Re: SATA RAID with Promise TX4 (Was: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?)
Hi! On 6/2/07, Darryl Gregorash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2007-06-01 23:23, HG wrote: snip So, the performance isn't very good. But this is a old computer (PIII 733, with 512Mb), so maybe the bottleneck is somewhere else. Or what do you think? Well, it is a PCI card. What's the speed of the PCI bus? That's going to be the limiting factor. True. Good guestion... I have no idea of the PCI bus speed. I actually thought that what ever it is, it's going to be more than (P)ATA and as Bonnie++ showed that the RAID was in the same ballpark as a PATA drive would be, I didn't think that PCI bus would be the limiting factor. But it must be - PIII 733MHz is not slowing the RAID parity calculations down, drives are fast, card is fast... that leaves the PCI bus I guess. -- HG. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: SATA RAID with Promise TX4 (Was: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?)
On 2007-06-02 05:41, HG wrote: snip thought that what ever it is, it's going to be more than (P)ATA and as Bonnie++ showed that the RAID was in the same ballpark as a PATA drive would be, I didn't think that PCI bus would be the limiting factor. You could check the mobo specs online. That's a SATA300 card, but it's running at or near ATA133 speeds. I suspect, if you do check, you'll find the PCI bus speed is similarly 133 :-) -- Hypocrisy is the homage vice pays to virtue. -- François de La Rochefoucauld -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: SATA RAID with Promise TX4 (Was: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?)
Hello all! On 5/27/07, Darryl Gregorash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2007-05-26 23:36, HG wrote: I have just ordered a Promise SATA300 TX4plus. It was the only And now it arrived. :-) page says that: Summary: No TCQ. Newer cards support NCQ. Full SATA control including hotplug and PM on all. What is confusing? The card supports these, but the driver does not. The comment you quoted about the sata_promise driver suggests that that TCQ will not be supported in the driver, because there is NCQ support in the cards. I think this is verified by the bool.msg : (couple of lines from there9 6scsi0 : sata_promise 6ata1: SATA link up 3.0 Gbps (SStatus 123 SControl 300) 6ata1.00: ATA-7, max UDMA/133, 976773168 sectors: LBA48 NCQ (depth 0/32) 6 ata1.00: configured for UDMA/133 5 Vendor: ATA Model: ST3500630AS Rev: 3.AA 5 Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 05 I'm running 2.6.18.8-0.3-default and if I understood correctly, that NCQ (depth 0/32) means that NCQ is not enabled in the driver. I'm obviously not getting the full 3Gb speed as my PIII (733MHz) is not quite up to that: 6raid5: automatically using best checksumming function: pIII_sse 4 pIII_sse : 1494.000 MB/sec This was done to get large fault tolerant disk. Therefore I formatted with EXT3 and put the data journaling on (no UPS). But still I was hoping for better performance. Here is one output from bonnie++: Version 1.01d --Sequential Output-- --Sequential Input- --Random- -Per Chr- --Block-- -Rewrite- -Per Chr- --Block-- --Seeks-- MachineSize K/sec %CP K/sec %CP K/sec %CP K/sec %CP K/sec %CP /sec %CP delta1G 19415 64 33664 40 24524 37 25513 73 60938 54 324.6 2 --Sequential Create-- Random Create -Create-- --Read--- -Delete-- -Create-- --Read--- -Delete-- files /sec %CP /sec %CP /sec %CP /sec %CP /sec %CP /sec %CP 16 15397 95 + +++ 19647 86 13929 84 + +++ 20957 92 So, the performance isn't very good. But this is a old computer (PIII 733, with 512Mb), so maybe the bottleneck is somewhere else. Or what do you think? The end goal is that this sits in a corner (home made Buffalo TeraStation) and is accessed through the network. Currently I have 100Mb net, but I'm hoping to be able to change it to 1000Mb. But this is what I was disappointed with, from another (windows) computer I was reading a large 2,5Gb file, the network usage went only up to 63% of the capacity. I must try that with another client soon, but I was hoping for much better performance (I've seen 100Mb net go to steady 92%). And a strange thing, when I open sysinfo:/ in konqueror, this new RAID is not listed there under the disk information. Why could that be? Not that it matters, but I'm just not very confident that everything is ok (I upgraded 10.0 - 10.2 + all possible upgrades there). -- HG. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: SATA RAID with Promise TX4 (Was: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?)
On 2007-06-01 23:23, HG wrote: snip So, the performance isn't very good. But this is a old computer (PIII 733, with 512Mb), so maybe the bottleneck is somewhere else. Or what do you think? Well, it is a PCI card. What's the speed of the PCI bus? That's going to be the limiting factor. -- Hypocrisy is the homage vice pays to virtue. -- François de La Rochefoucauld -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 5/28/07, HG [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello! On 5/27/07, Darryl Gregorash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2007-05-26 23:36, HG wrote: Hi! On 5/25/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html#matrix for the Sept. 06 status matrix. That should have been accurate for 10.2. Lots of big Greg I have just ordered a Promise SATA300 TX4plus. It was the only I can't find a TX4plus anywhere on the Promise website. Do you mean the TX4310? That was what the shop gave as the Promise internal code. The link they gave, points here: http://www.promise.com/product/product_detail_eng.asp?segment=undefinedproduct_id=139 Do you know more about the status as the table leaves me a little confused. The table says that the driver for above Promise does not support NCQ, new EH, hotplug or suspend. But when I scrolled up, the page says that: Summary: No TCQ. Newer cards support NCQ. Full SATA control including hotplug and PM on all. What is confusing? The card supports these, but the driver does not. The comment you quoted about the sata_promise driver suggests that that TCQ will not be supported in the driver, because there is NCQ support in the cards. I do not know if NCQ and TCQ are related in that way as you say - TCQ is something new to me and my drives do not support that (so, I wont get it even if the software would support it). Anyways, the Promise web-site (above) mentions that the card supports both NCQ and TCQ. The notes after the table say this: No, feature is not present. The hardware can support this feature, but driver code does not yet exist to support it. Note the word yet. That was the one word that I missed! 8-) Sorry about that. Yes, what I was confused about was, what the hardware supports and what the software supports now or in the future. Now it's clear. In other words, stay tuned -- the support should be there sometime in the future. If you absolutely /must/ have all these now, then look for something that can use the ahci driver, or get a Silicon Image SiI3124 (presumably, though, most if not all of those will be more expensive than you suggest your budget allows). I will stay tuned. Obviously I can live without those features (I mean, how did we store our data before NCQ and TCQ? :-) I'll stay with the card that I have selected. After all, I want reliable 4-port solution for home use with my own money... corporate would be different. So, all in all, I'm glad to know that what I selected is now supported by OpenSUSE. And in the future, I might even get better performance. Thanks! -- H Over the last 6 months (ie. since Sept. 06), the Promise Libata driver has received a significant amount of love and attention. I don't know the details, but in 2.6.21 and newer kernels I'm almost positive it is using the new EH. And I think the NCQ TCQ functionality is in there as well. If your really curious, check the 2.6.19, 2.6.20, 2.6.21 changelogs at http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ for major improvements. For recent minor bug fixes in the 2.6.21 series check changelogs for 2.6.21.1, 2.6.21.2 , 2.6.21.3. If you find that there is is new functionality available not in the stock OpenSuse 10.2 kernels (2.6.18 based iirc), you might want to consider using one of the Factory kernels. They are less tested, but likely will work fine in non-production environment. FYI: If you do go through the changelogs, I'd be curious what you find so post a summary back to the list if you don't mind. Greg -- Greg Freemyer The Norcross Group Forensics for the 21st Century -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 5/29/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If your really curious, check the 2.6.19, 2.6.20, 2.6.21 changelogs at http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ for major improvements. For recent minor bug fixes in the 2.6.21 series check changelogs for 2.6.21.1, 2.6.21.2 , 2.6.21.3. If you find that there is is new functionality available not in the stock OpenSuse 10.2 kernels (2.6.18 based iirc), you might want to consider using one of the Factory kernels. They are less tested, but likely will work fine in non-production environment. FYI: If you do go through the changelogs, I'd be curious what you find so post a summary back to the list if you don't mind. I ended up getting curious myself. 2.6.19 - Nothing significant related to Promise TX4 2.6.20 - New maintainer (Mikael Pettersson mikpe at it.uu.se). New EH implemented for most Promise TX chip sets. Appears to include hotplug. Not sure about NCQ or TCQ. 2.6.21 - Remaining TX4 chipsets moved to new EH. ATAPI support added (used by CDs/DVDs) 2.6.22-rc3 - Only one patch to fix a typo in flags. Don't know what impact it had. Note that I would be very surprised if any of the above has been back ported to opensuse 10.2. You need a factory or kotd kernel to get the above improvements. Or just wait for 10.3 to come out. (Do we have a target date? Aug. will be 8 months since 10.2) Greg -- Greg Freemyer The Norcross Group Forensics for the 21st Century -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 2007-05-29 09:57, Greg Freemyer wrote: snip above improvements. Or just wait for 10.3 to come out. (Do we have a target date? Aug. will be 8 months since 10.2) Of course, that is all in the roadmap at opensuse.org: From AJ's most recent accouncement: Thu, Jun 14 openSUSE 10.3 Alpha5 release Thu, Jul 19 openSUSE 10.3 Alpha6 release Thu, Aug 9 openSUSE 10.3 Beta1 release Thu, Aug 23 openSUSE 10.3 Beta2 release Thu, Sep 6 openSUSE 10.3 Beta3 release Thu, Sep 20 openSUSE 10.3 Release Candidate 1 release Thu, Sep 27 openSUSE 10.3 Goldmaster release (internal) Thu, Oct 4 openSUSE 10.3 public release and the definitive (?) source: http://en.opensuse.org/Roadmap/10.3 -- Hypocrisy is the homage vice pays to virtue. -- François de La Rochefoucauld -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
Hi! On 5/29/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/29/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If your really curious, check the 2.6.19, 2.6.20, 2.6.21 changelogs at http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ for major improvements. For recent minor bug fixes in the 2.6.21 series check [...] I ended up getting curious myself. [...] Note that I would be very surprised if any of the above has been back ported to opensuse 10.2. You need a factory or kotd kernel to get the above improvements. Or just wait for 10.3 to come out. (Do we have a target date? Aug. will be 8 months since 10.2) Thanks for looking up that info! I'm going ahead with 10.2. This is not business production, but it is the system where I'm going to be storing everything at home. So, I do not want to mess with this. I have other systems for messing around. :-) But that said, if this update (from 10.0 to 10.2) goes well, I am probably going to be updating to 10.3 when it comes. I'm hoping it to be a release like 9.3 - which was great. :-) -- H -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
Hello! On 5/27/07, Darryl Gregorash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2007-05-26 23:36, HG wrote: Hi! On 5/25/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html#matrix for the Sept. 06 status matrix. That should have been accurate for 10.2. Lots of big Greg I have just ordered a Promise SATA300 TX4plus. It was the only I can't find a TX4plus anywhere on the Promise website. Do you mean the TX4310? That was what the shop gave as the Promise internal code. The link they gave, points here: http://www.promise.com/product/product_detail_eng.asp?segment=undefinedproduct_id=139 Do you know more about the status as the table leaves me a little confused. The table says that the driver for above Promise does not support NCQ, new EH, hotplug or suspend. But when I scrolled up, the page says that: Summary: No TCQ. Newer cards support NCQ. Full SATA control including hotplug and PM on all. What is confusing? The card supports these, but the driver does not. The comment you quoted about the sata_promise driver suggests that that TCQ will not be supported in the driver, because there is NCQ support in the cards. I do not know if NCQ and TCQ are related in that way as you say - TCQ is something new to me and my drives do not support that (so, I wont get it even if the software would support it). Anyways, the Promise web-site (above) mentions that the card supports both NCQ and TCQ. The notes after the table say this: No, feature is not present. The hardware can support this feature, but driver code does not yet exist to support it. Note the word yet. That was the one word that I missed! 8-) Sorry about that. Yes, what I was confused about was, what the hardware supports and what the software supports now or in the future. Now it's clear. In other words, stay tuned -- the support should be there sometime in the future. If you absolutely /must/ have all these now, then look for something that can use the ahci driver, or get a Silicon Image SiI3124 (presumably, though, most if not all of those will be more expensive than you suggest your budget allows). I will stay tuned. Obviously I can live without those features (I mean, how did we store our data before NCQ and TCQ? :-) I'll stay with the card that I have selected. After all, I want reliable 4-port solution for home use with my own money... corporate would be different. So, all in all, I'm glad to know that what I selected is now supported by OpenSUSE. And in the future, I might even get better performance. Thanks! -- H -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 2007-05-28 04:27, HG wrote: snip That was what the shop gave as the Promise internal code. The link they gave, points here: http://www.promise.com/product/product_detail_eng.asp?segment=undefinedproduct_id=139 That link is the TX4, 4 SATA300 ports without RAID. The TX4310 is the corresponding card with a RAID controller, but of course it costs quite a bit more money. If hardware RAID is not an issue, the TX4 appears to be a good solution. snip So, all in all, I'm glad to know that what I selected is now supported by OpenSUSE. And in the future, I might even get better performance. And just as important, Promise advertises SuSELinux as one of the supported operating systems. -- Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo. -- HG Wells -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 2007-05-26 23:36, HG wrote: Hi! On 5/25/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html#matrix for the Sept. 06 status matrix. That should have been accurate for 10.2. Lots of big Greg I have just ordered a Promise SATA300 TX4plus. It was the only I can't find a TX4plus anywhere on the Promise website. Do you mean the TX4310? Do you know more about the status as the table leaves me a little confused. The table says that the driver for above Promise does not support NCQ, new EH, hotplug or suspend. But when I scrolled up, the page says that: Summary: No TCQ. Newer cards support NCQ. Full SATA control including hotplug and PM on all. What is confusing? The card supports these, but the driver does not. The comment you quoted about the sata_promise driver suggests that that TCQ will not be supported in the driver, because there is NCQ support in the cards. The notes after the table say this: No, feature is not present. The hardware can support this feature, but driver code does not yet exist to support it. Note the word yet. In other words, stay tuned -- the support should be there sometime in the future. If you absolutely /must/ have all these now, then look for something that can use the ahci driver, or get a Silicon Image SiI3124 (presumably, though, most if not all of those will be more expensive than you suggest your budget allows). -- Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo. -- HG Wells -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
Hi! On 5/25/07, Greg Freemyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html#matrix for the Sept. 06 status matrix. That should have been accurate for 10.2. Lots of big Greg I have just ordered a Promise SATA300 TX4plus. It was the only affordable 4 port solution I could find. According to their web-site, it supports NCQ and TCQ (my drives should support NCQ - Seagate 7200.10). Do you know more about the status as the table leaves me a little confused. The table says that the driver for above Promise does not support NCQ, new EH, hotplug or suspend. But when I scrolled up, the page says that: Summary: No TCQ. Newer cards support NCQ. Full SATA control including hotplug and PM on all. So, you see that it's quite confusing to see as these are kind saying the opposite thing. Or is it so that the cards support all these, but the driver does not. In that case, is it ever going to? I still have time to change my card, but it really hard to find affordable 4-port PCI card to run RAID... :-( -- H -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
- Oorspronkelijk bericht - Van: Robert Smits [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag, mei 25, 2007 04:21 AM Aan: 'OpenSUSE' Onderwerp: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card? I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? i use 3ware (AMCC) cards all the time. Rock stable and full linux support. jef peeraer -- Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - Harry Martin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
I agree 3ware is the best - Problem is that they are relatively expensive - Be well, Michael On 5/25/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Oorspronkelijk bericht - Van: Robert Smits [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag, mei 25, 2007 04:21 AM Aan: 'OpenSUSE' Onderwerp: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card? I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? i use 3ware (AMCC) cards all the time. Rock stable and full linux support. jef peeraer -- Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - Harry Martin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
As usual, the open suse community hasn't let me down. Thanks to everyone for their recommendations. Bob -- Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - Harry Martin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
On 5/24/07, Robert Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? Sata is rapidly improving in the kernel, so I would upgrade to 10.2 if I was going to rely on Sata. ie. 10.2 has a rewritten Error Handling routine (EH) that took almost a year to get developed and into the kernel. 10.1 has the original EH that basically just fails a drive when it encounters an error. The new one goes thru a whole series of graceful degradations. Several of the advanced functions like hot-plugging were not supportable with the old EH. See http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html#matrix for the Sept. 06 status matrix. That should have been accurate for 10.2. Lots of big improvements since then, 10.3 should have very solid Sata support, including: CD / DVD devices, NCQ, Hot-plugging, and hopefully all the Sata drivers moved to the new EH. (The last one is currently being tested.) FYI: 3ware is a SCSI device from the kernel perspective, so this discussion does not relate. If you are going to stay with 10.1, I would strongly consider a 3ware controller. Greg -- Greg Freemyer The Norcross Group Forensics for the 21st Century -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? -- Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - Harry Martin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
i've got a PCI Card Promise SATA300 TX4 on my HP Proliant server no driver needed and it allow a system to be bootable http://www.promise.com/product/product_detail_eng.asp?product_id=139 i run my Raptor 36GB SATA for the system on SLED-10 have fun Banana On May 25, 2007, at 4:21 AM, Robert Smits wrote: I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? -- Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - Harry Martin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] Recommendation for sata card?
Banana Flex wrote: i've got a PCI Card Promise SATA300 TX4 on my HP Proliant server no driver needed and it allow a system to be bootable http://www.promise.com/product/product_detail_eng.asp?product_id=139 i run my Raptor 36GB SATA for the system on SLED-10 have fun Banana On May 25, 2007, at 4:21 AM, Robert Smits wrote: I need a sata pci card to allow my suse 10.1 system to see a 320 GB sata drive. Any recommendations? --Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED] I use cards made by Syba. They are cheap, they come with linux drivers, they have PCI cards. I have a pair of 300 GB Seagate SATA drives (but their two-port PCI SATA cards are SATA I so the speed is 1.5 Mb/s instead of SATA II 3.5 Mb/s). -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
