or microprobed? Bernhard asked, I answered, please see Dr. Grossman's evaluation of looked at Rob Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Rob, What are you talking about. A type specimen for NWA 1110 was submitted to and studied by the University of Washington. Thin sections were cut, pieces were analyzed with a microprobe, specimens were sent out for Isotope work and dating. NWA 1110 is a well studied set of stones. Every fragment was cleaned and then looked at by Dr. Irving. Dr. Irving rejected several of the pebbles that were submitted as being terrestrial otherwise nobody would have known the difference. The NomCom then voted on this group of gravel and made it official. Dr Irving not only works in a laboratory he is one of the few scientist who has actually gone on a Team LunarRock expedition to Morocco. He knows what is going on in and is work is of the highest standard. Think about what you are saying, Adam - Original Message - From: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bernhard Rems [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 3:58 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Well, easy enough, I don't have any NWA 1110, never did so that answers that. You hit on trust. Trust is the way every meteorite in history has been sold until the dawn of NWA naming rules. Once again, every L'Aigle, every Gao, every Holbrook and Canyon Diablo. Burkina Faso has a new fall Lampiayrie, so add that to Gao, Guenie, Bilanga and to have a high collection area where pairings rules are not conducted or required. Trust is the very thing I am talking about. I strongly suspect that no non-NWA meteorite in your collection has been tested, if so the ratio is way down. Do things fall through the cracks, yes. Calcalong Creek is the paramount example, had Bob Haag had a bad day and just weighed and bagged it as Millbillillie then it likely would have been lost. But, by and large, the system ain't broke so why fix it. Buy from people you trust, like centuries of collectors in the past. I have sold to you more than once, I hope you trust me. I have nothing to hide. I merely offer that this recent chest beating is marketing disguised as science, and the scientist just confirmed it in saying that visual pairings are worthless and of little scientific importance. NWA 1110 was visually paired, A+B=C, so trust who you will, you still just bought a piece of paper if you bought NWA 1110. I am following the NomCom rules, I am doing what is asked. That does not mean I endorse it. I am 100% in favor of the scientific advancement in various fields that type specimens provide...but this is not science, it's marketing. Trust Point in fact, the only questionable material in my inventory came from the Hupes in the names NWA 1929, NWA 1906, NWA 801, NWA 978, and possibly NWA 1836, a claim which I can support with documents sitting right here on my desk and must now sort out at their own litigious request. So trust who you will. Furthermore, with the publishing of the who's naughty and who's nice lists is a customer what bought a large amount of classified NWA 3118 from my by way of the Hupes and is
Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer...
Adam...I don't think there is any argument. We simple pointed out that you mis-spoke when you told Rob that every one of your shergottite pieces had been micro-probed. I the interests of the collectors I think that honesty is the best policy, and I'm sure that you agree. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Adam Hupe wrote: Why is there an argument in regards to material that has been NomCom approved? The problem is pseudo-dealers thinking they know more than scientists. If we start questioning scientist, who have been very patient thus far with the collecting community, where will this leave us? Think about it, Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 5:24 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... AdamI think you meant your pieces were looked at by Dr. Irving as this is what you have told the list repeatedly. You could not possibly have had every piece microprobed as all the pieces we have seen sold by you on ebay did not even have a window polished into them. Further, no one in their right mind would microprobe each and every little piece of shergottite that you bought in Morocco. I think we can all move on from this NWA 1110 thread as it is getting rather old. We have NWA 2373 which has been provisionally classified as being paired with NWA 1068, so if anyone is still interested in purchasing a classified shergottite that has been properly tested and for which a type specimen has been submitted, please feel free. Thanks all! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Adam Hupe wrote: Microprobed, read the abstract: http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/snc/nwa1110.html How else can you get ratios to support a Martian origin? Adam - Original Message - From: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 5:00 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Looked at or microprobed? Bernhard asked, I answered, please see Dr. Grossman's evaluation of looked at Rob Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 - Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Rob, What are you talking about. A type specimen for NWA 1110 was submitted to and studied by the University of Washington. Thin sections were cut, pieces were analyzed with a microprobe, specimens were sent out for Isotope work and dating. NWA 1110 is a well studied set of stones. Every fragment was cleaned and then looked at by Dr. Irving. Dr. Irving rejected several of the pebbles that were submitted as being terrestrial otherwise nobody would have known the difference. The NomCom then voted on this group of gravel and made it official. Dr Irving not only works in a laboratory he is one of the few scientist who has actually gone on a Team LunarRock expedition to Morocco. He knows what is going on in and is work is of the highest standard. Think about what you are saying, Adam - Original Message - From: Rob Wesel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bernhard Rems [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 3:58 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Trust - Was...Honest Answer... Well, easy enough, I don't have any NWA 1110, never did so that answers that. You hit on trust. Trust is the way every meteorite in history has been sold until the dawn of NWA naming rules. Once again, every L'Aigle, every Gao, every Holbrook and Canyon Diablo. Burkina Faso has a new fall Lampiayrie, so add that to Gao, Guenie, Bilanga and to have a high collection area where pairings rules are not conducted or required. Trust is the very thing I am talking about. I strongly suspect that no non-NWA meteorite in your collection has been tested, if so the ratio is way down. Do things fall through the cracks, yes. Calcalong Creek is the paramount example, had Bob Haag had a bad day and just weighed and bagged it as Millbillillie then it likely would have been lost. But, by and large, the system ain't broke so why fix it. Buy from people you trust, like centuries of collectors in the past. I have sold to you more than once, I hope you trust me. I have nothing to hide. I merely offer that this recent
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: blank e-mails from LIst
Hello Mike and Tracy. Remember to always convert you email to plain text before you send it to the list. The list server will not accept html formatted emails and your email will disappear into the ether if you send one in a format other than plain text. Best wishes -John Mike / flattoprocks wrote: Hello Tracy and list (hopefully). I am not having the same type of trouble you are but have been completly unable to post to the list for some time. I have tried severl times to get help from the E-mail they send once a month, but so far my self help has been unsuccessful. I hope this E-mail will hitch a ride to some help for my being able to post to the list. Thanks Mike Miller // E-Bay flattoprocks Website // www.meteoritefinder.com - Original Message - From: tracy latimer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:35 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] OT: blank e-mails from LIst Hi! This morning, 4 of my pile of meteorite-list e-mails came in blank except for the header, all from people I have received mail from in the past with no trouble. I tried to reply to one e-mail, and it was bounced back to me from a Yahoo group without making it to the main list. Anyone else having this trouble, or might it be Hotmail-related? Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: AW: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices
Martinwhen you refer to stinky Campos are those like the rusty Old Campo that you are trying to sell on your website for $300 per kilo, stating that Despite its impressive Total Known Weight, Campo del Cielo isn't offered that often.? Are these the good sales prices that you are offering the new collectors? http://www.meteorite-martin.de/english/iron_en.html -Just curious. Cheers John Dawn Bernhard Rems wrote: -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Martin Altmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 04. November 2004 18:58 An: Bernhard Rems; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices And Bernhard, as always, I answer: For a serious dealer it does not pays off on the long run to praise stinky Campos or boring W4 desert H5s like the Star of India. Experienced collectors don't appreciate such exaggerations and the beginners will soon find out the overstatements. Meteorite market is not Fish Market. Martin You don't get my point, Martin. It's not praising stinky Campos or boring W4 desert H5's (BTW, the attitude that desert H5's are boring is something I fully reject), it's about transporting the magic of meteorites in your text, telling people more than just I sell a Campo. Give them background information, tell them that Campos tend to rust, but tell them also the history of this find. Tell them how they can take care of their pieces, and why even a stinky Campo is a piece of extraterrestrial matter that is something special. You don't have to exaggerate to sell. You just have to show that you appreciate what you are selling. Bernhard __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: NWA 2373 Martian Basaltic Shergottite-Update
Hello everone. Quite a few of you have already added one or more of our newly classified martian basaltic shergottites to your collections and we would like to thank all of you. For those of you that have already added one, photos of the main mass are now available on the NASA-JPL Martian Meteorite website at the following URL: http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/snc/nwa2373.html. For those of you that are planning on adding a NWA 2373 to your collection we have added several more beautiful pieces to the website and have listed several other wonderful specimens on ebay (http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQgotopageZ1QQsassZarizonaQ5fskiesQ5fmeteoritesQ5fpowerQ5fsellersQQsosortorderZ1QQsosortpropertyZ1). We recommend reserving a specimen sooner rather than later as these are selling at a fairly brisk rate. When you check out our ebay offerings be sure to see the Muonionalusta with a huge troilite inclusion that we added-it is gorgeous! Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New campos - your experiences?
Hello Bernhard. We believe that we consistently provide the highest quality Campos available, but please check out other dealers websites and judge for yourself. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com Bernhard Rendelius Rems wrote: Hi there, I am thinking about getting one of these new campos (3-8kg) form y collection. Now, Campost end to rust faster than the speed of light, and paying some hundred bucks for something that has disintegrated to brown powder within a year is nothing that makes me happy, really. What are your experiences with new campos? Whos a reliable seller for quality pieces (maybe even pieces that have been treated with some kind of rust prevention)? Please let me know. Best regards, Bernhard Rendelius Rems CEO RPGDot Network http://www.rpgdot.com http://www.rpgdot.com This outgoing mail has been virus-checked. __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Rare new ungrouped Ureilite sale!
Hey MikeThat's a gorgeous Ureilite! Thanks for sharing you photos! Cheers -John Arizona Skies Meteorites Michael Farmer wrote: I have finally cut up and am presenting for sale today one of the most interesting Ureilites known. This is Dhofar 979, a meteorite which I found on January 8th, 2004 in Oman. I was with Jack and Devon Schrader and found it about 30 meteorites from a perfectly oriented chondrite! This meteorite is unlike any other Ureilite, it cuts like butter, has no diamonds, and is very soft. It still looks like other Ureilites, without the major cutting problems. This is a spectacular meteorite, and I have priced it very low considering what it is. have a look here http://www.meteoritehunter.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Ad New Cumulate Eucrite, CV3 and LL6 polymict breccia
Hello everyone...we have just finished updating the website and have added a very nice, newly classified Cumulate eucrite, a newly classified CV3 and a New LL6 polymict breccia. If you are in the market or just want to see some nice meteorites please feel free to check these guys out. In particular, be sure to check out the photos of the CV3-you won't be sorry! Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad Museum Quality 6.12 kg Taza Iron
Hello everyone. We have just posted a gorgeous 6.12 kg remaglypted Taza Iron on our website. Even if you're not in the market for a world class plessitic Iron, you may enjoy taking a look. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com = __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New Carbonaceous Fall
Hello Rob and Congratulations on your new thumb-printed (and presumably foot-printed) fall! May we ask if there are any known pairings? Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Rob Wesel wrote: Hello all- After several hours of sonic booms, hissing noises, and assignment of blame a nicely thumbprinted 3.3 kilo individual was recovered last night at 0120 hrs not far from my home. There is some thumbprinting on this finder as well, expected to heal in the next day or two. Provisional naming proved acceptable based on anticipated characteristics and it will henceforth be referred to as Christina. And, oddly enough, they ARE warm to the touch! Rob Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Scale cubes in centimeters
Hello Pierre-MarieDave Freeman recently posted the following source for scale cubes to the list. Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Dear List; List member Peter Scherff has scale cubes (as seen in meteorite as found pictures). For those wanting to increase their Karma at meteorite hunting, email Peter for getting your cubes today! A very satisfied repeat customer, Dave Freeman mjwy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Pierre-Marie PELE wrote: Hello to the List, I'm searching for scale cubes but in centimeters scale. Does anybody know where to buy some ? Thanks a lot, Pierre-Marie Pele www.meteor-center.com -- Faites un voeu et puis Voila ! www.voila.fr __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AMAZING NEW METEORITE -FELL ON HOUSE!!!
A local newpaper in Venezuela has scooped CNN, NBC and CBS and broken the big story about an amazing new meteorite find (see below). We are sure that this will generate intense scientific interest as well as intense competition amongst the list dealers as they vie to purchase this cosmic beauty. Below is a tranlation of this ground breaking article. Into the hands of carvajalense family meteorite that fell 13 years ago and deserves to be studied. It does about 13 years, as a result of a rain of fleeting stars, phenomenon and astronomical spectacle that every year happens generally once, fell in one of the houses of the parish Glad Field, especially in the house of the Suárez family, of that populated community a small meteorite that could well solve many questions on asteroids and until the origin of the life. The grandmother of the young person David Suárez, witnessed the fall that night, a strange luminous object in the patio of her residence and decided to approach what was a small rock, of about 12 centimeters in length by seven of wide, still warms up by effect of the strong atmospheric effect. She kept the small stone, characterized to have oval and contouring form with beautiful lines brown, yellow color and amber, as if one was beautiful Eggs of Passover made by the Russians like inestimables jewels, like a memory, without knowledge that nothing less had in its hands than many centuries of studies of the cosmos and perhaps of its beginning. After the death of his grandmother, the young person David Suárez decides to take it to science, nevertheless many students of the matter in that time, which they wanted was to cut the rock and to destroy it to study it without contributing nothing in return, in addition without recognizing the inestimable value that represents for science. Suárez, makes the call to the true investigators of the origin of the life and the sidereal space, so that they communicate with him through telephones 2442260 and 2441804. To view this incredible NEW Meteorite click on the link below. http://www.diarioeltiempo.com.ve/secciones/secciones.php?num=47771codigo=nactllve=dos __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] AMAZING NEW METEORITE -FELL ON HOUSE!!!
Hello ZelmirThat certainly is a coincidence. I guess the more people that learn about the potential value of meteorites the more cosmic agates we'll be hearing about in the News. Apparently this chap was planning on retiring on the proceeds from Granny's meteorite as he became quite agitated when I referred to it as an agate and he told me to READ THE NEWPAPER AGAIN. Oh well -John Zelimir Gabelica wrote: Dear John, I was very impressed upon reading your message describing the amazing new meteorite that hit a house in Venezuela, because... I was just in Venezuela from Sept 1 to 11 (incidently with a really smooth return flight on this magic date, though some remanent turbulences from our friend Ivan the hurricane who hit us last Wednesday there over). I thought that, by bad luck, I missed this new house crasher by a couple of days...until I looked at the link, showing this nice agate-like egg/pebble! Well, it turned that, along with some lectures on advanced materials I had to deliver at a local sumposium in Caracas, the organizers gave me also a wild card for talking about some more exotic materials. I logically choosed the topic related to our beloved hobby, namely extraterrestrial materials. About 80 local people were therefore suddenly aware that meteorites do exist and now that John sent the post, I wonder whether we will suddenly be flooded from various infos coming from Venezuela and describing some sudden finds in the backyards or related local fall observations. Actually, as my speaking time was restricted (those kind of lectures require extended talks, questions included), I just skipped the last part related to... meteorite fakes and the corresponding warnings... I however doubt your post is really related to my lecture but what a coincidence! I keep you informed if I hear for more exotic falls or strange finds in the forthcoming days from there. So far, Venezuela, a large country, was very quiet, with only 3 meteorites reported. Maybe the Valera cow story, that I did not miss to report, excited some imaginations... Best to all, Zelimir A 09:59 14/09/04 -0700, vous avez écrit : A local newpaper in Venezuela has scooped CNN, NBC and CBS and broken the big story about an amazing new meteorite find (see below). We are sure that this will generate intense scientific interest as well as intense competition amongst the list dealers as they vie to purchase this cosmic beauty. Below is a tranlation of this ground breaking article. Into the hands of carvajalense family meteorite that fell 13 years ago and deserves to be studied. It does about 13 years, as a result of a rain of fleeting stars, phenomenon and astronomical spectacle that every year happens generally once, fell in one of the houses of the parish Glad Field, especially in the house of the Suárez family, of that populated community a small meteorite that could well solve many questions on asteroids and until the origin of the life. The grandmother of the young person David Suárez, witnessed the fall that night, a strange luminous object in the patio of her residence and decided to approach what was a small rock, of about 12 centimeters in length by seven of wide, still warms up by effect of the strong atmospheric effect. She kept the small stone, characterized to have oval and contouring form with beautiful lines brown, yellow color and amber, as if one was beautiful Eggs of Passover made by the Russians like inestimables jewels, like a memory, without knowledge that nothing less had in its hands than many centuries of studies of the cosmos and perhaps of its beginning. After the death of his grandmother, the young person David Suárez decides to take it to science, nevertheless many students of the matter in that time, which they wanted was to cut the rock and to destroy it to study it without contributing nothing in return, in addition without recognizing the inestimable value that represents for science. Suárez, makes the call to the true investigators of the origin of the life and the sidereal space, so that they communicate with him through telephones 2442260 and 2441804. To view this incredible NEW Meteorite click on the link below. http://www.diarioeltiempo.com.ve/secciones/secciones.php?num=47771codigo=nactllve=dos __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877
Hello Stan and List. Yes, this was exactly the point that we made in an earlier posting (The Probem with Reductionism ad Infinitum). The members of this list have not yet received any response from Adam on this matter and we wonder if he or anyone else have a reasonable explanation for this apparent double standard. -John Dawn stan . wrote: Regarding the different procedure for e.g. NWA / Gao-Guenie - this issue was addressed in an email by Jeff Grossman dated Sept. 9, 2004 (see below). Gao-Guenie can be treated like Allende or Holbrook in this context as it doesn't apply to areas of dense meteorite concentration. but what about stones like nwa 869? technically each one of them nees it's own nwa number and must be classified... my argument against the current guidelines is such: if a person were to submit 'x' new find comprising of many fragments of a meteorite, classification can be done based upon a representative thin section of only 1 fragment (or even a few tinsections) - even if there are many MANY fragements to the find. all of the fragments get the same nwa number with little or no testing done to them. now if more material if found in the exact same place, by the same people, and is the exact same rare classification as the orginal find - but it's found after the original stuff is published - then the new material must have thermoluminecence studies, cosmic ray exposure, and oxygen isotopse data taken before the material will be considered paired to the orignial find. I challange anyone to give me a valid scientific reason why material sumbited before publishing can all be considered nwa xxx based upon a cursory visual examination - yet material found after a write up in the met bul requires exhaustive additional testing to qualify as a pairing - testing that science make take years to complete for even the most exotic meteorites such as martian and lunars. _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877
Hello Adam, Stan and List. Adam-I think you missed the point that Stan and I were trying to make. We all agree that it would be best if every single stone found in the desert could be independently classified, the problem is that there are not enough resources or people willing to do so. The question was basically, how can fragments of some potential meteorite be paired with a classified fragment that has been properly analyzed and microprobed, when the remaining fragments have not even had a window polished into them, let alone been microprobed? This is particularily the case when there is no provenance as to the location in which these fragments were found as they could have been found in several different locations. It would seem in such a case that the best guestimate one could make in such a case would be to say that these non-analyzed fragments probably pair with the analyzed ones. For example, in the case of the 118g of NWA 1110, presumably around 116g have not been microprobed. In this case, it seems that the most accurate statement would be something along the lines of... the NWA 1110 non-analyzed fragments making up ~116g probably pair with NWA 1110's microprobed fragments. We are wondering about this because we are coming up against a similar predicament with several other falls. Thanks! -John Dawn Adam Hupe wrote: Dear John and List, The word apparent double standard would apply here. If you feel it is ok to pick numbers at random for additional finds when it comes to NWA and not others, why is this not happening with the Antarctic, Sahara, DAGs, SAUs and Dhofars? Why is it that when a Martian meteorite was announced as NWA 1068 some dealers are using a number that describes a pairing instead (NWA 1110)? Could it be that they are too lazy to apply for their own numbers, have their material studied and submitted for vote. NWA 1110 is not a catchall for additional finds, it is an official set of tested pebbles that happen to be Martian. Using the name NWA 869 is meaningless because like Kem Kem it has become a catchall stone. I would go as far as to say, you would better off selling NWA 869 as unclassified because an unclassified stone seems to be worth more on the open market these days. This one of the reasons I object strongly when it comes to rare material. All the best, Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: stan . [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 8:53 AM Subject: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877 Hello Stan and List. Yes, this was exactly the point that we made in an earlier posting (The Probem with Reductionism ad Infinitum). The members of this list have not yet received any response from Adam on this matter and we wonder if he or anyone else have a reasonable explanation for this apparent double standard. -John Dawn stan . wrote: Regarding the different procedure for e.g. NWA / Gao-Guenie - this issue was addressed in an email by Jeff Grossman dated Sept. 9, 2004 (see below). Gao-Guenie can be treated like Allende or Holbrook in this context as it doesn't apply to areas of dense meteorite concentration. but what about stones like nwa 869? technically each one of them nees it's own nwa number and must be classified... my argument against the current guidelines is such: if a person were to submit 'x' new find comprising of many fragments of a meteorite, classification can be done based upon a representative thin section of only 1 fragment (or even a few tinsections) - even if there are many MANY fragements to the find. all of the fragments get the same nwa number with little or no testing done to them. now if more material if found in the exact same place, by the same people, and is the exact same rare classification as the orginal find - but it's found after the original stuff is published - then the new material must have thermoluminecence studies, cosmic ray exposure, and oxygen isotopse data taken before the material will be considered paired to the orignial find. I challange anyone to give me a valid scientific reason why material sumbited before publishing can all be considered nwa xxx based upon a cursory visual examination - yet material found after a write up in the met bul requires exhaustive additional testing to qualify as a pairing - testing that science make take years to complete for even the most exotic meteorites such as martian and lunars. _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman
Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877
Hi Adam and thanks for the note. We know of around 60 g of picritic shergottite fragments that look identical to NWA 1110, and that were not part of the original 118 grams. This suggests that either several pieces of NWA 1068 hit rocks and broke into fragments, or perhaps more likely, a mass exploded at low elevation spreading fragments over a larger area than the 12 x 12 meter region that you mentioned??? Cheers -John Dawn Adam Hupe wrote: Dear List, We do know where all of NWA 1110 was found as does the journalist who documented our second expedition to Marrir. The first trip was published in Meteorite Magazine. Every piece of NWA 1110 was found by a Nomadic family in a 12 meter X 12 meter area 14 kilometers from the village of Marrir. This is not a strewn field. We figured NWA 1068 must have hit a rock on impact and shattered into several hundred pieces scattering them over a small area. The location alone is enough to make pairing statements after a qualified scientist authenticated every piece and the NomCom approved the scientists' work by making it official. Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 9:40 AM Subject: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877 Hello Adam, Stan and List. Adam-I think you missed the point that Stan and I were trying to make. We all agree that it would be best if every single stone found in the desert could be independently classified, the problem is that there are not enough resources or people willing to do so. The question was basically, how can fragments of some potential meteorite be paired with a classified fragment that has been properly analyzed and microprobed, when the remaining fragments have not even had a window polished into them, let alone been microprobed? This is particularily the case when there is no provenance as to the location in which these fragments were found as they could have been found in several different locations. It would seem in such a case that the best guestimate one could make in such a case would be to say that these non-analyzed fragments probably pair with the analyzed ones. For example, in the case of the 118g of NWA 1110, presumably around 116g have not been microprobed. In this case, it seems that the most accurate statement would be something along the lines of... the NWA 1110 non-analyzed fragments making up ~116g probably pair with NWA 1110's microprobed fragments. We are wondering about this because we are coming up against a similar predicament with several other falls. Thanks! -John Dawn Adam Hupe wrote: Dear John and List, The word apparent double standard would apply here. If you feel it is ok to pick numbers at random for additional finds when it comes to NWA and not others, why is this not happening with the Antarctic, Sahara, DAGs, SAUs and Dhofars? Why is it that when a Martian meteorite was announced as NWA 1068 some dealers are using a number that describes a pairing instead (NWA 1110)? Could it be that they are too lazy to apply for their own numbers, have their material studied and submitted for vote. NWA 1110 is not a catchall for additional finds, it is an official set of tested pebbles that happen to be Martian. Using the name NWA 869 is meaningless because like Kem Kem it has become a catchall stone. I would go as far as to say, you would better off selling NWA 869 as unclassified because an unclassified stone seems to be worth more on the open market these days. This one of the reasons I object strongly when it comes to rare material. All the best, Adam - Original Message - From: John Birdsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: stan . [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 8:53 AM Subject: Re: AW: [meteorite-list] Enough is Enough, Now NWA 1877 Hello Stan and List. Yes, this was exactly the point that we made in an earlier posting (The Probem with Reductionism ad Infinitum). The members of this list have not yet received any response from Adam on this matter and we wonder if he or anyone else have a reasonable explanation for this apparent double standard. -John Dawn stan . wrote: Regarding the different procedure for e.g. NWA / Gao-Guenie - this issue was addressed in an email by Jeff Grossman dated Sept. 9, 2004 (see below). Gao-Guenie can be treated like Allende or Holbrook in this context as it doesn't apply to areas of dense meteorite concentration. but what about stones like nwa 869? technically each one of them nees it's own nwa number and must be classified... my argument against the current guidelines is such: if a person were to submit 'x' new find comprising of many fragments of a meteorite, classification can be done based upon a representative thin section
[meteorite-list] Newly Classified Polymict Eucrite NWA 2366 Now Available! Ad
Hello Met List. Over the coming months we will be adding a number of newly classified, rare meteorites to our website. These include several achondrites, one planetary achondrite, a gorgeous carbonaceous chondrite, and two new irons. We have just update the website, adding a number of full and part slices from a gorgeous, newly classified polymict eucrite NWA 2366 (prov.). We have also added a new shock darkened L5 chondrite with an amazing black matrix (NWA 2363), and more beautiful slices of Imilac pallasite. Please feel free to view some or all of these new items on our website. Thanks! -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: AW: [meteorite-list] TRADE OFFER
Hello Bernhard, and Steve. I think Steve is using the term double cut to refer to what we have been calling a quarter cut. Essentially an end cut that has been cut in half in a plane perpendicular to the original cut face resulting in two cut faces intersecting at a 90 degree angle. Cheers -John Bernhard Rems wrote: Steve, you have been using the term double cut several times now. Could you explain what it means? Bernhard -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! Gesendet: Sonntag, 12. September 2004 16:13 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: [meteorite-list] TRADE OFFER Hello list.I have a 19.2 slice DOUBLE CUT of NWA 1553 EUCRITE for trade.Let me know what you have to offer.This easily goes for $19 to $22 a gram.It has alot of fusion crust on the back side.I have pictures if you want to see them.Let me know. steve arnold, chicago = Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 I. M. C. A. MEMBER #6728 Illinois Meteorites website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/illinoismeteorites/ ___ Do you Yahoo!? Shop for Back-to-School deals on Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com/backtoschool __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The Problems with Reductionism ad infinitum
Dear Adam and list. Adam as we follow your argument, we find some potential problems. As we understand it you bought a handful of putative meteorite fragments (118g) from a moroccan who told you they all came from the same strewn field. If you were not actually there when all 118g were unearthed, you are then simply relying on the word of the person that you purchased your samples from that they all came from the same location. You then had thin sections made from one or two of these fragments and they were classified as picritic shergottites and assigned the provisional name of NWA 1110-(please jump in and correct us if we are getting our facts wrong). Then, a planetary scientist looked at the rest of your fragments and told you that, by eye-balling them, they were consistent with the one or two which had actually been micro-probed. If this is the scenerio, then techinally speaking I don't think you can really acertain whether the un-analyzed fragments are truely paired to the analyzed fragments anymore than other dealers (or planetary scientists) can claim that the fragments they purchased from moroccan suppliers are paired to the official NWA 1110 without micro probe analysis. If we follow your argument to its ultimate conclusion you would have to ask the lab to make thin sections and perform microprobe analyses on each and every fragment that you purchased. This is particularily true in this case in which multiple picritic shergotite samples are coming out of Morocco. This is obviously ridiculous and no one would expect anyone to have such an analysis performed as it would waste the scientists time. This said, if you really want to insist on a strict adherence to the rules, as you appear to be doing, then no one can legitimately claim that the un-analyzed fragments in your 118g sample are paired with NWA 1110 until they have actually been microprobed by a qualified planetary scientist. Judging by the fragments of NWA 1110 that you have been selling on ebay, it does not appear that any of these have even had a window polished into their surface let alone a thin section made from them. I don't know of any planetary scientist capable of accurately classifying a tiny meteorite fragment by just looking at its exterior, especially when comparing one shergottite to another. Just how strictly do you want to adhere to the correct procedures for classifying these samples? Just my two cents worth... -John __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] nova petropolis
Hi SteveNope don't have any (sure wish we did though)-that's a beautiful meteorite! We do have two gorgeous new irons though, and we'll post some photos once they're classified. Cheers -John Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! wrote: Hi again list.As a follow up to my earlier quetion on nova petropolis, are there any other collecters who have any of this meteorite besides me and mike farmer?Just wondering. steve arnold = Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 I. M. C. A. MEMBER #6728 Illinois Meteorites website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/illinoismeteorites/ ___ Do you Yahoo!? Shop for Back-to-School deals on Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com/backtoschool __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] nova petropolis
Hi SteveNope we don't have any (wish we did though)-what a beautiful meteorite! If you know where we can get some email us. Cheers -John Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! wrote: Hi again list.As a follow up to my earlier quetion on nova petropolis, are there any other collecters who have any of this meteorite besides me and mike farmer?Just wondering. steve arnold = Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 I. M. C. A. MEMBER #6728 Illinois Meteorites website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/illinoismeteorites/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Imilac Slices Now Available-10% Off for List Members! -Ad
Hello List members. As some may have noticed, nice Imilac slices are nearly impossible to locate these days. We have recently added a number of gorgeous slices to our website. If anyone has been looking for a really beautiful translucent piece of Imilac please feel free to check them out. We'll take 10% off the listed price for list members from now until Sept. 15th (just mention this ad). Cheers -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: More Unsubstantiated Allegations
Dear Adam. It appears to us that once again you are making accusations about other meteorite dealers without backing up any of your statements with facts. Not only is this unfair to those that you malign but it seems to be becoming a habit of yours. If you can not or will not back up your accusations with facts then don't make them in the first place. The meteorite list has a number of clearly defined polices, one of which is: Make sure you can back up statements with -facts and references- Mike Farmer asked you to back up your allegations and we are all waiting for you to present the Facts that you seem to have conveniently omitted. Kind regards -John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Adam Hupe wrote: Mike, You would make a great politician as you avoid the real issues and address others with lies. I am not going to entertain you any more because frankly Mike the truth will be out soon enough, IN A BIG WAY, and you will only be able to blame yourself. It is unfortunate that good people will have been taken along the way. Adam - Original Message - From: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 11:24 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ramblings ADAM, so might I ask what I did in Monahans? PLEASE tell us, I went there, saw the meteorite, and left for home the same day, so again, please tell us? Meteor Crater? I got arrested there, Busted by Game and Fish for tresspassing, and case dropped. Again, what scientist might I ask had something to do with that? ANSWER please. What museums wont trade with me? Chicago I guess since I donated 998 to them then sold the mass to you. Casper my hero? You nead to read the archives better. I still do trading with TCU, Smithsonian, Natural History Museum London, American Museum of Natural History New York. Adam, name a museum that wont trade with me. Answer please. Michael Farmer - Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 11:09 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ramblings Hi Mike, Ok, here goes a name, Everett Gibson, how is that for starters, remember the Monahans meteorite! Will you ever show your face in Texas again after what you did to the good people? It is all in the press so don't try and lie. How about the Meteor Crater incident, would you like me to mention the scientist's name who busted you stealing? How about the museums di you upset while you were learning from Casper, an ex hero of yours. How many museums will not trade with you, would you like me to mention them? Mike you have done damage beyond repair so please find another hobby because a real business man would not bring up the things you do and expect to survive. Mike, you will not be around in meteoritics much longer because you are quickly loosing what little support you have left in the scientific community. If you want to continue this string I will be happy to report more of your escapades. Tired of Mike's lies, Adam - Original Message - From: Michael Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 10:59 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ramblings YAWN, again, UNNAMED SCIENTISTS, all talking the Hopes, neither one scientists. Adam, you are so full of yourself it isn't even funny anymore. Call me what you like, but you are the drama queen. I recall the Amgala posts during august with glee. so many people selling fake amgala, buy it from Adam if you want the real thing etc etc etc. Adam, if you are not willing to post names, don't bother to post your bullshit emails full of unnamed sources. Real scientists in Houston are way too busy to read the meteorite mailing list. Michael Farmer By the way How is the we aren't dealers spiel still working out? and the adventure stories about a couple of guys who have been on 3 meteorites hunts? You would think by reading the articles you have generated that you and Greg are Indiana Jones's but show your passports and you have been to Africa what, 2 times? 3 maybe? Still, you are doing a good job of hyping yourselves, I myself could'nt handle so much self congratulating. On another note, I hope Greg is ok (really) I would never want anyone to go through a hurricane and it is centered almost over Greg Hupe right now, among many other list memebers (David Weir) I hope you are well too. Original Message - From: Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 10:19 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Ramblings Dear List, Most List members joined in order to read about meteorites not politics
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[meteorite-list] Amgala allegatons: fact or fancy?
Dear List and Adam. Adam, in a recent email to the list (see below) you claimed that ~65% of the dealers selling Amgalas were selling something other than Amgala. Neither Mark Bostick, nor we have seen anyone selling fake Amgalas and we find this claim of yours somewhat difficult to believe. Could you please tell the meteorite-list members the facts upon which your statistics were based? It seems that if you are going to make serious allegations that smear ~65% of the dealers out there, at a minimum you should back your allegations with facts. We are sure the whole meteorite community (including the ~65% of dealers supposedly selling fake Amgalas) would greatly appreciate hearing the evidence upon which your based your statement. Thanks John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites Adam Hupe wrote: Hi Matteo and List, Apparently you have run into some dishonesty, I believe it is called a bait and switch situation. You think you are buying Amgala and you get Zag instead, a common occurrence these days. The Amgala fall is real, ~65% of the dealers who think they are selling the real McCoy are in error because they believe their Moroccan supplier. You can blame this on the source, not the dealers who are marketing it. Kind Regards, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: Lunar, Martian, Glorieta Mtn, Amgala More!!!
Hello all. We have just recently added some very nice Lunar and Martian specimens to the website along with some incredible Glorieta Mountain slices, Amgala whole individuals and beautiful slices, oriented Gao, etched henbury and Muonionalusta. If you would like to view any of these or other beautiful specimens feel free to click on the link below. Cheers John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
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[meteorite-list] Big Iron on ebay Ending in a couple hours
Hello everyone. If anyone is looking for an incredible, high quality Big Iron, we have a gorgeous 44.6 pound new Campo on ebay ending in a couple hours. Right now it is a steal going for under $43/ kg. This is well below wholesale and if you're in the market for a really terrific big iron this is a great opportunity to grab one at a great price! If you would like to check this one out please click on the link below: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemcategory=3239item=2244654693rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemcategory=3239item=2244654693rd=1 Thanks as always for looking! Cheers all John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Unstable Meteorites
Hello Tom. We can not speak for the other dealers out there, but we would recommend contacting the dealer that you purchased the meteorite from and asking for a replacement or a refund. Good Luck! John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ebay Auction ENDING NOW-HUGE CAMPO UNDER $39 per Kilo!
Hello all. We have an auction ending in under an hour for a gorgeous, big 28.4 pound, high quality Campo. You can STEAL this beautiful meteorite away right now for under $40 per kilo! If you've been looking for a nice big Iron, you won't find a higher quality Campo at a better price. If you would like to see this meteorite click on the link below: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemcategory=3239item=2243447082rd=1 We have the highest quality, most stable Campos available, so don't let this one get away Thanks for looking! John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Franconia Meteorites/Variation, Classification Confusion
Hello everybody. This is just to clear up some confusion that has arisen regarding meteorites recently found in the Franconia wash region east of Kingman, AZ. As a number of you already are aware, there have been a number of new Chondrites found in the region loosely referred to as Franconia wash. These appear to range in composition from LL5 to H5. We have at least two and perhaps three different Chondrites from this region (none of which have been classified as of yet). Bob Verish has one of these meteorites which has been classified as an (H5) and given the name 'Franconia'. In a recent posting Bob stated that only his stone can be properly called Franconia. We are assuming that he meant that only his stone can properly be called the Franconia 'type specimen'. As with any meteorite fall, all individual members of that fall are both individually and collectively referrred to by the name given to the type specimen, in this case 'Franconia'. We have posted on our website (http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com) several slices from an individual found in the Franconia wash strewn field by Jack Schrader, which we stated was unclassified and which appears to be extremely similar to the Franconia slices posted by Bob Verish (http://www.geocities.com/bolidechaser/mrf/franh5-g.jpg). Please compare these slices and draw you own conclusions. It is of course possible, though not very likely, that two very similar meteorites fell in the same strewn field. If indeed these are from the same fall, then they should of course all be referred to as 'Franconia'. If they are from a different fall, then they represent a New, and as yet unclassified, Arizona chondrite. In either case, this is an exciting find, and once the classification of these chondrites is verified we will update everyone. This might be a good opportunity to get a nice slice from a new Arizona Chondrite while the prices are still reasonable. If anyone has any questions please feel free to email us. Thanks John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Franconia Meteorites/Variation, Classification Confusion
Hi Dave, yes that's right. As a matter of fact some small irons have been found as well as some chondrites containing large iron nodules. It wouldn't be too surprising if the small irons turned out to be the remains of a nodule containing chondrite that fragmented at altitude. As far as classification goes I believe that the majority of different types are being classified as we speak. In any case, the slices that we posted from Franconia wash are, as we mentioned, unclassified. It will be fun to see how may different types eventually come out of this region! Cheers John Dear All, So what will be the opinion when an iron or pallesite comes out of there? Two or three different chondrites you say and we will call them all H5 regardless of the LL5 to H5...mmmseems like there needs to be a bunch more classification to do to me. With out classification, maybe they are not unlike some NWA's...orphans from a known location? Not to feed the ducks, Dave Freeman John Birdsell wrote: Hello everybody. This is just to clear up some confusion that has arisen regarding meteorites recently found in the Franconia wash region east of Kingman, AZ. As a number of you already are aware, there have been a number of new Chondrites found in the region loosely referred to as Franconia wash. These appear to range in composition from LL5 to H5. We have at least two and perhaps three different Chondrites from this region (none of which have been classified as of yet). Bob Verish has one of these meteorites which has been classified as an (H5) and given the name 'Franconia'. In a recent posting Bob stated that only his stone can be properly called Franconia. We are assuming that he meant that only his stone can properly be called the Franconia 'type specimen'. As with any meteorite fall, all individual members of that fall are both individually and collectively referrred to by the name given to the type specimen, in this case 'Franconia'. We have posted on our website (http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com) several slices from an individual found in the Franconia wash strewn field by Jack Schrader, which we stated was unclassified and which appears to be extremely similar to the Franconia slices posted by Bob Verish (http://www.geocities.com/bolidechaser/mrf/franh5-g.jpg). Please compare these slices and draw you own conclusions. It is of course possible, though not very likely, that two very similar meteorites fell in the same strewn field. If indeed these are from the same fall, then they should of course all be referred to as 'Franconia'. If they are from a different fall, then they represent a New, and as yet unclassified, Arizona chondrite. In either case, this is an exciting find, and once the classification of these chondrites is verified we will update everyone. This might be a good opportunity to get a nice slice from a new Arizona Chondrite while the prices are still reasonable. If anyone has any questions please feel free to email us. Thanks John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Franconia Meteorites
Hello everone and Thank you Ruben and Mike for better clarifying the situation for everyone. It will definitely be very interesting when more of these New meteorites are classified. Ruben and Mike are probably more familiar with the types of meteorites being found in this region than anyone else, so if anyone has any questions regarding the types of meteorites being found in this meteorite hot-spot contact Ruben or Mike! Cheers John __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad. Several Large Franconia Slices Now Available
Hello everyone. We have just posted several nice large slices from Arizona's newest meteorite, provisionally known as 'Franconia'. Feel free to check them out on our website: http://www.arizonaskiesmeteorites.com. You may also want to take a look at a very beautiful NWA 2089 (LL3) that we have also just posted. Thanks for looking! Cheers John Dawn Arizona Skies Meteorites P.O. Box 42662 Tucson, AZ 85733 __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
