[osdcmy-public] What we should do
This, my friends, is what we should do: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2009/10/26.html Azrul Sensei --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
World class programmers? Its a myth, there is no such thing. The moment programmers become world class, they are promoted to management , replace their compilers with powerpoint and instead of debugging they are now doing *gulp* sales :)) On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 2:52 PM, rafe azsnal azs...@gmail.com wrote: Ladies, I'm looking for a base line for world class develop looking at what boh said yes I do agreed. We are looking to develop a world class developer and we want to know how do you define someone to be it. What are the baseline?? rafe Send from my HTC Android On Nov 19, 2009 2:47 PM, Raja Iskandar Shah rajaiskand...@gmail.com wrote: boh, rafe was addressing it to the ladies. that's why i did not respond at first. as a person who is responsible for employing people including ladies, this is what i look for among fresh graduates: 1. academic cgpa 3.0 (not for intellect but for the sheer discipline to get the assignments, exams, project work done) 2. project work (not looking for the most brilliant stuff but for the intelligence to select the project, the tools, development and implementation) 3. oss community (for communication and collaboration skills) i also like multi-disciplinary people. the most recent recruit is an enviromental science graduate who took up programming for the love of it. On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Boh Yap bhy...@gmail.com wrote: hi rafe, Its not I ... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: What we should do
i would be looking for a pedantic system to watch goats mate and grass grow ;-) . matched with a few cameras, it would make for a must-have for discovery channel and national geographic enthusiasts On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 4:10 PM, Azrul Hasni MADISA azrulha...@gmail.comwrote: This, my friends, is what we should do: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2009/10/26.html Azrul Sensei --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
Google suggest me this: http://discuss.fogcreek.com/joelonsoftware/default.asp?cmd=showixPost=33890 -- Best Wishes, ApOgEE a.k.a JeRuNgKuN https://edge.launchpad.net/~apogee - ApOgEE on LaunchPad http://artofapogee.blogspot.com - Art Of ApOgEE http://coderstalk.blogspot.com - Coder's Talk --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
rafe azsnal wrote: Ladies, How would you define a world class developer?? What would be the standard and guidelines?? If so we were to produce what should we look at?? rafe Someone who gets to fly business class together with a world class project leader?: MUHAMMADSYAZWAN/BINMDKHUSAINIM 22NOV KUL BKK ELECTRONIC TICKET nbs p; PASSENGER ITINERARY RECEIPT PAN AIR TRAVEL SERVICE DATE: 17 NOVEMBER 2009 /93 BAAN KLANGMUANG AGENT: 1960 RATCHADA-LADPRAO RD.JANKAS NAME: MUHAMMADSYAZWAN/BINMDKHUSAINIM JATUJAK,BANGKOK 10900 IATA : 353 03542 TELEPHONE: 66 2 938 1444 ISSUING AIRLINE : MALAYSIA AIRLINES TICKET NUMBER : ETKT 232 3830708988 BOOKING REF : AMADEUS: ZV3RJH, AIRLINE: MH/L77VW FROM /TO FLIGHT CL DATE DEP FARE BASIS NVB NVA BAG ST KUALA LUMPUR MH 782 B 22NOV 1515 BST6MMY 22MAY 20K OK TERMINAL:M BKK SUVARNABHUM ARRIVAL TIME: 1620 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
wow...selamat jalan bro.. =) Hasanuddin Abu Bakar --- Ubuntu embedded developer/tester https://wiki.ubuntu.com/bizkut Get FireGPG for your Firefox! http://getfiregpg.org PGP Public Key http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0xC5A1B11965D43C5C On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 8:03 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: rafe azsnal wrote: Ladies, How would you define a world class developer?? What would be the standard and guidelines?? If so we were to produce what should we look at?? rafe Someone who gets to fly business class together with a world class project leader?: MUHAMMADSYAZWAN/BINMDKHUSAINIM 22NOV KUL BKK ELECTRONIC TICKET nbs p; PASSENGER ITINERARY RECEIPT PAN AIR TRAVEL SERVICE DATE: 17 NOVEMBER 2009 /93 BAAN KLANGMUANG AGENT: 1960 RATCHADA-LADPRAO RD.JANKAS NAME: MUHAMMADSYAZWAN/BINMDKHUSAINIM JATUJAK,BANGKOK 10900 IATA : 353 03542 TELEPHONE: 66 2 938 1444 ISSUING AIRLINE : MALAYSIA AIRLINES TICKET NUMBER : ETKT 232 3830708988 BOOKING REF : AMADEUS: ZV3RJH, AIRLINE: MH/L77VW FROM /TO FLIGHT CL DATE DEP FARE BASIS NVB NVA BAG ST KUALA LUMPUR MH 782 B 22NOV 1515 BST6MMY 22MAY 20K OK TERMINAL:M BKK SUVARNABHUM ARRIVAL TIME: 1620 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
Is this how we Malaysian measure??? So those people that we brought in flying economy is not world class developer?? 50 international speakers for osconf 09 is not top of their field?? Just because they fly economy?? This is how we measure?? Sad to see.. rafe Send from my HTC Android On Nov 19, 2009 8:21 PM, Hasanuddin Abu Bakar bizkut...@gmail.com wrote: business class == business developer == worldclass developer ? Hasanuddin Abu Bakar --- Ubuntu embedded developer/tester https://wik... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 8:16 PM, rafe azsnal azs...@gmail.com wrote: What business class got to ... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
Flying in and out of a country to pitch is usually done by many personalities who are putting themselves as world-class. Otherwise you can stay and bitch like some guy with a goat in a farm, as no one will think about asking you to sit on any world-class advisory panel. rafe azsnal wrote: Is this how we Malaysian measure??? So those people that we brought in flying economy is not world class developer?? 50 international speakers for osconf 09 is not top of their field?? Just because they fly economy?? This is how we measure?? Sad to see.. rafe --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
i wud agree with boh - someone recognised by their peers. if i heard so much of good things about someone, coming out from everyone, i'd be interested to know the person rgrds Nuhaa All Bakry / cawanpink http://cawanpink.net http://fosschix.my On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 9:03 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: Flying in and out of a country to pitch is usually done by many personalities who are putting themselves as world-class. Otherwise you can stay and bitch like some guy with a goat in a farm, as no one will think about asking you to sit on any world-class advisory panel. rafe azsnal wrote: Is this how we Malaysian measure??? So those people that we brought in flying economy is not world class developer?? 50 international speakers for osconf 09 is not top of their field?? Just because they fly economy?? This is how we measure?? Sad to see.. rafe --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
What r we arguing here? Simply d concept of the criteria of what an open source developer is!! As simple as that. I'm looking for a guidelines which I can follow and determine what sort of help should be given to those individual. The man with the goat can bitch all you want and I'll definitely put it as one of the guidelines. Living proof of a world developer :) right? rafe Send from my HTC Android On Nov 19, 2009 9:32 PM, nuhaa cawan.nu...@gmail.com wrote: i wud agree with boh - someone recognised by their peers. if i heard so much of good things about someone, coming out from everyone, i'd be interested to know the person rgrds Nuhaa All Bakry / cawanpink http://cawanpink.net http://fosschix.my On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 9:03 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: Flying in and out of a country to pitch is usually done by many personalities who are puttin... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia ht... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
Say la 'open source developer'... big diff with 'non-open' one. Also why put such a term 'developer', instead of 'leader'? Why aim low when you can aim much higher? -- ok, ok lets stop bitching and continue the picthing... According to that man with the borrowed goat, it is: 1. S/he has to be an expert in a field that is niche. 2. S/he is known by a worldwide community as a top contributor. 3. S/he has global social engineering skills. 4. The contribution and expertise need not be purely technical. Let us look at some examples: a. Jimmy Wales, is not known as a wikimedia developer at all but famous as the man who recognised the power of it to bring wikipedia to its present unassailable form. b. Linus Torvalds just started with a questionable kernel for the knack of kicking a few professors' butts and took over the GehNuu domain and mindshare by not giving a damn if the others can show a degree. c. Richard Stallman, who coded a minimalist Emacs but is the spokesperson for freedom in software. In a way Dr. M is one such leader too. He recognises world class ideas when he sees one. But let's say you call the bluff of the goatman and say, Ok, show me how to produce more of such leaders? Well, in the http://red1.org/MSC8.pdf is one such scheme to nurture more. From there you take a fairly good developer (in one case i dare take Azrul or Boh or Raja Iskandar) and allow them to go wild on the canvass. Key is (a) to maintain the spirit as open and not close whenever they smell money. Otherwise you end up with another world class kiasu bitch who just take in some millions and live it up in California Bay. Come to think of it why not the goatman do that? Can replace the goats with real bitchy babes. Back to our 1Malaysia gang. You can see that Azrul/Boh/Raja has (b) worldclass ideas. That is really crucial. Do they dare to dream up ideas that challenge the status quo? Or are they just lebih kurang 2 X 5 dan jangan kacau jiran pulau sana? C'mon, 'world class' is a big word. You do not mean 'middle class' do you? Or 'lower class' or regional class? World means world lah. Kalahkan semua yang ada kat dunia ini. Don't care if its German, Russian, Chinese, Indian or Latino, you are one that the whole world look up to and bitch against instead. Now their ideas need (c) support if you want to be part of the building process. Otherwise leave them be by luck they may become world level like the goatman again. But then, you end up with more bitching ones who either migrate or keep pitching non-stop. Ideas are contagious. Don't ever introduce one if you want a un-eventful life. Actually the beauty of this idea is that you do not need millions of bucks to pitch it. Just pay Azrul/Boh/Raja and goatman all in less than RM50k per month and do not disturb them for a whole year. If they do not launch something of world class every quarter, then i will permanently stop bitching. Game? rafe azsnal wrote: What r we arguing here? Simply d concept of the criteria of what an open source developer is!! As simple as that. I'm looking for a guidelines which I can follow and determine what sort of help should be given to those individual. The man with the goat can bitch all you want and I'll definitely put it as one of the guidelines. Living proof of a world developer :) right? rafe --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
ermm.. like the idea of getting the bitching stop. :) anyway back to the original question.. i like the guideline given here and YES world mean WORLD. this is not simply just empty talk we really want to build those people one way or another. will translate this to management paper. let wait and see what would be the decision. anyway who going to lead this if so the we get the green light. we need to channel it to somewhere and that somewhere cannot be individual. //rafe On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 10:40 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: Say la 'open source developer'... big diff with 'non-open' one. Also why put such a term 'developer', instead of 'leader'? Why aim low when you can aim much higher? -- ok, ok lets stop bitching and continue the picthing... According to that man with the borrowed goat, it is: 1. S/he has to be an expert in a field that is niche. 2. S/he is known by a worldwide community as a top contributor. 3. S/he has global social engineering skills. 4. The contribution and expertise need not be purely technical. Let us look at some examples: a. Jimmy Wales, is not known as a wikimedia developer at all but famous as the man who recognised the power of it to bring wikipedia to its present unassailable form. b. Linus Torvalds just started with a questionable kernel for the knack of kicking a few professors' butts and took over the GehNuu domain and mindshare by not giving a damn if the others can show a degree. c. Richard Stallman, who coded a minimalist Emacs but is the spokesperson for freedom in software. In a way Dr. M is one such leader too. He recognises world class ideas when he sees one. But let's say you call the bluff of the goatman and say, Ok, show me how to produce more of such leaders? Well, in the http://red1.org/MSC8.pdf is one such scheme to nurture more. From there you take a fairly good developer (in one case i dare take Azrul or Boh or Raja Iskandar) and allow them to go wild on the canvass. Key is (a) to maintain the spirit as open and not close whenever they smell money. Otherwise you end up with another world class kiasu bitch who just take in some millions and live it up in California Bay. Come to think of it why not the goatman do that? Can replace the goats with real bitchy babes. Back to our 1Malaysia gang. You can see that Azrul/Boh/Raja has (b) worldclass ideas. That is really crucial. Do they dare to dream up ideas that challenge the status quo? Or are they just lebih kurang 2 X 5 dan jangan kacau jiran pulau sana? C'mon, 'world class' is a big word. You do not mean 'middle class' do you? Or 'lower class' or regional class? World means world lah. Kalahkan semua yang ada kat dunia ini. Don't care if its German, Russian, Chinese, Indian or Latino, you are one that the whole world look up to and bitch against instead. Now their ideas need (c) support if you want to be part of the building process. Otherwise leave them be by luck they may become world level like the goatman again. But then, you end up with more bitching ones who either migrate or keep pitching non-stop. Ideas are contagious. Don't ever introduce one if you want a un-eventful life. Actually the beauty of this idea is that you do not need millions of bucks to pitch it. Just pay Azrul/Boh/Raja and goatman all in less than RM50k per month and do not disturb them for a whole year. If they do not launch something of world class every quarter, then i will permanently stop bitching. Game? rafe azsnal wrote: What r we arguing here? Simply d concept of the criteria of what an open source developer is!! As simple as that. I'm looking for a guidelines which I can follow and determine what sort of help should be given to those individual. The man with the goat can bitch all you want and I'll definitely put it as one of the guidelines. Living proof of a world developer :) right? rafe --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
well, let's practice what we pitch. Since we want community, well, here is one right here. This community has really good people all around. Don't tell me not enough? In fact if you want them to get started to show something on the big screen come June for MSCOSCONF: 1. Sphinx voice recognition integration to ERP (can ask Nuhaa to present using a SIP phone connected to asterisk to call up the sales orders and shipment info purely with her voice.) 2. Google Earth KVM representation of logistics info from the ERP. As you browse the earth, your business info appears as icons and graphix with widgets that blow up when mouseover for you to select Warehouse locators, shipment lines, invoice documents and related accounts postings. All above ERP events can push to clients' sms or post to their Facebook apps for intranet activity within the customer domains. E1 can be the MC.. he is bigger than Steve Jobs. rafe azsnal wrote: ermm.. like the idea of getting the bitching stop. :) anyway back to the original question.. i like the guideline given here and YES world mean WORLD. this is not simply just empty talk we really want to build those people one way or another. will translate this to management paper. let wait and see what would be the decision. anyway who going to lead this if so the we get the green light. we need to channel it to somewhere and that somewhere cannot be individual. //rafe --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
rafe azsnal wrote: ok let build the business case. community lead project. damn.. does that 'business' word makes me bitch, i mean pitch more: The business case is that if you have the whole attention on Malaysia on that day via YouTube, and Forbes magazine wires carrying big words such as Malaysia leads the way with killer ERP addons to ADempiere, an audacious Malaysian led open source project that is making waves in cyberspace., the world will pay attention and get their imagination run wild with ideas of commercialising with services built around such technology stack. British Telecoms might want it. Contribute it now, or else someone somewhere else in India might read this and beat us to it. :) red1 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
let do that part... u worried about the project. deal?? feed me with info. i can have it done on the plane... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:14 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: rafe azsnal wrote: ok let build the business case. community lead project. damn.. does that 'business' word makes me bitch, i mean pitch more: The business case is that if you have the whole attention on Malaysia on that day via YouTube, and Forbes magazine wires carrying big words such as Malaysia leads the way with killer ERP addons to ADempiere, an audacious Malaysian led open source project that is making waves in cyberspace., the world will pay attention and get their imagination run wild with ideas of commercialising with services built around such technology stack. British Telecoms might want it. Contribute it now, or else someone somewhere else in India might read this and beat us to it. :) red1 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
sorry.. let me do that part business case... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:16 PM, rafe azsnal azs...@gmail.com wrote: let do that part... u worried about the project. deal?? feed me with info. i can have it done on the plane... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:14 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: rafe azsnal wrote: ok let build the business case. community lead project. damn.. does that 'business' word makes me bitch, i mean pitch more: The business case is that if you have the whole attention on Malaysia on that day via YouTube, and Forbes magazine wires carrying big words such as Malaysia leads the way with killer ERP addons to ADempiere, an audacious Malaysian led open source project that is making waves in cyberspace., the world will pay attention and get their imagination run wild with ideas of commercialising with services built around such technology stack. British Telecoms might want it. Contribute it now, or else someone somewhere else in India might read this and beat us to it. :) red1 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
btw red1... if i have a choice i would rather showcase to the world the capability of the local rather than the international. osconf or not i want something that we truly own and proud off. i want that mat saleh cry with blood. :) On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:17 PM, rafe azsnal azs...@gmail.com wrote: sorry.. let me do that part business case... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:16 PM, rafe azsnal azs...@gmail.com wrote: let do that part... u worried about the project. deal?? feed me with info. i can have it done on the plane... On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 11:14 PM, red1 r...@red1.org wrote: rafe azsnal wrote: ok let build the business case. community lead project. damn.. does that 'business' word makes me bitch, i mean pitch more: The business case is that if you have the whole attention on Malaysia on that day via YouTube, and Forbes magazine wires carrying big words such as Malaysia leads the way with killer ERP addons to ADempiere, an audacious Malaysian led open source project that is making waves in cyberspace., the world will pay attention and get their imagination run wild with ideas of commercialising with services built around such technology stack. British Telecoms might want it. Contribute it now, or else someone somewhere else in India might read this and beat us to it. :) red1 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] mygosscon 2009 : 24 webdev champion : meetme is now wheneva.com
pls be informed that meetme application by bitfluent which won the recent 24hr webdev competition during mygosscon is now available for free registration at wheneva.com i think they are deserved winners and the judges made a very good choice. their approach to the task for setting an appointment is very appealing and made it simple compared to the others who indulged in form filling and workflows. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: mygosscon 2009 : 24 webdev champion : meetme is now wheneva.com
pls be informed that meetme application by bitfluent which won the recent 24hr webdev competition during mygosscon is now available for free registration at wheneva.com Thanks for mentioning the app. You beat me to the punch. I was going to announce it here, but work got in the way. i think they are deserved winners and the judges made a very good choice. their approach to the task for setting an appointment is very appealing and made it simple compared to the others who indulged in form filling and workflows. Thanks! The team is very much into consumer internet apps, not much enterprisey/intranet type of apps. We took four hours at the beginning just planning the flows via paper mockups and putting thought how we can simplify it. The code is hosted on http://github.com/bitfluent/wheneva .. I've fixed some issues since the competition, but there are more stuff as can be seen in the issue tracker: http://github.com/bitfluent/wheneva/issues If you do check out the app, note that it uses a particularly advanced plugin called Inherited Resources which assumes you are very familiar with Rail's REST implementation. If you check out app/controllers/*.rb, there's not much code at all as the plugin takes care of a lot of the Rail's REST boilerplate. I do plan to revive Malaysia.rb activities and plan a monthly meetup to hack on Wheneva. I'm currently hosting it for free* at http://heroku.com, so please do contribute and I'll push it to wheneva.com -- Kamal Fariz http://bitfluent.com Mobile: +60123099143 Twitter: kamal * still need to pay $5 for wildcard dns support --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[osdcmy-public] Re: [osdcmy] Re: World class developers
Rafe all, (I drafted this last nite, but my Internet connection was down (curse streamyx) and only posted this around noon today... agree with Raja, cultivating world-class developers, is like cultivating other world-class artisans/scientists... notice those that 'made it' were not cultivated locally, they made it on their own, overseas! (Jimmy Choo, Michelle Yeoh ... included). Perhaps that's some thing to be said of a free competitive environ vs a coddled and protective one! As IT geeks, we have the advantage of not leaving home ground, but still compete internationally!) Is yr concern 'only' with World Class Developers? What about the rest of the ecosystem? I think just focussing on this may not be sufficient, you have to take a more holistic approach, create the eco-system. Using the real life biological example, if you introduce some top-predators (say lions) into an ecosystem, and the rest of the ecosystem has not been upgraded, they will do well initially, until they run out of prey, and because the ecosystem is not SUSTAINABLE; ie:cannot produce more prey, they will eventually die out. Same with top-developers, they cannot work alone. Yes you can have super programmers that can come out with products working alone, but after that they either get bored or burnt out, so who supports the product? Especially if their are no 2nd tier programmers who can step up to maintain the project and be groomed to be leaders themselves. Also can we have world class developers without a world-class project? The 2 go hand in hand. Or whats the point of world class developer working on a low-class project? A world class developer may not be a visionary, or be an accidental one. Case in point being Linus Torvalds or Tim Berners Lee. They didn't start out to develop a product to change the world. Others saw the brilliance of their product or its potential and continued contributing to get it there. But the contributors came from all over the world. Sure Msia can initiate some world class project, but to try keep it Malaysian is silly! You want to tap brainpower wherever it is available, that's Open Source. Also I think Msia has a miserable record of grooming/cuktivating 'World Class 'somebody/something'. After they've 'made it', after spending a far bit of taxpayer's money, they just fade away... I quote 2 projects as example, a few M$ was spent to put a Malaysian on Everest, and even more M$ was spent for a Msian to sail around the world. What happened to these 'World Class' persons? They have faded into obscurity and haven't achieved much since then... (I was indirectly involved with Everest Proj. so I know what I'm talking about...) So all this 'rah rah Malaysia Boleh' is just a feel good for a while phenomena, is just not sustainable, and soon people forget about it until the next hot Malaysia Boleh ___(fill in the blank) campaign gets underway. Its just a flash in the pan, and it sucks. Rather I'd argue for devloping a good pool of decent devlopers, guys/gals with the correct attitude, aptitude and skills. Then from this pool of talent, some World Class developer may arise. Its the same when grooming atheletes, you don't just focus on a just 1 or 2 guys, you talent scout and select a team, then you train and groom them, and create an environment where they have to compete and improve. The the really good ones will rise to the top, and you will have your best. Perhaps we should do this, the talent scouting is important, to make sure you start with the right raw materials. GOT AN IDEA!, make this into a REALITY-SHOW, something like Donald Trump's 'Apprentice'. Instead here you are developing World Class 'Hackers', giving them an opportunity to realise their dream, and building it into a viable sustainable business! I'm more than willing to sit on the advisory committee, and sure so would the others like Red! et al... We need to create the environment and the culture to nurture World Class developers. The environment should be a lot more entrepreneurial, and the entrepreneurs should also be a lot more serious and hands-on, especially on the technology aspects. And stop stifling them by asking them to fill in 20 pgs of forms (for pre-seed, c'mon ...), But those are the accountants' requirements, you say! So get the accountants and lawyers out of the picture. My take on this is these 2 professions are by definition tradition VERY SHY OF RISK (KIASU) and they have little place to play, (they) tend to dissuade rather than encourage talented young ppl to take risks challenges! (makes more sense if they come in after preseed...) To minimise the cost of risks to MDEC et al, as someone has mentioned in another Post, set the quantum smaller and the time constraint shorter. I believe they (Azrul?) said, 50k, 3 months (for 2-3 ppl2), and if you deliver a proof of concept (POC) then get further funding. 3 mths is enough to deliver POC for sure... otherwise they are not qualified... Of course the the
[osdcmy-public] Re: World class developers
So now... you want blood? Are you sure? Can you repeat that? You have no idea what blood i can give you. ADempiere codebase is 3.1 million lines. Mostly are copyright Mat Sallehs and now growing number of Heng Sin, our Malaysian worldclass developer. But there are still much more lines. Each Java class is about 100 lines. So let's say we justify a business, oops, i mean world bashing case of converting those foreign copyrighted ones to Malaysians such as Azrul, we can start allotting in batches to get this Made In Malaysia copyright notice. First batch - 100 java classes of 100 lines = 10,000 lines X RM5 = RM50,000 of better quality code such as using Hibernate ORM and Rules Engine. If want a slow paper then X 10 batches again for 1,000 java classes of Made in Malaysia = RM500,000. Raja can forward his battleship company for the first war of branding our Malaysian name further. Are you really sure? rafe azsnal wrote: btw red1... if i have a choice i would rather showcase to the world the capability of the local rather than the international. osconf or not i want something that we truly own and proud off. i want that mat saleh cry with blood. :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Join Open Source Developers Club Malaysia http://www.osdc.my/ Facebook Fan page http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=98685301577 http://www.facebook.com/OSDC.my You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups OSDC.my Mailing List group. To post to this group, send email to osdcmy-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to osdcmy-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/osdcmy-list?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
