Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-20 Thread Shel Belinkoff

Bob Walkden wrote:
 
 ah yes, but how many of them had to pay for their own equipment?
 
 :o)

I know that you were half-jesting with your comment, but I could not
let it go without some response.  I strongly suspect that many of
those shown with their cameras were using their own equipment. 
Quite a few photographers - Chappelle, Stone, Flynn, for example -
had no direct affiliation with any publication, and even those that
did often used their own gear.

  I was looking through "Requiem" last night and noticed that none of
  the pictures I saw of photographers with their cameras had filters
  on their lenses.  And this was in a war zone.  What was also
  interesting was how these unprotected lenses produced so many
  remarkable photos.

-- 
Shel Belinkoff
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
There are no rules for good photographs, 
there are only good photographs.
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread Shel Belinkoff

tom wrote:
 
 Hmm, a Holga and a Canon. They look so "right" together.

I was somewhat surprised to see those two cameras on the web site.
 
 I must have missed the fist part of this threadyou using this stuff
 Shel?

Yes ... I've been using it for a few years.  Love it.  Some people
have had problems using it, but it's been fine for me.  I think the
key is not to use too much of it.

 I've had some specks on my lenses that I was worried about. Last week I
 finally just decided to scrub the crap out of them with a lens pen and
 they seem fine. The 20-35 looks new again, and it looked like I had
 sneezed on it last week.

I've been toying with the idea of running a few of my lenses through
the dishwasher.  Whaddaya think?

 Shel Belinkoff wrote:
 
  Chris Brogden wrote:
 
   What's ROR?
 
  http://www.ror.net/

-- 
Shel Belinkoff
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
There are no rules for good photographs, 
there are only good photographs.
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RE: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread petit miam

Just watch the seven years bad luck :)

 When the adrenaline stopped cursing through my veins
 and I stopped cursing,
 I went back to see which pieces of glass belonged to
 which item.  Lots of
 mirror glass.  But lo and behold, the lens was
 intact, the barrel not even
 dented, the camera likewise, unscathed.  And the
 lens coating?  Remember
 this is a protruding front element.  Nothing.  Just
 a little mirror dust
 where the two collided.  A quick shot with a can of
 Dust-Off and it was as
 good as new.  I was stunned.
 
 I have never been as paranoid of my lenses since.
 
 Paul M. Provencher
 (ppro)


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Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread Bob Walkden

Hi,

ah yes, but how many of them had to pay for their own equipment?

:o)

---

 Bob  

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thursday, April 19, 2001, 3:04:15 PM, you wrote:

 I was looking through "Requiem" last night and noticed that none of
 the pictures I saw of photographers with their cameras had filters
 on their lenses.  And this was in a war zone.  What was also
 interesting was how these unprotected lenses produced so many
 remarkable photos.


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RE: Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread Provencher, Paul M.

I guess I am just the most fortunate person because in 30 years of shooting,
often in hostile environments, and under adverse conditions, I have yet to
damage a front lens element, and I don't use filters of the UV or Skylight
variety for lens protectors.  I am partial to opaque, metal lens caps for
that purpose.  

Now I will probably get run over crossing the parking lot to get to my car
this evening but...

:-)
Paul M. Provencher
(ppro)
Bought all his own equipment

-Original Message-
From: Bob Walkden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 1:58 PM
To: Shel Belinkoff
Subject: Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens


Hi,

ah yes, but how many of them had to pay for their own equipment?

:o)

---

 Bob  

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thursday, April 19, 2001, 3:04:15 PM, you wrote:

 I was looking through "Requiem" last night and noticed that none of
 the pictures I saw of photographers with their cameras had filters
 on their lenses.  And this was in a war zone.  What was also
 interesting was how these unprotected lenses produced so many
 remarkable photos.


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Re: Carbon Black (Was RE: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens)

2001-04-19 Thread Bob Blakely

Carbon black was and still is the best lens cleaning substance ever used. Carbon black
(ultra fine powder) acts like activated charcoal and a mild abrasive that is way too 
soft
to hurt the coatings but will loosen and absorb almost any gook. It will lift oils and
other stains that you can't get out with other cleaning methods. Often you may see a 
lens
with "cleaning scratches", and just as often these stubborn marks are not scratches at
all, but a hard, almost irremovable residue (hard water? dried spit?). Carbon black 
has no
binders or adhesives and is not itself sticky, so it can't really fill scratches except
very temporarily (the carbon will blow off). Any commercial compound that claims to 
fill
scratches must have a binder and is therefore not pure carbon black. Folks stopped 
using
carbon black not because it wasn't the best, but because of the consequences of the
smallest of accidents when using it - not to your lens, to you, your clothing and 
anything
surrounding you. Use this stuff outdoors, or be prepared to suffer the wrath of your 
wife
if you spill even the smallest bit of it.

The most reliable source of pure, useful carbon black is calligraphy shops where it is
sold (usually as lamp black or bone black) to folks who make their own inks. This is 
what
I use to clean my lenses.

The active ingredient in lens pens is carbon.

Regards,
Bob...
---
"In the carboniferous epoch
we were promised perpetual peace.
They swore if we gave up our weapons
that the wars of the tribes would cease.
But when we disarmed they sold us,
and delivered us, bound, to our foe.
And the gods of the copybook headings said,
'Stick to the devil you know.' "
--Rudyard Kipling

From: "Provencher, Paul M." [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 It is carbon black, used to fill scratches and thereby eliminate unwanted
 refraction from them, improving results with a scratched lens - a very old
 trick, apparently resurrected in new form ("Productized")

 I have seen the advertisement - it makes claims way beyond what filling
 scratches with carbon black will accomplish, but in the case of a stray nick
 or scratch, like the one on the lens here:
 http://whitemetal.com/pentax/st_135_25/st_135_25_13.htm
 it can work very well.

 From: Lewis, Gerald [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

 Recently on the tele there has been an advert about a penlike device for
 repairing scratched spectacle lenses.  During the demo it shows rubbing on a
 blackish grey substance and then polishing it away to hide the scratches.  I
 have no idea if this really works, but might it be the same substance as the
 LENSPEN?

 From: Jan van Wijk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

 On Thu, 19 Apr 2001 08:39:40 -0400, W Keith Mosier wrote:

 Also, about the lens pen that Tom and many others have mentioned.  I've yet
 to find one in the local stores.  What exactly is it?  What manufacturer?

 Make or manufacturer is "CARSON", name is simply "LENSPEN"

 It is shaped like a thick balpoint, with a retractable soft brush on one
 end,
 and under a protective hood on the other end a special shaped foam
 brush,  with wat seems to be some very fine black powder ...

 What's it contain?
 

 Maybe something based on carbon-black ???

 I think on the old list several people talked about using carbon black (?)
 to clean lenses.  Is that right?

 I think it is, maybe it's in the pen as well :-)


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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread W Keith Mosier

Thanks, to everyone who responded about the Lenspen and the carbon black.

Shel Belinkoff wrote:

 "I was looking through "Requiem" last night and noticed that none of
 the pictures I saw of photographers with their cameras had filters on
 their lenses.  And this was in a war zone.  What was also interesting
 was how these unprotected lenses produced so many remarkable photos."

You're right.  Normally my group didn't use filters for lens protection.
But I had learned that if I was going to be susceptible to heavy salt spray
and wanted a clean lens later in the day to have some sort of filter on the
lens.

Another point, was that if the photog was having his/her picture taken,
they knew about it.  They knew to appear macho they had better take the
sissy filter off of the lens.   ; - )

K


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Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-19 Thread Bob Walkden

Hi,

just a thought, but maybe the ones who _did_ use filters are the ones
lucky enough not to be featured in "Requiem" !

---

 Bob ("it's only the filters that are keeping me alive" Walkden)

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thursday, April 19, 2001, 3:04:15 PM, you wrote:

 I was looking through "Requiem" last night and noticed that none of
 the pictures I saw of photographers with their cameras had filters
 on their lenses.  And this was in a war zone.  What was also
 interesting was how these unprotected lenses produced so many
 remarkable photos.


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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread Paul Jones

Hi, 

I have a F50/1.7 and it has developed little marks in the coating and i have no idea what that are from. they dont affect image quality at all. Would be curious to know what caused them.

Cya





From: Chris Brogden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens 
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2001 23:52:49 -0500 (CDT) 
 
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, William Robb wrote: 
 
  I read this and thought to myself. Lets see if what Clive 
  did was a party trick or real. 
[snip] 
  She really ground that sucker out. 
  The glass cleaned up as good as new, not a mark on it. 
  I might start cleaning my lenses. 
 
I've heard the stories about the cigarette-butting incident from my Pentax 
rep, too. According to him, the Canon and Nikon reps weren't too eager to 
try it on their lenses. :) I clean my less-valuable lenses all the time 
by breathing on them and wiping them with whatever shirt I happen to be 
wearing at the time, provided it's clean. If I remember correctly, the 
SMC is supposed to be tougher than the glass, and there's no way I can 
scratch most glass with my shirt. There's never been a problem so far, 
though I hesitate to do this with my more expensive lenses. 
 
chris 
 
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread Chris Brogden

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Paul Jones wrote:

 I have a F50/1.7 and it has developed little marks in the coating and i
 have no idea what that are from. they dont affect image quality at all.
 Would be curious to know what caused them.

Could it be the cement between two elements in a group separating in
places?  This can show up as small circular marks, I believe.

chris

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RE: Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread Lewis, Gerald

No, lint is not damaging but darned aggrevating when dusted across the
surface of your lens.  If you don't use one of the newer fabric lens
cleaning cloths an old cotton tee shirt that has been washed until it is
very soft is perfect for cleaning a lens along with a good lens cleaning
solution...AFTER... using a can of compressed air or a gentle brushing with
a fine camel hair brush to knock off the big chunks before rubbing them into
the coating.

Jerry in Houston

-Original Message-
From: Bob Walkden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 3:04 AM
To: Shel Belinkoff
Subject: Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens


Hi,

snip

The advice used to be given to use only lint-free cloth. I don't know how
to tell whether something contains lint or not, so assuming that lint is
damaging I try to use only stuff that is specifically intended for lens
cleaning.

---

 Bob  

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

We
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread Shel Belinkoff

Chris Brogden wrote:

 What's ROR?

http://www.ror.net/

-- 
Shel Belinkoff
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
There are no rules for good photographs, 
there are only good photographs.
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread tom

Hmm, a Holga and a Canon. They look so "right" together.

I must have missed the fist part of this threadyou using this stuff
Shel?

I've had some specks on my lenses that I was worried about. Last week I
finally just decided to scrub the crap out of them with a lens pen and
they seem fine. The 20-35 looks new again, and it looked like I had
sneezed on it last week.

tv

Shel Belinkoff wrote:
 
 Chris Brogden wrote:
 
  What's ROR?
 
 http://www.ror.net/
 
 --
 Shel Belinkoff
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 There are no rules for good photographs,
 there are only good photographs.
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301-758-3085
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RE: Re[2]: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens -- drifting slowly OT

2001-04-18 Thread Peifer, William [OCDUS]

Jerry Lewis (no relation) wrote:
If you don't use one of the newer fabric lens cleaning cloths
an old cotton tee shirt that has been washed until it is very
soft is perfect

Hi Jerry,

Aren't everybody's old tee-shirts like this, or am I the only one?  :-)
The ones that get *really* worn are great for delicate engine parts as well,
but my wife keeps trying to throw my old tattered rags in the garbage.  Just
got a new idea, though, after reading this thread.  How 'bout an eBay sale
of "Mint+ Custom Microfiber Optical Cleaning Fabric!  Specially
conditioned!!  LQQK!!!  NO RSRV"

Nyuk, nyuk!
Bill Peifer
Rochester, NY

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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-18 Thread Paul Jones

Hi Chris,

The marks are like little pits in the coating, they possibly look like 
something has splattered on the glass and damaged the coating. The could 
possibly be rissen (sp?) as apposed to pits, its hard to tell.

Cya


Hi
From: Chris Brogden Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated 
lens Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 01:44:02 -0500 (CDT)

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Paul Jones wrote:

  I have a F50/1.7 and it has developed little marks in the coating and i 
  have no idea what that are from. they dont affect image quality at all. 
  Would be curious to know what caused them.

Could it be the cement between two elements in a group separating in 
places? This can show up as small circular marks, I believe.

chris

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Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Paul . Stregevsky

Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3 telephotos.


Paul Franklin Stregevsky

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RE: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Provencher, Paul M.

The filter added to a single-coated lens, will not improve flare resistance.
The lens must be considered separately from the filter.  

The flare of the lens will remain unchanged with or without the filter.  

The flare from the filter will be less (probably) than a single-coated or
un-coated filter, but does not reduce the amount of flare that will arise
from the lens itself.  

In fact, the filter will actually increase your flare problems by the amount
attributed to the filter.  In other words you will have less flare on a
single coated lens without the filter, than with the multi-coated filter
attached.  If you are using the filter to reduce flare, you will not achieve
your goal.

Paul M. Provencher
(ppro)


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 1:29 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens


Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3 telephotos.


Paul Franklin Stregevsky

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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Bob

None. No improvement. It will add to any flair problem, but (presumably)
less so than other filters. The effect occurs at each air/glass interface
and are cumulative.

Regards,
Bob...

- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 10:29 AM
Subject: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens


 Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to
a
 single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

 The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3
telephotos.


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RE: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Lewis, Gerald

I don't think a UV filter has anything to do with flare resistance. Best
thing would be a good lens hood.

Jerry in Houston

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 12:29 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens


Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3 telephotos.


Paul Franklin Stregevsky

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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Bill D. Casselberry

 Bob wrote:
 
 None. No improvement. It will add to any flair problem, but (presumably)
 less so than other filters. The effect occurs at each air/glass interface
 and are cumulative.
 
If you must use the filter (and even on the lens alone) get 
a good lens hood that puts that puppy at the back of a long
tube of stray-light killing metal.

Bill

-
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http://www.orednet.org/~bcasselb
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Alin Flaider

Paul wrote:

PS Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
PS single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

  Bad news: filters, multicoated or not, can only add to flare. It's a
question of light transmission; no filter and generally no element
addition in an optical path will improve this factor in order to
reduce flare. 

  Servus, Alin


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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Todd Stanley


It might help a little bit in situations where the light coming almost
sideways that would normally hit the front element is now blocked by the
ring on the filter, but then why not just get a good lens hood?

Todd

At 01:29 PM 4/17/01 -0400, you wrote:
Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3 telephotos.


Paul Franklin Stregevsky

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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Shel Belinkoff

Not much, if at all.  A good lens hood is a better solution.
-- 
Shel Belinkoff
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
There are no rules for good photographs, 
there are only good photographs.

Paul asked:

Let's say I mount a top-end multicoated (B+W or Pentax) -010 UV filter to a
single-coated lens. How much will the filter improve flare resistance?

The lenses in question are my Vivitar Series 1 13/2.3 and 300/3 telephotos.
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Paul . Stregevsky

Both lenses come with built-in sliding hoods, though I will indeed equip
them with longer hoods, as I invariably do. But I still prefer to protect
the front glass with a filter; I live in fear of scratching the front
element of a lens that took forever to find and will take a second forever
to replace. I don't even like to apply a microfiber cleaning cloth to the
"real" front element.

Todd Stanley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

It might help a little bit in situations where the light coming almost
sideways that would normally hit the front element is now blocked by the
ring on the filter, but then why not just get a good lens hood?

Todd


Paul Franklin Stregevsky

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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Shel Belinkoff

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Both lenses come with built-in sliding hoods, though I will indeed equip
 them with longer hoods, as I invariably do. But I still prefer to protect
 the front glass with a filter; I live in fear of scratching the front
 element of a lens that took forever to find and will take a second forever
 to replace. I don't even like to apply a microfiber cleaning cloth to the
 "real" front element.

Hi Paul ... so use both a hood and a filter, but don't expect the
filter to add any qualities to the lens that it doesn't already
have.  And don't be so afraid of cleaning the lens.  Except for some
older, non coated lenses, or those with very poor coatings, the
front elements will stand up to proper cleaning.

I've stopped babying my lenses after seeing some Leica, Contax, and
Pentax reps clean their lenses.  Yes, I prefer to use a filter on
many of my lenses when using them in harsh environments, or if the
lens was especially hard to find, but, overall, it seems that most
good lenses don't have to be treated with kid gloves.  I recently
cleaned up a Leitz Summicron using ROR and an old (and very soft) T
shirt.  Man, that sukka sparkles ...g.
-- 
Shel Belinkoff
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
There are no rules for good photographs, 
there are only good photographs.
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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread William Robb


- Original Message -
From: "Shel Belinkoff"
Subject: Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

 I've stopped babying my lenses

I read this and thought to myself. Lets see if what Clive
did was a party trick or real.
I have an A 50mm f1.7 lens with a notchy aperture ring. I
decided to try to repair it, but it exploded when I took it
apart, and will never work again.
How tough is Pentax multi coating?
I decided to find out.
My wife is a smoker.
I asked her to butt a cigarette on the front element of this
lens.
She was less than co-operative at first.
She really ground that sucker out.
The glass cleaned up as good as new, not a mark on it.
I might start cleaning my lenses.
William Robb


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Re: Multicoated filter on a single-coated lens

2001-04-17 Thread Chris Brogden

On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, William Robb wrote:

 I read this and thought to myself. Lets see if what Clive
 did was a party trick or real.
[snip]
 She really ground that sucker out.
 The glass cleaned up as good as new, not a mark on it.
 I might start cleaning my lenses.

I've heard the stories about the cigarette-butting incident from my Pentax
rep, too.  According to him, the Canon and Nikon reps weren't too eager to
try it on their lenses.  :)  I clean my less-valuable lenses all the time
by breathing on them and wiping them with whatever shirt I happen to be
wearing at the time, provided it's clean.  If I remember correctly, the
SMC is supposed to be tougher than the glass, and there's no way I can
scratch most glass with my shirt.  There's never been a problem so far,
though I hesitate to do this with my more expensive lenses.

chris

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