ORA-04030 Out of Process memory

[Satyendra K Khare]

Please give some suggestions how to avoid this problem, it comes after 3
to 4 hours when i run a process through form, and it terminates then i
have to down the database and up again to restart that procedure..

ORA-04030 Out of Process memory when trying to allocate 528 Bytes (call
heap , user umc)
ORA-06512 at OBJ.PS_MATCH, Line 1298
ORA-06512 at line 1


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RE: VC++ to Oracle connectivity without installing client

[Justin Cave]

If you really need to develop a client/server application, rather than 
going for the eminently reasonable suggestion of using a three-tier 
architecture, I'd start by looking into response files.  This allows you to 
script the Oracle Universal Installer, so that the necessary client 
components will be installed without user intervention.  This could be 
called as the first step in your install program.

http://tahiti.oracle.com/pls/db92/db92.drilldown?levelnum=1&preference=&expand_all=&book=&method=FULL&chapters=0&verb=&word=response+file#a96697


At 08:18 PM 11/8/2002, you wrote:
Hrm.  But that's why everyone is doing web-based(three-tier) applications
to avoid doing that kind of thing.  Even if you manage to include Oracle
client into your app, you will still face the challenge of rolling
your app on 1000 PCs.  Plus subsequent fixes, new versions.

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 5:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hello Gurus,

I would like to program our VC++ application to
directly connect to Oracle database using OO4O or OCI.
But the problem is this VC++ app is gonna run on 1000s
of desktops where we may have to install Oracle client
which will be a time consuming in-efficient process. I
am trying to see if the required client dlls and other
files can be combined in the VC++ package itself and
delivered to those 1000s of desktops.

Can any of you give some insight into this, please?

Any help would be highly appreciated.

Thanks,
Muru


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Justin Cave
Distributed Database Consulting

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RE: How to tune this query ...

[Cary Millsap]

Title: How to tune this query ...









Watch out, though. The RULE hint probably
goes away in 10i (my guess, nothing official).

 



Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec
9–11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on
Oracle® System Performance, Feb 9–12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis'
Optimising Oracle, Nov 19–21 Dallas



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Jamadagni,
Rajendra
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002
4:59 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: How to tune this
query ...

 



This works nice
 Barbara Baker also hinted me that a
good old RULE hint fixes the problem.





 





Thank you Waleed
and Barbara ...





Raj





__



Rajendra Jamadagni 
    MIS, ESPN Inc.

Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com

Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that
of ESPN Inc. 

QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion
is an art!



-Original Message-
From: Khedr, Waleed
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002
5:20 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: How to tune this
query ...



Try this:





SELECT 
l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal, 
    DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row Wait
Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL -
User',l.TYPE||'System') res,





 





   
SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) TAB,u.NAME owner, 
    l.id1,l.id2, 
    DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock', 
   
2,'Row Share', 
   
3,'Row Exclusive', 
   
4,'Share', 
   
5,'Shr Row Excl', 
   
6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode, 
    DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock', 
   
2,'Row Share', 
   
3,'Row Excl', 
   
4,'Share', 
   
5,'Shr Row Excl', 
   
6,'Exclusive',NULL) request 
FROM (select /*+ no_merge */ * from v$lock) l, (select /*+ no_merge */ * 
from v$session )s, 
sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t 
WHERE l.SID = s.SID 
AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND' 
AND t.obj# = l.id1 
AND u.USER# = t.owner# 





 





 





Waleed

RE: VC++ to Oracle connectivity without installing client

[Ji, Richard]

Hrm.  But that's why everyone is doing web-based(three-tier) applications
to avoid doing that kind of thing.  Even if you manage to include Oracle
client into your app, you will still face the challenge of rolling
your app on 1000 PCs.  Plus subsequent fixes, new versions.

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 5:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hello Gurus,

I would like to program our VC++ application to
directly connect to Oracle database using OO4O or OCI.
But the problem is this VC++ app is gonna run on 1000s
of desktops where we may have to install Oracle client
which will be a time consuming in-efficient process. I
am trying to see if the required client dlls and other
files can be combined in the VC++ package itself and 
delivered to those 1000s of desktops.

Can any of you give some insight into this, please?

Any help would be highly appreciated.

Thanks,
Muru
 

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Away on a trip

[Kip . Bryant]

This is an automatic reply message from Kip Bryant.

I am attending a conference in New Orleans and will not be checking my email from
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If you need a response to your email before Nov 18, please get in
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Re: Oracle 10i new releases

[Rachel Carmichael]

6.0.33 on VAX/VMS

5 on VAX/VMS


--- Joe Testa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)
> 
> joe
> 
> 
> Mercadante, Thomas F wrote:
> 
> >Robert,
> >
> >I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the
> release
> >level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted,
> there were
> >huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is -
> lets stay
> >at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.
>  Are
> >the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical
> that
> >justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch up
> to 9i.
> >
> >
> >My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people
> will just
> >plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again in
> just a
> >few months.  Makes no sense to me.
> >
> >Tom Mercadante
> >Oracle Certified Professional
> >
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is
> it the
> >rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for
> features? The
> >push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column,
> fk's ,
> >drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
> >considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were,
> what
> >kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 
> >
> >So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the
> course that
> >it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm
> willing
> >to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1
> was.
> >
> >RF
> >
> >Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
> >Oracle Database Architect
> >CSX Midtier Database Administration
> >Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!
> >
> >Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package.
> How
> >efficient of you. 
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what
> is
> >Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast? 
> are
> >there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies
> this?
> >
> >makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now
> about a
> >year and a half.
> >
> >Tom Mercadante
> >Oracle Certified Professional
> >
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said
> that the
> >code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> >
> >Prakash
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> >
> >Sunil Nookala
> >DBA
> >Dell Corp.
> >
> >
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Joe Testa
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> -
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).


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RE: Oracle 10i new releases

[MacGregor, Ian A.]

Ha I remember Oracle 5 on VM.  Ah the joys of minidisks.  I started with Oracle on VMS 
in 1984, but I cannot recall the exact version.  BI files, IOR, UFI, RPT and RPF,  IAP 
and IAG when IAP was completely text driven.  I was Dba'ing before there was SQL*NET.  

Back in those days one was the DBA, the developer etc.  The advantage was one fixed 
one's own mistakes.  Sometimes People query, "How did you know what happened?", they 
think I'm a genius. Little do they know, they made the same blunder I did in 1986. 

Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:49 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Oh...  I'm sure they are many other who back farther then that...  But, I do remember 
6.0.36...  As a matter of fact it was 6.0.36.1.53 on IBM VM...  Ah the memories...

Tim

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 4:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)

joe


Mercadante, Thomas F wrote:

>Robert,
>
>I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the release 
>level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted, there 
>were huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is - 
>lets
stay
>at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.  
>Are the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical 
>that justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch 
>up to 9i.
>
>
>My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people will 
>just plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again 
>in just a few months.  Makes no sense to me.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it 
>the rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for 
>features?
The
>push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, 
>fk's , drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to 
>be considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, 
>what kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line.
>
>So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course
that
>it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm
willing
>to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 
>was.
>
>RF
>
>Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
>Oracle Database Architect
>CSX Midtier Database Administration
>Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!
>
>Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How 
>efficient of you.
>
> 
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is 
>Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are 
>there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies 
>this?
>
>makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about 
>a year and a half.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that 
>the code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
>
>Prakash
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
>
>Sunil Nookala
>DBA
>Dell Corp.
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
>
>  
>

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Re: Oracle 10i new releases

[Joe Testa]

i did use some version 5 on 386 PC :)

joe


John Kanagaraj wrote:


Move over Joe and Tim. I used 5.1.17 on a propreitary *nix box way back in
'89! I do know there are a few on this list that do go back farther than
that!

John

 

-Original Message-
From: Johnston, Tim [mailto:TJohnston@;quallaby.com]
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:49 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: Oracle 10i new releases


Oh...  I'm sure they are many other who back farther then 
that...  But, I do
remember 6.0.36...  As a matter of fact it was 6.0.36.1.53 on 
IBM VM...  Ah
the memories...

Tim

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 4:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)

joe

   


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RE: Oracle 10i new releases

[John Kanagaraj]

Move over Joe and Tim. I used 5.1.17 on a propreitary *nix box way back in
'89! I do know there are a few on this list that do go back farther than
that!

John

> -Original Message-
> From: Johnston, Tim [mailto:TJohnston@;quallaby.com]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:49 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: Oracle 10i new releases
> 
> 
> Oh...  I'm sure they are many other who back farther then 
> that...  But, I do
> remember 6.0.36...  As a matter of fact it was 6.0.36.1.53 on 
> IBM VM...  Ah
> the memories...
> 
> Tim
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 4:04 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)
> 
> joe
> 
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Re: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[Tim Gorman]

Dennis,
 
I've always characterized the ODS as having a data 
model that is only "lightly transformed" from it's source operational systems, 
while a data warehouse and the downstream data marts have a query-optimized star 
schema data model.  By saying "lightly transformed", I'm referring to the 
fact that data "transformation" doesn't refer only to summarization, but also to 
standardization/consolidation and cleansing.  Performing the 
standardization and cleansing parts of "transformation" on the way into the ODS 
enables some terrific functionality, which might fall into the following 
categories:

  mid-way "staging" area for data flowing from 
  operational systems into the data warehouse and on to the data 
  marts

  
This is probably the way that most people think 
of the ODS.  Depending on the complexity of transformation, it may or 
may not be a valid purpose.  Some simpler transformations can (and 
should!) be performed "on the fly" straight into the star-schema data model 
of the data warehouse, but for complex multi-step transformations and 
integration/merge of data from many sources, where synchronization, 
failures, and restarts are the norm, a staging area for this complex 
processing is crucial.

  offloaded "tactical" reporting from 
  operational systems

  
This is another valid purpose for an ODS 
-- whether as a simple "reporting database copy" or something more 
sophisticated.  Sometimes, if this is the only requirement, it can be 
as simple as a standby database that has been opened READ ONLY and used for 
offloading reporting or even a periodic EXP/IMP or the like.  However, 
such simple replication processes usually preclude the other usage 
categories described in this email.
 
This is very useful when the operational system 
is "legacy" and additional development is not possible or cost-effective, 
yet new reporting requirements still exist and continue to 
proliferate.  Instead of re-hiring old RPG programmers, use the ODS to 
enable new reports using Crystal, Oracle Reports, or even good ol' 
SQL*Plus...

  consolidated-view "tactical" reporting (if there 
  are many disparate source operational systems)

  
This is a slight variation on the purpose 
mentioned above.  I experienced it for the first time at a company 
which was growing rapidly via acquisition (way back in the hazy, crazy 
90s).  We spent a great deal of time working on the data modeling to 
ensure that we accurately defined and mapped data entities from the 
disparate source operational systems and merged them into a consolidate 
enterprise data model.  The result was a consolidated database of 
operational data that could be used for consolidated-view reporting, 
relieving much of management's pressure to consolidate operational 
systems.  An additional side-benefit was that all the mapping work 
between data models were later used on conversion projects to truly 
consolidate the disparate source operational 
  systems...

  "data-archival" point for operational 
  systems

  
I worked one project where the source 
operational systems were all factory-floor controllers (micro-vaxen) and 
there was a legal requirement to save that information for a very long time 
(20 years).  There was also a desire to analyze and mine that 
data.  The solution to both requirements was an ODS where the data was 
archived to optical storage mounted on an HSM file-system.  Rather than 
archive from hundreds of factory-floor machines, we killed two requirements 
with one stone...
 
Mixing this solution with the previous one 
("consolidated-view tactical reporting") is something I've not experienced, 
but it seems like another interesting purpose.  Never mind "legacy" 
applications, there aren't many "modern" ERP or CRM systems that adequately 
handle data archival/retrieval;  only "purge" at best.  An ODS is 
an elegant solution for these 
requirements...
There might be more uses for ODS, but I've found it 
useful to maintain these possible solutions in mind.  I would at least 
consider whether business requirements fall into any of these categories, 
because an ODS (not a DW, not another "operational system", not a simple 
"reporting database copy") is a better solution for all of them...
 
Hope this helps...
 
-Tim
 
- Original Message - 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:43 
PM
Subject: Re: Need Help on Operational Data 
Store
> > After reading literature from Kimball,  Inmon and some 
other experts, it> seems to me that we should have a 3-tier architecture 
-> Tier 1 -  operational data> Tier 2 - ODS which contains 
integrated, cleansed, transformed operational> detail data, or staging 
area in relational schema> Tier3 - star sche

Reminder : ListMeeting at OOW on 12th (Tuesday)

[John Kanagaraj]

Hi all,

Just a friendly reminder to all those who are getting together at OOW on
Tuesday evening (12th Nov).

Location: Chevy's restaurant, just opposite to the Moscone Center (3rd and
Howard) where OOW is being held. In case you need an address:

Chevys Mexican Restaurant 
201 3rd St
San Francisco, CA 94103 
(415) 543-8060 

Date/Time: Tuesday 12th Nov, 7PM. Those who need to revive themselves with
copious amounts of their favorite liquids can congregate earlier at the bar.

The guest list - at this time - includes (in no particular order):

 Drum Roll.

Mike Bates ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Kirti Deshpande ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Robert Freeman ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Ari Kaplan ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Anjo Kolk ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Steve McClure ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Conner McDonald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Cary Millsap (cary.millsap.hotsos.com) 
John Beresniewicz -- (With Cary)
Lex de Haan -- (With Cary)
James Morle ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
Mogens Norgaard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Pete Sherman -- ??
Gaja Vaidyanatha -- ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Kyle Hailey (With Gaja)
Richmond Shee (With Gaja)
Walt Weaver ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) --
Marlene Theriault ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Aaron & Jennifer Newman (with Marlene)
Sean Hull - ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Gerardo Molina ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - Organizer 
John Kanagaraj ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 

Now if this list of luminous personalities did not impress you, nothing will
:) I promise I will try and capture highlights of the geek-talk (and other
things as well) and post back to the list, so the rest don't miss the
proceedings!

John Kanagaraj
Oracle Applications DBA
DBSoft Inc
(W): 408-970-7002

What would you see if you were allowed to look back at your life at the end
of your journey in this earth?

** The opinions and statements above are entirely my own and not those of my
employer or clients **

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RE: How to tune this query ...

[Jamadagni, Rajendra]

Title: How to tune this query ...



This works nice  Barbara Baker also hinted me that a 
good old RULE hint fixes the problem.
 
Thank you Waleed and Barbara ...
Raj
__
Rajendra 
Jamadagni  
    MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot 
com
Any opinion expressed here is 
personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but 
having an opinion is an art!

  -Original Message-From: Khedr, Waleed 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 5:20 
  PMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: 
  How to tune this query ...
  Try 
  this:
  SELECT  l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal, 
      DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row 
  Wait Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL - 
  User',l.TYPE||'System') res,
   
      SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) 
  TAB,u.NAME owner,     l.id1,l.id2, 
      DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock', 
      
  2,'Row Share', 
      
  3,'Row Exclusive', 
      
  4,'Share', 
      
  5,'Shr Row Excl', 
      
  6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode,     
  DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock', 
      
  2,'Row Share', 
      
  3,'Row Excl', 
      
  4,'Share', 
      
  5,'Shr Row Excl', 
      
  6,'Exclusive',NULL) request FROM (select /*+ no_merge */ * from v$lock) l, 
  (select /*+ no_merge */ *  from v$session )s, sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t 
  WHERE l.SID = s.SID AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND' AND t.obj# = l.id1 
  AND u.USER# = t.owner# 
   
   
  Waleed
*This e-mail 
message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above and may 
contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from 
disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, or are 
not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify corporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 
and delete this e-mail message from your computer, Thank 
you.*1

RE: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Dennis
   My recollection of Kimball vs. Inmon is the reverse, that Kimball said
"why not", while Inmon said "no way". 
   But anyway, I think the key is knowing the situation at your
organization. What are your user expectations? What is your refresh cycle -
weekly, daily, etc.? How likely is the interval to change (start with a
week, then the users say it must be daily)? Depending on your design, some
DW functions may be unavailable to your users during data refresh. For
example, we have a DW that is loaded weekly, but the refresh occurs on the
weekend so the users don't run reports then. If there is a load problem then
the users are notified which portions of the DW are not available until the
problem is fixed. 
   The relational bit bothers me. Too many experienced data modeling people
have trouble giving up on the relational. Sometimes you need a little
relational to help data integrity of loads, but often it gets in the way.
Too much relational will yield a crippled DW. But I never try to argue with
a relational bigot (not to offend anyone, speaking just in the context of
DW), life is just too short and there are others willing to assume that
duty. Ralph has had some good articles on why relational is just not
appropriate in the DW.
   One thing Ralph is very firm about - get the grain of your fact table
correct because the tendency is to build at a higher grain and then you end
up rebuilding it again with much wasted effort and user frustration.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:44 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



After reading literature from Kimball,  Inmon and some other experts, it
seems to me that we should have a 3-tier architecture -
Tier 1 -  operational data
Tier 2 - ODS which contains integrated, cleansed, transformed operational
detail data, or staging area in relational schema
Tier3 - star schema Data marts

The question/contention here is tier 2 - should we provide reporting
capability for this? According to Kimball, staging area should not be
accessible to end users for direct reporting. But Inmon seems to disagree
with him on this one.
If ODS is an integrated, authoritative data source of the enterprise, I
don't see why we can't create ad-hoc reports against it. Of course since it
is relational, we might need reporting tools and heavy IS involvement. So
IMHO it depends on what the user needs are to decide what tier2 should look
like and be used for.
Anybody cares to commend on this?

Thanks

Dennis Meng
Database Administrator
Focal Communications Corp.


 

  Jared Still


  com> cc:

  Sent by: Subject: Re: Need Help on
Operational Data Store  
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 

 

  11/08/2002 11:19

  AM

  Please respond

  to ORACLE-L

 

 






Dennis,

I think you got it wrong right off when you stated that there's  a
"lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW ".

It isn't that issue at all.  No two people can agree on what an ODS
is at all, much less compare it to a DW.

To me for instance, an ODS is a place to stage data for the final
stages of some other process, be it a DW, or anything else.

An ODS is a rather generic term, and therefor whatever you
want it to be.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Greetings -
> I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there
are
> a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should
be
> used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
> Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover
ODS
> much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building
an
> ODS?
>
> TIA
>
>
> Dennis Meng
> Database Administrator
> Focal Communications Corp.
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RE: Oracle 10i new releases

[Johnston, Tim]

Oh...  I'm sure they are many other who back farther then that...  But, I do
remember 6.0.36...  As a matter of fact it was 6.0.36.1.53 on IBM VM...  Ah
the memories...

Tim

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 4:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)

joe


Mercadante, Thomas F wrote:

>Robert,
>
>I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the release
>level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted, there were
>huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is - lets
stay
>at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.  Are
>the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical that
>justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch up to 9i.
>
>
>My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people will just
>plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again in just a
>few months.  Makes no sense to me.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
>rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features?
The
>push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
>drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
>considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
>kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 
>
>So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course
that
>it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm
willing
>to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.
>
>RF
>
>Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
>Oracle Database Architect
>CSX Midtier Database Administration
>Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!
>
>Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
>efficient of you. 
>
> 
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
>Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
>there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?
>
>makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
>year and a half.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
>code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
>
>Prakash
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
>
>Sunil Nookala
>DBA
>Dell Corp.
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
>
>  
>

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Re: Data Purging Strategy

[Stephane Faroult]

Stephen Lee wrote:
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > I went to one meeting where someone from another DOE lab said
> > they needed to store some data on media which would last
> > 10,000 years.  I suggested chisels and stone tablets :)
> 
> That gold platter that NASA sent out into space: How long is it supposed to
> last?
> Another option might be a typical fruit cake -- the season for which is
> almost upon us.

While we are on the topic of comestibles, I find the comparison of the
lifespan of a CD to the time spent in wooden caskets by the favorite
beverages of some people of the list (sorry to disappoint, folks, but I
survive on water, tea and coffee) perfectly distressing. What about
writing the data on bottle labels ? Would last longer, and would
probably be more lovingly cared for.

-- 
Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole Software
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VC++ to Oracle connectivity without installing client

[Muru]

Hello Gurus,

I would like to program our VC++ application to
directly connect to Oracle database using OO4O or OCI.
But the problem is this VC++ app is gonna run on 1000s
of desktops where we may have to install Oracle client
which will be a time consuming in-efficient process. I
am trying to see if the required client dlls and other
files can be combined in the VC++ package itself and 
delivered to those 1000s of desktops.

Can any of you give some insight into this, please?

Any help would be highly appreciated.

Thanks,
Muru
 

__
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2
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Re: How to tune this query ...

[Stephane Faroult]

> "Jamadagni, Rajendra" wrote:
> 
> I am looking at oracle supplied locking query ... any idea how to tune
> this ?
> 
> SELECT  l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal,
> DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row Wait Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML
> Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL -
> User',l.TYPE||'System') res,
> 
> SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) TAB,u.NAME owner,
> l.id1,l.id2,
> DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock',
> 2,'Row Share',
> 3,'Row Exclusive',
> 4,'Share',
> 5,'Shr Row Excl',
> 6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode,
> DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock',
> 2,'Row Share',
> 3,'Row Excl',
> 4,'Share',
> 5,'Shr Row Excl',
> 6,'Exclusive',NULL) request
> FROM v$lock l, v$session s,
> sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t
> WHERE l.SID = s.SID
> AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND'
> AND t.obj# = l.id1
> AND u.USER# = t.owner#
> 
> Raj


Raj,

   It's a bit late here (midnight soon) so you will forgive me for not
researching all the details, but here is just a bit of advice. The main
problem are the dynamic views. I'd check in V$FIXED_VIEW_DEFINITION what
are the X$ they are based on (look for the definition of GV$ rather than
V$) and into V$INDEXED_FIXED_COLUMN which says what columns from X$
views are indexed (not many of them). And the important matter is of
course deciding the angle of attack - which table first? The obvious
candidate is V$SESSION, but it is not obvious that you have the proper
indexes to join it to V$LOCK (which is itself a complicated join, if I
remember well). I think that ORDERED plus a request for a hash join
between v$lock and v$session, with tables or views listed as v$session,
v$lock, sys.obj$ and sys.user$ should improve things. Next step would be
to see how v$lock is built, and directly query the X$ views which are
relevant, and them only. But I am erring.

HTH,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole Software
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RE: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[Jared . Still]

Dennis,

Well, as a matter of fact, I do prefer Kimball to Inmon.

I was unaware of their disagreement on ODS, which makes
sense I guess, since I've read little of Inmon.

My thoughts on ODS were based on discussions with former
colleagues.  We did have something at BlueCross that we expended
a lot of energy in designing, though we didn't call it an ODS.

Jared





DENNIS WILLIAMS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/08/2002 11:24 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
Subject:RE: Need Help on Operational Data Store


Jared
   Oh, I wouldn't let Bill Inmon hear you say that. He coined the term
Operational Data Store. I do not purport to be a data warehouse expert at
the least, but several years ago I studied the literature quite a bit and
tried to keep on top of the topics. And the subject has evolved some since
then. At that time, there tended to be two separate camps, followers of
Ralph Kimball's ideas and followers of Bill Inmon's ideas. Well, 
truthfully
there was a third group, the rabid Fifth Normal Form advocates that 
insisted
on fully normalizing their DW model. 
   The issue that split the Inmon and Kimball camps was the ODS. The two
titans of the industry even had some head-to-head debates at large
conferences. Ralph always claimed that the ODS was no big deal, you 
probably
had a loading area somewhere and if you had to give it a name, fine call 
it
an ODS. Bill insisted very strongly that the ODS was THE crucial concept 
in
data warehousing and if you didn't design that part correctly your data
warehouse was sure to fail. 
   Since I could easily read and understand Ralph's articles and I could
never figure out what Bill was saying, I tended to follow Ralph's advice.
Given your statements, Jared you sound like a classic Kimball follower as
well.
   But the world moves on, and since the hot topic has been "real-time 
data
warehouses", so I assume the ODS controversy is now moot. Today Inmon's 
big
topic is the "Corporate Information Factory".

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:20 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Dennis,

I think you got it wrong right off when you stated that there's  a
"lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW ".

It isn't that issue at all.  No two people can agree on what an ODS
is at all, much less compare it to a DW.

To me for instance, an ODS is a place to stage data for the final
stages of some other process, be it a DW, or anything else.

An ODS is a rather generic term, and therefor whatever you 
want it to be.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Greetings -
> I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there 
are
> a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should
be
> used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
> Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover
ODS
> much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building
an
> ODS?
>
> TIA
>
>
> Dennis Meng
> Database Administrator
> Focal Communications Corp.
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).



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RE: How to tune this query ...

[Khedr, Waleed]

Title: How to tune this query ...



Try 
this:
SELECT  l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal, 
    DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row Wait 
Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL - 
User',l.TYPE||'System') res,
 
    SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) TAB,u.NAME 
owner,     l.id1,l.id2, 
    DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock', 
    
2,'Row Share', 
    
3,'Row Exclusive', 
    
4,'Share', 
    
5,'Shr Row Excl', 
    
6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode,     
DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock', 
    
2,'Row Share', 
    
3,'Row Excl', 
    
4,'Share', 
    
5,'Shr Row Excl', 
    
6,'Exclusive',NULL) request FROM (select /*+ no_merge */ * from v$lock) l, 
(select /*+ no_merge */ *  from v$session )s, sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t 
WHERE l.SID = s.SID AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND' AND t.obj# = l.id1 
AND u.USER# = t.owner# 
 
 
Waleed

Re: How to tune this query ...

[Barbara Baker]

Raj:
I had trouble with this very query.  Posted it to this list.  Never came up with anything.  What fixed the query for me was to add the ordered hint (select /*+ ordered */).
You might give it a try.
Good luck!!
 
Barb
 
 "Jamadagni, Rajendra" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


I am looking at oracle supplied locking query ... any idea how to tune this ? 
SELECT  l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal,     DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row Wait Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL - User',l.TYPE||'System') res,
    SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) TAB,u.NAME owner,     l.id1,l.id2,     DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock',     2,'Row Share',     3,'Row Exclusive',     4,'Share',     5,'Shr Row Excl',     6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode,     DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock',     2,'Row Share',     3,'Row Excl', !
!
;    4,'Share',     5,'Shr Row Excl',     6,'Exclusive',NULL) request FROM v$lock l, v$session s, sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t WHERE l.SID = s.SID AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND' AND t.obj# = l.id1 AND u.USER# = t.owner# 
Raj __ Rajendra Jamadagni      MIS, ESPN Inc. Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art! This e-mail message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above and may contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, or are not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify c!
!
orporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 and delete this e-mail message from your computer, Thank you.*2Do you Yahoo!?
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[John Shaw]

I am still having mystery problems with our 9.2.0.2 on Solaris 9 - I have to set the 
optimizer_mode back to 8.1.7 to get any kind of response time from our Discoverer 
reports (9.2..0.53). I have Oracle consulting coming out Monday to see if they can 
find anything.

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/08/02 02:58PM >>>
Absolutely.  Which is why none of my 8i OPS databases have gone to 9i
RAC yet.  And from the recent article that was posted here (on Grid
Computing), I'm not alone.

--
| Brian McGraw /* DBA */  Infinity Insurance |
| mailto:Brian.McGraw@;Infinity-Insurance.com |
--

-Original Message-
Carmichael
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:24 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

I've got 9i production databases. But they are brand-new applications.
I haven't upgraded any of the 8i ones I have as yet, nor are there any
plans to do so.

Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"


--- "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
> should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
> first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
> systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
> Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
> they out of their @#$%! mind?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM] 
> > Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> > 
> > 
> > Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> > said that the
> > code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> > 
> > Prakash
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> > 
> > Sunil Nookala
> > DBA
> > Dell Corp.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
> > -- 
> > Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com 
> > San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
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> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
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> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
> > -- 
> > Author: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1)
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[Stephen Lee]

> -Original Message-
> I went to one meeting where someone from another DOE lab said 
> they needed to store some data on media which would last 
> 10,000 years.  I suggested chisels and stone tablets :)

That gold platter that NASA sent out into space: How long is it supposed to
last?
Another option might be a typical fruit cake -- the season for which is
almost upon us.
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Re: Oracle 10i

[Ray Stell]

On Fri, Nov 08, 2002 at 01:14:21PM -0800, MacGregor, Ian A. wrote:
> It's not just the new releases, but the withdrawal of support for "old" releases 
>which is the problem.  


bingo! 

I love the way otn has oracle 8i under "archived."  

Like I'm running Oracle V2 released on DEC PDP-11.

Good weekend, folks!
===
Ray Stell   [EMAIL PROTECTED] (540) 231-4109 KE4TJC28^D
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Re[2]: Oracle 10i new releases

[dgoulet]

No, but I can remember 6.0.36 on HP-UX and 6.0.33 on HP-MPE.  Still have the
tapes too.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Joe Testa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/8/2002 1:03 PM

anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)

joe


Mercadante, Thomas F wrote:

>Robert,
>
>I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the release
>level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted, there were
>huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is - lets stay
>at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.  Are
>the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical that
>justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch up to 9i.
>
>
>My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people will just
>plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again in just a
>few months.  Makes no sense to me.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
>rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features? The
>push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
>drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
>considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
>kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 
>
>So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
>it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
>to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.
>
>RF
>
>Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
>Oracle Database Architect
>CSX Midtier Database Administration
>Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!
>
>Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
>efficient of you. 
>
> 
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
>Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
>there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?
>
>makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
>year and a half.
>
>Tom Mercadante
>Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
>code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
>
>Prakash
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
>
>Sunil Nookala
>DBA
>Dell Corp.
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
>Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
>
>  
>

-- 
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Stephen Lee]

> -Original Message-
> 
> Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"
> 

Well  But haven't you noticed that there are ALWAYS a few bugs that have
been strategically sprinkled about in any given release, the fix to which is
"upgrade to version x.y.z"?  Or is this just a Tru64 thing?  The old
strategy of Planned Obsolescence?
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Jesse, Rich]

How's about application vendors that can't keep up the pace of new Oracle
releases, but Oracle Support won't support the old versions?  What's the
*CUSTOMER* supposed to do???

The "new" version of Cognos' PowerHouse that we're looking at, which is tied
to a newer version of our third-party ERP system, officially was tested with
Oracle *7*.  Yay.  If it doesn't do 9iR2, does it do us any good to spend 9
months "upgrading"???

  At least it'll be 65F this weekend so I can leave my DBs alone an go
rake leaves.  :)

Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

> -Original Message-
> From: Rachel Carmichael [mailto:wisernet100@;yahoo.com]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:24 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> I've got 9i production databases. But they are brand-new applications.
> I haven't upgraded any of the 8i ones I have as yet, nor are there any
> plans to do so.
> 
> Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"
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RE: Destination address unreachable

[Stephen Lee]

> -Original Message-
> Yet, I don't think that passing the 9iOCP (or any
> certification) makes you an "expert".

Along that same line, when I saw the Master certification stuff, I thought
if one came across somebody who had successfully completed it, should the
first question be: Did you ever actually WORK in a database shop; or have
you spent all your time studying certification?  Or are you just an amazing
genius who is able to do both (in which case, you certainly don't want to
work here!)?
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How to tune this query ...

[Jamadagni, Rajendra]

Title: How to tune this query ...





I am looking at oracle supplied locking query ... any idea how to tune this ?


SELECT  l.SID,s.serial#,s.username,s.terminal,
    DECODE(l.TYPE,'RW','RW - Row Wait Enqueue', 'TM','TM - DML Enqueue', 'TX','TX - Trans Enqueue', 'UL','UL - User',l.TYPE||'System') res,

    SUBSTR(t.NAME,1,20) TAB,u.NAME owner,
    l.id1,l.id2,
    DECODE(l.lmode,1,'No Lock',
    2,'Row Share',
    3,'Row Exclusive',
    4,'Share',
    5,'Shr Row Excl',
    6,'Exclusive',NULL) lmode,
    DECODE(l.request,1,'No Lock',
    2,'Row Share',
    3,'Row Excl',
    4,'Share',
    5,'Shr Row Excl',
    6,'Exclusive',NULL) request
FROM v$lock l, v$session s,
sys.USER$ u,sys.obj$ t
WHERE l.SID = s.SID
AND s.TYPE != 'BACKGROUND'
AND t.obj# = l.id1
AND u.USER# = t.owner#



Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni      MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art!



This e-mail 
message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above and may 
contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from 
disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, or are 
not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify corporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 
and delete this e-mail message from your computer, Thank 
you.*2

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Jamadagni, Rajendra]

Title: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?





Even though all my databases are on 9201 or 9013, I don't want to know when 10i will be out.


Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni      MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art!



*This e-mail 
message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above and may 
contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from 
disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, or are 
not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify corporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 
and delete this e-mail message from your computer, Thank 
you.*1

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Rachel Carmichael]

as an author the publisher is also pushing an 18 month life cycle
of the book(s) so that new releases come out close to when the new
release of Oracle comes out.

I believe, in the manufacturing world, it's called "planned
obselescence"


--- "Jesse, Rich" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It does???  Now that you 10i is around the corner, are you going to
> invest
> in all the 9i books and certification only to have to redo (undo?!)
> it all
> in a year?
> 
> Could make a decent argument for O'Reilly's Safari for those books
> specific
> to 9i, IMHO.
> 
> My $0.02,
> Rich
> 
> Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex,
> WI USA
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Stephen Lee [mailto:slee@;dollar.com]
> > Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:19 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> > 
> > > -Original Message-
> > > just what is Oracle's business model for pushing these release's
> > > out this fast?
> > 
> > It sells books and certification classes.
> > At our shop, we have started to blow off certification now 
> > that Oracle has
> > gotten so ridiculous about it.
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Jesse, Rich
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
> -
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).


__
Do you Yahoo!?
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Re:FW: Destination address unreachable

[dgoulet]

Robert,

If Oracle keeps to the same course with respect to licensing and the price
thereof their market share in 5 to 10 years may not be worth much either.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: "Freeman; Robert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/8/2002 11:09 AM

Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features? The
push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 

So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?

makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
year and a half.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

-- 
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-- 
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Ian - I have seen some of that in the general media. One problem is that if
the information is extremely miniaturized so a lot of information can be
stored in a small area, then some who discovers one of your artifacts may
not realize something is written on it. The first clay tablets with
cuneiform writing were tossed because they were assumed to be decorative
tiles. An ingenious solution was to write in a spiral pattern on a disk and
make the outer row large enough to be easily readable with the naked eye,
then gradually reduce the character size. I thought that was clever. 
< obligatory Oracle reference >
Of course Larry feels that Oracle will still be available then.


Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:15 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I went to one meeting where someone from another DOE lab said they needed to
store some data on media which would last 10,000 years.  I suggested chisels
and stone tablets :)

Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:14 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Ron,

Under ideal conditions, that is,  controlled temperature, humidity and
atmosphere, a CD has a lifespan of 30-200 years.

In typical conditions, 5-50 years.  

CD's stored in a computer room might only last 10 years.  In someone's desk,
maybe only 5 years.

On the visor of your car, probably not that long.  ;)

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 04:48, Ron Rogers wrote:
> Jay,
>  Remind the management that in the future there might also ba a change 
> of hardware and then the backups on tape could possible be useless and 
> unreadable by the new tape drives. If possible save the data to a text 
> delimited file and save the file. That wouls insure you that you would 
> always be able to at least read the information if needed.  I have a 
> lot of data( from 1993- to - today) that someday will be archived , I 
> hope, and I can remove from the system. I will be saving it in text 
> format in CD's so it can be accessed if needed. We also are changing 
> to a new server and OS format. The old backup tapes are scrap now.
> Planning on your part could be very helpfull down the road.
> Ron
>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:24PM >>>
>
> Well, if worst comes to worst we can always install an earlier version 
> on a box and import it there.
> But the reason we can't get more storage approved still has me shaking
> my
> head...
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:19 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Jay,
>
> just make sure you are not around when, after several Oracle upgrades, 
> and they want to "import" one of these files back that they discover 
> that the
> current release of import can no longer read the older version of the
> .dmp
> file.
>
> now what are these senior damagers going to do?  blame the DBA, that's 
> what!
>
>
> duck and cover... duck and cover...
>
> Tom Mercadante
> Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:55 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> FWIW, what we just implemented (because senior management refuses to 
> approve additional storage on the grounds that "making the database 
> larger will
> affect performance" - aaargh!) is
>
> 1) Confirmed with business how long data needs to be online for 
> various tables (they're all partitioned so that makes it a lot easier)
> 2) Export partitions older than that once/month (this is generated off
> a
> table that lists each partitioned table and how long data should be
> kep)
> 3) After confirming that all export files are valid we drop the old
> partitions (this will be done by script but is being done manually for
> the
> first few months)
> 4) Leave dmp files on server for 2 end of months (our end of month
> backup
> tapes are stored for 7 years)
> 5) Maintain a table in database saying what exported partitions are on
> what
> date's tapes
>
>
> And I really long for the days in this company when senior management 
> made technical decisions by asking the technical people instead of 
> just making
> things up...
>
> Jay Miller
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 11:54 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Someone asked about this 3 weeks ago.  Here's my take
> on archiving data.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this,
> but nonetheless,  I have an opinion.   :)
>
> Here's an email from last month.  You can undoubtedly find some other 
> ideas on this by searching the archives of this list at fatcity.com
>
> Jared
>
> ==
>
> I'm not a proponent of purging data.
>
> Unless of course, you expect to never see it again.
>
> That word 'archive' rolls of the tongues of managers
> and consultants pretty easily, but what's behind it

RE: database link tuning

[Vergara, Michael (TEM)]

I did some similar experimenting.  I was doing a join of two
local tables, and then pushing the result set out a database
link to a remote table.  Took for-flipping-ever.  Then I
did a local join to a temporary table, and pushed from there.
Ran less than a minute for the same result.

The moral is "do it local".

Just my 2¢ worth on a rainy Friday.

Mike

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:43 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Paula
   I was hoping someone with more specific experience in this area. Here is
a quote from Oracle Performance Tuning 101: 
  Be particularly when joining a local table to a remote table.
 
My vote if you only have 60 rows would be to populate a local table with
those rows before running your query.



Dennis Williams 
DBA, 40%OCP 
Lifetouch, Inc. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:40 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



BTW, 

Was doing join of views pointing to tables through 2 database links and
gateway.  Just wondering - faster to move the tables then perform join
locally esp. if I can do CTAS each time - h.

-Original Message- 
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:34 PM 
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' 


Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using
CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another
Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!!  

The waits are: 

Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   %
totalAverage Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352
80.870917573872599.120234604105614250   852.374685967221
0   0

Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating ascii
file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8,
database links?

Thanks, 
Paula 

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Re: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[dmeng]

After reading literature from Kimball,  Inmon and some other experts, it
seems to me that we should have a 3-tier architecture -
Tier 1 -  operational data
Tier 2 - ODS which contains integrated, cleansed, transformed operational
detail data, or staging area in relational schema
Tier3 - star schema Data marts

The question/contention here is tier 2 - should we provide reporting
capability for this? According to Kimball, staging area should not be
accessible to end users for direct reporting. But Inmon seems to disagree
with him on this one.
If ODS is an integrated, authoritative data source of the enterprise, I
don't see why we can't create ad-hoc reports against it. Of course since it
is relational, we might need reporting tools and heavy IS involvement. So
IMHO it depends on what the user needs are to decide what tier2 should look
like and be used for.
Anybody cares to commend on this?

Thanks

Dennis Meng
Database Administrator
Focal Communications Corp.


   
  
  Jared Still  
  

  com> cc: 
  
  Sent by: Subject: Re: Need Help on Operational 
Data Store  
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
   
  
   
  
  11/08/2002 11:19 
  
  AM   
  
  Please respond   
  
  to ORACLE-L  
  
   
  
   
  





Dennis,

I think you got it wrong right off when you stated that there's  a
"lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW ".

It isn't that issue at all.  No two people can agree on what an ODS
is at all, much less compare it to a DW.

To me for instance, an ODS is a place to stage data for the final
stages of some other process, be it a DW, or anything else.

An ODS is a rather generic term, and therefor whatever you
want it to be.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Greetings -
> I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there
are
> a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should
be
> used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
> Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover
ODS
> much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building
an
> ODS?
>
> TIA
>
>
> Dennis Meng
> Database Administrator
> Focal Communications Corp.
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Mladen
   We are running 9i in production with no problems. But it is a new
development application and therefore isn't large. For most of our
production databases we are still waiting for application vendors to certify
9i.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:15 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
they out of their @#$%! mind?

> -Original Message-
> From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> said that the
> code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> 
> Prakash
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> 
> Sunil Nookala
> DBA
> Dell Corp.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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> Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
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RE: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Jared
   Oh, I wouldn't let Bill Inmon hear you say that. He coined the term
Operational Data Store. I do not purport to be a data warehouse expert at
the least, but several years ago I studied the literature quite a bit and
tried to keep on top of the topics. And the subject has evolved some since
then. At that time, there tended to be two separate camps, followers of
Ralph Kimball's ideas and followers of Bill Inmon's ideas. Well, truthfully
there was a third group, the rabid Fifth Normal Form advocates that insisted
on fully normalizing their DW model. 
   The issue that split the Inmon and Kimball camps was the ODS. The two
titans of the industry even had some head-to-head debates at large
conferences. Ralph always claimed that the ODS was no big deal, you probably
had a loading area somewhere and if you had to give it a name, fine call it
an ODS. Bill insisted very strongly that the ODS was THE crucial concept in
data warehousing and if you didn't design that part correctly your data
warehouse was sure to fail. 
   Since I could easily read and understand Ralph's articles and I could
never figure out what Bill was saying, I tended to follow Ralph's advice.
Given your statements, Jared you sound like a classic Kimball follower as
well.
   But the world moves on, and since the hot topic has been "real-time data
warehouses", so I assume the ODS controversy is now moot. Today Inmon's big
topic is the "Corporate Information Factory".

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:20 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Dennis,

I think you got it wrong right off when you stated that there's  a
"lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW ".

It isn't that issue at all.  No two people can agree on what an ODS
is at all, much less compare it to a DW.

To me for instance, an ODS is a place to stage data for the final
stages of some other process, be it a DW, or anything else.

An ODS is a rather generic term, and therefor whatever you 
want it to be.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Greetings -
> I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there are
> a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should
be
> used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
> Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover
ODS
> much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building
an
> ODS?
>
> TIA
>
>
> Dennis Meng
> Database Administrator
> Focal Communications Corp.
-- 
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RE: Oracle 10i

[MacGregor, Ian A.]

It's not just the new releases, but the withdrawal of support for "old" releases which 
is the problem.  Look at the 9.0.2 vs. 9.0.1.  Oracle had announced the end of 9.0.1 
support before they had released the first patchset to 9.0.2.  While I admire those 
folks on the hemorrhaging edge, standard practice for most sites has been not to move 
to a new version until at least the first patchset.   Yes 9.0.2 fixed many  bugs in 
9.0.1, but those bugs were also fixed in patchsets.  Also any bugs found in 9.0.1  
after the 9.0.2 code was frozen make have been fixed in a patchset for 9.0.1, but 
still present in 9.0.2. 

The other problem is those of us who have to maintain 24 X 7 databases.  We have some 
which collect metadata on physics experiments.  Even when the accelerator is not 
working these databases are being hit hard  by data analysts.   This year I had a 4 
hour window to upgrade one system.  Even then I just upgraded it form 8.1.6 to 8.1.7.



Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: Freeman, Robert [mailto:Robert_Freeman@;csx.com] 
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:09 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Mladen,

I think this is the wrong attitude, to be honest, and it's not Oracle's fault. This is 
the result, in large part, of competitive pressures. Oracle must keep up or loose 
market share, loose revenue, and finally loose investor confidence. In a sense, it's 
*out* fault, as we demand that Oracle support this (for example, partitioning or drop 
column or XML) and we fault it if they do not (e.g. Well UDB does this, or SQL Server 
does that). We are the precipitous of all of this change ultimately.

We are actually using 9i on several production systems, and I've got 9iR2 on it's way. 
I've been banging 9iR2 pretty hard over the past 6 months. I think it's much more 
solid than 9iR1 was. Highly recommend that if you are going to move to 9, that you 
make it 9iR2.



RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How efficient of 
you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:15 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle should give us some time to 
get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3. Who makes so stupid 
business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
they out of their @#$%! mind?

> -Original Message-
> From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also
> said that the
> code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> 
> Prakash
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> 
> Sunil Nookala
> DBA
> Dell Corp.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> 
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> 
> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
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>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
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> Fat City Netwo

RE: Data Purging Strategy

[Rachel Carmichael]

water constantly dripping on stone, will wear away the stone. And an
earthquake, with debris falling on that stone could shatter it.

I don't think even that will work


--- "MacGregor, Ian A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I went to one meeting where someone from another DOE lab said they
> needed to store some data on media which would last 10,000 years.  I
> suggested chisels and stone tablets :)
> 
> Ian MacGregor
> Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:14 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> 
> Ron,
> 
> Under ideal conditions, that is,  controlled temperature, humidity
> and atmosphere, a CD has a lifespan of 30-200 years.
> 
> In typical conditions, 5-50 years.  
> 
> CD's stored in a computer room might only last 10 years.  In
> someone's desk, maybe only 5 years.
> 
> On the visor of your car, probably not that long.  ;)
> 
> Jared
> 
> On Friday 08 November 2002 04:48, Ron Rogers wrote:
> > Jay,
> >  Remind the management that in the future there might also ba a
> change 
> > of hardware and then the backups on tape could possible be useless
> and 
> > unreadable by the new tape drives. If possible save the data to a
> text 
> > delimited file and save the file. That wouls insure you that you
> would 
> > always be able to at least read the information if needed.  I have
> a 
> > lot of data( from 1993- to - today) that someday will be archived ,
> I 
> > hope, and I can remove from the system. I will be saving it in text
> 
> > format in CD's so it can be accessed if needed. We also are
> changing 
> > to a new server and OS format. The old backup tapes are scrap now.
> > Planning on your part could be very helpfull down the road.
> > Ron
> >
> > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:24PM >>>
> >
> > Well, if worst comes to worst we can always install an earlier
> version 
> > on a box and import it there.
> > But the reason we can't get more storage approved still has me
> shaking
> > my
> > head...
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:19 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Jay,
> >
> > just make sure you are not around when, after several Oracle
> upgrades, 
> > and they want to "import" one of these files back that they
> discover 
> > that the
> > current release of import can no longer read the older version of
> the
> > .dmp
> > file.
> >
> > now what are these senior damagers going to do?  blame the DBA,
> that's 
> > what!
> >
> >
> > duck and cover... duck and cover...
> >
> > Tom Mercadante
> > Oracle Certified Professional
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:55 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > FWIW, what we just implemented (because senior management refuses
> to 
> > approve additional storage on the grounds that "making the database
> 
> > larger will
> > affect performance" - aaargh!) is
> >
> > 1) Confirmed with business how long data needs to be online for 
> > various tables (they're all partitioned so that makes it a lot
> easier)
> > 2) Export partitions older than that once/month (this is generated
> off
> > a
> > table that lists each partitioned table and how long data should be
> > kep)
> > 3) After confirming that all export files are valid we drop the old
> > partitions (this will be done by script but is being done manually
> for
> > the
> > first few months)
> > 4) Leave dmp files on server for 2 end of months (our end of month
> > backup
> > tapes are stored for 7 years)
> > 5) Maintain a table in database saying what exported partitions are
> on
> > what
> > date's tapes
> >
> >
> > And I really long for the days in this company when senior
> management 
> > made technical decisions by asking the technical people instead of 
> > just making
> > things up...
> >
> > Jay Miller
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 11:54 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > Someone asked about this 3 weeks ago.  Here's my take
> > on archiving data.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this,
> > but nonetheless,  I have an opinion.   :)
> >
> > Here's an email from last month.  You can undoubtedly find some
> other 
> > ideas on this by searching the archives of this list at fatcity.com
> >
> > Jared
> >
> > ==
> >
> > I'm not a proponent of purging data.
> >
> > Unless of course, you expect to never see it again.
> >
> > That word 'archive' rolls of the tongues of managers
> > and consultants pretty easily, but what's behind it?
> >
> > There are a few gotchas with purging and archiving.
> >
> > Let's assume you have some 3 year old data that
> > you need to see again, and it has been purged.
> >
> > Here are some of the possible problems:
> >
> > *  Your backup tapes are corrupted
> > *  Your new backup hardware can't read the old tapes
> > *  Your

RE: FW: developer 2000

[Viktor]

You need to get a patch. The one I was talking about is Dev 2.1 Patch 6 is patch. Look it up to metalink, or contact Oracle Support for assisstance.
 Paulo Gomes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


THANKS
Do u happen to know where can i get that?
Regards
Paulo
 

-Original Message-From: Viktor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 18:09To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: Re: FW: developer 2000
I think you may need to get an upgraded installer version 3.3.1.1.0c. This is the one compatible with Y2K. Then, run the installer and select typical, and that should be it. 
Regards, 
Viktor 

 Paulo Gomes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:33> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: developer 2000> > > > -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:31> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: > > hi people> now is my turn to ask for help.> Just got some old forms that are still in developer 2000 version. Can't> upgrade the client and have a win 2000 machine. Developer 2000 doesn't> install in win 2000.> Does anyone knows any trick to install Developer 2000 in win 2000?> I DON'T WANT TO INSTALL A NEW NT MACHINE JUST FIX SOME LITTLE PROBLEM.> > Thanks in advance> Regards> Paulo-- Please see the official ORACLE-!
!
! ! L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com-- Author: Paulo GomesINET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.comSan Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services-To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail messageto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and inthe message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You mayalso send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).


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Re: Oracle 10i new releases

[Joe Testa]

anyone remember the 6 days, 6.0.36 on sunos :)

joe


Mercadante, Thomas F wrote:


Robert,

I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the release
level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted, there were
huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is - lets stay
at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.  Are
the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical that
justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch up to 9i.


My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people will just
plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again in just a
few months.  Makes no sense to me.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features? The
push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 

So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 





-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?

makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
year and a half.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

 


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RE: database link tuning

[Jared . Still]

You're bringing over 60 rows, but how many 
rows are in the table you are querying?

What version of Oracle?

Jared






[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/08/2002 09:33 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
Subject:RE: database link tuning


Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using 
CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another 
Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!! 
The waits are: 
Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   % 
totalAverage Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352 
80.870917573872599.120234604105614250   852.374685967221   
  0   0 
Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating 
ascii file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8, 
database links?
Thanks, 
Paula 


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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Brian McGraw]

Absolutely.  Which is why none of my 8i OPS databases have gone to 9i
RAC yet.  And from the recent article that was posted here (on Grid
Computing), I'm not alone.

--
| Brian McGraw /* DBA */  Infinity Insurance |
| mailto:Brian.McGraw@;Infinity-Insurance.com |
--

-Original Message-
Carmichael
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:24 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

I've got 9i production databases. But they are brand-new applications.
I haven't upgraded any of the 8i ones I have as yet, nor are there any
plans to do so.

Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"


--- "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
> should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
> first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
> systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
> Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
> they out of their @#$%! mind?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> > Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> > 
> > 
> > Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> > said that the
> > code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> > 
> > Prakash
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> > 
> > Sunil Nookala
> > DBA
> > Dell Corp.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting
> services
> >
> -
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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> > also send the HELP command for other information (like
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> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[Jared . Still]

Scott,

You're walking where angels fear to tread.

Watch it.

Jared





[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/08/2002 09:25 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
Subject:RE: Data Purging Strategy


Burnt mud?  Isn't that all scotch?

Scott Shafer
San Antonio, TX
210.581.6217


> -Original Message-
> From:  Steve McClure [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent:  Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:34 PM
> To:Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:   RE: Data Purging Strategy
> 
> Sherry Finish?  I thought you liked scotch that tasted like burnt mud?
> 
> -Original Message-
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:55 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> That reminds me:
> 
> Mark, your annual stipend is due.
> 
> Make it a case of Glenmorangie this time, Sherry finish.  :)
> 
> Jared
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  11/06/2002 07:56 AM
>  Please respond to ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: 
> Subject:RE: Data Purging Strategy
> 
> 
> Hey Dennis,
> Mark Leith is the only person on this list allowed to mention 3rd party
> products.
> I am sure he bought the franchise from Jared :)
> 
> John
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: 06 November 2002 14:15
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Prem - You are receiving some excellent advice from Tom and Tim. I would
> mention two items in addition:
>   - If you ever hope to re-use the data you archive off-line, you must 
> also
> archive all the related tables, because after all, this is a RELATIONAL
> database.
>   - PrincetonSoftech has a product Active Archiving that looks pretty 
good
> from the demos I've seen. I haven't used it myself.
> 
> 
> 
> Dennis Williams 
> DBA, 40%OCP 
> Lifetouch, Inc. 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 6:54 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Prem,
> 
> I would re-visit the requirement.  Why do you feel the need to delete 
the
> data from the database?  What is the purpose for this type of 
requirement?
> It would be far easier to modify the requirement than to do what you are
> thinking of doing.
> 
> Adding columns to database tables indicating that a record has passed 
it's
> retention policy and thus, is not included in queries, would be a much
> easier solution.
> 
> Or, simply moving these records to historical tables in the database - 
and
> NOT deleting them from the system - is a much better solution.  The data 

> is
> always accessible and not available in the current tables.  And you will 

> not
> be playing the "get the data from tape and reload it" game with all of 
> it's
> problems (writing an offload program, table structure changes & offload
> program versions).
> 
> Try and keep this as simple as possible.
> 
> Hope this helps
> 
> Tom Mercadante 
> Oracle Certified Professional 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:13 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> 
> Dear List, 
> 
> I need some inputs from you all regarding purging data from the 
database. 
> 
> This is the requirement 
> 
> 
> We define a retention period for all the data in the system. 
> When the retention period is reached,  the data should be deleted, but 
> then
> at a later time, some user might request for this purged data. So it 
must 
> be
> possible to retrieve this data. 
> 
> This is the strategy we have designed for this. 
> 
> When the retention period is reached, move the data from the main 
database
> to an offline database. Then delete the data from the main database. 
> 
> In the offline database, we cannot again keep it from long, so it has to
> moved to tapes. Now my question, how can we move this data to tapes and 
at
> the same time retrieve data from the tapes based on dates. 
> i.e, the user will ask for the data on a particular date, so it must be
> possible to retrieve data from the tapes based on a date and load it to 
> the
> database tables. 
> 
> Regards 
> Prem 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
> -
> To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> -- 
> Please see the offici

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Jesse, Rich]

It does???  Now that you 10i is around the corner, are you going to invest
in all the 9i books and certification only to have to redo (undo?!) it all
in a year?

Could make a decent argument for O'Reilly's Safari for those books specific
to 9i, IMHO.

My $0.02,
Rich

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

> -Original Message-
> From: Stephen Lee [mailto:slee@;dollar.com]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:19 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > just what is Oracle's business model for pushing these release's
> > out this fast?
> 
> It sells books and certification classes.
> At our shop, we have started to blow off certification now 
> that Oracle has
> gotten so ridiculous about it.
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RE: database link tuning

[Toepke, Kevin M]

Yes, be particularly careful when accessing tables across database links.
The threshold for when a FTS is more efficient than an index access changes.

Also, i found out this week, that if you use in-line views in your query,
Oracle can send the whole in-line view across the database link!. In the
following example, oracle will execute the inline view on the cust database!
Without the inline view, oracle chose a FTS of tablea hash joined to FTS of
tableb.

SELECT *
FROM   (SELECT *
FROM   tablea@cust, tableb@cust
WHERE  tablea.key = tableb.key) t
  ,tablec
WHERE  tablec.key = t.key

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:43 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Paula
   I was hoping someone with more specific experience in this area. Here is
a quote from Oracle Performance Tuning 101: 
  Be particularly when joining a local table to a remote table.
 
My vote if you only have 60 rows would be to populate a local table with
those rows before running your query.



Dennis Williams 
DBA, 40%OCP 
Lifetouch, Inc. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:40 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



BTW, 

Was doing join of views pointing to tables through 2 database links and
gateway.  Just wondering - faster to move the tables then perform join
locally esp. if I can do CTAS each time - h.

-Original Message- 
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:34 PM 
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' 


Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using
CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another
Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!!  

The waits are: 

Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   %
totalAverage Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352
80.870917573872599.120234604105614250   852.374685967221
0   0

Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating ascii
file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8,
database links?

Thanks, 
Paula 

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RE: Oracle 10i

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Robert - I agree with you that Oracle needs to pump out new features in
order to keep ahead of the competition. They are able to charge higher
license fees than SQL Server because they offer better features. In the
database business, "sitting still makes you road kill".
   Of course, the new features are much more effective if there are
thousands of DBAs that are 1) aware of the new features, 2) understand the
new features and can deploy them. Doesn't the OCP just work out beautifully?
When you apply for a job, the manager asks if you are Oracle9i (or 10i)
certified. That means that you are fully aware of the new features. From
Oracle's perspective, this is a win-win. And the occasional upgrade exam
isn't too bad. I didn't make the certification plunge because I thought you
would have to do the complete certification with each new version. Just a
new features module isn't all that bad.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Certification has become a bear, in my eyes. 8i was hard enough with all
it's new features, but 9i has just a ton of new features (and 9iR2 even
more). The 9i OCP Upgrade Exam, IMHO, is probably the most difficult of any
of them because it covers a much wider scope of material than any of the
other exams did. Yet, I don't think that passing the 9iOCP (or any
certification) makes you an "expert". That passing scores are something like
55 or 60%, should tell you somethin'.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:20 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L




> -Original Message-
> just what is Oracle's business model for pushing these release's
> out this fast?

It sells books and certification classes.
At our shop, we have started to blow off certification now that Oracle has
gotten so ridiculous about it.
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Jared . Still]

But Mladen, how do you *really* feel?

Wait a minute, I don't want to know.


As for 9i, I have one dev db on 9i, and am still reading
Robert F's Oracle 9i New Features book.

Production is 7.3.4, 8.0.4, 8.0.6, 8.1.6

Jared






"Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/08/2002 10:14 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L

 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc: 
Subject:RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?


I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
they out of their @#$%! mind?

> -Original Message-
> From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> said that the
> code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> 
> Prakash
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> 
> Sunil Nookala
> DBA
> Dell Corp.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[MacGregor, Ian A.]

I went to one meeting where someone from another DOE lab said they needed to store 
some data on media which would last 10,000 years.  I suggested chisels and stone 
tablets :)

Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:14 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Ron,

Under ideal conditions, that is,  controlled temperature, humidity and atmosphere, a 
CD has a lifespan of 30-200 years.

In typical conditions, 5-50 years.  

CD's stored in a computer room might only last 10 years.  In someone's desk, maybe 
only 5 years.

On the visor of your car, probably not that long.  ;)

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 04:48, Ron Rogers wrote:
> Jay,
>  Remind the management that in the future there might also ba a change 
> of hardware and then the backups on tape could possible be useless and 
> unreadable by the new tape drives. If possible save the data to a text 
> delimited file and save the file. That wouls insure you that you would 
> always be able to at least read the information if needed.  I have a 
> lot of data( from 1993- to - today) that someday will be archived , I 
> hope, and I can remove from the system. I will be saving it in text 
> format in CD's so it can be accessed if needed. We also are changing 
> to a new server and OS format. The old backup tapes are scrap now.
> Planning on your part could be very helpfull down the road.
> Ron
>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:24PM >>>
>
> Well, if worst comes to worst we can always install an earlier version 
> on a box and import it there.
> But the reason we can't get more storage approved still has me shaking
> my
> head...
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:19 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Jay,
>
> just make sure you are not around when, after several Oracle upgrades, 
> and they want to "import" one of these files back that they discover 
> that the
> current release of import can no longer read the older version of the
> .dmp
> file.
>
> now what are these senior damagers going to do?  blame the DBA, that's 
> what!
>
>
> duck and cover... duck and cover...
>
> Tom Mercadante
> Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:55 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> FWIW, what we just implemented (because senior management refuses to 
> approve additional storage on the grounds that "making the database 
> larger will
> affect performance" - aaargh!) is
>
> 1) Confirmed with business how long data needs to be online for 
> various tables (they're all partitioned so that makes it a lot easier)
> 2) Export partitions older than that once/month (this is generated off
> a
> table that lists each partitioned table and how long data should be
> kep)
> 3) After confirming that all export files are valid we drop the old
> partitions (this will be done by script but is being done manually for
> the
> first few months)
> 4) Leave dmp files on server for 2 end of months (our end of month
> backup
> tapes are stored for 7 years)
> 5) Maintain a table in database saying what exported partitions are on
> what
> date's tapes
>
>
> And I really long for the days in this company when senior management 
> made technical decisions by asking the technical people instead of 
> just making
> things up...
>
> Jay Miller
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 11:54 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Someone asked about this 3 weeks ago.  Here's my take
> on archiving data.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this,
> but nonetheless,  I have an opinion.   :)
>
> Here's an email from last month.  You can undoubtedly find some other 
> ideas on this by searching the archives of this list at fatcity.com
>
> Jared
>
> ==
>
> I'm not a proponent of purging data.
>
> Unless of course, you expect to never see it again.
>
> That word 'archive' rolls of the tongues of managers
> and consultants pretty easily, but what's behind it?
>
> There are a few gotchas with purging and archiving.
>
> Let's assume you have some 3 year old data that
> you need to see again, and it has been purged.
>
> Here are some of the possible problems:
>
> *  Your backup tapes are corrupted
> *  Your new backup hardware can't read the old tapes
> *  Your software no longer understands the format that
> the data is in.
> * You have the correct software, but it won't work on the
>current version of OS on your hardware.
> * The data format/software/whatever is not well documented
> *  The employees that understood the data 3 years ago
>have been laid off.
> * ... lots more stuff
>
> Read Bryon Bergeron's "Dark Ages II: When the Digital Data Die" 
> http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=2-0130661074-0
>
> Perhaps much better than archiving the data, is to stick with the idea 

RE: LOCALLY MANAGED TABLESPACE

[Leonard, George]

If you are tyring to use a LM temporary tablespace how about creating a
second tablespace, temporary that is lcoally managed and then slowly alter
the user, maybe even try and doa  little test with a  queryt hat will sue
temporary space, run the query with one user on the normal dict man
tablespace and the second user on the LM  nd see if you can convince your
boss now as the best time,

They like to see that it works. If it does then they will sya yes sooner.

George

George Leonard
Oracle Database Administrator
Dimension Data (Pty) Ltd
(Reg. No. 1987/006597/07)
Tel: (+27 11) 575 0573
Fax: (+27 11) 576 0573
E-mail:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web:   http://www.didata.co.za
 
You Have The Obligation to Inform One Honestly of the risk, And As a Person
You Are Committed to Educate Yourself to the Total Risk In Any Activity!
Once Informed & Totally Aware of the Risk, Every Fool Has the Right to Kill
or Injure Themselves as They See Fit!

-Original Message-
Sent: 01 November 2002 19:46 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Very, very lucky.
 
I've been trying to get permission to move just my temporary tablespace to
locally managed for months.  My boss' boss refuses to give the okay until
after our standby database is moved to a new location (if anyone can explain
why those two things are related in any way I'd be overjoyed).
 
And yes, I pointed out that every other database (either new or migrated
before DBA responsibilities got shifted to someone who knows nothing about
databases) has been using locally managed tablespaces and that our QA and QC
testing went perfectly.
 
 
 
Jay Miller
 
 

 
 -Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 12:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


You are lucky, very lucky...

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 9:59 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Pardon the ignorance, I'm simply trying to understand... What is meant by
"management" in this context? I'm can't imagine a circumstance under which
ANY business manager would have a say on what goes on in the black box
called Oracle. Downtime? Cost of hardware/software? Vendor selection? I can
see the input on those issues. But, all the way down to extent management??
Or am I simply lucky to not have that level of bureaucracy?
 

Gary Weber
Senior DBA
Charles Jones, LLC||Superior Information Services, LLC


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 10:29 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Same here

 

Getting management to first understand the extent issue on Dictionary
managed was a interesting exercise. Now trying to break that understanding
down when wanting to use LMT is like double the work, painful.

 

Difficult thing trying to educate them enough to understand something but
not leaving at the same time halve way where you start getting these
interesting architecture decisions or ideas.

 

George



George Leonard

Oracle Database Administrator

Dimension Data (Pty) Ltd

(Reg. No. 1987/006597/07)

Tel: (+27 11) 575 0573

Fax: (+27 11) 576 0573

E-mail:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Web:   http://www.didata.co.za  

 

You Have The Obligation to Inform One Honestly of the risk, And As a Person

You Are Committed to Educate Yourself to the Total Risk In Any Activity!

Once Informed & Totally Aware of the Risk, Every Fool Has the Right to Kill
or Injure Themselves as They See Fit!

-Original Message-
Sent: 25 October 2002 13:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

 

The only issue we faced was convincing the management that in LMT having 150
extents is not really a problem. 

Raj 
__ 
Rajendra Jamadagni  MIS, ESPN Inc. 
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com 
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc.

QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art! 

-Original Message- 
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 1:49 PM 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 

 

Hi 
I am thinking to change our few dictinary manages tablespace to locally 
managed tablespace.Can any one experienced any issues with locally managed 
tablespace? 
Do any one experience what gain after changing to locally managed 
tablespace? 

Thx 
-Seema 

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Development and Test Database Licensing?

[Casey A. Jordan]

How does Oracle handle the licensing of the 
Dev and Test servers.  Does an OTN license need to be purchased 
for this or does the purchase of the
production server license allow for the Test 
and Dev servers.  
 
thanks,
caj
 
 

  From: 
  Paulo Gomes 
  
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  
  Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:25 
  PM
  Subject: RE: FW: developer 2000
  
  THANKS
  Do u 
  happen to know where can i get that?
  Regards
  Paulo
   
  
-Original Message-From: Viktor 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 
2002 18:09To: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: Re: FW: developer 2000
I think you may need to get an upgraded installer version 3.3.1.1.0c. 
This is the one compatible with Y2K. Then, run the installer and select 
typical, and that should be it. 
Regards, 
Viktor 

 Paulo Gomes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> 
  -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: 
  sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:33> To: 
  '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: developer 2000> > 
  > > -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes 
  > Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:31> To: 
  '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: > > hi 
  people> now is my turn to ask for help.> Just got some old 
  forms that are still in developer 2000 version. Can't> upgrade the 
  client and have a win 2000 machine. Developer 2000 doesn't> install 
  in win 2000.> Does anyone knows any trick to install Developer 2000 
  in win 2000?> I DON'T WANT TO INSTALL A NEW NT MACHINE JUST FIX 
  SOME LITTLE PROBLEM.> > Thanks in advance> 
  Regards> Paulo-- Please see the official ORACLE-! ! L FAQ: 
  http://www.orafaq.com-- Author: Paulo GomesINET: 
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Do you Yahoo!?U2 on 
LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits 
CD

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Rachel Carmichael]

I've got 9i production databases. But they are brand-new applications.
I haven't upgraded any of the 8i ones I have as yet, nor are there any
plans to do so.

Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"


--- "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
> should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
> first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
> systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
> Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
> they out of their @#$%! mind?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> > Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> > 
> > 
> > Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> > said that the
> > code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> > 
> > Prakash
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> > 
> > Sunil Nookala
> > DBA
> > Dell Corp.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com
> > San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting
> services
> >
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> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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> > -- 
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Oracle 10i new releases

[Mercadante, Thomas F]

Robert,

I guess what you say makes sense.  But why the need to move the release
level from 8, to 8i, to 9i to 10i all within 5 years?  Granted, there were
huge improvements from 8 to 9i.  I guess what I'm arguing for is - lets stay
at 9i for awhile.  There is nothing wrong with 9i release 1 thru 15.  Are
the new features that will be available in 10i really that radical that
justifies a major release?  Give the rest of us a chance to catch up to 9i.


My feeling is that Oracle will get hurt sooner or later - people will just
plain not move to the newer release, just to face migrating again in just a
few months.  Makes no sense to me.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features? The
push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 

So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?

makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
year and a half.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

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Oracle 10i

[Freeman, Robert]

Mladen,

I think this is the wrong attitude, to be honest, and it's not Oracle's
fault. This is the result, in large part, of competitive pressures. Oracle
must keep up or loose market share, loose revenue, and finally loose
investor confidence. In a sense, it's *out* fault, as we demand that Oracle
support this (for example, partitioning or drop column or XML) and we fault
it if they do not (e.g. Well UDB does this, or SQL Server does that). We are
the precipitous of all of this change ultimately.

We are actually using 9i on several production systems, and I've got 9iR2 on
it's way.
I've been banging 9iR2 pretty hard over the past 6 months. I think it's much
more
solid than 9iR1 was. Highly recommend that if you are going to move to 9,
that you
make it 9iR2.



RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:15 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
they out of their @#$%! mind?

> -Original Message-
> From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> said that the
> code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> 
> Prakash
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> 
> Sunil Nookala
> DBA
> Dell Corp.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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Re:RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[dgoulet]

Heck, I haven't even gotten a moment to install 9i on a play machine yet!!  And
I've still got 8.0.4 in production!!

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Rachel Carmichael <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date:   11/8/2002 11:24 AM

I've got 9i production databases. But they are brand-new applications.
I haven't upgraded any of the 8i ones I have as yet, nor are there any
plans to do so.

Isn't there an adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?"


--- "Gogala, Mladen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
> should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
> first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
> systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
> Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
> they out of their @#$%! mind?
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> > Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> > 
> > 
> > Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> > said that the
> > code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> > 
> > Prakash
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> > 
> > Sunil Nookala
> > DBA
> > Dell Corp.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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FW: Destination address unreachable

[Freeman, Robert]

Certification has become a bear, in my eyes. 8i was hard enough with all
it's new features, but 9i has just a ton of new features (and 9iR2 even
more). The 9i OCP Upgrade Exam, IMHO, is probably the most difficult of any
of them because it covers a much wider scope of material than any of the
other exams did. Yet, I don't think that passing the 9iOCP (or any
certification) makes you an "expert". That passing scores are something like
55 or 60%, should tell you somethin'.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 1:20 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L




> -Original Message-
> just what is Oracle's business model for pushing these release's
> out this fast?

It sells books and certification classes.
At our shop, we have started to blow off certification now that Oracle has
gotten so ridiculous about it.
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RE: database link tuning

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Paula
   I was hoping someone with more specific experience in this area. Here is
a quote from Oracle Performance Tuning 101: 
  Be particularly when joining a local table to a remote table.
 
My vote if you only have 60 rows would be to populate a local table with
those rows before running your query.



Dennis Williams 
DBA, 40%OCP 
Lifetouch, Inc. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:40 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



BTW, 

Was doing join of views pointing to tables through 2 database links and
gateway.  Just wondering - faster to move the tables then perform join
locally esp. if I can do CTAS each time - h.

-Original Message- 
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:34 PM 
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' 


Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using
CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another
Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!!  

The waits are: 

Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   %
totalAverage Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352
80.870917573872599.120234604105614250   852.374685967221
0   0

Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating ascii
file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8,
database links?

Thanks, 
Paula 

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FW: Destination address unreachable

[Freeman, Robert]

Is it that Oracle's business model is pushing these releases or is it the
rapid pace of technology change and the demand of the user for features? The
push to the web, XML, Java, and new feature requests (rename column, fk's ,
drop column, etc...). Then there is competition too that has to be
considered. If Oracle doesn't "keep up with the Joneses" as it were, what
kind of market share will it have 5 and 10 years down the line. 

So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?

makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
year and a half.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

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RE: Changing column format

[MacGregor, Ian A.]

I should add that what we do is to keep the "old key" record and attach the "new key" 
children to it.  The "new key" child information is more current.  Things are even 
murkier here because we have: Peoplesoft whose design cannot handle the data we need 
to keep on our collaborators, nor all the data we need on employees; and a homegrown 
system which is not designed to pay employees nor keep track of their benefits.  
Collaborators are paid by their home institutions not us.  

The homegrown system is built and maintained via Oracle Designer and uses the Web 
Server Generator to build the data entry and query screens  Developing new systems is 
magnitudes faster than using Peoplesoft.  

The systems do have to share information and there has to be a database of record for 
each piece of information.  What's ugly is that the database of record depends not 
only on the type of information, but also the "type" of person to which it belongs.

Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 5:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


we have systems where for various reasons (usually because someone can't type) a row 
is entered with differing names, but which refer to the same person. We use unique, 
non-semantic ids, with no meaning associated to the key.

We STILL have the problem (and I'm facing having to design a way to do this in a new 
system) of merging the information in these two records and cascading the referential 
integrity

OUCH


--- Jared Still <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> Thank you Adam!  I had given up hope that someone
> else would point this out.
> 
> Jared
> 
> On Thursday 07 November 2002 14:24, Donahue, Adam wrote:
> > I believe "username" here would be a unique identifier.  In most
> systems,
> > username must be unique (at least within a particular domain).  If
> yours is
> > a single domain system, David, then having two Jim Joneses would
> not be the
> > problem.
> >
> > There is another, more database-specific reason not to use the
> username
> > field as the primary key: username (I assume) has semantic meaning,
> andm
> > further, I assume, could change.  For example, let's assume my
> username is
> > "adonahue".  Later I get a promotion and I want a vanity username
> of
> > "adam".  Let's also assume your database consists of several
> tables, many
> > of which reference the user table by username.
> >
> > In this case, updating the username will require updating ALL rows
> in all
> > tables to reflect the new name. (That is, the data structure
> becomes
> > denormalized if username is the primary key.)  If you use userid,
> you can
> > simply update the user table referenced by the corresponding
> userid, and no
> > further changes would be required in child tables.
> >
> > Jerry's suggestion is best:  userid as the primary (surrogate) key,
> and a
> > non-null unique constraint on username to prevent duplicate names
> within
> > the same system.
> >
> > Adam
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 4:24 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >
> > David,
> >
> > I suggest that you don't. There are many "Jim Jones" in the world.
> How are
> > you going to handle that? Is this field really your primary key and
> related
> > to other tables or do you just need to make sure there are no
> duplicate
> > names? If so, create a unique constraint instead.
> >
> > If you must, first make sure that there is not already a duplicate
> name.
> >
> > SELECT username, count(username)
> > FROM your_table_name
> > GROUP BY username
> > HAVING count(username) >1;
> >
> > If you have any records returned, you need to fix your data before
> creating
> > the primary key. Same thing with null values. If the SQL below
> returns a
> > number other than zero, you need to put something in the null
> values before
> > creating the primary key.
> >
> > SELECT count(username)
> > FROM your_table_name
> > where username = Null;
> >
> > To drop the primary key:
> >
> > ALTER TABLE your_table_name
> >   DROP PRIMARY KEY CASCADE;
> >
> > To create a primary key:
> >
> > ALTER TABLE your_table_name
> >   ADD PRIMARY KEY (username);
> >
> > Personally, I think you are going to regret doing this.
> >
> > Jerry Whittle
> > ACIFICS DBA
> > NCI Information Systems Inc.
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 618-622-4145
> >
> > -Original Message-
> >
> > I create a table to store user account information and set
> "userid" column
> > to be primary key.  I now want to set "username" to be primary key
> instead
> > of "userid", how do I change it?  There are couple hundreds of
> records in
> > table.  Please advise.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > David
> 
> 
> Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"; name="Attachment: 1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> Content-Description:
> 
> -

RE: FW: developer 2000

[Paulo Gomes]

THANKS
Do u 
happen to know where can i get that?
Regards
Paulo
 

  -Original Message-From: Viktor 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 
  18:09To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: 
  Re: FW: developer 2000
  I think you may need to get an upgraded installer version 3.3.1.1.0c. This 
  is the one compatible with Y2K. Then, run the installer and select typical, 
  and that should be it. 
  Regards, 
  Viktor 
   
   Paulo Gomes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
  > 
-Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: 
sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:33> To: 
'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: developer 2000> > 
> > -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes 
> Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:31> To: 
'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: > > hi people> 
now is my turn to ask for help.> Just got some old forms that are 
still in developer 2000 version. Can't> upgrade the client and have a 
win 2000 machine. Developer 2000 doesn't> install in win 
2000.> Does anyone knows any trick to install Developer 2000 in win 
2000?> I DON'T WANT TO INSTALL A NEW NT MACHINE JUST FIX SOME LITTLE 
PROBLEM.> > Thanks in advance> Regards> 
Paulo-- Please see the official ORACLE-! ! L FAQ: 
http://www.orafaq.com-- Author: Paulo GomesINET: 
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services-To 
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command for other information (like subscribing).
  
  
  Do you Yahoo!?U2 on 
  LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits 
CD

Re: FW: developer 2000

[Viktor]

I think you may need to get an upgraded installer version 3.3.1.1.0c. This is the one compatible with Y2K. Then, run the installer and select typical, and that should be it. 
Regards,
Viktor
 
 Paulo Gomes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:33> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: developer 2000> > > > -Original Message-> From: Paulo Gomes > Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:31> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'> Subject: > > hi people> now is my turn to ask for help.> Just got some old forms that are still in developer 2000 version. Can't> upgrade the client and have a win 2000 machine. Developer 2000 doesn't> install in win 2000.> Does anyone knows any trick to install Developer 2000 in win 2000?> I DON'T WANT TO INSTALL A NEW NT MACHINE JUST FIX SOME LITTLE PROBLEM.> > Thanks in advance> Regards> Paulo-- Please see the official ORACLE-!
!
L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com-- Author: Paulo GomesINET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.comSan Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services-To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail messageto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and inthe message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You mayalso send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive medley & videos from Greatest Hits CD

Re: Data Purging Strategy

[Darlene Marley]

Hair of the dog!  I wonder if that would help my sorry butt.
Might have to leave for the airport early and sit at the bar until the stupor
clears.  Hope I don't miss my plane.
D

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Burnt mud?  Isn't that all scotch?
>

-- 
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-- 
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RE: updating sdo_ordinate array

[Jamadagni, Rajendra]

Title: newocp Stationery



you 
are not updating any table either ...
 
Raj
__
Rajendra 
Jamadagni  
    MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot 
com
Any opinion expressed here is personal 
and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having 
an opinion is an art!

  -Original Message-From: Robert Morrison 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 
  11:29 AMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: 
  updating sdo_ordinate array
  Hi,
   
  a query for all the spatial experts out 
  there.
   
  My ordinate array has values stored in 
  metres, ie
   
  SDO_GEOMETRY(3, NULL, NULL, 
  SDO_ELEM_INFO_ARRAY(1, 3, 1), SDO_ORDINATE_ARRAY(100066.781, 203070.305, 
  100574.094, 202339.257, 100170.282, 200904.413)
   
  I need them stored in mm, ie
   
  SDO_GEOMETRY(3, NULL, NULL, 
  SDO_ELEM_INFO_ARRAY(1, 3, 1), SDO_ORDINATE_ARRAY(100066781, 203070305, 
  100574094, 202339257, 100170282, 200904413)
   
  I have tried the following, however 
  although it executes ok it doesn't actually update anything.
   
  DECLARE i number; 
  BEGIN 
  FOR rec IN (SELECT area FROM sdo_test) 
  LOOP i := 1; while i < rec.area.sdo_ordinates.count LOOP 
  rec.area.sdo_ordinates(i):=(rec.area.sdo_ordinates(i) * 1000); i := i 
  + 1; end loop; END LOOP; 
  commit; 
  END; / 
  Can anyone point me in the right 
  direction.
   
  TIA
   
  Robert Morrison
This e-mail 
message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above and may 
contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from 
disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, or are 
not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify corporate MIS at (860) 766-2000 
and delete this e-mail message from your computer, Thank 
you.*2

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Stephen Lee]

> -Original Message-
> just what is Oracle's business model for pushing these release's
> out this fast?

It sells books and certification classes.
At our shop, we have started to blow off certification now that Oracle has
gotten so ridiculous about it.
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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Gogala, Mladen]

I don't want to express my real feelings but @#$%! oracle
should give us some time to get accustomed to the @#$%! 9i 
first. Is anybody here running 9i in production? My production 
systems are still on 8i, 8.0 (Oracle Financials) and even 7.3.
Who makes so stupid business decisions at @#$%! Oracle? Are 
they out of their @#$%! mind?

> -Original Message-
> From: BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1) [mailto:prakash.bala@;HP.COM]
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?
> 
> 
> Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also 
> said that the
> code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.
> 
> Prakash
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.
> 
> Sunil Nookala
> DBA
> Dell Corp.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Pall, Tom [Contractor]
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
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> -- 
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> -- 
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> -- 
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RE: database link tuning

[Paula_Stankus]

Title: RE: database link tuning





BTW,


Was doing join of views pointing to tables through 2 database links and gateway.  Just wondering - faster to move the tables then perform join locally esp. if I can do CTAS each time - h.

-Original Message-
From: Stankus, Paula G 
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:34 PM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: database link tuning



Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!!  

The waits are:


Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   %  total    Average Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352    80.8709175738725    99.1202346041056    14250   852.374685967221    0   0    

Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating ascii file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8, database links?

Thanks,
Paula

RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user

[Markham, Richard]

Title: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user



Choudhary
out of 
curiousity, is it understood that you will need to drop the same 
recently imported indexes from the data TS before running the import 

into 
the index TS ?  or will subsequent import cause a rebuild on the incoming 
indexes?

  -Original Message-From: Choudhary Rajendra (TTL_LKO) 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:38 
  AMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: 
  full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user
     if  you 
  have to import all indexes,constraints  to a single 
  tablespace then following procedure will work 
   
   4) After 
  importing data change the default tablespace to index tablespace ,ensure 
  that no other ts 
  quota (except 
  index ts)  is given to the schema . Grant sufficient quota on index 
  tablespace . 
   5) 
  do import with ignore=Y 
  ,rows=no ,indexes=y,constraints=y ,It will create indexes and constraints 
  on index ts. 
   
   6) 
  Revert back the default tablespace . 
   
     
     Rajendra  
    
  
      
  
  
-Original Message-From: Magaliff, Bill 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Thursday, November 07, 
2002 8:14 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same 
user
Richard:
 
if 
all of the objects are going into a single tablespace, make sure that new 
user has default tablespace set properly to the new TS and that s/he has a 
proper quota on that TS (I start with UNLIMITED).  Also, make sure that 
user has a quota of ZERO on the TS from which the data was exported - 
otherwise the default import behavior will put the objects into the TS from 
which they were taken.  Then just run the import (remembering, of 
course, to take all your small rollback segments offline and leave just one 
large rollback segment on line).
 
If 
you want Indexes in a separate TS, then here's what I 
do:
 
1)    set all as listed above, but make sure the user 
has unlimited quotas on both data and index TS
2)    import data only - I use "constraints=n grants=n 
indexes=n" to insure it's only table data that gets in
3)    import again with only the indexfile option, 
which will create a sql script
4)    Edit the indexfile to remove stuff you don't 
want. . . I use macros in my text editor to remove (in this 
order):
** 
all the lines beginning with "REM  ...xRows imported" 

** 
"REM  CREATE TABLE " statements - start with that string and delete 
until the next semi-colon (end of the CREATE TABLE 
statement);
these first two are for clarity only - so that I end up with a script 
that ONLY includes what I want, not all the other stuff, even though it's 
commented out.
 
**  all remaining instances of the string "REM  " (REM 
followed by two spaces) - this you must do to get all the ALTER TABLE 
statements properly.
 
this leaves you with clean sql to just create constraints and 
indexes
 
5)    do global search/replace for the index 
tablespace name (which is enclosed in double-quotes), putting in the name of 
the TS you want.
6)    remove the line at the top that says "connect 
" - you should connect first b4 running the 
script
 
7)    save the file!
8)    run the script to create all the 
indexes
 
HTH
 
bill
 
 
 -Original 
Message-From: Markham, Richard 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Thursday, November 07, 
2002 8:59 AMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same 
user

  I have a full export of user to where I need to import all 
  his objects/grants but into a NEW 
  tablespace.  What's the easiest way I can assure that 
  ~everything~ is imported.  Will I need to use 
  a combination of INDEXFILE and other procedures or 
  will a full export; drop tablespace; create new tablespace; alter user's default tablespace; full import suffice 
  for all objects? Thanks for any tips. 

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[Mercadante, Thomas F]

does this bother anybody else as much as it bothers me?  just what is
Oracle's business model for pushing these release's out this fast?  are
there that many new features, or a market to capture, that justifies this?

makes no sense to me.  the shelf life of an oracle release is now about a
year and a half.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 11:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

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RE: CPU Problem

[Richards, Brian]

Do they even make records anymore? No
Would the children of today even understand the reference? Most wouldn't
I suddenly feel very old. I feel your pain (still have my collection of 400
LPs - did see a 'new' record player on the shelf in the electronics section
recently)

Brian
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[Whittle Jerome Contr NCI]

Title: RE: Data Purging Strategy






And finding something to play that CD in 50 years, much less understand the data format, will be like finding something to play an old 78 now.

78. How's that for showing my age! I even had a 16 once. And a 4-track (pre 8-track).

Jerry Whittle

ACIFICS DBA

NCI Information Systems Inc.

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

618-622-4145

-Original Message-

From:   Jared Still [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Ron,

Under ideal conditions, that is,  controlled temperature, humidity

and atmosphere, a CD has a lifespan of 30-200 years.

In typical conditions, 5-50 years.  

CD's stored in a computer room might only last 10 years.  In

someone's desk, maybe only 5 years.

On the visor of your car, probably not that long.  ;)

Jared

RE: CPU Problem

[Cary Millsap]

All true, and an excellent observation.

I agree that "If a query is well-tuned, then it will consume more CPU
than anything else." However, this is not equivalent to saying, "If a
query consumes more CPU than anything else, then it is well tuned." It
is quite possible that the statement could consume less CPU than it does
and still return the correct answer. The way to accomplish this is...

(drum roll, please)

...eliminate unnecessary LIOs. :)


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
Lee
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:18 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


> We are facing with some CPU problem (cpu 100% usage!),

To offer another point of view:

There are some queries, especially in a data warehouse, that are large
queries, that must, by the nature of the information sought, sort
through
large amounts of data.  The RDBMS, in an attempt to satisfy the query
as
quickly as possible, is going to use its CPU resources to their full
extent.
ANY time an Oracle query is being run, be it big or small, elegant or
trashy, it will use all the CPU that the OS will allow it to use; and
the OS
will run a CPU to 100% of its capacity when there is work to be done.
Most
of the time, things come and go fast enough on a system that you don't
see
those momentary 100% spikes in CPU usage.  Think about it: Why would the
OS
deliberately drag its feet in getting work done?  Is this some kind of
union-made OS?

This is a explanation that I have given many times to sys admins that
expressed alarm that an Oracle process was using 100% of a CPU.  It
SHOULD
to do that!

Now, if this is a database in which one should not be seeing large,
long-running queries, to quote Emily Littella: "Well, that's different!"
The decision as to whether you have a problem should not be based on
some
percentage of CPU usage, but on what is "normal" usage for this
particular
database.
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RE: Data Purging Strategy

[Scott . Shafer]

Burnt mud?  Isn't that all scotch?

Scott Shafer
San Antonio, TX
210.581.6217


> -Original Message-
> From: Steve McClure [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:34 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  RE: Data Purging Strategy
> 
> Sherry Finish?  I thought you liked scotch that tasted like burnt mud?
> 
> -Original Message-
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:55 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> That reminds me:
> 
> Mark, your annual stipend is due.
> 
> Make it a case of Glenmorangie this time, Sherry finish.  :)
> 
> Jared
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  11/06/2002 07:56 AM
>  Please respond to ORACLE-L
> 
>  
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: 
> Subject:RE: Data Purging Strategy
> 
> 
> Hey Dennis,
> Mark Leith is the only person on this list allowed to mention 3rd party
> products.
> I am sure he bought the franchise from Jared :)
> 
> John
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: 06 November 2002 14:15
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Prem - You are receiving some excellent advice from Tom and Tim. I would
> mention two items in addition:
>   - If you ever hope to re-use the data you archive off-line, you must 
> also
> archive all the related tables, because after all, this is a RELATIONAL
> database.
>   - PrincetonSoftech has a product Active Archiving that looks pretty good
> from the demos I've seen. I haven't used it myself.
> 
> 
> 
> Dennis Williams 
> DBA, 40%OCP 
> Lifetouch, Inc. 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 6:54 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Prem,
>  
> I would re-visit the requirement.  Why do you feel the need to delete the
> data from the database?  What is the purpose for this type of requirement?
> It would be far easier to modify the requirement than to do what you are
> thinking of doing.
>  
> Adding columns to database tables indicating that a record has passed it's
> retention policy and thus, is not included in queries, would be a much
> easier solution.
>  
> Or, simply moving these records to historical tables in the database - and
> NOT deleting them from the system - is a much better solution.  The data 
> is
> always accessible and not available in the current tables.  And you will 
> not
> be playing the "get the data from tape and reload it" game with all of 
> it's
> problems (writing an offload program, table structure changes & offload
> program versions).
>  
> Try and keep this as simple as possible.
>  
> Hope this helps
>  
> Tom Mercadante 
> Oracle Certified Professional 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 4:13 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> 
> Dear List, 
> 
> I need some inputs from you all regarding purging data from the database. 
> 
> This is the requirement 
> 
> 
> We define a retention period for all the data in the system. 
> When the retention period is reached,  the data should be deleted, but 
> then
> at a later time, some user might request for this purged data. So it must 
> be
> possible to retrieve this data. 
> 
> This is the strategy we have designed for this. 
> 
> When the retention period is reached, move the data from the main database
> to an offline database. Then delete the data from the main database. 
> 
> In the offline database, we cannot again keep it from long, so it has to
> moved to tapes. Now my question, how can we move this data to tapes and at
> the same time retrieve data from the tapes based on dates. 
> i.e, the user will ask for the data on a particular date, so it must be
> possible to retrieve data from the tapes based on a date and load it to 
> the
> database tables. 
> 
> Regards 
> Prem 
> 
>  
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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RE: database link tuning

[Paula_Stankus]

Title: RE: database link tuning





Trying to bring over 60 rows with database link and write to table using CTAS.  It is taking forever - going through Oracle - going through another Oracle that is hooked up with a gateway to Informix - yuck!!  

The waits are:


Event   Waits   Waits/sec   % total Wait Time (ms)  Wait Time/sec   %  total    Average Wait SQL*Net more data from dblink  1352    80.8709175738725    99.1202346041056    14250   852.374685967221    0   0    

Any ideas how to speed up other than getting another gateway, creating ascii file and using direct load.  Is there a way to tune related to Net8, database links?

Thanks,
Paula

FW: developer 2000

[Paulo Gomes]

>  -Original Message-
> From: Paulo Gomes  
> Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:33
> To:   '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> Subject:  developer 2000
> 
> 
> 
>  -Original Message-
> From: Paulo Gomes  
> Sent: sexta-feira, 8 de Novembro de 2002 17:31
> To:   '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> Subject:  
> 
> hi people
>  now is my turn to ask for help.
> Just got some old forms that are still in developer 2000 version. Can't
> upgrade the client and have a win 2000 machine. Developer 2000 doesn't
> install in win 2000.
> Does anyone knows any trick to install Developer 2000 in win 2000?
> I DON'T WANT TO INSTALL A NEW NT MACHINE JUST FIX SOME LITTLE PROBLEM.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> Regards
> Paulo
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RE: Number of extents

[Cary Millsap]

The statement "Any object that is returned from the following query will
decrease performance" is false. Having large numbers of extents matters
only (1) if your application drops tables frequently and you're not
using LMT, or (2) your application inserts into a table that endures new
extent allocation every few seconds, or (3) if your application uses
Oracle7 Parallel Server. Since 1, 2, and 3 are all bad ideas, having 20
or 100 or even 20,000 extents in a segment is of virtually no
performance consequence whatsoever. (For details on what's up with #3,
see www.jlcomp.demon.co.uk/extent.html.)

The information in the MetaLink document is at least as old as a paper
written for Support by some friends in Oracle Application Development
back in about 1987. The now-infamous document still serves as an
embarrassment to my friends who wrote it. The idea had nearly died a
proper death until the author of "part number 2434-6 (Oracle Press)"
re-invigorated it in 1999.

In spite of this statement's falseness, it has been a godsend for some:

* It created an easy way out of many tough Support calls. "Just rebuild
your database and call me back if things are still slow." Things of
course *would* still be slow afterward, but at least when the customer
called back the next week, the call would probably get picked up by
different analyst.

* It created an opportunity for the intake of tens of millions of
dollars in consulting revenue and de-fragmentation software sales.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on Oracle® System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
Nguyen
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:24 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Hello,

I was very surprise when I saw what is below in the note 
100960.1 at Metalink about the number of extents. Could-you 
give me your opinion please ? 

1.4 OBJECTS WHICH DECREASE PERFORMANCE  Any object that is 
returned from the following query will decrease 
performance.  While the performance hit on over extended 
objects is not  significant, the aggregate effect on many 
over extended objects does impact performance.   
ttitle 'All segments with >20 extents belonging to SYS' 
skipclear breaks   clear computes   clear 
columnscolumn tablespace_name  format a15   column 
segment_name format a30   column segment_type 
format a8select  substr(tablespace_name,1,15) 
Tname,   segment_name,   
segment_type,   substr
(owner,1,10) "OWNER",   count
(*) "Extents",   blocks   from
sys.dba_extents   where   owner != 'SYS'   group by 
tablespace_name,   segment_name,   
segment_type,   owner,   blocks   
having count(*) >20;

Accédez au courrier électronique de La Poste : www.laposte.net ;
3615 LAPOSTENET (0,13 €/mn) ; tél : 08 92 68 13 50 (0,34€/mn)"



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Re: Oracle & SAN Experiences?

[Jared Still]

Tim,

Of course, there are excellent arguments for having test and
development environments on the same SAN.  

With SAP for example, wholesale refreshes of the test and dev
environments periodically take place.  These are refreshed from
production.  

Having these on the same SAN can make a huge difference in
the performance of these.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > The Sys. Admin. team wants to consolidate storage (and
> > probably get a new toy too) on all of our servers, so they
> > are evaluating a SAN (LSI  Logic E4600).  The DBA team is
> > doing some research to determine the pros and cons of
> > doing this, and I'd like to hear any of your experiences
> > (good and bad) using SAN with Oracle.
> >
> > My understanding is that all of our database servers would
> > remain intact, but the attached disk storage would move
> > into the SAN.  So, we still have the Production, Test, and
> > App. servers with their processors and memory, Oracle
> > homes, etc.  The SAN will hold database files from
> > Production, Test, Apps., staging, ODS,data warehouse, etc.
> >
> > Their arguments:
> > -the SAN is very scalable (500 GB - 40 TB)
> > -easy to manage disks in one central location
> > -fancy statistics collection on all SAN disks
> > -much higher throughput on the fiber SAN connections than
> > with locally attached disk arrays
> > -capable of using mixed RAID levels (0, 1, 1+0, 5, etc.)
> > -can partition sets of disks in the SAN for specific
> > server access -Snapshot backup capability is very fast in
> > the SAN (much faster than traditional Oracle backups)
> >
> > DBA arguments:
> > -How will this affect database performance?
> > -What are the drawbacks, if any, with the pre-fetch of
> > data performed by the SAN (i.e., SAN cache)
> > -How tunable is the SAN
> > -Fast, small disks are better for performance and less
> > wasted space than the typical huge disks in a SAN (it's
> > possible to use smaller disks in the SAN) -Prove it!
> >
> >
> > After reading the "Sane SAN" article and a case study
> > about Volvo implementing a SAN, I believe it's possible to
> > have a great Oracle/SAN implementation if it's setup
> > correctly and tuned.  Other resources that you can Google
> > are "Using SVA SnapShot with Oracle", "Performance
> > Benchmark LSI Logic E4600 (STK D178)", "SAN Storage for
> > Open Systems Environments", and of course check the
> > OraFaq.
> >
> > Thanks for sharing,
> >
> > David Wagoner
> > Oracle DBA
>
> Sounds like you're going through an excellent evaluation
> process.  I would suggest to keep in mind Anjo's advice to
> also regard I/O in terms of units of throughput (i.e. read
> or write rates) instead of Gbytes or Tbytes (i.e. static
> capacity).  Helps clarify the discussions...
>
> The other thing is the idea of co-mingling production and
> dev/test.  Of course it is possible and quite feasible, but
> if you look at things from the perspective of units of
> throughput, you might find a huge disparity or conflict.
> Perhaps the most telling indicator might be reviewing
> whether or not your LANs for production and dev/test are
> isolated from one another -- many of the rationales for
> doing so (or not doing so) might be similar to the
> considerations for your SAN.
>
> Good luck!
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RE: Space management failures on autoextend datafiles

[Hately, Mike (NESL-IT)]

Hi Ron,

you're quite right and I'm pointing out that this functionality
(auto-extension of a file to accomodate a tempoary segment) works fine for
me. 
That suggests that (bugs aside) temporary segments are quite capable of
forcing a datafile to extend.
The thrust of your earlier mail seemed to be that this was a deliberate
design choice on the part of Oracle rather than a bug.
Apologies if I misundestood your intention.

Regards,
Mike


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 3:59 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Mike,
 In the previous discussion on this thread the problem was that the
autoextent would not work for a temp segment created during the index
creation and the problem was solved by  extending the tablespace to
handle the temp segments.
Ron

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/08/02 09:18AM >>>
Ron,
I don't believe all of that to be true.

In your example idx2 should be created and the tablespace should
extend.
Otherwise what would be the point of having AUTOEXTEND on any
tablespace
which held only indexes?
I agree that Oracle will use a temporary segment to hold the index
data
until it is fully created but Oracle will extend the datafile
regardless.
In fact, when I tested this at 8.1.7.3 and 9.2 even an index rebuild
extended the datfile in order to accomodate the new index.

regards,
Mike Hately

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:39 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Let's think about this for a minute.
You create and index called idx1 using a designated tablespace that
has
sufficient space to hold the complete index.
You create a new index idx2 on the table using the same tablespace and
you think that it should autoextend to hold the permanent index.
 The system generates the index and starts placing the temporary index
named something like 123.123 in the tablespace. This index is a
temporary index until the system has completed creating the entire
index. Then it will make the index name permanent as idx2 and use the
space accordingly with the required extents and autoextend. Oracle
does
not know that the index will complete, be aborted, crash, etc so it
can
not make any permanent assignment to the extents( that is why it is
called temporary) . Oracle would permanently extent tablespaces for
each
temporary function then the database could artificially expand when
the
functions were only temporary in nature and the compounded effect
could
cause a ripple effect. The backup size would expand, search functions
could take longer because of the increased size, disk space would be
wasted.
Just a few thoughts and ideas.
Ron
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Re: Oracle & SAN Experiences?

[Gary Weber]

I am off today, recuperating from a SAN failure earlier this week. Here is a
very short take: our Dell SAN went down (backplane failure), taking ALL of
databases along with it. This meant that all servers attached to this SAN
were offline. Upon Dell "repairing" the SAN, data on one volume (mapped to
production server) was corrupted and I had to restore from tape and apply a
week's worth of archived logs. Time it took Dell to fix their hardware? 48
hours. We also have a new EMC Sym, and are considering abandoning SAN
approach and putting all eggs into Sym, since EMC guys at least monitor
their hardware and would've known of such failure prior to it occurring. Am
I saying SANs are bad? No. But do consider your vendor, support level, and
required reliability.

Gary

- Original Message -
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:58 AM


> The Sys. Admin. team wants to consolidate storage (and probably get a new
> toy too) on all of our servers, so they are evaluating a SAN (LSI  Logic
> E4600).  The DBA team is doing some research to determine the pros and
cons
> of doing this, and I'd like to hear any of your experiences (good and bad)
> using SAN with Oracle.
>
> My understanding is that all of our database servers would remain intact,
> but the attached disk storage would move into the SAN.  So, we still have
> the Production, Test, and App. servers with their processors and memory,
> Oracle homes, etc.  The SAN will hold database files from Production,
Test,
> Apps., staging, ODS,data warehouse, etc.
>
> Their arguments:
> -the SAN is very scalable (500 GB - 40 TB)
> -easy to manage disks in one central location
> -fancy statistics collection on all SAN disks
> -much higher throughput on the fiber SAN connections than with locally
> attached disk arrays
> -capable of using mixed RAID levels (0, 1, 1+0, 5, etc.)
> -can partition sets of disks in the SAN for specific server access
> -Snapshot backup capability is very fast in the SAN (much faster than
> traditional Oracle backups)
>
> DBA arguments:
> -How will this affect database performance?
> -What are the drawbacks, if any, with the pre-fetch of data performed by
the
> SAN (i.e., SAN cache)
> -How tunable is the SAN
> -Fast, small disks are better for performance and less wasted space than
the
> typical huge disks in a SAN (it's possible to use smaller disks in the
SAN)
> -Prove it!
>
>
> After reading the "Sane SAN" article and a case study about Volvo
> implementing a SAN, I believe it's possible to have a great Oracle/SAN
> implementation if it's setup correctly and tuned.  Other resources that
you
> can Google are "Using SVA SnapShot with Oracle", "Performance Benchmark
LSI
> Logic E4600 (STK D178)", "SAN Storage for Open Systems Environments", and
of
> course check the OraFaq.
>
> Thanks for sharing,
>
> David Wagoner
> Oracle DBA
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[Jared Still]

Dennis,

I think you got it wrong right off when you stated that there's  a
"lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW ".

It isn't that issue at all.  No two people can agree on what an ODS
is at all, much less compare it to a DW.

To me for instance, an ODS is a place to stage data for the final
stages of some other process, be it a DW, or anything else.

An ODS is a rather generic term, and therefor whatever you 
want it to be.

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 07:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Greetings -
> I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there are
> a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should be
> used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
> Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover ODS
> much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building an
> ODS?
>
> TIA
>
>
> Dennis Meng
> Database Administrator
> Focal Communications Corp.
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Re: Data Purging Strategy

[Jared Still]

Ron,

Under ideal conditions, that is,  controlled temperature, humidity
and atmosphere, a CD has a lifespan of 30-200 years.

In typical conditions, 5-50 years.  

CD's stored in a computer room might only last 10 years.  In
someone's desk, maybe only 5 years.

On the visor of your car, probably not that long.  ;)

Jared

On Friday 08 November 2002 04:48, Ron Rogers wrote:
> Jay,
>  Remind the management that in the future there might also ba a change
> of hardware and then the backups on tape could possible be useless and
> unreadable by the new tape drives. If possible save the data to a text
> delimited file and save the file. That wouls insure you that you would
> always be able to at least read the information if needed.
>  I have a lot of data( from 1993- to - today) that someday will be
> archived , I hope, and I can remove from the system. I will be saving it
> in text format in CD's so it can be accessed if needed. We also are
> changing to a new server and OS format. The old backup tapes are scrap
> now.
> Planning on your part could be very helpfull down the road.
> Ron
>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:24PM >>>
>
> Well, if worst comes to worst we can always install an earlier version
> on a
> box and import it there.
> But the reason we can't get more storage approved still has me shaking
> my
> head...
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:19 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Jay,
>
> just make sure you are not around when, after several Oracle upgrades,
> and
> they want to "import" one of these files back that they discover that
> the
> current release of import can no longer read the older version of the
> .dmp
> file.
>
> now what are these senior damagers going to do?  blame the DBA, that's
> what!
>
>
> duck and cover... duck and cover...
>
> Tom Mercadante
> Oracle Certified Professional
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:55 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> FWIW, what we just implemented (because senior management refuses to
> approve
> additional storage on the grounds that "making the database larger
> will
> affect performance" - aaargh!) is
>
> 1) Confirmed with business how long data needs to be online for
> various
> tables (they're all partitioned so that makes it a lot easier)
> 2) Export partitions older than that once/month (this is generated off
> a
> table that lists each partitioned table and how long data should be
> kep)
> 3) After confirming that all export files are valid we drop the old
> partitions (this will be done by script but is being done manually for
> the
> first few months)
> 4) Leave dmp files on server for 2 end of months (our end of month
> backup
> tapes are stored for 7 years)
> 5) Maintain a table in database saying what exported partitions are on
> what
> date's tapes
>
>
> And I really long for the days in this company when senior management
> made
> technical decisions by asking the technical people instead of just
> making
> things up...
>
> Jay Miller
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 11:54 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Someone asked about this 3 weeks ago.  Here's my take
> on archiving data.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this,
> but nonetheless,  I have an opinion.   :)
>
> Here's an email from last month.  You can undoubtedly find
> some other ideas on this by searching the archives of this
> list at fatcity.com
>
> Jared
>
> ==
>
> I'm not a proponent of purging data.
>
> Unless of course, you expect to never see it again.
>
> That word 'archive' rolls of the tongues of managers
> and consultants pretty easily, but what's behind it?
>
> There are a few gotchas with purging and archiving.
>
> Let's assume you have some 3 year old data that
> you need to see again, and it has been purged.
>
> Here are some of the possible problems:
>
> *  Your backup tapes are corrupted
> *  Your new backup hardware can't read the old tapes
> *  Your software no longer understands the format that
> the data is in.
> * You have the correct software, but it won't work on the
>current version of OS on your hardware.
> * The data format/software/whatever is not well documented
> *  The employees that understood the data 3 years ago
>have been laid off.
> * ... lots more stuff
>
> Read Bryon Bergeron's "Dark Ages II: When the Digital Data Die"
> http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=2-0130661074-0
>
> Perhaps much better than archiving the data, is to stick with the
> idea of moving it to another database, and using lots of cheap
> disk storage (NAS) or a heirarchical file system to store it.
>
> The point being that if it's online somewhere, it will be maintained.
>
> Don't purge it till Finance, HR, the IRS and any other stakeholder
> says it's ok.  Only then purge it and archive it to offline tape with
> the
> knowledge that 

Whitepapers on Triggers

[Steven Haas]

Listers,

Oracle 8.1.7

I am looking for any whitepaper(s) that can
provide guidelines on the creation, use,
performance and limitations of triggers.

I need to create triggers on possibly 45 tables
for auditing purposes.  The first draft
requirements document indicates denormalizing
data and generating data for null columns using
the triggers (yeah, bad ideas).  I prefer to make
them as simple as possible and would like to have
the best arguments against doing it the way the
requirements suggest.

TIA,

Steve Haas

"Opinions, real or imagined, are mine."

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RE: Need Help on Operational Data Store

[DENNIS WILLIAMS]

Dennis - Bill Inmon is the patron saint of the ODS people. Pretty much equal
industry status with Ralph. Claims the title of "The Father of Data
Warehousing" (right there on his site). Start with his Web site at
http://www.billinmon.com/. His articles are published on DB Review magazine,
http://www.dmreview.com/. Enjoy.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 9:59 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Greetings -
I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there are
a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should be
used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover ODS
much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building an
ODS?

TIA


Dennis Meng
Database Administrator
Focal Communications Corp.

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RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

[BALA,PRAKASH (HP-USA,ex1)]

Heard from Tom Kyte that 10i should be out by Dec'03. He also said that the
code is already frozen and beta testing is going on.

Prakash

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 14:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


The day we all finish upgrading our databases to 9i.

Sunil Nookala
DBA
Dell Corp.



-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Has anyone heard when Oracle will be releasing version 10i?

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Re: More question about TEMP

[Viral Desai]

Ron,

Data files in this case would be visible in dba_temp_files
The object will exist after the session has ended but it will release any space if the session created rows in that object. In other words as you create more rows, it will allocate extents, as soon as your session ends it will release those temp extents, it will still have some space allocated to it since the definition of the table will remain in the schema.
You can verify space allocation/deallocation using v$sort_usage dynamic view.
Regards,
Viral
 

>From: "Ron Rogers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: More question about TEMP 
>Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 07:33:34 -0800 
> 
>List, 
>Sorry for the confusion. 
> As the DBA I "grant create session to rrogers" and "grant create 
>table to rrogers" 
>As rrogers I 
>"create temporary tablespace fubar 
>tempfile '/data4/ror.dbf 'size 10M 
>extent management local uniform size 128k;" 
> 
>The tablespace gets created and is visable by the DBA with 
>"Select * from dba_tablespaces where tablespace_name 'FUBAR';" 
>The datafile is NOT visable in the dba_data_files view. 
> 
>As rrogers I create a table 
>"Create global temporary table testror( 
>col1 char(1000));" 
> The table is visable to the DBA as 
>select * from dba_tables where owner ='RROGERS'; 
>and desc rrogers.testror. 
> 
>As rrogers I exit the system and the table is still visable to the DBA. 
>The manual says that the "temporary tablespace"fubar is an allocation 
>of space that can contain schema objects for the duration of the 
>session" If this is so then why is the table still there.??? 
>I think that the manual should read that the object created can contain 
>data only for the duration of the session Or something to the same 
>effect as the objects still exist after the session has ended. 
>Am I correct in my tests? 
>Ron 
> 
>-- 
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
>-- 
>Author: Ron Rogers 
> INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
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>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may 
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). 
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RE: CPU Problem

[David Davis]

Definately worth repeating. Its an excellent article. Read it last night. 
Hmmm. Maybe I need a life.

Do they even make records anymore? Would the children of today even 
understand the reference? I suddenly feel very old. :-)


From: "Cary Millsap" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: CPU Problem
Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 14:43:46 -0800

SQL that does excessively many reads from memory. Trace it. Read "Why
you should focus on LIOs instead of PIOs" at www.hotsos.com/catalog.

My apologies to the list for repeating myself like a broken record. :)


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
Alavi
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Hi List,

We are facing with some CPU problem (cpu 100% usage!), Just want to get
some
idea from you guys, any clue what can cause this problem:
Here is a copy of some part of ora.ini
This happen during usage of some long query with subquery, this can be
the
cause of problem or just some wrong setting in ini file.
I appreciate your help.

compatible = 8.1.7.4
db_block_buffers = 1
db_block_lru_latches = 4
db_block_size = 8192
db_file_multiblock_read_count = 16
hash_area_size = 2048000
java_pool_size = 20971520
large_pool_size = 614400
log_buffer = 262144
log_checkpoint_interval = 1
log_checkpoint_timeout = 1800
max_enabled_roles = 30
open_cursors = 300
optimizer_index_caching = 90
optimizer_index_cost_adj = 35
os_authent_prefix = ""
processes = 100
session_cached_cursors = 100
shared_pool_size = 134217728
sort_area_retained_size = 262144
sort_area_size = 262144
timed_statistics = TRUE





Hamid Alavi
Office 818 737-0526
Cell818 416-5095






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updating sdo_ordinate array

[Robert Morrison]

Title: newocp Stationery



Hi,
 
a query for all the spatial experts out 
there.
 
My ordinate array has values stored in 
metres, ie
 
SDO_GEOMETRY(3, NULL, NULL, 
SDO_ELEM_INFO_ARRAY(1, 3, 1), SDO_ORDINATE_ARRAY(100066.781, 203070.305, 
100574.094, 202339.257, 100170.282, 200904.413)
 
I need them stored in mm, ie
 
SDO_GEOMETRY(3, NULL, NULL, 
SDO_ELEM_INFO_ARRAY(1, 3, 1), SDO_ORDINATE_ARRAY(100066781, 203070305, 
100574094, 202339257, 100170282, 200904413)
 
I have tried the following, however although 
it executes ok it doesn't actually update anything.
 
DECLARE i number; 
BEGIN 
FOR rec IN (SELECT area FROM sdo_test) LOOP 
i := 1; while i < rec.area.sdo_ordinates.count LOOP 
rec.area.sdo_ordinates(i):=(rec.area.sdo_ordinates(i) * 1000); i := i + 
1; end loop; END LOOP; 
commit; 
END; / 
Can anyone point me in the right 
direction.
 
TIA
 
Robert Morrison

re: more questions about temp.

[M Rafiq]

Ron,

1)Those temp data files to be removed from OS manually. make sure that temp 
tablespace dropped successfully.

2) for temporary temp tablespace datafiles are shown in dba_temp_files view 
(if tablespace is not dropped)

HTH,

Regards
Rafiq









Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 07:39:02 -0800

list,
additional information that needs clarification.
After the Temporary tablespace fubar had been dropped the datafile
still existed on the OS level. If you have space problems be sure to
look at both your permanant and temporary tablespaces. Temporary
tablespace do NOT show up in the dba_data_files view.
Ron
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Need Help on Operational Data Store

[dmeng]

Greetings -
I need some help with building an Operational Data Store. I know there are
a lot of confusion in ODS vs. DW but I belong to the camp of 'ODS should be
used only for operational reporting, not decision support'. So while
Kimball talks a lot about building a DW in his books, he does not cover ODS
much. Are there any books/websites/third parties that deal with building an
ODS?

TIA


Dennis Meng
Database Administrator
Focal Communications Corp.

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RE: Space management failures on autoextend datafiles

[Ron Rogers]

Mike,
 In the previous discussion on this thread the problem was that the
autoextent would not work for a temp segment created during the index
creation and the problem was solved by  extending the tablespace to
handle the temp segments.
Ron

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/08/02 09:18AM >>>
Ron,
I don't believe all of that to be true.

In your example idx2 should be created and the tablespace should
extend.
Otherwise what would be the point of having AUTOEXTEND on any
tablespace
which held only indexes?
I agree that Oracle will use a temporary segment to hold the index
data
until it is fully created but Oracle will extend the datafile
regardless.
In fact, when I tested this at 8.1.7.3 and 9.2 even an index rebuild
extended the datfile in order to accomodate the new index.

regards,
Mike Hately

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:39 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Let's think about this for a minute.
You create and index called idx1 using a designated tablespace that
has
sufficient space to hold the complete index.
You create a new index idx2 on the table using the same tablespace and
you think that it should autoextend to hold the permanent index.
 The system generates the index and starts placing the temporary index
named something like 123.123 in the tablespace. This index is a
temporary index until the system has completed creating the entire
index. Then it will make the index name permanent as idx2 and use the
space accordingly with the required extents and autoextend. Oracle
does
not know that the index will complete, be aborted, crash, etc so it
can
not make any permanent assignment to the extents( that is why it is
called temporary) . Oracle would permanently extent tablespaces for
each
temporary function then the database could artificially expand when
the
functions were only temporary in nature and the compounded effect
could
cause a ripple effect. The backup size would expand, search functions
could take longer because of the increased size, disk space would be
wasted.
Just a few thoughts and ideas.
Ron

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:43PM >>>
maybe temp segments don't cause an autoextend? 

at least it's consistent

--- "Fink, Dan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Update... I tried the same test with 8.1.7 on Solaris 8. Same
> result...
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I just manually expanded the file and the index build finished with
> no
> problem. I also set the USER_DATA ts as autoextend and it extended
> several
> times without error. The only difference is in the fact that the
> INDEX
> segment is initially created as a TEMP segment. Interesting
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:34 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Dan, 
> That's exactly, what someone described yesterday, it was LMT with
> autoallocate, and they made sure, that there was plenty of space on
> the hard
> drive for TEMP file to grow.
> The only difference: it was not Solaris - it was AIX.
>  
> Igor Neyman, OCP DBA
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
>   
>  
>  
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:15 PM
> 
> Igor and Yechiel,
> Thanks for the responses. I'm glad to hear that I am not the
only
> one
> experiencing the problem. 
> I should have also mentioned that the tablespace is LMT with
> autoallocate and is nowhere near the max size.
>  
> Dan Fink
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 9:35 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hi Paulo
>  
> When creating an index, or CTAS, oracle use temp segments while
> building and
> rename them after the build finish. So if you do not have enough
> space you
> will get: unable to allocate TEMP segment.
>  
> Yechiel Adar
> Mehish
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 6:04 PM
> 
> never heard on this problem but are u sure table the temp tablespace
> of the
> user executing the commeand is temp and not user_indx???
> regards
> Paulo
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: quinta-feira, 7 de Novembro de 2002 15:39
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I have a 9.2 database running on Solaris 8. I'm creating some test
> tables
> with indexes. The USER_INDX tablespace's datafile is set to
> autoextend (as
> are TEMP and USER_DATA). When the system attempts to create indexes,
> instead
> of auotextending the datafile (there is plenty of space on the
> device), it
> throws an ORA-01652: unable to extend temp segment by 128 in
> tablespace
> USER_INDX error. If I manually resize the datafile and rerun it, no
> problems.
>  
> Anyone else heard of this behavior? I can't find anything on
Metalink
> 

RE: Space management failures on autoextend datafiles

[Fink, Dan]

I just tried a cartesian product/sort and the TEMP tablespace, which is set
up as temporary and using a tempfile was able to autoextend. Of course, the
next step is to set up a TEMP tablespace as temporary using a datafile, then
permanent and see what happens...volunteers?

In regards to the issue of not autoextending in the event of a statement
failure. If this were the case, then almost no autoextension would occur. If
I insert 10 million rows into a table, causing the datafile to autoextend, I
could issue a rollback and not 'save' the rows. However, the table would
still have allocated the additional space (and the HWM would be WAY out
there...). 

Dan Fink

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:44 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


maybe temp segments don't cause an autoextend? 

at least it's consistent

--- "Fink, Dan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Update... I tried the same test with 8.1.7 on Solaris 8. Same
> result...
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I just manually expanded the file and the index build finished with
> no
> problem. I also set the USER_DATA ts as autoextend and it extended
> several
> times without error. The only difference is in the fact that the
> INDEX
> segment is initially created as a TEMP segment. Interesting
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:34 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Dan, 
> That's exactly, what someone described yesterday, it was LMT with
> autoallocate, and they made sure, that there was plenty of space on
> the hard
> drive for TEMP file to grow.
> The only difference: it was not Solaris - it was AIX.
>  
> Igor Neyman, OCP DBA
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
>   
>  
>  
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:15 PM
> 
> Igor and Yechiel,
> Thanks for the responses. I'm glad to hear that I am not the only
> one
> experiencing the problem. 
> I should have also mentioned that the tablespace is LMT with
> autoallocate and is nowhere near the max size.
>  
> Dan Fink
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 9:35 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hi Paulo
>  
> When creating an index, or CTAS, oracle use temp segments while
> building and
> rename them after the build finish. So if you do not have enough
> space you
> will get: unable to allocate TEMP segment.
>  
> Yechiel Adar
> Mehish
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 6:04 PM
> 
> never heard on this problem but are u sure table the temp tablespace
> of the
> user executing the commeand is temp and not user_indx???
> regards
> Paulo
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: quinta-feira, 7 de Novembro de 2002 15:39
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I have a 9.2 database running on Solaris 8. I'm creating some test
> tables
> with indexes. The USER_INDX tablespace's datafile is set to
> autoextend (as
> are TEMP and USER_DATA). When the system attempts to create indexes,
> instead
> of auotextending the datafile (there is plenty of space on the
> device), it
> throws an ORA-01652: unable to extend temp segment by 128 in
> tablespace
> USER_INDX error. If I manually resize the datafile and rerun it, no
> problems.
>  
> Anyone else heard of this behavior? I can't find anything on Metalink
> that
> fits the problem definition. 
>  
> Dan Fink
> 
> 


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Re: Oracle & SAN Experiences?

[tim]

> The Sys. Admin. team wants to consolidate storage (and
> probably get a new toy too) on all of our servers, so they
> are evaluating a SAN (LSI  Logic E4600).  The DBA team is
> doing some research to determine the pros and cons of
> doing this, and I'd like to hear any of your experiences
> (good and bad) using SAN with Oracle.
>  
> My understanding is that all of our database servers would
> remain intact, but the attached disk storage would move
> into the SAN.  So, we still have the Production, Test, and
> App. servers with their processors and memory, Oracle
> homes, etc.  The SAN will hold database files from
> Production, Test, Apps., staging, ODS,data warehouse, etc.
>  
> Their arguments:
> -the SAN is very scalable (500 GB - 40 TB)
> -easy to manage disks in one central location
> -fancy statistics collection on all SAN disks
> -much higher throughput on the fiber SAN connections than
> with locally attached disk arrays
> -capable of using mixed RAID levels (0, 1, 1+0, 5, etc.)
> -can partition sets of disks in the SAN for specific
> server access -Snapshot backup capability is very fast in
> the SAN (much faster than traditional Oracle backups)
>  
> DBA arguments:
> -How will this affect database performance?
> -What are the drawbacks, if any, with the pre-fetch of
> data performed by the SAN (i.e., SAN cache)
> -How tunable is the SAN
> -Fast, small disks are better for performance and less
> wasted space than the typical huge disks in a SAN (it's
> possible to use smaller disks in the SAN) -Prove it!
>  
>  
> After reading the "Sane SAN" article and a case study
> about Volvo implementing a SAN, I believe it's possible to
> have a great Oracle/SAN implementation if it's setup
> correctly and tuned.  Other resources that you can Google
> are "Using SVA SnapShot with Oracle", "Performance
> Benchmark LSI Logic E4600 (STK D178)", "SAN Storage for
> Open Systems Environments", and of course check the
> OraFaq.
>  
> Thanks for sharing,
>  
> David Wagoner
> Oracle DBA

Sounds like you're going through an excellent evaluation
process.  I would suggest to keep in mind Anjo's advice to
also regard I/O in terms of units of throughput (i.e. read
or write rates) instead of Gbytes or Tbytes (i.e. static
capacity).  Helps clarify the discussions...

The other thing is the idea of co-mingling production and
dev/test.  Of course it is possible and quite feasible, but
if you look at things from the perspective of units of
throughput, you might find a huge disparity or conflict. 
Perhaps the most telling indicator might be reviewing
whether or not your LANs for production and dev/test are
isolated from one another -- many of the rationales for
doing so (or not doing so) might be similar to the
considerations for your SAN.

Good luck!
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re: more questions about temp.

[Ron Rogers]

list,
additional information that needs clarification.
After the Temporary tablespace fubar had been dropped the datafile
still existed on the OS level. If you have space problems be sure to
look at both your permanant and temporary tablespaces. Temporary
tablespace do NOT show up in the dba_data_files view.
Ron
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RE: Space management failures on autoextend datafiles

[Rachel Carmichael]

as i said. maybe temp segments don't cause autoextend :)

--- Ron Rogers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Let's think about this for a minute.
> You create and index called idx1 using a designated tablespace that
> has
> sufficient space to hold the complete index.
> You create a new index idx2 on the table using the same tablespace
> and
> you think that it should autoextend to hold the permanent index.
>  The system generates the index and starts placing the temporary
> index
> named something like 123.123 in the tablespace. This index is a
> temporary index until the system has completed creating the entire
> index. Then it will make the index name permanent as idx2 and use the
> space accordingly with the required extents and autoextend. Oracle
> does
> not know that the index will complete, be aborted, crash, etc so it
> can
> not make any permanent assignment to the extents( that is why it is
> called temporary) . Oracle would permanently extent tablespaces for
> each
> temporary function then the database could artificially expand when
> the
> functions were only temporary in nature and the compounded effect
> could
> cause a ripple effect. The backup size would expand, search functions
> could take longer because of the increased size, disk space would be
> wasted.
> Just a few thoughts and ideas.
> Ron
> 
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:43PM >>>
> maybe temp segments don't cause an autoextend? 
> 
> at least it's consistent
> 
> --- "Fink, Dan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Update... I tried the same test with 8.1.7 on Solaris 8. Same
> > result...
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:09 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > I just manually expanded the file and the index build finished with
> > no
> > problem. I also set the USER_DATA ts as autoextend and it extended
> > several
> > times without error. The only difference is in the fact that the
> > INDEX
> > segment is initially created as a TEMP segment. Interesting
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:34 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Dan, 
> > That's exactly, what someone described yesterday, it was LMT with
> > autoallocate, and they made sure, that there was plenty of space on
> > the hard
> > drive for TEMP file to grow.
> > The only difference: it was not Solaris - it was AIX.
> >  
> > Igor Neyman, OCP DBA
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
> >   
> >  
> >  
> > 
> > - Original Message - 
> > To: Multiple recipients of list  
> > ORACLE-L 
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:15 PM
> > 
> > Igor and Yechiel,
> > Thanks for the responses. I'm glad to hear that I am not the
> only
> > one
> > experiencing the problem. 
> > I should have also mentioned that the tablespace is LMT with
> > autoallocate and is nowhere near the max size.
> >  
> > Dan Fink
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 9:35 AM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > Hi Paulo
> >  
> > When creating an index, or CTAS, oracle use temp segments while
> > building and
> > rename them after the build finish. So if you do not have enough
> > space you
> > will get: unable to allocate TEMP segment.
> >  
> > Yechiel Adar
> > Mehish
> > 
> > - Original Message - 
> > To: Multiple recipients of list  
> > ORACLE-L 
> > Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 6:04 PM
> > 
> > never heard on this problem but are u sure table the temp
> tablespace
> > of the
> > user executing the commeand is temp and not user_indx???
> > regards
> > Paulo
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > Sent: quinta-feira, 7 de Novembro de 2002 15:39
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > 
> > 
> > I have a 9.2 database running on Solaris 8. I'm creating some test
> > tables
> > with indexes. The USER_INDX tablespace's datafile is set to
> > autoextend (as
> > are TEMP and USER_DATA). When the system attempts to create
> indexes,
> > instead
> > of auotextending the datafile (there is plenty of space on the
> > device), it
> > throws an ORA-01652: unable to extend temp segment by 128 in
> > tablespace
> > USER_INDX error. If I manually resize the datafile and rerun it, no
> > problems.
> >  
> > Anyone else heard of this behavior? I can't find anything on
> Metalink
> > that
> > fits the problem definition. 
> >  
> > Dan Fink
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> __
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> U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
> http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
> -- 
> Author: Rachel Carmichael
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
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> San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
> -

More question about TEMP

[Ron Rogers]

List, 
Sorry for the confusion.
 As the  DBA I "grant create session to rrogers" and "grant create
table to rrogers"
As rrogers I 
"create temporary tablespace fubar 
tempfile '/data4/ror.dbf 'size 10M 
extent management local uniform size 128k;"

The tablespace gets created and is visable by the DBA with
"Select * from dba_tablespaces where tablespace_name 'FUBAR';"
The datafile is NOT visable in the dba_data_files view.

As rrogers I create a table
"Create global temporary table testror(
col1  char(1000));"
 The table is visable to the DBA as
select * from dba_tables where owner ='RROGERS';
and desc rrogers.testror.

As rrogers I exit the system and the table is still visable to the DBA.
The manual  says that the "temporary tablespace"fubar is an allocation
of space that can contain schema objects for the duration of the
session" If this is so then why is the table still there.???
I think that the manual should read that the object created can contain
data only for the duration of the session Or something to the same
effect as the objects still exist after the session has ended.
Am I correct in my tests?
Ron

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Number of extents

[Thanh-truc Nguyen]

Hello,

I was very surprise when I saw what is below in the note 
100960.1 at Metalink about the number of extents. Could-you 
give me your opinion please ? 

1.4 OBJECTS WHICH DECREASE PERFORMANCE  Any object that is 
returned from the following query will decrease 
performance.  While the performance hit on over extended 
objects is not  significant, the aggregate effect on many 
over extended objects does impact performance.   
ttitle 'All segments with >20 extents belonging to SYS' 
skipclear breaks   clear computes   clear 
columnscolumn tablespace_name  format a15   column 
segment_name format a30   column segment_type 
format a8select  substr(tablespace_name,1,15) 
Tname,   segment_name,   
segment_type,   substr
(owner,1,10) "OWNER",   count
(*) "Extents",   blocks   from
sys.dba_extents   where   owner != 'SYS'   group by 
tablespace_name,   segment_name,   
segment_type,   owner,   blocks   
having count(*) >20;

Accédez au courrier électronique de La Poste : www.laposte.net ;
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RE: CPU Problem

[Stephen Lee]

> We are facing with some CPU problem (cpu 100% usage!),

To offer another point of view:

There are some queries, especially in a data warehouse, that are large
queries, that must, by the nature of the information sought, sort through
large amounts of data.  The RDBMS, in an attempt to satisfy the query  as
quickly as possible, is going to use its CPU resources to their full extent.
ANY time an Oracle query is being run, be it big or small, elegant or
trashy, it will use all the CPU that the OS will allow it to use; and the OS
will run a CPU to 100% of its capacity when there is work to be done.  Most
of the time, things come and go fast enough on a system that you don't see
those momentary 100% spikes in CPU usage.  Think about it: Why would the OS
deliberately drag its feet in getting work done?  Is this some kind of
union-made OS?

This is a explanation that I have given many times to sys admins that
expressed alarm that an Oracle process was using 100% of a CPU.  It SHOULD
to do that!

Now, if this is a database in which one should not be seeing large,
long-running queries, to quote Emily Littella: "Well, that's different!"
The decision as to whether you have a problem should not be based on some
percentage of CPU usage, but on what is "normal" usage for this particular
database.
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Oracle & SAN Experiences?

[David Wagoner]

Title: The Sys








The Sys. Admin. team wants to consolidate storage (and probably get a
new toy too) on all of our servers, so they are evaluating a SAN (LSI  Logic E4600).  The DBA team is doing some research to determine the pros
and cons of doing this, and I’d like to hear any of your experiences (good and
bad) using SAN with Oracle.

 

My understanding is that all of our database servers would remain
intact, but the attached disk storage would move into the SAN.  So, we still have the Production, Test,
and App. servers with their processors and memory, Oracle homes, etc.  The SAN will hold database files from
Production, Test, Apps., staging, ODS,data warehouse, etc.

 

Their arguments:

-the SAN is very scalable (500 GB – 40 TB)

-easy to manage disks in one central location

-fancy statistics collection on all SAN disks

-much higher throughput on the fiber SAN connections than with locally
attached disk arrays

-capable of using mixed RAID levels (0, 1, 1+0, 5, etc.)

-can partition sets of disks in the SAN for specific server access

-Snapshot backup capability is very fast in the SAN (much faster than
traditional Oracle backups)

 

DBA arguments:

-How will this affect database performance?

-What are the drawbacks, if any, with the pre-fetch of data performed by
the SAN (i.e., SAN cache)

-How tunable is the SAN

-Fast, small disks are better for performance and less wasted space than
the typical huge disks in a SAN (it’s possible to use smaller disks in the SAN)

-Prove it!

 

 

After reading the “Sane SAN” article and a case study about Volvo
implementing a SAN, I believe it’s possible to have a great Oracle/SAN
implementation if it’s setup correctly and tuned.  Other resources that you can Google are “Using SVA SnapShot
with Oracle”, “Performance Benchmark LSI Logic E4600 (STK D178)”, “SAN Storage
for Open Systems Environments”, and of course check the OraFaq.

 

Thanks for sharing,

 

David Wagoner

Oracle DBA

 

 

 

 

RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user

[Mark Leith]

Title: RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user



A 
quick note to those that downloaded a version of DBATool yesterday following on 
from my message, and to all those that have a past version as well. 

 
The 
download link on the DBATool web page hadn't been updated for the new version 
that is on the web site - shoot the webmaster (me)! Following is a link to the 
latest version of DBATool (which has added support for partitioned table DDL 
etc.), if you would like to grab the latest download, just pull it down, and 
install straight over the version you already have. You do not need to 
de-install the old version, and will not have to re-apply for a registration 
key.
 
http://www.cool-tools.co.uk/products/downloads/dbatool_install020306.exe
 
Sorry 
for my stupidity! ;)
 
Mark
 

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Markham, RichardSent: 
  07 November 2002 16:14To: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same 
  user
  well now I can say I'm spoiled.  I was given more than 
  enough information to to accomplish the task (done) 
  and a new tool to boot! =) 
  Thanks alot everyone. 
  -Original Message- From: Mark 
  Leith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] 
  Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:45 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user 
  
  And if all else fails (not that the advice already given 
  will!), we have a tool that can manipulate the DDL for 
  the users objects VERY quickly and easily, through a 
  "rule based" change (e.g. Modify  tables storage clauses within  schema to ): 
  http://www.cool-tools.co.uk/products/dbatool.html 

  It's free, have at it! 
  HTH 
  Mark 
  -Original Message- Sent: 07 
  November 2002 14:44 To: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-L 
  Extra security could be to give zero quota on other 
  tablespaces. -Original Message- 
  Sent: donderdag 7 november 2002 14:59 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  I have a full export of user to where I need to import all 
  his objects/grants but into a 
  NEW tablespace.  What's the easiest way I can assure that 
  ~everything~ is imported.  Will I need to use a 
  combination of INDEXFILE and other procedures or will 
  a full export; drop tablespace; create new tablespace; 
  alter user's default tablespace; full import suffice for all objects? Thanks for any tips. 
  -- Please see the official ORACLE-L 
  FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- 
  Author: Mark Leith   
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
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  hosting services - 
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  message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling 
  of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line 
  containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing 
  list you want to be removed from).  You may also 
  send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). 

RE: Space management failures on autoextend datafiles

[Hately, Mike (NESL-IT)]

Ron,
I don't believe all of that to be true.

In your example idx2 should be created and the tablespace should extend.
Otherwise what would be the point of having AUTOEXTEND on any tablespace
which held only indexes?
I agree that Oracle will use a temporary segment to hold the index data
until it is fully created but Oracle will extend the datafile regardless.
In fact, when I tested this at 8.1.7.3 and 9.2 even an index rebuild
extended the datfile in order to accomodate the new index.

regards,
Mike Hately

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:39 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Let's think about this for a minute.
You create and index called idx1 using a designated tablespace that has
sufficient space to hold the complete index.
You create a new index idx2 on the table using the same tablespace and
you think that it should autoextend to hold the permanent index.
 The system generates the index and starts placing the temporary index
named something like 123.123 in the tablespace. This index is a
temporary index until the system has completed creating the entire
index. Then it will make the index name permanent as idx2 and use the
space accordingly with the required extents and autoextend. Oracle does
not know that the index will complete, be aborted, crash, etc so it can
not make any permanent assignment to the extents( that is why it is
called temporary) . Oracle would permanently extent tablespaces for each
temporary function then the database could artificially expand when the
functions were only temporary in nature and the compounded effect could
cause a ripple effect. The backup size would expand, search functions
could take longer because of the increased size, disk space would be
wasted.
Just a few thoughts and ideas.
Ron

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/07/02 04:43PM >>>
maybe temp segments don't cause an autoextend? 

at least it's consistent

--- "Fink, Dan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Update... I tried the same test with 8.1.7 on Solaris 8. Same
> result...
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:09 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I just manually expanded the file and the index build finished with
> no
> problem. I also set the USER_DATA ts as autoextend and it extended
> several
> times without error. The only difference is in the fact that the
> INDEX
> segment is initially created as a TEMP segment. Interesting
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:34 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Dan, 
> That's exactly, what someone described yesterday, it was LMT with
> autoallocate, and they made sure, that there was plenty of space on
> the hard
> drive for TEMP file to grow.
> The only difference: it was not Solaris - it was AIX.
>  
> Igor Neyman, OCP DBA
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
>   
>  
>  
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:15 PM
> 
> Igor and Yechiel,
> Thanks for the responses. I'm glad to hear that I am not the
only
> one
> experiencing the problem. 
> I should have also mentioned that the tablespace is LMT with
> autoallocate and is nowhere near the max size.
>  
> Dan Fink
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 9:35 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hi Paulo
>  
> When creating an index, or CTAS, oracle use temp segments while
> building and
> rename them after the build finish. So if you do not have enough
> space you
> will get: unable to allocate TEMP segment.
>  
> Yechiel Adar
> Mehish
> 
> - Original Message - 
> To: Multiple recipients of list  
> ORACLE-L 
> Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 6:04 PM
> 
> never heard on this problem but are u sure table the temp tablespace
> of the
> user executing the commeand is temp and not user_indx???
> regards
> Paulo
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: quinta-feira, 7 de Novembro de 2002 15:39
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> I have a 9.2 database running on Solaris 8. I'm creating some test
> tables
> with indexes. The USER_INDX tablespace's datafile is set to
> autoextend (as
> are TEMP and USER_DATA). When the system attempts to create indexes,
> instead
> of auotextending the datafile (there is plenty of space on the
> device), it
> throws an ORA-01652: unable to extend temp segment by 128 in
> tablespace
> USER_INDX error. If I manually resize the datafile and rerun it, no
> problems.
>  
> Anyone else heard of this behavior? I can't find anything on
Metalink
> that
> fits the problem definition. 
>  
> Dan Fink
> 
> 


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Author: Rachel Ca

RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user

[Magaliff, Bill]

Title: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user



oh 
- I like that! thanks!

  -Original Message-From: Choudhary Rajendra (TTL_LKO) 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:38 
  AMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: RE: 
  full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same user
     if  you 
  have to import all indexes,constraints  to a single 
  tablespace then following procedure will work 
   
   4) After 
  importing data change the default tablespace to index tablespace ,ensure 
  that no other ts 
  quota (except 
  index ts)  is given to the schema . Grant sufficient quota on index 
  tablespace . 
   5) 
  do import with ignore=Y 
  ,rows=no ,indexes=y,constraints=y ,It will create indexes and constraints 
  on index ts. 
   
   6) 
  Revert back the default tablespace . 
   
     
     Rajendra  
    
  
      
  
  
-Original Message-From: Magaliff, Bill 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Thursday, November 07, 
2002 8:14 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: RE: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same 
user
Richard:
 
if 
all of the objects are going into a single tablespace, make sure that new 
user has default tablespace set properly to the new TS and that s/he has a 
proper quota on that TS (I start with UNLIMITED).  Also, make sure that 
user has a quota of ZERO on the TS from which the data was exported - 
otherwise the default import behavior will put the objects into the TS from 
which they were taken.  Then just run the import (remembering, of 
course, to take all your small rollback segments offline and leave just one 
large rollback segment on line).
 
If 
you want Indexes in a separate TS, then here's what I 
do:
 
1)    set all as listed above, but make sure the user 
has unlimited quotas on both data and index TS
2)    import data only - I use "constraints=n grants=n 
indexes=n" to insure it's only table data that gets in
3)    import again with only the indexfile option, 
which will create a sql script
4)    Edit the indexfile to remove stuff you don't 
want. . . I use macros in my text editor to remove (in this 
order):
** 
all the lines beginning with "REM  ...xRows imported" 

** 
"REM  CREATE TABLE " statements - start with that string and delete 
until the next semi-colon (end of the CREATE TABLE 
statement);
these first two are for clarity only - so that I end up with a script 
that ONLY includes what I want, not all the other stuff, even though it's 
commented out.
 
**  all remaining instances of the string "REM  " (REM 
followed by two spaces) - this you must do to get all the ALTER TABLE 
statements properly.
 
this leaves you with clean sql to just create constraints and 
indexes
 
5)    do global search/replace for the index 
tablespace name (which is enclosed in double-quotes), putting in the name of 
the TS you want.
6)    remove the line at the top that says "connect 
" - you should connect first b4 running the 
script
 
7)    save the file!
8)    run the script to create all the 
indexes
 
HTH
 
bill
 
 
 -Original 
Message-From: Markham, Richard 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Thursday, November 07, 
2002 8:59 AMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-LSubject: full exp/imp of user to new tablespace; same 
user

  I have a full export of user to where I need to import all 
  his objects/grants but into a NEW 
  tablespace.  What's the easiest way I can assure that 
  ~everything~ is imported.  Will I need to use 
  a combination of INDEXFILE and other procedures or 
  will a full export; drop tablespace; create new tablespace; alter user's default tablespace; full import suffice 
  for all objects? Thanks for any tips. 

Fw: Destination address unreachable

[Tim Gorman]

i don't believe that external tables can be indexed yet.  you've got
parallel query, though...

> - Original Message -
> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 4:23 AM
> Subject: RE: Data Purging Strategy
>
>
> > Another poor man's solution would be to unload the tables into flat
files
> and attach
> > to them as needed using Oracle's external table feature from 9i. That
> solution
> > should hold for quite a while into the future since the external table
> function is very
> > much like SQL*Loader, which is so integral to so many systems that
Oracle
> is not
> > going to think about making it 'go away'. You would still run into
> problems if there is
> > some substantive change that makes the external tables from 9i invalid,
> but that still
> > leaves you with flat files that you can load back into the DB with
> SQL*Loader.
> >
> > Chris Gait
> >
> >
> > On 6 Nov 2002 at 6:43, Conboy, Jim wrote:
> >
> > Date sent:  Wed, 06 Nov 2002 06:43:38 -0800
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L  > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Send reply to:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Organization:   Fat City Network Services, San Diego, California
> >
> > > A poor man's solution might be to load the offline database with
> appropriate data, then do a tablespace export and store the results on CD
> labelled by date.  Restoring needed data would entail a tablespace import
of
> stuff from the appropriate CD into the offline DB.  I'm sure here's some
> > gotchas involved but some variation on that theme might work.
> > >
> > > Jim
> > >
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 8:49 AM
> > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > >
> > >
> > > This is a data-archival requirement, not a data-purge requirement.  It
> only resembles a purge requirement based on the
multiple-database-migration
> strategy you outlined.  There are alternatives...
> > >
> > > Depending on the volume of data in your database and your availability
> requirements, implementing table- and index-partitioning will likely be
> crucial.  One strategy is to have the most-active tables partitioned by a
> date column and have different sets of these partitions reside in
> time-variant
> > tablespaces.  With this arrangement, you can archive data to tape by
> simply setting the archived tablespaces to READ ONLY and then migrating
them
> to tape-based (instead of disk-based) file-systems and bringing them back
> online.  Legato has this file-system technology (recently purchased) and
> > there is a share-ware product called SAMFS which is an HSM (hierarchical
> storage mgmt) filesystem used by some vendors (i.e. StorageTek, etc).  By
> setting tablespaces to READ ONLY it becomes very easy to move them from
disk
> to tape while retaining them within the same original database,
> > simplifying the task of later retrieval (which is really important).
> > >
> > > Of course, Oracle's partitioning option is enormously expensive, but
in
> this case it is a matter of the upfront license costs (with reduced
> downstream implementation costs due to simplicity) versus a large
downstream
> application-development cost.  In this situation, I think roughly offsets
> > everything.  Since I'm not spending the money, I can afford such a
> calculation...  :-)
> > >
> > > With the various storage technologies available, a single database can
> straddle several simultaneously, optimizing performance or cost as needed.
> Some files might reside on solid-state NVRAM "disk", some on SAN-based
disk,
> some on NAS-based storage, and then finally reside in archive media
> > file-systems such as tape or magneto-optical based HSM file-systems.
> > >
> > > - Original Message -
> > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
> > > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 2:13 AM
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear List,
> > >
> > > I need some inputs from you all regarding purging data from the
> database.
> > >
> > > This is the requirement
> > >
> > >
> > > We define a retention period for all the data in the system.
> > > When the retention period is reached,  the data should be deleted, but
> then at a later time, some user might request for this purged data. So it
> must be possible to retrieve this data.
> > >
> > > This is the strategy we have designed for this.
> > >
> > > When the retention period is reached, move the data from the main
> database to an offline database. Then delete the data from the main
> database.
> > >
> > > In the offline database, we cannot again keep it from long, so it has
to
> moved to tapes. Now my question, how can we move this data to tapes and at
> the same time retrieve data from the tapes based on dates.
> > > i.e, the user will ask for the data on a particular date, so it must
be
> possible to retrieve data from the tapes based on a date and load it to
the
> database tables.
> > >
> > > Regard