RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Hi Boz, You may be interested to see what this bastard has on his personal web page. Take a look at the following URL: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/ I got this from examining the HTML source on his eBay listing page. The image file for his eBay item is listed on this page as M135f3.jpg. More interesting is the original file listed on this page. Take a look at the file entitled Pentax135.jpg. Better yet, let me give you the link to the picture he lists on this page: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/Pentax135.jpg Professional photo dealer, my ass! Forgot the link, indeed! This is CLEARLY your image -- this idiot even left your copyright notice in place! My guess is that not only will eBay be interested to learn this, but Freenet.de will be interested as well. Looks to me like somebody owes you some money. Good luck with all this, Boz. You've assembled a lot of highly valuable information that should be vigorously protected. Please let us know how you make out. Bill Peifer Rochester, NY (apologizing in advance for all the indelicate language, but dammit -- this kind of thing really sticks in my craw!) -Original Message- From: Bojidar Dimitrov [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 6:42 AM To: PDML Subject: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? TIA, Boz - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Boz, I'm with Bill on this one. The guy's a lying, cheating bastard and he deserves whatever he'll get. Don't let him get away with this! Peifer, William [OCDUS] wrote: Hi Boz, You may be interested to see what this bastard has on his personal web page. Take a look at the following URL: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/ I got this from examining the HTML source on his eBay listing page. The image file for his eBay item is listed on this page as M135f3.jpg. More interesting is the original file listed on this page. Take a look at the file entitled Pentax135.jpg. Better yet, let me give you the link to the picture he lists on this page: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/Pentax135.jpg Professional photo dealer, my ass! Forgot the link, indeed! This is CLEARLY your image -- this idiot even left your copyright notice in place! My guess is that not only will eBay be interested to learn this, but Freenet.de will be interested as well. Looks to me like somebody owes you some money. Good luck with all this, Boz. You've assembled a lot of highly valuable information that should be vigorously protected. Please let us know how you make out. Bill Peifer Rochester, NY -- Shel Belinkoff mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~belinkoff/ If you are a bad technician, it doesn't matter how big your negs are. - PDML member - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
And if you look real hard at the image,you can make out the s/n too.Some peoples kids.Go get em Boz. Dave Begin Original Message From: Shel Belinkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:52:00 -0800 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Boz, I'm with Bill on this one. The guy's a lying, cheating bastard and he deserves whatever he'll get. Don't let him get away with this! Peifer, William [OCDUS] wrote: Hi Boz, You may be interested to see what this bastard has on his personal web page. Take a look at the following URL: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/ I got this from examining the HTML source on his eBay listing page. The image file for his eBay item is listed on this page as M135f3.jpg. More interesting is the original file listed on this page. Take a look at the file entitled Pentax135.jpg. Better yet, let me give you the link to the picture he lists on this page: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/Pentax135.jpg Professional photo dealer, my ass! Forgot the link, indeed! This is CLEARLY your image -- this idiot even left your copyright notice in place! My guess is that not only will eBay be interested to learn this, but Freenet.de will be interested as well. Looks to me like somebody owes you some money. Good luck with all this, Boz. You've assembled a lot of highly valuable information that should be vigorously protected. Please let us know how you make out. Bill Peifer Rochester, NY -- Shel Belinkoff mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~belinkoff/ If you are a bad technician, it doesn't matter how big your negs are. - PDML member - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . End Original Message Pentax User Stouffville Ontario Canada Sign up today for your Free E-mail at: http://www.canoe.ca/CanoeMail - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Go get him, Boz. I suggest you check his site for other images of yours, then invoice him $1000 per image. Follow up to his web site, and to Ebay. Talk to that Copyright Attorney. This guy is just a blattent thief and a liar to boot. If that don't work, enlist us here on the list If Ebay ignors a couple of hundred e-mails about this I would be more than suprised. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: David Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 2:49 PM Subject: Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) And if you look real hard at the image,you can make out the s/n too.Some peoples kids.Go get em Boz. Dave Begin Original Message From: Shel Belinkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:52:00 -0800 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Boz, I'm with Bill on this one. The guy's a lying, cheating bastard and he deserves whatever he'll get. Don't let him get away with this! Peifer, William [OCDUS] wrote: Hi Boz, You may be interested to see what this bastard has on his personal web page. Take a look at the following URL: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/ I got this from examining the HTML source on his eBay listing page. The image file for his eBay item is listed on this page as M135f3.jpg. More interesting is the original file listed on this page. Take a look at the file entitled Pentax135.jpg. Better yet, let me give you the link to the picture he lists on this page: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/Pentax135.jpg Professional photo dealer, my ass! Forgot the link, indeed! This is CLEARLY your image -- this idiot even left your copyright notice in place! My guess is that not only will eBay be interested to learn this, but Freenet.de will be interested as well. Looks to me like somebody owes you some money. Good luck with all this, Boz. You've assembled a lot of highly valuable information that should be vigorously protected. Please let us know how you make out. Bill Peifer Rochester, NY -- Shel Belinkoff mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~belinkoff/ If you are a bad technician, it doesn't matter how big your negs are. - PDML member - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . End Original Message Pentax User Stouffville Ontario Canada Sign up today for your Free E-mail at: http://www.canoe.ca/CanoeMail - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
This link just popped up on the Equestrian Photographers Yahoo Group.I just looked at it quickly but might be usfull. http://www.chillingeffects.org/ Dave Begin Original Message From: T Rittenhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:05:27 -0500 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Go get him, Boz. I suggest you check his site for other images of yours, then invoice him $1000 per image. Follow up to his web site, and to Ebay. Talk to that Copyright Attorney. This guy is just a blattent thief and a liar to boot. If that don't work, enlist us here on the list If Ebay ignors a couple of hundred e-mails about this I would be more than suprised. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: David Brooks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 2:49 PM Subject: Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) And if you look real hard at the image,you can make out the s/n too.Some peoples kids.Go get em Boz. Dave Begin Original Message From: Shel Belinkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:52:00 -0800 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Boz, I'm with Bill on this one. The guy's a lying, cheating bastard and he deserves whatever he'll get. Don't let him get away with this! Peifer, William [OCDUS] wrote: Hi Boz, You may be interested to see what this bastard has on his personal web page. Take a look at the following URL: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/ I got this from examining the HTML source on his eBay listing page. The image file for his eBay item is listed on this page as M135f3.jpg. More interesting is the original file listed on this page. Take a look at the file entitled Pentax135.jpg. Better yet, let me give you the link to the picture he lists on this page: http://people.freenet.de/ebayfreund/Pentax135.jpg Professional photo dealer, my ass! Forgot the link, indeed! This is CLEARLY your image -- this idiot even left your copyright notice in place! My guess is that not only will eBay be interested to learn this, but Freenet.de will be interested as well. Looks to me like somebody owes you some money. Good luck with all this, Boz. You've assembled a lot of highly valuable information that should be vigorously protected. Please let us know how you make out. Bill Peifer Rochester, NY -- Shel Belinkoff mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~belinkoff/ If you are a bad technician, it doesn't matter how big your negs are. - PDML member - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . End Original Message Pentax User Stouffville Ontario Canada Sign up today for your Free E-mail at: http://www.canoe.ca/CanoeMail - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . End Original Message Pentax User Stouffville Ontario Canada Sign up today for your Free E-mail at: http://www.canoe.ca/CanoeMail - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, T Rittenhouse wrote: Go get him, Boz I suggest you check his site for other images of yours, then invoice him $1000 per image Follow up to his web site, and to Ebay Talk to that Copyright Attorney This guy is just a blattent thief and a liar to boot If that don't work, enlist us here on the list If Ebay ignors a couple of hundred e-mails about this I would be more than suprised And if that doesn't work, we can always pull a Jay and Silent Bob on them :) chris - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List To unsubscribe, go to http://wwwpdmlnet and follow the directions Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pugkomkonorg
KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? TIA, Boz -- _\\|//_ Imagination is more important than knowledge... 0(` O-O ')0 A. Einstein ===ooO=(_)=Ooo=== Bojidar D. Dimitrov author and editor, Pentax K-Mount web page [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://kmp.BDimitrov.de/ = __ __ - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Bojidar Dimitrov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 That is a copyright infringment. The serial # says all. I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? How about writing your copyright message on the item itself that in the (in this case white) background? -- http://members.chello.nl/~j.schoone\\|// Registered Linux user #78364 - The Linux Counter - http://counter.li.org Assume nothing, expect anything. - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Boz, You could do what BH does with their photos. They have a big, but faint BH superimposed over the product. That or you could put KMP Site in smaller white lettering over some black portion of the item like the focusing grip. In any case, I would complain to the offender and then let it go. You have created such a great site that people will steal from it. It is the most sincere form of flattery. g Regards, Bob S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On 26 Feb 2002 at 12:41, Bojidar Dimitrov wrote: Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? If you're feeling industrious you can place some code on your pages to the right mouse button menu: http://www.aspfree.com/authors/MVadivel/disablerightbutton.asp There are other versions of this that might be better. In any event, it's pretty easy to get around, and the copyright notice that Paul recommended is a good idea. tv - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, Bojidar Dimitrov wrote: Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 The Internet Remote Cattle-Prod Transmission Protocal. It transmits a short, sharp electric shock to spammers and people who steal your images and text. Damn, that was just wishful thinking, sorry. dave maybe for Christmas, if I wish hard enough... -- dave o'brien - http://www.diaspoir.net Trying to be happy is like trying to build a machine for which the only specification is that it should run noiselessly. - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Paul, My Russian-born wife would say that dumb Yank is a tautology. Paul M. Provencher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry if I got your first and last names switched. I'm just a dumb Yank! Paul Franklin Stregevsky 13 Selby Court Poolesville, Maryland 20837-2410 [EMAIL PROTECTED] H (301) 349-5243 - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Place a large copyright notice across the image making it visible but not totally opaque. Do not place it in a corner or on an evenly colored part of the image or it will be just too easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? ... Yes. :-(((. Once the image is downloaded you can't tell what it will be used for, viewing, saving or anything else. Ciao, Flavio - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On Tuesday, February 26, 2002, at 07:56 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In any case, I would complain to the offender and then let it go. I would suggest putting fine print on the site about what you charge for use of your images, including an outrageous fee for commercial use (i.e. to sell a product, like this fellow is doing). Then contact e-Bay, tell them of the infringement and ask them to assist you in collecting your bill. ;) -Aaron - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Boz asked: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? Short answer: yes, you're dreaming. Other people have given better advice than I can on legal and social approaches to the problem; my comments are on the technical side. There's no really good technical solution. There are techniques to make theft of the images a little more difficult (the my car only has to be harder to steal than my neighbour's car, not invulnerable approach). The harder you make it to steal the images, the more you interfere with legitimate viewing of them. So what you want, as with _any_ computer-security issue, is to find a useful and reasonable compromise between the cost (in money, effort, and inconvenience) and effectiveness of the security measures you choose. Putting copyright notices along the edges of an image does very little to distract from the image and does not reduce the quality of it. It's also easy to defeat by cropping the image. It _does_ mean that anyone who takes the image directly from your site can't claim ignorance of its copyright status, but all they have to do is claim that they stole it from someone else who'd already filed off the copyright notice (*and* claim to be ignorant of copyright law in general!). Putting an invisible digital watermark in the image allows you to prove that the image is yours as long as the thief doesn't know how to check for it and remove it, but does little to discourage an ignorant thief from using your work. Putting a visible but faint watermark across the whole image is harder to remove (I'm betting that someone with better Photoshop skills than I have can undo it -- *if* they decide that it's worth that much effort instead of finding someone else to rip off) but diminishes the usefulness of the image to legitimate users (i.e. viewers of your web site). The question becomes, How *badly* do you feel that compromises the usefulness of your site? If the answer is, Well that's unfortunate but not a show-stopper, and theft of your work is a bigger deal than that, then there's your answer. Cleverly editing the copyright notice in place of the serial number is a lot more work on your end, and can be undone by anyone who knows Photoshop as well as you do. (Unless, of course, they decide it's easier to steal from someone else...) It does less to diminish the information-usefulness of the image than the visible watermark. (If most of the theft is for eBay listings, putting Not For Sale! in the watermark might also be a nice touch...) I suggest not trying Javascript code to stop folks from downloading images. First, for them to _see_ the image, it _has_ been transmitted to their computer; they just need to know a little more to be able to save it, but it's already in memory (and possibly on disk in the cache) on their system. If nothing else, a screen-capture program will get it. Second, such little gain is probably not worth the cost to legitimate users: anyone using a non-Javascript-capable browser or who turns off Javascript for performance or security reasons can no longer use your site. (FWIW, I'm in the latter category.) Those cover people copying your images. My recommendation is to go with a simple copyright notice and rely on social and legal measures to deal with theft as you discover it. Now as for people linking directly to your images instead of copying them, there are some tricks ... it comes down to a question of how much effort it's worth. Someone else suggested renaming images and replacing them with a blank image (or, what I'd be inclined to do, an image of a sign saying, The picture that was supposed to be here was stolen from..., or maybe a photo of a camera that has been smashed to bits). Well that's an after-the-fact, _reactive_ approach (which is also true of legal solutions, notifying eBay of offenses, etc.). To do this proactively, you could perhaps use a server-side script which concocts a new filename each time the page is loaded (or one which changes based on the date/time), and configure the server so that any requests for an expired filename return the this image was stolen picture. It has to be server-side so that the actual filename of the permanent image is not exposed. If the big problem you run into is folks linking in to your images, this ought to discourage that (at the expense of more coding on your end, and more load on your web server (though if your pages are already coming out of a database, this probably isn't a huge increase percentagewise)). It doesn't stop them from _copying_ the images, of course, and I'm pretty sure I could come up with a chunk of Java or Javascript code to snarf the filename-of-the-moment on the fly
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Boz, it's very expensive to go after folks that copy web pictures. If you try legal action, the defending lawyer has a right to ask you to prove that the images are actually yours. You'd have to produce negatives or slides to prove it. If you acquired the images from friends that sent them to you, you'd have to prove that too. Of course, if you could produce the object itself, with the same serial number as the image, that would probably work, too. You could also send e-mails to eBay and the folks bidding on the lens and explain to them that the advertised lens does not belong to the seller, it belongs to you and it is not for sale. Just a few ramblings from snowy, southern Illinois. Len --- - Original Message - From: Bojidar Dimitrov [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 7:27 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) I wrote: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I have gotten in touch with the seller, and he assures me that he took the image from the web page of a professional photo dealer I will try to locate the dealer now. Cheers, Boz - - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
And if javascript is turned off? Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: tom [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 8:59 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) On 26 Feb 2002 at 12:41, Bojidar Dimitrov wrote: Hi all, What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? If you're feeling industrious you can place some code on your pages to the right mouse button menu: http://www.aspfree.com/authors/MVadivel/disablerightbutton.asp There are other versions of this that might be better. In any event, it's pretty easy to get around, and the copyright notice that Paul recommended is a good idea. tv - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Your need to contact that store and tell them to cease and desist, invoice them for the use of your photos up to that time too, makes them realize they are stealing something valuable. Since this is a commercial firm, you are dealing with a bigger issue here, you should talk to a copyright attorney if they do not respond immediately and satisfactorily. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: Bojidar Dimitrov [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:13 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Hi Paul, If this seller happens to have been so careless as to have loaded the image from your site on the auction listing, rename the image to something else and substitute a 1x1 white pixel image in it's place. This is, of course, a great idea, but I am stinkin' mad because the original thief took the image, then _REMOVED_ the copyright notice, and finally used/uses the image for commercial advantage, thus violating the KMP copyright notice. It seems that the current eBay seller is not the person who manipulated the image, rather it was a professional photo dealer with a store in Berlin. Thanks anyway, Boz - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: 2: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
I went back to the link a few minutes ago and the main picture is now blank.The second one is still there. Maybe Boz's on a roll. Dave Pentax User Stouffville Ontario Canada Sign up today for your Free E-mail at: http://www.canoe.ca/CanoeMail - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Aaron suggested: It seems that the current eBay seller is not the person who manipulated the image, rather it was a professional photo dealer with a store in Berlin. Send them a bill. Call the store and demand payment. Ask them so explain their actions. Ask them if their store allows shoplifting. Anyone know offhand what typical current stock-photography fees are for web use these days? Boz, can you find out how long they've been using your image? Could be a tidy profit, though I'm not sure which country's courts would have to be used to sue them. -- Glenn - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Paul, I had not thought thru the ramifications of what I suggested, especially the commercial opportunities. I think you are very right with the suggestion to agressively defend your content. Regards, Bob S. I wrote: In any case, I would complain to the offender and then let it go. Paul added: That is probably the easiest path, and certainly the least stressful. But if one truely wishes to protect their intellectual property, it is a fatal mistake. This leads to more widespread abuse and dilutes the value of that which you are trying to protect. If Dimitrov sells or wishes to sell his work, he will find it difficult to command a proper value for it when it has been freely used far and wide. I admit this to be a somewhat philosophical argument but it comes down to personal value systems. For me, even though my web site images are not particularly stunning, and the subjects are far from socially redeeming (I feature mainly toy cars and Jeeps in the woods), there are several markets for this type of work. By agressively protecting it, I have been able to expect and receive decent compensation any time my images are used. This has led to contracts to illustrate toy books, the ongoing responsibility to write several magazine articles per month, and compensation for the use of images on my site and made for hire, in related publications. If I ignore what is at times widespread abuse of my site content, I will not have had the same bargaining power when negotiating the price of my work. This is a basic principle of doing this stuff for a living. If you are just dabbling, don't ever want to be getting paid, or don't really care where your work shows up, then a brief complaint and letting it go is OK. But it does not convey how much you value your own work, and substantially diminishes your value in the market. Dimitrov, your site is a sparkling example of how to dispense information on a topic. No matter what your professional aspirations may be, I encourage you to protect your content if for no other reason that to make a statement of what your work is worth to you. ppro © 2002 Paul M. Provencher All Rights Reserved. May not be used without Permission ( smiling ) - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On Tuesday, February 26, 2002, at 12:58 PM, T Rittenhouse wrote: Unfortunately for them ignorance of the law is not a legal excuse. On the other you are not going to be able to collect damages unless you can show realistically that there is a money issue involved. If someone stole your pic and used it for a national billboard campaign where they would normally expect to pay a hundred thousand dollars for that use of the image. For something like the Ebay sellers illegal use about all you could expect is a cease and desist order. Except that the eBay fella stole it from a retail store that had stolen it. So, the retail store is using it to sell product on the internet. Commercial use, big money. -Aaron - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
I like all the petty little get even tricks I have seen in this thread. But, as has been said, if Boz has commercial possibilities with his images, allowing copyright infringements degrades the value. If someone feels it is easier to copy a photo than to take one themselves they are admitting to the commercial value of that photo so have no defense whatsoever. If the images have no commercial value to Boz, then probably a copyright attorney would suggest not litigating. But in any case he should notify all parties of his ownership of the copyright and ask them to cease using it without payment. This is necessary to protect his rights and to protect others copyrights as well. It is a common good issue. This presupposes that Boz owns the copyrights to the images, I don't suppose he doesn't, but you would be surprised how many thieves get upset when someone steals their ill gotten gains. Reminds me of the story about the guy that called the cops to report that someone had robbed him of the ten grand that he had robbed a bank for. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: Nitin Garg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:56 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) If this seller happens to have been so careless as to have loaded the image from your site on the auction listing, rename the image to something else and substitute a 1x1 white pixel image in it's place. should one decide to ever do this, for maximum impact, make sure there is a bid on the auction already. If their isnt any, place one if the starting bid is low enough or there is a reserve :) - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Bojidar Dimitrov writes: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? The serial number of the lens doesn't show in the picture. If it did, then it might be more obvious that it isn't a picture of their actual lens, which is what they are trying to pass it off as. Not that I'm recommending that you publish the serial number of the lens in that way. As for copyright notice location, just paste it over a nondescript part of the barrel. There is still no guarantee that they can't retouch it out, but all you are really after is making it so much work that they go steal somebody else's image or take their own. hope that helps, patbob ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Yep, that is why I said Boz should contact a copyright attorney in that case. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: Aaron Reynolds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 1:35 PM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) On Tuesday, February 26, 2002, at 12:58 PM, T Rittenhouse wrote: Unfortunately for them ignorance of the law is not a legal excuse. On the other you are not going to be able to collect damages unless you can show realistically that there is a money issue involved. If someone stole your pic and used it for a national billboard campaign where they would normally expect to pay a hundred thousand dollars for that use of the image. For something like the Ebay sellers illegal use about all you could expect is a cease and desist order. Except that the eBay fella stole it from a retail store that had stolen it. So, the retail store is using it to sell product on the internet. Commercial use, big money. -Aaron - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) (Thanks to all)
Hi, Thank you all for your comments and suggestions. Sadly, I have had to watermark all KMP images that I own, and now you all have to pay the price of seing the lower-quality images. If anyone needs a good image that I own, drop me a line. I am going to pursue the issue a bit more with the commercial firm that stole my image(s). I have to find them first because the eBay seller says he has no records of the exact URL. But I'll try it. Thanks again, Boz - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
On Tuesday, February 26, 2002, at 02:17 PM, Patrick White wrote: As for copyright notice location, just paste it over a nondescript part of the barrel. There is still no guarantee that they can't retouch it out, but all you are really after is making it so much work that they go steal somebody else's image or take their own. If you have a KMP logo of some kind, putting it in a corner of the image, overlapping the lens slightly, that would look good and be a bit of a deterrent. -Aaron - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) (Thanks to all)
I suspect that the person using your images probably stole them from you directly and is hiding behind the I can't remember where I got them claim. Sad pathetic little man. ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Bojidar Dimitrov Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 2:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) (Thanks to all) Hi, Thank you all for your comments and suggestions. Sadly, I have had to watermark all KMP images that I own, and now you all have to pay the price of seing the lower-quality images. If anyone needs a good image that I own, drop me a line. I am going to pursue the issue a bit more with the commercial firm that stole my image(s). I have to find them first because the eBay seller says he has no records of the exact URL. But I'll try it. Thanks again, Boz - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
I had this problem with an eBay seller (VOLVOMAX) in Germany who has a very successful toy Volvo business. He moved to eBay from mailers and thought he could use my site as a source for images. He wrote and asked, I quoted prices, and he said no thanks. Then he used them anyway. I was able to get him to stop, and forced him to do his own photography. So now what does he do? He scans the images from the boxes instead. Not my problem anymore. What really bothered me about him was that he was loading them from my server and I was getting the bill for the bandwidth! That is something that you can get reimbursed for in this kind of situation (commercial web site making unauthorized use of copyrighted materials and server resources without permission). There is plenty of legal precedence and lawyers who will be happy to take the case if the stakes are high enough. ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of T Rittenhouse Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 1:08 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Your need to contact that store and tell them to cease and desist, invoice them for the use of your photos up to that time too, makes them realize they are stealing something valuable. Since this is a commercial firm, you are dealing with a bigger issue here, you should talk to a copyright attorney if they do not respond immediately and satisfactorily. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: Bojidar Dimitrov [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:13 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Hi Paul, If this seller happens to have been so careless as to have loaded the image from your site on the auction listing, rename the image to something else and substitute a 1x1 white pixel image in it's place. This is, of course, a great idea, but I am stinkin' mad because the original thief took the image, then _REMOVED_ the copyright notice, and finally used/uses the image for commercial advantage, thus violating the KMP copyright notice. It seems that the current eBay seller is not the person who manipulated the image, rather it was a professional photo dealer with a store in Berlin. Thanks anyway, Boz - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
It's not expensive - I have done it successfully numerous times. Several sites were removed from servers in response to my properly formatted notice to ISPs' Copyright Agent. Very satisfying. It took 1/2 hour to prepare my stock warning and follow-up notices and a few minutes to fill in the instance-specific info. It matches the copyright law and Terms of Use for just about every ISP, and gets just about instant response in 9 out of 10 cases. Nothing is absolute. I guess Boz needs to decide if it is worth it to him to protect his work this way. ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Len Paris Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:25 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Boz, it's very expensive to go after folks that copy web pictures. If you try legal action, the defending lawyer has a right to ask you to prove that the images are actually yours. You'd have to produce negatives or slides to prove it. If you acquired the images from friends that sent them to you, you'd have to prove that too. Of course, if you could produce the object itself, with the same serial number as the image, that would probably work, too. You could also send e-mails to eBay and the folks bidding on the lens and explain to them that the advertised lens does not belong to the seller, it belongs to you and it is not for sale. Just a few ramblings from snowy, southern Illinois. Len --- - Original Message - From: Bojidar Dimitrov [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 7:27 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) I wrote: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I have gotten in touch with the seller, and he assures me that he took the image from the web page of a professional photo dealer I will try to locate the dealer now. Cheers, Boz - - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Two more points - for what it's worth: Terms of Use - post them on your site. There are a number of good ones that you can tailor to your needs. Look at mine. http://whitemetal.com Copyright Notice - put one on every page. I just have a standard page footer that goes on automatically. Go to the web site ISP that hosts the image that was stolen and locate their Terms of Service and Copyright clauses. They all tell how to pursue infractions. In every case I have encountered, the steps to file a complaint were exactly the same. In other words, once you have written the necessary documentation once, the only thing that changes is the image file name, the infringing user, and the renamed image (if applicable). In other words you need to invest some time in protecting your work so that when things happen, you are prepared to respond. ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of T Rittenhouse Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 12:59 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Unfortunately for them ignorance of the law is not a legal excuse. On the other you are not going to be able to collect damages unless you can show realistically that there is a money issue involved. If someone stole your pic and used it for a national billboard campaign where they would normally expect to pay a hundred thousand dollars for that use of the image. For something like the Ebay sellers illegal use about all you could expect is a cease and desist order. BTW Boz, since you notified him it is your image and it is still up the user can not hardly claim ignorance can he? Notify Ebay immediately with a copy of your e-mail communications to the seller. I will make a guess, he won't be using Ebay again for awhile. Ciao, Graywolf - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 10:15 AM Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Boz asked: What can I do against this: http://cgi.ebay.de/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1334153963 I don't mean legally, but I would appreciate ideas on how to place the copyright notices so that they are not so easy to remove. Am I dreaming when thinking of images that do not allow themselves to be screencaptured and edited? Short answer: yes, you're dreaming. Other people have given better advice than I can on legal and social approaches to the problem; my comments are on the technical side. There's no really good technical solution. There are techniques to make theft of the images a little more difficult (the my car only has to be harder to steal than my neighbour's car, not invulnerable approach). The harder you make it to steal the images, the more you interfere with legitimate viewing of them. So what you want, as with _any_ computer-security issue, is to find a useful and reasonable compromise between the cost (in money, effort, and inconvenience) and effectiveness of the security measures you choose. Putting copyright notices along the edges of an image does very little to distract from the image and does not reduce the quality of it. It's also easy to defeat by cropping the image. It _does_ mean that anyone who takes the image directly from your site can't claim ignorance of its copyright status, but all they have to do is claim that they stole it from someone else who'd already filed off the copyright notice (*and* claim to be ignorant of copyright law in general!). Putting an invisible digital watermark in the image allows you to prove that the image is yours as long as the thief doesn't know how to check for it and remove it, but does little to discourage an ignorant thief from using your work. Putting a visible but faint watermark across the whole image is harder to remove (I'm betting that someone with better Photoshop skills than I have can undo it -- *if* they decide that it's worth that much effort instead of finding someone else to rip off) but diminishes the usefulness of the image to legitimate users (i.e. viewers of your web site). The question becomes, How *badly* do you feel that compromises the usefulness of your site? If the answer is, Well that's unfortunate but not a show-stopper, and theft of your work is a bigger deal than that, then there's your answer. Cleverly editing the copyright notice in place of the serial number is a lot more work on your end, and can be undone by anyone who knows Photoshop as well as you do. (Unless, of course, they decide it's easier to steal from someone else...) It does less to diminish the information-usefulness of the image than the visible watermark. (If most of the theft is for eBay listings, putting Not For Sale! in the watermark might also be a nice
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
You pretty much have to list your rates in advance so that there is a something to point to. You could post it on your site, use the java script to notify people when they right-click, or something like that. If you have paid invoices from people who have used your work, that can also support your claim. But really if it isn't about the money, then all you are trying to do is get them to cease and desist. ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 12:10 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Aaron suggested: It seems that the current eBay seller is not the person who manipulated the image, rather it was a professional photo dealer with a store in Berlin. Send them a bill. Call the store and demand payment. Ask them so explain their actions. Ask them if their store allows shoplifting. Anyone know offhand what typical current stock-photography fees are for web use these days? Boz, can you find out how long they've been using your image? Could be a tidy profit, though I'm not sure which country's courts would have to be used to sue them. -- Glenn - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s)
Hey, I wish I could let go when it comes to this stuff. But we all know how much time we spend learning our craft, how much time we spend making the images and putting them up, how much money we spend on our ISP, and never mind the cost of mint SMCT's and cameras! And then there is the principle... Thanks for your comment! ppro -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 1:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) Paul, I had not thought thru the ramifications of what I suggested, especially the commercial opportunities. I think you are very right with the suggestion to agressively defend your content. Regards, Bob S. I wrote: In any case, I would complain to the offender and then let it go. Paul added: That is probably the easiest path, and certainly the least stressful. But if one truely wishes to protect their intellectual property, it is a fatal mistake. This leads to more widespread abuse and dilutes the value of that which you are trying to protect. If Dimitrov sells or wishes to sell his work, he will find it difficult to command a proper value for it when it has been freely used far and wide. I admit this to be a somewhat philosophical argument but it comes down to personal value systems. For me, even though my web site images are not particularly stunning, and the subjects are far from socially redeeming (I feature mainly toy cars and Jeeps in the woods), there are several markets for this type of work. By agressively protecting it, I have been able to expect and receive decent compensation any time my images are used. This has led to contracts to illustrate toy books, the ongoing responsibility to write several magazine articles per month, and compensation for the use of images on my site and made for hire, in related publications. If I ignore what is at times widespread abuse of my site content, I will not have had the same bargaining power when negotiating the price of my work. This is a basic principle of doing this stuff for a living. If you are just dabbling, don't ever want to be getting paid, or don't really care where your work shows up, then a brief complaint and letting it go is OK. But it does not convey how much you value your own work, and substantially diminishes your value in the market. Dimitrov, your site is a sparkling example of how to dispense information on a topic. No matter what your professional aspirations may be, I encourage you to protect your content if for no other reason that to make a statement of what your work is worth to you. ppro © 2002 Paul M. Provencher All Rights Reserved. May not be used without Permission ( smiling ) - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: KMP Copyright Infringement(s) (Thanks to all)
Bojidar Dimitrov wrote: Thank you all for your comments and suggestions. Sadly, I have had to watermark all KMP images that I own, and now you all have to pay the price of seing the lower-quality images. If anyone needs a good image that I own, drop me a line. I am going to pursue the issue a bit more with the commercial firm that stole my image(s). I have to find them first because the eBay seller says he has no records of the exact URL. But I'll try it. Forgot the URL? Sounds suspicious to me. Are you *sure* he didn't steal the images himself and then invent the story about getting them form someone else's web site? Notify eBay either way. -- Mark Roberts www.robertstech.com - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
