[osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
[NOTE: The following is a repost from openindiana list... hoping to gain the benefit of long time experience here as well] Being much a novice in building for a zfs server, I've cobbled up a setup with one of those build it online setups... on ebay this one was. But before I plunge for the green backs. I'd really feel a bit more confident if a few experienced people ran there eye down the lineup and see if anything looks like a deal breaker, or needs changing. It seems like a decent enough price at 1317 (+ Free shipping) but again.. I'm not one who would really know if it was or not. This machine will be used as a home lan zfs server, and will be handling a fair bit of hefty video and other graphic files since I am an amateur videographer and need to save certain elements of my projects for a while after they are sold... A single project can easily run into a 100GB and more... but usually the parts that need saving are more like 50-80 gb. This setup will have the 2 new 1tb discs seen in the build and then 2 500 gb ide disks 2 500 gb sata disks 2 750 gb sata disks that are still at this moment attached to my old dysfunctional zfs server. I will set them up in mirrored pairs so will end up with something like 2.5 TB of usable space. And then of course take off whatever amount zfs needs for its workings... but anyway it will be a decent amount of space. And now the line up: ---- ---=--- - ---- ---=--- - price: $1317.00 CONFIGURATION PARTS: CPU: AMD 64 CPU AM3 AMD Phenom II X6 1090T 3.2GHz (Six Core) 45nm, AM3 6MB Cache PARTS: Cooling Fans: AMD 64 CPU Fans Coolermaster GeminII S, 5 Copper Heat Pipes, Dual Cooler CPU fan PARTS: Motherboards: AMD 64 AM3 Motherboards GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H,Onboard Video,HDMI,X-fire,USB 3.0,SATA3,IEEE PARTS: Memory: DDR3 Dual Channel memory 16GB (4x4GB) PC10600 DDR3 1333 Dual Channel PARTS: Video TV Cards: PCI-Express Video cards NONE SELECTED , | [Aside: the following drives could as well be 2 TB WD green (as the | 1tb WD black shown below) for an extra $33 per,(total $66), but I was | not sure if at some point the shear size begins to be a problem by | itself for things like scrub or resilvering. | | Any comments on that would be welcome too.] ` PARTS: Hard Drives 1000.0GB Western Digital Black 7200RPM SATA 3 6.0Gb/s 64m cache PARTS: Hard Drives 1000.0GB Western Digital Black 7200RPM SATA 3 6.0Gb/s 64m cache PARTS: CD/DVD/R/RW Drives: DVD Recorders Lite On 22x DVD Recorder Dual Layer +R/RW -R/RW PARTS: Sound Cards Realtek HD digital audio (onboard) PARTS: Networking: Network Cards Ethernet network adapter (onboard) PARTS: Cases / Power Supplies: Cases Antec P193 Black Case, Full Tower, 11 bays, front USB eSATA PARTS: Cooling Fans: Case Fans Dual Case Fans 120 mm Extra Quiet DC fan (two fans) PARTS: Power Supply Corsair 750W ultra quiet ATX Power Supply, SLI X-fire ready PARTS: Speakers Black Multimedia amplified stereo speakers SOFTWARE: Operating Systems NONE SELECTED PARTS: Assembly and Test Standard assembly and test 3-5 business days ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
On 2/20/2011 6:24 AM, Harry Putnam wrote: [NOTE: The following is a repost from openindiana list... hoping to gain the benefit of long time experience here as well] Being much a novice in building for a zfs server, I've cobbled up a setup with one of those build it online setups... on ebay this one was. But before I plunge for the green backs. I'd really feel a bit more confident if a few experienced people ran there eye down the lineup and see if anything looks like a deal breaker, or needs changing. It seems like a decent enough price at 1317 (+ Free shipping) but again.. I'm not one who would really know if it was or not. This machine will be used as a home lan zfs server, and will be handling a fair bit of hefty video and other graphic files since I am an amateur videographer and need to save certain elements of my projects for a while after they are sold... A single project can easily run into a 100GB and more... but usually the parts that need saving are more like 50-80 gb. [snip] I'm assuming, by your statement above, that this will be just a file server, and you will only run light interactive (or, at best, infrequent) jobs. [snip] CONFIGURATION PARTS: CPU: AMD 64 CPU AM3 AMD Phenom II X6 1090T 3.2GHz (Six Core) 45nm, AM3 6MB Cache This is way overkill for a home file server, that you aren't doing anything else with. Even with compression turned on, you're not going to be able to stress such a CPU - you'll be disk I/O and network I/O bound long before you hit a CPU issue. Go with something much cheaper. An Athlon II X4 or X3 is a much better choice. You won't need the extra L3 cache of the Phenom. I'd go with a low-end X3 or X4 ($80 or $90, respectively). That saves you over $100. PARTS: Cooling Fans: AMD 64 CPU Fans Coolermaster GeminII S, 5 Copper Heat Pipes, Dual Cooler CPU fan PARTS: Motherboards: AMD 64 AM3 Motherboards GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H,Onboard Video,HDMI,X-fire,USB 3.0,SATA3,IEEE You won't need CrossFire. Or likely HDMI. Look for a motherboard that has a couple of x8 PCI-E slots, for possible future use of add-in HBAs. But you don't need anything fancier than that. PARTS: Memory: DDR3 Dual Channel memory 16GB (4x4GB) PC10600 DDR3 1333 Dual Channel Get ECC RAM for a ZFS server. Don't skimp - get it. DDR3-1333 is fine, though you might have to use DDR3-1066 for your motherboard when doing ECC. Check your MB manual. Either way, you won't notice the difference. -- Erik Trimble Java System Support Mailstop: usca22-123 Phone: x17195 Santa Clara, CA Timezone: US/Pacific (GMT-0800) ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
Erik Trimble erik.trim...@oracle.com writes: First, thanks for the good input PARTS: Memory: DDR3 Dual Channel memory 16GB (4x4GB) PC10600 DDR3 1333 Dual Channel Get ECC RAM for a ZFS server. Don't skimp - get it. DDR3-1333 is fine, though you might have to use DDR3-1066 for your motherboard when doing ECC. Check your MB manual. Either way, you won't notice the difference. I've asked this in another thread, but since you mention it here maybe if you are willing, I could get a brief notion from you as to what it means to use ECC or not. And the relationship of buffered/unbuffered. In the specs of memory... its quite confusing how that kind of stuff is listed if you don't now poop about what it really means. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
First off, thanks for the good input. And excuse the little post inbetween asking about ECC and Buffering. I'd still like to hear your comments but I did find what appears to be an excellent (not so technical) discussion of about those point here: http://www.pcbuyerbeware.co.uk/RAM.htm Now, let me also say that some of the changes you recommend would mean that I would not be able to use the Build it online system where I did the system we are discussing. Changes are possible but only within what is probably quite a narrow range compared to what is available. So to get to the main changes... I'd need to build it myself or pay someone to build it who would allow me to say what hardware would be used in all aspects. I am a bit reluctant to build it myself. I spent a lifetime either doing high rigging where we handled 1 1/2 inch cabling and bigger to move 100 ton pieces around or doing heavy duty welding where 1/2 plate would be about the lightest I'd be likely to work with. All that to say my hands are not accustomed to doing fine work so I suspect I'd break something or run into problems I don't now how to solve and end up taking a good long time to get a system built. Erik Trimble erik.trim...@oracle.com writes: [...] This machine will be used as a home lan zfs server, and will be handling a fair bit of hefty video and other graphic files since I am an amateur videographer and need to save certain elements of my projects for a while after they are sold... A single project can easily run into a 100GB and more... but usually the parts that need saving are more like 50-80 gb. [snip] I'm assuming, by your statement above, that this will be just a file server, and you will only run light interactive (or, at best, infrequent) jobs. I would probably do a project on a zfs share as much as possible. I guess that falls into `light interactive' since it would be at most 2 people working that way. The rest would be all file serving and storage. [snip] CONFIGURATION PARTS: CPU: AMD 64 CPU AM3 AMD Phenom II X6 1090T 3.2GHz (Six Core) 45nm, AM3 6MB Cache This is way overkill for a home file server, that you aren't doing anything else with. Even with compression turned on, you're not going to be able to stress such a CPU - you'll be disk I/O and network I/O bound long before you hit a CPU issue. Go with something much cheaper. An Athlon II X4 or X3 is a much better choice. You won't need the extra L3 cache of the Phenom. I'd go with a low-end X3 or X4 ($80 or $90, respectively). That saves you over $100. That is one change that can be done on the system I used on ebay. PARTS: Cooling Fans: AMD 64 CPU Fans Coolermaster GeminII S, 5 Copper Heat Pipes, Dual Cooler CPU fan PARTS: Motherboards: AMD 64 AM3 Motherboards GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H,Onboard Video,HDMI,X-fire,USB 3.0,SATA3,IEEE You won't need CrossFire. Or likely HDMI. Look for a motherboard that has a couple of x8 PCI-E slots, for possible future use of add-in HBAs. But you don't need anything fancier than that. There is a limited range of Mobo available. You'll notice this particular one has `onboard' video so I assumed then I would not get any other specialized video card at all, just use the onboard options. Also some of the boards available, only allow 8gb ram. There are 26 motherboards available to swap around with, x8 pci-e is not available on the 8-9 that I looked at. Is that something that is commonly available? Oh, and what are HBAs? Googling turns up way too many possibilities. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
I'd recommend something like the HP Proliant Microserver that holds four drives. 8Gb RAM should be sufficient for your needs since you aren't using deduplication or if you are it's not likely to be an issue for the size of your pools. -Gary ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
Hi Harryp, The motherboard you listed (GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H) does not support ECC type memory. So to follow Erik's guidance to use ECC ram you would have to find a different motherboard that does support ECC type memory. see: Memory supported non-ECC http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3342#sp Hope that helps. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
Andre Lue sik3...@yahoo.com writes: Hi Harryp, The motherboard you listed (GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H) does not support ECC type memory. So to follow Erik's guidance to use ECC ram you would have to find a different motherboard that does support ECC type memory. Thanks for the info. see: Memory supported non-ECC http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3342#sp That helped find something on the build list: ASUS M4A88TD-M /USB3,AMD 880G, Onboard Video http://magicmicro.com/debay.asp?iid=3674 But it still specifies unbuffered. Does that matter so much. I've read in other posts what it means and I understood it to mean that the data is buffered before release. What actually happens during that buffering... I'm not so sure. Some good news is that apparently both of the 16 gb memory sets appear to offer both ECC and NON-ecc. Maybe you can say if that is what it means here: http://magicmicro.com/debay.asp?iid=3572 ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
Gary Driggs gdri...@gmail.com writes: I'd recommend something like the HP Proliant Microserver that holds four drives. 8Gb RAM should be sufficient for your needs since you aren't using deduplication or if you are it's not likely to be an issue for the size of your pools. Thanks, Just a quick look around it appears to be about the same money for a new one, as I posted, but less machine, and if I tried to use my existing 4 @ 500GB + 2 @ 750GB drives. The best combination I'd get would be about 1200GB (mirrored). and leave 2 disks unused. If I bought bigger disks then the price shoots up a bit. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
On 02/21/11 11:38 AM, Harry Putnam wrote: That helped find something on the build list: ASUS M4A88TD-M /USB3,AMD 880G, Onboard Video http://magicmicro.com/debay.asp?iid=3674 But it still specifies unbuffered. Does that matter so much. I've read in other posts what it means and I understood it to mean that the data is buffered before release. What actually happens during that buffering... I'm not so sure. Hardly any consumer boards support ECC memory because their chip-sets don't support it. The main external difference between buffered and unbuffered ECC memory is the load each DIMM puts on the memory buses. In simple terms, you can fit a lot more buffered DIMS. Some good news is that apparently both of the 16 gb memory sets appear to offer both ECC and NON-ecc. Maybe you can say if that is what it means here: http://magicmicro.com/debay.asp?iid=3572 Almost certainly non-ECC only. Otherwise they would say. -- Ian. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
On Sun, Feb 20, 2011, Harry Putnam wrote: ASUS M4A88TD-M /USB3,AMD 880G, Onboard Video That's basically the same what I use. ASUS M4A88TD-M, DDR3 RAM, 1333, ECC (KVR1333D3E9SK2/4G) It works pretty well except for the onboard graphics -- see the mailing list for my questions about it. PS: Wikipedia is usually pretty good at explaining stuff like ECC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECC_RAM ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
Claus Assmann opensolaris+disc...@esmtp.org writes: On Sun, Feb 20, 2011, Harry Putnam wrote: ASUS M4A88TD-M /USB3,AMD 880G, Onboard Video That's basically the same what I use. ASUS M4A88TD-M, DDR3 RAM, 1333, ECC (KVR1333D3E9SK2/4G) Ahh great... good to hear from someone who speaks from experience. So at least we know ECC is available for that board. Still not sure how to get the builders to use that but I suspect I'll have to track them down and get an oral promise. But anyway there turns out to be a drawback with that one too, in that it's kind of weak in the expansion slots: 1 x PCIe 2.0 x16 2 x PCIe 2.0 x1 1 x PCI But I found another one on this builders list that appears to have ECC and better expansion slots: Unless Ian C. is right about ECC, then this board has the same notation as the other one: 4 x DIMM, Max. 16 GB, DDR3 2000(O.C.)/1333/1066 ECC,Non-ECC, Un-buffered Memory ASUS M4A89GTD PRO,890GX http://magicmicro.com/debay.asp?iid=3525 And it has a better expansion setup: 2 x PCIe 2.0 x16 support ATI CrossFireX™ technology(@dual x8 speed) 1 x PCIe 2.0 x4 1 x PCIe 2.0 x1 2 x PCI ---- ---=--- - Claus Wrote: It works pretty well except for the onboard graphics -- see the mailing list for my questions about it. I wondered about that onboard video... Which mailing list do you mean, an asus list? PS: Wikipedia is usually pretty good at explaining stuff like ECC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECC_RAM You are right there, I was a lazy slug but really just had a mental senior moment I guess because when I googled it, one of the first things that caught my eye turned out to be what seems really excellent for some one with my lack of knowledge: http://www.pcbuyerbeware.co.uk/RAM.htm (in case another dimwit is following this) PS - Is this the same Claus who over the years has answered many of my sendmail questions too? ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Another [OT] Hardware Post
On 02/21/11 02:43 PM, Harry Putnam wrote: Claus Assmann opensolaris+disc...@esmtp.org writes: On Sun, Feb 20, 2011, Harry Putnam wrote: ASUS M4A88TD-M /USB3,AMD 880G, Onboard Video That's basically the same what I use. ASUS M4A88TD-M, DDR3 RAM, 1333, ECC (KVR1333D3E9SK2/4G) Ahh great... good to hear from someone who speaks from experience. So at least we know ECC is available for that board. Still not sure how to get the builders to use that but I suspect I'll have to track them down and get an oral promise. But anyway there turns out to be a drawback with that one too, in that it's kind of weak in the expansion slots: 1 x PCIe 2.0 x16 2 x PCIe 2.0 x1 1 x PCI But I found another one on this builders list that appears to have ECC and better expansion slots: Unless Ian C. is right about ECC, then this board has the same notation as the other one: All I said was if they don't say ECC is supported, it isn't! In this case, they do. -- Ian. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
