Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: Christine Aguila [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/04 Fri PM 04:34:05 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta - Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's me. Or, rather, the eight days of two hours sleep. The five second micronaps aren't working. King Zombie I'll send you the link to my online photo gallery--that'll put you right to sleep ;-). Seriously, get some rest. Cheers, Christine OK. I'll ask Katy to stop teething. 8- - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Couldn't make the sound work from this PC, but it seems like a reversed Coca-cola Light Break... Jostein 2008/4/4 Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED]: From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Although my new one might be Woolfhardisworthy. Mike: Is this an adjective for that famous British Wolf whistle or Wolf call British construction workers are famous for?--Heard a funny BBC radio story on the way to work today. Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Turns out the construction workers are ok with this new policy, but the women are upset by the ban--at least the handful interviewed for the story are. Cheers, Christine I'm not at all surprised that the construction workers are in broad agreement with such a policy - they are terribly enlightened over here, as this documentary proves: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u3j0d6iI_U Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: Christine Aguila [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu PM 10:30:00 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta - Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Although my new one might be Woolfhardisworthy. Mike: Is this an adjective for that famous British Wolf whistle or Wolf call British construction workers are famous for?--Heard a funny BBC radio story on the way to work today. Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Turns out the construction workers are ok with this new policy, but the women are upset by the ban--at least the handful interviewed for the story are. All the words I mentioned are names. If you follow the link in my post, you will see how to pronounce them. They are probably corruptions of the names of long departed ancestral invaders from the frozen north and Normandy. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: John Francis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu PM 10:53:58 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta On Thu, Apr 03, 2008 at 05:30:00PM -0500, Christine Aguila wrote: Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Wimpey, at a guess. (Often jokingly regarded as an acronym for We Import More Paddies Every Year - many of the construction workers in the UK are Irish). Not any more. Czy pan movisz po Polsku? - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
If you do a validation of a set of files that you know to be good and generate a checksum, then run the validation again at another time ... and the checksums match ... the files are good. If this weren't true, there would be no point to file validation. Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 2:05 PM, Bob Sullivan wrote: Godfrey, My point of view is that you haven't validated that you can recover your pictures from the data until you actually do such, or at least do a sample. To say the bits and bites are all the same implies no other glitches in the process. Regards, Bob S. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] All the words I mentioned are names. Mike: I know that--and I followed the link. I guess I forgot the ;-)--the wink, wink, winkicon. Cheers, Christine -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: Christine Aguila [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/04 Fri PM 02:41:26 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta - Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] All the words I mentioned are names. Mike: I know that--and I followed the link. I guess I forgot the ;-)--the wink, wink, winkicon. Cheers, Christine It's me. Or, rather, the eight days of two hours sleep. The five second micronaps aren't working. King Zombie - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
In a message dated 4/3/2008 2:11:50 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Godfrey, My point of view is that you haven't validated that you can recover your pictures from the data until you actually do such, or at least do a sample. To say the bits and bites are all the same implies no other glitches in the process. Regards, Bob S. == I have storage paranoia like you do. Probably the best thing to do is, back up to CDs/DVDs, two copies, keep on hard disk. Then go in in one to three months or so and see if one can get photos off CDs/DVDs. Usually, for me, if a disc is bad, it is bad from the beginning. Marnie aka Doe **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv000316) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On 4/4/08, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed: I guess I forgot the ;-)--the wink, wink, winkicon You have an LX? -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's me. Or, rather, the eight days of two hours sleep. The five second micronaps aren't working. King Zombie I'll send you the link to my online photo gallery--that'll put you right to sleep ;-). Seriously, get some rest. Cheers, Christine -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I'm sorry to say, I don't get the point of the question here. camera? car? large-sized winkicon? having-a-brain-fart-in-Chicago, Christine - Original Message - From: Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: pentax list PDML@pdml.net Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 10:42 AM Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta On 4/4/08, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed: I guess I forgot the ;-)--the wink, wink, winkicon You have an LX? -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On 4/4/08, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed: I'm sorry to say, I don't get the point of the question here. camera? car? large-sized winkicon? having-a-brain-fart-in-Chicago, Christine Soyou've never actually owned an LX then...? You've never actually experienced that, ahhh, LX feeling...? he feeling that everything is alright with the world, nothing is too much? ;-) -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Apr 4, 2008, at 8:29 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have storage paranoia like you do. Probably the best thing to do is, back up to CDs/DVDs, two copies, keep on hard disk. Then go in in one to three months or so and see if one can get photos off CDs/DVDs. In the past week or two I've been working on a largish project which required that I go back through exposures made on film and scanned in the late 1990s along with all my digital capture work from 2002 and up. I only have 2005 and later digital files on my working drives. I opened up my hard drive (and about three dozen of CDs made up to 13 years ago) archives and have reviewed 76,000 photos with no errors at all, selected out about 3600 of them for further grading and use, copied them to my current workspace, etc. They've loaded and many have been edited in Lightroom since. I'd say the file archiving and validation system I've built is working rather nicely, and the media is proving to be robust enough for my needs. Usually, for me, if a disc is bad, it is bad from the beginning. That's why you should *always* run a verification/validation pass immediately after burning a CD/DVD, and make at least two independently from the original working set of files. I'm sorry but this is not rocket science. It's pretty easy to achieve highly reliable archives with today's systems, with a minimum of fuss and computer savvy. Good quality equipment, well designed archiving policy and proper procedures do the job. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 12:52 AM, Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: he feeling that everything is alright with the world, nothing is too much? E... Dave :-) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
The LX is the Pentax Uber Camera of the 1980's. A full system in some ways fully equal to the Canon New F1 and Nikon F3 exceeding both in some areas falling short in others. It is the center of a full professional system. The LX wink was current on the list between LX owners. (I guess no one else was supposed to use it, though how that could be enforced was beyond me). I still have a pair of them they are beautiful cameras. Though they don't get much work these days. http://www.bdimitrov.de/kmp/bodies/LX/LX_old.html http://www.bdimitrov.de/kmp/bodies/LX/LX_new.html Christine Aguila wrote: I'm sorry to say, I don't get the point of the question here. camera? car? large-sized winkicon? having-a-brain-fart-in-Chicago, Christine - Original Message - From: Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: pentax list PDML@pdml.net Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 10:42 AM Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta On 4/4/08, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed: I guess I forgot the ;-)--the wink, wink, winkicon You have an LX? -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
In a message dated 4/4/2008 10:01:56 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Usually, for me, if a disc is bad, it is bad from the beginning. That's why you should *always* run a verification/validation pass immediately after burning a CD/DVD, and make at least two independently from the original working set of files. I'm sorry but this is not rocket science. It's pretty easy to achieve highly reliable archives with today's systems, with a minimum of fuss and computer savvy. Good quality equipment, well designed archiving policy and proper procedures do the job. Godfrey == Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv000316) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. Marnie aka Doe :-) A read-after-write check should be built into the hardware (albeit switchable from the operating system). Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. I know Nero can be told to verify the data after the burn is complete. I'm always suspicious until I've stuck the CD into another drive and made sure that at the very least, the directory structure is in place. I recall reading a technobabble article a few years ago about the number of errors that can happen during a normal burn process, and how if you keep copying the same data from CD to CD to CD, eventually, you will end up with an unusable coaster, and also that a CD can self introduce errors just sitting there, slowly oxidizing. I don't recall the source of the article, but reading it was enough to make me start looking into hard drives instead of optical media, and to stick with good quality writers and discs for CD burning. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Fri, 04 Apr 2008 20:22:33 +0100 Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. Marnie aka Doe :-) well both are PC's really. I add another confusion as i run Ubuntu Linux on my PC. but as Bob said there should be a verification option in the burning software. i have run discs out of windows and mac OS PC's at friends homes and have found the verifications but really have no idea what applications I used there. I burn 2 dvds and two sets of CDs as backup each month. One is a straight copy of the originals and edits and the other is a compressed file copy. I also keep copies on my machine and an hidden directory on my son's machine ( he has all the excess storage in the house) I am looking at net based storage solutions as well. paranoia and multiple replications. Bran -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Apr 4, 2008, at 13:55, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/ validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. Marnie aka Doe :-) Marnie - It really depends upon what you're using to run your backups to disc. But MOST software has an option to immediately do a verify/compare between your source files and the burned disc immediately after the disc is written. Might not give you that cool checksum verification that Godfrey is talking about, but it's better than nothing. -Charles -- Charles Robinson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Apr 4, 2008, at 14:52, Bran Everseeking wrote: I burn 2 dvds and two sets of CDs as backup each month. One is a straight copy of the originals and edits and the other is a compressed file copy. I also keep copies on my machine and an hidden directory on my son's machine ( he has all the excess storage in the house) Is your intent to actually COMPRESS files (which, if they're JPEG files, won't really happen) or to just park them inside of some larger file structure which has error-checking and such? -Charles -- Charles Robinson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Apr 4, 2008, at 1:59 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/ validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. It really depends upon what you're using to run your backups to disc. But MOST software has an option to immediately do a verify/compare between your source files and the burned disc immediately after the disc is written. Might not give you that cool checksum verification that Godfrey is talking about, but it's better than nothing. That's what Apple's Mac OS X built-in CD/DVD burning software does, as well as Roxio Toast. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Don't use the built in software in XP use something like Nero which will automatically verify the burn, if you ask it to. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/4/2008 10:01:56 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Usually, for me, if a disc is bad, it is bad from the beginning. That's why you should *always* run a verification/validation pass immediately after burning a CD/DVD, and make at least two independently from the original working set of files. I'm sorry but this is not rocket science. It's pretty easy to achieve highly reliable archives with today's systems, with a minimum of fuss and computer savvy. Good quality equipment, well designed archiving policy and proper procedures do the job. Godfrey == Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv000316) -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
In my blissful ignorance, I've always done the verify. I guess that's because I've always used either the apple sofware or toast. Now I use Toast 9 exclusively. It's excellent. In addition to doing he verify, it automatically will pick the best write speed if you allow it that option. On my LaCie burner, the best write speed is usually fairly fast -- 8 or 9X. Paul -- Original message -- From: Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Apr 4, 2008, at 1:59 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: Well, actually, Godfrey, not sure how to do a verification/ validation pass. And you can't help, as you're Mac and I am PC. It really depends upon what you're using to run your backups to disc. But MOST software has an option to immediately do a verify/compare between your source files and the burned disc immediately after the disc is written. Might not give you that cool checksum verification that Godfrey is talking about, but it's better than nothing. That's what Apple's Mac OS X built-in CD/DVD burning software does, as well as Roxio Toast. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Charles Robinson wrote: It really depends upon what you're using to run your backups to disc. But MOST software has an option to immediately do a verify/compare between your source files and the burned disc immediately after the disc is written. Having been burned before, I never trust that. In my house, it's not a valid backup until I've copied every last byte back to another disk and done a binary comparison between those new copies and the originals. I have a small external (USB) hard drive I use exclusively for this. -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta In my blissful ignorance, I've always done the verify. I guess that's because I've always used either the apple sofware or toast. Now I use Toast 9 exclusively. It's excellent. In addition to doing he verify, it automatically will pick the best write speed if you allow it that option. On my LaCie burner, the best write speed is usually fairly fast -- 8 or 9X. That sounds exactly like Nero for PC. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Fri, 04 Apr 2008 16:00:59 -0500 Charles Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is your intent to actually COMPRESS files (which, if they're JPEG files, won't really happen) or to just park them inside of some larger file structure which has error-checking and such? -Charles the latter. compression is less than 10 % for the usual months mix of dng and jpg. Bran -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Thanks for all the answers. I think checksums or byte comparisons are best, but I will look into what my software offers. Actually, never done any verification, so anything will probably be better than nothing. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv000316) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. Jostein 2008/4/3, William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: - Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of my film scans are stored on CDs, and they still read well. Keep your fingers crossed. I've had serious trouble with a whole bunch of CDRs containing my back-ups of film scan data. They were stored in specially made CD paper jackets, the kind commonly used in books or commercial software packages. These jackets, bought from a local CD production company, had self-adhesive flaps and it appears something evaporating from this adhesive has damaged the CDs in the jacket to the point that they've become unredable. All this after about four years of storage. There was a distinct brownish colouring of the CDs in the section whch had been next to the flap. I've had a few CDs go bad, stored in plastic jewel cases. I've always tried to buy name brand ones such as Verbatim or Fuji, and I have always verified the data after the write. It's just the luck of the draw, I guess. I'm pretty close to buying an external RAID of some sort, and I will probably transfer as many of my files over to it from the CDs as is practical. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu AM 08:19:17 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. Jostein I thought digital was supposed to make photography easy and cheap? };-) 2008/4/3, William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: - Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of my film scans are stored on CDs, and they still read well. Keep your fingers crossed. I've had serious trouble with a whole bunch of CDRs containing my back-ups of film scan data. They were stored in specially made CD paper jackets, the kind commonly used in books or commercial software packages. These jackets, bought from a local CD production company, had self-adhesive flaps and it appears something evaporating from this adhesive has damaged the CDs in the jacket to the point that they've become unredable. All this after about four years of storage. There was a distinct brownish colouring of the CDs in the section whch had been next to the flap. I've had a few CDs go bad, stored in plastic jewel cases. I've always tried to buy name brand ones such as Verbatim or Fuji, and I have always verified the data after the write. It's just the luck of the draw, I guess. I'm pretty close to buying an external RAID of some sort, and I will probably transfer as many of my files over to it from the CDs as is practical. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
At 04:47 PM 3/04/2008, Cotty wrote: On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. I think it's Norwegian for Boring as bat s#!t Cheers, Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu AM 08:47:32 GMT To: pentax list PDML@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. You've got slikkepot, what more do you want? - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Just try again... On 4/3/08, Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. Reminds me of the good old days of German coastal radio station Norddeich Radio. One of their routine messages was that owing to severe weather the pilotage in the Elbe and Weser estuary had been *temporarily* suspended. Temporarily... An awful word to pronounce for us Germans. Usually sounded as if someone had just fed them a glowing hot potatoe. :-)) Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany private homepage: http://www.fotoralf.de manual cameras and photo galleries - updated Jan. 10, 2005 Contarex - Kiev 60 - Horizon 202 - P6 mount lenses -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
lol yeah... It needs practice... :-) Jostein 2008/4/3, Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Just try again... On 4/3/08, Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
You also need to keep the software and drivers too. (I'd like to think I'm just paranoid...) AlunFoto wrote: At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. Jostein 2008/4/3, William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: - Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of my film scans are stored on CDs, and they still read well. Keep your fingers crossed. I've had serious trouble with a whole bunch of CDRs containing my back-ups of film scan data. They were stored in specially made CD paper jackets, the kind commonly used in books or commercial software packages. These jackets, bought from a local CD production company, had self-adhesive flaps and it appears something evaporating from this adhesive has damaged the CDs in the jacket to the point that they've become unredable. All this after about four years of storage. There was a distinct brownish colouring of the CDs in the section whch had been next to the flap. I've had a few CDs go bad, stored in plastic jewel cases. I've always tried to buy name brand ones such as Verbatim or Fuji, and I have always verified the data after the write. It's just the luck of the draw, I guess. I'm pretty close to buying an external RAID of some sort, and I will probably transfer as many of my files over to it from the CDs as is practical. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I thought digital was supposed to make photography easy and cheap? };-) If we stored negatives the way we are supposed to film would be a lot more expensive too. (I'll bet the archival film sheets are eating away at my negatives even now). mike wilson wrote: From: AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu AM 08:19:17 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. Jostein I thought digital was supposed to make photography easy and cheap? };-) 2008/4/3, William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: - Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of my film scans are stored on CDs, and they still read well. Keep your fingers crossed. I've had serious trouble with a whole bunch of CDRs containing my back-ups of film scan data. They were stored in specially made CD paper jackets, the kind commonly used in books or commercial software packages. These jackets, bought from a local CD production company, had self-adhesive flaps and it appears something evaporating from this adhesive has damaged the CDs in the jacket to the point that they've become unredable. All this after about four years of storage. There was a distinct brownish colouring of the CDs in the section whch had been next to the flap. I've had a few CDs go bad, stored in plastic jewel cases. I've always tried to buy name brand ones such as Verbatim or Fuji, and I have always verified the data after the write. It's just the luck of the draw, I guess. I'm pretty close to buying an external RAID of some sort, and I will probably transfer as many of my files over to it from the CDs as is practical. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
2008/4/3, Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. Ach, that's easier than aperture. :-) Recently sorted out ascertain, but I'm still struggling with superfluous. The best surprise yet, though, was Southwark. :-) Cheers, Jostein -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: AlunFoto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2008/04/03 Thu PM 02:01:44 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta 2008/4/3, Cotty [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On 3/4/08, AlunFoto, discombobulated, unleashed: iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. Ach, that's easier than aperture. :-) Recently sorted out ascertain, but I'm still struggling with superfluous. The best surprise yet, though, was Southwark. :-) Cholmondeley. My favourite; Featherstonehaugh. Although my new one might be Woolfhardisworthy. http://cgi.peak.org/~jeremy/retort.cgi?British=Cholmondeley For the German in you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yR0lWICH3rY (Hope that comes out, viewing videos is blocked) - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
iterative Holy mackerel, I wish I could say that word. Ach, that's easier than aperture. :-) Recently sorted out ascertain, but I'm still struggling with superfluous. The best surprise yet, though, was Southwark. :-) Cheers, Jostein I bet they taught you the tourist pronunciation, didn't they! Ha ha - it gets them every time. I love it when tourists ask me how to find their way to 'Suvverk' and 'Lester Square'. I never get tired of that joke. If you really want to impress the locals next time you're here, try the proper Cockney pronunciations - 'sooth vark' and 'leek easter square'. You'll be amazed at their friendly reaction - they might even offer you a pint of their local pastie and a knees up! The best way to pronounce 'superfluous' is 'too much'. Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Put your images into industry-standard formats (TIFF, JPEG, DNG) and archive the files. Upgrade the storage medium as the medium is improved by copying the files. Hard drives are the current standard storage medium. These formats will be around for many many years. You don't have to worry about software and drivers. Or, make five excellent prints of all your best work and delete all the original files. This means that everything you have is as good as a film image and print was. Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 8:04 AM, P. J. Alling wrote: You also need to keep the software and drivers too. (I'd like to think I'm just paranoid...) AlunFoto wrote: At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
2008/4/3, Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I bet they taught you the tourist pronunciation, didn't they! Ha ha - it gets them every time. I love it when tourists ask me how to find their way to 'Suvverk' and 'Lester Square'. I never get tired of that joke. If you really want to impress the locals next time you're here, try the proper Cockney pronunciations - 'sooth vark' and 'leek easter square'. You'll be amazed at their friendly reaction - they might even offer you a pint of their local pastie and a knees up! The best way to pronounce 'superfluous' is 'too much'. Like in superfluous information? :-) Jostein -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
The backup heaven is Restore. :-) Jostein 2008/4/3, Bob Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:28 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Put your images into industry-standard formats (TIFF, JPEG, DNG) and archive the files. Upgrade the storage medium as the medium is improved by copying the files. Hard drives are the current standard storage medium. These formats will be around for many many years. You don't have to worry about software and drivers. Or, make five excellent prints of all your best work and delete all the original files. This means that everything you have is as good as a film image and print was. Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 8:04 AM, P. J. Alling wrote: You also need to keep the software and drivers too. (I'd like to think I'm just paranoid...) AlunFoto wrote: At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:28 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Put your images into industry-standard formats (TIFF, JPEG, DNG) and archive the files. Upgrade the storage medium as the medium is improved by copying the files. Hard drives are the current standard storage medium. These formats will be around for many many years. You don't have to worry about software and drivers. Or, make five excellent prints of all your best work and delete all the original files. This means that everything you have is as good as a film image and print was. Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 8:04 AM, P. J. Alling wrote: You also need to keep the software and drivers too. (I'd like to think I'm just paranoid...) AlunFoto wrote: At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I run a drive/file system validation utility about once every month or two on my archives. It's too much work to do that frequently on the small capacity media like CD and DVD ... loading and unloading 200-300 of these volumes is days of tedious work ... so I concentrate doing that for the hard drive archive systems only. Mount a terabyte drive, say validate it and come back in a couple of hours. All the hard drive archives are twinned disks so if there's a problem with one, the other is likely just fine and I dump the bad, replace it, recopy the data. (It's not happened in the past four years of doing it this way ...) For the small media, I just make two copies and store them carefully. So far, on spot checks, they're all fine. If I find a bad one, I'll make another copy of the good one. Replication, replication... Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sullivan wrote: I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I run a drive/file system validation utility about once every month or two on my archives. It's too much work to do that frequently on the small capacity media like CD and DVD ... loading and unloading 200-300 of these volumes is days of tedious work ... so I concentrate doing that for the hard drive archive systems only. Mount a terabyte drive, say validate it and come back in a couple of hours. All the hard drive archives are twinned disks so if there's a problem with one, the other is likely just fine and I dump the bad, replace it, recopy the data. (It's not happened in the past four years of doing it this way ...) For the small media, I just make two copies and store them carefully. So far, on spot checks, they're all fine. If I find a bad one, I'll make another copy of the good one. Replication, replication... Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sullivan wrote: I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Well my point was that I burned some perfectly good CDs on an HP 2100 burner under Win98. I moved that burner to a machine running Win2K, those CDs were unreadable. They weren't that important so I put them aside to try some data recovery at a later time. I acquired a DVD burner, that was put into the Win2K machine, and the HP 2100 was returned to the Win98 machine. A while later I came across the unreadable CDs and decided to try to recover the data. They worked the first time in the Win98 machine, the Win2K machine still can't read them. Software and Drivers... Bob Sullivan wrote: I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:28 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Put your images into industry-standard formats (TIFF, JPEG, DNG) and archive the files. Upgrade the storage medium as the medium is improved by copying the files. Hard drives are the current standard storage medium. These formats will be around for many many years. You don't have to worry about software and drivers. Or, make five excellent prints of all your best work and delete all the original files. This means that everything you have is as good as a film image and print was. Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 8:04 AM, P. J. Alling wrote: You also need to keep the software and drivers too. (I'd like to think I'm just paranoid...) AlunFoto wrote: At the agency where I work, we received roughly a TB of documentation last year. Loads of DVDs and CDs. We've had important documentation on DVDs corrupted in less than 2 years, and there's far much more money involved with these documents than with any photo. So we regard discs as transport media only. Privately, I tend to think the same way. I use DVDs as a second-stage disaster recovery backup, and make sure to keep the DVD unit used to produce the backup together with the discs. I don't wish to run the risk of subtle incompatibilities between different devices. And yes, I've seen that happen at work. I have even seen differences among DVD players/recorders from the same mfg. and same production run (similar serial numbers). Backup is, at its basest, a continuous and iterative process. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
I prefer redundant information. AlunFoto wrote: 2008/4/3, Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I bet they taught you the tourist pronunciation, didn't they! Ha ha - it gets them every time. I love it when tourists ask me how to find their way to 'Suvverk' and 'Lester Square'. I never get tired of that joke. If you really want to impress the locals next time you're here, try the proper Cockney pronunciations - 'sooth vark' and 'leek easter square'. You'll be amazed at their friendly reaction - they might even offer you a pint of their local pastie and a knees up! The best way to pronounce 'superfluous' is 'too much'. Like in superfluous information? :-) Jostein -- Vote for Cthulhu. Why settle for a lesser evil... -- Dr. Jerry Pournelle -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Bob Sullivan wrote: My point of view is that you haven't validated that you can recover your pictures from the data until you actually do such, or at least do a sample. To say the bits and bites are all the same implies no other glitches in the process. No doubt. The number one most neglected part of backup systems and processes world wide is not testing the recovery/restore process. Mainly because in many cases a thorough test requires either a complete second system, or downtime of the main system. That's not the case here, and anyone can easily test copying all of the files from a CD, DVD, or external drive. Of course, you're still out of luck if you only have the one copy when it starts reporting errors. -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
AlunFoto wrote: Recently sorted out ascertain, but I'm still struggling with superfluous. Superfluous is properly pronounced extra. :-) -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Ralf R. Radermacher wrote: Temporarily... An awful word to pronounce for us Germans. Usually sounded as if someone had just fed them a glowing hot potatoe. :-)) vorübergehend ... hmmm, I see what you mean. :-) -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
Godfrey, My point of view is that you haven't validated that you can recover your pictures from the data until you actually do such, or at least do a sample. To say the bits and bites are all the same implies no other glitches in the process. Regards, Bob S. On 4/3/08, Godfrey DiGiorgi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I run a drive/file system validation utility about once every month or two on my archives. It's too much work to do that frequently on the small capacity media like CD and DVD ... loading and unloading 200-300 of these volumes is days of tedious work ... so I concentrate doing that for the hard drive archive systems only. Mount a terabyte drive, say validate it and come back in a couple of hours. All the hard drive archives are twinned disks so if there's a problem with one, the other is likely just fine and I dump the bad, replace it, recopy the data. (It's not happened in the past four years of doing it this way ...) For the small media, I just make two copies and store them carefully. So far, on spot checks, they're all fine. If I find a bad one, I'll make another copy of the good one. Replication, replication... Godfrey On Apr 3, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sullivan wrote: I understand the need for archival storage and try to do some. My main fear is the amount of data I manipulate now and will in the future. With a large amounts of data, checking the conditions of the back-up becomes an issue. Some of us have encountered problems where the backup hasn't worked for the last 15 months. You only find that out when you try to go back and retrieve something. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Although my new one might be Woolfhardisworthy. Mike: Is this an adjective for that famous British Wolf whistle or Wolf call British construction workers are famous for?--Heard a funny BBC radio story on the way to work today. Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Turns out the construction workers are ok with this new policy, but the women are upset by the ban--at least the handful interviewed for the story are. Cheers, Christine -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Although my new one might be Woolfhardisworthy. Mike: Is this an adjective for that famous British Wolf whistle or Wolf call British construction workers are famous for?--Heard a funny BBC radio story on the way to work today. Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Turns out the construction workers are ok with this new policy, but the women are upset by the ban--at least the handful interviewed for the story are. Cheers, Christine I'm not at all surprised that the construction workers are in broad agreement with such a policy - they are terribly enlightened over here, as this documentary proves: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u3j0d6iI_U Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
On Thu, Apr 03, 2008 at 05:30:00PM -0500, Christine Aguila wrote: Apparently, a construction company by the name of Wimbley (sp?) has banned the famous Wolf whistle. Wimpey, at a guess. (Often jokingly regarded as an acronym for We Import More Paddies Every Year - many of the construction workers in the UK are Irish). -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
lol!!! Cheers, Christine - Original Message - From: Bob W [EMAIL PROTECTED] I'm not at all surprised that the construction workers are in broad agreement with such a policy - they are terribly enlightened over here, as this documentary proves: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u3j0d6iI_U Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: John Francis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wimpey, at a guess. yes, I think that was the name! Cheers, Christine -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta
- Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Reliabilty of CD storage - was: Lightroom 2.0 beta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of my film scans are stored on CDs, and they still read well. Keep your fingers crossed. I've had serious trouble with a whole bunch of CDRs containing my back-ups of film scan data. They were stored in specially made CD paper jackets, the kind commonly used in books or commercial software packages. These jackets, bought from a local CD production company, had self-adhesive flaps and it appears something evaporating from this adhesive has damaged the CDs in the jacket to the point that they've become unredable. All this after about four years of storage. There was a distinct brownish colouring of the CDs in the section whch had been next to the flap. I've had a few CDs go bad, stored in plastic jewel cases. I've always tried to buy name brand ones such as Verbatim or Fuji, and I have always verified the data after the write. It's just the luck of the draw, I guess. I'm pretty close to buying an external RAID of some sort, and I will probably transfer as many of my files over to it from the CDs as is practical. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
