Re: What is photographic art?
Thanks, Basil... Cheers, Manuel Bill wrote: >On 19/12/2013 6:10 PM, Bruce Walker wrote: >> On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 5:13 PM, Bill >wrote: >>> >>> >> >> Heh. Optimist. >> >> Try mentioning the war. >> >Don't ever mention the war “Analysis kills spontaneity.” -- Henri-Frederic Amiel -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 12/19/2013 6:06 PM, Larry Colen wrote: One of my ongoing sources of cognitive dissonance is people mistaking my photos for art. One way of recognizing the refined taste of the PDML is that has rarely, if ever, happened here. The difference between art and artsy. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Mayhaps those "postcards" your uncle brought home from Paris after WWII? -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
I'll never get over Macho Grande! Dan Matyola http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Bill wrote: > On 19/12/2013 6:10 PM, Bruce Walker wrote: >> >> On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 5:13 PM, Bill wrote: >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> Heh. Optimist. >> >> Try mentioning the war. >> > Don't ever mention the war > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 19/12/2013 6:10 PM, Bruce Walker wrote: On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 5:13 PM, Bill wrote: Heh. Optimist. Try mentioning the war. Don't ever mention the war -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 5:13 PM, Bill wrote: > > Heh. Optimist. Try mentioning the war. -- -bmw -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Dec 19, 2013, at 5:32 PM, Mark Roberts wrote: > Stan Halpin wrote: > >> On Dec 19, 2013, at 4:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: >> >>> Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : >>> >>> Dan Matyola >>> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola >> >> I disagree. > > No you don't! > > -- > Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia > www.robertstech.com It depends on your definition of disagree Mark. I try to follow ISO666. stan -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 04:29:34PM -0500, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: > I'm just trying to insert a bit of levity into a weighty situation. > > Of course, many photographs are art. Anything by HC-B, and much of > that by AA, for easy examples. I don't know about that, you saw what happened when one of HC-B's photos was posted to a critique site. > > My photographs are not art. At best, they are "pleasant" or "nicely > illustrative." There are, however, several photographers on this list > who consistently produce art with their cameras. To name them would > tend to get into personal taste and disruptive argumentation. One of my ongoing sources of cognitive dissonance is people mistaking my photos for art. One way of recognizing the refined taste of the PDML is that has rarely, if ever, happened here. -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com http://red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 04:56:41PM -0500, Stan Halpin wrote: > > On Dec 19, 2013, at 4:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: > > > Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : > > > > Dan Matyola > > http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola > > > > I disagree. You're right, that should be "Nobody is too stupid to debate on this list". > > stan > > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com http://red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Mark - did you pay for the arguement?? ann On 12/19/2013 17:32, Mark Roberts wrote: Stan Halpin wrote: On Dec 19, 2013, at 4:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : Dan Matyola http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola I disagree. No you don't! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Stan Halpin wrote: >On Dec 19, 2013, at 4:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: > >> Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : >> >> Dan Matyola >> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola > >I disagree. No you don't! -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 19/12/2013 3:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : You'll know it's too stupid to debate when I wade in. bill -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Dec 19, 2013, at 4:30 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: > Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : > > Dan Matyola > http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola > I disagree. stan -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Nothing is to stupid to be debated on this list! : Dan Matyola http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Mark Roberts wrote: >>"What is photographic art?" > > A stupid thing to debate over. > > -- > Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia > www.robertstech.com > > > > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
I'm just trying to insert a bit of levity into a weighty situation. Of course, many photographs are art. Anything by HC-B, and much of that by AA, for easy examples. My photographs are not art. At best, they are "pleasant" or "nicely illustrative." There are, however, several photographers on this list who consistently produce art with their cameras. To name them would tend to get into personal taste and disruptive argumentation. Dan Matyola http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Bruce Walker wrote: > So, no photograph is art? No art includes photographs? > > BS. > > > On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 4:08 PM, Daniel J. Matyola > wrote: >> "What is photographic art?" >> >> An oxymoron. >> >> Dan Matyola >> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. > > > > -- > -bmw > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
>"What is photographic art?" A stupid thing to debate over. -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
So, no photograph is art? No art includes photographs? BS. On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 4:08 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote: > "What is photographic art?" > > An oxymoron. > > Dan Matyola > http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- -bmw -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
"What is photographic art?" An oxymoron. Dan Matyola http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Time to trot out the Dire Straits quote again: And then you get an artist says he doesn't want to paint at all He takes an empty canvas and sticks it on the wall The birds of a feather all the phonies and all of the fakes While the dealers they get together And they decide who gets the breaks And who's going to be in the gallery On 12/18/2013 7:23 PM, Stan Halpin wrote: Earlier in this thread someone mentioned the example of mobiles: once "art", now the baby-crib attachment to keep ankle-biters occupied. We watch Antiques Roadshow on PBS. The other evening they had a Calder miniature mobile, appraised at $1M. My mother-in-law's caregiver (NOT a sophisticate) could not stop laughing at the the thought that someone would pay that much for such a piece of junk. I like the notion that Art is the use of some medium to evoke reactions in others. To make them feel and/or think. The viewer, reader, listener, etc. may not grasp the artist's motivations, his or her feelings or ideas that went into some artistic expression, but the Artist wants to evoke something. [Not necessarily disbelief and laughter as in my example.] One thing that makes it all so hard to define and commercialize is that the viewing/reading/listening public may well not understand the language being spoken by the Artist. Which is why Art Appreciation courses used to be offered in some Universities. stan On Dec 18, 2013, at 6:22 PM, Bob W wrote: From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Mark Roberts John wrote: A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a paragraph to explain what it's about. "The more words there are on a gallery wall next to a picture, the worse the picture." - Gustave Flaubert http://www.web-options.com/Rouen2013/content/P0030436_large.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 12/18/2013 17:38, DagT wrote: This is art: http://www.thrane.name/Pictures/Stuff/files/page18-1010-full.html DagT twice over :-) ann 18. des. 2013 kl. 22:19 skrev Alunfoto - Jostein Øksne : I produce art. On the pretext that you spell "art" with an f. Jostein -Opprinnelig melding- Fra: DagT Dato: 17. desember 2013 23:23 Til: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Emne: Re: What is photographic art? I don´t care if my pictures are art or not. It doesn´t make them any better. DagT 17. des. 2013 kl. 23:03 skrev Walt : Of course my photos are art. And so is everything else I do if you leave it to me to be the judge. -- Walt On 12/16/2013 8:45 AM, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art form to a baby crib toy) Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century ago. There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others of us just try hard. Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Stan Halpin wrote: >And this is why I disagree with the notion that "if it takes more words to >describe, >it must be of lower quality." It might also be the case that the public >doesn't >understand that artist's language. I agree with you on that. So, I think, would Gustave Flaubert, because I believe he was saying something quite different. -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
And to finish my thought... On Dec 18, 2013, at 7:23 PM, Stan Halpin wrote: > Earlier in this thread someone mentioned the example of mobiles: once "art", > now the baby-crib attachment to keep ankle-biters occupied. > We watch Antiques Roadshow on PBS. The other evening they had a Calder > miniature mobile, appraised at $1M. My mother-in-law's caregiver (NOT a > sophisticate) could not stop laughing at the the thought that someone would > pay that much for such a piece of junk. > > I like the notion that Art is the use of some medium to evoke reactions in > others. To make them feel and/or think. The viewer, reader, listener, etc. > may not grasp the artist's motivations, his or her feelings or ideas that > went into some artistic expression, but the Artist wants to evoke something. > [Not necessarily disbelief and laughter as in my example.] > > One thing that makes it all so hard to define and commercialize is that the > viewing/reading/listening public may well not understand the language being > spoken by the Artist. Which is why Art Appreciation courses used to be > offered in some Universities. And this is why I disagree with the notion that "if it takes more words to describe, it must be of lower quality." It might also be the case that the public doesn't understand that artist's language. > > stan > > >>> From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Mark Roberts >>> >>> John wrote: >>> > A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a > paragraph > to explain what it's about. >>> >>> "The more words there are on a gallery wall next to a >>> picture, the worse the picture." >>> - Gustave Flaubert >>> >> -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Earlier in this thread someone mentioned the example of mobiles: once "art", now the baby-crib attachment to keep ankle-biters occupied. We watch Antiques Roadshow on PBS. The other evening they had a Calder miniature mobile, appraised at $1M. My mother-in-law's caregiver (NOT a sophisticate) could not stop laughing at the the thought that someone would pay that much for such a piece of junk. I like the notion that Art is the use of some medium to evoke reactions in others. To make them feel and/or think. The viewer, reader, listener, etc. may not grasp the artist's motivations, his or her feelings or ideas that went into some artistic expression, but the Artist wants to evoke something. [Not necessarily disbelief and laughter as in my example.] One thing that makes it all so hard to define and commercialize is that the viewing/reading/listening public may well not understand the language being spoken by the Artist. Which is why Art Appreciation courses used to be offered in some Universities. stan On Dec 18, 2013, at 6:22 PM, Bob W wrote: >> From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Mark Roberts >> >> John wrote: >> >>> A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a >> paragraph >>> to explain what it's about. >> >> "The more words there are on a gallery wall next to a >> picture, the worse the picture." >> - Gustave Flaubert >> > > http://www.web-options.com/Rouen2013/content/P0030436_large.html > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: What is photographic art?
> From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of Mark Roberts > > John wrote: > > >A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a > paragraph > >to explain what it's about. > > "The more words there are on a gallery wall next to a > picture, the worse the picture." > - Gustave Flaubert > http://www.web-options.com/Rouen2013/content/P0030436_large.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: What is photographic art?
> From: PDML [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of John > > The topic got passing mention at my weekly nature photography > group brunch today. > > A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a > paragraph to explain what it's about. > > But that got me to thinking. How do you know if it's a > photograph that needs a paragraph or a paragraph that needs a > photograph? > In my oupinion that would be a patagraph, and I feel sure that the Collège de 'Pataphysique would back me up on this. B -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
This is art: http://www.thrane.name/Pictures/Stuff/files/page18-1010-full.html DagT 18. des. 2013 kl. 22:19 skrev Alunfoto - Jostein Øksne : > I produce art. On the pretext that you spell "art" with an f. > > Jostein > > -Opprinnelig melding- Fra: DagT > Dato: 17. desember 2013 23:23 > Til: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > Emne: Re: What is photographic art? > > I don´t care if my pictures are art or not. It doesn´t make them any better. > > DagT > > 17. des. 2013 kl. 23:03 skrev Walt : > >> Of course my photos are art. And so is everything else I do if you leave it >> to me to be the judge. >> >> -- Walt >> >> On 12/16/2013 8:45 AM, CollinB wrote: >>> When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art >>> form. >>> But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art >>> form to a baby crib toy) >>> Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century >>> ago. >>> >>> There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others >>> of us just try hard. >>> >>> Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. >>> Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. >>> Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
John wrote: >A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a paragraph >to explain what it's about. "The more words there are on a gallery wall next to a picture, the worse the picture." - Gustave Flaubert -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
The topic got passing mention at my weekly nature photography group brunch today. A comment was made that it's "art" when a photograph needs a paragraph to explain what it's about. But that got me to thinking. How do you know if it's a photograph that needs a paragraph or a paragraph that needs a photograph? -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
I don´t care if my pictures are art or not. It doesn´t make them any better. DagT 17. des. 2013 kl. 23:03 skrev Walt : > Of course my photos are art. And so is everything else I do if you leave it > to me to be the judge. > > -- Walt > > On 12/16/2013 8:45 AM, CollinB wrote: >> When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art >> form. >> But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art >> form to a baby crib toy) >> Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century >> ago. >> >> There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others >> of us just try hard. >> >> Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. >> Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. >> Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Mine must be because I frame em! Kenneth Waller http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller - Original Message - From: "Walt" Subject: Re: What is photographic art? Of course my photos are art. And so is everything else I do if you leave it to me to be the judge. -- Walt On 12/16/2013 8:45 AM, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art form to a baby crib toy) Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century ago. There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others of us just try hard. Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Of course my photos are art. And so is everything else I do if you leave it to me to be the judge. -- Walt On 12/16/2013 8:45 AM, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art form to a baby crib toy) Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century ago. There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others of us just try hard. Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
I've seen a lot of "art" where the if the "artist" was trying to evoke the feelings of disgust they succeeded admirably, however I don't think that /I/ would call that art. On 12/16/2013 3:58 PM, Attila Boros wrote: On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 4:45 PM, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art form to a baby crib toy) Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century ago. There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others of us just try hard. Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. There is no exact scientific definition of art. By that I mean to look at anything and be able to tell if it's art or not with certainty according to the definition. Such definition can't be given, but that's the beauty of it isn't it? It remains to each of us to decide whether something is art or not, but there are no hard and fast rules and we might come to different conclusions (this is why the "eye of the beholder" isn't a proper definition). Popularity doesn't destroy art unless your definition requires that art shouldn't be mainstream. "To evoke in oneself a feeling one has once experienced, and having evoked it in oneself, then, by means of movements, lines, colors, sounds, or forms expressed in words, so to transmit that feeling that others may experience the same feeling — this is the activity of art. Art is a human activity consisting in this, that one man consciously, by means of certain external signs, hands on to others feelings he has lived through, and that other people are infected by these feelings and also experience them." (Leo Tolstoy) This is a good definition of the artistic process, describing the intention of the artist when he creates art. But will the same feelings be transmitted to the viewers is impossible to tell. I'd say if he succeeds to evoke any feelings then he created art. -- Attila -- A newspaper is a device for making the ignorant more ignorant, and the crazy, crazier. - H.L.Mencken -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 12/16/2013 1:20 PM, Mark Roberts wrote: Larry Colen wrote: The only people who are bigger wankers than self proclaimed artists, are the people who debate about what qualifies as art. Have I mentioned lately that the 2013 PDML Quotations List will be out next week? So you're saying Larry got in just under the wire? -- A newspaper is a device for making the ignorant more ignorant, and the crazy, crazier. - H.L.Mencken -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Quoting Larry Colen : On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 09:45:51AM -0500, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. And some of us don't give a shit, we just like playing with our toys. If we get pretty pictures in the process, so much the better. I'm pretty much in the 'don't give a shit' camp. -- Cheers Brian ++ Brian Walters Western Sydney Australia http://lyons-ryan.org/southernlight/ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
If I think it's art, then it's art ... at least as far as I'm concerned. Your mileage may vary. Professional driver on a closed course. Do not try this at home. Standard disclaimers apply. On 12/16/2013 3:58 PM, Attila Boros wrote: On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 4:45 PM, CollinB wrote: When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art form to a baby crib toy) Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century ago. There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others of us just try hard. Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. There is no exact scientific definition of art. By that I mean to look at anything and be able to tell if it's art or not with certainty according to the definition. Such definition can't be given, but that's the beauty of it isn't it? It remains to each of us to decide whether something is art or not, but there are no hard and fast rules and we might come to different conclusions (this is why the "eye of the beholder" isn't a proper definition). Popularity doesn't destroy art unless your definition requires that art shouldn't be mainstream. "To evoke in oneself a feeling one has once experienced, and having evoked it in oneself, then, by means of movements, lines, colors, sounds, or forms expressed in words, so to transmit that feeling that others may experience the same feeling — this is the activity of art. Art is a human activity consisting in this, that one man consciously, by means of certain external signs, hands on to others feelings he has lived through, and that other people are infected by these feelings and also experience them." (Leo Tolstoy) This is a good definition of the artistic process, describing the intention of the artist when he creates art. But will the same feelings be transmitted to the viewers is impossible to tell. I'd say if he succeeds to evoke any feelings then he created art. -- Attila -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 4:45 PM, CollinB wrote: > When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art > form. > But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art > form to a baby crib toy) > Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century > ago. > > There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others > of us just try hard. > > Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. > Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. > Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. There is no exact scientific definition of art. By that I mean to look at anything and be able to tell if it's art or not with certainty according to the definition. Such definition can't be given, but that's the beauty of it isn't it? It remains to each of us to decide whether something is art or not, but there are no hard and fast rules and we might come to different conclusions (this is why the "eye of the beholder" isn't a proper definition). Popularity doesn't destroy art unless your definition requires that art shouldn't be mainstream. "To evoke in oneself a feeling one has once experienced, and having evoked it in oneself, then, by means of movements, lines, colors, sounds, or forms expressed in words, so to transmit that feeling that others may experience the same feeling — this is the activity of art. Art is a human activity consisting in this, that one man consciously, by means of certain external signs, hands on to others feelings he has lived through, and that other people are infected by these feelings and also experience them." (Leo Tolstoy) This is a good definition of the artistic process, describing the intention of the artist when he creates art. But will the same feelings be transmitted to the viewers is impossible to tell. I'd say if he succeeds to evoke any feelings then he created art. -- Attila -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
>And some of us don't give a shit, we just like playing with our toys. >If we get pretty pictures in the process, so much the better. > >Larry Nobody said we couldn't have fun. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
> >Well you woke up bored, didn't you, Collin? :-D > >Cheers, > > -M. Reading too much Feyerabend. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 01:20:11PM -0500, Mark Roberts wrote: > Larry Colen wrote: > > >The only people who are bigger wankers than self proclaimed artists, > >are the people who debate about what qualifies as art. > > Have I mentioned lately that the 2013 PDML Quotations List will be out > next week? Is that an automark? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com http://red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Larry Colen wrote: >The only people who are bigger wankers than self proclaimed artists, >are the people who debate about what qualifies as art. Have I mentioned lately that the 2013 PDML Quotations List will be out next week? -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 09:45:51AM -0500, CollinB wrote: > When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art > form. The only people who are bigger wankers than self proclaimed artists, are the people who debate about what qualifies as art. Photos can be used to express beauty, express information or express emotion. If a photo accomplishes the goal of the photographer, subject or audience, it doesn't matter whether someone else thinks that it is art or not. > But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an art > form to a baby crib toy) The only thing popularity destroys is the opportunity for pretentiousness. > Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a century > ago. > > There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. Others > of us just try hard. And some of us don't give a shit, we just like playing with our toys. If we get pretty pictures in the process, so much the better. > > Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. > Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. > Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com http://red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
Alunfoto - Jostein Øksne wrote: >From: CollinB > >> When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it >> remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. > >Ironically, that seems not to apply to rhetorics. :-) -- Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia www.robertstech.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
CollinB wrote: >When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art >form. >But popularity, it seems, destroys art. (eg, the mobile went from an >art >form to a baby crib toy) >Kodak is to blame for the change in photography and that was about a >century >ago. > >There is a remnant of photographic art. Some here do it quite well. >Others >of us just try hard. > >Art is more than the individualism of the eye of the beholder. >Such pomo definitions destroy all meaning. >Art is a rigorous creation, an image which speaks clearly. Well you woke up bored, didn't you, Collin? :-D Cheers, —M. \/\/o/\/\ --> http://WorldOfMiserere.com http://EnticingTheLight.com A Quest for Photographic Enlightenment -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
On 16/12/2013 8:58 AM, Alunfoto - Jostein Øksne wrote: -Opprinnelig melding- From: CollinB When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. Ironically, that seems not to apply to rhetorics. :-) Jostein I'm making the popcorn. bill -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: What is photographic art?
-Opprinnelig melding- From: CollinB When a medium belongs exclusively to the artists then it remains an art form. But popularity, it seems, destroys art. Ironically, that seems not to apply to rhetorics. :-) Jostein -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
