Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
Marc, Hebrew works fine on openoffice with all the major linux distributions. If you could suggest how to tackle this, I'd be happy to have a look. Amit On 9/24/07, Marc Espie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We do not have full i18n support. The locale stuff in the base system is not finished (I know, I'm late...) Qt has its own locale system, so hebrew should work just fine in all Qt and KDE applications (including right-to-left text). Gnome and gtk also have some support. Vim supports more or less every script including hebrew. I don't know if there's any issue with input, I'm not familiar with hebrew, and I've only been working with japanese input. There might be some tweak to help OpenOffice. Does OpenOffice support hebrew on some platforms ? If it does, it might make sense to try to figure out the configuration differences.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
Aaron W. Hsu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am willing to guess that with something like Hebrew, OpenBSD has all the necessary support for the system, but, most common applications do not have support for the right-to-left way of writing. Well, do you consider, say, ksh and vi as part of the system or as common applications? What about wscons? Does a Hebrew VT220 change writing direction? I know that adding full POSIX i18n support requires changes to lots of text processing tools under /usr/bin. Languages like Hebrew or Arabic are likely to add further complications, but I don't know if their needs are covered by POSIX. At least I'm aware that I know approximately nothing about this topic. I sure hope people who make confident pronouncements are actually more knowledgeable. -- Christian naddy Weisgerber [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
On 9/24/07, Christian Weisgerber [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Aaron W. Hsu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am willing to guess that with something like Hebrew, OpenBSD has all the necessary support for the system, but, most common applications do not have support for the right-to-left way of writing. Well, do you consider, say, ksh and vi as part of the system or as common applications? What about wscons? Does a Hebrew VT220 change writing direction? http://mlterm.sourceforge.net/ vim supports right to left layout and Arabic shaping, but without Unicode semantics for number strings, so you kinda have to know what you're doing if you're going to use it to edit text with number strings. emacs has had an implementation of r-t-l for years, waiting for somebody to test/debug. A good resource for this sort of thing is arabeyes.org. Their focus is Arabic but they try to accomodate any r-t-l language, including Hebrew (in general, if it supports Arabic, it supports Hebrew). They also stick to technology. -gregg
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
On 9/23/07, Dmitrij D. Czarkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sunday 23 September 2007 01:58:51 you wrote: On 9/22/07, Dmitrij D. Czarkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe OpenBSD's libiconv doesn't have UTF-8 support, so You might need to choose another locale... OK, let's assume I want to use the ISO-8859-8 locale. How do I do that? Amit. -- Dmitrij D. Czarkoff Just the same way as with Your utf8 locale: $ echo export LC_ALL=he_IL.ISO-8859-8 LANG=he_IL.ISO-8859-8 ~/.xsession Unfortunately, this locale (or for that matter, any he_IL) doesn't exist on my system, i.e. in /usr/share/locale. This brings me back to my original question: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew? Amit. Should work (anyway does for me with ru_RU.KOI8-R). I don't know about OpenOffice - I'm avoiding it, but AbiWord works... -- Dmitrij D. Czarkoff
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
On 9/23/07, Amit Finkler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This brings me back to my original question: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew? in many cases, you want application support, and openbsd didn't write all the apps you use. suppport is a pretty broad concept.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
Amit Finkler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unfortunately, this locale (or for that matter, any he_IL) doesn't exist on my system, i.e. in /usr/share/locale. And that's probably the easiest part. Think of right-to-left writing or mixing ltr/rtl. This brings me back to my original question: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew? I don't know what supporting Hebrew would entail overall, but I think it's fair to say that OpenBSD doesn't support it. Some applications running on OpenBSD may deal with it to some degree, e.g., try Firefox with the Hebrew Wikipedia. -- Christian naddy Weisgerber [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
I am willing to guess that with something like Hebrew, OpenBSD has all the necessary support for the system, but, most common applications do not have support for the right-to-left way of writing. There should be no problem actually getting file names into hebrew form, because that should just be an encoding issue, and you need the right fonts to be able to display Hebrew glyphs. On the other hand, not all applications are going to support filenames written like that, and even less applications are going to know how to write Hebrew. If you use Emacs, I am fairly confident that you can get hebrew working on it, for basic editing and all the good stuff. KDE and some of the others may have input editors that will allow you to do things on their level, but overall, you'll have to very carefully pick and choose applications, because you won't find blankent compatibility. -- ((name Aaron Hsu) (email/xmpp [EMAIL PROTECTED]) (phone 703-597-7656) (site http://www.aaronhsu.com;)) [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature]
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
GNOME and all GTK+ programs should work with r-t-l scripts rather good.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
On 9/23/07, Ted Unangst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/23/07, Amit Finkler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This brings me back to my original question: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew? in many cases, you want application support, and openbsd didn't write all the apps you use. suppport is a pretty broad concept. That is true, but I would expect that at least the locales would be installed by default in /usr/share/locale so that a user from a right-to-left speaking country would be able to use it. I volunteer to make it so if I only knew how.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
We do not have full i18n support. The locale stuff in the base system is not finished (I know, I'm late...) Qt has its own locale system, so hebrew should work just fine in all Qt and KDE applications (including right-to-left text). Gnome and gtk also have some support. Vim supports more or less every script including hebrew. I don't know if there's any issue with input, I'm not familiar with hebrew, and I've only been working with japanese input. There might be some tweak to help OpenOffice. Does OpenOffice support hebrew on some platforms ? If it does, it might make sense to try to figure out the configuration differences.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
Hi Amit, Maybe I missed something, but you do have a Hebrew font installed on your system and in your font path right? On 24/09/2007, Marc Espie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We do not have full i18n support. The locale stuff in the base system is not finished (I know, I'm late...) Qt has its own locale system, so hebrew should work just fine in all Qt and KDE applications (including right-to-left text). Gnome and gtk also have some support. Vim supports more or less every script including hebrew. I don't know if there's any issue with input, I'm not familiar with hebrew, and I've only been working with japanese input. There might be some tweak to help OpenOffice. Does OpenOffice support hebrew on some platforms ? If it does, it might make sense to try to figure out the configuration differences.
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
Filenames in foreign languages can sometimes be a little problematic, because Unix doesn't really have any standard on how to store them on disk - filenames are just byte arrays. Because a machine may have users with different locales this can make sharing files very difficult, so the desktop environments seem to be storing filenames in UTF-8 with no regard to the locale. GTK apps also look at the environment variable G_FILENAME_ENCODING, which you may want to define, but if memory serves me correctly it defaults to UTF-8 so with an UTF-8 locale you don't need to care. Are you sure .profile is sourced in your X session? Try checking the environment variables are set in an xterm. The command locale will also print out the locale settings, but I can't remember if OpenBSD has one (I'm stuck on a painful mobile device so I can't check). Do the filenames look ok if you ls them in an xterm? HTH, Jussi Peltola [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature which had a name of signature.asc]
Re: Does OpenBSD support Hebrew?
On 9/22/07, Jussi Peltola [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Filenames in foreign languages can sometimes be a little problematic, because Unix doesn't really have any standard on how to store them on disk - filenames are just byte arrays. Because a machine may have users with different locales this can make sharing files very difficult, so the desktop environments seem to be storing filenames in UTF-8 with no regard to the locale. GTK apps also look at the environment variable G_FILENAME_ENCODING, which you may want to define, but if memory serves me correctly it defaults to UTF-8 so with an UTF-8 locale you don't need to care. Are you sure .profile is sourced in your X session? Try checking the environment variables are set in an xterm. I don't know what you mean by sourced, but when I type set xterm I see them. The command locale will also print out the locale settings, but I can't remember if OpenBSD has one (I'm stuck on a painful mobile device so I can't check). I don't think it has one either. In any case I noticed that indeed the two sets weren't really accepted by the system: perl: warning: Setting locale failed. perl: warning: Please check that your locale settings: LC_ALL = (unset), LC_CTYPE = he_IL.UTF-8, LC_COLLATE = he_IL.UTF-8, LANG = (unset) are supported and installed on your system. perl: warning: Falling back to the standard locale (C). Can't resolve locale Do the filenames look ok if you ls them in an xterm? OK, I checked that and they don't. They appear like gibberish and question marks surrounded by circles. I guess this conforms to the above perl warning. Maybe there just isn't a he_IL.UTF-8 locale for OpenBSD. HTH, Jussi Peltola -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFG9UGo0SX92aZxWNIRAuVUAKCEoA+wg57S7VA9saaiJ/3vjGcyOQCdEZnb JtD1KDPlmqEO51PrrcMOYiw= =b0l1 -END PGP SIGNATURE-
