Re: [PLUG] Jerky Mouse

[John Jason Jordan]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 19:14:10 -0700
King Beowulf  dijo:

>On 10/29/18 6:35 PM, John Jason Jordan wrote:
>> On Fri, 28 Sep 2018 10:31:47 -0700
>> Jason Barnett  dijo:
>>   
>>> In my experience, this type of problem has always been either a low
>>> battery in the mouse, or RF interference.
>>> Try a wired mouse. If it still jerks then it is a computer/software
>>> issue, if it works fine then it is likely an RF issue.  

>> At this point it just has to be an RF problem. Unfortunately, I do
>> not have a wired mouse to test with, but I discovered something else
>> that sort of proves that it is RF interference: Both mice are
>> Logitech M185 mice Part# 8100C5234, so I just turned off the one
>> connected to the laptop, et voilà! The mouse connected to the
>> desktop started working perfectly.

>Did you just turn off the laptop mouse or also unplug the laptop
>transceiver? This sounds like the desktop transceiver is connecting to
>the laptop mouse as well as the desktop mouse.

I don't know what is connecting to what, but you led me to what I think
will ultimately be the solution.

>I can't tell from the Logitech M185 product page if the nano
>transceiver is one of the 'unified' types.  Does is have an orange
>square pattern on the transceiver?
>
>Options:
>1. If unified, see if you can find ltunify for your distro
>https://lekensteyn.nl/logitech-unifying.html#ltunify
>
>This may allow setting up the transceivers so that they only "see" one
>particular mouse.
>
>2. If not, you have 2 transceivers sending on the same 2.4GHz band.
>One of the devices has to go. Try a different mouse make/model, or go
>wired for the desktop
>
>3. Build a small Faraday cage for the laptop.  Unfortunately this is
>also block network wifi (a security feature!).

OK, first no Faraday cage. That would just interfere too much with my
pursuit of karma. :)

Second, the M185 receiver does not have an orange square pattern on its
transceiver. 

Third, I looked for ltunify, but the link above took me to a page with
instructions for installing from source, and glancing through them I
concluded that it was doubtful that it could be done, at least not
easily. But that led me to fire up Synaptic and search on 'Logitech,'
which turned up a couple of possibilities: logitech-applet and solaar.
The former can only change the resolution from the default 400cpi to
800cpi. But Solaar is for pairing and unpairing. 

I was on the laptop when I did this, so I installed Solaar and launched
it. It has a very minimal GUI display, and when I say 'minimal' I mean
it displayed nothing. Eventually I figured out that the display was
empty because it failed to find the M185 attached to the laptop. This
did not surprise me because the M185 transceiver lacked the orange
rectangle, and because I paid $10 for it at Wally World. Ya gets what
ya pays for, I guess. :(

So then I installed Solaar on the desktop, and got the same results.
But I have a couple other wireless USB mice around here, so I grabbed
one - an M325, whose transceiver has the orange rectangle - plugged it
in, and there it was in the Solaar display. And, while it appears in
the Solaar display on the desktop, it does not appear in the Solaar
display on the desktop.

On the desktop I could use Solaar to unpair the mouse, but that would
surely deactivate it, so that is not a good idea. A better idea would
be to buy a replacement for the M185 still in use on the laptop, one
whose transceiver has the orange rectangle. 

Thanks for pointing me in the direction to a solution. :)
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Re: [PLUG] Jerky Mouse

[tim]

Quoting King Beowulf :


On 10/29/18 6:35 PM, John Jason Jordan wrote:

On Fri, 28 Sep 2018 10:31:47 -0700
Jason Barnett  dijo:


In my experience, this type of problem has always been either a low
battery in the mouse, or RF interference.
Try a wired mouse. If it still jerks then it is a computer/software
issue, if it works fine then it is likely an RF issue.



...


At this point it just has to be an RF problem. Unfortunately, I do not
have a wired mouse to test with, but I discovered something else that
sort of proves that it is RF interference: Both mice are Logitech M185
mice Part# 8100C5234, so I just turned off the one connected to the
laptop, et voilà! The mouse connected to the desktop started working
perfectly.

At least I have a temporary workaround, but now I need to figure out a
permanent solution. I already tried physically moving them, but
both mice need to be at hand while I am at my desk, so options are
limited and I already tried moving the receivers as far as I could
without success. Any other suggestions?


Did you just turn off the laptop mouse or also unplug the laptop
transceiver? This sounds like the desktop transceiver is connecting to
the laptop mouse as well as the desktop mouse.

I can't tell from the Logitech M185 product page if the nano transceiver
is one of the 'unified' types.  Does is have an orange square pattern on
the transceiver?

Options:
1. If unified, see if you can find ltunify for your distro
https://lekensteyn.nl/logitech-unifying.html#ltunify

This may allow setting up the transceivers so that they only "see" one
particular mouse.

2. If not, you have 2 transceivers sending on the same 2.4GHz band.  One
of the devices has to go. Try a different mouse make/model, or go wired
for the desktop

3. Build a small Faraday cage for the laptop.  Unfortunately this is
also block network wifi (a security feature!).

-Ed


I know that this comment is the essence of thread drift, but you need  
to be careful with your titles.  I've spent the evening being  
distracted of thoughts of a mouse built out of thin sheets of dried,  
smoked beef.




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Re: [PLUG] Online copies of textinfo content available?

[King Beowulf]

On 10/28/18 6:09 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 10/27/2018 02:29 PM, King Beowulf wrote:
>> On 10/26/18 8:48 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>> [snip]
>> Also check your local drive.  Depending on how XYZ was packaged to
>> install onto you linux disribution, you should find documentation under
>>
>> /usr/doc/XYZ
> 
> Such path(s) do not exist on my machine.

Ack. Another reason I do not use your distro.  No offense. There are
usually either HTML or text or both documenation files shipped with
source archives. A binary packager that just tosses them...

> 
> Following nested Gnu links suggests there exists something referred to
> as "INFOPATH" *BUT* no hint how to retrieve it. < *ARGH* >
> 
> 

if 'echo $INFOPATH' is empty, ah well, the default path is then used.

All the documentation INFO files are usually here:

/usr/share/info

which is a usually a symlink to

/usr/info.

You could write a shell script to dump them all as plain text to a fat32
(vfat) formatted USB drive and then read them on any PC device.

If the infopage you want is not there because the application package
was not installed, well, then you need to read the documentation on the
developer web site in whatever format they decide to provide.

-Ed




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Re: [PLUG] Specifying numeric order to sort

[Russell Senior]

>I want to sort the following file in reverse numeric order (highest number
> first, sequentially decreasing to lowest number). I've tried specifying -g,
> -n, and -h for the numeric sort order and none seem to work for me.

I want to take this opportunity to note that I am personally
responsible for the -g option to GNU sort. It is extra slow, but once
upon a time in the early 1990s I needed it, and I collaborated on the
patch that was eventually applied. That's all I wanted to say.
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Re: [PLUG] Introduction - from Niagara Falls NY

[J. Hart]

My apologies for the delay in replying.  I have just arrived in Portland 
from the wilds of the Far East beyond the edge of the known world.   I 
am staying in the Paramount Hotel in room 810.  I will be in attendance 
at the meeting on Nov 1.


I haven't had time yet to prepare a formal talk.  It's been a busy few 
weekw so far.  Besides tinkering with a roomful of computers, I also 
raise carnivorous plants for some odd reason, and have somehow become 
responsible for caring for the carnivorous plant collection at the big 
botanical garden in Buffalo NY (buffalogardens.com - huge greenhouses).  
It's the beginning of dormancy season for many of the North American 
species, and that's a bit busy both in the greenhouses and at home.


I'd be happy to do a brief introduction and am prepared to engage in 
informal discussions about what I've been up to. (Will there be any law 
enforcement present ?)


I'll try and see if I can do better than that.  If you have any 
questions, please feel free to call me at the hotel or 716-622-2070


On 10/29/2018 12:48 PM, Michael Dexter wrote:


Hey,

Are you willing to give a talk?

Thanks!



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Re: [PLUG] Jerky Mouse

[King Beowulf]

On 10/29/18 6:35 PM, John Jason Jordan wrote:
> On Fri, 28 Sep 2018 10:31:47 -0700
> Jason Barnett  dijo:
> 
>> In my experience, this type of problem has always been either a low
>> battery in the mouse, or RF interference.
>> Try a wired mouse. If it still jerks then it is a computer/software
>> issue, if it works fine then it is likely an RF issue.
> 
...
> 
> At this point it just has to be an RF problem. Unfortunately, I do not
> have a wired mouse to test with, but I discovered something else that
> sort of proves that it is RF interference: Both mice are Logitech M185
> mice Part# 8100C5234, so I just turned off the one connected to the
> laptop, et voilà! The mouse connected to the desktop started working
> perfectly.
> 
> At least I have a temporary workaround, but now I need to figure out a
> permanent solution. I already tried physically moving them, but
> both mice need to be at hand while I am at my desk, so options are
> limited and I already tried moving the receivers as far as I could
> without success. Any other suggestions?

Did you just turn off the laptop mouse or also unplug the laptop
transceiver? This sounds like the desktop transceiver is connecting to
the laptop mouse as well as the desktop mouse.

I can't tell from the Logitech M185 product page if the nano transceiver
is one of the 'unified' types.  Does is have an orange square pattern on
the transceiver?

Options:
1. If unified, see if you can find ltunify for your distro
https://lekensteyn.nl/logitech-unifying.html#ltunify

This may allow setting up the transceivers so that they only "see" one
particular mouse.

2. If not, you have 2 transceivers sending on the same 2.4GHz band.  One
of the devices has to go. Try a different mouse make/model, or go wired
for the desktop

3. Build a small Faraday cage for the laptop.  Unfortunately this is
also block network wifi (a security feature!).

-Ed




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Re: [PLUG] Jerky Mouse

[John Jason Jordan]

On Fri, 28 Sep 2018 10:31:47 -0700
Jason Barnett  dijo:

>In my experience, this type of problem has always been either a low
>battery in the mouse, or RF interference.
>Try a wired mouse. If it still jerks then it is a computer/software
>issue, if it works fine then it is likely an RF issue.

The problem continues, and it is very exasperating. 

I have the same exact make/model mouse for my laptop which is right
next to the desktop. It works flawlessly. I have swapped the mice and
whichever one is connected to the laptop works perfectly and the one
connected to the desktop continues its jerky behavior.

At this point it just has to be an RF problem. Unfortunately, I do not
have a wired mouse to test with, but I discovered something else that
sort of proves that it is RF interference: Both mice are Logitech M185
mice Part# 8100C5234, so I just turned off the one connected to the
laptop, et voilà! The mouse connected to the desktop started working
perfectly.

At least I have a temporary workaround, but now I need to figure out a
permanent solution. I already tried physically moving them, but
both mice need to be at hand while I am at my desk, so options are
limited and I already tried moving the receivers as far as I could
without success. Any other suggestions?
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Re: [PLUG] Specifying numeric order to sort [RESOLVED]

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, David Fleck wrote:


I think you're missing the '-t' option.  Try
sort -n -r -t '|' -k 3 number-samples-per-site.txt -o sorted


  Thanks, David. I looked at the -t option, saw the spaces between columns
and ignored the pipe as the separator.

Best regards,

Rich
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Re: [PLUG] Resolved: Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Ben Koenig]

It's a different way of installing the same thing

The second option further down is adding it to your repository so that it
doesn't break apt.

Remember why I suggested this - You want to be able to maintain the ability
to install system updates.

If you install a third party deb package manually, you will probably end up
losing the ability to install other packages and updates from the repos.
Emphasis on probably, it depends on how far your distro has deviated from
the version Oracle supports.

Installing the repo makes apt aware of it, which means you will avoid lots
of stupid errors when checking for updates.


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 4:21 PM Dick Steffens  wrote:

> On 10/29/18 4:17 PM, Ben Koenig wrote:
> > Scroll down to where it says "Debian-based distributions"
>
> Okay. I see that. But what tells me it's the better way than the one
> above that says Ubuntu 18.04 / Debian 10  AMD64?
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Dick Steffens
>
>
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Ben Koenig]

Alas, my attempts to point out reality have once again been thwarted by
hype and lofty opinions.

I'll just put on my Big Blue Hat and continue watching as Linux continues
stomping third-world platforms into the dirt. If the Digital Cinema
industry throws a tantrum over this I'll find out soon enough.

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 4:26 PM Rich Shepard 
wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, Ken Stephens wrote:
>
> > Check out Cringely's article on IBM and Red Hat.
> > https://www.cringely.com/
>
>In the 1980s I was told by IBMers that the company acknowledged it was
> not
> a technology company but a service company. Because IBM put engineers at
> mainframe client sites to oversee the big iron they gained new customers.
> Their technical staff knew the IMB hardware/software was behind what other
> vendors put out, but as Cringely explains, IBM was built on its sales force
> and that's what allowed it to survice.
>
>As an aside, I see the push for everyone to put all their data as
> drizzle
> in someone's cloud is a return to the centralized mainframe environment but
> much less secure. Feh!
>
> Rich
>
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Re: [PLUG] Specifying numeric order to sort

[David Fleck]

On Mon, 2018-10-29 at 15:51 -0700, Rich Shepard wrote:
> 
   The command 'sort -n -r -k 3 number-samples-per-site.txt -o sorted' is an
> example. And, the reverse option is ignored when I specify a numeric format.
> (Whether the -k option has a space before the 3 makes no difference here.)
> 
>I'm not seeing what I'm missing.

I think you're missing the '-t' option.  Try

sort -n -r -t '|' -k 3 number-samples-per-site.txt -o sorted

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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Tomas Kuchta]

If you are installing Oracle VirtualBox version. Do not forget to uninstall
the standard version before you start.


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 10:46 PM Dick Steffens  wrote:

> On 10/28/18 11:35 PM, Tomas Kuchta wrote:
> > That is 32bit CPU, correct?
>
> The laptop is 64 bit, and that's the version of Linux Mint I installed.
> I don't know about the version of VirtualBox in the repos.
>
> When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try
> getting the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that
> works. That's what I have on my desktop and it's working well.
>
> --
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>
> Dick Steffens
>
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, Ken Stephens wrote:


Check out Cringely's article on IBM and Red Hat.
https://www.cringely.com/


  In the 1980s I was told by IBMers that the company acknowledged it was not
a technology company but a service company. Because IBM put engineers at
mainframe client sites to oversee the big iron they gained new customers.
Their technical staff knew the IMB hardware/software was behind what other
vendors put out, but as Cringely explains, IBM was built on its sales force
and that's what allowed it to survice.

  As an aside, I see the push for everyone to put all their data as drizzle
in someone's cloud is a return to the centralized mainframe environment but
much less secure. Feh!

Rich

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Re: [PLUG] Resolved: Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/29/18 4:17 PM, Ben Koenig wrote:

Scroll down to where it says "Debian-based distributions"


Okay. I see that. But what tells me it's the better way than the one 
above that says Ubuntu 18.04 / Debian 10  AMD64?


--
Regards,

Dick Steffens


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Re: [PLUG] Resolved: Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/29/18 3:19 PM, Ben Koenig wrote:

Heads up, there have been a number of other people on this list that
installed virtualbox the way you just did. It results in dependency
problems down the road that can prevent security updates.

There are 2 methods listed on the VirtualBox website
1) Quick 'n Dirty
2) Correct and Clean


Can you point to both of those? I only see one at 
https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Linux_Downloads


--
Regards,

Dick Steffens

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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Ben Koenig]

The point of running a project with independent management is that
individuals can come and go.

Assuming the structure of the project, the organization that defines it
does not collapse, then people can take on tasks should Red Hat employees
stop contributing.

There is a difference between "running the system" and "hosting the
system". I would hope, given that both projects claim to stand on their own
feet that they are relying on Red Hat knowledge, not property.



On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 3:26 PM Larry Brigman 
wrote:

> Not 100% sure on that last comment as most of the people running the
> infrastructure/Build systems are Redhat Employees.
>
> On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 3:16 PM Ben Koenig  wrote:
>
> > FYI CentOS does not need the blessing of IBM any more than it already
> needs
> > the blessing of Red Hat. Here's some reading material you might find
> > interesting.
> > https://www.centos.org/about/
> > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/council/
> >
> > Change of management at Red Hat will likely have no serious impact on the
> > development of Fedora and CentOS.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 11:32 AM John Jason Jordan 
> wrote:
> >
> > > On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 10:49:48 -0700
> > > Richard England  dijo:
> > >
> > > >IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is
> > > >what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little
> > > >interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives
> > > >like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.
> > >
> > > My take is that Redhat started Fedora as a test bed. I used it for a
> > > couple of years before giving up on it. Yes, it's free, and in some
> ways
> > > a competitor to the bigger desktop providers like Mint and Ubuntu, but
> > > I couldn't put up with the constant, almost mandatory updates.
> > > Nevertheless,  while I bitched about having to update, I had to
> > > recognize that I knew the purpose of Fedora before I started using it -
> > > I got a free desktop in exchange for being Redhat's guinea pig. So, as
> > > long as Redhat needs a place to test new ideas, Fedora will probably
> > > continue.
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Ken Stephens]

Check out Cringely's article on IBM and Red Hat.

https://www.cringely.com/

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 3:26 PM Larry Brigman 
wrote:

> Not 100% sure on that last comment as most of the people running the
> infrastructure/Build systems are Redhat Employees.
>
> On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 3:16 PM Ben Koenig  wrote:
>
> > FYI CentOS does not need the blessing of IBM any more than it already
> needs
> > the blessing of Red Hat. Here's some reading material you might find
> > interesting.
> > https://www.centos.org/about/
> > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/council/
> >
> > Change of management at Red Hat will likely have no serious impact on the
> > development of Fedora and CentOS.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 11:32 AM John Jason Jordan 
> wrote:
> >
> > > On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 10:49:48 -0700
> > > Richard England  dijo:
> > >
> > > >IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is
> > > >what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little
> > > >interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives
> > > >like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.
> > >
> > > My take is that Redhat started Fedora as a test bed. I used it for a
> > > couple of years before giving up on it. Yes, it's free, and in some
> ways
> > > a competitor to the bigger desktop providers like Mint and Ubuntu, but
> > > I couldn't put up with the constant, almost mandatory updates.
> > > Nevertheless,  while I bitched about having to update, I had to
> > > recognize that I knew the purpose of Fedora before I started using it -
> > > I got a free desktop in exchange for being Redhat's guinea pig. So, as
> > > long as Redhat needs a place to test new ideas, Fedora will probably
> > > continue.
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[PLUG] Specifying numeric order to sort

[Rich Shepard]

  I want to sort the following file in reverse numeric order (highest number
first, sequentially decreasing to lowest number). I've tried specifying -g,
-n, and -h for the numeric sort order and none seem to work for me.

  The command 'sort -n -r -k 3 number-samples-per-site.txt -o sorted' is an
example. And, the reverse option is ignored when I specify a numeric format.
(Whether the -k option has a space before the 3 makes no difference here.)

  I'm not seeing what I'm missing.

---8<
 site_nbr |site_name| count 
--+-+---

 10625| Clackamas R. at Carver  |   
  1
 10483| Beaverton Creek/downstream of Tektronix |   
  1
 11757| South Yamhill R. upstream of Whiteson Landfill  |   
  1
 10486| Cedar Mill Creek at Hwy 26 (Cedar Mill) |   
  1
 11758| South Yamhill R. opposite side from Whiteson Landfill   |   
  1
 10351| Willamette R. at Adair water intake |   
  1
 11759| South Yamhill R. downstream of Whiteson Landfill|   
  1
 10468| Fanno Creek at Durham Station (Durham)  |   
  1
 10865| Deep Creek at Hwy 224 Bridge (Barton)   |   
  1
 10459| Tualatin R. at Hwy 210 (Scholls)|   
  1
 15431| 1670 Thornton Lake Place/Dick Berne |   
  1
 10360| Clackamas R. at Hwy 99E (Gladstone) |   
  1
 10340| Willamette R. at I-5 (Wilsonville)  |   
  1
 10335| Willamette R. at Staff Jennings Marina  |   
  1
 15417| 1436 Harder Lane/E. E. Eckart   |   
  2
 10350| Willamette R. at Albany (eastbound Hwy 20 bridge)   |   
  2
 15438| 451 NW Quarry Road/P. Vollstedt Pasture |   
  2
 15428| 960 NW ones/Dick Housden|   
  2
 10366| South Santiam R. Hwy 226 (Crabtree) |   
  2
 15415| 1434 Springhill Road/S. L. Dalesky  |   
  2
 10348| Willamette R. at Buena Vista Ferry  |   
  2
 15426| 825 NW Ridders/Geo. Bryson  |   
  2
 16679| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well 13B (L-10)|   
  2
 15418| 451 NW Quarry Road/Phyllis Vollstedt|   
  2
 15423| 710 E Thornton Lake Road/R.H. Mealey|   
  2
 15413| 724 S. Nebergall Loop/Bob Whitehead |   
  2
 10339| Willamette R. at Canby Ferry|   
  2
 15420| 146 NE Cloverdale/Tom Aasum |   
  2
 15424| 905 NE Springhill Road/Golf Club|   
  2
 10792| North Santiam R. at Greens Bridge   |   
  2
 10555| Willamette R. at Marion Street (Salem)  |   
  2
 10794| North Santiam at Mehama Bridge  |   
  2
 10347| Willamette R. at South R. Road (Independence)   |   
  2
 15419| 880 NE Cherry Lane/Tom Hughson  |   
  2
 15435| 171 Creswell Lane/im Moore  |   
  2
 15416| 1440 Shady Lane/Lynn Peters |   
  2
 16675| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well 9 (L-4)   |   
  3
 16704| New Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well L-13 (Monitoring Well -F) |   
  3
 16695| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well 12C (L-3) |   
  3
 16700| New Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well L-14 (Monitoring Well -E) |   
  3
 16680| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well 14 (L-6)  |   
  3
 10460| Tualatin R. at Farmington Road  |   
  3
 15784| Short Mountain Landfill Monitoring Well leachate lagoon |   
  4
 10777| South Santiam R. at Waterloo Bridge |   
  4
 10361| Molalla R. at Hwy 99E (Canby)   |   
  4
 16696| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well L-12  |   
  4
 16703| New Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well L-5 (Monitoring Well -A)  |   
  4
 16692| Woodburn Landfill Monitoring Well 25 (P-25) |   
  4
 10342| Willamette R. at Hwy 219 (new Newberg bridge)   |   
  4
 16705| Monitoring Well L-9 |   
  4
 14326| Brown's Island Landfill Monitoring Well 10B 

Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Larry Brigman]

Not 100% sure on that last comment as most of the people running the
infrastructure/Build systems are Redhat Employees.

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 3:16 PM Ben Koenig  wrote:

> FYI CentOS does not need the blessing of IBM any more than it already needs
> the blessing of Red Hat. Here's some reading material you might find
> interesting.
> https://www.centos.org/about/
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/council/
>
> Change of management at Red Hat will likely have no serious impact on the
> development of Fedora and CentOS.
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 11:32 AM John Jason Jordan  wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 10:49:48 -0700
> > Richard England  dijo:
> >
> > >IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is
> > >what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little
> > >interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives
> > >like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.
> >
> > My take is that Redhat started Fedora as a test bed. I used it for a
> > couple of years before giving up on it. Yes, it's free, and in some ways
> > a competitor to the bigger desktop providers like Mint and Ubuntu, but
> > I couldn't put up with the constant, almost mandatory updates.
> > Nevertheless,  while I bitched about having to update, I had to
> > recognize that I knew the purpose of Fedora before I started using it -
> > I got a free desktop in exchange for being Redhat's guinea pig. So, as
> > long as Redhat needs a place to test new ideas, Fedora will probably
> > continue.
> > ___
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> > PLUG@pdxlinux.org
> > http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug
> >
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[PLUG] THURSDAY: Meeting to be Announced

[Michael Dexter]

Hello all,

I am hoping our frequent virtual visitor from NY can give a talk given 
that they're passing through town.


Topic to be announced!

All the best,

Michael Dexter
PLUG Volunteer
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Re: [PLUG] Resolved: Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Ben Koenig]

Heads up, there have been a number of other people on this list that
installed virtualbox the way you just did. It results in dependency
problems down the road that can prevent security updates.

There are 2 methods listed on the VirtualBox website
1) Quick 'n Dirty
2) Correct and Clean

You went for option #1. Good luck ;-)


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 1:41 PM Dick Steffens  wrote:

> On 10/29/18 7:46 AM, Dick Steffens wrote:
>
> > When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try
> > getting the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that
> > works. That's what I have on my desktop and it's working well.
>
> I finished today's work early, so I had time to download:
>
> virualbox-5.2_5.2.20-125813-Ubuntu-bionic-amd64.deb
>
> from the Oracle website. It installed without complaint once I fully
> removed what was there with Synaptic. Then I successfully imported a
> .ova and it works fine.
>
> The only thing missing was an icon to launch VirtualBox, so I created
> one by right-clicking on the desktop, clicking on Create Launcher ...,
> and filling in the blanks. The command to start the VirtualBox GUI is
> virtualbox.
>
> With that done, I think I have everything I used to have on the laptop
> before the SSD installation. Now to give it a few days of testing under
> normal operating conditions.
>
> Thanks to all who offered advice, whether I took it or not. :-)
>
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Dick Steffens
>
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Ben Koenig]

FYI CentOS does not need the blessing of IBM any more than it already needs
the blessing of Red Hat. Here's some reading material you might find
interesting.
https://www.centos.org/about/
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/council/

Change of management at Red Hat will likely have no serious impact on the
development of Fedora and CentOS.


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 11:32 AM John Jason Jordan  wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 10:49:48 -0700
> Richard England  dijo:
>
> >IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is
> >what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little
> >interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives
> >like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.
>
> My take is that Redhat started Fedora as a test bed. I used it for a
> couple of years before giving up on it. Yes, it's free, and in some ways
> a competitor to the bigger desktop providers like Mint and Ubuntu, but
> I couldn't put up with the constant, almost mandatory updates.
> Nevertheless,  while I bitched about having to update, I had to
> recognize that I knew the purpose of Fedora before I started using it -
> I got a free desktop in exchange for being Redhat's guinea pig. So, as
> long as Redhat needs a place to test new ideas, Fedora will probably
> continue.
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[PLUG] Do you have an EFI partition on the hard drive (formatted GPT rather than DOS)?

[mitch Stanley]

Hi,  I believe so as I have not changed any settings.   ( I do not
understand completely the Hard Drive terminology).

Thanks , Mitch

Message: 7
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2018 08:15:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Shepard 
To: Portland Linux/Unix Group 
Subject: Re: [PLUG] More details on trying to Install Ubuntu 16.04
onto Lenovo Ideapad 330
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, mitch Stanley wrote:

> 5. Boot Mode is not Legacy but set at default on UFEI
> 6.Moved Boot Order from Windows Boot Manager to EFI DVD / CD ROM
> 7. Saved settings.

Mitch,

   Do you have an EFI partition on the hard drive (formatted GPT rather than
DOS)?

Rich
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[PLUG] Resolved: Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/29/18 7:46 AM, Dick Steffens wrote:

When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try 
getting the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that 
works. That's what I have on my desktop and it's working well.


I finished today's work early, so I had time to download:

virualbox-5.2_5.2.20-125813-Ubuntu-bionic-amd64.deb

from the Oracle website. It installed without complaint once I fully 
removed what was there with Synaptic. Then I successfully imported a 
.ova and it works fine.


The only thing missing was an icon to launch VirtualBox, so I created 
one by right-clicking on the desktop, clicking on Create Launcher ..., 
and filling in the blanks. The command to start the VirtualBox GUI is 
virtualbox.


With that done, I think I have everything I used to have on the laptop 
before the SSD installation. Now to give it a few days of testing under 
normal operating conditions.


Thanks to all who offered advice, whether I took it or not. :-)


--
Regards,

Dick Steffens

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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[John Jason Jordan]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 10:49:48 -0700
Richard England  dijo:

>IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is 
>what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little 
>interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives 
>like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.

My take is that Redhat started Fedora as a test bed. I used it for a
couple of years before giving up on it. Yes, it's free, and in some ways
a competitor to the bigger desktop providers like Mint and Ubuntu, but
I couldn't put up with the constant, almost mandatory updates.
Nevertheless,  while I bitched about having to update, I had to
recognize that I knew the purpose of Fedora before I started using it -
I got a free desktop in exchange for being Redhat's guinea pig. So, as
long as Redhat needs a place to test new ideas, Fedora will probably
continue.
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, Richard England wrote:


IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is
what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little
interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives like
Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.


  Perhaps Fedora and CentOS will be continued by a volunteer community if
corporate drops support. Like chromium and chrome.

Rich
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Bill Morita]

Good discussion on subject here:
https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-the-cloud-wars-forced-ibm-to-buy-red-hat-for-34-billion/?ftag=TRE-03-10aaa6b=20390513085982283125304917388969
-- Bill Morita
512-569-6387 (Cell)


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 8:56 AM  wrote:

> Apparently Redhat Software is now part of IBM. What does this mean for the
> Linux community?
>
>  -- Michael C. Robinson
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Richard England]

IBM will probably continue their Linux efforts. The better question is 
what will they do with Fedora and the desktop. IBM may have little 
interest in the desktop and their interest in non-revenue initiatives 
like Fedora and CentOS are questionable, as well.


[Have you used their documentation and/or web sites?  I have. It does 
not bode well if those are an indication.]


~~R

On 10/29/18 8:56 AM, mich...@robinson-west.com wrote:

Apparently Redhat Software is now part of IBM. What does this mean for the 
Linux community?

  -- Michael C. Robinson
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, Dick Steffens wrote:


Probably not much. IBM has long been involved in Linux.


  Such as Wietse Venema's writing and continued upgrading/maintaining of
postfix while working at IBM.

Rich
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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/29/18 8:56 AM, mich...@robinson-west.com wrote:

Apparently Redhat Software is now part of IBM. What does this mean for the 
Linux community?


Probably not much. IBM has long been involved in Linux.

And while it's a press release, and so taken with the appropriate grain 
of salt, see:


https://www.redhat.com/en/about/press-releases/ibm-acquire-red-hat-completely-changing-cloud-landscape-and-becoming-world%E2%80%99s-1-hybrid-cloud-provider

--
Regards,

Dick Steffens

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Re: [PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[Larry Brigman]

Not yet.  Still needs government approval.

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 8:56 AM  Apparently Redhat Software is now part of IBM. What does this mean for the
> Linux community?
>
>  -- Michael C. Robinson
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Re: [PLUG] Searching for work in Portland remotely...

[VY]

Have you tried these sites?

http://www.weworkremotely.com
https://www.upwork.com



On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 8:14 AM  wrote:

> October 29, 2018 9:30 AM, "Jason Bergstrom"  wrote:
>
> > The Mayo Clinic in Rochester has several jobs listed:
> >
> >
> https://jobs.mayoclinic.org/job-search/?br_keyword=_location=Rochester_category=IT+and+Enginee
> >
> ing_specialty=0_schedule=0_benefits=0_telework=0=1
> >
> > Jason,
> > ber...@bergie.net
>
> I've already applied at Mayo Clinic, getting in is nearly impossible.  IBM
> in the last decade or so as the second major employer here has cleared out
> almost completely.  The number of positions compared to the number of
> skilled applicants is highly tilted and not in my favor.  I wouldn't be six
> months unemployed if the job market were decent here.  Rochester
> has all the disadvantages of a city with none of the advantages like good
> public transit.  I miss Portland.
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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, Dick Steffens wrote:

When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try getting 
the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that works. That's 
what I have on my desktop and it's working well.


Dick,

  Don't write off KVM/qemu too quickly. See these threads:





HTH,

Rich
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[PLUG] IBM acquires Redhat

[michael]

Apparently Redhat Software is now part of IBM. What does this mean for the 
Linux community?

 -- Michael C. Robinson
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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/29/18 8:19 AM, Roderick Anderson wrote:

Dick,

I haven't followed this thread so I may be completely off base.

Depending on what you're trying to accomplish you might look at KVM or 
Wine.


Several HAMs and Linux users succeeded getting a Window only HAM radio 
logging program running on Linux.  I had tried several times before 
but ran into too many problems.  A little over a month ago using Linux 
Mint 19 we got the program running under Wine on both 64bit and 32bit 
processors.


The trick was installing Wind, Winetricks and wine32 on the 64bit 
Linux Mint system.  The Jet drivers were only 32bit.  It could also be 
that Wine had matured since my previous attempts a year or so ago.


I mention KVM because our Windows guru (well he makes his money 
working on Windows machines) used KVM to install Linux Mint 19 32bit 
on his Debian 64bit laptop.  I think he said you can do the same with 
Windows.


Thanks for your ideas.

My main reason to stay with VirtualBox is that I have a small handful of 
older Windows programs that I infrequently use. Some have no open source 
alternative. Others are ones that I learned years ago, and the learning 
curve was steep. Open source alternatives would also require a steep 
learning curve, and since I don't need them often, it's just easier to 
use the old familiar ones. I have these in a VirtualBox .ova file. So 
once I have VirtualBox installed, it's pretty easy to import the .ova.


--
Regards,

Dick Steffens


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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Roderick Anderson]

Dick,

I haven't followed this thread so I may be completely off base.

Depending on what you're trying to accomplish you might look at KVM or Wine.

Several HAMs and Linux users succeeded getting a Window only HAM radio 
logging program running on Linux.  I had tried several times before but 
ran into too many problems.  A little over a month ago using Linux Mint 
19 we got the program running under Wine on both 64bit and 32bit processors.


The trick was installing Wind, Winetricks and wine32 on the 64bit Linux 
Mint system.  The Jet drivers were only 32bit.  It could also be that 
Wine had matured since my previous attempts a year or so ago.


I mention KVM because our Windows guru (well he makes his money working 
on Windows machines) used KVM to install Linux Mint 19 32bit on his 
Debian 64bit laptop.  I think he said you can do the same with Windows.


73, \\||/
Rod - K7ZBE
--
On 10/29/18 7:46 AM, Dick Steffens wrote:

On 10/28/18 11:35 PM, Tomas Kuchta wrote:

That is 32bit CPU, correct?


The laptop is 64 bit, and that's the version of Linux Mint I installed. 
I don't know about the version of VirtualBox in the repos.


When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try 
getting the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that 
works. That's what I have on my desktop and it's working well.



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Re: [PLUG] More details on trying to Install Ubuntu 16.04 onto Lenovo Ideapad 330

[Rich Shepard]

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018, mitch Stanley wrote:


5. Boot Mode is not Legacy but set at default on UFEI
6.Moved Boot Order from Windows Boot Manager to EFI DVD / CD ROM
7. Saved settings.


Mitch,

  Do you have an EFI partition on the hard drive (formatted GPT rather than
DOS)?

Rich
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Re: [PLUG] Searching for work in Portland remotely...

[michael]

October 29, 2018 9:30 AM, "Jason Bergstrom"  wrote:

> The Mayo Clinic in Rochester has several jobs listed:
> 
> https://jobs.mayoclinic.org/job-search/?br_keyword=_location=Rochester_category=IT+and+Enginee
> ing_specialty=0_schedule=0_benefits=0_telework=0=1
> 
> Jason,
> ber...@bergie.net

I've already applied at Mayo Clinic, getting in is nearly impossible.  IBM in 
the last decade or so as the second major employer here has cleared out almost 
completely.  The number of positions compared to the number of skilled 
applicants is highly tilted and not in my favor.  I wouldn't be six months 
unemployed if the job market were decent here.  Rochester 
has all the disadvantages of a city with none of the advantages like good 
public transit.  I miss Portland.
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Re: [PLUG] Searching for work in Portland remotely...

[John Meissen]

If you're aware of this site, it might help:

http://portlandtech.org/

> I am a Portland State University graduate in computer science trapped in 
> Rochester, Minnesota without work.
> 
> I've been in this situation for six months now and am facing the end of 
> unemployment benefits.
> 
> Searching for work in Portland remotely, hard. Ironically, I live next to one 
> of the biggest IBM facilities in the world and it is a ghost town.
> 
> I know C and C++, I worked with Raspberry Pi's running Raspbian, I am wanting 
> to increase my certifiable skills in Linux, and I have exposure to more
> things than I am good at including Ansible, git, Python, Perl, bash, 
> etcetera. Studying for a test on Javascript, CSS3, and HTML5 Saturday.
> 
> Unfortunately, I was let go of from my job at Apex in under a year, worked 
> there for seven months. It was an impossible situation for me, code that was 
> engineered to not make sense to anyone else. That said, I got a framebuffer 
> system converted to an X Windows system and it displayed somewhat well. 
> Because of concurrency problems and hidden algorithms, I never got the system 
> working the way it should be. I'd love to work somewhere else in precision 
> manufacturing utilizing embedded Linux.
> 
> Meanwhile, I have been trying to convert a rack running a web site in 
> Scappoose to a hosted site at Eskimo North. Some success, but I don't 
> understand systemd well enough to make a stock CentOS 7 run a custom compiled 
> Apache and PHP. I really need professional training in CentOS/Redhat 
> Enterprise Linux to complement my Linux Professional Institute Level 1 
> certification. I've grown up on Redhat, but I don't understand it anymore.
> 
>  -- Michael C. Robinson
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[PLUG] More details on trying to Install Ubuntu 16.04 onto Lenovo Ideapad 330

[mitch Stanley]

Hi, Sorry for lack of specifics -

1. Windows 10 not installed

2. Selected F2 on BIOS for Laptop to boot from CD

3. Have not installed Windows 10 ( Plan to avoid Dual Boot )

4. Using Linux Format Magazine CD – Ubuntu 16.04

5. Boot Mode is not Legacy but set at default on UFEI

6.Moved Boot Order from Windows Boot Manager to EFI DVD / CD ROM

7. Saved settings.

8. System keeps returning to Original Boot order – Windows Boot Manager.

9. Initially, a Message was displayed - ? Exact wording but - System
prevented

unauthorized Disc to be loaded .

10. Now , System ignores boot order & defaults to loading Windows installer.





Message: 5
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2018 20:08:51 -0700
From: Nat Taylor 
To: "Portland Linux/Unix Group" 
Subject: Re: [PLUG] IdeaPad 330 - I'm having a difficult tome
installing  Ubuntu
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

More details would help solve the problem.
are you having problems with network connectivity?
at what point during the install process are you getting error messages?
what are they?
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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Dick Steffens]

On 10/28/18 11:35 PM, Tomas Kuchta wrote:

That is 32bit CPU, correct?


The laptop is 64 bit, and that's the version of Linux Mint I installed. 
I don't know about the version of VirtualBox in the repos.


When next I have time, which might not be until tomorrow, I'll try 
getting the version made for Ubuntu 18 from Oracle and see if that 
works. That's what I have on my desktop and it's working well.


--
Regards,

Dick Steffens

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Re: [PLUG] Searching for work in Portland remotely...

[Jason Bergstrom]

The Mayo Clinic in Rochester has several jobs listed:

https://jobs.mayoclinic.org/job-search/?br_keyword=_location=Rochester_category=IT+and+Engineering_specialty=0_schedule=0_benefits=0_telework=0=1

Jason,
ber...@bergie.net

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 12:45:40PM +, mich...@robinson-west.com wrote:
> I am a Portland State University graduate in computer science trapped in 
> Rochester, Minnesota without work.
> 
> I've been in this situation for six months now and am facing the end of 
> unemployment benefits.
> 
> Searching for work in Portland remotely, hard. Ironically, I live next to one 
> of the biggest IBM facilities in the world and it is a ghost town.
> 
> I know C and C++, I worked with Raspberry Pi's running Raspbian, I am wanting 
> to increase my certifiable skills in Linux, and I have exposure to more
> things than I am good at including Ansible, git, Python, Perl, bash, 
> etcetera. Studying for a test on Javascript, CSS3, and HTML5 Saturday.
> 
> Unfortunately, I was let go of from my job at Apex in under a year, worked 
> there for seven months. It was an impossible situation for me, code that was 
> engineered to not make sense to anyone else. That said, I got a framebuffer 
> system converted to an X Windows system and it displayed somewhat well. 
> Because of concurrency problems and hidden algorithms, I never got the system 
> working the way it should be. I'd love to work somewhere else in precision 
> manufacturing utilizing embedded Linux.
> 
> Meanwhile, I have been trying to convert a rack running a web site in 
> Scappoose to a hosted site at Eskimo North. Some success, but I don't 
> understand systemd well enough to make a stock CentOS 7 run a custom compiled 
> Apache and PHP. I really need professional training in CentOS/Redhat 
> Enterprise Linux to complement my Linux Professional Institute Level 1 
> certification. I've grown up on Redhat, but I don't understand it anymore.
> 
>  -- Michael C. Robinson
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[PLUG] Searching for work in Portland remotely...

[michael]

I am a Portland State University graduate in computer science trapped in 
Rochester, Minnesota without work.

I've been in this situation for six months now and am facing the end of 
unemployment benefits.

Searching for work in Portland remotely, hard. Ironically, I live next to one 
of the biggest IBM facilities in the world and it is a ghost town.

I know C and C++, I worked with Raspberry Pi's running Raspbian, I am wanting 
to increase my certifiable skills in Linux, and I have exposure to more
things than I am good at including Ansible, git, Python, Perl, bash, etcetera. 
Studying for a test on Javascript, CSS3, and HTML5 Saturday.

Unfortunately, I was let go of from my job at Apex in under a year, worked 
there for seven months. It was an impossible situation for me, code that was 
engineered to not make sense to anyone else. That said, I got a framebuffer 
system converted to an X Windows system and it displayed somewhat well. Because 
of concurrency problems and hidden algorithms, I never got the system working 
the way it should be. I'd love to work somewhere else in precision 
manufacturing utilizing embedded Linux.

Meanwhile, I have been trying to convert a rack running a web site in Scappoose 
to a hosted site at Eskimo North. Some success, but I don't understand systemd 
well enough to make a stock CentOS 7 run a custom compiled Apache and PHP. I 
really need professional training in CentOS/Redhat Enterprise Linux to 
complement my Linux Professional Institute Level 1 certification. I've grown up 
on Redhat, but I don't understand it anymore.

 -- Michael C. Robinson
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Re: [PLUG] Installing VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19

[Tomas Kuchta]

That is 32bit CPU, correct?

If yes, you might try searching if the missing packages exist for 32bit CPU.

On Sun, Oct 28, 2018, 3:16 PM Dick Steffens  wrote:

> Is anyone using VirtualBox on Linux Mint 19?
>
> I followed the instructions at:
>
>
> https://www.itzgeek.com/how-tos/linux/linux-mint-how-tos/install-virtualbox-4-3-on-linux-mint-17.html
>
> But when I got to sudo apt-get install virtualbox-5.2 I get this error
> message.
>
>
> dick@Linux-Mint-X200-Tablet:~$ sudo apt-get install virtualbox-5.2
> [sudo] password for dick:
> Reading package lists... Done
> Building dependency tree
> Reading state information... Done
> Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
> requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
> distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
> or been moved out of Incoming.
> The following information may help to resolve the situation:
>
> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
>   virtualbox-5.2 : Depends: libcurl3 (>= 7.16.2) but it is not going to
> be installed
>Depends: libpng12-0 (>= 1.2.13-4) but it is not
> installable
>Depends: libvpx3 (>= 1.5.0) but it is not installable
> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
> dick@Linux-Mint-X200-Tablet:~$
>
>
> Of course the web page instructions assume all went well, so they don't
> mention how to fix the broken packages. I tried running Fix Broken
> Packages in Symantic. I says they're fixed, but the error continues.
>
> Clue stick appreciated.
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Dick Steffens
>
>
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