Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: Making it easier for women to breastfeed

[Sally @ home]

Absolutely brilliant!!

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "Denise Hynd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2007 7:08 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Fw: Making it easier for women to breastfeed








Hello all,

Please send far and wide. This is fantastic, warmly, Carolyn


Rachel Myr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 02/25/07 9:30 pm >>>

This video montage from numerous 'nurse-ins' was made by a breastfeeding
enthusiast in Canada after the wave of demonstrations by breastfeeding
mothers following the expulsion of a mother from a Delta airlines flight
(BEFORE departure :-)) when she declined to stop feeding her child on 
board.

If enough people go to youtube and view it, it gets moved up to a more
visible placement on the youtube website, and more people who don't 
normally

think about breastfeeding will see it.
It's a nice film, and the music is well chosen.
I was alerted to it on Lactnet by the person who did the video montage 
you

can see here, and am trying to do my bit to get it some more circulation.
Enjoy.

Nurse-Ins across <http://youtube.com/watch?v=kmgLgIUB2T4>  America

cheers
Rachel Myr, well and truly snowed in, in Kristiansand, Norway





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Re: [ozmidwifery] Midwives eat their young, don't they?

[Sally @ home]

Thank you Andrea,

The article is brilliant...I will definately be using this in our 
workplace...many of us have been subject to this sort of behaviour. The main 
culprits have not been pulled aside or cautioned for their behaviour, so it 
goes on! What once was a lovely unit to work in, and it's only coming up to 
2 years in operation, has turned into a divisive and unpleasant snakepit! 
Really good midwives are leaving, and apathy and disillusionment abound.


Carolyn, you are brilliant, and I wish you were down here.

Sally x
- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Robertson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 7:22 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Midwives eat their young, don't they?



Hi Honey and others,

A more recent article on this issue can be found here:

http://www.birthinternational.com/articles/hastie02.html

and an earlier article on the same topic, also by Carolyn Hastie is here:

http://www.birthinternational.com/articles/hastie01.html

Both should be widely read and circulated.

Cheers

Andrea









At 10:27 PM 13/01/2007, you wrote:
For the lister who asked for this in the past week, I have found my paper 
copy. It is in Birth Issues Volume 4 Number 3 1995. Carolyn Hastie. 
Midwives eat their young, don't they? A story of horizontal violence in 
midwifery.


If you would like me to fax it to you email me off list.
Regards
Honey




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Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth

[Sally @ home]

Lynne,

Would you be willing to send me a copy of your learning package?

Sally
  - Original Message - 
  From: Lynne Staff 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 11:57 AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


  Hi Helen
  When I get to work tomorrow, I will send you the reference list from my 
recently updated (Oct 2006) warm water immersion in labour and birth learning 
package for midwives. This may be helpful - re publishing our figures - this is 
a goal for 2007!
  Warm regards, and a happy and fruitful 2007!
- Original Message - 
From: Helen and Graham 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 9:54 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


Hi Lynne

Can you point me to some research that I can use to support the safety of 
waterbirth.  I have just read the following reference in the SA Women's and 
Children's Waterbirth Policy as sent in by Fiona to Ozmid as follows:

"There is no evidence that perinatal mortality and morbidity, including 
admissions to
special care nurseries for babies born into a warm water environment, is 
significantly

different to babies born out of water (Geissbuehler et al 2004; Gilbert & 
Tookey

1999)."

but wondered whether you had any other references to call on.  



Also wondering if you had thought about publishing Selangor's own findings? 
 It would be a great contribution to hospitals trying to weigh up the risk 
benefits of waterbirth.  There still seems to be such fear surrounding the 
whole issue in the majority of the hospital system that it would be great to 
have some positive local experiences/research to quote.  

Thanks in advance.

Helen





  - Original Message - 
  From: Lynne Staff 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 10:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


  Hi Mary
  At Selangor we - midwives, obstetricians and paediatricians - have 
'officially' supported women for waterbirth since Feb 1998. Our rate is 35% of 
vaginal births and over 1600 babies have been waterborn since we opened. We 
will continue to do so as it has benefits for women, their babies and is safe. 
  Regards, Lynne


  - Original Message - 
From: Mary Murphy 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:50 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


Hi everyone, I know this question has been asked before, but I can't 
remember the answer.  Do we have any maternity units, birth centres etc who 
officially do waterbirth?  I know homebirthers do, but I want to know about 
institutions.  Thanks, MM



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12:47 PM

Re: [ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?

[Sally @ home]

Carolyn,
You are amazing...after being completely denigrated by the medicos and some 
of my colleagues for believing that women DO NOT need V'E's every 4 hours to 
assess progress of labour, what you have written is a breath of fresh air, 
with your permission I would like to forward your previous email to my 
colleagues, to make those who practice obsteric nursing aware and to support 
those who truly work with women.


Have you got some info on Taylorism, I would like saome background on it. 
Thanks heaps.


regards

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "Gail McKenzie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?


WOW!!!   Thank you thank you thank you.  Carolyn, that was just 
what I needed.  Are you going to the homebirth conference this year?   If 
so, I would dearly love to catch up with you & everyone else who 
contributes to the ozmidwifery site.  maybe we can wear a flower or 
something so we recognise each other.


Much love and admiration,  Gail 



From: "Heartlogic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?
Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 13:24:40 +1100

Dear Gail,

Firstly, your instincts are spot on.

This is a very distressing story.  It is not a coincidence that these 
women's labours stalled following his VE's, that is absolutely to be 
expected and is the result of a mindless disruption of the women's optimal 
state of neurophyiological functioning. Taylorism, that is an industrial, 
efficiency management model, has no place in the dynamic fluid process of 
birth, sadly it has become merged into the 'health' care system with this 
sort of unconscious abuse becoming more common.


'Discussions' with the doctors at that stage will do nothing except breed 
resistence and further intervention; in mindless individuals it can even 
result in payback situations where intervention will be done just because 
you are the midwife. The right to rule is still endemic in the maternity 
services.


the first thing to understand is that these people really believe they are 
doing the right thing.
the second thing to understand is that they are taught all about the 
abnormalities of birth, they have absolutely no idea about normal 
physiology as applied to birth (gross generalisation, I know)

the third thing is that they are terrified of birth
the fourth thing is that they are taught throughout medical school that 
they are the boss of everything and the government and health departments 
agree and structure everything (I know, there are exceptions) to reinforce 
that idea
the fifth and probably MOST important thing is that they do get taught 
about 'patient' autonomy and the need for consent.


So, here is where it gets interesting and where our opportunity lies.

It is vitally important that you use every moment with birthing women to 
help them understand the situation, without making it combatative and 
engendering a siege mentality and ask them what they want to have happen, 
how they would like things to go, so they can say what they want - be left 
alone, checked in another hour a few more hours, more time, a bath, move 
freely, have the baby listened to by doppler in the shower/bath etc if 
women have the information that can help them with the deeply damaging 
throw away lines that get trotted out like 'stillbirth' 'brain damage' 
etc, then women can say what they want and we as midwives can support them 
in that and remember to DOCUMENT what women want.  To do things against 
rational people's will is abuse. To argue about medical intervention with 
midwives is a nuisance and an affront to power beliefs.


Getting strategic is important. Learning tactical support of birthing 
women is a midwifery art form and a very challenging one.  It is crucial 
that you avoid blame, judgement and criticism as these emotional states 
are damaging for everyone and lead to despair.  It is useful to come from 
the point of view that they mean well but are ignorant about birth 
physiology and are taught to look for problems. Neuroscience and quantum 
physics teaches us we find what we are looking for. That also means we 
make it up if it is not there.


Our job is to work with women and their processes, to give women 
information to make their own decisions and to help them actualise their 
decisions and to help doctors know what women want. :-)   makes it so 
simple really. Simple does not, however, mean easy.


Every time you find yourself with a pregnant and/or birthing woman ask 
questions of yourself like 'how can I best inform her of her options?'  ' 
how can I best explain the process of birth so she knows what to expect?' 
'how can I support her with what she wants?' ' how c

[ozmidwifery] Headline - Risks fail to deter caesarean deliveries

[Sally-Anne Brown]

apologies for cross posts



Risks fail to deter caesarean deliveries
Mark Metherell
December 19, 2006

To view the entire article, click on: 
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/12/18/1166290475617.html



Sign up for news updates from The Sydney Morning Herald newsroom emailed 
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http://smh.com.au/newsletters/subscription.html


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[ozmidwifery] temp in labour

[Sally @ home]

I was just wondering if my last post landed as I have had absolutely no replies.

Would like to know what ppl consider a temp in labour, on land or in water.

Sally
  - Original Message - 
  From: Kristin Beckedahl 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 12:06 AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Use of sports drinks in labour


  I used Endura during my 4 and a half labour - and really felt like I needed 
it due to the pace of things (and an early vomit !?!).

  I've also supported a couples of births where I have brought this along with 
me for the woman.  Both of these births were *unremarkable* with mums birthing 
normally with no intervention etc with reasonably fast labours; 6 and 9hours.

  Kristin

  CBE & Naturopath









From: "Helen and Graham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Use of sports drinks in labour
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 21:31:34 +1100


Thanks for the replies about the sports drinks in labour however I must say 
I am still a bit confused.  I will have to do some more research I think

Helen
  - Original Message - 
  From: Honey Acharya 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 10:51 AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Use of sports drinks in labour


  I believe in the value of drinks with electrolytes, not just water. 
Commonly used things are herb tea and honey, their own labour aide, juice, or 
sports drinks - one that I have used myself and seen recommended by others is 
Endura which has electrolytes and magnesium, lemon lime flavour is preferred 
and obtainable in a powder form in a tub for approx $30 at the health food shop 
or chemist.

  I haven't seen any evidence on it but to me it makes sense, we don't 
perform other physical activities for long periods and expect our bodies to 
keep functioning well on just water and without sustenance, muscles continue to 
need energy and electrolytes to contract. 
  If there are not studies done on it can you compare with studies on 
athletes?


- Original Message - 
From: Helen and Graham 
To: ozmidwifery 
Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 8:38 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Use of sports drinks in labour


Is anyone recommending women use sports drinks such as Poweraid etc 
when in labour?  I have read some good evidence to suggest it is better than 
water in long labours but don't have the source at my fingertipsinterested 
in your thoughts/findings.  I figure anything that can help keep a woman from 
tiring and being labelled by doctors as a "fail to progress" has got to be 
worth a try as long as it is evidence based.

Helen


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3:41 PM

[ozmidwifery] maternal temperature

[Sally @ home]

What would be considered a pyrexia in a labouring woman?

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "leanne wynne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 9:12 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] article FYI - "another example of technology that 
promises more than it delivers




Fetal O2 Monitoring Doesn't Change Outcomes or Cesarean Rates

By Neil Osterweil, MedPage Today Staff Writer
Reviewed by Zalman S. Agus, MD; Emeritus Professor at the University of 
Pennsylvania School of Medicine.

November 22, 2006

DALLAS, Nov. 22 -- Fetal oxygen saturation monitoring doesn't alter the 
rate of caesarean deliveries or improve outcomes for newborns, researchers 
in a large randomized study reported.


When investigators monitored more than 5,300 women in first-time labor 
with fetal pulse oximetry, but randomly masked the data from half of the 
observers, there were no significant differences in outcomes or in 
Caesarean rates, reported Steven L. Bloom, M.D., of the University of 
Texas Southwestern Medical Center here, and colleagues elsewhere.


The delivery teams equipped with fetal oxygen saturation data and those 
kept in the dark acted similarly, the investigators reported in the Nov. 
23 issue of the New England Journal of Medicine.


The findings suggest that fetal pulse oximetry may be another example of a 
technology that promises more than it delivers, they authors added.


"The widespread adoption of intrapartum electronic fetal monitoring in the 
early 1970s has been cited as an example of the incorporation of 
technology without proof of benefit," they wrote.


"The development of fetal oxygen saturation might improve understanding of 
fetal well-being during labor and thus reduce the rate of cesarean 
delivery for the indication of abnormal fetal heart rate," they continued. 
"Our trial confirms the value of rigorous assessment of new forms of 
technology by showing that knowledge of fetal oxygen saturation does not 
lead to a significant reduction in cesarean births overall or for the 
indication of a nonreassuring fetal heart rate."


In an accompanying editorial, Michael F. Greene, M.D, of the Massachusetts 
General Hospital in Boston agreed that those who seek a technological fix 
to the problem of fetal monitoring need to keep searching.


"The reduction in the rate of cesarean deliveries that were performed out 
of concern for intrapartum fetal asphyxia seen in previous studies was not 
observed in this trial, nor was there the enigmatic increase in cesarean 
deliveries for the indication of dystocia among women with non-reassuring 
fetal heart-rate patterns," Dr. Greene wrote.


"The performance of electronic fetal heart-rate monitoring as a screening 
test for fetal oxygen desaturation was poor. Neonatal outcomes were not 
significantly different between the groups."


Although electronic fetal monitoring is used in about 85% of all live 
births in the United States, its benefits, if any are uncertain, and 
critics maintain that it may contribute to the surge in caesarean 
deliveries, the authors noted.


Fetal pulse oximetry, approved conditionally by the FDA in 2000, was 
intended to provide continuous fetal oxygen saturation data when there is 
a "non-reassuring" fetal heart-rate pattern.


The device involves a sensor placed through the mother's dilated cervix 
after her membranes have ruptured. The sensor is placed against the fetus' 
face, and measures the fetus oxygen saturation levels during labor.


To determine whether knowledge of fetal oxygen saturation during labor 
would have an effect of clinical practice or fetal outcomes, the 
investigators conducted a multicenter study.


A total of 5,341 women who had never before given birth were enrolled at 
14 centers. All women were assigned to electronic fetal monitoring with 
fetal pulse oximetry, but in half of the cases the investigators were 
blinded to the pulse oximetry data, while in the other half the clinicians 
were allowed full access to the data.


The investigators collected data on fetal heart-rate patterns before 
randomization, and used the information to stratify the study population 
into two groups: one with non-reassuring fetal heart-rate patterns, for 
whom fetal oximetry was primarily intended, and the other without fetal 
heart-rate abnormalities before the time of randomization.


They defined a non-reassuring fetal heart-rate pattern, using criteria 
from an earlier trial of fetal oximetry, as:


Severe variable decelerations (<70 beats per minute for at least 60 
seconds)

Late decelerations
Bradycardia (<110 beats per minute)
Tachycardia (>160 beats per minute)
Diminished heart-rate variability (<5 beats per minute over a period of at 
least 30 minutes)

One or more variable decelerations in two consecutive 30-minute windows
Increased heart-rate variability (>25 beats per minute o

Re: [ozmidwifery] No Births at Ryde Birth Centre

[sally tracy]

Dear all
I might be able to shed a bit of light on Justine's comments. 
One of the obstacles we had in getting Ryde Midwifery Group Practice up
and running was an assurance to the Area health service that there
would always be someone  (obstetric) capable of doing an emergency CS
if necessary at the Ryde hospital - in case of a dire emergency. 
Needless to say this has never been called upon  - but with the
troubles of the Ryde General Hospital  - the RMGP is drawn into it all
unwittingly  - because the RMGP can no longer assure the area heath
service that an obstetrician can provide that back up at Ryde.
Therefore this is really a timely opportunity for the RMGP to reframe
the service they are providing and have it ratified by the Area health
service  - without the nonsense clause that existed in the first
proposal. Belmont for example does not have this clause  - and I think
Ryde midwifery group practice only had it because we had to compromise
a on a few fairly benign (we thought at the time) caveats in order to
get started. Now we are several years down the track and looking OK  -
i dont think it will be such a hurdle..

so I think Justine is correct is asserting that it will be only a blip
in the process  - but a process never the less  - and for those of you
getting these things up and running  - there are so many battles to be
fought  -i guess we have to look at this as just another not
insurmountable (but  tiresome) hurdle. 

I do think it would be incredibly helpful if any consumers concerned
could take it up with as many people as possible  - ie their local
member of parliament, the CEO of the Area health Service, the head of
Obstetrics at Northern Sydney Health, the NSW Health department , the
Australian College of Midwives  - anybody who needs to know this isn't
good enough  best wishes
Sally t.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  

  Justine,
  

can you clarify what you mean? I don't understand what you're saying. 
What "greater good" are women losing out to? How long will it last? When 
will births be reinstated? Who is the driving force behind denying women 
their intended place and mode of birth and what are their motives? Is MC 
taking up the cause to fight for the consumers to have access to what 
they were promised?
TIA,
J

  
  
I'm interested to hear the answers to these questions to Janet.

Thanks
Love Abby
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Re: [ozmidwifery] ACMI conference

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Di 
 
You might want to try the last minute on line 
groups
 
eg:  quickbeds.com or wotif.com 
etc
 
many more to be found on google or other 
s/engines
 
hopefully some sydney folk will also offer 
billeting
 
warm regards
 
sally-anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  D. 
  Morgan 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 10:26 
  AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] ACMI 
  conference
  
  Hi all
  I am trying to get to the ACMI conference in 
  Sydney, Dec 1,2. Have any midwives who are going or who live in Sydney 
  found or could suggest any cheaper accomodation options around Double Bay 
  than the conference venue??
  Cheers
  Di M
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] I need to vent!!!

[Sally @ home]

Well done Carolyn.
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Heartlogic 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 9:46 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] I need to 
  vent!!!
  
  I was asked to judge a baby contest in the late 
  70's.  Of course I was horrified at the time, but was compelled because 
  of where I worked etc etc.   
   
  I gave all the babies first prize.  
  :-)
   
  ' They' didn't ask me again.  
  :-)
   
  Great idea to send those letters Barb.  I 
  keep getting the official replies from some poor bunny in the 'office'  - 
  I know, I've been one myself at one time.  But the numbers do 
  matter.  Each letter represents in political terms, 100 voters, so if 
  everyone on this list wrote :-)
   
  politically yours, (which reminds me, I'm 
  standing for the Democrats again next election, just got officially 
  'selected')
   
  Carolyn (Hastie)
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Jackie 
Kitschke 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 9:02 
PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] I need to 
vent!!!

Not to mention the "Pick my pretty 
baby"competitions.
Jackie

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Barbara Glare & Chris Bright 
  
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 6:37 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] I need to 
  vent!!!
  
  HI,
   
  They won't have free rein if we all (mothers 
  and health professionals COMPLAIN)  It amazes me that amidst the 
  ocean of media report about healthy eating and obesity, the importance of 
  breastfeeding is ignored, or ridiculed on television as it was on 
  "Sunrise" yesterday morning (and probably will be on 60 minutes on the 
  weekend) or crucified like it was on "Life at One" last week.  
  
   
  The media needs to lift it's act, and they 
  will only do so when they get the message from US.  
  Yesterday morning "Sunrise" did an article on 
  David Suzuki, talking about in 1992 more than 1/2 of the world's 
  scientific Nobel Laureats wrote an open letter warning of the damage to 
  the enviromnment.  No media outlet in the world ran the 
  story.
  Then Sunrise spoke about a poll they were 
  running.  Breast v. bottle, and the announcer tut-tutting about how 
  breastfeeding was a personal choice and women shouldn't be judgemental of 
  each other.  Excuse me!  they had just set it up!
   
  Breastfeeding is not a choice like wearing 
  your blue top or your red top tonight.  And getting information to 
  women and health professionals has nothing at all to do with guilt - the 
  usual excuse used by the media to ( and promoted by the formula companies 
  to ultimately promote their wares)  Anyway, as to 
  complaining
   
  Write to your member of Parliament asking him 
  to write to/forward on the material you send to Tony Abbott, Minister for 
  Health.  This way you kill 2 birds with the one stone.  You 
  educate your local MP and Let Tony Abbott know that health professionals 
  and mothers of Australia are NOT HAPPY
   
  Also, write to the APMAIF panel, enclosing 
  any brochures etc that you have.  Don't worry about whether it is 
  technically a breech of the agreement.  If it is enough to offend you 
  as a mother or a health professional, send it in - let them know how you 
  feel!
   
  APMAIF SecretariatDepartment of Health and AgeingMail Drop 
  Point 15GPO Box 9848ACT 2601
  While you are at it, you could complain to 
  the Victorian Office of Children about their decision to keep having their 
  Maternal and child health nurses educated by Wyeth.  You could write 
  to the CEO Gill Callister [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  And send a copy to Minister Sheryl Garbutt at 
  the same time.
   
  Warm Regards,
  Barb
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
jesse/jayne 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 
10:35 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] I need 
to vent!!!

Are the formula companies really 
giving infant FORUMULA samples to pregnant women here?  Are they 
breeching the WHO Code so blatantly here?  I thought it was fairly 
well regulated - unlike many other countries.  If it does happen at 
the Expo, you should report them to the ABA for further 
action.
 
Unfortunately they have free reign with 
that toddler milk crap in a can/drink dispensing machine 
whatever.
 
Jayne
 
 

Re: [ozmidwifery] mec staining

[Sally @ home]

The research now states that suctioning of babies 
with mec stained liquor actually makes no difference to outcome. Mec stained 
liquor really is quite common...the most important aspect I think is whether it 
is fresh/thick/particulate. Or old/thin. This can happen with/without fetal 
distress.
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Kristin 
  Beckedahl 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, September 15, 2006 4:21 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] mec staining
  
  
  Hi all,
  Are all cases of mec liquor staining 
  considered serious or treated as an emergency?  Can you have staining and 
  fetal heart rate be OK?
  Thanks,
  Kristin-- 
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  14/09/2006

Re: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations

[Sally @ home]

Exactly, Shelley.

In practice I do very few VE's as well, relying on all the external signs 
we, as midwives, use everyday. However, having one's knowledge and 
experienced completely disregarded is extremely disheartening.


We are organising a forum to try and alter the policy/guideline, but have 
very little time to prepare...hence the plea for help :o)


Thanks
Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "michelle gascoigne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations


Introducing myself and replying at the same time. My name is Shelly I am a 
midwife in England and the mother of two boys. We are thinking of a move 
to Aus and so joined this list as it came recomended. I am on a few lists 
in the UK.
Sadly for the medics much of what midwives do is art and not science. We 
often do not have scientific evidence to back what we do (or more to the 
point don't do). The good thing is neither do they so turn the tables and 
ask them to provide the evidence for what they are suggesting. Much 
routine and ritual care is just that and not based on any sound evidence. 
A couple of excellent UK authors to check out are Soo Downe and Sara 
Wickham. They write on normality as a rule. In practce I do very few VE's 
and often have to discuss this with colleagues and at supervision. If you 
watch women who are labouring (without an epidural) they move in certain 
ways they say certain things and there are external physical signs of 
progress. In the notes I write these in and explain why at this point is 
will or will not be following the 'guidelines'. In the UK they are 
generally guidelines and not policies.

Shelly

- Original Message - 
From: "Sally @ home" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 2:31 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations



Just to add to this...
There was an extremely heated discussion at a meeting with docs and 
midwives where I work about how doing a VE is the only way to ascertain 
progress in the normal labour of uncompromised healthy women. The 
midwives now have to come up with evidence showing that doing a VE within 
1- 4 hours of admission to hospital (then 4-6 hourly thereafter) is not 
necessary as we are able to assess progress in different ways (all of 
which have been poo-pooed by the medicos)...so...am needing the help of 
all you wonderfully wise women out there.


Thanks in advance.

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "Sally @ home" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 10:30 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations


Was wondering what guidelines others worked with regarding when to do 
vaginal examinations...specifically in the hospital setting. And what 
evidence they base their practice on.


Thanks in advance.

Sally
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Re: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Sally

Can I suggest you email Sara Wickham who has a chapter written in her book 
abt not doing VE's in labour written by Lesley Hobbs may be helpful to get 
some research sent to you asap  [EMAIL PROTECTED]



also on the gentle birth website (also pasted below) are some links to 
research on the external signs of assessing dilation 
http://www.gentlebirth.org/archives/birth.html#Dilation


good luck

sally-anne

Assessing Dilation from External Signs





Assessing Dilation from External Signs





To VE or not to VE? That is the question from the Association of Radical 
Midwives






I think it's a rare instance where one needs to assess dilation in order to 
provide appropriate care.  Eventually, she'll either feel an urge to push or 
you'll see the head between her legs.






I'll be working as a doula with a client who has an abuse history and wants 
to avoid all vaginal exams in labor.  What can I do if the nurses become 
insistent about assessing cervical dilation?






In general, hospital nurses are clueless about external signs because 
they're not used to watching the labor progress. They arrive and leave at 
random points in the labor, and they only know how to assess dilation by 
checking the cervix.


When I'm labor coaching at a hospital birth, where cervical exams are 
generally off limits to me as the labor coach, I look first at the 
contraction pattern, then dilation bleeding, then early decels to reflect 
coming up against the resistance from the pelvic floor, then movement of the 
location of the heart (having a mechanical fetoscope is best for this) to 
reflect descent/rotation, and then expect an urge to push.


I would be prepared to study up on the alternative techniques and then bluff 
your way like crazy that you really can assess dilation that way, start your 
estimate on the low side, make regular progress, and do everything you can 
to make sure she gets to the "urge to push" phase before they get too 
curious.


And remind the client that she can always say no.  Ideally, she will have 
discussed this with her care provider and it will be charted that no vaginal 
exams are to be done for the first twelve hours, or something like that. 
Get clear guidelines from your client, and remind them that touching her 
without her consent is criminal assault.






At the initial exam, I let them know when and how many standard vag exams 
women have and then explain that many women, however, choose to have two... 
one for the PAP and one when the membranes rupture. I let her decide how 
many she wants, but that two is the minimum.


During the 3rd Tri, reminding her again about the vaginal exam when her 
membranes rupture (or if she chooses, when she arrives, when membranes 
rupture, urge to push, etc.).






Why? We see many clients who for religious reasons refuse vaginal exams; so 
we don' t do them. We explain the "usual" of course, and that VEs may help 
by giving additional info in certain instances -- -- but if a mom wants to 
refuse a VE, Pap, etc; then why not go along with her wishes?.


If we listen to heart rate when membranes rupture --the FHTs will tell us if 
there is a problem with the cord. (which is unlikely anyway if she is full 
term and vertex).


If she has the urge to push and can't stop pushing then let her push -- you 
will either see the baby soon, or she will get discouraged and stop pushing. 
This is an easy call! Vaginal exams in labor are almost never REALLY 
necessary! Watch mom and baby from the outside -- outward signs/symptoms of 
progress in labor are pretty reliable.






A research study in 1997 hypothesized that the purple line that creeps up 
the natal cleft can be an indicator of cervical dilatation.  The line begins 
at the anal margin at the start of labour and rises like a mercury 
thermometer.  When it reaches the top, the woman is fully.


Lancet 1990 Jan 13;335(8681):122
Clinical method for evaluating progress in first stage of labour.
Byrne DL, Edmonds DK

A midwife, Lesley Hobbs, has just published an article in the Practicising 
Midwife(1998) 1:11, and she is finding this a quite reliable indicator of 
cervical dilation (after much practice)  She gives a 

Re: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations

[Sally @ home]

Just to add to this...
There was an extremely heated discussion at a meeting with docs and midwives 
where I work about how doing a VE is the only way to ascertain progress in 
the normal labour of uncompromised healthy women. The midwives now have to 
come up with evidence showing that doing a VE within 1- 4 hours of admission 
to hospital (then 4-6 hourly thereafter) is not necessary as we are able to 
assess progress in different ways (all of which have been poo-pooed by the 
medicos)...so...am needing the help of all you wonderfully wise women out 
there.


Thanks in advance.

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "Sally @ home" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 10:30 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations


Was wondering what guidelines others worked with regarding when to do 
vaginal examinations...specifically in the hospital setting. And what 
evidence they base their practice on.


Thanks in advance.

Sally
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[ozmidwifery] Vaginal examinations

[Sally @ home]

Was wondering what guidelines others worked with regarding when to do 
vaginal examinations...specifically in the hospital setting. And what 
evidence they base their practice on.


Thanks in advance.

Sally 


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Re: [ozmidwifery] midiwfe in Vic

[Sally @ home]

Yes, I work at Casey Hospital, have been since it 
opened last year. We provide midwifery led care to women who are 'low-risk'. It 
is a lovely hospital (as hospitals go) and the midwives are great!!
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mike & 
  Lindsay Kennedy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 10:16 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] midiwfe in 
  Vic
  Casey hospital in Berwick appears to be a low risk low 
  intervention hospital.
  On 8/22/06, Belinda 
  Maier <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  > wrote:
  I 
have a client in midwifery group practice who would like to birth in 
Melb with her family, she is over 34 weeks so i am assuming she wont 
getinto birth centers?? She is close to Monash, is there anyone who 
couldtalk to her regarding her options there??Belinda 
SA--This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> 
to subscribe or unsubscribe.-- 
  My photos online @ http://community.webshots.com/user/mike1962nzMy 
  Group online @ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PSP_for_PhotographersNew 
  Photo site@Mike - http://mikelinz.dotphoto.comLindsay 
  - Http://likeminz.dotphoto.com"Life 
  is a sexually transmitted condition with 100% mortality and birth is as 
  safe as it gets." Unknown 
  
  

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  18/08/2006

Re: [ozmidwifery] NZ stats

[sally tracy]

e NO idea what the maternity system is costing the
Australian taxpayer. Certainly the payments are not tied to outcomes  -
it is a purely fee for service system 
Before I get of my soapbox  - i want to add just one more little scrap
of information that I learned very recently from a senior defense
lawyer in NSW.. When obstetricians have to pay their insurance rebates 
- the rebate is calculated according to the 'risk' of the applicant -
i.e. if there have been cases of litigation  - the premiums will be
higher. Our benevolent federal government kicks in and pays the
premiums of those doctors whose premiums are above a certain level  - I
would hazard a guess that this equates to the Australian taxpayer  -
i.e. you and me paying for the premiums of doctors who probably dont
have the best practicenow  - were you thinking that our system
is better than that across the ditch.
best wishes
Sally T.



brendamanning wrote:

  
  
  
  BEWARE:
REALITY CHECK:
  
I don't want to disillusion alot of you but a reality check is way
overdue about what's going on across the Tasman.
  
The saying: 'Be careful what you wish for.'
is very applicable here.
  
What MW have gained in autonomy, they have lost in the respect of their
professional colleagues, the community & women generally. The whole
maternity system has an 'uncomfortable feeling'.
  
I've thought alot before writing this all down, not wanting to 'upset'
people, & of course it grieves me because it's my home & I'd
love to be there !! 
SO here goes: this is looking at the situation without the 'rose tinted
spectacles'. But of course it's generalising in some aspects.
  
As a Kiwi who spends time every year in NZ & came through the
changes seeing the system evolve there, I feel I really need to say
that Aust would not be doing it's women a service to emulate the system
EXACTLY as it is implemented there. It may appear idyllic but it isn't,
and not a day goes by that there's not an article in some newspaper
there decrying Midwives (they are NOT popular 
politically & have created alot of emnity & alienated health
professionals with whom we would much rather have collaborative
practice) . There is a national midwifery shortage, the same as here
& because of the way the system is set up there large areas of the
country have women with reduced 
choices in pregnancy care, not enhanced.
  
I specifically went to the Manawatu, Wairarapa & Horewhenua
districts looking to relocate there 6 months ago. I go every year with
the same intention ie checking out the system & the situation. This
year I spoke to all Pg women I saw, esp around Carterton, Greytown for
those of you that know the area (because my elderly parents live in
Upper Hutt & I wanted to be close).
  
  
In Martinborough alone, (a small rural town), I saw 6 Pg women in the
street over the space of an hour & each one was birthing either in
Levin or Hutt Hospital (ie 1 hour drive North, or South through the
Rimutuka ranges, ie narrow & windy as hell, icy & sometimes
closed in winter ! ). There was no MW in their community, they were
totally horrified at the thought of birth at home & they had
reduced options because the GPs have been 'squeezed' out of providing
maternity care. I spoke with a group of IP in Levin & they are
overwhelmed & understaffed, travelling alot of mileage over narrow
windy roads to clinic. The majority of their births are in hospital
& they (the IPs) are turning women away because they are
overbooked. 
  One woman
in Wellington tried 13 MW before she found 1 as her LMC ! 
  
I was offered 10 jobs in 1 week ! 
  
There are few private maternity hospitals there.
  
I also have a very close friend in the outer Auckland region who keeps
me up to date with cuttings, emails etc. There is alot of general
dissatisfaction there with the whole system too.
  
There are alot of IPs who have 'burned out' & returned to the
hospital system over the last 4 years overwhelmed by work &
commitment to on call 24/7 because the women have no other options for
local care !
  
The system is not one to emulate here.
Surely we want more choice for women, not
less, and we certainly don't want to alienate our
professional colleagues who we need to be working WITH, not AGAINST.
  
I really believe that Aust MW need to look more closely at the system
in NZ before holding it up as a model of care they aspire to. It needs
alot of 'tweaking' to make it ideal.  I love NZ, but in this arena it's
not perfect & I think MW need to look very closely at the big
picture.
  
Off the soapbox now !!
  
  
With kind regards
Brenda Manning 
www.themidwife.com.au
  
- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Robertson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, July

Re: Fw: [ozmidwifery] Blood pressure...

[Sally Williams]

Hi Andrea,

Was wondering if you could contact me off list at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
am wanting to catch up for a chat.

Sally
- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Bilcliff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2006 4:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: [ozmidwifery] Blood pressure...



So did I.
Andrea Bilcliff

- Original Message - 


From: "Jo Bourne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


I did get it the first time... maybe some emails get through to some 
people but not everyone?


At 12:29 PM +1000 6/7/06, Stephen & Felicity wrote:
Sending this to the list for the second time as it mysteriously 
disappeared. >:o(



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Re: [ozmidwifery] community mid program WA

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Congratulations to one and all ... beautiful timing :)

Sally-Anne (Brown)

- Original Message - 
From: "Heartlogic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006 6:44 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] community mid program WA


Actually, NSW Health is really moving now. They have not only supported 
homebirth through the programme at St George, they have indicated that 
they support homebirth as an option generally. They are in fact, busy 
producing a guideline for health services who wish to provide homebirth 
services.


Our service manager, Anne Saxton (an absolutely amazing person and a 
visionary) has put in a submission to area executive for Belmont Birthing 
Service to offer homebirth as part of our service.


warmly, Carolyn


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[ozmidwifery] The 24th HBA Conference and spaces for children

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all
 
We sincerely appreciate the efforts everyone is 
making to attend the 24th Homebirth Australia Conference - now just one week 
away.
 
By way of clarification we have become aware that 
some delegates are bringing their children with them to the conference who have 
not advised us they are doing so.
 
As you can all appreciate - we have already had to 
move the conference once three weeks ago as the number of delegates booked to 
attend had more than doubled the numbers we had expected.  The only 
remaining available venue we could move to is the centre we have 
booked at the Mercure Hotel. It is not possible for us to move the venue again 
to cater for more delegates or children coming with delegates we were not 
advised of.
 
Please be aware we have clearly cited in our 
information pack to delegates the following points:
 
a) Breast - fed babies are warmly welcomed to 
attend the conference
 
b) We offerred childcare for delegates wishing to 
use this service and the childcare option is now FULLY BOOKED
 
c) There is an unfenced pool in one of the walkways 
between the function centre and the mercure hotel where all meal breaks and the 
conference expo will be held. The main foyer to the function centre leads 
directly onto the pool area and the doors will be closed but not locked.  
We do not have the staff to supervise children who may be coming and going from 
the funstion centre.  Full responsibility for children attending the 
conference must be taken by parents please as we absolutely snowed under in 
organising this eventand it is not reasonable to expect the handful of 
organisers to do this :)
 
We are now full booked at this venue and cannot 
offer childcare or a 'separate space' for children attending the 
conference.  Every seat in both venues for the program is taken by 
delegates, except of course breast -fed babies who are able to sit on a 
'lap'. Literally the only remaining space for children to sit is on the floor 
and it will not be possible to do this in front of the auditaurium as there 
is no room there - due to the live feed out we are doing for mums with unsettled 
bubs into the foyer and the audiovisual set up.
 
Please be aware the venue is a major 
hotel that has other guests staying - and is 
therefore essentially a public space - we do not have the staff or volunteers to 
either co-ordinate an off site additional childcare facility but for those 
delegates planning to attend with children we are not aware were coming to the 
event may want to consider organising this as another 
option. Some delegates have advised us they have a support person attending 
who is helping with childcare, primarily at the accommodation venue 
booked.  
 
We have made every effort to accommodate breast fed 
babies and children we have been advised of that are coming to the conference 
and have co-ordinated several parenting safe spaces to do this. We have aimed 
to honour the traditional philosophy of ensuring the venue is woman and 
baby and child friendly. Please be aware that if you are planning to bring a 
child to the conference we need to be advised of this asap if you have not 
already done so.
 
All information for delegates has been either 
emailed (or abt to be) as well as been available on the website at www.homebirthaustralia.org for 
your reference.  If I can be of further assistance please do not hesitate 
to contact me on 04319 46647 or by email. 
 
Please note you do not need to reconfirm a booking 
for childcare or advise us if you are bringing a breast fed baby if you have 
already advised us of this with your booking.
 
 
 
Warm Regards
 
 
Sally-Anne Brown
for the 24th Homebirth Australia Conference 
team
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[ozmidwifery] 24th HBA conf - Tickets nearly sold !

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all
 
Just to update you that the 24th Homebirth 
Australia Conference has just about sold out at the 'larger conference 
venue'.  We only have five tickets left and the program is now complete and 
available for viewing on the website.  Please note we do not do day only 
tickets.  There are only 20 spaces left for the conference 
dinner which will be held on sat july1.  Registration forms can be 
downloaded at www.homebirthaustralia.org 

 
We will be convening a national press conference on 
the issues for remote and rural women who have lost their local birthing 
services pre-conference on Friday June 30 at Parliament House Victoria, please 
stay tuned.  Women, babies, families, balloons and banners warmly 
welcomed to attend for a 'photo shoot' outside Parliament House at 12 
noon.
 
We look forward to seeing you all 
there...
 
Warm Regards
 
Sally-Anne Brown 
for the 24th Homebirth Australia conference 
team.
04319 466 47 
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Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] ctg stuff

[sally @ home]

Well said, Sue. There are 2 sides to the face of 
the choice coin...we may not agree with some women's choices, but if they are 
adamant and they have been given all the pros and cons then, really, who are we 
to dictate to them about what they choose?
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Susan 
  Cudlipp 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 2:20 
  PM
  Subject: Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] ctg 
  stuff
  
  
Choice is an interesting concept: if we 
truly support choice then surely even 'bad' choices should be 
respected?  One of our obs has joked about having a sign made for the 
ANC saying 'please do not ask for an induction as a refusal often offends' 
because the request comes so often.
However, the other obs will often agree to a 
woman's request without too much argument.  I have seen instances where 
the Ob has told the woman - you are not ready to birth, there is no reason 
to induce and if we try you will have a lengthy and horrible labour.  
The reply was "I DONT CARE- I WANT TO BE INDUCED" How can the ob refuse in 
this instance?  The reverse is not true - if a woman reaches T+10 she 
is booked for IOL - there is little 'choice' within our policy for anyone 
who wishes to wait longer - despite the evidence or the individual 
circumstances.   Occasionally requests for 'social' induction 
can be for very valid personal reasons and such instances should also be 
respected.
 I have discussed with some of 
our obs the mentality of agreeing to elective C/S for no other reason 
than maternal request, given that we are a public hospital - should we 
be wasting taxpayers money on non-essential surgery etc etc.  
Again the question of choice. If a woman demands an elective C/S despite 
discussion of the pros and cons, the usual route is to go with her wishes - 
presumably for fear of litigation if the birth does not go well.  I did 
challenge one ob who agreed without hesitation to a woman's request for 
repeat C/S and asked him what his attitude would have been if she had asked 
for VBAC - did not get much in the way of response!
Not saying that I agree with this you 
understand but it does cause some tricky moral dilemmas.
I feel the key issue is one of respect and 
honest discussion - ah but that is all too often missing within the medical 
model of care. That and education - women don't know that they have choices 
to challenge the usual practice of whoever their care provider happens to 
be, sadly those who do challenge are often seen as 'troublesome radicals' if 
their challenge is against 'routine' interventions. (Of course they are not 
seen the same way if their challenge is to request unecessary interventions! 
:-))
Sue
- Original Message - 
From: 
Emily 

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 8:49 
AM
Subject: Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] ctg 
stuff
hi all i have just finished the 'obstetrics' term of my 
course and over the 9 weeks i repetitively brought up my disgust with the 
use of CTGs against all the very high quality evidence that is out there 
against them, that noone refutes they just ignore. the wonderful 
obstetrician who was my supervisor (only one ive ever met that i like) 
agreed and said it is only collective inertia and fear that has led to 
everyone still using it. the fact that it has sneakily become the best 
practice standard. in the big cochrane review on the subject the only 
benefit seen was a reduction in neonatal seizures seen in the CTG group. 
this was used as evidence that it may reduce the incidence of cerebral palsy 
in this group also. actually, there was follow up studies done on all the 
studies included in the review some years later and it actually showed no 
difference in cerebral palsy rates in most studies. one study amazingly 
actually showed a higher rate of cerebral palsy in the CTG group !! this has 
been conveniently forgotten. CTGs are still sold to women as being a safety 
net to prevent cerebral palsy despite the fact that there is absolutely no 
evidence whatesoever of this being the caseall that remains to be the 
benefit of CTGs is for care providers. it makes many people feel safe to 
have a neat little print off documenting what has been happening. the other 
thing is that apparently in the court system, parents can only be 
'compensated' if a no fault verdict is made and that requires a CTG. 
anyway i wrote a huge article about this titled 'the irony of obstetric 
risk analysis'  and handed it in with my end of term work. i am waiting 
with bated breath to hear the f

Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?

[sally @ home]

You know, a lot of the time I feel trapped between a rock and hard place!! I 
know that what has been said is not a personal attack, but working in "the 
system" (and how bad am I for succumbing to that?) makes me, by default, 
part of the problem. This I find very hard. I worked for 14 years as an 
independent midwife, it was hard yakka but extremely rewarding in all 
regards...I loved it. However, I was bearly able to keep food on the table, 
and paying bills was a nightmare.My belief was to keep my bookings 
manageable so that I could be there for all the women I worked with. In that 
time I never missed a birth. I believed I was working truly 'with woman'.
In 2000 I went from homebirthing into a Level 3 referral hospital, because 
it was my misguided belief that I may learn something. (I had never worked 
with women with high risk pregnancies) and I really needed some financial 
stability in my life. The culture shock was immense and I spent the first 
few months wondering what the heck I had done. The midwives I worked with 
worked under the most horrendous conditions and time and time again I saw 
them raw with grief because they felt they were unable to give the care 
these women needed and were entitled to.
Last year I started work at a brand new hospital in Berwick. A 'low risk' 
midwifery led unit...we endeavor to work with women in the true sense, we 
buck the system as much as we are able, which is often, and we bend the 
rules constantly, however,it is hard given that the medical profession, 
especially anaesthetists, have us over a barrel...this is where the rock and 
the hard place come in. We buck the system and we are hauled over the coals 
by the 'programme' and the medical establishment, we tow the line and we are 
shot down in flames by people who regard anything to do with hospitals as 
anti birthing women. Considering the hard work and effort we go to to work 
with and enable women to achieve the experience that is their right, I find 
some of what has been said quite insulting. Sure, there are midwives out 
there that are more medical model than midwives in the true sense, but this 
can be said for all people from all walks of life, and yes some policies etc 
are frustrating to work within, but  unfortunately we can't work without 
them. Working in 'the system' is hard enough, it is a constant battle and an 
exhausting one at that. I am saddened by what I am reading and it just fuels 
my belief that midwifery is not where I want to be anymore.


Sally
--
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Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?

[sally @ home]

I have to say that, unfortunately, many women 
are not in tune enough with their bodies to know whether they have ruptured 
their membranes or not. this is evidenced by what they say on the phone...eg " 
I'm not sure if I have broken my waters or not".  And we have had 
incidences of women desperate to be induced tipping a glass of water down their 
pants to make it look like they have!!
 
Policies and guidelines are not necessarily 'a load 
of rubbish' either, they are not just a bunch of words written down at the whim 
of an individual person. Believe me, having been on a guidelines development 
committee, with everyone from the Director of Obstetrics to midwives from the 
birth centre. It has taken over 18 months to review and rewrite only a handful 
of guidelines. Unfortunately, we need these so that we all do the same 
thing.There is enough confliciting adveice dished out by midwives as it 
is.
Not all of these guidelines are restrictive and if 
women know enough to challenge them then I see that as good for the system. I 
just wish there were more women out there who would challenge the 
system.
 
However, whilst I was practicing as an independent 
midwife...I treated the women I was working with the respect and honour 
that they deserved and would definately watch and wait in cases like 
this.
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  jo 
  
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:26 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long 
  before synto is used?
  
  
  I always find it 
  amazing that what is happening to a woman’s body (i.e SROM) is not believed 
  and that she has to go in for ‘confirmation’. Surely the woman would know and 
  wouldn’t need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women can’t be 
  trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more 
  frustrating it gets.
   
  I supported at a 
  homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife 
  wouldn’t deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself 
  out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest 
  for 8 days – constant water trickling – 37 +1 labour started – 4 hours, 
  beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. 
   
  Times, clocks, 
  protocols, policies, it’s all a load of rubbish.
   
  Jo
   
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ homeSent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 
  AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long 
  before synto is used?
   
  
  We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman 
  rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, 
  either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an 
  abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours 
  after ROM. We ask to attend the unit 
  daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they 
  haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt 
  infusion.
  
   
  
  Sally
  

- Original Message - 


From: Kelly @ 
BellyBelly 

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 


Sent: 
Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AM

Subject: RE: 
[ozmidwifery] How long before synto is 
used?

 
How frustrating 
then, that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to 
induce labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep 
coming back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for 
synto! It’s a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having 
an ARM to ask to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not 
allow this? I get the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have 
asked many times if we can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do 
is walk the ward, and not leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to 
get things going, as mum ends anxious about the whole thing especially when 
you have such an unrealistic time frame to get things going! 

 
Obviously some 
cases are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, 
and the recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course 
makes it different but frustrating when you don’t have much info about, I 
think I need a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the 
internet mum found it hard to get any good information. She was only 
borderline for cholestasis, but the doctors were scaring her about what 
*could* happen and how they 
just don’t understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after 
only 2 hours despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. 
Just an assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting

Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?

[sally @ home]

We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with 
?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by 
history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, 
CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We 
ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous 
labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt 
infusion.
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Kelly @ 
  BellyBelly 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 
  AM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long 
  before synto is used?
  
  
  How frustrating then, 
  that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to induce 
  labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep coming 
  back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for synto! It’s 
  a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having an ARM to ask 
  to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not allow this? I get 
  the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have asked many times if we 
  can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do is walk the ward, and not 
  leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to get things going, as mum ends 
  anxious about the whole thing especially when you have such an unrealistic 
  time frame to get things going! 
   
  Obviously some cases 
  are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, and the 
  recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course makes it 
  different but frustrating when you don’t have much info about, I think I need 
  a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the internet mum found 
  it hard to get any good information. She was only borderline for cholestasis, 
  but the doctors were scaring her about what *could* happen and how they just don’t 
  understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after only 2 hours 
  despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. Just an 
  assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting stressed from the 
  labour – wouldn’t the induced labour be more likely to stress baby? And the 
  fact mum couldn’t cope with the contractions as well and then had peth? The 
  labour went quite quickly and it was all over in a few hours. 
  
  
  Best 
  Regards,Kelly 
  ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au 
  Gentle Solutions 
  From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth 
  Support - 
  http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] 
  On Behalf Of Debbie 
  SlaterSent: Thursday, 15 
  June 2006 12:05 AMTo: 
  ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long 
  before synto is used?
   
  The 
  UK’s NICE guidelines 
  inherited from the UK’s Royal College of Obs and Gynea 
  suggest that it is fine to leave pre-labour rupture of membranes up to 96 
  hours before induction of labour – see http://www.nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=17381
   
   
  
  Debbie 
  Slater
  Perth, WA
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] 
  On Behalf Of Kelly @ 
  BellyBellySent: Wednesday, 
  14 June 2006 8:48 PMTo: 
  ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] How long before 
  synto is used?
   
  For those who work in maternity 
  units, I am just wondering what the policy is in your unit in regards to how 
  long a woman can continue after her waters have broken before having synto put 
  up? There seems to be such pressure to put it up fairly quickly (after you ask 
  to at least wait at all!), with an average of about 1 hour before the woman 
  gets the pressure to speed things up.
  Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, 
  BellyBelly.com.au 
  Gentle 
  Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth 
  Support - 
  http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
   
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] Extension of abstracts poster presentation HBA conf

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all - due to a cple of requests to extend the 
call for abstracts we have rescheduled the close of submissions to Friday June 
9, 2006. There will be a prize awarded to the most innovative poster 
presented.
 
 
 
 
Call for Abstracts  deadline extended to June 9, 2006: 

 
Poster Presentations 24th 
Homebirth Australia Conference 
 
 
Background:
Homebirth Australia is holding the 24th HBA 
national conference July 1-2, 2006 in Geelong,Victoria.  The 
conference is titled "Bringing birth back 
Home". Central to the theme is that 
care
from a known midwife is a safe model of care and 
represents the gold standard for care given 
to women through pregnancy,birth and postnatally. 
Many women in regional and rural areas of Australiaare unable to access this 
model of care.  International and Australian speakers will share their 
ideas and plans to enable birth to be reclaimed by women and "bought home" into 
their communities to improve the outcomes forAustralian women and their 
families.Submissions of abstracts are warmly welcomed by 
conference delegates of current research or midwifery projects to be 
displayed at the 24th Homebirth Australia 
conference.  The criteria for submissions is 
as follows:
 
1) Abstracts of no more than 200 
words are to be sent to the 24th Homebirth Australia Conference poster 
presentation selection committee by email or hard copy outlining the name of the 
project, institution, authors and content of poster presentation by 
COB June 9 2006. Please include your 
name, address, phone and email details.
 
2) Priority will be given to current 
projects relevant to the conference theme of "bringing birth back home" to local 
communities for Indigenous and non-Indigenous women across remote and 
rural Australia.  Relevant research projects that identify or aim 
to improve access to homebirth, one-to-one midwifery care or relevant 
maternity issues will also be considered.
3) Priority will be given to researchers who are 
also registered as a delegate at the conference.
 
All submissions will be considered 
and we aim to include as many as possible.  All applicants will be 
notified of the outcome of their submissions by June 12, 2006. Please 
note the criteria for the size of the final poster presentation is strictly no bigger than  50 cms width x 
75 cm length (poster size).
 
The poster 
presentations will provide an opportunity for information exchange, 
exposure for the researcher/project and generates the theme of 
'continuation' and 'reclamation'. There will be an opportunity for 
successful applicants to speak 
with other delegates about their poster presentation during all meal 
breaks. In addition a prize will be given for the best poster presentation 
as determined by conference delegates. Submission of 
abstracts are as follows please:
 
1) 
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] with 
'Submission of poster abstract for 24th HBA Conference' written in the subject 
heading of the email please.
 
or
2) Mail postmarked 
on or before June 9 2006 to the 
following address: 
24th Homebirth Australia Conference poster presentation selection 
committee
c/- Penny 
Lalor,
16 Lawton 
Avenue
Geelong West VIC 
3218
For more information 
please contact Penny Lalor: (03) 52218375 or [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Information about conference registration can 
be found athttp://www.homebirthaustralia.org/conference.html  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] homebirth conference

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Lyn
 
The conference venue is approximately 20 minutes 
walk from the Mercure and dble rooms start at a special conference rate of $139 
per room per night.  The rooms at the Geelong Conference Centre are now 
limited in numbers but are $97 per room per night including breakfast. 
Both venues are very comfortable.  The accommodation co-ordinator for the 
conference is Diana Stubbs and Diana can be emailed at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
Kind Regards
 
 
Sally-Anne Brown

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  lyn 
  lyn 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 6:01 PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] homebirth 
  conference
  
  This is a request to the melbourne 
  members
   
  I'm going to the conference and being from Sydney 
  and working with a budget im seeking advice on  
  accommodation.
   
  Where are other staying?  Are both the 
  conference centre and the Mecure comfortable?  The Mecure is slightly 
  cheaper but will I be spending much on taxis getting from there to the 
  conference?   I am working from a budget.
   
  I am getting so excited to see these great women 
  is real life.
   
  Linda.
   
   
   
  
  

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Fw: [ozmidwifery] travel knowlege

[Sally-Anne Brown]

sorry -to clarify (night duty blur) 
 
to railway is abt 5 mins by bus
to melb is the one hr by train
 
Sally-Anne :)
xo
- Original Message - 
From: Sally-Anne Brown 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 11:03 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] travel knowlege

Dear Mary 
 
The closest railway is Geelong Station and the 
local women are organising a bus to transport delegates to and from the 
railway.  The trip  is about one hour.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mary 
  Murphy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 9:41 
AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] travel 
  knowlege
  
  
  Hi all, this is not about 
  midwifery but I hope someone can help- possibly someone from  Geelong.  I will be 
  attending the Homebirth conf in July.  After that I want to travel by 
  train to Melbourne.  I will be staying at the 
  Conference centre and want to know which railway station is closest as I will 
  have to book out about 5.30am to catch the train.  Thanks, 
  MM
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] travel knowlege

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Mary 
 
The closest railway is Geelong Station and the 
local women are organising a bus to transport delegates to and from the 
railway.  The trip  is about one hour.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mary 
  Murphy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 9:41 
AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] travel 
  knowlege
  
  
  Hi all, this is not about 
  midwifery but I hope someone can help- possibly someone from  Geelong.  I will be 
  attending the Homebirth conf in July.  After that I want to travel by 
  train to Melbourne.  I will be staying at the 
  Conference centre and want to know which railway station is closest as I will 
  have to book out about 5.30am to catch the train.  Thanks, 
  MM
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] EFM on satellite systems

[Sally-Anne Brown]

yes and the company that sells them had a stand at 
the icm and quoted one hospital where i worked abt 500, 000 bucks to set up 
three rooms with their machines and the midwives station desk etc (of course the 
true costs only came out when we dragged it out of them).  i wondered what 
the women would think abt their 500,000 been spent in this way. 
 
not to mention the very basics that had not been 
covered like NOT using dodgy paper so CTG's can also be stored over the 35 
odd years required.
 
Sally-Anne (Brown)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Kelly @ 
  BellyBelly 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 1:55 
PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] EFM on satellite 
  systems
  
  
  I was at a birth the last few days 
  @ RWH and the midwives were telling me hospitals (RWH included) are soon 
  changing to new EFM machines which are linked to a satellite system, so women 
  can be monitored by the midwives from the ward desk. They were joking about it 
  too, how they could have a loudspeaker go off and ask them to adjust the 
  monitor next, should it not be in the right spot. Does anyone know anything 
  more about this and what are your thoughts? One to one midwifery care seems 
  further off sometimes, which is very, very sad…
  Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, 
  BellyBelly.com.au 
  Gentle 
  Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth 
  Support - 
  http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
   
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] World Health Day

[Sally-Anne Brown]

 
Dear all, 
Today is World Health Day and the theme for World 
Health Day 2006 is "Working together for health." It was chosen to highlight the 
international shortage of health workers, and how best to attract and retain 
medical personnel. 
 
 
... the link for world health report is cited below as is the WHO media 
release
http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2006/pr19/en/
 
 

World Health Day 2006 
Health workforce crisis is having a deadly impact on many 
countries' ability to fight disease and improve health, new WHO report warns 
World Health Report outlines need for more investment in health 
workforce to improve working conditions, revitalize training institutions and 
anticipate future challenges 
7 APRIL 2006 | GENEVA/LUSAKA/LONDON -- A serious shortage of health 
workers in 57 countries is impairing provision of essential, life-saving 
interventions such as childhood immunization, safe pregnancy and delivery 
services for mothers, and access to treatment for HIV/AIDS, malaria and 
tuberculosis. This shortage, combined with a lack of training and knowledge, is 
also a major obstacle for health systems as they attempt to respond effectively 
to chronic diseases, avian influenza and other health challenges, according to 
The World Health Report 2006 - Working together for health, published today by 
the World Health Organization (WHO).
More than four million additional doctors, nurses, midwives, managers and 
public health workers are urgently needed to fill the gap in these 57 countries, 
36 of which are in sub-Saharan Africa, says the Report, which is highlighted by 
events in many cities around the world to mark World Health Day. Every country 
needs to improve the way it plans for, educates and employs the doctors, nurses 
and support staff who make up the health workforce and provide them with better 
working conditions, it concludes.
"The global population is growing, but the number of health workers is 
stagnating or even falling in many of the places where they are needed most," 
said WHO Director-General Dr LEE Jong-wook. "Across the developing world, health 
workers face economic hardship, deteriorating infrastructure and social unrest. 
In many countries, the HIV/AIDS epidemic has also destroyed the health and lives 
of health workers."
The World Health Report sets out a 10-year plan to address the crisis. It 
calls for national leadership to urgently formulate and implement country 
strategies for the health workforce. These need to be backed by international 
donor assistance.
Infectious diseases and complications of pregnancy and delivery cause at 
least 10 million deaths each year. Better access to health workers could prevent 
many of those deaths. There is clear evidence that as the ratio of health 
workers to population increases, so in turn does infant, child and maternal 
survival.
"Not enough health workers are being trained or recruited where they are most 
needed, and increasing numbers are joining a brain drain of qualified 
professionals who are migrating to better-paid jobs in richer countries, whether 
those countries are near neighbours or wealthy industrialized nations. Such 
countries are likely to attract even more foreign staff because of their ageing 
populations, who will need more long-term, chronic care," said WHO Assistant 
Director-General Dr Timothy Evans.
To tackle this crisis, more direct investment in the training and support of 
health workers is needed now. Initial costs will be for the training of more 
health workers. As they graduate and enter the workforce, funds will be needed 
to pay their salaries. Health budgets will have to increase by at least US$10 
per person per year in the 57 countries with severe shortages to educate and pay 
the salaries of the four million health workers needed to fill the gap. To meet 
that target within 20 years is an ambitious but reasonable goal, the Report 
concludes.
Financing this gap will require significant, dedicated and predictable 
funding from national sources, as well as from international development 
partners. The Report recommends that of all new donor funds for health, 50% 
should be dedicated to strengthening health systems, of which 50% should be 
dedicated specifically to training, retaining and sustaining the health 
workforce.
At least 1.3 billion people worldwide lack access to the most basic 
healthcare, often because there is no health worker. The shortage is global, but 
the burden is greatest in countries overwhelmed by poverty and disease where 
these health workers are needed most. Shortages are most severe in sub-Saharan 
Africa, which has 11% of the world's population and 24% of the global burden of 
disease but only 3% of the world's health workers.
The Report calls for prompt and innovative initiatives to improve efficiency. 
For example, HIV/AIDS, TB and other priority disease programmes have implemented 
ways for health workers with limited formal training to successfully 

Re: [ozmidwifery] Article: Premmie Babies 'Bed Blocking'

[sally tracy]

Dear  list,
there is no excuse for the use of insensitive and offensive language
for example the use of the word 'bed blocking'. The production line
language is in  common parlance unfortunately.. I recommend the
recent paper by Denis Walsh published in the journal Social Science
& Medicine 62 (2006) 1330–1340 ,
"Subverting the assembly-line: Childbirth in a free-standing birth
centre".
I also think that the discussion needs to focus more on the practice of
RCOG and other professional groups who need to re-examine the advice
they give women regarding elective caesarean section. I'm sure our
research will show that the rise in the rate of admission of babies who
are 'drugged' at birth and plucked from their mothers via CS and also
those who are born by CS too early  - i.e. younger than 39 completed
weeks gestationare the real reason why so many intensive beds
are taken up  - often these babies are admitted for 24 hours or longer 
- sometimes even on ventilators if the RDS is bad enough,and
both these circumstances are easily preventable!!!.
ST

Gloria Lemay wrote:

  
  
  
  
  Wise words, Nicole.  We all have to
look at the reality of medical costs that are skyrocketing and
never-ending technology that we can buy but can't afford.  Gloria in
Canada
  
-
Original Message - 
From:
Nicole Carver 
To:
ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au

Sent:
Saturday, April 01, 2006 3:03 PM
Subject:
RE: [ozmidwifery] Article: Premmie Babies 'Bed Blocking'


How sad. A more valid point to discuss is the
suffering that some of these babies go through, which should be weighed
against chance of survival and later quality of life. There is a lot
that is done to these babies to keep them alive, that must must be
incredibly painful and distressing. Good palliative care for some,
would be far kinder in their brief lives than intercostal tubes,
arterial lines, ventilation, gastric tubes, tape all over their face
which pulls off their skin when changed, noisy, scary environments etc.

 
However, what a heart rending decision to
make. I am greatful for my three healthy children, born vaginally at
term. No miscarriages or even any scares. How precious life is.
 
Perhaps
there should be more done in the prevention of prematurity, such as
reducing the stress of pregnant women in lower socio-economic groups by
running support groups and providing one to one midwifery care, and
more intervention to help women stop smoking.
 
Nicole.

  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Kelly
@ BellyBelly
  Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 10:19 PM
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Article: Premmie Babies 'Bed
Blocking'
  
  
  
  This was apparently on
Sky… makes you sick to the stomach…
   
  Fury
Over Baby Comments 
Updated: 14:38, Monday March 27, 2006 
  
Doctors have provoked controversy by suggesting premature babies should
not always be treated because they are "bed blocking". 
  
They said that in some cases, premature babies born under 25 weeks
should be allowed to die. 
  
The Royal College Of Obstetricians And Gynaecologists said space in
neo-natal units was often in short supply. 
  
They said this was the result of "bed-blocking" by very sick premature
babies. 
  
The Royal
  College said
such beds could be better used to treat babies with a higher chance of
survival than sick premature ones. 
  
Professor Sir Alan Craft, of the Royal College of Paediatrics, said:
"Many paediatricians would be in favour of adopting the Dutch model of
no active intervention for these very little babies. 
  
"The vast majority of children born at this gestation who do survive
have significant disabilities. 
  
"There is a lifetime cost and that needs to be taken into the equation
when society tries to decide whether it wants to intervene." 
  
However, premature babies charity Bliss described the idea as a "gross
abuse of human rights". 
  
Chief executive Rob Williams said: "We might as well have a policy of
not treating victims of car crashes which occur at over 50 miles an
hour, or denying medical services to those over a certain age."
   
  __
   
  Then
this:
   
  Premature
babies are blocking beds, says royal medical college 
By Amy Iggulden 
(Filed: 27/03/2006) 
  
Premature babies who need months of expensive care have been accused of
"bed blocking" by one of Britain's royal medical colleges, it emerged
yesterday. 
Sarah and James Cummings 
Sara Cummings and her son James, now a healthy five-year-old, who was
born at just 24 weeks 
  
In a consultation document, the Royal College of Obstetrics and
Gynaecology (RCOG) said that very premature babies were taking up
intensive care space that could be used for healthier babies. 

Re: [ozmidwifery] PPH & C/S

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Kelly
 
Re PPH: 
It would be interesting to find out if this woman 
was induced or had active management in last 2 births. Her body may not repond 
well to the syntoIf she can get onto a good 
homeopath 'Ustilago Maidus' is excellent for prevention of pph  but must 
have dosage determined by qualified homeopath.  Have seen this 
used very effectively in a small number of women for abt 10 yrs where woman 
has had a previous pph and none with remedy. It is not one of the regular 
homeopathics used.  Newtons Pharmacy in Sydney stock it and will do postal 
orders if her homeopath does not stock it.
 
Re ? G.D
Diet sounds good as Gloria has suggested and if she 
has G.D and is doing her BSL's and they are high . the Australian Bush 
Flower essence Peach Flowered Tea Tree is excellent.  I have seen a number 
of women over the years who are on insulin (sliding scale used to determine 
dose) for G.D use the essence and within 2-5 days have reduced BSL's and have 
not required and more insulin for the remainder of the 
pregnancy. 
 
It could be this woman is tall and a little 
longer herself and has big bubs  one woman I know all her bubs are 
11-13 pounds and she has never had GD,  always normal vaginal births and 
peri intact everytime.  
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Kelly @ 
  BellyBelly 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 4:26 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] PPH & 
C/S
  
  
  Hello 
  all,
   
  A woman on my forums has had two 
  normal births of big babies – 11lb3oz and 13lb5oz and had a PPH with both. Her 
  Ob is now recommending a c/s with her third 
  bub and wants a scan at 34 weeks as a deciding factor of this. She wants a 
  normal birth – is it okay just for her to say no without too much risk with 
  PPH?
  Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, 
  BellyBelly.com.au 
  Gentle 
  Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth 
  Support - 
  http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
   
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] H*lp please - Article in the Sun Herald

[Sally-Anne Brown]

David
 
I will try and get a copy for you but when a 
similar thing has happenned to me in rural Vic... if you call the paper they can 
send copies either directly to you or your local newsagent (if you have one 
!).  As well as copies been kept in most libraries (public, uni etc) is 
worth keeping in mind.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Great 
  Birth & Men at Birth 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2006 4:02 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] H*lp please - 
  Article in the Sun Herald
  
  Dear 
  Folks,
  
  Apparently 
  last Sunday (26 March) in the Sun-Herald (Sydney paper) on page 76 there is an 
  article called "Lonely beginnings for fathers of the 
  revolution."  
  I provided some 
  material for this article and the journalist was going to let me see it before it went to 
  print.  Unfortunately she never let me know it was being published last weekend and therefore I 
  have been unable to get 
  a copy of the article (I live outside Canberra and by the time I found out about it no 
  Canberra newsagents had a copy).
  
  I have 
  tried contacting the journo but she has gone on maternity leave!  And the paper won't give me 
  her contact details.
  
  Does 
  anyone have a copy of it that they could send me?  I will 
  of course pay postage 
  costs.
  
  Any help 
  you can offer would be greatly appreciated.
  
  Cheers,
  
  David
  
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  http://www.acmi.org.au/menatbirth.htm
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Uns*bscribing from the list

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all -

Just to reiterate what Kim has said and to clarify further as Kim kindly did 
for me a few yrs ago when I had a break from the list and couldn't get off !
The command should be written in the BODY of the email NOT in the subject 
heading.


Kind Regards
Sally-Anne
- Original Message - 
From: "Kim Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2006 9:25 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Uns*bscribing from the list



Hi everyone,

I've been made aware that a few people are
having problems uns*bscribing from the list.

Note that I am replacing the "u" with an
asterisk so that the message reaches the
list, in the instructions following ignore the *,
ie don't cut and paste without replacing it
with a "u".

The basic instructions are as follows:

Send an email to:

  [EMAIL PROTECTED]

In text only (not formated text) type the words

  uns*bscribe ozmidwifery

You should receive an email back from the list
to authorise the command.

Please follow these instructions and if you have
any problems, please email me directly with
the details and I'll do my best to assist.

Regards
Kim
List Admin



---
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List Administration
Birth International
ACE Graphics and Associates in Childbirth Education

http://www.birthinternational.com/
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [ozmidwifery] on the subject of induction

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Yes ...as in contacts ... not sure where published 
(and if published yet)
 
1) Sally Tracy et al .. presented at the Midwife 
Unit Day Newcastle Uni November 2005.  (contact Sally for details of 
publication - possibly cited in smaller units paper published dec 2005 
BJOG. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
2) Allison and Brett Shorten (presented at 
conference Melbourne late 2005).  Probably unpublished at this point but 
you can email Allison also to get an update on this [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Janet 
  Fraser 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 8:49 
AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] on the subject 
  of induction
  
  Hi Sally-Anne,
  do you have refs for those 
  studies?
  Cheers,
  J
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Sally-Anne Brown 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 6:29 
AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] on the 
subject of induction

Dear all
 
re IOL and c/s.
two australian authors have looked at c/s with 
epidural block. 
both concluded it is around 60% with 
edb.
both authors tracy et al and shorten and 
shorten (university of wollongong) found it to be at 60% not 50% and the 
latter researchers found this to be so regardless of whether there was IOL 
or not.
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mary 
  Murphy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 11:29 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] on the 
  subject of induction
  
  
  Amy asks "Is the "failed induction-requiring C/s" 
  rate really around 50%?"
  Monica replies "no, IOLs resulting in CS at 
  something like 32%" 
   
  Ooo-err!  Not a ½ 
   only 1/3.  Still a lot of inductions result in C/s. I see Amy’s 
  dilemma.  According to the medical advice she has ¼ chance of 
  stillbirth if she doesn’t have an early induction, 1/3  chance of C/S 
  if she does. I can see why women would throw in the towel and choose 
  elective C/S.  At least it is a sure thing without the last minute 
  drama.  MM
   
   
   
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Re: [ozmidwifery] on the subject of induction

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Yes - that comparison is made in the study by 
Shorten & Shorten - not sure of the demographic - but likely to be 
in NSW.
 
 
SA
xo

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mary 
  Murphy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 10:23 
  AM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] on the subject 
  of induction
  
  
  So to clarify, you 
  mean that C/S is 60% in labours with Epidural regardless of whether it was 
  spontaneous labour or Induction? MM
   
  
  
  
  
  
  Sally-Anne 
  wrote: re IOL and c/s.two australian 
  authors have looked at c/s with epidural block. both concluded it is around 
  60% with edb.
  
  both authors tracy et al and 
  shorten and shorten (university of wollongong) found it to be at 60% not 50% 
  and the latter researchers found this to be so regardless of whether there was 
  IOL or not.
  
   
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] on the subject of induction

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all
 
re IOL and c/s.
two australian authors have looked at c/s with 
epidural block. 
both concluded it is around 60% with 
edb.
both authors tracy et al and shorten and 
shorten (university of wollongong) found it to be at 60% not 50% and the latter 
researchers found this to be so regardless of whether there was IOL or 
not.
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mary 
  Murphy 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 11:29 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] on the subject 
  of induction
  
  
  Amy asks "Is the "failed induction-requiring C/s" rate 
  really around 50%?"
  Monica replies "no, IOLs resulting in CS at something 
  like 32%" 
   
  Ooo-err!  Not a ½  only 
  1/3.  Still a lot of inductions result in C/s. I see Amy’s dilemma.  
  According to the medical advice she has ¼ chance of stillbirth if she doesn’t 
  have an early induction, 1/3  chance of C/S if she does. I can see why 
  women would throw in the towel and choose elective C/S.  At least it is a 
  sure thing without the last minute drama.  
MM
   
   
   
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[ozmidwifery] 24th Homebirth Australia Conference - Air Travel Info

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all
 
Just a quick note for prospective delegates 
attending the 24th Homebirth Australia Conference, 
Geelong July 1-2 this year.
 
 
Re Air Travel:
 
Virgin Blue have a sale on 
commenced yesterday with flights in and out of Melbourne.   www.virginblue.com.au 
 


  GO FOR GOLD IN AND OUT OF MELBOURNE
  
  
Travelling Between
FARES FROM
+ taxes etc

  
Launceston ↔Melbourne
$69


  
Newcastle ↔Melbourne
$69

  
Hobart ↔Melbourne
$85

  
Canberra ↔Melbourne
$89

  
Adelaide ↔Melbourne
$95

  
Sydney ↔Melbourne
$105

  
Sunshine Coast ↔Melbourne
$109

  
Gold Coast ↔Melbourne
$109

  
Brisbane ↔Melbourne
$139

  
Coffs Coast ↔Melbourne
$155

  
Cairns ↔Melbourne
$159

  
Darwin ↔Melbourne
$199

  
Perth ↔Melbourne
$215

 
 
 
Also reasonable fares from Perth, Adelaide, 
Sydney etc 
 
1)  Qantas  www.qantas.com.au  (prices incl. of taxes) - some great sydney, adelaide 
and perth fares at present for June 30 to melb
 
2) Jetstar - which is the 
only airline that flies to Avalon airport melbourne (near geelong) www.jetstar.com.au
which has a great brisbane fare at 
present.   As Jetstar flies out of Melbourne 
from both Tullamarine and Avalon, please make sure you travel from the correct 
airport - refer to the Jetstar flight schedule.  
Services to and from Adelaide, Brisbane and 
Sydney operate from Avalon, while all other routes operate from 
Tullamarine.
 
3) Ozjet  www.ozjet.com.au - only do flights from 
perth and syd and they are currently at least dble the price of the other 
airlines.
 
 
Please note: Re Transfers
 
1) Tullamarine Airport Shuttle 

For those of you who prefer to fly to Melbourne 
(Tullamarine) we recommend you come the day before (june 30) the conference 
begins if possible to arrive please in Geelong 2pm-5pm for check in at the 
conference centre accommodation if you are planning to stay on site. A 
shuttle service operates regularly from melb airport to Geelong and they 
will be able to drop you to the door at a cost of $40-45 return. Their website 
has timetable and fare details available on line www.gull.com.au 
 
 
2) Avalon Airport Shuttle 
- Services between 
Geelong and Avalon:  www.avalonairportshuttle.com.au
Services between Avalon airport and Geelong, 
Bellarine Peninsula and the Great Ocean Road are operated by Avalon Airport 
Shuttle.  One-way trips cost $12 per adult 
to Geelong Bus Port. Door to Door service is 
available throughout Geelong, Bellarine Peninsula and the Great Ocean Road. For 
prices phone (03) 52 788 788. Bus Services from 
Geelong are timed to coincide with the Jetstar schedule. Passengers using the 
Avalon Airport Shuttle service to the airport should remember to check departure 
times on (03) 52 788 788.  
 
We will advise further if these services will offer 
a conference rate ...
 
For conference information and 
bookings email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Fw: [ozmidwifery] Re: University research.....

[Sally-Anne Brown]

RESENDING
 
- Original Message - 
From: Sally-Anne Brown 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 6:56 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: University research.

Dear Donna and all,
The Australian Society of Independent Midwives 
(ASIM) meets monthly (usually) in Sydney and provides a supportive environment 
for debriefing for midwives in private practice as well as an opportunity for 
peer review. ASIM has been operating for abt 15 odd yrs. Jan Robinson is the 
convenor and can be contacted by email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
In Victoria Midwives in Private Practice (MIPP) 
also meets regularly on a similar basis.  You can reach Joy Johnston also 
by email on [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
In WA the CMWA provides this role for midwives and 
their webpage can also be found on the net http://www.communitymidwives.org.au/
 
The ACMI have set up and email list for midwives 
with the intention of enabling this type of debriefing to occur www.acmi.org.au
Under the section 'for midwives'.  Whilst the 
midwives chat list appears to be aimed at a more general discussion there 
is also a rural midwives list which does provide a more informal space 
for discussion and debriefing/support.
 
I think you will find that most birth units also 
have a process for staff to debrief with collaegues/management on either a 
formal or informal basis.
 
The Independent Midwife organisations have provided 
a supportive role for a number of years in Australia as one of the many 
services they have pioneeered in this country - like 'one-to-one midwifery care' 
- which is a term now used by many models of midwife care in this country, 
essentially aiming to copy this model, but the Independent Midwife model 
actually remains the only one that continues to provide this care.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  brendamanning 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 5:18 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: University 
  research.
  
  I have found, by 
  & large, that (perhaps because) we are a nurturing & caring 
  profession we tend to look after one another. 
  We probably do most of 
  our debriefing with our partners, friends & colleagues, as Janet says in 
  'an informal manner'. 
  Our network offers 
  formal debriefing & counselling should it be required, through a 
  professional counselling service. 
  I've never felt the 
  need to go elsewhere myself to deal with work related issues, but I am 
  speaking generally & don't profess to express the views of 
  my peers.
   
  With kind regardsBrenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Janet 
Fraser 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 4:30 
PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: 
University research.

I've long thought this 
should happen and I think some MWs have informal groups where they debrief. 
My forums have a private CP section where great stuff happens and I'm sure 
there are other places like that too. Is there are reason MWs haven't set 
this up for themselves?
Needs to be 
encouraged!!!
J

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Dleh71 
  
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 
  4:21 PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: University 
  research.
  Hi,I am a regiseterd nurse and 
  a student midwife.I am currently researching if there are any support 
  services for midwives.Because this is quite an emotionally draining 
  area to work in, and currently there seems very little support is 
  available for midwives.I have spoken with the NSW Nurses & 
  Midwives Board, NSWNA, NSW Midwives Association, ACMI, ANF, College of 
  Nursing - all of these had very little to no support services for 
  midwives. I have also emailed the Maternity Coalition, no reply as 
  yet.The support services could be e-based, phone, or in person.I 
  thought someone might be able to help.Thankyou.Donna 
  Houghton.Message 
  sent using Dodo Internet Webmail Server -- This mailing list is 
  sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to 
  subscribe or unsubscribe. 
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] Nice Guidelines postnatal care - 2nd consult

[Sally-Anne Brown]

  
  

  Fyi- 2nd consultation Feb 6-March 6 NICE guidelines 
  postnatal care
  SA
   
   
  Postnatal care: second consultation
  

  
  A clinical practice guideline on Postnatal care is 
  being developed for use in the NHS in England and Wales. Registered 
  stakeholders for the Postnatal care guideline are invited 
  to comment on the provisional guideline recommendations via this 
  website.
  Although individuals and organisations not registered as stakeholders 
  are able to comment, we recommend that you contact the registered 
  stakeholder organisation that most closely represents your interests and 
  pass your comments to them. We work closely with stakeholder organisations 
  and take their views very seriously.
  
List of registered stakeholders and information on the progress for 
this guideline topic - Click here 
  Note that the provisional guideline recommendations presented here 
  do not constitute the Institute's formal guidance on this guideline topic. 
  The recommendations are provisional and may change after 
  consultation.
  Consultation dates: 6th February - 6th March 2006
  Consultation documents:
  
Full version 
Appendices 
NICE version 
Information for the Public guide 
Comments proforma 
  The full version describes the evidence and 
  views that have been considered, and sets out the provisional guideline 
  recommendations that have been developed - these may have been revised in 
  the light of comments made during the first consultation period.
  The (NICE) short version presents the 
  provisional guideline recommendations only with some brief supporting 
  information. Again the recommendations may have been revised following the 
  first round of consultation. (It is the finalised short version that is 
  issued to the NHS as guidance.)
  The Information for the Public has been 
  prepared to help people who may be affected by the guideline 
  recommendations understand what the provisional recommendations mean; this 
  information was not available during the first consultation period.
  Points to consider in the second consultation:
  During this consultation period, you may want to
  
Review the changes that have been made to the full guideline and/or 
the short version 
Comment on the key recommendations for implementation selected by 
the guideline developers 
Comment on the usefulness of the information that describes the 
provisional guideline recommendations in easy-to-understand language 
(Information for the Public) 
Make final comments on the guideline prior to publication. 
  How to submit your comments:
  Please use the comments proforma above and return by email to
  
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] or on a disk to:
  
Sarah Dunsdon Guidelines Coordinator National Institute for 
Health & Clinical Excellence MidCity Place 71 High Holborn 
London WC1V 6NA
  The Institute is unable to accept: 
  
More than one response per stakeholder organisation 
Comments received after the consultation deadline 
Comments that are not on the correct proforma 
Confidential information or other material that you would not wish 
to be made public 
Personal medical information about yourself or another person from 
which your or the person's identity could be ascertained. 
  What will happen to your comments:
  
All comments (with the exception of personal, individual comments) 
will be sent to the developers at the end of the consultation 
Comment from registered stakeholders ONLY will be formally responded 
to by the developers and posted on the NICE website after the final 
guidelines are published 
Personal, individual comments will be forwarded to the Patient 
Involvement Unit for NICE, who will consider them when making their 
response. 
  Acknowledgement of comments: 
  You should receive an automated acknowledgement from the email box when 
  you email your comments. If you do not receive this acknowledgement, 
  please contact the relevant Guidelines Coordinator to ensure they have 
  been safely received.
  Anticipated publication date: June 2006
   
  


  
REPORT ON BREAST FEEDING 
Running in parallel to this consultation is an effective action 
briefing on the initiation and duration of breastfeeding. This 
document presents draft evidence-based recommendations for promoting 
the initiation and continuation of breastfeeding, particularly among 
population groups where breastfee

Re: [ozmidwifery] repair surgery and bf

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Janet and all, 
Just sharing a friend's experience of surgery and 
b/feeding - no doubt just adds to the 'common sense' approach being articulated 
on the list.
 
After baby no 3 (all born at home in the US) 
midwife notices a goitre and suggests again (as GP had missed it) to seek 
medical advice.  Large tumour size of a golf ball found on thyroid.  
Had only 2 weeks prep time before having tumour removed and radiation therapy 
commenced soon after.  During radiation she had to be isolated for 2 
weeks in hosi followed by a further 1-2 weeks at a friend's holiday farm to 
recover and not be near her kids (radiation stuff).
So at 10 weeks Baby A continued to 
be breastfed as normal throughout whole hosi stay (surgery part) till 
radiation commenced.  Her closest friends including sister-in-law who also 
had a newborn pumped like mad for the 2 .5 weeks prior to radiation starting 
(and kept going) and dad bottlefed bub the truck load of ebm until mum came home 
just under 4 weeks later.  Baby A took to the breast like a hand to a glove 
and Baby No 4 also born at home in water 3 odd yrs later.  Mum well - 
healed beutifully- no further probs ... thanks to her loving midwife, family and 
friends.  
 
Makes you wonder though why they do so many caesers 
if a woman can't heal cos she's breastfeeding...Might be good to write to this OB and thank them for giving us such a 
valuable piece of info for the 'campaign'.. :)
 
Sally-Anne
xo

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Janet 
  Fraser 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:52 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] repair surgery and 
  bf
  
  Hi all,
  a woman with horrific 
  injuries inflicted during a ventouse has been told she can't have repair 
  surgery unless she weans her 4 month old and waits 3 months. Her labia was 
  torn off on one side, right up to her clitoris and she can barely walk, is on 
  strong pain killers and the only thing she *can* do is bf. Her life has been 
  shattered by this so she really needs surgery.
  Thoughts, 
  please?
  TIA,
  J
  Joyous Birth Home Birth 
  Forum - a world first!http://www.joyousbirth.info/
   
  Attending births is like 
  growing roses. You have to marvel at the ones that just open up and bloom at 
  the first kiss of the sun but you wouldn't dream of pulling open the petals of 
  the tightly closed buds and forcing them to blossom to your time line. 
  
   
  ~Gloria Lemay~
   
   
   
   
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] 24th HOMEBIRTH AUSTRALIA CONFERENCE

[Sally-Anne Brown]

 
Dear all 
 
Apologies for cross - postings..
 
On behalf of the Homebirth Australia Conference 
Committee we are delighted to announce on this auspicious day (Full 
moon in Leo) the 24th Homebirth Australia Conference will be held in 
Geelong Victoria on July 1st and 2nd.  Please note the date, 
venue, speakers and booking details cited below.  The committee is working 
very hard to raise funds to keep costs low and the event accessible for women. 
In the event you can assist (even by long distance) your efforts would be warmly 
appreciated - please email [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you 
can help
 
Also featured at the conference will be a tribute 
to the late Joan Donley and Jeannine Parvatti Baker as well as a ceremony of our 
midwife elders and wise ones 'handing down their knowledge' to the younger 
midwives - to keep those homefires burning.  There will be of course a 
timely session of "what is happenning around oz" as well as the HBA 
AGM.
 
All in all there will be many more wonderful 
presenters than those cited on the invited speakers list participating in either 
the conference, the ceremony, conference expo or the poster display which will 
feature the work by current research mothers and midwives ...
 
Of course more than anything we would love to see 
as many of you there as possible.  
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne Brown
for the Homebirth Australia Conference 
committee
 
 
 

24th 
Homebirth Australia 
Conference
 
“Bringing Birth Back 
Home”
 
The homebirth model can: Return services to rural 
Australia
Improve Indigenous outcomes & humanise our broken 
maternity system  

 





 
Guest 
Speakers: 
 
Ina May Gaskin 
(USA) Traditional Midwife, Author, 
Activist
Robyn Thompson 
(AUS) Practicing 
Independent Midwife
Sally Pairman 
(NZ) 
Academic, Midwife 
Henci Goer 
(USA) 
Author 
Rachael Mazza 
(AUS) 
ABC TV’s “Message stick”, Indigenous woman, Homebirth 
Mother
Dr Sarah Buckley 
(AUS) 
GP, Homebirth Mother, 
Author
Justine Caines 
(AUS) 
Consumer Activist, Rural Homebirth Mother 

Maggie Lecky Thompson (AUS) 
Founder ASIM
Jo Hunter (AUS) Convenor 
HBA, Doula, Homebirth Mother  
  
Date & Venue:
July 1-2 
2006
Geelong Conference 
Centre
Adams Court, East Geelong 

 
 
Registration Includes: 
Full Conference, all meals & expo. 

Optional: Accommodation (on site) & Conference 
Dinner
 
For information & conference registration 
:
Email  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Or visit 
www.homebirthaustralia.org
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Weight gain in pregnancy

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Kylie

I think it can be individual.  I have been caring for a woman who is 
normally 110 kgs and usually loses weight (14-15 kgs) with each pregnancy 
and the babies are fine. I guess it is done to how the woman is feeling in 
herself and how bub palps etc.


Kind Regards

Sally-Anne
- Original Message - 
From: "Kylie Holden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 10:38 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] Weight gain in pregnancy



I have another question for you all!

I know a woman who is pregnant, currently about 27 weeks.  She has been 
told by her doctor that as she is very overweight (100+kg) she should put 
on as little weight as possible during pregnancy.  At 27 weeks she has 
only put on three quarters of a kilo, and doctor is very pleased!  I 
didn't know what to say to her.  Is such a small weight gain safe for the 
baby?  According to the textbooks, average weight gain is 3-4kgs in the 
first 20 weeks and then half a kilo every week after that (of course, wide 
variances occur and every woman is different), but the books that I have 
don't say if it's different for obese women.


Less than a kilo of weight gain at 27 weeks...any thoughts?

Thanks
Kylie

_
realestate.com.au: the biggest address in property 
http://ninemsn.realestate.com.au


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[ozmidwifery] SMH - Headline - More mums prefer to induce birth

[Sally-Anne Brown]

SYDNEY MORNING HERALD


More mums prefer to induce birth
Julie Robotham Medical Editor
January 14, 2006

URL: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/01/13/1137118970057.html

The online edition of The Sydney Morning Herald brings you updated local 
and world news, sports results, entertainment news and reviews and the 
latest technology information.


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Morning Herald newsroom. 
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Re: [ozmidwifery] caesarian rates soaring

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Congrats to Barb Vernon on her take on this issue 
on ABC TV news tonite (NSW).
For those of you who didn't catch the story on 
c/section risks you might want to catch the last news.
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Helen and Graham 
  To: ozmidwifery 
  Sent: Friday, January 13, 2006 8:27 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] caesarian rates 
  soaring
  
  
  http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200601/s1547238.htm
  Caesarean rate increase 'alarming'
  
  New South Wales Health Minister John Hatzistergos says a 
  special task force will investigate why an increasing number of women are 
  having caesareans.
  A new report has found the state's caesarean rate is just 
  over 27 per cent, a rise of about 6 per cent on five years ago.
  Mr Hatzistergos says the increase is alarming. 
  "The decision ultimately as to how a birth should be 
  delivered is one which is to be made the mother in consultation with her 
  medical adviser," he said. 
  "However I am concerned, particularly at the private 
  level, that it appears to some extent the increased number of caesareans is 
  accentuated by reasons that are not clinically based."
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] Fw: Headline - A prescription for disaster

[Sally-Anne Brown]

SYDNEY MORNING HERALD


A prescription for disaster
Mark Metherill
January 12, 2006

URL: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/01/11/1136956242780.html

The online edition of The Sydney Morning Herald brings you updated local 
and world news, sports results, entertainment news and reviews and the 
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[ozmidwifery] Fw: Headline - Watchdog sees signs of overservicing

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Another great opportunity for letters to the editor


SYDNEY MORNING HERALD

Watchdog sees signs of overservicing
Mark Metherell
January 12, 2006

URL: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/01/11/1136956243014.html

The online edition of The Sydney Morning Herald brings you updated local 
and world news, sports results, entertainment news and reviews and the 
latest technology information.


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Morning Herald newsroom. 
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[ozmidwifery] Fw: Headline - Medicare to clamp down on big operators

[Sally-Anne Brown]

SYDNEY MORNING HERALD:

Medicare to clamp down on big operators
Mark Metherell Political Correspondent
January 12, 2006

URL: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/01/11/1136956242979.html

The online edition of The Sydney Morning Herald brings you updated local 
and world news, sports results, entertainment news and reviews and the 
latest technology information.


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Morning Herald newsroom. 
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Re: [ozmidwifery] Breach of List Ethics

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all,

RE:  Dear Kelly,
I have just been sent the email you sent from your client regarding 
EPI-NO.

I have also seen the  comment from a midwife who answered your query.


I am very interested to read these posts.
Sent by whom ???
It is clear that irrespective of comments made on this list that any person 
forwarding list emails without consent of the persons involved is 
(knowlingly or unknowingly) in breach of basic email ethics.

In the extreme of course this may be referred to as a 'mole'.
Can those persons who wish to send on emails please take the time to ask 
first ?
and for the person/persons who have sent on these emails, perhaps you will 
consider acknowledging this to the list.


Kind Regards

Sally-Anne


- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Robertson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2006 4:17 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] EPI-NO



Hello,

Just forwarding a message I received from Tecsana, that was intended for 
the list




You have not provided sufficient information for a response to this

woman's query however
from what has been provided:

a. The second time she has used EPI-NO
b. She was pushing out the balloon.

the woman was not following instructions in the correct use of EPI-NO. It 
would not be
possible to push out the balloon with the amount of dilatation possible 
after the second
use. The balloon is inflated to the level of personal comfort and the 
woman will experience
a slight burning sensation at which point she would cease dilatation. This 
is controlled by
the woman. Your client should not recommence training with EPI-NO unless 
instructed to
by her obstetrician as her problem may be the result of an underlying 
condition.


Perhaps you could request from the midwife who made that comment, clinical 
evidence
to support it.  We work in an evidence based medical  environment, and all 
evidence of
which we are aware supports the contrary view. A new EPI-NO  Clinical 
Trial will commence
in January through Sydney University to show the effect of EPI-NO on the 
Pelvic Floor

following childbirth.

Please make you client aware that EPI-NO is also a pelvic floor training 
device which can

be used 4-6 weeks after delivery to strengthen the Pelvic Floor.

I would be happy to  answer any questions you may have.

Sincerely

Campbell Heather
Tecsana Limited.




-
Andrea Robertson
Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education

e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: www.birthinternational.com


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[ozmidwifery] Fw: Abbott and rural

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all

And it would seem they even have this wrong - claiming proceduralist GP's 
keep rural services alive.  Most rural areas that have a health service do 
not have proceduralist GP's...


Sally-Anne



Extra funds to keep GPs in rural areas. 09/01/2006. ABC News Online
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200601/s1544349.htm
The Federal Government will spend an extra $5 million a year trying to 
keep skilled doctors in rural and remote areas It is one of two rural 
health initiatives announced on Monday Federal Health




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Re: [ozmidwifery] article in our local paper today

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Congratulations to you Andrea and the women of Echuca .
A fabulous article and very timely 

2006 the year for reclamation of rural birthing services !!

Kind Regards

Sally-Anne
- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Quanchi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Maternity Coalition" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
"ozmidwifery" 
Cc: "Steve & Robin Humphress" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Jan & Gale Perry" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Helen Gray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 6:45 PM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] article in our local paper today


This was in our local paper today and I thought you might be interested. I 
sent them an email over a month ago when I received a copy of the report 
and it took till now for it to appear.

Andrea Quanchi

http://rivheraldechuca.net/story.asp?TakeNo=200601066155153

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[ozmidwifery] Fw: More babies die in larger hospitals (http://theaustralian.com.au report)

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Also today in the Australian
 
Congratulations to Sally Tracy and colleagues on the much 
awaited publication of the smaller units paper in the BJOG yesterday 
December 6th - a very auspicious day for 'births' 
 
This study is without doubt going to provide the much needed 
evidence that to force a woman from remote rural Australia to an unknown setting 
in regional/metro settings to give birth 'in the name of safety'  just 
doesn't hold water.
 
Well done to you all on such a fabulous study and the 
tremendous efforts made to support safe birth for women of rural oz, in their 
own commmunities.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne
 
- Original Message - 
From: sally b 
To: sally-anne 
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 1:34 PM
Subject: More babies die in larger hospitals (http://theaustralian.com.au 
report)


  
  
sally b ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) suggested you might 
  be interested in this http://theaustralian.com.au 
  report.



  
  

  


  

  
More babies die 
in larger hospitalsAdam Cresswell, Health 
editor07 December 2005BABIES born in large city 
hospitals are more likely to die in their first month than those 
born in smaller rural centres, a comprehensive analysis of 
Australian births has revealed.
The findings have 
prompted experts to call for a "complete rethink" of maternity 
service planning across the country. 
The researchers for the study, which was reported yesterday in an 
international journal, say the findings prove smaller centres are 
safe - and undermine fears about quality that have led state 
governments to close scores of small maternity units nationwide in 
the past decade. 
Study co-author Sally Tracy, a senior research fellow at the 
National Perinatal Statistics Unit at the University of NSW, said 
that over the past 10 years "at least half" of the smaller rural 
maternity units across the country had been closed on safety 
grounds. "Big does not necessarily mean better ... it is time for a 
complete rethink about maternity service planning," she said. 
The study found 98.5per cent of 146,422 "multiparous", or 
non-firstborn, babies born in large hospitals were alive after 28 
days, compared with 99.2per cent in very small units. 
But Dr Tracy said while this was an expected result - because 
very high-risk or complicated cases would naturally be referred to 
the biggest hospitals - the real point was that death rates were no 
higher in smaller units. 
"All women do not need the very intense medical care that's 
available in these large tertiary hospitals," Dr Tracy told The 
Australian. 
"At this point, the policy in Australia is just to keep on 
closing these small units, and leaving rural women stranded to give 
birth on the side of the road." 
Rural doctors have also backed the findings. 
For the study, published online by the British Journal of 
Obstetrics and Gynaecology, Dr Tracy and colleagues examined data 
from more than 702,000 women who gave birth from January 1, 1999, to 
December 31, 2001 - representing more than 90per cent of all births 
in that time. 
The researchers grouped hospitals into five bands, based on how 
many babies they delivered each year. 
They also looked at the risk status of the mother, what 
interventions she required - such as epidurals and emergency 
caesarean sections - and whether the baby was alive after 28 days. 
Among firstborns, 98.9per cent of the 4483 born in small units 
with fewer than 100 births annually were alive after 28 days, 
compared with 98.4per cent of the 115,940 born in the largest 
hospitals. Looking only at births considered low-risk - a more 
meaningful comparison - smaller units also saw slightly lower death 
rates, but because of the low numbers involved in the small units 
the difference was not statistically significant. 
As expected, higher levels of interventions were also recorded in 
bigger hospitals. 
Queensland GP Ross Maxwell, president of the Rural Doctors 
Association of Australia, said the findings showed "low-risk 
delivery in small hospitals is very safe". "In rural Australia, we 
certainly need a strong rethink and more work to maximise the 
  

Re: [ozmidwifery] Tribute to Joah Donley from Mothering Magazine, Living Treasures feature

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Gloria and Kirsten
 
Thank you for your posts about Joan and Jeanine 
over the past few days.  Two amazing women who will be sadly missed 
and fondly remembered what a powerful transition time this week has 
been.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne
 
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Gloria Lemay 
  
  To: Undisclosed-Recipient:;@uniserve.com;;; 
  
  Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 8:09 
  AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Tribute to Joah 
  Donley from Mothering Magazine, Living Treasures feature
  
  
  Living treasure: Joan 
  DonleyMothering, 
   July-August, 2003  
  ORIGINALLY FROM CANADA, WHERE SHE WAS a maternity nurse, Joan Donley is the 
  matriarch of the modern midwifery and homebirth movement in New Zealand. With 
  global political aspirations, she has become a strong voice for independent 
  midwifery internationally. Donley began her midwifery training in New Zealand 
  in 1971 at the age of 55.
  A life member of the New Zealand College of Midwives, Donley was 
  instrumental in achieving an amendment to the Nurses Act of 1977, which 
  restored autonomous practice to New Zealand midwives. New Zealand doctors were 
  very resistant to this amendment, concerned about the erosion of a 50-year-old 
  fee-for-service system. Negotiations established a new pay structure for 
  doctors and midwives. Numbers of New Zealand independent midwives grew from 
  less than in 1990 to more than 1,500 in 1995. Together they lobbied the 
  government in 1989 to birth the certificate of midwifery, which grew into a 
  diploma and in 1993 matured into a bachelor of health science degree in 
  midwifery. In New Zealand today, more than 70 percent of births are attended 
  by midwives, the highest rate in the world; nearly 10 percent of births occur 
  at home.
  At 81, Donley was the first to be awarded an honorary master of health 
  science degree. As well as being a prolific author, Donley has been a speaker 
  at many midwifery conferences throughout the world and has been a consultant 
  to Canada's department of health in the implementation of its direct-entry 
  registration of midwives. In 1990 Donley received an Order of the British 
  Empire medal for services to midwifery and childbirth. She has also been 
  awarded a Women's Suffrage Medal.Her most significant achievements, however, 
  are the 750 babies she has caught, including 4 of her 12 grandchildren.
  COPYRIGHT 2003 Mothering MagazineCOPYRIGHT 2003 Gale Group
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] Peaceful birth

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear friends
 
This evening as the moon transcends into an 
aquarian quarter one of our most dynamic and fabulous women of consumer 
maternity reform in Australia is preparing for the birth of her twins.  

 
Justine Caines (for those of you who do not know of 
her - yet !!) is a woman of great strength and courage and has without doubt 
transformed the political climate for birth reform in this country in a way that 
has never been acheived before.
 
I ask all of you to send Justine and her husband 
Paul and their 4 children - Ruby (6) Clancy (4) Wil (3) and Toby (18mths) 
lots of the good midwifery and womanly vibes for a wonderful and peaceful 
birth. For those of you who are able and wish to - could you please light a 
candle in support and encouragement for Justine and her 
family.
 
Peace at birth
Peace on Earth
 
(adapted from the 2004 MC campaign for rural 
women's birthing services)
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne 
 
 
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Re: [ozmidwifery] rooming in

[sally @ home]

I'm with you Brenda...if we were living in larger communities, or extended
families rather than the very restrictive nuclear families, there would be
lots of helpers to care for the babies when the mothers needed a rest.

One homebirth I attended the woman had both her mother and mother-in-law
with her. After the birth all she had to do was feed the baby and rest, the
other 2 did everything else, it was wonderful..

I'd never take a baby out of a room unless it was specifically
requested...Baby Friendly can mean Mother Friendly too.

Sally

- Original Message -
From: "brendamanning" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:27 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] rooming in


> I work some night duty in a small unit & if mothers ask me to 'mind' their
> babies & take them back for feeds overnight then I do, willingly.
>
> I'm heavily into nurturing women, odd eh ??
>
> The Mums know what they want, if they need to sleep, why would I say no ?
I
> am being paid to stay awake & care for women & babies, that's what we do !
> If they want us to mind their babies we do, it might be the only
> uninterrupted sleep they get for months. We don't ever 'take' the babies
> away, but always respond when asked unless we are flat out.
> Are we wrong to help out when requested ?
> When we take the babies back for feeds, we help with the nappy changing if
> needed, sit with the Mums,make them tea, provide analgesia or hotpacks &
> give them something to eat after feeds.
> Isn't that just a huge basic part of 'caring for women' OR 'mothering the
> mother' ? Wouldn't our mothers do that for us if they were around for the
> feeds in the wee small hours ? Or would our support people shut the door &
> say "go for it, see you in the morning Welcome to motherhood" ! How
> supportive is that ?
>
> Wrong again ???
>
> With kind regards
> Brenda Manning
> www.themidwife.com.au
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "islips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:00 AM
> Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] rooming in
>
>
> > The obs dont like the idea of mucousy babies staying in the rooms with
> > mums. However in most cases where the woman has had a c/s we get the
> > fathers to stay the night to help out. There were other issues such as
> > unwell mums etc. The women who complained were all multis and basic
reason
> > was that they were tierd. Last time i checked i was a midwife not a
nanny
> >  Since we implemented the rooming in policy our primips are BF
better
> > and going home so much more confident. It will be a shame if it goes
back.
> > Zoe
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Cheryl LHK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: 
> > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 10:29 PM
> > Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] rooming in
> >
> >
> >> Just a query?  What are the obst's complaints based on - the same 3
> >> mothers complaints?  No doubt they were tired and wanted a bit of
rest!!
> >> Welcome to motherhood.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>From: "islips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>>Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> >>>To: 
> >>>Subject: [ozmidwifery] rooming in
> >>>Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 14:56:48 +0800
> >>>
> >>>I wonder if someone can help me put together some stats regarding
> >>>'rooming in' . I work at a large private hospital in Perth . We
recently
> >>>closed our night nursery and implemented a 'rooming in policy'. This
has
> >>>worked very well in enhancing BF , mothercrafting etc. However due to 3
> >>>mothers and 3 obs complaining it looks as though we will have to change
> >>>the policy. we have a meeting on tuesday and i would like to present
some
> >>>current research to the medical profession regarding the benefits of
> >>>rooming in.
> >>>thanks
> >>>zoe
> >>>   - Original Message -
> >>>   From: Mary Murphy
> >>>   To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> >>>   Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 7:28 AM
> >>>   Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] question
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>   Jenny, could you give us the reference please?  Thanks, MM
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
>
>>>-
-
> >>>
> >>>   ", one study demonstrated zero oxygen, because there is no longer
any
> >>> utero-placental circulation. This is part of the stimulation for the
> >>> baby to breathe, but the baby is receiving some circulatory volume. "
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>   Jennifer Cameron FRCNA FACM
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> >> Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe.
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe.
>
> --
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Re: [ozmidwifery] re: hospital based midwife

[sally tracy]

I think MM has hit the nail on the headwe must
NEVER get into tearing each other apartthe real issue is as
Mary says, the need to seriously reform the system. Women deserve to be
able to select the option of midwifery  care from the word go...after
all they can take themselves off to any Tom Dick or Harry doctor. But
if we can improve the lot of women  - to have the opportunity to choose
the care they feel most comfortable with .then this involves a few
basic changes  - not the least being a change to funding arrangements
AND the recognition that midwives are great practitioners  - the
BEST in factand women should really not be missing the chance to
find one to provide maternity care..including the place they
choose to give birth
The real issue is a fight to let women have the choice  - this is what
is absent in the maternity services...as women we deserve the right
.and we need to do as MM says ...the only way we can
change "the system" is to make women awareof their rights and help them
function without the fear.
Sally T.


Mary Murphy wrote:

  My heart bleeds when I see this sort of discussion going on.  I am all for
healthy and passionate debate, but we should be standing together, not
tearing each other apart. The medical profession doesn't need to attack us,
we do that ourselves(like all oppressed groups). 
How can we express our disagreement over the current policy oriented
maternity services without it becoming targeted on one group or another? I
am grateful for those hospital based midwives who welcome my client and put
her at ease when we transfer for medical assistance and try so hard to
"soften" the harshness of the hospital environment, while still providing
the clinical care required. . Thank you! 
I think that the only way we can change "the system" is to make women aware
of their rights and help them function without the fear. As Caroline Flint
says, "everyday, tell a woman about your job as a midwife" and soon the
whole population will know". cheers, MM 

It seems that there are those who feel a midwife working in a hospital
setting has "sold her/his sole to the devil" for doing so.  But they are the

ones on the "front line" so to speak who fight every day for the rights of 
birthing women, without them it would be worse.  Yes there are lots of 
problems in every hospital in regards to care of women, but the fact is 
women do birth in hospitals and we need our best, most passionate midwives 
there standing beside them or all is lost and it will all become obstectrics

care under doctors sole control with "ob nurses". If no one has the passion 
to work in the hospitals who's left???  We are never going to get 
anywhere if its so easy for external forces to cause us to turn on each 
other so easily "United we stand, divided we fall"???  Yes there are

going to be differences of opinion which we are all entitled to express, 
thats what I love about the country we live in. But we must have one goal 
and that is to get and give the absolute best care for women and their 
families no mater whether they turn up at a Birthing Centre, Hospital, in 
their own home or where ever.  We must fight to be the worlds BEST place to 
have a child and make every pregnant women wish they could birth here no 
matter where she goes in Australia.

This is the first time I have ever written anything on here so as you can 
tell this has sparked an interest in me.  And I hope it makes sence!

Amanda

- Original Message - 
From: "wump fish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 2:25 PM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re: hospital based midwife


  
  
It is sad to hear yet another hospital midwife feeling under attack. It 
can be argued that hospital midwives have an even greater role to play in 
changing the maternity service and catering for women's needs. I turned 
down the chance of working as an independent in the UK because I believed 
that the women in hospital needed me more. They were birthing in a strange

  
  
  
  
environment amongst strangers, many in vulnerable social situations. The 
statistics demonstrated the poor chances these women had of avoiding an 
instrumental birth or c-section.

It is because most women give birth in hospitals, and because the 
statistics for physiological birth are shocking - that hospital midwives 
are so important. It is time we asked ourselves how we can improve these 
outcomes for women and increase satisfaction rates. Many of us are, and as

  
  
  
  
I have said, I have come across far more motivated midwives in the 
Australian hospital system than the UK. Let's not kid ourselves that there

  
  
  
  
is not a lot to fight for if we do not want to end up as obstetric nurses.

  
  
  
  
We are prevente

Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: twins birth story

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Congrats Yvette to you and your family
 
kind regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Lindsay 
  & Yvette 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2005 4:59 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: twins birth 
  story
  
  Hi all,
  Some of you may remember me going on about 
  trying to plan a vaginal twins birth.  Babies are 8 weeks old now & 
  here's the full birth story.
  http://bellybelly.com.au/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15647
   
  Kind Regards,
  Yvette
  Mum of 5
  http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/t/twingirlslb/
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] looking for a midwife

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Jan
will email you off line
 
SA

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jan 
  Ireland 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2005 11:34 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] looking for a 
  midwife
  
  HI Sally-ann brown or those who know 

   what is your e.mail address jan ireland 
  
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Sally-Anne Brown 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 8:31 
AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] looking for 
a midwife

Dear Jan
 
If you would like to email me off the list I 
have a number of midwives details I am happy to provide you 
with.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne (Brown)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jan 
  Ireland 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 8:13 
  AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] looking for a 
  midwife
  
  dearest midwives
  i have a client who is now living in anglesea 
  4th baby other 3 born at home are there any mws doing homebirths please 
  repl asap is 15 wks into preg now cheers jan 
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] Jeanine Parvati

[Sally Westbury]

 

 



Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson



 

From Jeanine Parvati's latest newsletter on her
birthkeeper's website.

Our dear crone-sister is ailing. She is unable to
receive a liver transplant
and is now in a hospice preparing to pass.

She is asking for her friends/sisters/kindred
spirits to tune in together at
noon on the 23rd of October for
13 minutes and to send her your prayer
tincture, she refers to this as settling her
spiritual affairs and suggests
that it is time to say what has been left unsaid.

Her website is www.birthkeepers.com click on fall
2005 newsletter.

If her name sounds familiar you may have read
one of her booksJeanine's
books include Conscious Conception ,Prenatal Yoga
(the first book on this
subject 1970's) and Hygeia , a woman's herbal. She
is a woman who has made a
huge contribution to birth in this time and place,
in a very unique and
visionary way.

PAuline












YAHOO!
GROUPS LINKS


 


  Visit
 your group "NZhomebirth"
 on the web.
   
  To
 unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   
  Your
 use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
 


 

RE: [ozmidwifery] Obs first visits

[Sally Westbury]

At King Edwards birth centre the GP/OB review
the notes only at 36 weeks.

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

Re: [ozmidwifery] looking for a midwife

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Jan
 
If you would like to email me off the list I have a 
number of midwives details I am happy to provide you with.
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne (Brown)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jan 
  Ireland 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 8:13 
  AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] looking for a 
  midwife
  
  dearest midwives
  i have a client who is now living in anglesea 4th 
  baby other 3 born at home are there any mws doing homebirths please repl asap 
  is 15 wks into preg now cheers jan 
  
  

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RE: [ozmidwifery] 'Breech birth woman wise'

[Sally Westbury]

That’s fantastic Tina

 

You are an incredible strong woman. Don’t
forget it

 

love

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

RE: [ozmidwifery] Convenience

[Sally Westbury]

An you can send a puppy to boarding kennel so you can have a holiday

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

[ozmidwifery] Fw: letter from Kerry Nettle to SMH in response to Devine's take on midwives

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Title: FW:



Hi everyone,
sorry this is a little late to post - just letting 
you know Kerry Nettle (NSW Greens Senator) also attempted to get a letter to the 
editor published re Miranda Devine's antics - here tis FYI
 
Kind Regards
 
Sally-Anne
 
 
- Original Message - 
From: Nettle, 
Kerry (Senator) 
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 10:58 AM
Subject: FW: 

Hi Sally-Anne Here is the letter I sent the herald 
Good on Justine for her dialogue with 
Miranda Hope u r well 
cheers Kerry 
 -Original 
Message- From:   
Nettle, Kerry (Senator)  Sent:   Thursday, 22 September 2005 2:33 PM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject:    

Despite inferences in Miranda Divine’s article (SMH 
22/9/2005), it is fantastic news that there is rapidly growing support for 
midwife-based birthing units as a safe option for expectant mums across 
Australia. More women are choosing to have midwives as the primary carer at the 
birth of their child because midwives do a great job. Supporting midwives makes 
economic sense, with the costs of births assisted by midwives well below those 
relying on often unnecessary and expensive medical intervention. There is no 
evidence that hospitals are a safer place for low-risk births and Caesarean 
section rates are lower with midwife assisted births. This is all good news for 
the many expectant mums who feel comfortable in the more personalised and less 
clinical atmosphere of birthing centres.
Greens Senator Kerry Nettle 111-117 Devonshire St Surry 
Hills 02 9690 2038 



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[ozmidwifery] re Birth centres

[sally tracy]

thankyou to all who have responded to my 
messageif you would prefer to contact off the list - am happy
to do so
i will be happy to compile a sort of directory at the end of our little
study..
Sally T.

Re: [ozmidwifery] birth centres in Australia

[sally tracy]

thankyou everyone who has responded to my 
messageif you would prefer to contact off the list - am happy
to do so
i will be happy to compile a sort of directory at the end of our little
study..
Sally T.

sally tracy wrote:

  
  
  Dear all
am trying to update a list of birth centres or places that the midwives
and women  refer to as birth centres...Denise H. made a list of
models of midwifery care a few years ago and many of those are birth
centresI'm wondering if there are any more birth centres that
we havent got on the list   - it would be useful to have a contact
number beside each one  because I would like to contact each birth
centre in Australia over the next couple of months
many thanks 
Sally T.
If you put the state , name of birth centre, and contact ...would
be great 
  
  

[ozmidwifery] birth centres in Australia

[sally tracy]

Dear all
am trying to update a list of birth centres or places that the midwives
and women  refer to as birth centres...Denise H. made a list of
models of midwifery care a few years ago and many of those are birth
centresI'm wondering if there are any more birth centres that
we havent got on the list   - it would be useful to have a contact
number beside each one  because I would like to contact each birth
centre in Australia over the next couple of months
many thanks 
Sally T.
If you put the state , name of birth centre, and contact ...would
be great 

Re: [ozmidwifery] VBAC Breech Twins

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Congrats on the birth of your twins Yvette 
!!
and another inspiring contribution from Gloria 
.
 
Kind Regards,
 
Sally-Anne
 
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Lindsay 
  & Yvette 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 9:27 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] VBAC Breech 
  Twins
  
  Thankyou so much for sharing this 
  Gloria.  This is the most brilliant thing I've heard for ages.  It 
  shows how mothers can change the culture from within, if we're strong 
  enough.  What an incredibly brave woman.  I would love to read the 
  birth story if there is one.  This is the kind of thing I want to tell 
  all the pregnant twins mums I meet.  At an AMBA morning tea the other day 
  I was the only one of 5 to have had a vaginal birth.
   
  This has absolutely made my day!  Woke up 
  in a very grouchy mood, perhaps I'll have a better day now.  Would love 
  to hear more of this sort of thing.  It just doesn't occur to most people 
  to question anything we're told by doctors & midwives in hospital.  
  We should be encouraged to ask ourselves, ok, if I just say no what will 
  happen.  We have a right to be in a hospital if we choose to without 
  being held to ransom.
   
  I struggled to get my vaginal birth, and 
  struggled with the fear passed on to me and to my husband.  Had my babies 
  been breech I'd have had no hope.  I'd love to meet this woman and thank 
  her on behalf of all mothers.
   
  Yvette
  mother of 5 including 1 month old 
  twins
   
  Ps still working on full birth story, will 
  post link when it's done.
   
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Gloria 
Lemay 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 
5:30 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] VBAC Breech 
Twins

Okay women, here's your miracle for the day! This is from a 
doula friend in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. She has given permission to share 
it far and wide so feel free to repost. GloriaHello 
Everyone,I would like to report that my VBAC, Breech, with twins 
client gave birth totally naturally and without intervention at the 
Rockyview hospital last week. It was an awesome thing to witness. A woman 
saying “No Thank You” to fear mongering and letting her body guide the way. 
Baby A was breech so the 2nd stage was slow and the doctors can be quite 
intense with their comments. Here are some for the 
records….“Delivering these babies naturally is just the same 
as throwing them off a cliff” and“You’ve had a C-section before, and 
your uterus is now slowing down with contractions, these are signs that your 
uterus is about to explode, and that will kill you and your 
babies”The babies are healthy and happy and the mom is so 
excited to have conquered her fears. Having had a C-section previously, she 
said that concentrating on the short term pain for long term gain got her 
through it. She couldn’t bare the thought of another incision and now 3 
babies to take care of. When the babies were delivered the room had 15 
people in it. There was actually applause when the first baby emerged “bum 
first”. I think that after the staff realized that the Mom was going all the 
way with the requests they got excited (doc included). The hospital took 
advantage of the happening and invited various interns and students to the 
birth so that they could get an education on breech, twin deliveries. I 
guess not that many women ever get a chance to follow through with it, so no 
one gets the education. I was totally alarmed to that the hospital was so 
helpful. One of the nurses mentioned that the hospital had an incident 6 
months ago where they tried to withdraw care because the woman wouldn’t 
listen to them and things went bad – so some policies have supposedly 
changed and they care for people no matter what their birth requests. I was 
impressed with the people on staff that day, but the pessimist in me knows 
the battle isn’t over – but things are changing! Thank you to Gloria 
and Patty who I called heading into the birth – when some of the fear was 
rubbing off on me – the Doula!Charis Curtis, W.T.Prema Sai 
Wholistic Living2713 14th St SWCalgary, AB T2T 
3V2[EMAIL PROTECTED]www.premasai.ca
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] smh - ;etters sat sept 24

[Sally-Anne Brown]

smh - sat sept 24
 
 
Mother knows bestWhat an insult to women to assume that they 
are not intelligent and autonomous enough to take in the information about 
different options of care that are available during pregnancy, and then make the 
right decision for them and their babies ("Mum and baby are caught in the 
middle", Herald, September 22) .
Do we, as midwives and obstetricians, actually have the arrogance to think 
that we know what is best for all women? Our role is to put balanced and 
accurate information out there so women can make the choice by and for 
themselves. And we are all interested in the one outcome of a healthy mother and 
child.
Jennifer Darby Rozelle
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Re: [ozmidwifery] SMH Letter - support of Devine

[sally tracy]

not despairing too badly  - it seems this is a beat
up - ie the person didn't exist and although the letter doesn't
completely put Ryde in it  - by inference it does. The author is a
lawyer at West Ryde.but there have been no women having a 3rd baby
transferred that we can find!
ST

Andrea Robertson wrote:
Hi there,
  
  
This letter is in today's SMH:
  
  
-
  
  
  
The centre, not middle
  
  
  
It would be a great tragedy if the tremendous advances Australia has
achieved in maternal and infant survival and wellbeing in the past 50
years are being put at risk by moves to wind back the role medical
skill and intervention has played in this achievement ("Mum and baby
are caught in the middle", Herald, September 22).
  
  
Our family's recent experience at a midwife-led hospital birthing unit,
where a third childbirth was unexpectedly fraught with life-threatening
complications that could have been avoided with timely medical
assessment and intervention, has left us traumatised and highly
critical of the midwife-led model of childbirth.
  
  
By all means give midwives the recognition and key role they have
earned, but making childbirth a political and ideological battlefield
where the aim seems to be to take as much of the field as possible,
belies the stated aim, of putting the wellbeing of mother and infant at
the centre.
  
  
Patricia Gilchrist West Ryde
  
  
--
  
  
Oh well,  you can't win 'em all.
  
  
Andrea
  
  
  
-
  
Andrea Robertson
  
Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education
  
  
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
web: www.birthinternational.com
  
  
  
--
  
This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
  
Visit  to subscribe or
unsubscribe.
  
  

Re: [ozmidwifery] perinatal stats

[sally williams]

No Brenda...that's exactly what I thought too 
:P
 
Sally

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  brendamanning 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 2:50 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] perinatal 
  stats
  
  Every time I see the Dept of BD&M mentioned I 
  think of:
  " Bondage, Domination & Masochism" !! 
  
  Or is that just my freaky sense of humour 
  ??
  BM
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Sally Westbury 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 10:20 
AM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] perinatal 
stats


I wonder what a 
letter from BD&M would feel like for the parents. I think that if I got 
a letter from them I would wonder if what my midwife was doing was legal. 
Then the parents are being asked to police midwifery practice. These forms 
are not mandatory are we perhaps need to respect 
the decisions each practitioner makes.
 
Labels of lazy are 
    not helpful. 
 
Sally 
Westbury
Homebirth 
Midwife
"Learn 
from mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look 
for wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find 
it."
— 
Lois 
Wilson
 

Re: [ozmidwifery] wyong reopens

[Sally-Anne Brown]

congrats to you all and the women of wyong 
..
 
kind regards
 
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  diane 
  
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 10:41 
  AM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] wyong 
reopens
  
  
  Hi everyone,
  Hot breaking news today... Wyong birthing unit is 
  opening next Monday as a low risk birthing unit. Anything outside the ACMI 
  guidelines are refered or transfered to Gosford. We're so 
  excited
  Cheers
  Diane
  
  

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  19/09/2005
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Re: [ozmidwifery] the 7.30 (to report or not report !) segment

[Sally-Anne Brown]

dear all 
 
- re the woman in mouriks care - just to clarify - 
twas a 28 hr labour -  now is that what they call 
fantabulous (?!?) obstetric care ?
 
well done to sally t and leonie on their 
brilliant work - and especially to the women filmed - for all of them really - 
the journos were obviously determined to run the fear mongering sensational 
line ( just like they did when Justine Caines did 60 minutes in May last year - 
travelled 800 kms return with 4 children and an 9 week old baby to film in 
sydney all in the name of the cause and they changed the story from being a 
homebirth story to a promote caesarean gig and sensationalised to the hilt  
!!).
 
what is so unforgiveable - is these journos 
treat women so appaullingly to get a story. i wonder how the woman who went into 
labour on the take last night felt once she saw the story in it's edited 
light  ?!  .....
 
sally - you were so quick off the mark and did 
it brilliantly. 3 hrs of intensive interviewing is no mean feat and you 
were amazing.  you are one woman they could not break...
 
re future media -  i think we need to keep 
strong on all sides of the media -  forewarned is 
forearmed and it is really about going in with eyes wide open ie: we now know 
for sure the journos will only run it this way - but the stories will reach more 
and more women who can see the wood for the trees. 
 
and as we all know - it may have been 
quite different if a woman who respects women had edited the footage 
!
 
a fantastic effort - and a strengthening for 
us all...
 
 
Warm Regards
 
Sally-Anne
 
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  jo 
  
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 2:47 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] "Midwifery led 
  units"
  
  
  The couple who had ob 
  care and had a 38hr labour and ended up with 
  forceps
   
  What were the reasons for this? 
  Was she induced? Did she have an epidural? How long did he ‘allow’ her to push 
  before he thought it necessary to pull the baby 
  out?
   
  I though you were wonderful Sally, 
  and I had to giggle a little when he was going on at the conference and I 
  could see Nicky Leap in the background with her head in her hands. It 
  certainly is hair pulling stuff!
   
  Cheers
   
  Jo
   
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Anne ClarkeSent: Tuesday, 20 September 2005 10:29 
  AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] "Midwifery led 
  units"
   
  
  Dear 
  Sally,
  
   
  
  You and the Ryde Birth Centre 
  still looked terrific to me.  Liked how the one Ob. supported Midwives in 
  the 7.30 report.  
  
   
  
  The couple who had ob care and had 
  a 38hr labour and ended up with forceps - would have transferred her long ago 
  and so no wait on ongoing care.  The 7.30 report inferred that the 
  mother would have had to wait another 20 minutes for transport before getting 
  her forcep birth, although with Midwifery care she would have probably 
  been transferred long before she needed the forceps anyway.  I am sure 
  the ob was waiting just outside the door 'just in case' he needed her for her 
  forcep birth. So frustrating when they do not report in 
  context.
  
   
  
  What is wrong with 'Midwifery led 
  units'?
  
   
  
  RegardsAnne ClarkeBirth Centre, Brisbane
  
   
  
  - Original Message - 
  
  

From: sally 
tracy 

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 


Sent: 
Tuesday, September 20, 2005 10:04 AM

Subject: Re: 
[ozmidwifery] "Midwifery led units"

 
Dear Oz mids and AndreaI 
agree wholeheartedly with you we have to have  a better term..and 
on the day in Newcastle I proposed we stop suggesting any one practitioner 
is more important than another in this stuff and call the units 
'co-operative maternity units'!! Co-ops between women midwives and the odd 
obstetrician or paed.I'm sorry the 7.30 report was so frightfulI 
knew it was going to be a mild disaster  - because they were s 
determined to have Mourik in all his glory and they really wanted me to 
respond. When I refused  - it was considered dull television , so I was 
completely caught out when they suggested to me that Sri Devis transfer was 
a failure! Crikey   - that's the two seconds worth of the at 
least (three hours filming) they decided to show of my response. Moral 
of the story is that we are caught in a horrible constant shark attack and 
we seem to always have to be defending our practice no matter what. The 
glimmer of light in last night program was the gorgeous women  - those 
who hadn't had a 28 hour labour!!! excuse me  - the Ryde women average 
about 6-8 hours...and didn't their babies look so alert an

RE: [ozmidwifery] wyong reopens

[Sally Westbury]

That’s so fantastic

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

RE: [ozmidwifery] perinatal stats

[Sally Westbury]

Births deaths and marriages

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

RE: [ozmidwifery] wyong reopens

[Sally Westbury]

Where is wyong?

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

RE: [ozmidwifery] perinatal stats

[Sally Westbury]

I wonder what a letter from BD&M would
feel like for the parents. I think that if I got a letter from them I would
wonder if what my midwife was doing was legal. Then the parents are being asked
to police midwifery practice. These forms are not mandatory are we perhaps need to respect the decisions each practitioner makes.

 

Labels of lazy are not helpful. 

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

Re: [ozmidwifery] "Midwifery led units"

[sally tracy]

Dear Oz mids and Andrea
I agree wholeheartedly with you we have to have  a better term..and
on the day in Newcastle I proposed we stop suggesting any one
practitioner is more important than another in this stuff and call the
units 'co-operative maternity units'!! Co-ops between women midwives
and the odd obstetrician or paed.
I'm sorry the 7.30 report was so frightfulI knew it was going to be
a mild disaster  - because they were s determined to have Mourik in
all his glory and they really wanted me to respond. When I refused  -
it was considered dull television , so I was completely caught out when
they suggested to me that Sri Devis transfer was a failure!
Crikey   - that's the two seconds worth of the at least (three hours
filming) they decided to show of my response. 
Moral of the story is that we are caught in a horrible constant shark
attack and we seem to always have to be defending our practice no
matter what. The glimmer of light in last night program was the
gorgeous women  - those who hadn't had a 28 hour labour!!! excuse me  -
the Ryde women average about 6-8 hours...and didn't their babies look
so alert and drug free

Honey Acharya wrote:

  Here's the transcript if anyone missed it
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2005/s1463815.htm

Cheers
Honey
- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Robertson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 7:48 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] "Midwifery led units"


  
  
As I watched the 7.30 Report last night, that dreadful term "midwifery led
unit" kept springing up. I have a real problem with this term, as you can
read on My Diary:

http://www.birthinternational.com/diary/index.html

Can't we do better than this?

Thinking caps on please!

Andrea

-
Andrea Robertson
Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education

e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: www.birthinternational.com


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Visit  to subscribe or unsubscribe.

  
  

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[ozmidwifery] 7.30 report on TONITE

[Sally-Anne Brown]

GREETINGS ALL
 
7.30 REPORT IS DEFINITELY ON ABC TV TONITE - PROMO 
JUST WENT TO AIR...
 
ENJOY
 
SA
 
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[ozmidwifery] 7.30 report now on again - promos going to air

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Hi everyone, 
 
At bloody last !! Last night the 7.30 report did a 
promo for the midwife led unit story featuring Sally Tracy to be screened this week.
No day set - but could be any night from 
monday.
 
well done to all who ensured it didnt get 
shelved.
 
Sally-Anne
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[ozmidwifery] care of the newborn

[sally williams]

I am sure we have discussed this before but as usual discarded info coz not
relevant to me at that point!!

Does anyone have guidelines for care of the normal healthy term infant? I am
embarrassed to ask, really, because for me it is not an issue. However, some
midiwves in our unit are doing pre-feed obs on all newborns until they go
home!!!

Very frustrating, but true. I need something in black and white to put in
front of them to show it is utterly and completely unnecessary.

Thanks in advance

Sally
- Original Message -
From: "Jo Bourne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 9:41 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] another fyi...


> I can't give you a bunch of references but my understanding is that there
is a lot of research out there supporting this and none that contradicts it,
at least in terms of fertility, I don't know as much regarding pregnancy.
IVF clinics break down their stats by age for a reason. Here are SIVFs
stats:
>
> http://www.sydneyivf.com/pages/success/index.cfm
>
> Most clinics give stats slightly differently (ie by clinical pregnancy or
by live birth, by transfer or stim cycle) but they all break them down by
age and SIVFs stats are probably better than average for older women. If you
ask your Fertility Specialist (if you are unfortunate enough to need one)
about your specific chances a  good clinic can give you stats for your age
and diagnosis. Age ALWAYS comes into it.
>
> The older you get the greater the chance is that a small problem that
might have delayed conception will become a big problem that prevents it.
Sometimes women who needed IVF for #1 fall pregnant naturally or more easily
the second time around but I seem to hear far more often that #2 turns out
to be even harder - the initial problem having been worsened by a couple
more years passing.
>
> Also to address something from the article that is not really correct
here - in Australia the highest risk of multiples is with lower end assisted
reproduction such as ovulation induction or IUI, not IVF. In my case for
example we abandoned ovulation induction in favour of IVF to prevent
multiples. In fact putting back only one embryo at a time you have less
chance of twins doing IVF than conceiving naturally (you can still get
identical twins, at a slightly higher rate than natural identicals, but you
rule out fraternal twins which are far more common).  Not really relevant to
the age thing but it's an annoying misconception.
>
> cheers
> Jo
>
>
> At 10:04 PM +1200 16/9/05, Safetsleep wrote:
> >wonder how many studies involved .i would be interested to see the
actual studies and stats.,
> >miriam
> >
> >- Original Message - From: "Jennifairy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;

> >Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 9:37 PM
> >Subject: [ozmidwifery] another fyi...
> >
> >>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4248244.stm
> >>
> >>Delaying babies 'defies nature'
> >>*Women who wait until their late 30s to have children are defying nature
and risking heartbreak, leading obstetricians have warned. *
> >>
> >>Over the last 20 years pregnancies in women over 35 have risen markedly
and the average age of mothers has gone up.
> >>
> >>Writing in the British Medical Journal, the London-based fertility
specialists say they are "saddened" by the number of women they see who have
problems.
> >>
> >>They say the best age for pregnancy remains 20 to 35.
> >>
> >>Over the last 20 years the average age for a woman to have their first
baby has risen from 26 to 29.
> >>
> >>
> >>* The message that needs to go out is 'don't leave it too late' *
> >>Peter Bowen-Simpkins, Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists
> >>
> >>The specialists, led by Dr Susan Bewley, who treats women with high-risk
pregnancies at Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital, warned age-related fertility
problems increase after 35 and dramatically after 40.
> >>
> >>Other experts said it was right to remind women not to leave it too
late.
> >>
> >>* 'Having it all' *
> >>
> >>In the BMJ, the specialists write: "Paradoxically, the availability of
IVF may lull women into infertility while they wait for a suitable partner
and concentrate on their careers and achieving security and a comfortable
living standard."
> >>
> >>But they warn IVF treatment carries no guarantees - with a high failure
rate and extra risks of multiple pregnancies where it is successful.
> >>
> >>For men, there are also risks in waiting until they are older to father
children as semen counts deteriorate 

Re: [ozmidwifery] perinatal stats

[sally tracy]

Dear all
Jan has summed it up in a nutshell  - both the discrepancies and the
reasons why many home births go unreported..  we  did a 'run' with
the national data a couple of months ago  - and we were surprised to
find an even greater difference than this one you report Jan. The most
difficult thing is to reconcile the BD&M data with the perinatal
data  - because there is such a long lead time between when the baby is
born and when parents have to register the birth (ie five years).
I agree with many of the midwives who do not risk
disclosureuntil we are convinced there will be no burning at
the stake...everyone is much safer staying silent. 
There is SUCH a need for genuine  recognition for what midwives do. We
are too  vulnerable  at present to risk being noticed in many
ways... look at the flak we have received from RANCIDCOG and the
AMA for example when we've tried to offer an evidence based midwifery
service. We continue to jump through every conceivable hoop  - but the
power is with the money , and until we have legislative rights , and
more importantly , until WOMEN have rights to seek the sort of care
they believe to be best for them and their babies, we will have to
remian  silent  (and strong!)
Sally T. 

Jan Robinson wrote:
Hi
Andrea
  
Yes it is a huge discrepancy but the law only relates to births
attended by registered doctors or midwives. Registered health
professionals have an obligation to report the details of each birth
they attend whether they occur at home or in a hospital. They have to
provide the NOTIFICATION OF BIRTH to BD&M and submit the perinatal
data to the appropriate department of their Dept of Health. It is the
parents responsibility to register the birth of their child.
  
  
  
I assume that MOST of the unreported home births are that way because
lay people would be unaware of their state laws. 
Individuals who are aware of the laws also understand that if they DO
report any births that they attend also run the risk of "holding
themselves out to be a midwife" and that is PUNISHABLE by law.
  
  
It would be interesting for midwives to approach their own
state/territory Dept of BD&M as to the number of babies registered
as
being born at their home address and then get the figures from the
perinatal data collections to compare.
  
Anyone want to get cracking in their state? I'd love to get data from
around the country. I have some Tasmanian figures and I have some
from Victoria but they are not as easy to interpret as the NSW data.
  
  
At the moment we are using the NSW figures to try and convince the
Health Minister to publicly fund the home births and therefore provide
a legitimate choice of skilled home birth practitioner for ALL women
wanting a home birth. 
  
Cheers
  
Jan
  
  
  
  Jan Robinson
Independent Midwife Practitioner
  
National Coordinator Australian Society of Independent Midwives
  
8 Robin Crescent South Hurstville NSW 2221 Phone/Fax: 02
9546 4350
  
e-mail address: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> website:
www.midwiferyeducation.com.au
  
  
On 15 Sep, 2005, at 08:23, Andrea Quanchi wrote:
  
  
  Jan that is a huge discrepancy, How many of these ones
not
reported to Data Collection are attended by registered midwives do you
think? Surely the data collection could approach these people not
reporting, through the births deaths and marriages, through the
families that they are attending to cover the privacy issues,
informing them of their duty to report and where they can access the
data collection material. You wont get all of them but you might get
some more. Are they scared of being identified if they are not
registered? Maybe it needs to be free from this issue if you want the
data


Andrea

On 15/09/2005, at 7:58 AM, Jan Robinson wrote:


Hi Andrea, Denise et al
  
  
I have just been in touch with our Dept of Births Deaths and Marriages
again for an update on babies registered as being born at home. The
numbers change each year as there are some people who don't register
their child until they need to go to school so I get updates for each
year.
  
So far what we have in NSW is
  
actual number of home births registered number of PLANNED HOME
BIRTHS reported to perinatal data collection (NSW Midwives Data
Collection)
  
1999 493 139 
2000 394 108
  
2001 388 144
  
2002 322 99 
2003 383 109
  
2004 359 don't have the 2004 figures from NSWMD collection yet
- hope to have them soon - the BD&M are much more organised with
data
collection but I guess that is because they have motivated providers of
their data (the parents). Even though there
has been a law since the 1990s that states all doctors and midwives
who attend home births must submit their data - the NSWMD knows a lot
of health professionals fail to report. There
is no law that states unattended home births have to be reported to
the NSWMDC.
  
2005 to date 19

Re: [ozmidwifery] perinatal stats

[sally tracy]

Dear all
Jan has summed it up in a nutshell  - both the discrepancies and the
reasons why many home births go unreported..  we  did a 'run' with
the national data a couple of months ago  - and we were suprised to
find an even geater difference than this one you report Jan. The most
difficult thing is to reconcile the BD&M data with the perinatal
data  - because there is such a long lead time between when the baby is
born and when parents have to register the birth (ie five years) 
Sally T. 

Jan Robinson wrote:
Hi
Andrea
  
Yes it is a huge discrepancy but the law only relates to births
attended by registered doctors or midwives. Registered health
professionals have an obligation to report the details of each birth
they attend whether they occur at home or in a hospital. They have to
provide the NOTIFICATION OF BIRTH to BD&M and submit the perinatal
data to the appropriate department of their Dept of Health. It is the
parents responsibility to register the birth of their child.
  
  
  
I assume that MOST of the unreported home births are that way because
lay people would be unaware of their state laws. 
Individuals who are aware of the laws also understand that if they DO
report any births that they attend also run the risk of "holding
themselves out to be a midwife" and that is PUNISHABLE by law.
  
  
It would be interesting for midwives to approach their own
state/territory Dept of BD&M as to the number of babies registered
as
being born at their home address and then get the figures from the
perinatal data collections to compare.
  
Anyone want to get cracking in their state? I'd love to get data from
around the country. I have some Tasmanian figures and I have some
from Victoria but they are not as easy to interpret as the NSW data.
  
  
At the moment we are using the NSW figures to try and convince the
Health Minister to publicly fund the home births and therefore provide
a legitimate choice of skilled home birth practitioner for ALL women
wanting a home birth. 
  
Cheers
  
Jan
  
  
  
  Jan Robinson
Independent Midwife Practitioner
  
National Coordinator Australian Society of Independent Midwives
  
8 Robin Crescent South Hurstville NSW 2221 Phone/Fax: 02
9546 4350
  
e-mail address: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> website:
www.midwiferyeducation.com.au
  
  
On 15 Sep, 2005, at 08:23, Andrea Quanchi wrote:
  
  
  Jan that is a huge discrepancy, How many of these ones
not
reported to Data Collection are attended by registered midwives do you
think? Surely the data collection could approach these people not
reporting, through the births deaths and marriages, through the
families that they are attending to cover the privacy issues,
informing them of their duty to report and where they can access the
data collection material. You wont get all of them but you might get
some more. Are they scared of being identified if they are not
registered? Maybe it needs to be free from this issue if you want the
data


Andrea

On 15/09/2005, at 7:58 AM, Jan Robinson wrote:


Hi Andrea, Denise et al
  
  
I have just been in touch with our Dept of Births Deaths and Marriages
again for an update on babies registered as being born at home. The
numbers change each year as there are some people who don't register
their child until they need to go to school so I get updates for each
year.
  
So far what we have in NSW is
  
actual number of home births registered number of PLANNED HOME
BIRTHS reported to perinatal data collection (NSW Midwives Data
Collection)
  
1999 493 139 
2000 394 108
  
2001 388 144
  
2002 322 99 
2003 383 109
  
2004 359 don't have the 2004 figures from NSWMD collection yet
- hope to have them soon - the BD&M are much more organised with
data
collection but I guess that is because they have motivated providers of
their data (the parents). Even though there
has been a law since the 1990s that states all doctors and midwives
who attend home births must submit their data - the NSWMD knows a lot
of health professionals fail to report. There
is no law that states unattended home births have to be reported to
the NSWMDC.
  
2005 to date 197
  
  
You can see there is quiet a difference in the records
  
  
I'd love some budding Master's student to get busy on this one as I
won't have time for it until I retire and that won't be until we get
the home births publicly funded across the country.
  
I feel sure that if primary care midwives had the medicare provider
number a lot of those unattended women would have a registered midwife
with them for the birth.
  
  
Cheers
  
Jan
  

  
  
  

  
  
  
Jan Robinson Independent Midwife Practitioner
  
National Coordinator Australian Society of Independent Midwives
  
8 Robin Crescent South Hurstville NSW 2221 Phone/Fax: 02
9546 4350

RE: [ozmidwifery] baby poo

[Sally Westbury]

I think that I would be trying to get more
hindmilk into the babe. Do you think it is a lactose
intolerance?

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

Re: [ozmidwifery] IOL and C/s...

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Tania, 
Allison Shorten and Brett Shorten (University of 
Wollongong) are about to publish an Australian study on the c/section rate with 
epidural block. I do not have any info on demopgraphics etc as you would imagine 
all the details are kept under wraps until publication (which is what we want - 
publication !!).
 
They have studied two groups a) IOL and b) 
spontaneous labour.  The results show a slight difference in the two 
groups of about 1.5% higher in the IOL group compared with the spont labour 
group. In both groups the results show (approx) 60% c/section rate - 
not the 30-50% c/section rate often spoken of.
 
This study is in line with the results Sally Tracy 
found in her research on EDB and c/section which also sits around 
60%.
 
I would suggest IOL should be looked at in it's 
entirety (the package deal).  I am not sure if either study looks at the 
numbers of women having IOL.  BUT we can safely say to women now - two 
Australian studies have identified that whether you have IOL or not there is a 
60% chance of having a c/section with epidural block.
 
SA
xo

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Tania 
  Smallwood 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 6:11 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] IOL and 
  C/s...
  
  
   
  Just wondering if there are any 
  good quality trials about IOL and increase of c/s?  Have just re-read 
  Enkin, and it does state that IOL is not associated with an increase in 
  caesarean section rate (but given that most states here are up around the 30% 
  mark, you have to wonder what they are comparing that to?), but I thought 
  something came out of the Uk not long ago disputing 
  this?
   
  Anyone?
   
  Tania
  
  

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[ozmidwifery] jan Ireland

[sally williams]

Hey Jan,
 
Can you contact me offlist on [EMAIL PROTECTED] about the 
PLP Forum on Thursday. Elisabeth and I were just wondering what you will be 
talking about.
 
Thanks and look forward to seeing you there.
 
Sally

RE: [ozmidwifery] Friend with breach baby...told CS only options.

[Sally Westbury]

Hi Deb,

 

This is a hard position to be in.

 

The buck stops with how strong this woman
is. No-one can do a C/S without her consent. If she wishes to be really
stubborn, exert her rights and desire and be ready to have grumpy midwives and obs
assisting her c/s then she simply waits for labour. Remind her that the
medical/midwifery staff are there to provide her with a service, so don’t
be put off by this, just be prepared.

 

In a system that is unsupportive and
inexperienced with vaginal breech birth probably a C/S is gentler for her baby.
A breech extraction is pretty much medically managed, usually with an episiotomy
(which she may also refuse) added in staff who are very afraid the energy is
very violent. 

 

On the other hand an amazing woman who had
a c/s for breech with her first baby went on to have a VBAC breech. She had
planned to have an elective c/s when labour had established. When it actually
started she felt she could do it. Unexpectedly she met a fair obs at our
tertiary hospital who said something along the lines of… it is hospital
policy and therefore I advise you to have a c/s BUT I am experienced with
breech births. 

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

Re: [ozmidwifery] 7.30 report

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all

Pat Brodie mentioned last week will be on monday night as in tonight - but
obviously will depend on other stuff like the devastation with Katrina.  so
check it out - may be on..

SA

- Original Message - 
From: "Andrea Robertson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 11:57 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] 7.30 report


> I have just heard from Denis Walsh that he and some others were filmed by
> the 7.30 Report (ABC) at the Conference last week. The program may go to
> air anytime this week, possibly Tuesday.
>
> All good stuff!
>
> Regards,
>
> Andrea
>
> -
> Andrea Robertson
> Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education
>
> e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> web: www.birthinternational.com
>
>
> --
> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> Visit  to subscribe or unsubscribe.
>
>
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>



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RE: [ozmidwifery] NSW news

[Sally Westbury]

Oh.. and just to dig the hole for myself deeper. I believe that
accreditation for independent midwives has not supported independent
practice but is a way to control and punish midwives who wish to work
within their full scope of practice.

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to
tell. Look for wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where
you'll find it."

- Lois Wilson


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RE: [ozmidwifery] NSW news

[Sally Westbury]

Sheesh.. 

The old credentialing crap. Midwives do not need to be credentialed to
provide care for low risk women. That is what we are trained to do.
Credentialing should be for things that are outside the scope of normal
midwifery care. Things like epidurals, interpreting electronic fetal
monitoring, induction of labour etc.

This drives me crazy

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to
tell. Look for wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where
you'll find it."

- Lois Wilson


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[ozmidwifery] Fw: Midwife criticism 'misused statistics' (http://theaustralian.com.au report)

[Sally-Anne Brown]

 
- Original Message - 
From: sally b 
To: Sally-Anne Brown 
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 6:12 AM
Subject: Midwife criticism 'misused statistics' (http://theaustralian.com.au 
report)


  
  
sally b ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) suggested you might 
  be interested in this http://theaustralian.com.au 
  report.



  
  

  


  

  
Midwife criticism 
'misused statistics'Adam Cresswell, Health 
editor01 September 2005A KEY critic of midwife-led 
birthing centres who claimed an international study showed they 
increased baby death rates by 85per cent has been attacked as 
"irresponsible" by the British expert who helped write 
it.
Denis Walsh, who is 
on a sabbatical in Australia, yesterday accused NSW obstetrician 
Andrew Pesce of committing "the worst kind of statistical misuse" in 
claiming the Cochrane review had found midwife care - now being 
expanded through new midwife-led birthing centres in NSW - increased 
a baby's chance of dying. 
While the review did find an association, Dr Walsh said it was 
not statistically significant, meaning there was not enough data to 
prove the extra deaths were not due to chance. 
Dr Pesce, who is the secretary of industrial lobby group the 
National Association of Specialist Obstetricians and Gynaecologists, 
made his claims in The Australian on Tuesday and said the benefits 
of such stand-alone centres were overblown. 
Dr Pesce last night stood by his original comments, and rejected 
Dr Walsh's criticism of him as "political". 
The row threatens to increase tensions between opponents and 
advocates of stand-alone midwife-led birthing centres, some of whom 
now privately admit the two sides are effectively "at war". 
So far, two stand-alone midwife-led birthing units have been set 
up in NSW, at Ryde in northwestern Sydney and Belmont, south of 
Newcastle. A home-birth service linked to St George Hospital in 
southern Sydney is also planned. 
Dr Walsh, a senior lecturer in midwifery research at the 
University of Central Lancashire in northern England, was one of 
four experts who updated the Cochrane Collaboration review last 
year. Cochrane papers draw together data from the best-quality 
trials and are accepted internationally as the most reliable source 
of medical evidence. 
He is about to return to Britain after a 10-month sabbatical in 
Australia. He told The Australian yesterday that the 85 per cent 
figure did not appear in the review and that Dr Pesce had made a 
"fundamental error" by using figures that were not statistically 
significant. 
"One wonders if Pesce was operating out of a different agenda 
when he goes on to confuse such an important issue," Dr Walsh said. 
"I suspect that he probably was, when he goes on to irresponsibly 
use statistics to scare prospective birth centre users. 
"This is the worst kind of statistical misuse." 
Dr Pesce said the findings were "right on the border" of 
significance and claimed the figures showed there was only a 
one-in-20 chance that the higher death rate was not a true finding. 
"It just shows how political the issue is - I think those 
comments are fairly biased themselves," he said. 
"The review didn't prove that hospital care was associated with 
higher rates of caesareans either, but we all know it is. 
"The study showed there was certainly a tendency to an increased 
risk ... and you can't assume safety. The onus is on people who 
advocate birthing centres to show that it's safe."

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[ozmidwifery] Birds & Bees Circa 2005

[Sally Westbury]

 Seamless Unity
Junior asks his dad, "Daddy, how was I born?" His dad
sighs and replies, Ah, my son, I guess one day you would have to find out
anyway. Well, you see, your Mom and I first got
together in a chat room on MSN. Then I set up a date via e-mail with your mom
and we met at a cyber-cafe. We sneaked into a secluded room, where your mother
agreed to a download from my hard drive. As soon as I was ready to upload, we
discovered that neither one of us had used a firewall, but it was too late to
hit the delete button. Six weeks later, your mom sent me an instant message
saying that her operating system was showing signs of unauthorized program
activity from a self-extracting file which had implanted itself in her BIOS.
Then nine months later a little Pop-Up appeared and said: You've Got Male"

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

[ozmidwifery] Fw: 'Higher risk' in midwife deliveries (http://theaustralian.com.au report)

[Sally-Anne Brown]

 
- Original Message - 
From: Sally 
To: Sally-Anne Brown 
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 8:11 AM
Subject: 'Higher risk' in midwife deliveries (http://theaustralian.com.au 
report)


  
  
Sally ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) suggested you might 
  be interested in this http://theaustralian.com.au 
  report.



  
  

  


  

  
'Higher risk' in 
midwife deliveriesAdam Cresswell, Health 
editor30 August 2005THE safety of midwife-led 
birthing units has been doubted and the most reliable evidence 
suggests babies born in such centres are 85 per cent more likely to 
die during or shortly after birth, compared with babies born in 
major hospitals.
Leading obstetrician 
Andrew Pesce said yesterday that a review by the international 
Cochrane Collaboration - considered the best source of evidence for 
medical claims - found that home-like settings for births were 
associated with "modest benefits". 
Dr Pesce said these benefits included higher rates of 
breastfeeding, more satisfied mothers and slightly higher rates of 
spontaneous vaginal childbirth (as opposed to surgical deliveries). 
However, the Sydney-based Dr Pesce - who is also secretary of the 
industrial lobby group the National Association of Specialist 
Obstetricians and Gynaecologists - said the review, published late 
last year, also found babies born in home-like settings such as 
midwife-run centres ran an 85 per cent higher risk of death around 
the time of childbirth. However, the overall rate is still very low 
- about eight babies in 1000 live births in 2002, according to the 
Australian Bureau of Statistics. 
Dr Pesce also said studies that midwives sometimes used to back 
up their safety claims were scientifically inferior, usually because 
their subjects were not randomised - an accepted technique to remove 
bias. 
"Everybody says it's been shown to be safe - but it's not. It's 
been shown to be reasonably safe, but without question there's a 
worry about increased risk of perinatal mortality," he said. 
"There's a positive effect (of birthing centres), but it's a lot 
lower than you would be led to believe by people who advocate this 
model." 
Kathleen Fahy, professor of midwifery at the University of 
Newcastle, said Dr Pesce was using the Cochrane deaths data "to 
imply that something is significant when it isn't". 
"What's going on here is a desire to prevent midwives from 
practising their profession, and using safety to do so," she said. 
Sally Tracy, associate professor of midwifery practice 
development at the University of Technology Sydney, said she had 
recently finalised a study using data from more than 1million 
Australian births, which would be published shortly in a major 
medical journal. 
Although prevented under medical journal requirements from 
discussing the findings before publication, she said the results 
were positive for midwife centres. 
In an article to be published next month in NASOG's newsletter, 
Dr Pesce - who also represents obstetricians and gynaecologists on 
the Australian Medical Association's federal council - said the 
Cochrane review looked at the results of six different trials, 
together involving 8677 women. 
The review found birth centre care was associated with "modest" 
reductions in some medical interventions, such as episiotomies - 
where a cut is made in the perineum to assist birth and prevent 
uncontrolled tearing. 
However, Dr Pesce wrote that the study found higher perineal 
lacerations in midwife care, so the overall rate of injury in that 
area was similar. 
"In summary, there is now good-quality evidence of higher risk of 
perinatal death in birth centres, with only modest reductions in 
some medical interventions," he wrote.

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Re: [ozmidwifery] when NOT to cut an episiotomy

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear Andrea
'Well done to you both - another amazing woman 
!
thank you for sharing this great story with us 
all.
 
 
Kind Regards
Sally-Anne

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Andrea 
  Quanchi 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 3:41 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] when to cut an 
  episiotomy
  Threads like this come back to haunt you. Last night I cared 
  for a primip who I took over on night duty as she was about to enter second 
  stage after having laboured all day and having had no sleep the night before. 
  Given lots of time she progressed very slowly to having the head distending 
  the peri and there it sat through several contractions with no further 
  progress despite maternal effort ( and yes I did think oh no hear goes I'm 
  going to have to eat my words and cut an epis. I looked at the scissors and 
  decided to leave them where they were and listen to the FH instead which was 
  strong. Then her body decided that it needed a rest and we sat for about 15 
  min with no contractions and listening to the FH while she slept. Then she 
  woke up had one contraction where she birthed the head over an intact peri and 
  a second soon after which birthed the body before she lay back and said that 
  all I had to give! What more did she need. I had a student with me who was 
  completely baffled and we spent quite some time afterwards discussing what had 
  just happened because that had never been in anything she had heard or read. 
  One very happy mum and one midwife with her stats 
  intact!!!Andrea QuanchiOn 22/08/2005, at 11:35 PM, Katrina 
  Flora wrote:
  Not entirely sure I want to 
know, but Mary what is 
"buttonholing"? Katrina
- Original 
  Message -From: 
Mary Murphy To: 
ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
Sent: 
  Monday, August 22, 2005 10:03 AMSubject: 
  RE: [ozmidwifery] when to cut an 
  episiotomyBecause 
  you asked:  I have cut 3 in 22 yrs as a homebirth midwife.  1 
  for foetal distress, 1 for “buttonholing’ & the other I can’t 
  remember.  It was all so long ago.  Working with a group of 7 
  other midwives, I have never heard of them cutting episiotomies either. MM  Who 
  else would like to celebrate their lack of desire or interest in cutting a 
  woman's 
  perineum.
  
  

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Liability ruling in Weekend Australian

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Thanks for this link Tania, 
 
re the case - two thoughts
 
ONE - this is exactly why all midwives need to be 
aware that they should have their own PI Insurance - because of the reality that 
vicarious liability alone does not cover a midwife.  Sadly - many midwives 
still make the assumption that the PI Insurance issue is to be put in the 
basket for IPM's to deal with, in the belief it is only their issue (how sad our 
colleagues are not supported anyway! ) - but the truth is PI is an issue 
that affects all midwives ! 
 
good to see Bisits calling it as it is and not 
buying into the primary care stuff as RANZCOG recently did (it would be 
delightful to be a fly on the wall right now). Of course Mourik's claim that 
Ob's be responsible for the work of midwives is the response we would expect 
when the issue not been faced is the OB been responisble for their own 
work..which leads into point two.
 
TWO - 
 

We all know obstetric beds are the highest 
number of hospital beds used currently approx 250,000 per year.  
And despite the OB's  largely 
turning birthing into big  'business' - with overservicing of well 
women and less time available for the women who do need hrs of 
intensive obstetric care - govts still provide the funds to keep it 
happenning,
 
Women do not actually receive the care they 
think they will when they choose an obstetrician for their care in both the 
private and public health sector. we know the OB's do not 
provide the care for a woman experiencing 
labour and birth -  it is the midwives who provide this care 
with the OB glorified for catching the baby (if they actually make it in 
time -and only if the woman has private health cover).  Whilst 
different OB's do have different practices, in the public health arena a woman 
does not realise that even in an obstetric 
emergency - caesarean section or emergency medical care - the Obstetrician 
does not provide this.  - women do 
not realise it is provided by the team of midwives and drs/ob's 
in training (residents and registrars) while the obstetricians who may 
have seen the women for one or two brief periods in pregnancy and birth (15-30 
mins ?) are drumming up big business (scans and genetic tests), often 
imposed on healthy well young women at whim - who 
again do not need to be overserviced with costly and unnessary tests. and we all 
know only a small proportion of women receiving this care actually need it - and 
the costs to women and the system are exorbitant. 
 

Yet how do the govts address this ? - when the 
insurance crisis hit the fed government bailed the OB's out to the 
tune of $600 million and libs senator helen coonan secured coverage with 
Llyods (London) ... the govt also provides access to 
the high costs claim scheme (where if the Ob's PI insurance fee is more 
than 7.5% of their income the govt pays the rest 80% AND will payout any 
claim over $300,000 !) - not to mention the 
coverage by medicare etc.
 
so why do govts continue to pay unnessary 
medicalised birth costs and the 'patch up the damage funds' for other health 
costs resulting from women recovering from traumatic birth experiences, 
postnatal depression etc ?  why do they keep plugging up the holes and 
support a service that is essentially unnessary and expensive 
medical sub standard care for the majority of women (80% 
WHO) ?
 
Why do govts deny women the right to experience the 
safest and most cost effective pregnancy and birth care ensuring the health 
system 'dam' wall bursts while midwives do not have equity to 
access medicare provider numbers or insurance ? ... yes abbott has stated he is now finally considering 
medicare for midwives but only if a woman has been serviced by the public health 
budget of a medicare swiped visit to the GP for a referral first ! 
 
despite all the evidence, unnessa'scary costs are 
continuing to be paid out big time - for sub-standard care of healthy well 
women experiencing pregnancy and birth.  one does not need to look 
much further than the individual and organisational donations at election 
time and the politics of the obstetric alliance to work out why.
 
Sally-Anne 
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Tania 
  Smallwood 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 7:00 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Liability ruling 
  in Weekend Australian
  
  
  http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,16318814%255E23289,00.html
   
   
  


  
 
  Liability ruling delivers 
  fuel to midwife debateAdam Cresswell, health editorAugust 20, 2005 
  
  DOCTORS and midwives are at 
  loggerheads over their legal liabilities from new-style birthing units after a 
  hospital sued an obstetrician to recover a share of the $7.5million it was 
  ordered to pay for a birth mishap involving a 
  midwife.Obstetricians say the 
  case vindicates their fears they wi

RE: [ozmidwifery] when to cut an episiotomy

[Sally Westbury]

I have never cut an episiotomy since I have
been registered as a midwife. I did as a student midwife in 1988. 

 

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from
mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to tell. Look for
wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where you'll find it."

— Lois Wilson

 

RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: shoulder dysticia

[Sally Westbury]

I agree with gloria in this. Actually I give all my first time mums your
article "pushing for first time moms"

Sally Westbury

Homebirth Midwife

"Learn from mothers and babies; every one of them has a unique story to
tell. Look for wisdom in the humblest places - that's usually where
you'll find it."

- Lois Wilson



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[ozmidwifery] ABC On Line Forum - hospitals

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Hi everyone, 
 
The ABC communities forum are running a segment on 
health called 'an apple a day' in response to beattie's plug for health care 
reform and what govts can do about it - in particular our 
overstretched hospital system
 
The link is cited below and is a great opportunity 
to discuss the unnecassary overuse of obstetric beds which top the nations 
'highest number of beds used " at around 250,000 per year.
 
http://www2b.abc.net.au/news/forum/newsonline3/default.htm
 


  
  

  
  Kind Regards
   
  Sally-Anne
   
Log 
  In
An apple a day
Queensland Premier Peter Beattie has reignited the debate about the country's 
ailing health system by calling for a broader debate on the future of the the 
health system.
He says people should take better care of their health to reduce pressure on 
public hospitals.
After criticism about waiting lists to see specialists, the Premier says the 
system faces even more pressure from an ageing and increasingly unhealthy 
population.
"Too much smoking, obesity, ageing of the population are all putting huge 
pressures on our system," he said.
The Premier enlisted the help of his wife and nurse, Dr Heather Beattie, to 
reinforce the message.
"We have to accept that the health dollar, in the end, has to be limited," 
she said.
She also says in the end people have to take some responsibility for their 
health.
What measures can people take to relieve pressure on the health system?
Are people doing enough to look after themselves?
What more can governments do to turn around the country's ailing health 
system?
Are the issues Mr Beattie refers to confined to Queensland or can they be 
applied to the whole country?
Have your say.
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[ozmidwifery] congrats to the campaign team

[Sally-Anne Brown]

Dear all
 
ABC TV news covered the medicare for midwives story 
about 5 mins ago.
congrats to Ingrid Mckenzie (mc mum) and your 
gorgeous baby
and to Barb Vernon on such great coverage and 
ensuring the great 'grabs' got heard.
and of course ...
ranzcog running the safety line again ... surprise 
surprise ... perhaps its time to do some media on the safety of obsteric care 
.?!
you both did brilliantly and 
it compliments beautifully with the coverage by 
another two strong mc women, Rachelle Meredith in the Sunday Tele (?) on the 
w/end and the fantastic letter justine penned (and hopefully will 
be printed) to the smh earlier today.
 
the wheel is turning...
 
kind regards
Sally-Anne
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