Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Tony McGee 

  
  
Seconded - we still support a really old Windows Mobile apps that
requires Visual Studio 2003, database projects that need to support
both SQL Server Reporting Services 2005 and 2008 incompatible
versions of RDL and report viewer controls, and some ASP.NET 4/.NET
4 web projects that require VS2010.
I reckon our case of having to install up to four different versions
of Visual Studio side by side is not that uncommon. It's maddening
having to fight against the VS project upgrade wizard that always
seems to be waiting in ambush.


On 24/02/2012 6:24 PM, Nick Randolph wrote:

  
  
  
  
  
Oh
the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for
a while and watch what happens in the real world. Even some
dev shops are stuck on VS2008 in the same way as some
enterprises are on WinXP.
 

 If you do anything related to the old Windows
Mobile platform, for example, you have to use VS2008 – and
no, there are some cases where we can’t just build a Windows
Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us when killing
Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of
business applications that require peripherals and/or
ruggedized devices L

 

  Nick
Randolph
  |
  Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP – Windows
  Phone Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The
  information contained in this email is confidential. If
  you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose
  or use the information in this email in any way. Built to
  Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any
  emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed
  are the author's own and may not reflect the views or
  opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

 

  
From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of
David Kean
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 3:58 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are
your thoughts?
  

 
Thanks for the feedback. On the three different
versions things, why are you using three? What you building
that still requires 2005/2008?
 
From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
On Behalf Of mike smith
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:35 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your
thoughts?
 
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at
4:15 PM, David Kean 
wrote:
> We showed off the new look today: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/visualstudio/
>
>  
>
> Thoughts?

I agree, somewhat, about the colour, but feel you've gone
too far towards monochrome.  And if you make me learn a new
set of damned icons, I won't use the bloody thing.  This is
one thing I wish Microsoft would stop tinkering with.
 Icons, menu layouts, dialog layouts.   Some of us don't
move on completely from one version to another, but use 3
different versions of VS.  Do you have any idea how painful
this is? 

 

   


  Take the
  comment/uncomment icons. WTF are they meant to represent?


   


  


   


  
  
  -- 
  Meski
  
   http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
  
  "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for
  sex. Sure, you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" -
  Adam Hills

RE: Clouding an application

2012-02-24 Thread Rob Andrew 
Ken,

 

Sorry yes the original point of my email was that we are investigating cloud 
providers and was wondering whether anyone had any experiences/thoughts about 
best options here. The current application is asp.net/sql server (if that has 
any bearing on cloud provider decisions). 

 

Rob

 

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Ken Schaefer
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 9:31 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: Clouding an application

 

I’d ask for some more detail.

 

5000 users/day could be as little as 104 concurrent sessions (5000/24 hours @ 
30 minutes/session), or as high as 625 concurrent sessions (5000/8 hours @ 60 
minutes/session. Or it be even higher if that 5000 users all comes in during a 
single 1 hour period.

 

300 records a session – this is reading 300 records? Or inserting 300 records? 
How much data in each of these records? Reading 300 records in a 30 minute 
session doesn’t seem like much (but I suppose it depends what a record means)

 

How many concurrent requests are you seeing? Or requests/second? If a session 
is only a single page request that’s very different to a session comprising 
1000 page requests.

 

When you are seeing peak load, what resource usage increases are you seeing? 
Where do you think your bottleneck will be? CPU? Memory? Network bandwidth? 
Disk I/O? etc

 

Would one of the cloud providers (Amazon etc) be of use?

 

Cheers

Ken

 

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Rob Andrew
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 6:07 PM
To: 'ozDotNet'
Subject: RE: Clouding an application

 

David,

 

Sure – the target numbers are currently just modelling numbers, as we have an 
existing application that supports about 5 thousand users at peak times. 
Running this on a standard web hosting plan is fine at the moment, but we are 
starting to see user numbers peak during certain times of the month. So we 
normally go from about 100 individual users per day to just over 5 thousand per 
day over the course of a month. Sessions last for about 30-60 min each. 

 

Data wise we are relatively heavy with each user generating about 300 or so 
records per session. 

 

We’re looking to take it to O/S markets and the hope is that the number will 
expand at least several fold so we are looking for scalability options that 
scale with our requirements (rather than buying 5 servers say and using them 5% 
of the time). 

 

Rob

 

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of David Connors
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 7:50 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: Clouding an application

 

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Rob Andrew  wrote:

* High numbers of adhoc/recurrent users

* Highly variable number of users per period

* Relatively high data requirements per user

* "Peaky" usage profile for users (application is used for a day a week, but 
often in bursts by groups of users)

etc

 

Can you put some numbers around this? What is your actual peak load? Can you 
tell us something about the complexity of the data access? 

 

 

-- 

David Connors |   da...@codify.com |  
 www.codify.com

Codify Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 417 189 
363
V-Card:   
https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors
Address Info:   https://www.codify.com/contact

RE: Clouding an application

2012-02-24 Thread Ken Schaefer 
I’d ask for some more detail.

5000 users/day could be as little as 104 concurrent sessions (5000/24 hours @ 
30 minutes/session), or as high as 625 concurrent sessions (5000/8 hours @ 60 
minutes/session. Or it be even higher if that 5000 users all comes in during a 
single 1 hour period.

300 records a session – this is reading 300 records? Or inserting 300 records? 
How much data in each of these records? Reading 300 records in a 30 minute 
session doesn’t seem like much (but I suppose it depends what a record means)

How many concurrent requests are you seeing? Or requests/second? If a session 
is only a single page request that’s very different to a session comprising 
1000 page requests.

When you are seeing peak load, what resource usage increases are you seeing? 
Where do you think your bottleneck will be? CPU? Memory? Network bandwidth? 
Disk I/O? etc

Would one of the cloud providers (Amazon etc) be of use?

Cheers
Ken

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Rob Andrew
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 6:07 PM
To: 'ozDotNet'
Subject: RE: Clouding an application

David,

Sure – the target numbers are currently just modelling numbers, as we have an 
existing application that supports about 5 thousand users at peak times. 
Running this on a standard web hosting plan is fine at the moment, but we are 
starting to see user numbers peak during certain times of the month. So we 
normally go from about 100 individual users per day to just over 5 thousand per 
day over the course of a month. Sessions last for about 30-60 min each.

Data wise we are relatively heavy with each user generating about 300 or so 
records per session.

We’re looking to take it to O/S markets and the hope is that the number will 
expand at least several fold so we are looking for scalability options that 
scale with our requirements (rather than buying 5 servers say and using them 5% 
of the time).

Rob

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of David Connors
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 7:50 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: Clouding an application

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Rob Andrew 
mailto:rand...@voyageconnect.com>> wrote:
* High numbers of adhoc/recurrent users
* Highly variable number of users per period
* Relatively high data requirements per user
* "Peaky" usage profile for users (application is used for a day a week, but 
often in bursts by groups of users)
etc

Can you put some numbers around this? What is your actual peak load? Can you 
tell us something about the complexity of the data access?


--
David Connors | da...@codify.com | 
www.codify.com
Codify Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 417 189 
363
V-Card: https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors
Address Info: https://www.codify.com/contact

RE: Clouding an application

2012-02-24 Thread Rob Andrew 
David,

 

Sure – the target numbers are currently just modelling numbers, as we have an 
existing application that supports about 5 thousand users at peak times. 
Running this on a standard web hosting plan is fine at the moment, but we are 
starting to see user numbers peak during certain times of the month. So we 
normally go from about 100 individual users per day to just over 5 thousand per 
day over the course of a month. Sessions last for about 30-60 min each. 

 

Data wise we are relatively heavy with each user generating about 300 or so 
records per session. 

 

We’re looking to take it to O/S markets and the hope is that the number will 
expand at least several fold so we are looking for scalability options that 
scale with our requirements (rather than buying 5 servers say and using them 5% 
of the time). 

 

Rob

 

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of David Connors
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 7:50 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: Clouding an application

 

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Rob Andrew  wrote:

* High numbers of adhoc/recurrent users

* Highly variable number of users per period

* Relatively high data requirements per user

* "Peaky" usage profile for users (application is used for a day a week, but 
often in bursts by groups of users)

etc

 

Can you put some numbers around this? What is your actual peak load? Can you 
tell us something about the complexity of the data access? 

 

 

-- 

David Connors |   da...@codify.com |  
 www.codify.com

Codify Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 417 189 
363
V-Card:   
https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors
Address Info:   https://www.codify.com/contact

Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread David Connors 
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Joseph Cooney wrote:

> I'm disappointed that MS went after this instead of making an editor that
> can open a moderately large text file without halting for a few minutes.
>

Or how about fixing fundamentals like this:

error  : The Web Application Project  is configured to use IIS. To
access local IIS Web sites, you must run Visual Studio in the context of an
administrator account.

WTF. Glad to see reduced colour focuses us on content - meanwhile the IDE
focuses us on insanely bad development practices.

-- 
*David Connors* | da...@codify.com | www.codify.com
Codify Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 417
189 363
V-Card: https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors
Address Info: https://www.codify.com/contact

RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread David Kean 
Yep, fair call. :)

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Nick Randolph
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 12:46 AM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Ah you know I think that David just pushed the wrong button - the MS mobile dev 
community is still a little sore from the beating we took on that one.

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP - Windows Phone 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of Ian Thomas
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 6:39 PM
To: 'ozDotNet'
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Nick - I didn't think that needed explaining!



Ian Thomas
Victoria Park, Western Australia


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of Nick Randolph
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 4:24 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Oh the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for a while and 
watch what happens in the real world. Even some dev shops are stuck on VS2008 
in the same way as some enterprises are on WinXP.

 If you do anything related to the old Windows Mobile platform, for 
example, you have to use VS2008 - and no, there are some cases where we can't 
just build a Windows Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us when 
killing Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of business 
applications that require peripherals and/or ruggedized devices :( 

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP - Windows Phone 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

Re: Clouding an application

2012-02-24 Thread David Connors 
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Rob Andrew wrote:

> * High numbers of adhoc/recurrent users
> * Highly variable number of users per period
> * Relatively high data requirements per user
> * "Peaky" usage profile for users (application is used for a day a week,
> but often in bursts by groups of users)
> etc
>

Can you put some numbers around this? What is your actual peak load? Can
you tell us something about the complexity of the data access?


-- 
*David Connors* | da...@codify.com | www.codify.com
Codify Pty Ltd
Phone: +61 (7) 3210 6268 | Facsimile: +61 (7) 3210 6269 | Mobile: +61 417
189 363
V-Card: https://www.codify.com/cards/davidconnors
Address Info: https://www.codify.com/contact

RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Nick Randolph 
Ah you know I think that David just pushed the wrong button - the MS mobile dev 
community is still a little sore from the beating we took on that one.

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP - Windows Phone 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Ian Thomas
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 6:39 PM
To: 'ozDotNet'
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Nick - I didn't think that needed explaining!



Ian Thomas
Victoria Park, Western Australia


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of Nick Randolph
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 4:24 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Oh the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for a while and 
watch what happens in the real world. Even some dev shops are stuck on VS2008 
in the same way as some enterprises are on WinXP.

 If you do anything related to the old Windows Mobile platform, for 
example, you have to use VS2008 - and no, there are some cases where we can't 
just build a Windows Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us when 
killing Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of business 
applications that require peripherals and/or ruggedized devices :( 

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP - Windows Phone 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Ian Thomas 
Nick - I didn't think that needed explaining! 

 

  _  

Ian Thomas
Victoria Park, Western Australia

  _  

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
On Behalf Of Nick Randolph
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 4:24 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

 

Oh the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for a while and
watch what happens in the real world. Even some dev shops are stuck on
VS2008 in the same way as some enterprises are on WinXP.

 

 If you do anything related to the old Windows Mobile platform, for
example, you have to use VS2008 - and no, there are some cases where we
can't just build a Windows Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us
when killing Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of business
applications that require peripherals and/or ruggedized devices :-( 

 

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP - Windows Phone
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this
email in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of
any emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the
author's own and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty
Ltd.

Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Peter Gfader 
#1 I love the new look too!  Or... maybe I should say that I am not too
fussed about it because for sure there are heaps of themes that let me
"fix" it.

But
#2 Please fix the docking. Let controls use up all space. There are at
least 4 places where that would be nice... as mentioned by others:
1 Project properties
2 Tools | Options Dialog (Keyboard shows 3 lines)
3 Exception dialog in Debugger
4 Debug | Exceptions Dialog

Thanks!
Looking forward to use it


BTW
+1 to performance



On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 9:24 AM, Nick Randolph  wrote:

> Oh the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for a while and
> watch what happens in the real world. Even some dev shops are stuck on
> VS2008 in the same way as some enterprises are on WinXP.
>
> ** **
>
>  If you do anything related to the old Windows Mobile platform, for
> example, you have to use VS2008 – and no, there are some cases where we
> can’t just build a Windows Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us
> when killing Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of business
> applications that require peripherals and/or ruggedized devices L *
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> *Nick Randolph** *| *Built to Roam Pty Ltd* | Microsoft MVP – Windows
> Phone Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
> The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not
> the intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this
> email in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of
> any emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the
> author's own and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty
> Ltd.
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:
> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *David Kean
> *Sent:* Friday, 24 February 2012 3:58 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet
> *Subject:* RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>
> ** **
>
> Thanks for the feedback. On the three different versions things, why are
> you using three? What you building that still requires 2005/2008?
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *mike smith
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:35 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet
> *Subject:* Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>
> ** **
>
> On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 4:15 PM, David Kean 
> wrote:
> > We showed off the new look today: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/visualstudio/
> >
> >
> >
> > Thoughts?
>
> I agree, somewhat, about the colour, but feel you've gone too far towards
> monochrome.  And if you make me learn a new set of damned icons, I won't
> use the bloody thing.  This is one thing I wish Microsoft would stop
> tinkering with.  Icons, menu layouts, dialog layouts.   Some of us don't
> move on completely from one version to another, but use 3 different
> versions of VS.  Do you have any idea how painful this is?
>
> [image: Description: Pictographic icons from VS 2010 on the top row with
> the equivalent VS 11 glyphs on the bottom row] 
>
> ** **
>
> Take the comment/uncomment icons. WTF are they meant to represent?
>
> ** **
>
> 
>
> ** **
>
>
>
> --
> Meski
>
>  http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
>
> "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
> you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
>



-- 


  .peter.gfader. (current mood = happy!)
  Check this before you go live
  http://blog.gfader.com/2011/07/website-check-list-part-1-aspnet-4.html
<>

RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Nick Randolph 
Oh the sheltered life you live. Break out of the MS bubble for a while and 
watch what happens in the real world. Even some dev shops are stuck on VS2008 
in the same way as some enterprises are on WinXP.

 If you do anything related to the old Windows Mobile platform, for 
example, you have to use VS2008 – and no, there are some cases where we can’t 
just build a Windows Phone version. Microsoft officially screwed us when 
killing Windows Mobile as there is no alternative for line of business 
applications that require peripherals and/or ruggedized devices ☹ 

Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP – Windows Phone 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @btroam
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of David Kean
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2012 3:58 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Thanks for the feedback. On the three different versions things, why are you 
using three? What you building that still requires 2005/2008?

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of mike smith
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:35 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 4:15 PM, David Kean 
mailto:david.k...@microsoft.com>> wrote:
> We showed off the new look today: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/visualstudio/
>
>
>
> Thoughts?

I agree, somewhat, about the colour, but feel you've gone too far towards 
monochrome.  And if you make me learn a new set of damned icons, I won't use 
the bloody thing.  This is one thing I wish Microsoft would stop tinkering 
with.  Icons, menu layouts, dialog layouts.   Some of us don't move on 
completely from one version to another, but use 3 different versions of VS.  Do 
you have any idea how painful this is?

[Description: Pictographic icons from VS 2010 on the top row with the 
equivalent VS 11 glyphs on the bottom row]

Take the comment/uncomment icons. WTF are they meant to represent?





--
Meski

 http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv

"Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure, you'll 
get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
<>

Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Stephen Price 
Going against the grain here. I love the new look, the simpler
glyphs/icons.
Love the sexy black theme. Everything should have a sexy black theme.
Definitely make the UI resolution agnostic. Everything needs to resize to
whatever size monitor you have, and even multi screens.

To further reiterate the impact of my last email, VS needs to load so
lightning fast that it makes notepad look bloated. Seriously, what's so
hard about this? As i read in a blog post once, they are *just* text files
we're talking about here!!!

Sexy and fast. We don't ask for much, do we? ;)

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 3:36 PM, David Kean wrote:

>  One of the “about bloody time” features that we’ve added to VS is round
> tripping of projects. Basically, the majority of projects can be opened
> back and forth between VS2010 and VS11 without any changes. 
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:
> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *djones...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:26 PM
>
> *To:* ozDotNet
> *Subject:* Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>
>  ** **
>
> Seconded on different versions thing.
>
> Switching between 2010 and 2008 little changes in menus really slow me
> down.
> Doing >of classname in 2010 with the auto complete is very very annoying.
>
> (4.0, vsto projects and the frankinapp that's been converted from
> vs,2003,2005,2008)
>
> Davy .02€
>
> Hexed into a portable ouija board. 
>  --
>
> *From: *David Kean  
>
> *Sender: *ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
>
> *Date: *Fri, 24 Feb 2012 05:58:26 +
>
> *To: *ozDotNet
>
> *ReplyTo: *ozDotNet  
>
> *Subject: *RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>
> ** **
>
> Thanks for the feedback. On the three different versions things, why are
> you using three? What you building that still requires 2005/2008?
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *mike smith
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:35 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet
> *Subject:* Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>
> ** **
>
> On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 4:15 PM, David Kean 
> wrote:
> > We showed off the new look today: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/visualstudio/
> >
> >
> >
> > Thoughts?
>
> I agree, somewhat, about the colour, but feel you've gone too far towards
> monochrome.  And if you make me learn a new set of damned icons, I won't
> use the bloody thing.  This is one thing I wish Microsoft would stop
> tinkering with.  Icons, menu layouts, dialog layouts.   Some of us don't
> move on completely from one version to another, but use 3 different
> versions of VS.  Do you have any idea how painful this is?
>
> [image: Description: Pictographic icons from VS 2010 on the top row with
> the equivalent VS 11 glyphs on the bottom row] 
>
> ** **
>
> Take the comment/uncomment icons. WTF are they meant to represent?
>
> ** **
>
> 
>
> ** **
>
>
>
> --
> Meski
>
>  http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
>
> "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
> you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
>

RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread David Kean 
With regards to the notepad replacement, add some votes to this: 
http://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/131389-visual-studio-performance/suggestions/2255626-make-it-feasible-to-use-visual-studio-as-a-program

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Ian Thomas
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:58 PM
To: 'ozDotNet'
Subject: RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

Stephen - I thought I was the only neo-luddite that did things like that ...
But round-tripping of projects - and other "tech" things - surely must be given 
more promotion than the UX / UI nonsense in that blog post, which is going to 
suck the oxygen from the real advancements in a new version.



Ian Thomas
Victoria Park, Western Australia


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
 On Behalf Of Stephen Price
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 3:51 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

I'd be happy if you could open a SMALL text file from explorer without having 
to wait a few minutes.

Why do you think that everyone has a notepad replacement installed? If Visual 
Studio loaded fast we wouldn't need them, VS would be the best notepad 
replacement. Impress me. I dare you. Make VS fast enough that I uninstall my 
notepad replacement.

Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?

2012-02-24 Thread Geoff Appleby 
So very agreed. Give me  colour!
On Feb 24, 2012 6:35 PM, "Iain Carlin"  wrote:

> YUK!
>
> If I wanted to look at a black and white screen all day I would buy a
> black and white monitor...what craziness is this? Have Microsoft employed
> some UI designers from Apple or something. Leave the icons in colour,
> monochrome is just going to make my already difficult job even harder.
>
>
> On 24 February 2012 17:56,  wrote:
>
>> Seconded on different versions thing.
>>
>> Switching between 2010 and 2008 little changes in menus really slow me
>> down.
>> Doing >of classname in 2010 with the auto complete is very very annoying.
>>
>> (4.0, vsto projects and the frankinapp that's been converted from
>> vs,2003,2005,2008)
>>
>> Davy .02€
>> Hexed into a portable ouija board.
>> --
>> *From: * David Kean 
>> *Sender: * ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
>> *Date: *Fri, 24 Feb 2012 05:58:26 +
>> *To: *ozDotNet
>> *ReplyTo: * ozDotNet 
>> *Subject: *RE: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>>
>>  Thanks for the feedback. On the three different versions things, why
>> are you using three? What you building that still requires 2005/2008?
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:
>> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *mike smith
>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 23, 2012 9:35 PM
>> *To:* ozDotNet
>> *Subject:* Re: New look of Visual Studio, what are your thoughts?
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 4:15 PM, David Kean 
>> wrote:
>> > We showed off the new look today: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/visualstudio/
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Thoughts?
>>
>> I agree, somewhat, about the colour, but feel you've gone too far towards
>> monochrome.  And if you make me learn a new set of damned icons, I won't
>> use the bloody thing.  This is one thing I wish Microsoft would stop
>> tinkering with.  Icons, menu layouts, dialog layouts.   Some of us don't
>> move on completely from one version to another, but use 3 different
>> versions of VS.  Do you have any idea how painful this is?
>>
>> [image: Description: Pictographic icons from VS 2010 on the top row with
>> the equivalent VS 11 glyphs on the bottom row] 
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> Take the comment/uncomment icons. WTF are they meant to represent?
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> 
>>
>> ** **
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Meski
>>
>>  http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
>>
>> "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
>> you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
>>
>
>
<>