date:20080626

If you scroll down, the abstract is available for free and in plain
text. As is the custom for most of those scientific publishing
services. I wouldn't pay, either, only to find out something about
some American butterfly, but I thought you perhaps would have found
the abstract interesting too.

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Damnifiknow. The link you posted wants money, and I refuse to pay to
read. I've never heard of temperature differences causing wing color
differences. Monarchs live in every temperate climate and overwinter
in Mexico, none of the photographs I've seen from their winter quarters
have ever shown a particularly large color variation. On the other hand
the difference between the colors I saw in Walters photo and mine were
reminiscent of the difference I observed when I converted to jpeg on a
few images without first converting to the correct color space.

AlunFoto wrote:
Peter, Walt, Bob,

Is there natural variation in Monarch wing color?
I did a quick google search and came across a scientific study of
monarchs reared at different temperatures in a lab. The article is
mostly concerned with larva colour, but also mentions that adult
females from populations grown in warmer conditions become darker than
usual.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

Walt and Peter,
I don't think there's a lot wrong with the color,
especially since flash was used.
Here's one without flash, taken on Fujichrome and scanned to a Kodak CD.
http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452144size=lg
Regards, Bob S.

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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OT: Photographic Weapon?

2008-06-26 Thread David Savage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAX_3Bgel7M

Cheers,

Dave

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Re: 3 for You Simpson Fans

Sidewalk + subject is my favorite.

Major Simpson fan, here at the Brooks house hold.

Dave

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Christine  Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Sidewalk + subject
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452550

 horizontal
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452551size=lg

 vertical
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452552

 Cheers, Christine


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Re: OT: Photographic Weapon?

 From: David Savage [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Date: 2008/06/26 Thu AM 10:33:04 GMT
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net
 Subject: OT: Photographic Weapon?

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAX_3Bgel7M

Trenchant.

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Re: PESO 2008 - 100 (resend) - GDG

Title is fitting, i like the the set of legs only.

Dave

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 8:30 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Sorry: changed the file name and didn't update the email.
 ---

 Today on my morning walk ...

   http://homepage.mac.com/godders/100-departing.jpg
   Departing - This Cafe Life 2008
   Olympus E-1 + Summilux-D 25mm f/1.4 ASPH
   ISO 100 @ f/1.4 @ 1/320 sec

 Comments and critique always appreciated.

 enjoy
 Godfrey

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Re: Once A Year


 
 From: Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Date: 2008/06/25 Wed PM 09:11:24 GMT
 To: 'Pentax-Discuss Mail List' pdml@pdml.net
 Subject: Once A Year
 
 Connoisseurs of the island race that lives off the coast of Europe may
 find this gallery of pictures by Homer Sykes interesting and
 enjoyable:
 
 http://www.luminous-lint.com/app/vexhibit/_PHOTOGRAPHER_Homer__Sykes_0
 1/5/0/0/

Dunting the freeholder is a new one on me.


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RE: Photographic Weapon?

2008-06-26 Thread Anthony Farr

Brilliant.  A perfect use for an old film body.

Regards, Anthony Farr

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
 David Savage
 Sent: Thursday, 26 June 2008 8:33 PM
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 Subject: OT: Photographic Weapon?
 
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAX_3Bgel7M
 
 Cheers,
 
 Dave
 
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Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF) Pentax (ZK)

2008-06-26 Thread Roman Melihhov

http://www.zeiss.com/c12567a8003b58b9/Contents-Frame/e0943e181906e994c125746c0053918c
^^^ beautiful babies. I wonder price tag?!



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Re: Once A Year

 From: Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Date: 2008/06/25 Wed PM 09:11:24 GMT
 To: 'Pentax-Discuss Mail List' pdml@pdml.net
 Subject: Once A Year

 Connoisseurs of the island race that lives off the coast of Europe may
 find this gallery of pictures by Homer Sykes interesting and
 enjoyable:

 http://www.luminous-lint.com/app/vexhibit/_PHOTOGRAPHER_Homer__Sykes_0
 1/5/0/0/

 These are from one of the seminal books of modern British photography,
 Once A Year. Like Tony Ray-Jones before him, Sykes was inspired by the
 collection of photographs of English life in the 19th century that was
 put together by Sir Benjamin Stone, and he went out to photograph the
 same customs in a modern style.

 Around the same time other British photographers such as Ian Berry,
 Don McCullin and David Hurn were also taking a look at the way people
 lived here. Up-and-coming photographers such as Martin Parr were
 making names for themselves working in the same tradition, and Parr
 has famously built on and extended this work, and it is also continued
 by the likes of Mark Power (see his book The Shipping Forecast for
 examples). 

 Tony Ray-Jones:
 http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10307850

A review of last year's Tate exhibition:
http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,,2082871,00.html

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Re: Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF) Pentax (ZK)

2008-06-26 Thread Jaume Lahuerta

A Spanish photo web site talked about it being around 1000EUR 
:-(
http://www.quesabesde.com/noticias/carl-zeiss-distagon-t-18mm-f3.5,1_4373


- Mensaje original 
De: Roman Melihhov [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Para: pdml@pdml.net
Enviado: jueves, 26 de junio, 2008 13:08:56
Asunto: Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF)  Pentax (ZK)

http://www.zeiss.com/c12567a8003b58b9/Contents-Frame/e0943e181906e994c125746c0053918c
^^^ beautiful babies. I wonder price tag?!



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  __ 
Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.

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Re: Highly Recomended

2008-06-26 Thread Christian

Scott Loveless wrote:
 Charles Robinson wrote:

 Roman will post the link in a couple of weeks.

 We should start a pool.
 

JCO can photograph it.

Christian

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Re: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Oh yes I did. The abstract was quite interesting, if you read closely
the hypothesis was that the insect would be darker in cold climates to
help the insects keep warm. The quot and the position in the abstract
that tells me how much this hypothesis is worth is this one

Across all populations, monarch larvae developed the darkest
coloration in the cold treatment and were lightest when reared in hot
temperatures. Similar results were observed for measures of adult wing
melanism, /with the exception of adult females, which developed darker
colored wings in warmer temperatures./
Hum, damn near half of the experimental population showed the reverse
adaptation. Perhaps there is another explanation. In the current
question as to whether this effect is great enough to make as big a
difference as seen between Walters butterfly shot and mine, or whether
processing or perhaps color space caused the difference, the abstract
doesn't tell us that. In fact it tells little or nothing at all.

AlunFoto wrote:
If you scroll down, the abstract is available for free and in plain
text. As is the custom for most of those scientific publishing
services. I wouldn't pay, either, only to find out something about
some American butterfly, but I thought you perhaps would have found
the abstract interesting too.

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

Damnifiknow. The link you posted wants money, and I refuse to pay to
read. I've never heard of temperature differences causing wing color
differences. Monarchs live in every temperate climate and overwinter
in Mexico, none of the photographs I've seen from their winter quarters
have ever shown a particularly large color variation. On the other hand
the difference between the colors I saw in Walters photo and mine were
reminiscent of the difference I observed when I converted to jpeg on a
few images without first converting to the correct color space.

AlunFoto wrote:

Peter, Walt, Bob,

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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K20D dynamic range question

Hi!

The review just published on DPReview and mentioned here mentions that
K20D has 9.0 Ev of usable dynamic range whereas according to their
test of K10D, it has only 7.3 Ev of DR. I wonder if anyone can
actually confirm this. I am not interested in numbers of course, more
of a perception resulting from real life use of both cameras under
similar conditions.

Thanks in advance.

-- 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question

I have been trying to look into this, but haven't been able to reach
any conclusions yet. The tests I did last week was done with the K20D
on a tripod and using the 2s self-timer. So alas, I'm left with a set
of test shots with an awful lot of weird noise. I have learned about
the firmware update adressing that problem, but haven't got around to
update the camera yet. :-(

Though off-topic for a Pentax group, there was a very interesting
discussion at www.foto.no last week (in Norwegian, unfortunately),
discussing the dynamic ranges in raw files from various cameras. With
the Canons in particular, but also the Nikons, it seems one can pull
down details from highlights that seem to be blown by up to 2-2.5
stops, judged from the chimping screen. It was argued quite forcefully
that underexposure was to be dreaded much more than overexposure,
because of the lousy S/N ratio in the deeper shadows.

Apparently, the K10D does not provide much leeway in the
post-processing compared to what appears on the chimping screen, but
nobody tested the K20D. It's tempting to speculate that the switch to
a CMOS sensor in the latter could make a big difference... :-)

Jostein


2008/6/26 Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi!

 The review just published on DPReview and mentioned here mentions that
 K20D has 9.0 Ev of usable dynamic range whereas according to their
 test of K10D, it has only 7.3 Ev of DR. I wonder if anyone can
 actually confirm this. I am not interested in numbers of course, more
 of a perception resulting from real life use of both cameras under
 similar conditions.

 Thanks in advance.

 --
 Boris

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Hi!

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 4:20 PM, AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Apparently, the K10D does not provide much leeway in the
 post-processing compared to what appears on the chimping screen, but
 nobody tested the K20D. It's tempting to speculate that the switch to
 a CMOS sensor in the latter could make a big difference... :-)

Tempting it will be. However I must point out that from my usage
pattern it turns out that this is in fact incorrect. Numerous times I
were (or is it I was?!) able to pull out the highlight detail from the
chimping screen blinkies. Recently it drove me to the point that I
actually turned off the blinkies. Instead, I am basing my judgment of
the histogram display. Having said that, I should also point out that
I couldn't possibly tell how many highlight Ev stops are pullable...



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Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread timber

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/

Cheers,
.t


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Re: K20D dynamic range question

2008/6/26 Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Tempting it will be. However I must point out that from my usage
 pattern it turns out that this is in fact incorrect. Numerous times I
 were (or is it I was?!) able to pull out the highlight detail from the
 chimping screen blinkies. Recently it drove me to the point that I
 actually turned off the blinkies. Instead, I am basing my judgment of
 the histogram display. Having said that, I should also point out that
 I couldn't possibly tell how many highlight Ev stops are pullable...

This match my personal experience with K10D too, Boris. And like you I
don't really know exactly how many stops I can pull down, but I think
it's less than two.

Jostein

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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

It looks hurried.  The Color comparison test available on almost all 
other DSLR reviews is missing, (supposedly there based on the text but 
the K20D data simply doesn't show up in the drop down lists for a random 
sample of other cameras).  It make me wonder just how careful the 
testers were...

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/

 Cheers,
 .t


   


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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread Scott Loveless

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/
 
Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

;)

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Enablement

2008-06-26 Thread John Wittingham

Just took delivery of a DA* 300 f/4 SDM, first impressions quite positive. In 
comparison to my Sigma 300mm f/4 APO it'a a little lighter and less cumbersome 
but does not have the quick detachable tripod collar of the Sigma or the focus 
limiter, of course it is SDM and sealed. More comment and perhaps a PESO or two 
when I get chance to use it, maybe this weekend. Planning on a test against my 
Sigma 300 f/4 with and without TC's fitted.

Best regards,

John

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PESO - DA* 300/4 sample shot

This hunting tern was observed yesterday afternoon by the Eastern end
of the Greenland Dock, Southwark Bourough, London.

I think it is a good testimony both to the capability of the lens, and
to the AF capability of the K20D. I had the AF set for auto-selection
of sensor, because I had to keep full concentration on keeping the
tern inside the frame. Out of about 20 shots with varying background
(clouds, blue sky, foliage, and brick walls as here), only 2 are
focused on the background. Pretty neat, eh? :-)

http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-97

A crop (not 1:1)
http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-98

Exposure: 1/1000s, f/5.6, ISO 200.

Best,
Jostein

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Re: Enablement

Look forward to your testing, John. Especially the performance with TCs added.

Best,
Jostein

2008/6/26 John Wittingham [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Just took delivery of a DA* 300 f/4 SDM, first impressions quite positive. In 
 comparison to my Sigma 300mm f/4 APO it'a a little lighter and less 
 cumbersome but does not have the quick detachable tripod collar of the Sigma 
 or the focus limiter, of course it is SDM and sealed. More comment and 
 perhaps a PESO or two when I get chance to use it, maybe this weekend. 
 Planning on a test against my Sigma 300 f/4 with and without TC's fitted.

 Best regards,

 John

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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread timber



 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/

 Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

 ;)

Me, the Pentax K20D... and who's the third? :D
I think I am missing a point here... O.o

.t


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RE: Enablement

2008-06-26 Thread John Wittingham

Hi Jostein

I cam barely control myself, I just want to get out there with some decent 
weather, but at the moment I'm in work and it's raining. The Tern shot looks 
very promising for things to come, really nice capture.

Regards,

John

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of AlunFoto [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]
Sent: 26 June 2008 15:12
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: Enablement

Look forward to your testing, John. Especially the performance with TCs added.

Best,
Jostein

2008/6/26 John Wittingham [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Just took delivery of a DA* 300 f/4 SDM, first impressions quite positive. In 
 comparison to my Sigma 300mm f/4 APO it'a a little lighter and less 
 cumbersome but does not have the quick detachable tripod collar of the Sigma 
 or the focus limiter, of course it is SDM and sealed. More comment and 
 perhaps a PESO or two when I get chance to use it, maybe this weekend. 
 Planning on a test against my Sigma 300 f/4 with and without TC's fitted.

 Best regards,

 John

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the K10D. 
That's with the EDR feature turned on.
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Hi!
 
 The review just published on DPReview and mentioned here mentions that
 K20D has 9.0 Ev of usable dynamic range whereas according to their
 test of K10D, it has only 7.3 Ev of DR. I wonder if anyone can
 actually confirm this. I am not interested in numbers of course, more
 of a perception resulting from real life use of both cameras under
 similar conditions.
 
 Thanks in advance.
 
 -- 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Paul, I probably did not mention that explicitly, but I was talking
about K20D using with EDR turned *off*. Say, you take K10D and K20D
both at ISO 100 and take a shot. Any observable difference in
highlight/shadow details?

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the 
 K10D. That's with the EDR feature turned on.
 Paul

-- 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question

I measured DR myself with the *ist DS and K10D using a procedure very  
similar to what was written up in Photo Techniques January/February  
2007 issue. In my testing, the K10D's RAW capture dynamic range runs  
from 11 to 9 stops over the ISO range from 100 to 1600, an increase of  
about 2 stops over the *ist DS.  (DR decreases as ISO increases.)

No testing of dynamic range is comparable unless the exact same  
procedure is used on all cameras. Whatever numbers DPR is publishing  
is reflective more of their testing methods than of the cameras  
specifically.

Godfrey



On Jun 26, 2008, at 5:17 AM, Boris Liberman wrote:

 Hi!

 The review just published on DPReview and mentioned here mentions that
 K20D has 9.0 Ev of usable dynamic range whereas according to their
 test of K10D, it has only 7.3 Ev of DR. I wonder if anyone can
 actually confirm this. I am not interested in numbers of course, more
 of a perception resulting from real life use of both cameras under
 similar conditions.


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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread Adam Maas

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 10:20 AM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/

 Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

 ;)

 Me, the Pentax K20D... and who's the third? :D
 I think I am missing a point here... O.o

 .t


You've started the third thread on the K20D Review over at DPReview.



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Re: PESO - DA* 300/4 sample shot

2008-06-26 Thread Bob Sullivan

Jostien,
Yes, very neat!
I love how sharp the tern is in the 1:1 crop.
Please don't post any more DA*300/4 shots - too much enablement!  ;-)
Regards,  Bob S.

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 8:54 AM, AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 This hunting tern was observed yesterday afternoon by the Eastern end
 of the Greenland Dock, Southwark Bourough, London.

 I think it is a good testimony both to the capability of the lens, and
 to the AF capability of the K20D. I had the AF set for auto-selection
 of sensor, because I had to keep full concentration on keeping the
 tern inside the frame. Out of about 20 shots with varying background
 (clouds, blue sky, foliage, and brick walls as here), only 2 are
 focused on the background. Pretty neat, eh? :-)

 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-97

 A crop (not 1:1)
 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-98

 Exposure: 1/1000s, f/5.6, ISO 200.

 Best,
 Jostein

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

2008-06-26 Thread Jaume Lahuerta

Boris, Boris,...

Remember that happiness consists in having little needs...

;-)

Jaume
(whose little needs consist is a K20D replacement for his Ds)


- Mensaje original 
De: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Para: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Enviado: jueves, 26 de junio, 2008 16:42:28
Asunto: Re: K20D dynamic range question

Paul, I probably did not mention that explicitly, but I was talking
about K20D using with EDR turned *off*. Say, you take K10D and K20D
both at ISO 100 and take a shot. Any observable difference in
highlight/shadow details?

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the 
 K10D. That's with the EDR feature turned on.
 Paul

-- 
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Re: Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF) Pentax (ZK)

2008-06-26 Thread Adam Maas

Interesting, I'd love to get one in ZF form, even if it isn't the 21mm
Distagon I really want to see.

Pricing is probably around $1500USD, similar to the 100mm f2
Makro-Planar, which is the other really exotic lens in the line.

-Adam

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 7:08 AM, Roman Melihhov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.zeiss.com/c12567a8003b58b9/Contents-Frame/e0943e181906e994c125746c0053918c
 ^^^ beautiful babies. I wonder price tag?!



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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Don't know. I rarely turn EDR off, and I don't pixel peep.
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Paul, I probably did not mention that explicitly, but I was talking
 about K20D using with EDR turned *off*. Say, you take K10D and K20D
 both at ISO 100 and take a shot. Any observable difference in
 highlight/shadow details?
 
 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the 
 K10D. That's with the EDR feature turned on.
  Paul
 
 -- 
 Boris
 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question


 
 From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Numerous times I
 were (or is it I was?!) able to pull out the highlight detail from the
 chimping screen blinkies. 

Was.  The first person, I, is the subject of the verb, not numerous times.
http://leo.stcloudstate.edu/grammar/subverag.html

Dunno about the other stuff.  8-)


-
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Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam


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RE: Enablement

2008-06-26 Thread John Wittingham

I wish Pentax would add a DA* 400/5.6 to the roadmap.

John

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of AlunFoto [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]
Sent: 26 June 2008 15:12
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: Enablement

Look forward to your testing, John. Especially the performance with TCs added.

Best,
Jostein

2008/6/26 John Wittingham [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Just took delivery of a DA* 300 f/4 SDM, first impressions quite positive. In 
 comparison to my Sigma 300mm f/4 APO it'a a little lighter and less 
 cumbersome but does not have the quick detachable tripod collar of the Sigma 
 or the focus limiter, of course it is SDM and sealed. More comment and 
 perhaps a PESO or two when I get chance to use it, maybe this weekend. 
 Planning on a test against my Sigma 300 f/4 with and without TC's fitted.

 Best regards,

 John

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Jaume, I wasn't saying that I was going to replace K10D with K20D.
However, what Godfrey said means that I am going to be totally
satisfied with 11 stop of DR at ISO 100.

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:53 PM, Jaume Lahuerta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Boris, Boris,...

 Remember that happiness consists in having little needs...

 ;-)

 Jaume
 (whose little needs consist is a K20D replacement for his Ds)


 - Mensaje original 
 De: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Para: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
 Enviado: jueves, 26 de junio, 2008 16:42:28
 Asunto: Re: K20D dynamic range question

 Paul, I probably did not mention that explicitly, but I was talking
 about K20D using with EDR turned *off*. Say, you take K10D and K20D
 both at ISO 100 and take a shot. Any observable difference in
 highlight/shadow details?

 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the 
 K10D. That's with the EDR feature turned on.
 Paul

 --
 Boris

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

Jaume,

Don't you recognise the desperate search for arguments _against_ enablement? :-)

voice of vogon robot
   Resistance is useless!
/voice of vogon robot

Jostein

2008/6/26 Jaume Lahuerta [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Boris, Boris,...

 Remember that happiness consists in having little needs...

 ;-)

 Jaume
 (whose little needs consist is a K20D replacement for his Ds)


 - Mensaje original 
 De: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Para: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
 Enviado: jueves, 26 de junio, 2008 16:42:28
 Asunto: Re: K20D dynamic range question

 Paul, I probably did not mention that explicitly, but I was talking
 about K20D using with EDR turned *off*. Say, you take K10D and K20D
 both at ISO 100 and take a shot. Any observable difference in
 highlight/shadow details?

 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:34 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yes, definitely true. I can save skies with the K20D that I lose with the 
 K10D. That's with the EDR feature turned on.
 Paul

 --
 Boris

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:59 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Don't know. I rarely turn EDR off, and I don't pixel peep.
 Paul

Understood. However washed out skies for example is something that is
immediately visible and IMHO does not account for pixel peeping.

-- 
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Re: PESO - DA* 300/4 sample shot

Cool shot, but not enough CA for me.:-0

Dave

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 9:54 AM, AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 This hunting tern was observed yesterday afternoon by the Eastern end
 of the Greenland Dock, Southwark Bourough, London.

 I think it is a good testimony both to the capability of the lens, and
 to the AF capability of the K20D. I had the AF set for auto-selection
 of sensor, because I had to keep full concentration on keeping the
 tern inside the frame. Out of about 20 shots with varying background
 (clouds, blue sky, foliage, and brick walls as here), only 2 are
 focused on the background. Pretty neat, eh? :-)

 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-97

 A crop (not 1:1)
 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-98

 Exposure: 1/1000s, f/5.6, ISO 200.

 Best,
 Jostein

 --
 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/
 http://alunfoto.blogspot.com

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Re: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

2008-06-26 Thread Walter Hamler

In case you missed the post, the butterfly in question is not a
Monarch but a Queen. It has a darker more chocholate coloring.

Walt

On 6/26/08, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Oh yes I did. The abstract was quite interesting, if you read closely
the hypothesis was that the insect would be darker in cold climates to
help the insects keep warm. The quot and the position in the abstract
that tells me how much this hypothesis is worth is this one

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

AlunFoto wrote:

Peter, Walt, Bob,

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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Re: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

I didn't miss the post, you're right of course, if it's a queen
butterfly the comparison to the coloring of monarchs is not relevant,
and my suggestion is moot. In the word of Emily Latella Nevermind.

Walter Hamler wrote:
In case you missed the post, the butterfly in question is not a
Monarch but a Queen. It has a darker more chocholate coloring.

Walt

On 6/26/08, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hum, damn near half of the experimental population showed the reverse
adaptation. Perhaps there is another explanation. In the current
question as to whether this effect is great enough to make as big a
difference as seen between Walters butterfly shot and mine, or whether
processing or perhaps color space caused the difference, the abstract
doesn't tell us that. In fact it tells little or nothing at all.

AlunFoto wrote:

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

AlunFoto wrote:

Peter, Walt, Bob,

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

2008-06-26 Thread Jos from Holland

Dear Group,
I have lot of film material (negatives and slides) that I want to 
convert to digital.
I have a good Minolta film scanner, at that time I paid more for it than 
a K20D costs :-). It delivers good quality but it takes far to much time 
to be used on larger quantities of pictures...
So I want to work out a faster method using my K10D.
July PUG gave a last push, because that black and white negative had to 
be digitized.
I worked out the following, remarks, questions and suggestions are most 
welcome!
_
The hardware_
Aim is to get a 1:1 image of the slide (36x24) on the sensor of my K10D 
(approx 24x18)
I would like to use my SMC-M 100/4 macro or my SMC-M 50/1.7 because they 
are mechanically compatible with my Pentax slide copier.
autobellows M with slide copier does not work: lens cannot come close 
enough to the body.
I made a metal bracket to connect the slide copier directly to the body.
  1:1 can be reached with SMC-M 50/1.7 with 20+12mm macro rings from PANAGOR
Aperture of lens set to 11 as compromise for sharpnees / depth of field 
to allow some unflatness of the film and to allow for some misalignment 
of slide copier, lens and body.
ISO 100 for best noise performance.
Using flash light from behind the slide copier, Adjusting flash power 
and / or flash distance to get the histogram more or less in the middle.
Contrast of negative film is low, so exposure is not really critical
This set op allows quick reproduction

Now the Software part.
The image contrast on negative film is low and has to be increased a lot 
in the processing.
Unfortunately the K10D does not have a setting for negative film 
copying. That would be nice if the contrast range could be adjusted to 
cover the full range of the AD converter, than 8 bits could be enough. 
We donot have that, so we must use RAW to get more bits. In the 
processing the higher number of bits has to be maintained till the 
contrast expansion is done.

For the image processing I use Photoshop Elements 6.0 with the free 
downloadable plug-in SmartCurve this plug-in is very  powerfull and 
increases the value of PSE a lot for me.

After importing the file in PSE, do not forget to tick the 16bit square 
(remember 8 bit is not enough for negative film)
rotate the picture 1 or 2 degrees if needed
crop the picture
convert to black and white by selecting  gray tones
Select filter smartcurve this curve allows to invert the negative to 
positive (vertical flip of the curve), to choose the white level and the 
black level (expand contrast  to best possible value) and fine tune 
gamma (mid gray) if needed
Now convert the immage to 720pixels voor longest side (PUG requirement)
Adjust sharpness for best compromise at normal viewing distance (take 
care more sharpness can result in more visibility of film grain!)
Go back to 8 bits to be able to save as jpeg
Save as Jpeg while selecting maximum quality level with file size below 
256kb (PUG requirement) and file name with max 8 characters (PUG 
requirement)

This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed improvements are 
most welcome
:-)
Jos


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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread Cotty

On 26/6/08, Scott Loveless, discombobulated, unleashed:

Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

;)


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Re: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

2008-06-26 Thread Perry Pellechia

If you are interested in seeing the full article send me an email. I
have access to the journal through my work.
FWIW, they used a Oly C-3000 to photograph the larvae and a flat bead
scanner to image the butterflies.

Perry.

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 8:06 AM, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Oh yes I did. The abstract was quite interesting, if you read closely
the hypothesis was that the insect would be darker in cold climates to
help the insects keep warm. The quot and the position in the abstract
that tells me how much this hypothesis is worth is this one

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

AlunFoto wrote:

Peter, Walt, Bob,

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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Re: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Thanks Perry, but the answer is that Walter apparently photographed a
Queen butterfly, where as I was photographing Monarch Butterflies so
what we were really comparing apples and oran..., well no more like
oranges and tangerines.

Perry Pellechia wrote:
If you are interested in seeing the full article send me an email. I
have access to the journal through my work.
FWIW, they used a Oly C-3000 to photograph the larvae and a flat bead
scanner to image the butterflies.

Perry.

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 8:06 AM, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

AlunFoto wrote:

Jostein

2008/6/26 P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

AlunFoto wrote:

Peter, Walt, Bob,

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL_udi=B6T94-4GJM3Y5-1_user=10_rdoc=1_fmt=_orig=search_sort=dview=c_acct=C50221_version=1_urlVersion=0_userid=10md5=a63c95bf46d5dc941776d1da7d26b91b

Now since Walt lives in Florida... :-)

Jostein

2008/6/25 Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Christine Aguila
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi Walt: Very nice, but perhaps a little bit of a crop on the right?
Great
catch nonetheless! Cheers, Christine

- Original Message -
From: Walter Hamler [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 7:08 PM
Subject: PESO-Butterfly Encounter

Local Nursery has a Butterfly House. Great opportunity for pics but I
have learned bigtime that macro is hard!!!

Walt

http://walthamler.smugmug.com/gallery/4592986_mrB5J/3/319375517_VQr2A#319375517_VQr2A-XL-LB

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Peso Last day of.....

School today.:-)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djbrooks/2613123279/

My bus in the driveway between last two runs.

My feet are cut off. Liz took the shot.

K10D, DA F 50 f2.8, LR adjust temp a bit and up lights.

Dave (I have the summer off, well not really, i have lots of horse shows) Brooks

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Ontario Canada

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Re: Peso Last day of.....

My that is a handsome bus, I like what you've done with it.

David J Brooks wrote:
 School today.:-)

 http://www.flickr.com/photos/djbrooks/2613123279/

 My bus in the driveway between last two runs.

 My feet are cut off. Liz took the shot.

 K10D, DA F 50 f2.8, LR adjust temp a bit and up lights.

 Dave (I have the summer off, well not really, i have lots of horse shows) 
 Brooks

   


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Re: Peso Last day of.....

Looks good, Dave.  Have a great summer off!!!  Cheers, Christine


- Original Message - 
From: David J Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax Discuss pdml@pdml.net; Harry Bolton [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Barb 
Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Sarah Bedford-James 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; Yvette Sheppard [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 12:55 PM
Subject: Peso Last day of.


 School today.:-)

 http://www.flickr.com/photos/djbrooks/2613123279/

 My bus in the driveway between last two runs.

 My feet are cut off. Liz took the shot.

 K10D, DA F 50 f2.8, LR adjust temp a bit and up lights.

 Dave (I have the summer off, well not really, i have lots of horse shows) 
 Brooks

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 www.caughtinmotion.com
 http://brooksinthecountry.blogspot.com/
 Ontario Canada

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Re: 3 for You Simpson Fans

Thanks, Dave.  You know, I've never seen an episode of the Simpson's. 
Cheers, Christine


- Original Message - 
From: David J Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:51 AM
Subject: Re: 3 for You Simpson Fans


 Sidewalk + subject is my favorite.

 Major Simpson fan, here at the Brooks house hold.

 Dave

 On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Christine  Aguila
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Sidewalk + subject
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452550

 horizontal
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452551size=lg

 vertical
 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452552

 Cheers, Christine


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 Ontario Canada

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

On Jun 26, 2008, at 10:02 AM, Jos from Holland wrote:
 ... This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed  
 improvements are
 most welcome ...


I used to scan a lot of film ... probably up to five rolls of film a  
week, selectively ... and it is *always* time consuming, tedious and  
difficult to get top notch results. I've done it with scanners, with  
macro setups, etc etc etc.

Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now  
outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results  
look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a  
thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.

I now only scan a few frames a year at most as I explore my film  
archives. For that level of endeavor, I use the Nikon Coolscan IV ED  
and Vuescan software to capture the image data. I do any required  
editing in Lightroom and Photoshop CS2.

Godfrey

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

2008-06-26 Thread DagT

The problem with that thread on www.foto.no is that the theory was  
based on Canon 5D highlight warning and exposure meter, so how I´m not  
sure how relevant it is for Pentax. The highlight warning on the Canon  
seems to be based on the jpg-files, while in my experience the  
highlight warning is closer to the RAW files on K20D. Also, as also  
stated by dpreview K20D seems to be basing the exposure meter on the  
highlights so it is different from both K10D and Canon 5D.  The guy  
who was claiming this had a look at my K20D files and found lack of  
details in the same areas that had highlight warnings on the camera.  
He claims that his method works on K20D but I´m not convinced.

In my experience the exposure meter on K20D goes more to the right  
than K10D (and thus follows some of the recommendations in the  
mentioned thread) and it has a little better dynamic range in RAW. A  
very rough test based n the chimping method shows that the range  
between higlight and low light warnings on K20D was 10EV...

DagT

Den 26. juni. 2008 kl. 15.20 skrev AlunFoto:

 I have been trying to look into this, but haven't been able to reach
 any conclusions yet. The tests I did last week was done with the K20D
 on a tripod and using the 2s self-timer. So alas, I'm left with a set
 of test shots with an awful lot of weird noise. I have learned about
 the firmware update adressing that problem, but haven't got around to
 update the camera yet. :-(

 Though off-topic for a Pentax group, there was a very interesting
 discussion at www.foto.no last week (in Norwegian, unfortunately),
 discussing the dynamic ranges in raw files from various cameras. With
 the Canons in particular, but also the Nikons, it seems one can pull
 down details from highlights that seem to be blown by up to 2-2.5
 stops, judged from the chimping screen. It was argued quite forcefully
 that underexposure was to be dreaded much more than overexposure,
 because of the lousy S/N ratio in the deeper shadows.

 Apparently, the K10D does not provide much leeway in the
 post-processing compared to what appears on the chimping screen, but
 nobody tested the K20D. It's tempting to speculate that the switch to
 a CMOS sensor in the latter could make a big difference... :-)

 Jostein


 2008/6/26 Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi!

 The review just published on DPReview and mentioned here mentions  
 that
 K20D has 9.0 Ev of usable dynamic range whereas according to their
 test of K10D, it has only 7.3 Ev of DR. I wonder if anyone can
 actually confirm this. I am not interested in numbers of course, more
 of a perception resulting from real life use of both cameras under
 similar conditions.

 Thanks in advance.

 --
 Boris

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

- Original Message - 
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for 
PUG

 On Jun 26, 2008, at 10:02 AM, Jos from Holland wrote:
 ... This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed
 improvements are
 most welcome ...

 Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now
 outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results
 look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a
 thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.

Yes, I've done a thorough read of ScanCafe's website, and I very much want 
to try them, but at one point their turn-around time was 8 weeks because 
business boomed,  they've been scrambling to expand staff to accommodate 
the business.  I've been meaning to check back.  Maybe they've expanded now 
and can improve upon the turn-around time.

Cheers, Christine 

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG


On Jun 26, 2008, at 11:18 AM, Christine Aguila wrote:

 Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now
 outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results
 look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a
 thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.

 Yes, I've done a thorough read of ScanCafe's website, and I very  
 much want
 to try them, but at one point their turn-around time was 8 weeks  
 because
 business boomed,  they've been scrambling to expand staff to  
 accommodate
 the business.  I've been meaning to check back.  Maybe they've  
 expanded now
 and can improve upon the turn-around time.

If I'm thinking of scanning 100-1000 negatives, 8 weeks is far less  
than the time it would take me to do the job myself... !

G

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

- Original Message - 
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 1:24 PM
Subject: Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for 
PUG

 On Jun 26, 2008, at 11:18 AM, Christine Aguila wrote:

 Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now
 outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results
 look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a
 thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.

 Yes, I've done a thorough read of ScanCafe's website, and I very
 much want
 to try them, but at one point their turn-around time was 8 weeks
 because
 business boomed,  they've been scrambling to expand staff to
 accommodate
 the business.  I've been meaning to check back.  Maybe they've
 expanded now
 and can improve upon the turn-around time.

 If I'm thinking of scanning 100-1000 negatives, 8 weeks is far less
 than the time it would take me to do the job myself... !

 G

True enough!  Point taken :-)  Cheers, Christine 

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RE: Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF) Pentax (ZK)

2008-06-26 Thread Bob W

smugI've got a Zeiss 21mm and a 100mm makro in CZ fit. Both very
nice lensessmug

I will happily entertain reasonable offers for both.

Bob

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On 
 Behalf Of Adam Maas
 Sent: 26 June 2008 15:59
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 Subject: Re: Zeiss 18mm f/3.5 for Nikon (ZF)  Pentax (ZK)
 
 Interesting, I'd love to get one in ZF form, even if it isn't the
21mm
 Distagon I really want to see.
 
 Pricing is probably around $1500USD, similar to the 100mm f2
 Makro-Planar, which is the other really exotic lens in the line.
 
 -Adam
 
 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 7:08 AM, Roman Melihhov 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
 http://www.zeiss.com/c12567a8003b58b9/Contents-Frame/e0943e181
906e994c125746c0053918c
  ^^^ beautiful babies. I wonder price tag?!
 
 
 
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 Explorations of the City Around Us.
 
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Re: Highly Recomended

Too funny!  Subtle, but great!

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Best regards,
Bruce


Thursday, June 26, 2008, 4:38:16 AM, you wrote:

C Scott Loveless wrote:
 Charles Robinson wrote:

 Roman will post the link in a couple of weeks.

 We should start a pool.
 

C JCO can photograph it.

C Christian




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PESO 2008 - 101 - GDG

Morning walk in light mists, near dawn ...

   http://homepage.mac.com/godders/101-threes.jpg
   Threes - Neighborhood Details 2008
   Olympus E-1 + Summilux-D 25mm f/1.4 ASPH + Olympus EC14
   ISO 200 @ f/2.0 @ 1/400 sec, fl=35mm

Comments and critique always appreciated.

enjoy
Godfrey

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RE: PESO - DA* 300/4 sample shot

2008-06-26 Thread Bob W

Nicely focused on the tern, and it really shows the beauty of these
little birds. There are a lot of them about at the moment. I know they
are summer visitors, but there seem to be more of them on the river
this year than I've seen before. They distract me when I go jogging
because I enjoy watching them holding their position in the breeze
then plunging to the water.

Bob 

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On 
 Behalf Of AlunFoto
 Sent: 26 June 2008 14:55
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 Subject: PESO - DA* 300/4 sample shot
 
 This hunting tern was observed yesterday afternoon by the Eastern
end
 of the Greenland Dock, Southwark Bourough, London.
 
 I think it is a good testimony both to the capability of the lens,
and
 to the AF capability of the K20D. I had the AF set for
auto-selection
 of sensor, because I had to keep full concentration on keeping the
 tern inside the frame. Out of about 20 shots with varying background
 (clouds, blue sky, foliage, and brick walls as here), only 2 are
 focused on the background. Pretty neat, eh? :-)
 
 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-97
 
 A crop (not 1:1)
 http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/displayimage.php?pos=-98
 
 Exposure: 1/1000s, f/5.6, ISO 200.
 
 Best,
 Jostein
 
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RE: Once A Year

2008-06-26 Thread Bob W

  
  Connoisseurs of the island race that lives off the coast of 
 Europe may
  find this gallery of pictures by Homer Sykes interesting and
  enjoyable:
  
  

http://www.luminous-lint.com/app/vexhibit/_PHOTOGRAPHER_Homer__Sykes_0
  1/5/0/0/
  
 
 A review of last year's Tate exhibition:
 http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,,2082871,00.html
 

I went to that. In fact, I submitted some of my own photos. It was a
really good exhibition.

Bob


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OT - mic windshield

2008-06-26 Thread Cotty

Just buying some sound peripherals and came across this, a common
accessory but the name made me laugh

http://www.thomann.de/gb/rode_deadkitten.htm

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

True. But I haven't shot enough with the K20D and no EDR to say for sure if 
there's a difference. But with EDR, the K20D definitely shows an extended 
range. I can't see any reason to shoot without EDR other than a need for a 
wider stop or slower shutter speed (on the low ISO end of things). Actually, 
the few times I've turned it off have been to shoot at ISO 6400. There's no 
difference in image quality between ISO 100 and ISO 200.
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:59 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Don't know. I rarely turn EDR off, and I don't pixel peep.
  Paul
 
 Understood. However washed out skies for example is something that is
 immediately visible and IMHO does not account for pixel peeping.
 
 -- 
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Re: 3 for You Simpson Fans

It's tasteless but brilliant. 
Beer me Marge!
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Christine  Aguila [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Thanks, Dave.  You know, I've never seen an episode of the Simpson's. 
 Cheers, Christine
 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: David J Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
 Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:51 AM
 Subject: Re: 3 for You Simpson Fans
 
 
  Sidewalk + subject is my favorite.
 
  Major Simpson fan, here at the Brooks house hold.
 
  Dave
 
  On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Christine  Aguila
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Sidewalk + subject
  http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452550
 
  horizontal
  http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452551size=lg
 
  vertical
  http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=7452552
 
  Cheers, Christine
 
 
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  -- 
  Equine Photography
  www.caughtinmotion.com
  http://brooksinthecountry.blogspot.com/
  Ontario Canada
 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question

2008-06-26 Thread Tim Bray

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 1:00 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 True. But I haven't shot enough with the K20D and no EDR to say for sure if 
 there's a difference.

The difference is not dramatic, but it's there.  I wonder why they
just didn't leave it permanently on.

 -T

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

It sounds like you've optimized this process, and I'm sure your results will be 
more than acceptable. Thje only thing I might suggest is using a  good evenly 
lit  light box for illumination. That being said,  a high quality film scanner 
will undoubtedly do a better job, and I doubt that you'd spend any more time at 
it. The setup here has to be quite time consuming. 
 -- Original message --
From: Jos from Holland [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Dear Group,
 I have lot of film material (negatives and slides) that I want to 
 convert to digital.
 I have a good Minolta film scanner, at that time I paid more for it than 
 a K20D costs :-). It delivers good quality but it takes far to much time 
 to be used on larger quantities of pictures...
 So I want to work out a faster method using my K10D.
 July PUG gave a last push, because that black and white negative had to 
 be digitized.
 I worked out the following, remarks, questions and suggestions are most 
 welcome!
 _
 The hardware_
 Aim is to get a 1:1 image of the slide (36x24) on the sensor of my K10D 
 (approx 24x18)
 I would like to use my SMC-M 100/4 macro or my SMC-M 50/1.7 because they 
 are mechanically compatible with my Pentax slide copier.
 autobellows M with slide copier does not work: lens cannot come close 
 enough to the body.
 I made a metal bracket to connect the slide copier directly to the body.
   1:1 can be reached with SMC-M 50/1.7 with 20+12mm macro rings from PANAGOR
 Aperture of lens set to 11 as compromise for sharpnees / depth of field 
 to allow some unflatness of the film and to allow for some misalignment 
 of slide copier, lens and body.
 ISO 100 for best noise performance.
 Using flash light from behind the slide copier, Adjusting flash power 
 and / or flash distance to get the histogram more or less in the middle.
 Contrast of negative film is low, so exposure is not really critical
 This set op allows quick reproduction
 
 Now the Software part.
 The image contrast on negative film is low and has to be increased a lot 
 in the processing.
 Unfortunately the K10D does not have a setting for negative film 
 copying. That would be nice if the contrast range could be adjusted to 
 cover the full range of the AD converter, than 8 bits could be enough. 
 We donot have that, so we must use RAW to get more bits. In the 
 processing the higher number of bits has to be maintained till the 
 contrast expansion is done.
 
 For the image processing I use Photoshop Elements 6.0 with the free 
 downloadable plug-in SmartCurve this plug-in is very  powerfull and 
 increases the value of PSE a lot for me.
 
 After importing the file in PSE, do not forget to tick the 16bit square 
 (remember 8 bit is not enough for negative film)
 rotate the picture 1 or 2 degrees if needed
 crop the picture
 convert to black and white by selecting  gray tones
 Select filter smartcurve this curve allows to invert the negative to 
 positive (vertical flip of the curve), to choose the white level and the 
 black level (expand contrast  to best possible value) and fine tune 
 gamma (mid gray) if needed
 Now convert the immage to 720pixels voor longest side (PUG requirement)
 Adjust sharpness for best compromise at normal viewing distance (take 
 care more sharpness can result in more visibility of film grain!)
 Go back to 8 bits to be able to save as jpeg
 Save as Jpeg while selecting maximum quality level with file size below 
 256kb (PUG requirement) and file name with max 8 characters (PUG 
 requirement)
 
 This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed improvements are 
 most welcome
 :-)
 Jos
 
 
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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

I have more than 200,000 negatives that I've never printed or scanned. Probably 
10,000 that I'd REALLY like to have scanned. Many of those are BW shots of my 
kids when they were toddlers -- thirty years ago.  I should look into this.
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 On Jun 26, 2008, at 11:18 AM, Christine Aguila wrote:
 
  Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now
  outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results
  look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a
  thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.
 
  Yes, I've done a thorough read of ScanCafe's website, and I very  
  much want
  to try them, but at one point their turn-around time was 8 weeks  
  because
  business boomed,  they've been scrambling to expand staff to  
  accommodate
  the business.  I've been meaning to check back.  Maybe they've  
  expanded now
  and can improve upon the turn-around time.
 
 If I'm thinking of scanning 100-1000 negatives, 8 weeks is far less  
 than the time it would take me to do the job myself... !
 
 G
 
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Re: K20D dynamic range question


 -- Original message --
From: Tim Bray [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 1:00 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  True. But I haven't shot enough with the K20D and no EDR to say for sure if 
 there's a difference.
 
 The difference is not dramatic, but it's there.  I wonder why they
 just didn't leave it permanently on.

No 6400, no 100 if it's permanently on. Sometimes you need those extremes.
Paul

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

2008-06-26 Thread Jos from Holland

Thnx for your reaction Godfrey, I did not think in the direction of 
having it done, yet.
Economicly you're probably right, working a few days and use that money 
leads probably to more scanned film than I could do myself in those few 
days.
The same holds for painting my house, but I still do it myself, maybe 
I'm stupid
But, another thing is the issue of selection (for every solution there 
is a problem :-) :
40 years of driven amateur photography gave me 10 to 20 thousend 
slides or negatives plus 10 thousend family slides from my father.
I want to select before scanning. I expect 5 to 10 %  that I will want 
to digitize. Can I tell to scancafe to scan only #6 and #24 of a set of 
negative strips?
For the slides I already decided not to use a projector, but select on a 
light table, but if I have to take every slide in my hands, it is not so 
much time to put an approved slide in my set up and click, I could even 
make a footswitch to do it faster :-)
Jos


Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
 On Jun 26, 2008, at 10:02 AM, Jos from Holland wrote:
   
 ... This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed  
 improvements are
 most welcome ...
 


 I used to scan a lot of film ... probably up to five rolls of film a  
 week, selectively ... and it is *always* time consuming, tedious and  
 difficult to get top notch results. I've done it with scanners, with  
 macro setups, etc etc etc.

 Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are now  
 outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/). The results  
 look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand negatives ($240 for a  
 thousand slides), it is great time and money savings.

 I now only scan a few frames a year at most as I explore my film  
 archives. For that level of endeavor, I use the Nikon Coolscan IV ED  
 and Vuescan software to capture the image data. I do any required  
 editing in Lightroom and Photoshop CS2.

 Godfrey

   

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG


- Original Message - 
From: Jos from Holland [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 I want to select before scanning. I expect 5 to 10 %  that I will want
 to digitize. Can I tell to scancafe to scan only #6 and #24 of a set of
 negative strips?


Jos:  Scancafe lets you pic the scans you want--and you only have to pay for 
the ones you want! BUT, they do require you to purchase a 50% minimum--but 
that should be a problem when doing huge scan-jobs, right?  The chances of 
you wanting at least half of your scanned images seems to be pretty high.

You should check out the web site.

Cheers, Christine 



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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

2008-06-26 Thread Scott Loveless

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I have more than 200,000 negatives that I've never printed or
 scanned. Probably 10,000 that I'd REALLY like to have scanned. Many
 of those are BW shots of my kids when they were toddlers -- thirty
 years ago.  I should look into this. Paul -- Original
 message -- From: Godfrey DiGiorgi
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 On Jun 26, 2008, at 11:18 AM, Christine Aguila wrote:
 
 Most of the professionals I've talked to in the past year are
 now outsourcing this work to ScanCafe (http://scancafe.com/).
 The results look very good, and at $190 to scan a thousand
 negatives ($240 for a thousand slides), it is great time and
 money savings.

FYI, those prices are for color negs.  BW runs a buck per photo.

-- 
Scott Loveless
http://www.twosixteen.com/fivetoedsloth/

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Re: K20D dynamic range question

2008-06-26 Thread John Francis

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 08:20:41PM +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  -- Original message --
 From: Tim Bray [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 1:00 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   True. But I haven't shot enough with the K20D and no EDR to say for sure 
   if 
  there's a difference.
  
  The difference is not dramatic, but it's there.  I wonder why they
  just didn't leave it permanently on.
 
 No 6400, no 100 if it's permanently on. Sometimes you need those extremes.
 Paul

And even if you never use them, it looks good on the spec sheet.


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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread Tim Øsleby

Blame it on server hickup t.
That's what I did.

MaritimTim

2008/6/26  [EMAIL PROTECTED]:


 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/

 Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

 ;)

 Me, the Pentax K20D... and who's the third? :D
 I think I am missing a point here... O.o

 .t


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-- 
MaritimTim

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Re: Work flow to convert a BW film negative to a digital file for PUG

2008-06-26 Thread Jos from Holland

TNX Paul,
My Minolta Dimage ScanSpeed does  a better job than the macro set-up 
with my K10D, pixel count is effectively three times higher in case of 
colour, but it is sooo sloow: high resolution scanning takes 45 
seconds! I only want to spent so much time if the picture has to be 
printed on larger format.
The light box is a nice idea. I tried also my laptop with a white page, 
together with the diffuser of the Pentax slide copier this gives avery 
homogeneous lighting. Finaly a used the flash to have shutterspeed fast 
enough to avoid vibration blurr. Idealy I should construct a lightbox 
with constant light to ease focussing and flash to avoid blurr.
Jos

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 It sounds like you've optimized this process, and I'm sure your results will 
 be more than acceptable. Thje only thing I might suggest is using a  good 
 evenly lit  light box for illumination. That being said,  a high quality film 
 scanner will undoubtedly do a better job, and I doubt that you'd spend any 
 more time at it. The setup here has to be quite time consuming. 
  -- Original message --
 From: Jos from Holland [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   
 Dear Group,
 I have lot of film material (negatives and slides) that I want to 
 convert to digital.
 I have a good Minolta film scanner, at that time I paid more for it than 
 a K20D costs :-). It delivers good quality but it takes far to much time 
 to be used on larger quantities of pictures...
 So I want to work out a faster method using my K10D.
 July PUG gave a last push, because that black and white negative had to 
 be digitized.
 I worked out the following, remarks, questions and suggestions are most 
 welcome!
 _
 The hardware_
 Aim is to get a 1:1 image of the slide (36x24) on the sensor of my K10D 
 (approx 24x18)
 I would like to use my SMC-M 100/4 macro or my SMC-M 50/1.7 because they 
 are mechanically compatible with my Pentax slide copier.
 autobellows M with slide copier does not work: lens cannot come close 
 enough to the body.
 I made a metal bracket to connect the slide copier directly to the body.
   1:1 can be reached with SMC-M 50/1.7 with 20+12mm macro rings from PANAGOR
 Aperture of lens set to 11 as compromise for sharpnees / depth of field 
 to allow some unflatness of the film and to allow for some misalignment 
 of slide copier, lens and body.
 ISO 100 for best noise performance.
 Using flash light from behind the slide copier, Adjusting flash power 
 and / or flash distance to get the histogram more or less in the middle.
 Contrast of negative film is low, so exposure is not really critical
 This set op allows quick reproduction

 Now the Software part.
 The image contrast on negative film is low and has to be increased a lot 
 in the processing.
 Unfortunately the K10D does not have a setting for negative film 
 copying. That would be nice if the contrast range could be adjusted to 
 cover the full range of the AD converter, than 8 bits could be enough. 
 We donot have that, so we must use RAW to get more bits. In the 
 processing the higher number of bits has to be maintained till the 
 contrast expansion is done.

 For the image processing I use Photoshop Elements 6.0 with the free 
 downloadable plug-in SmartCurve this plug-in is very  powerfull and 
 increases the value of PSE a lot for me.

 After importing the file in PSE, do not forget to tick the 16bit square 
 (remember 8 bit is not enough for negative film)
 rotate the picture 1 or 2 degrees if needed
 crop the picture
 convert to black and white by selecting  gray tones
 Select filter smartcurve this curve allows to invert the negative to 
 positive (vertical flip of the curve), to choose the white level and the 
 black level (expand contrast  to best possible value) and fine tune 
 gamma (mid gray) if needed
 Now convert the immage to 720pixels voor longest side (PUG requirement)
 Adjust sharpness for best compromise at normal viewing distance (take 
 care more sharpness can result in more visibility of film grain!)
 Go back to 8 bits to be able to save as jpeg
 Save as Jpeg while selecting maximum quality level with file size below 
 256kb (PUG requirement) and file name with max 8 characters (PUG 
 requirement)

 This worked for me. Suggestions for quality or speed improvements are 
 most welcome
 :-)
 Jos


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Re: PESO - Bree

Hello Scott,

I kind of like this one.  There are some issues - especially the
dog's eyes, but there is something about it overall - you've captured
a very natural moment.  Some minor fill flash and some further
shooting with her could be very interesting.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce


Monday, June 23, 2008, 2:02:46 PM, you wrote:

SL Bree and her dog, Sacha.
SL http://picasaweb.google.com/sdloveless/PDMLPESO/photo#5215184476565989666

SL P645, 120 Macro, Kodak EPL cross processed.  EPL does not cross process
SL well.  I've had much better luck with Astia.  Took a bit of fiddling to
SL get it to this point, and it's really grainy.

SL -- 
SL Scott Loveless
SL http://www.twosixteen.com/fivetoedsloth/




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Re: On the issue of blown highlights!

That's exactly what I was thinking grin.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce


Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 11:06:50 AM, you wrote:

DB Christine Aguila wrote:
 Hi Bruce:  Your mention of slides prompted me to go through a big box of 
 slides that I shot over 20 years ago with the Pentax MX--slides of a 
 girlfriend trip to Cancun  Florida--among other stuff.  I haven't looked at 
 these slides for years--barely recognize myself!  Anyway, yes, biasing away 
 from Highlights--yes, very key. I can see in the slides I've got some 
 bikini-clad girlfriends on the beach with some suntan lotion blown 
 highlights--made me giggle.  Anyway, thanks for the comments  advice. 
 Cheers, Christine

DB pics or it didn't happen.




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Re: GIMP question

You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
about the same as Elements.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce


Monday, June 23, 2008, 9:15:27 PM, you wrote:

BL [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Please don't take offense, but the real question is why would any serious 
 photographer subject their file to GIMP? 
 Paul

BL None taken, Paul. However I use GIMP as a complementary software for the
BL LightRoom. I cannot justify buying full PhotoShop and find Elements too
BL restrictive. GIMP appears to be just about perfect.

BL In fact, hopefully soon, GIMP will support 16-bit editing all over. Then
BL it will be better still.

BL I do hope that my degree of seriousness hadn't suffered any change due
BL to the above revelation ;-).

BL Boris






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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Sandy Harris

Bruce Dayton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
 power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
 support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
 about the same as Elements.

Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz each,
several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the alternatives
to GIMP?

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Re: PESO - Dogwood

Well, it doesn't look like a dog at all - more like a flower grin.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce


Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 9:10:44 AM, you wrote:

SL At least I think it's a dogwood.  Please correct me if I'm wrong. 
SL http://picasaweb.google.com/sdloveless/PDMLPESO/photo#5215479571735267298

SL P645, 120 Macro, EPL converted to BW.

SL Comments/critiques appreciated.

SL -- 
SL Scott Loveless
SL http://www.twosixteen.com/fivetoedsloth/




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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Bran Everseeking

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 17:10:12 -0400
Sandy Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
 resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz
 each, several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the
 alternatives to GIMP?

with colour depth and a few tools showfoto and digikam are a good pair
but until gimp gets 16 bit there are really no photoshop subs i do not
think.

cinepaint maybe?

Bran

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Re: GIMP question

Open source?  None that I know of.

Sandy Harris wrote:
 Bruce Dayton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   
 You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
 power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
 support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
 about the same as Elements.
 

 Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
 resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz each,
 several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the alternatives
 to GIMP?

   


-- 
Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil...
   -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle 


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Re: GIMP question

The alternative is to not be a serious photographer, apparently.  You
have to decide if the photography is more important than the
hardware/software.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce


Thursday, June 26, 2008, 2:10:12 PM, you wrote:

SH Bruce Dayton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
 power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
 support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
 about the same as Elements.

SH Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
SH resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz each,
SH several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the alternatives
SH to GIMP?




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PESO: red and violet

2008-06-26 Thread Tim Bray

Petal on ground cover:
http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2008/06/25/-big/R0010537.jpg

context: http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2008/06/25/Red-Petal-on-Violet

 -T

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Re: GIMP question

I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources need a 
Linus based photo processing system? Do you believe that software developers 
arent't entitled to profit and some protection of their intellectual property? 
If so, please send me all yur photos so I can sell them.
Paul
 -- Original message --
From: Bran Everseeking [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 17:10:12 -0400
 Sandy Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
  resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz
  each, several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the
  alternatives to GIMP?
 
 with colour depth and a few tools showfoto and digikam are a good pair
 but until gimp gets 16 bit there are really no photoshop subs i do not
 think.
 
 cinepaint maybe?
 
 Bran
 
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Re: Finally a REVIEW :D

2008-06-26 Thread Ken Waller

No but they stayed at a Holiday Inn Express ! ;+}

Kenneth Waller
http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f

- Original Message - 
From: Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Finally a REVIEW :D


 On 26/6/08, Scott Loveless, discombobulated, unleashed:
 
Did the three of you rent an apartment together, or what?

;)
 
 
 LOL
 --
 
 
 Cheers,
  Cotty


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P-TTL and how-to-disable question

2008-06-26 Thread Charles Robinson

Just thinking aloud... about how to use my screwy 540 for a while  
before sending it in for repairs.

If I were to somehow cover all of the pins except for the center one  
and the 1st original I'm a dedicated Pentax flash and this is how I  
signal to you that I'm charged pin, would the thing default to the  
A mode when I put it on the K10D?

That would get me by for about 85% of what I use a flash for.  I know  
it seems to work that way when I attach it to the ME-Super.

I know I'm delaying the inevitable co$t of $ending it in for repair 
$ but money is tight right now.  Thoughts?  Ideas?  Am I nuts?

  -Charles

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I am riding in the MS-TRAM this summer.  Please consider sponsoring me!
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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Sandy Harris

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:04 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources
 need a Linus based photo processing system?

I have access to reasonable Linux machines, and not to any Windows boxes.
For most applications, Linux does everything I need, and in some areas it
is obviously, at least for my purposes, superior to Windows. Photo editing
may be the exception; that's what I'm trying to discover.

 Do you believe that software developers arent't entitled to profit and
 some protection of their intellectual property?

No, but I believe that for much software development, you get better
results with an open model, where people publish their work for
others to criticise and build on.

To me, commercial secrecy in software seems much like the secrecy
military requirements impose on nuclear science. It may  be necessary,
but it is obviously bad for the science.

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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread William Robb

- Original Message - 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Subject: Re: GIMP question

 I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources need 
 a Linus based 
 photo processing system? Do you believe that software developers arent't 
 entitled to profit 
 and some protection of their intellectual property? If so, please send me all 
 yur photos so I 
 can sell them.

A lot of people do. Photoshop is just about the most pirated program out there 
at the moment. I 
personally know close to a dozen people with pirated Photoshop on their 
computers.
I am not one of them.

William Robb 

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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Sandy Harris

William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources need 
 a Linus based
 photo processing system? Do you believe that software developers arent't 
 entitled to profit
 and some protection of their intellectual property? If so, please send me 
 all yur photos so I
 can sell them.

 A lot of people do. Photoshop is just about the most pirated program out 
 there at the moment. I
 personally know close to a dozen people with pirated Photoshop on their 
 computers.

I've been living in China. The normal way to configure a computer (or
a building full of
them) there is to buy three CDs at around a dollar each: Windows, MS Office and
Photoshop.

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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Brian Walters

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 13:48:04 -0700, Bruce Dayton
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
 You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
 power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
 support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
 about the same as Elements.



I tried Picture Window Pro recently when I was looking for a 16 bit
editor that didn't cost the arm and several legs that Adobe wants for
Photoshop CS3.

I liked it but couldn't get my head around the multiple windows it
created every time I made some sort of adjustment.  Short of saving
every window as a separate file, I couldn't work out how to save the
workflow created by all of the various adjustments.  The program doesn't
seem to have an easy way to allow the user to tweek the processed image
further at a later date.  If the program created a layer stack that
could be saved in a single file (like PS and PS Elements), I probably
would have bought it.



Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/



 
 Monday, June 23, 2008, 9:15:27 PM, you wrote:
 
 BL [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Please don't take offense, but the real question is why would any serious 
  photographer subject their file to GIMP? 
  Paul
 
 BL None taken, Paul. However I use GIMP as a complementary software for
 the
 BL LightRoom. I cannot justify buying full PhotoShop and find Elements
 too
 BL restrictive. GIMP appears to be just about perfect.
 
 BL In fact, hopefully soon, GIMP will support 16-bit editing all over.
 Then
 BL it will be better still.
 
 BL I do hope that my degree of seriousness hadn't suffered any change
 due
 BL to the above revelation ;-).
 
 BL Boris
 
 
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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Brian Walters

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 17:10:12 -0400, Sandy Harris
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
 Bruce Dayton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  You might want to consider Picture Window Pro - it has much more
  power than elements such as full color management, full 16 bit
  support for all operations, curves, masking, etc.  But it is priced
  about the same as Elements.
 
 Assuming one wants to use only open source software and has reasonable
 resources -- some variant of Unix, a few cores at a few gigahertz each,
 several gigs of RAM and a decent video system -- what are the
 alternatives
 to GIMP?
 



Probably only Cinepaint - but it's interface is just as inscrutable as
the GIMP's..



Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/


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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread John Francis

On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 06:42:40PM -0400, Sandy Harris wrote:
 On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:04 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources
  need a Linus based photo processing system?
 
 I have access to reasonable Linux machines, and not to any Windows boxes.
 For most applications, Linux does everything I need, and in some areas it
 is obviously, at least for my purposes, superior to Windows. Photo editing
 may be the exception; that's what I'm trying to discover.
 
  Do you believe that software developers arent't entitled to profit and
  some protection of their intellectual property?
 
 No, but I believe that for much software development, you get better
 results with an open model, where people publish their work for
 others to criticise and build on.

Well, there's nothing stopping people doing this with image software,
either.  But to date the results aren't thrilling - dcraw is nowhere
near as good as Adobe Camera Raw, and GIMP is pitiful when compared to
just about any of the Adobe image editing products.

I think Lightroom and PhotoShop Elements are well worth the money.


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Re: GIMP question

2008-06-26 Thread Brian Walters

Hi Paul

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 22:04:51 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
 I'm still mystified by this. Why does someone with reasonable resources
 need a Linus based photo processing system? Do you believe that software
 developers arent't entitled to profit and some protection of their
 intellectual property? If so, please send me all yur photos so I can sell
 them.
 Paul



Even though I use a lot of free and open source software, I have no
problem with software developers getting a reasonable profit from their
efforts.  But when the cost of the software is about the same as the
cost of the camera (as in CS3), I remain to be convinced that it's
reasonable.

Abobe also seems to be intent on keeping Elements sufficiently crippled
to force photographers to the higher priced product (eg, no 16 bit
adjustment layers).  I'll happily buy Elements when and if it supports
16 bit adjustment layers but, until then, my old version of PS 6 will
have to suffice.




Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/



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PEF vs DNG: The Battle for Hard Drive Space

2008-06-26 Thread John Celio

So I've got a bajillion PEF files from over the years, and my photography 
hard drive is rapidly filling up (I can't imagine how fast it'll fill 
whenever I manage to upgrade to the K20D or its eventual replacement).  I've 
been thinking about converting all my PEFs to compressed DNGs, but can't 
remember the various ups and downs I've read about in various threads here.

So my question is, are there any reasons one should NOT convert PEFs to 
compressed DNGs?

Thanks,
John

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Re: PESO - Bree

Very nice, Scott! I love the expressions.

G

On Jun 23, 2008, at 2:02 PM, Scott Loveless wrote:

 Bree and her dog, Sacha.
 http://picasaweb.google.com/sdloveless/PDMLPESO/ 
 photo#5215184476565989666

 P645, 120 Macro, Kodak EPL cross processed.  EPL does not cross  
 process
 well.  I've had much better luck with Astia.  Took a bit of  
 fiddling to
 get it to this point, and it's really grainy.


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Re: PEF vs DNG: The Battle for Hard Drive Space

2008-06-26 Thread Evan Hanson

I converted all my files to DNG months ago and haven't looked back.   
No downsides so far.


Evan
On Jun 26, 2008, at 8:09 PM, John Celio wrote:

 So I've got a bajillion PEF files from over the years, and my  
 photography
 hard drive is rapidly filling up (I can't imagine how fast it'll fill
 whenever I manage to upgrade to the K20D or its eventual  
 replacement).  I've
 been thinking about converting all my PEFs to compressed DNGs, but  
 can't
 remember the various ups and downs I've read about in various  
 threads here.

 So my question is, are there any reasons one should NOT convert  
 PEFs to
 compressed DNGs?

 Thanks,
 John

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Re: PESO: More of the real stuff


On Jun 24, 2008, at 3:56 PM, Ralf R. Radermacher wrote:

 A classical winter shot of Cockerill's coking plant in Seraing,  
 Belgium.
 Only possible in a two-week window around Christmas, when the sun  
 is low
 enough to be right behind the coal tower, in the early afternoon.

 http://www.fotocommunity.de/pc/pc/mypics/770012/display/13313360

Lovely as usual, Ralf!

Godfrey

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Re: PEF vs DNG: The Battle for Hard Drive Space