Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Darren Duncan]

On 2020-08-28 8:28 p.m., tutilu...@tutanota.com wrote:
That's... not what I've been saying. If you don't recognize that Chrome/Firefox 
are spyware, you *are* objectively wrong. There's just no two ways about it. Are 
you astroturfing for Google/Mozilla (it's almost pointless to even mention 
Mozilla at all anymore because they are owned by Google)? Why persist in 
defending this evil mega corporation's horrific treatment of your security?


You haven't actually explained what the harm here is.  So what if Chrome or 
Firefox "spy" on you.  What is an *actual* harm you have suffered or expect to 
suffer because of using those browsers?  What would they do with what they learn 
that would cause you actual harm?


I've already jumped through tons of hoops and wasted tons of time and effort 
sending messages to this mailing list. I'm not going to sit and "file bugs" on 
top of that, doubtlessly requiring me to jump through even more hoops. I'm not a 
pgAdmin developer. Every bug I've ever managed to file in the past for any 
project has been ignored. FOSS developers hate bug reports and make it 
obnoxiously difficult to submit them. This is what I learned many, many years ago.


Its already established that filing bugs is the only valid way to get a problem 
solved.  So if you're wasting your time continuing to send messages to this 
mailing list rather than filing the bugs, then you should have spent the time 
filing the bugs instead.  That's the only way your pgAdmin problems would get fixed.


-- Darren Duncan

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Akshay Joshi]

Hi All

We have fixed the *weird* issue of *BrowserCommand* and *FixedPort* both.
It will be part of the release on 19th September but if someone wants to
test it and confirm then please download and install the nightly build from
https://www.postgresql.org/ftp/pgadmin/pgadmin4/snapshots/2020-09-02/

*Note*: If you are testing the snapshot build just keep that in mind there
are commits which are still in "Testing".

On Sat, Aug 29, 2020 at 8:58 AM  wrote:

> Aug 27, 2020, 4:43 PM by jac...@pobox.com:
>
> You “chose” to use Pale Moon.
>
> No, I did not.
>
> To you, it appeared to be the only reasonable alternative
>
> Not only does it appear that way -- it *is* that way.
>
> you “chose” to use it when there were other options available.
>
> There are no other options.
>
> I get that you don’t consider them acceptable options, but they are
> options nevertheless.
>
> It's like having the "option" to be injected with two different kinds of
> deadly diseases, or just a common flu. (Pale Moon is the common flu.) I
> don't understand why you insist that there are options.
>
> if there is a behavior in the product that is specific to Pale Moon (as it
> appears the issue you are bringing up is)
>
> No. For the love of the holy PostgreSQL elephant, read before replying...
>
> do you feel that the team is responsible for testing EVERY option that a
> user might choose?
>
> This is the *entire point* of using a stand-alone GUI/webview...
>
> I would bet that if we took a poll of users, that less than 1% would say
> that they use Pale Moon.
>
> So what? Less than 1% of the general population have any kind of brain as
> well. But again, it doesn't matter as the issue isn't with Pale Moon. And
> the (secondary) issues that *are* with Pale Moon should not exist either.
> The pgAdmin developers should be using Pale Moon themselves as there is no
> non-spyware browser available in this dystopian nightmare that the Internet
> (and the world in general) has turned into.
>
> So how much of the team's testing capacity should be dedicated to a
> “configuration” that less than 1% of the user base uses?
>
> 100%, if that 1% are the only ones who have a brain. In fact, it should
> detect any use of Chrome/Firefox and display a big warning that
> Google/Mozilla are spying on every key they press down inside those
> trojans, and direct them to download a real browser. Sadly, even Pale Moon
> isn't what I would call a "real browser". But it's at least free from the
> worst kind of obvious, malicious spying by the browser vendor itself.
>
> You can continue to say that everyone else is wrong and you are right
>
> That's... not what I've been saying. If you don't recognize that
> Chrome/Firefox are spyware, you *are* objectively wrong. There's just no
> two ways about it. Are you astroturfing for Google/Mozilla (it's almost
> pointless to even mention Mozilla at all anymore because they are owned by
> Google)? Why persist in defending this evil mega corporation's horrific
> treatment of your security?
>
> And I say again that if the latest version of pgAdmin does not work
> correctly for you with Pale Moon, then report the bug and revert to the
> older version of pgAdmin that DOES work with Pale Moon. I suspect that if
> the cause is found, the team will add an automated test to ensure that the
> problem does not recur. That won’t stop other problems from occurring, and
> problems with pdAdmin in a relatively disused configuration are going to go
> unfound until you find them.
>
> I've already jumped through tons of hoops and wasted tons of time and
> effort sending messages to this mailing list. I'm not going to sit and
> "file bugs" on top of that, doubtlessly requiring me to jump through even
> more hoops. I'm not a pgAdmin developer. Every bug I've ever managed to
> file in the past for any project has been ignored. FOSS developers hate bug
> reports and make it obnoxiously difficult to submit them. This is what I
> learned many, many years ago.
>
> That’s just reality.
>
> Yeah, it's hopeless, so let's all just install Google's cancerware.
> That'll show them for sure.
>


-- 
*Thanks & Regards*
*Akshay Joshi*
*pgAdmin Hacker | Sr. Software Architect*
*EDB Postgres *

*Mobile: +91 976-788-8246*

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[tutiluren]

Aug 27, 2020, 4:43 PM by jac...@pobox.com:

>  You “chose” to use Pale Moon.
>
No, I did not.

>  To you, it appeared to be the only reasonable alternative
>
Not only does it appear that way -- it *is* that way.

> you “chose” to use it when there were other options available.
>
There are no other options.

>  I get that you don’t consider them acceptable options, but they are options 
> nevertheless.
>
It's like having the "option" to be injected with two different kinds of deadly 
diseases, or just a common flu. (Pale Moon is the common flu.) I don't 
understand why you insist that there are options.

> if there is a behavior in the product that is specific to Pale Moon (as it 
> appears the issue you are bringing up is)
>
No. For the love of the holy PostgreSQL elephant, read before replying...

> do you feel that the team is responsible for testing EVERY option that a user 
> might choose?
>
This is the *entire point* of using a stand-alone GUI/webview...

>  I would bet that if we took a poll of users, that less than 1% would say 
> that they use Pale Moon.
>
So what? Less than 1% of the general population have any kind of brain as well. 
But again, it doesn't matter as the issue isn't with Pale Moon. And the 
(secondary) issues that *are* with Pale Moon should not exist either. The 
pgAdmin developers should be using Pale Moon themselves as there is no 
non-spyware browser available in this dystopian nightmare that the Internet 
(and the world in general) has turned into.

>  So how much of the team's testing capacity should be dedicated to a 
> “configuration” that less than 1% of the user base uses?
>
100%, if that 1% are the only ones who have a brain. In fact, it should detect 
any use of Chrome/Firefox and display a big warning that Google/Mozilla are 
spying on every key they press down inside those trojans, and direct them to 
download a real browser. Sadly, even Pale Moon isn't what I would call a "real 
browser". But it's at least free from the worst kind of obvious, malicious 
spying by the browser vendor itself.

> You can continue to say that everyone else is wrong and you are right
>
That's... not what I've been saying. If you don't recognize that Chrome/Firefox 
are spyware, you *are* objectively wrong. There's just no two ways about it. 
Are you astroturfing for Google/Mozilla (it's almost pointless to even mention 
Mozilla at all anymore because they are owned by Google)? Why persist in 
defending this evil mega corporation's horrific treatment of your security?

> And I say again that if the latest version of pgAdmin does not work correctly 
> for you with Pale Moon, then report the bug and revert to the older version 
> of pgAdmin that DOES work with Pale Moon. I suspect that if the cause is 
> found, the team will add an automated test to ensure that the problem does 
> not recur. That won’t stop other problems from occurring, and problems with 
> pdAdmin in a relatively disused configuration are going to go unfound until 
> you find them.
>
I've already jumped through tons of hoops and wasted tons of time and effort 
sending messages to this mailing list. I'm not going to sit and "file bugs" on 
top of that, doubtlessly requiring me to jump through even more hoops. I'm not 
a pgAdmin developer. Every bug I've ever managed to file in the past for any 
project has been ignored. FOSS developers hate bug reports and make it 
obnoxiously difficult to submit them. This is what I learned many, many years 
ago.

>  That’s just reality.
>
Yeah, it's hopeless, so let's all just install Google's cancerware. That'll 
show them for sure.

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Jack Royal-Gordon]

Perhaps I chose my words poorly - “insist, while being accurate, probably 
carries negative connotations that were unnecessary. You “chose” to use Pale 
Moon. To you, it appeared to be the only reasonable alternative; that may be 
true or may not - it is subject to debate. But you “chose” to use it when there 
were other options available. I get that you don’t consider them acceptable 
options, but they are options nevertheless. I’ll let the developers speak for 
themselves if they choose to, but I can imagine that their testing does not 
include Pale Moon, so if there is a behavior in the product that is specific to 
Pale Moon (as it appears the issue you are bringing up is), it’s only due to 
not testing with Pale Moon.

Regardless of how logical it is to use Pale Moon, do you feel that the team is 
responsible for testing EVERY option that a user might choose? I would bet that 
if we took a poll of users, that less than 1% would say that they use Pale 
Moon. So how much of the team's testing capacity should be dedicated to a 
“configuration” that less than 1% of the user base uses?

You can continue to say that everyone else is wrong and you are right, but 
that’s not very productive, regardless of whether you’re right or wrong.

And I say again that if the latest version of pgAdmin does not work correctly 
for you with Pale Moon, then report the bug and revert to the older version of 
pgAdmin that DOES work with Pale Moon. I suspect that if the cause is found, 
the team will add an automated test to ensure that the problem does not recur. 
That won’t stop other problems from occurring, and problems with pdAdmin in a 
relatively disused configuration are going to go unfound until you find them. 
That’s just reality. You can scream about it all you want, but that isn’t going 
to change anything.

> On Aug 27, 2020, at 6:57 AM, tutilu...@tutanota.com wrote:
> 
> I don't "insist upon" anything. As already mentioned numerous times, both on 
> the list and to you personally, there is *no choice*. I hate Pale Moon. Don't 
> twist my words into some kind of Pale Moon advocacy. It's a garbage fork with 
> numerous issues. I use it *because there is no choice*. Why is it so 
> difficult to understand? Has every classic "computer geek" disappeared from 
> this world or what the hell is going on? Do you not have the faintest idea 
> what Google is about? This is as baffling as those who insist that Mozilla 
> "stands for privacy", or even that Microsoft does. It's like we are living in 
> different universes which have somehow crossed.
> 
> So you "solution" is to install Google's cancerware because... it won't spy 
> on me if I wish hard enough? You are not making any sense. Besides, if you 
> had bothered to actually read (which nobody ever does, so why am I even still 
> trying to communicate?), you'd have seen that my main issue has nothing to do 
> with Pale Moon and everything to do with pgAdmin 4 not executing its "browser 
> command". I'm not going to repeat this a single more time now.
> 
> It's insulting to keep hearing supposedly intelligent people suggest to 
> install spyware. You're a damn fool if you subject yourself and others to 
> this.
> 
> 
> Aug 26, 2020, 11:00 PM by jac...@pobox.com:
> Here’s a thought that I think could solve your issues:
> 
> It sounds like a lot of your issues are caused by the insistence on using 
> PaleMoon. I don’t imagine that the team does much if any testing against 
> PaleMoon, so I’m not shocked that you have issues with it. And I get it - you 
> want private browsing. Why don’t you use Chrome for pgAdmin, and use PaleMoon 
> for everything else? I don’t imagine that Chrome’s “spying” would be an issue 
> for you with pgAdmin. Are you thinking that they’re going to monitor the 
> databases you are administering?
> 
>> On Aug 26, 2020, at 10:32 AM, tutilu...@tutanota.com 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Aug 25, 2020, 2:59 PM by dp...@pgadmin.org :
>> 
>> 
>> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM > > wrote:
>>  
>> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
>> 
>> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html 
>>  
>> 
>> This certainly convinces me that there is quite a lot of testing happening, 
>> so that's at least reassuring in some sense. However, since it's necessary 
>> (in practice) to create a separate, dedicated browser profile for pgAdmin 
>> (since otherwise, it forgets the entire "state" every time you clear your 
>> browser data or close the browser, which happens constantly), breaking the 
>> "browser command" in a new version is quite remarkable.
>> 
>> Also, it should be noted that my found work-around, to find the pgAdmin icon 
>> in the Notification area, right click it and then click "New pgAdmin 
>> window", only works once you are actually running it. When I start my 
>> machine, pgAdmin 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Christophe Pettus]

> On Aug 27, 2020, at 06:57, tutilu...@tutanota.com wrote:
> 
> You're a damn fool if you subject yourself and others to this.

Please be civil on community lists.  Language like this is unproductive.
--
-- Christophe Pettus
   x...@thebuild.com

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[tutiluren]

I don't "insist upon" anything. As already mentioned numerous times, both on 
the list and to you personally, there is *no choice*. I hate Pale Moon. Don't 
twist my words into some kind of Pale Moon advocacy. It's a garbage fork with 
numerous issues. I use it *because there is no choice*. Why is it so difficult 
to understand? Has every classic "computer geek" disappeared from this world or 
what the hell is going on? Do you not have the faintest idea what Google is 
about? This is as baffling as those who insist that Mozilla "stands for 
privacy", or even that Microsoft does. It's like we are living in different 
universes which have somehow crossed.
So you "solution" is to install Google's cancerware because... it won't spy on 
me if I wish hard enough? You are not making any sense. Besides, if you had 
bothered to actually read (which nobody ever does, so why am I even still 
trying to communicate?), you'd have seen that my main issue has nothing to do 
with Pale Moon and everything to do with pgAdmin 4 not executing its "browser 
command". I'm not going to repeat this a single more time now.

It's insulting to keep hearing supposedly intelligent people suggest to install 
spyware. You're a damn fool if you subject yourself and others to this.


Aug 26, 2020, 11:00 PM by jac...@pobox.com:

> Here’s a thought that I think could solve your issues:
>
> It sounds like a lot of your issues are caused by the insistence on using 
> PaleMoon. I don’t imagine that the team does much if any testing against 
> PaleMoon, so I’m not shocked that you have issues with it. And I get it - you 
> want private browsing. Why don’t you use Chrome for pgAdmin, and use PaleMoon 
> for everything else? I don’t imagine that Chrome’s “spying” would be an issue 
> for you with pgAdmin. Are you thinking that they’re going to monitor the 
> databases you are administering?
>
>
>> On Aug 26, 2020, at 10:32 AM, >> tutilu...@tutanota.com>>  wrote:
>>
>> Aug 25, 2020, 2:59 PM by >> dp...@pgadmin.org>> :
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM <>>> tutilu...@tutanota.com>>> > wrote:
>>>  
>>>
 Please consider testing your software before releasing it.

>>>
>>> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html>>>  
>>>
>>
>> This certainly convinces me that there is quite a lot of testing happening, 
>> so that's at least reassuring in some sense. However, since it's necessary 
>> (in practice) to create a separate, dedicated browser profile for pgAdmin 
>> (since otherwise, it forgets the entire "state" every time you clear your 
>> browser data or close the browser, which happens constantly), breaking the 
>> "browser command" in a new version is quite remarkable.
>>
>> Also, it should be noted that my found work-around, to find the pgAdmin icon 
>> in the Notification area, right click it and then click "New pgAdmin 
>> window", only works once you are actually running it. When I start my 
>> machine, pgAdmin isn't running, so I first have to launch it using my normal 
>> Taskbar icon, which up until the latest version opened the correct pgAdmin 
>> browser profile. Now, it instead loads for some time and finally opens in 
>> the default browser (obviously with forgotten "state"). I then have to close 
>> it and then start it with the Notification area work-around.
>>
>> Yes, I could make it run on boot, to save myself another click and some 
>> waiting, but again, the problem isn't that I cannot find a way at all to use 
>> pgAdmin -- the issue is that such an "obvious" thing broke. It really makes 
>> me wonder how anyone could be running pgAdmin in their standard browser 
>> profile. I guess they never or rarely clear their browser data and never 
>> have to close all browser windows. I frequently need to do that for many 
>> reasons besides privacy, including updates, freezes/crashes (most frequently 
>> caused by pgAdmin, ironically), getting the "right order" of grouped windows 
>> of different browser profiles, etc.
>>
>> As I explained previously, it's impossible for me to use a "supported 
>> browser" because Chrome (and all its "skins" which pretend to be browsers) 
>> as well as Firefox are pure spyware. I don't say that without reason, but 
>> I'm not going to go into detail about that again here. At the end of the 
>> day, I'm forced to use Pale Moon or nothing at this point, and pgAdmin 
>> either hangs entirely or freezes for many, many seconds (half a minute or 
>> more is not uncommon) if I forget myself and try to click and resize the 
>> object tree pane to make me able to see what it contains. I have to actively 
>> remember to just scroll horizontally or else I can say "good bye" to that 
>> entire pgAdmin session. Which has many times caused loss of work/state for 
>> me. The same thing happens even if I just maximize/restore the window. The 
>> most likely cause is some JavaScript code used to "redraw" or "recalculate" 
>> the view.
>>
>> As you can see, I have extremely good reasons 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Jack Royal-Gordon]

Here’s a thought that I think could solve your issues:

It sounds like a lot of your issues are caused by the insistence on using 
PaleMoon. I don’t imagine that the team does much if any testing against 
PaleMoon, so I’m not shocked that you have issues with it. And I get it - you 
want private browsing. Why don’t you use Chrome for pgAdmin, and use PaleMoon 
for everything else? I don’t imagine that Chrome’s “spying” would be an issue 
for you with pgAdmin. Are you thinking that they’re going to monitor the 
databases you are administering?

> On Aug 26, 2020, at 10:32 AM, tutilu...@tutanota.com wrote:
> 
> Aug 25, 2020, 2:59 PM by dp...@pgadmin.org:
> 
> 
> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  > wrote:
>  
> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
> 
> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html 
>  
> 
> This certainly convinces me that there is quite a lot of testing happening, 
> so that's at least reassuring in some sense. However, since it's necessary 
> (in practice) to create a separate, dedicated browser profile for pgAdmin 
> (since otherwise, it forgets the entire "state" every time you clear your 
> browser data or close the browser, which happens constantly), breaking the 
> "browser command" in a new version is quite remarkable.
> 
> Also, it should be noted that my found work-around, to find the pgAdmin icon 
> in the Notification area, right click it and then click "New pgAdmin window", 
> only works once you are actually running it. When I start my machine, pgAdmin 
> isn't running, so I first have to launch it using my normal Taskbar icon, 
> which up until the latest version opened the correct pgAdmin browser profile. 
> Now, it instead loads for some time and finally opens in the default browser 
> (obviously with forgotten "state"). I then have to close it and then start it 
> with the Notification area work-around.
> 
> Yes, I could make it run on boot, to save myself another click and some 
> waiting, but again, the problem isn't that I cannot find a way at all to use 
> pgAdmin -- the issue is that such an "obvious" thing broke. It really makes 
> me wonder how anyone could be running pgAdmin in their standard browser 
> profile. I guess they never or rarely clear their browser data and never have 
> to close all browser windows. I frequently need to do that for many reasons 
> besides privacy, including updates, freezes/crashes (most frequently caused 
> by pgAdmin, ironically), getting the "right order" of grouped windows of 
> different browser profiles, etc.
> 
> As I explained previously, it's impossible for me to use a "supported 
> browser" because Chrome (and all its "skins" which pretend to be browsers) as 
> well as Firefox are pure spyware. I don't say that without reason, but I'm 
> not going to go into detail about that again here. At the end of the day, I'm 
> forced to use Pale Moon or nothing at this point, and pgAdmin either hangs 
> entirely or freezes for many, many seconds (half a minute or more is not 
> uncommon) if I forget myself and try to click and resize the object tree pane 
> to make me able to see what it contains. I have to actively remember to just 
> scroll horizontally or else I can say "good bye" to that entire pgAdmin 
> session. Which has many times caused loss of work/state for me. The same 
> thing happens even if I just maximize/restore the window. The most likely 
> cause is some JavaScript code used to "redraw" or "recalculate" the view.
> 
> As you can see, I have extremely good reasons for wanting pgAdmin to ship 
> with its own GUI/webview, and I frankly don't understand the stated reasons 
> for why this is not done. I don't think you're lying, but NW.js (for example) 
> uses Chrome/Chromium's engine and should not be possible to have any issues 
> rendering and handling pgAdmin on all supported OSes. (I don't mention 
> Electron because its developer is extremely toxic.)
> 
> Yes, I'm aware that pgAdmin can be run in a "hosted" manner, so it still has 
> to support "other browsers" (whatever that means at this point with Google's 
> engine having a total monopoly besides a minimal Firefox and Safari user 
> base), but then you could at least say that there's always the option to 
> download the "stand-alone" version of pgAdmin which comes with a nice 
> GUI/webview and never has to interfere in any way with existing browsers and 
> all the nightmares that entails.
> 
> The fact that you, the developers, don't see this as the #1 priority makes me 
> wonder how it's possible that my "workflow" is apparently so fundamentally 
> different from yours. Note that I'm not bashing the entire concept of "web 
> apps", as this is what I have the most experience with myself, but simply the 
> reluctance of packaging it in such a manner that it can be used without 
> piggybacking on other software.
> 
> I actually remember 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[tutiluren]

Aug 25, 2020, 2:59 PM by dp...@pgadmin.org:

>
>
> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM <> tutilu...@tutanota.com> > wrote:
>  
>
>> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
>>
>
> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html>  
>

This certainly convinces me that there is quite a lot of testing happening, so 
that's at least reassuring in some sense. However, since it's necessary (in 
practice) to create a separate, dedicated browser profile for pgAdmin (since 
otherwise, it forgets the entire "state" every time you clear your browser data 
or close the browser, which happens constantly), breaking the "browser command" 
in a new version is quite remarkable.

Also, it should be noted that my found work-around, to find the pgAdmin icon in 
the Notification area, right click it and then click "New pgAdmin window", only 
works once you are actually running it. When I start my machine, pgAdmin isn't 
running, so I first have to launch it using my normal Taskbar icon, which up 
until the latest version opened the correct pgAdmin browser profile. Now, it 
instead loads for some time and finally opens in the default browser (obviously 
with forgotten "state"). I then have to close it and then start it with the 
Notification area work-around.

Yes, I could make it run on boot, to save myself another click and some 
waiting, but again, the problem isn't that I cannot find a way at all to use 
pgAdmin -- the issue is that such an "obvious" thing broke. It really makes me 
wonder how anyone could be running pgAdmin in their standard browser profile. I 
guess they never or rarely clear their browser data and never have to close all 
browser windows. I frequently need to do that for many reasons besides privacy, 
including updates, freezes/crashes (most frequently caused by pgAdmin, 
ironically), getting the "right order" of grouped windows of different browser 
profiles, etc.

As I explained previously, it's impossible for me to use a "supported browser" 
because Chrome (and all its "skins" which pretend to be browsers) as well as 
Firefox are pure spyware. I don't say that without reason, but I'm not going to 
go into detail about that again here. At the end of the day, I'm forced to use 
Pale Moon or nothing at this point, and pgAdmin either hangs entirely or 
freezes for many, many seconds (half a minute or more is not uncommon) if I 
forget myself and try to click and resize the object tree pane to make me able 
to see what it contains. I have to actively remember to just scroll 
horizontally or else I can say "good bye" to that entire pgAdmin session. Which 
has many times caused loss of work/state for me. The same thing happens even if 
I just maximize/restore the window. The most likely cause is some JavaScript 
code used to "redraw" or "recalculate" the view.

As you can see, I have extremely good reasons for wanting pgAdmin to ship with 
its own GUI/webview, and I frankly don't understand the stated reasons for why 
this is not done. I don't think you're lying, but NW.js (for example) uses 
Chrome/Chromium's engine and should not be possible to have any issues 
rendering and handling pgAdmin on all supported OSes. (I don't mention Electron 
because its developer is extremely toxic.)

Yes, I'm aware that pgAdmin can be run in a "hosted" manner, so it still has to 
support "other browsers" (whatever that means at this point with Google's 
engine having a total monopoly besides a minimal Firefox and Safari user base), 
but then you could at least say that there's always the option to download the 
"stand-alone" version of pgAdmin which comes with a nice GUI/webview and never 
has to interfere in any way with existing browsers and all the nightmares that 
entails.

The fact that you, the developers, don't see this as the #1 priority makes me 
wonder how it's possible that my "workflow" is apparently so fundamentally 
different from yours. Note that I'm not bashing the entire concept of "web 
apps", as this is what I have the most experience with myself, but simply the 
reluctance of packaging it in such a manner that it can be used without 
piggybacking on other software.

I actually remember trying it out early on when it was still a stand-alone 
thing, and while it was horribly slow and buggy, I never attributed this to the 
fact that it ran in some kind of webview. That makes no sense to me. My browser 
is an old fork of Firefox, maintained by "some guy in his basement", and I use 
it solely out of having no other choice. How can a webview which simply uses 
the Chromium engine (as evil as I find it, but that's a different problem) 
possibly be slower at rendering pgAdmin, which was made to support Chrome? 
Something about that doesn't add up.

pgAdmin III is entirely unusable at this point, and none of the "alternatives" 
to pgAdmin 4 are usable (for a number of reasons which are also pointless to 
list). I thus consider pgAdmin 4 to be the "official" and *only* software to 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Dave Page]

Thanks Rik!

On Tue, Aug 25, 2020 at 2:12 PM richard coleman 
wrote:

> Dave,
>
> Thanks for the link.  It was very informative.  Best wishes to you and
> your team.
>
> rik.
>
> On Tue, Aug 25, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Page  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
>>>
>>
>> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html
>>
>> --
>> Dave Page
>> Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
>> Twitter: @pgsnake
>>
>> EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com
>>
>>

-- 
Dave Page
Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
Twitter: @pgsnake

EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[richard coleman]

Dave,

Thanks for the link.  It was very informative.  Best wishes to you and your
team.

rik.

On Tue, Aug 25, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Page  wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:
>
>
>> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
>>
>
> https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html
>
> --
> Dave Page
> Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
> Twitter: @pgsnake
>
> EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com
>
>

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Dave Page]

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:


> Please consider testing your software before releasing it.
>

https://pgsnake.blogspot.com/2020/08/testing-pgadmin.html

-- 
Dave Page
Blog: http://pgsnake.blogspot.com
Twitter: @pgsnake

EDB: http://www.enterprisedb.com

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Akshay Joshi]

On Sun, Aug 23, 2020 at 12:11 AM  wrote:

>
> You should stop complaining.
>
>
> Why? Why would I stop complaining if something is wrong? That's when you
> are *supposed* to complain. Just because something doesn't cost money
> doesn't mean it's free. I've paid dearly with blood, sweat and tears. Maybe
> you consider your time and energy to be worthless, but I don't. In fact,
> it's far more valuable to me than money. I just don't *have* any money.
>
> I'm really trying to not sound rude, and I often feel bad when I later
> read replies, but I apparently just can't help it. I *do* feel that they
> "owe" me a basic stable/sensible PG management software, in some
> philosophical sense. Not everything is about money. This mentality must
> end. It's ruined this world.
>

Complaining about something is not wrong but that should not be in a rude
way. Words that we use should not demoralize the developers who are working
on it and try to provide quality software which makes use of PostgreSQL
easier.

To complaint about something we already have Bug tracking system
https://redmine.postgresql.org/projects/pgadmin4/issues/new

Definitely it's not all about money and I like your statement "I've paid
dearly with blood, sweat, and tears". Please think about the same as the
developer's perspective who are working hard. We have very few people
working on it with a single QA person.

I have a few questions here:

   - Does it happen ever that you have logged the issue and it has not been
   fixed or rejected(without any proper reason)?
   - If it happens have you update the RM so that we came to know about the
   priority of the issue.

In my last email, I have explained the reason for this *weird* bug which is
reproducible only on Windows. I'm surprised just for one extra click on the
"New pgAdmin window" we are into the very long discussion :)


-- 
*Thanks & Regards*
*Akshay Joshi*
*pgAdmin Hacker | Sr. Software Architect*
*EDB Postgres *

*Mobile: +91 976-788-8246*

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[tutiluren]

>
> You’re an ass!
>

Great argument. I'm won over. It's clear that you're a very intelligent and 
mature person who doesn't make yourself look incredibly stupid at all. So 
short, yet so powerful. Your reply has profoundly changed my entire worldview...

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[tutiluren]

> You should stop complaining. 
>

Why? Why would I stop complaining if something is wrong? That's when you are 
*supposed* to complain. Just because something doesn't cost money doesn't mean 
it's free. I've paid dearly with blood, sweat and tears. Maybe you consider 
your time and energy to be worthless, but I don't. In fact, it's far more 
valuable to me than money. I just don't *have* any money.

I'm really trying to not sound rude, and I often feel bad when I later read 
replies, but I apparently just can't help it. I *do* feel that they "owe" me a 
basic stable/sensible PG management software, in some philosophical sense. Not 
everything is about money. This mentality must end. It's ruined this world.

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[cgerard999]

Hi Rob,
I have the same bad experience as you with PgAdmin4. We are also using pgAdmin3 
so far and I was very excited to test the new version. 
Alas, I have so many issues that, if I had tested the 2 versions separately, I 
would have said that the old one is v4. 
Among the issues I got, keyboard shortcuts don’t work, I am not allowed to 
cancel my own queries, object refresh is damn slow, I get unexpected errors 
when visualizing a table, I can’t use Firefox since the Key is always changing 
for some reason ...
It’s amazing to see these discrepancies on basic functions whereas many 
advanced bugs seem to be worked and fixed. 
I also hate having to use the browser instead of a standalone app. I lose 
everything when I need to close my browser. 
Personal preferences. 
I am stuck on postgresql 8, which certainly doesn’t help. 
But they are right, they owe us absolutely nothing since we don’t pay them. 
They don’t even have to provide you alternatives. 
You should stop complaining. 
In my company’s environment, pgAdmin4,is not usable. 
We will continue to use  pgAdmin3, and I am thinking about developing a GUI for 
basic stuff (run query, export results, explain plan, display tables details 
etc) which is 99% of our activities. 
Python has some very good libraries for that. If you have a good set of 
developers, it might make sense. 
You could easily do some nice enhancements like exporting as excel with 3 lines 
of code, automating stuff etc. 
On windows, i have tested a few free alternatives but found nothing 
significantly better than pgAdmin3  
On Mac, some folks are using Postico. 
Their Windows version is unfortunately not usable. 

Sent from my mobile phone

> Le 21 août 2020 à 14:50, Rob Richardson  a écrit :
> 
> 
> My company relies on PostgreSQL and pgAdmin, as do thousands of other 
> companies, I'm sure.  Since most of our customers have been with us for a 
> long time and have stable installations, we have not been upgrading them to 
> the latest PostgreSQL version, and therefore, most of my experience has been 
> with pgAdmin III.  Nonetheless, I have been less than impressed with it.  It 
> freezes or disables commands at random times.  Not enough to prevent me from 
> working, but enough to make me think that the development process has not 
> been rigorous enough.
> 
> Eventually, I am sure that we will be migrating to modern versions of 
> PostgreSQL and therefore to pgAdmin 4.  I've glanced at it.  My initial, 
> uneducated impression is that changes were made from pgAdmin III for little 
> reason other than change itself.  I would have much preferred to see it keep 
> the same UI rather than moving to a browser.
> 
> But because PostgreSQL is such a successful database platform, used by 
> thousands upon thousands of mission-critical applications, it is incumbent on 
> the developer community to ensure that its administration tool works well, 
> and that upgrades do not break existing features.  If, as you say, we should 
> not count on the developers of pgAdmin 4 to ensure that upgrades do not break 
> existing features, then please suggest a professionally developed, 
> professionally supported alternative that we can pay for and get the quality 
> assurance that we, as professional developers and users, should expect.
> 
> Rob Richardson
> 
> On Friday, August 21, 2020, 06:51:29 AM EDT, Stephen Knox 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Gosh, you're right, this does sound very rude.
> 
> I'm not sure where to start with this and I'm a user, not a developer of the 
> software, so shouldn't be taking this too personally.
> 
> You seem to have misread the licence of the software: 
> https://github.com/postgres/pgadmin4/blob/master/LICENSE.
> 
> As this is open source software, no one is guaranteeing you anything (why 
> should they, you didn't pay for it, right?). What they are guaranteeing you 
> is that the code is open for you to view and change if you so desire (given 
> certain conditions). There is a likelihood that other people will come and 
> fix and bugs, create new features, but that is not a given, nor should it be.
> 
> If it is really "mission-critical software" then sitting around ranting in a 
> mailing list is not going to help you. If you are experiencing these issues 
> (personally I have had very few issues with the software, so can't help you 
> there). You need to do one of:
> 
> - Ask politely if anyone can help, file bugs properly on the bug tracker by 
> stating your system environment, steps to reproduce etc. Note, this email 
> does not meet the politeness criterion
> - Obtain the skills yourself to fix your own issues, and ideally contribute 
> those back to the project
> - Pay someone as a one off to fix the bugs you are experiencing or an ongoing 
> maintenance-type contract
> 
> I'm afraid your message just comes off as entitled, uninformed, and yes, rude.
> 
> Stephen Knox
> 
> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:
> pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Jack Royal-Gordon]

Hi Bob,

pgAdmin III is a TOTALLY DIFFERENT piece of software than pgAdmin 4. I used III 
for a number of years. I was never thrilled with it, but it did what I needed 
for me. For example, if I lost my connection to the server either voluntarily 
or because I closed my laptop, I could not allow the program to reconnect — I 
had to terminate the command I was trying, close the window and reopen it, else 
the program would bomb. pgAdmin IV at least does recover quite well from this 
situation.

pgAdmin 4 is a re-implementation of much of the functionality of pgAdmin III, 
but in a browser environment rather than a standalone program. It runs a server 
or daemon in the background on your machine to maintain a connection to the 
database and feed information to your browser window. Some people like the 
browser-based implementation, others do not. But it would be a mistake to judge 
pgAdmin 4 by your experience with pgAdmin III.

Jack

> On Aug 21, 2020, at 5:50 AM, Rob Richardson  wrote:
> 
> My company relies on PostgreSQL and pgAdmin, as do thousands of other 
> companies, I'm sure.  Since most of our customers have been with us for a 
> long time and have stable installations, we have not been upgrading them to 
> the latest PostgreSQL version, and therefore, most of my experience has been 
> with pgAdmin III.  Nonetheless, I have been less than impressed with it.  It 
> freezes or disables commands at random times.  Not enough to prevent me from 
> working, but enough to make me think that the development process has not 
> been rigorous enough.
> 
> Eventually, I am sure that we will be migrating to modern versions of 
> PostgreSQL and therefore to pgAdmin 4.  I've glanced at it.  My initial, 
> uneducated impression is that changes were made from pgAdmin III for little 
> reason other than change itself.  I would have much preferred to see it keep 
> the same UI rather than moving to a browser.
> 
> But because PostgreSQL is such a successful database platform, used by 
> thousands upon thousands of mission-critical applications, it is incumbent on 
> the developer community to ensure that its administration tool works well, 
> and that upgrades do not break existing features.  If, as you say, we should 
> not count on the developers of pgAdmin 4 to ensure that upgrades do not break 
> existing features, then please suggest a professionally developed, 
> professionally supported alternative that we can pay for and get the quality 
> assurance that we, as professional developers and users, should expect.
> 
> Rob Richardson
> 
> On Friday, August 21, 2020, 06:51:29 AM EDT, Stephen Knox 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Gosh, you're right, this does sound very rude.
> 
> I'm not sure where to start with this and I'm a user, not a developer of the 
> software, so shouldn't be taking this too personally.
> 
> You seem to have misread the licence of the software: 
> https://github.com/postgres/pgadmin4/blob/master/LICENSE 
> .
> 
> As this is open source software, no one is guaranteeing you anything (why 
> should they, you didn't pay for it, right?). What they are guaranteeing you 
> is that the code is open for you to view and change if you so desire (given 
> certain conditions). There is a likelihood that other people will come and 
> fix and bugs, create new features, but that is not a given, nor should it be.
> 
> If it is really "mission-critical software" then sitting around ranting in a 
> mailing list is not going to help you. If you are experiencing these issues 
> (personally I have had very few issues with the software, so can't help you 
> there). You need to do one of:
> 
> - Ask politely if anyone can help, file bugs properly on the bug tracker by 
> stating your system environment, steps to reproduce etc. Note, this email 
> does not meet the politeness criterion
> - Obtain the skills yourself to fix your own issues, and ideally contribute 
> those back to the project
> - Pay someone as a one off to fix the bugs you are experiencing or an ongoing 
> maintenance-type contract
> 
> I'm afraid your message just comes off as entitled, uninformed, and yes, rude.
> 
> Stephen Knox
> 
> On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  > wrote:
> pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After being harassed to upgrade 
> to the latest version, pgAdmin has stopped opening itself properly.
> 
> It no longer opens in the correct Pale Moon profile. It now opens in the 
> *default* profile, which completely breaks everything. I've previously tried 
> to explain how important it is for pgAdmin to have its own dedicated 
> GUI/"webview", so I'm not going to go into details about why this is so 
> important here. It seems to fall on deaf ears either way.
> 
> 

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Stephen Knox]

https://www.postgresql.org/support/professional_support/

I don't think any software developer sets out for change for change's sake.
If I recall the reasons for the change to a web based system were the
larger number of developers who can code in javascript (which is hardly
debatable).

It's incumbent upon the person using any software to ensure that they can
either maintain it themselves, are happy with the general direction and for
others to lead, or can find someone and afford to pay them to maintain
their interests on their behalf. In this way open source is no different
from commercial software, the difference with FOSS is that the first two
are options and you are not reliant on any one entity. Leaving aside any
TCO issues. Or you can fork the project and take it in a complety different
direction if you're not happy with the direction. The fact that you haven't
suggests you don't care enough to do so.

On Fri, 21 Aug 2020, 13:50 Rob Richardson, 

 please suggest a professionally developed, professionally supported
alternative that we can pay for and get the quality assurance that we, as
professional developers and users, should expect.

https://www.postgresql.org/support/professional_support/

>
>

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Khushboo Vashi]

Hi,

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 3:53 PM  wrote:

> pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After being harassed to
> upgrade to the latest version, pgAdmin has stopped opening itself properly.
>
> It no longer opens in the correct Pale Moon profile. It now opens in the
> *default* profile, which completely breaks everything. I've previously
> tried to explain how important it is for pgAdmin to have its own dedicated
> GUI/"webview", so I'm not going to go into details about why this is so
> important here. It seems to fall on deaf ears either way.
>
> My `Browser Command` is:
>
> "C:\Program Files\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe" -p "pgAdmin" --no-remote "%URL%"
>
> In other words, identical to v4.24 and every version before that. Yet it
> now suddenly opens in the default profile, apparently ignoring my command
> entirely. I also tried restarting the entire machine to make sure it wasn't
> some weird temporary glitch.
>
> If I run this in Windows, it opens the right profile, so it's not my
> browser at fault:
>
> "C:\Program Files\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe" -p "pgAdmin" --no-remote
> "about:config"
>
>
I have tested pgAdmin 4 v4.25 on MacOS with Firefox browser and it is
working fine.
My command:  "/Applications/Firefox.app/Contents/MacOS/firefox" "%URL%" -p
testprofile

Is there no quality assurance for this program? I have never encountered
> any software in my life which breaks as frequently as this... which says a
> lot.
>
> If I go to the notification icon of pgAdmin, right click it and click "New
> pgAdmin window", it opens in the right profile, as it's supposed to. So
> clearly it's *able* to do it, somehow, but only in this weird way. It would
> mean many clicks each time I want to open pgAdmin and doesn't address the
> actual problem.
>
> In desperation, I even tried to make a completely new Pale Moon shortcut:
>
> "C:\Program Files\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe" -p "pgAdmin" --no-remote "
> http://127.0.0.1:49707/browser/;
>
> But then it just says:
>
> > Unauthorized
> > The server could not verify that you are authorized to access the URL
> requested. You either supplied the wrong credentials (e.g. a bad password),
> or your browser doesn't understand how to supply the credentials required.
>
> I have no idea how this is even technically possible, but v4.25 clearly
> has broken *something*.
>
> If this sounds "rude", it's because I feel horribly insulted as a user
> when this mission-critical software (because it *is* mission-critical)
> keeps breaking in weird ways. I've plowed down countless hours of my life
> just working around bugs and "features" added to pgAdmin 4. I feel like I'm
> *fighting against* it rather than using a great tool. I'm almost at the
> point where I'm going to make my own database manager, since pgAdmin 4 is
> not just very slow and glitchy, but downright *broken* now.
>
> And how do I turn off that nag screen which constantly keeps pestering me
> to "upgrade" to the new version, which is very likely to break everything?
> I want to disable that message so I never have to see it and never have to
> get another broken pgAdmin version on my system ever again. I would go
> through this Hell at the most once a year or something.
>
>
To disable the upgrade notification set UPGRADE_CHECK_ENABLED = False. Please
refer https://www.pgadmin.org/docs/pgadmin4/4.25/config_py.html to overide
the default settings.
Also, you can log the bug/feature request @
https://redmine.postgresql.org/projects/pgadmin4

Thanks,
Khushboo

> It feels like I'm one some kind of "bleeding edge" branch rather than the
> stable/production one. Please consider testing your software before
> releasing it.
>
> I truly don't understand how you can keep doing this to your users. Do you
> hate us? There are some really good ideas and neat features inside this
> program, but it's hidden behind all these layers of madness which ruins the
> entire experience and cripples the user when they need it the most.
>
> I could very well never even have found the work-around. Most users
> probably would not have tried half of what I've tried to get this to work.
>

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Anthony DeBarros]

Hello.

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 6:23 AM  wrote:

> pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After being harassed to
> upgrade to the latest version, pgAdmin has stopped opening itself properly.
>

Snip.

Your experience is vastly different than mine. I use pgadmin 4 every day.
It has only improved by leaps and bounds since initial release. If I see an
opportunity for improvement, I submit a feature request in Redmine. More
often than not, my request eventually gets acted on or, if not, declined
with a good reason.

I lurk here daily because it's fun watching a well-run dev team work in
predictable, rapid cycles. Bugs get handled.

Your use is an edge case for a browser that has barely any market share.
Fine if you want to run life that way, but don't expect smooth sailing.



Your situation is an edge case,

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Rob Richardson]

 My company relies on PostgreSQL and pgAdmin, as do thousands of other 
companies, I'm sure.  Since most of our customers have been with us for a long 
time and have stable installations, we have not been upgrading them to the 
latest PostgreSQL version, and therefore, most of my experience has been with 
pgAdmin III.  Nonetheless, I have been less than impressed with it.  It freezes 
or disables commands at random times.  Not enough to prevent me from working, 
but enough to make me think that the development process has not been rigorous 
enough.
Eventually, I am sure that we will be migrating to modern versions of 
PostgreSQL and therefore to pgAdmin 4.  I've glanced at it.  My initial, 
uneducated impression is that changes were made from pgAdmin III for little 
reason other than change itself.  I would have much preferred to see it keep 
the same UI rather than moving to a browser.
But because PostgreSQL is such a successful database platform, used by 
thousands upon thousands of mission-critical applications, it is incumbent on 
the developer community to ensure that its administration tool works well, and 
that upgrades do not break existing features.  If, as you say, we should not 
count on the developers of pgAdmin 4 to ensure that upgrades do not break 
existing features, then please suggest a professionally developed, 
professionally supported alternative that we can pay for and get the quality 
assurance that we, as professional developers and users, should expect.
Rob Richardson
On Friday, August 21, 2020, 06:51:29 AM EDT, Stephen Knox 
 wrote:  
 
 Gosh, you're right, this does sound very rude.
I'm not sure where to start with this and I'm a user, not a developer of the 
software, so shouldn't be taking this too personally.
You seem to have misread the licence of the software: 
https://github.com/postgres/pgadmin4/blob/master/LICENSE.
As this is open source software, no one is guaranteeing you anything (why 
should they, you didn't pay for it, right?). What they are guaranteeing you is 
that the code is open for you to view and change if you so desire (given 
certain conditions). There is a likelihood that other people will come and fix 
and bugs, create new features, but that is not a given, nor should it be.
If it is really "mission-critical software" then sitting around ranting in a 
mailing list is not going to help you. If you are experiencing these issues 
(personally I have had very few issues with the software, so can't help you 
there). You need to do one of:
- Ask politely if anyone can help, file bugs properly on the bug tracker by 
stating your system environment, steps to reproduce etc. Note, this email does 
not meet the politeness criterion- Obtain the skills yourself to fix your own 
issues, and ideally contribute those back to the project- Pay someone as a one 
off to fix the bugs you are experiencing or an ongoing maintenance-type contract
I'm afraid your message just comes off as entitled, uninformed, and yes, rude.
Stephen Knox
On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:

 pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After being harassed to upgrade 
to the latest version, pgAdmin has stopped opening itself properly.

It no longer opens in the correct Pale Moon profile. It now opens in the 
*default* profile, which completely breaks everything. I've previously tried to 
explain how important it is for pgAdmin to have its own dedicated 
GUI/"webview", so I'm not going to go into details about why this is so 
important here. It seems to fall on deaf ears either way.


 
  

Re: Critical bug: pgAdmin v4.25 has started ignoring my "Browser Command" which completely cripples me and makes me unable to manage my PostgreSQL database.

[Stephen Knox]

Gosh, you're right, this does sound very rude.

I'm not sure where to start with this and I'm a user, not a developer of
the software, so shouldn't be taking this too personally.

You seem to have misread the licence of the software:
https://github.com/postgres/pgadmin4/blob/master/LICENSE.

As this is open source software, no one is guaranteeing you anything (why
should they, you didn't pay for it, right?). What they are guaranteeing you
is that the code is open for you to view and change if you so desire (given
certain conditions). There is a likelihood that other people will come and
fix and bugs, create new features, but that is not a given, nor should it
be.

If it is really "mission-critical software" then sitting around ranting in
a mailing list is not going to help you. If you are experiencing these
issues (personally I have had very few issues with the software, so can't
help you there). You need to do one of:

- Ask politely if anyone can help, file bugs properly on the bug tracker by
stating your system environment, steps to reproduce etc. Note, this email
does not meet the politeness criterion
- Obtain the skills yourself to fix your own issues, and ideally contribute
those back to the project
- Pay someone as a one off to fix the bugs you are experiencing or an
ongoing maintenance-type contract

I'm afraid your message just comes off as entitled, uninformed, and yes,
rude.

Stephen Knox

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 11:23 AM  wrote:

> pgAdmin v4.25 has yet again broken something. After being harassed to
> upgrade to the latest version, pgAdmin has stopped opening itself properly.
>
> It no longer opens in the correct Pale Moon profile. It now opens in the
> *default* profile, which completely breaks everything. I've previously
> tried to explain how important it is for pgAdmin to have its own dedicated
> GUI/"webview", so I'm not going to go into details about why this is so
> important here. It seems to fall on deaf ears either way.
>
>
>