Re: West Side Stammtisch - Cancelled
I agree that each of our PLUG events need backup people willing to step up. That's how we work the hackfest? On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:39 PM, Brian Cluff br...@snaptek.com wrote: Does this really need to be canceled tonight? If there is enough people that want to show up, this sort of event can get away without having it's sponsoring person show up every once in a while. I think we should get a raise of hands and if enough people are going to show up, go ahead and have a stammtisch. I'm guessing that at least one person that didn't check the list might show up anyway since it's too short of notice. Brian Cluff On 09/15/2010 09:38 AM, Tuna wrote: Hi, I have put this off for too long. Since last month, I have started school at EMCC. I have a class that about completely overlaps the stammtisch times. As such, I am unable to show up tonight. I suggest we reschedule for Friday nights. Does that work with everyone? We've never had a Friday event before. -andrew --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: West Side Stammtisch - Cancelled
On 09/16/2010 06:52 AM, Lisa Kachold wrote: I agree that each of our PLUG events need backup people willing to step up. That's how we work the hackfest? Indubitably. Is Chris Bardwell on this list? You up for it, Chris? On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:39 PM, Brian Cluff br...@snaptek.com mailto:br...@snaptek.com wrote: Does this really need to be canceled tonight? If there is enough people that want to show up, this sort of event can get away without having it's sponsoring person show up every once in a while. I think we should get a raise of hands and if enough people are going to show up, go ahead and have a stammtisch. I'm guessing that at least one person that didn't check the list might show up anyway since it's too short of notice. Brian Cluff On 09/15/2010 09:38 AM, Tuna wrote: Hi, I have put this off for too long. Since last month, I have started school at EMCC. I have a class that about completely overlaps the stammtisch times. As such, I am unable to show up tonight. I suggest we reschedule for Friday nights. Does that work with everyone? We've never had a Friday event before. -andrew --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
64 bit flash for linux... finally
http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/09/16/0340226/Adobe-Releases-New-64-bit-Flash-Plugin-For-Linux?from=rss for those who actually like flash :-) -- A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button. Stephen --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Since it is vague interpret it in the way that best suits you :) Don't say anything negative about yourself if you can help it lest they filter your application to the trash before even interviewing you. I think in such situations LESS is MORE :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 09:53, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
say things like you wanted to leverage some time off for personal development projects or small business opportunities. Eric On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:57 AM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: Since it is vague interpret it in the way that best suits you :) Don't say anything negative about yourself if you can help it lest they filter your application to the trash before even interviewing you. I think in such situations LESS is MORE :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 09:53, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
They are just trying to find out if you were unemployed for any length and that you didnt just take a hike or somesuch i guess. This is a new one to me as well. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:04 AM, Eric Cope eric.c...@gmail.com wrote: say things like you wanted to leverage some time off for personal development projects or small business opportunities. Eric On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:57 AM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: Since it is vague interpret it in the way that best suits you :) Don't say anything negative about yourself if you can help it lest they filter your application to the trash before even interviewing you. I think in such situations LESS is MORE :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 09:53, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button. Stephen --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Hi All, I thought I'd chime in here as I've seen many of these type of questions in my tenure in corporate IT. All that the hiring personell are looking for is someone who is creative, resourceful and doesn't give up. So, if you say you were unemployed from date X to date Y due to a lay off couldn't get hired due the a bad economy, believe me your application will be in the trash before you know it. Also, requesting information for the past seven years is completely unrealistic (and the hiring managers know this). They will only be interested in job history for up through the past year or two. A few other points to keep in mind: - The application's sole purpose is to weed people out. - Never, ever, ever, ever say you were fired. Even if you were fired, say you were laid off. - What you say on an application should always flatter you and tell them why they would benefit by hiring you. I was on a phone interview yesterday and this exact question arose. My last job ended over a year ago (lay off), but I've been doing contract work for the past year. When asked what I've been doing for the past year, I simply say that I've been doing IT contract work and I'm currently between contracts looking for interesting and challenging projects to pursue. She seemed very happy with my answer. There are a number of reasons you can put on an application to explain gaps in employment: - I chose to take a several months off to spend the summer with my family - I took several short term IT projects which I exposed me to new ideas and methods - I wanted to take a few months off to spend time training and updating my skill set One could argue that you are never really unemployed, just pursuing different avenues of learning and growing as a person. All of which makes you a much better employee for them to hire. Hope this helps. Peter Tim Bogart wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
When I completed all of the objectives given to me to accomplish, the position was abolished. At 09:57 AM 9/16/2010, you wrote: Since it is vague interpret it in the way that best suits you :) Don't say anything negative about yourself if you can help it lest they filter your application to the trash before even interviewing you. I think in such situations LESS is MORE :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 09:53, Tim Bogart mailto:timbog...@yahoo.comtimbog...@yahoo.com wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.usPLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discusshttp://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Local Motors tour tonight for Software Freedom Day
moin moin, a reminder that tonight is the Local Motors tour for Software Freedom Day. Local Motors hosts the Software Freedom Day (SFD) Phoenix area event by providing a tour of Local-Motors' Chandler Micro-Factory on Thursday, September 16th at 18:30. Meet in the lobby. RSVP not required, but it will help us if you register by emailing volunteer...@ableconf.com. Local Motors uses Creative Commons licensing for car and part designs giving owners and third party parts manufacturers full source access to the specs created by Local Motors. Local Motors uses Free Software internally and would like to use more in the cars and in the production of the cars. Local Motors Micro-Factory, 1576B Nelson Rd, Chandler, AZ 85226 http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1576B+S.+Nelson+Rd.,+Chandler,+AZ+85226 The Phoenix area Software Freedom Day activity is a joint effort from ABLEconf (Arizona Business Liberty Experience conference), PLUG (Phoenix Linux Users Group) and AZLoCo (Arizona Ubuntu Local Committee). ABLEconf is an annual Free Software for Free Enterprise conference. http://www.ABLEconf.com/ http://www.Local-Motors.com/ http://www.SoftwareFreedomDay.com/ ciao, der.hans -- # http://www.LuftHans.com/http://www.LuftHans.com/Classes/ # I decry the current tendency to seek patents on algorithms. There are # better ways to earn a living than to prevent other people from making use # of one's contributions to computer science. -- Donald E. Knuth ___ PLUG-announce mailing list - plug-annou...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-announce PLUG Website at http://plug.phoenix.az.us --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Test, please ignore
Nothing to see here move along. ___ PLUG-announce mailing list - plug-annou...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-announce PLUG Website at http://plug.phoenix.az.us --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Just as an aside to everybody, I was interviewed on Wednesday of last week. The interview was not in Phoenix. They flew me to the interview site, put me up in a hotel overnight, and I interviewed the next day. Then, this past Monday, I got an email from them that began like this... Tim, Good day to you: You should have received an email requesting you fill out an official employee application. Once you get this, We would like to move forward with an offer for you but can not until this step is complete: Certain portions were edited out to conserve the name of the employer. I guess I can still be eliminated depending what's on the application. But I am very excited about this, nonetheless. Wish me luck. Respectfully, Tim B. It's all good! From: Lyle Tuttle l.tut...@cox.net To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 12:04:41 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application When I completed all of the objectives given to me to accomplish, the position was abolished. At 09:57 AM 9/16/2010, you wrote: Since it is vague interpret it in the way that best suits you :) Don't say anything negative about yourself if you can help it lest they filter your application to the trash before even interviewing you. I think in such situations LESS is MORE :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 09:53, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Good luck with this, Tim. I would advise not stretching the truth on the application. If anything on your application is found to be false later on, it could be grounds for dismissal regardless of the significance of the falsehood. -- -Eric 'shubes' Tim Bogart wrote: Just as an aside to everybody, I was interviewed on Wednesday of last week. The interview was not in Phoenix. They flew me to the interview site, put me up in a hotel overnight, and I interviewed the next day. Then, this past Monday, I got an email from them that began like this... Tim, Good day to you: You should have received an email requesting you fill out an official employee application. Once you get this, We would like to move forward with an offer for you but can not until this step is complete: Certain portions were edited out to conserve the name of the employer. I guess I can still be eliminated depending what's on the application. But I am very excited about this, nonetheless. Wish me luck. Respectfully, Tim B. / / /It's all good!/ --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Local Motors tour tonight for Software Freedom Day
Is anyone going to attend from the far West Valley? (G) Far West means near Surprise At 12:18 PM 9/16/2010, you wrote: moin moin, a reminder that tonight is the Local Motors tour for Software Freedom Day. Local Motors hosts the Software Freedom Day (SFD) Phoenix area event by providing a tour of Local-Motors' Chandler Micro-Factory on Thursday, September 16th at 18:30. Meet in the lobby. RSVP not required, but it will help us if you register by emailing volunteer...@ableconf.com. Local Motors uses Creative Commons licensing for car and part designs giving owners and third party parts manufacturers full source access to the specs created by Local Motors. Local Motors uses Free Software internally and would like to use more in the cars and in the production of the cars. Local Motors Micro-Factory, 1576B Nelson Rd, Chandler, AZ 85226 http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1576B+S.+Nelson+Rd.,+Chandler,+AZ+85226 The Phoenix area Software Freedom Day activity is a joint effort from ABLEconf (Arizona Business Liberty Experience conference), PLUG (Phoenix Linux Users Group) and AZLoCo (Arizona Ubuntu Local Committee). ABLEconf is an annual Free Software for Free Enterprise conference. http://www.ABLEconf.com/ http://www.Local-Motors.com/ http://www.SoftwareFreedomDay.com/ ciao, der.hans -- # http://www.LuftHans.com/http://www.LuftHans.com/Classes/ # I decry the current tendency to seek patents on algorithms. There are # better ways to earn a living than to prevent other people from making use # of one's contributions to computer science. -- Donald E. Knuth ___ PLUG-announce mailing list - plug-annou...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-announce PLUG Website at http://plug.phoenix.az.us --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
This is the advice I seem to be most comfortable with, even though it may not be the most productive. I'm treating it like an application for a security clearance. I have experience with a gentleman who on an application for a security clearance described some unsavory activities that involved some farm animals (no, I'm not going to go into specifics, but you can probably use your imagination and come up with a scenerio that will encompass the activitity, even though it may make you whince) and wound up GETTING THE CLEARANCE! In such situations, HONESTY is the most important factor. Whodathunkit? Tim True is stranger than fact. Grandpa Jones Hee-Haw From: Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 1:55:08 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Good luck with this, Tim. I would advise not stretching the truth on the application. If anything on your application is found to be false later on, it could be grounds for dismissal regardless of the significance of the falsehood. -- -Eric 'shubes' Tim Bogart wrote: Just as an aside to everybody, I was interviewed on Wednesday of last week. The interview was not in Phoenix. They flew me to the interview site, put me up in a hotel overnight, and I interviewed the next day. Then, this past Monday, I got an email from them that began like this... Tim, Good day to you: You should have received an email requesting you fill out an official employee application. Once you get this, We would like to move forward with an offer for you but can not until this step is complete: Certain portions were edited out to conserve the name of the employer. I guess I can still be eliminated depending what's on the application. But I am very excited about this, nonetheless. Wish me luck. Respectfully, Tim B. / / /It's all good!/ --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Local Motors tour tonight for Software Freedom Day
Am 16. Sep, 2010 schwätzte Lyle Tuttle so: Is anyone going to attend from the far West Valley? (G) Far West means near Surprise I'm only half-way that far, but will be there :). ciao, der.hans -- # http://www.LuftHans.com/http://www.LuftHans.com/Classes/ # kill telnet, long live ssh - der.hans--- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
It is generally best not to stretch the truth on an application, but if you feel you must in order to get the job that's your decision. But understand that it is *extraordinarily* rare these days that a company will fire you because they found out later that you lied on your application. If they want to fire you they have the right to do so without cause (in AZ anyway). They'll be able to come up with a dozen legitimate reasons to dismiss an employee without having to go through the hassle of checking all the info on an application months or years after the fact. Lying on a application was much more of a risk when you could lose years of pension benefits as a result. But that's not so much of an issue these days. Just my 2 cents Interesting about the farm animal guy. Must have been a gov't job. :) Peter Tim Bogart wrote: This is the advice I seem to be most comfortable with, even though it may not be the most productive. I'm treating it like an application for a security clearance. I have experience with a gentleman who on an application for a security clearance described some unsavory activities that involved some farm animals (no, I'm not going to go into specifics, but you can probably use your imagination and come up with a scenerio that will encompass the activitity, even though it may make you whince) and wound up GETTING THE CLEARANCE! In such situations, HONESTY is the most important factor. Whodathunkit? Tim True is stranger than fact. Grandpa Jones Hee-Haw *From:* Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net *To:* plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 1:55:08 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Good luck with this, Tim. I would advise not stretching the truth on the application. If anything on your application is found to be false later on, it could be grounds for dismissal regardless of the significance of the falsehood. -- -Eric 'shubes' Tim Bogart wrote: Just as an aside to everybody, I was interviewed on Wednesday of last week. The interview was not in Phoenix. They flew me to the interview site, put me up in a hotel overnight, and I interviewed the next day. Then, this past Monday, I got an email from them that began like this... Tim, Good day to you: You should have received an email requesting you fill out an official employee application. Once you get this, We would like to move forward with an offer for you but can not until this step is complete: Certain portions were edited out to conserve the name of the employer. I guess I can still be eliminated depending what's on the application. But I am very excited about this, nonetheless. Wish me luck. Respectfully, Tim B. / / /It's all good!/ --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw From: AZ Pete su...@cactusfamily.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 2:18:38 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application It is generally best not to stretch the truth on an application, but if you feel you must in order to get the job that's your decision. But understand that it is *extraordinarily* rare these days that a company will fire you because they found out later that you lied on your application. If they want to fire you they have the right to do so without cause (in AZ anyway). They'll be able to come up with a dozen legitimate reasons to dismiss an employee without having to go through the hassle of checking all the info on an application months or years after the fact. Lying on a application was much more of a risk when you could lose years of pension benefits as a result. But that's not so much of an issue these days. Just my 2 cents Interesting about the farm animal guy. Must have been a gov't job. :) Peter Tim Bogart wrote: This is the advice I seem to be most comfortable with, even though it may not be the most productive. I'm treating it like an application for a security clearance. I have experience with a gentleman who on an application for a security clearance described some unsavory activities that involved some farm animals (no, I'm not going to go into specifics, but you can probably use your imagination and come up with a scenerio that will encompass the activitity, even though it may make you whince) and wound up GETTING THE CLEARANCE! In such situations, HONESTY is the most important factor. Whodathunkit? Tim True is stranger than fact. Grandpa Jones Hee-Haw From: Eric Shuberte...@shubes.net To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 1:55:08 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Good luck with this, Tim. I would advise not stretching the truth on the application. If anything on your application is found to be false later on, it could be grounds for dismissal regardless of the significance of the falsehood. -- -Eric 'shubes' Tim Bogart wrote: Just as an aside to everybody, I was interviewed on Wednesday of last week. The interview was not in Phoenix. They flew me to the interview site, put me up in a hotel overnight, and I interviewed the next day. Then, this past Monday, I got an email from them that began like this... Tim, Good day to you: You should have received an email requesting you fill out an official employee application. Once you get this, We would like to move forward with an offer for you but can not until this step is complete: Certain portions were edited out to conserve the name of the employer. I guess I can still be eliminated depending what's on the application. But I am very excited about this, nonetheless. Wish me luck. Respectfully, Tim B. / / /It's all good!/ --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for FAILING TO DISCLOSE their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... From: JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
That is what I was alluding to; arrested acquitted=not guilty. They arrest and accuse people of things they didn't do every day. Thank god we don't have 'photo convictions' for anything other than speeding and running red lights (there is no justice in traffic court) :) On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 15:02, Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.com wrote: That is still a bit strange. All the applications I have filled out the question is have you ever been found guilty --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
Maybe... but I'd be willing to bet that the words charged with or are in there somewhere too. Believe me, they want to know everything. I misquoted Grandpa Jones... he used to say Fact is stranger than true. Tim From: Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 3:02:33 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application That is still a bit strange. All the applications I have filled out the question is have you ever been found guilty On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 2:54 PM, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for FAILING TO DISCLOSE their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... From: JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.plug.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
I'm pretty sure expungment is an entirely separate process if I'm not mistaken. If you've gone through the process of being charged and tried for a crime, even if you were found innocent or exonerated or whatever the result, I believe it's still a matter of public record forever and ever, unless as you say, it gets expunged. Not even a Presidential pardon as I understand it is the equivalent of an expungment if I'm not mistaken. I'm not an attorney, but I'm pretty darned sure of that which I say on this subject. Any lawyers out there who wish to offer a ruling on this? I can always be wrong. That's why I try never to speak in absolutes. This level of the discussion is moot for me because I'm not an attorney and any opinion I have on the subject emanates from an orifice from which oratory is not worth the time it takes. Tim From: JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 3:03:40 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for FAILING TO DISCLOSE their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... From: JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
The significance isn't the crime itself, that you were tried, or what the verdict was. The significance is you falsified your application by omitting the fact that it occurred. Lying about it (or anything) on you application is a term of dismissal. It's that simple. JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for *FAILING TO DISCLOSE* their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... *From:* JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com mailto:j...@twingeckos.com *To:* Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Eric 'shubes' --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
I've only ever seen applications ask if you've been convicted of a crime never just accused. If the question is 'accused' I would check yes and write 'I was falsely accused and was acquitted' next to it; if there wasn't room I'd check both boxes. Alternately I'd cross out the offending word and put convicted and check no. Anyone fired for undisclosed suspicion of a crime who has been acquitted should sue the heck out of that company. I can see if you were convicted and left it out where that would be grounds but if you were acquitted it's a different matter. Accusation!=guilt. People falsely accuse people of things they didn't do all the time. Police mistakenly arrest and charge the wrong person for a crime they didn't commit (some even are put to death though those people ARE convicted). I don't think it's fair to ask if someone has been accused of a crime but it's fine to ask if they have been convicted. More direct questions like 'have you ever stolen' are fine with me too. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 15:21, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: The significance isn't the crime itself, that you were tried, or what the verdict was. The significance is you falsified your application by omitting the fact that it occurred. Lying about it (or anything) on you application is a term of dismissal. It's that simple. JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
That's how I see it, based on my experience, and my Jimmeny Cricket factor too. Hence, my bewilderment as to why they would ask (what amounts in my mind to be just a really stupid question) Why were you unemployed for 9 months? And why is I don't know, I just couldn't get hired anywhere such a bad response. Why is the abject truth so bad? It's a simple truth and for the average person, there's no shame in it. It's certainly not an unemployed individual's fault if hiring managers don't find in his or her favor. Well, maybe it is. Maybe the person doesn't have the creds. Maybe the person doesn't interview well. There again, maybe the economy stinks. Maybe it's NOT their fault directly. Even if you ask why you didn't get hired into a position, normally the response you get is We decided to pursue other candidates. And you still don't know why you don't have a job. I just find it to be a question, the asking of which there is little or nothing to gain. I find it nothing but embarrassing to an applicant. Sure, there is a reason. But for every application submitted, for every resume submitted, there can be a thousand different reason why one was not successful in securing employment. What an employer is doing by asking the question in the first place is asking the applicant to speculate, because the actual truth of the matter can never be known. The best response, and one I would LOVE to use one day would be I don't know. I'm sure all 9000 companies that I've applied with has their own reasons. Why don't you hire me and then it won't matter. Now I'm just venting. ... sorry. Tim From: Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 3:21:33 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application The significance isn't the crime itself, that you were tried, or what the verdict was. The significance is you falsified your application by omitting the fact that it occurred. Lying about it (or anything) on you application is a term of dismissal. It's that simple. JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for *FAILING TO DISCLOSE* their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... *From:* JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com mailto:j...@twingeckos.com *To:* Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
I have seen the question framed as have you ever been arrested (NOT convicted) for a serious misdemeanor or felony. On 09/16/2010 03:03 PM, JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for *FAILING TO DISCLOSE* their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... *From:* JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com mailto:j...@twingeckos.com *To:* Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
All, After reading my own post, I think I can answer my own questions... It's because of my own naivete. Okay. My therapy session is over. I'm getting up from the couch and leaving now. I thank everyone for their participation. Any other questions or concerns will be addressed in my most thoughtful manner. All of you have been very helpful and I thank all of you very very much. Respectfully, Tim B. From: Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 4:05:50 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application That's how I see it, based on my experience, and my Jimmeny Cricket factor too. Hence, my bewilderment as to why they would ask (what amounts in my mind to be just a really stupid question) Why were you unemployed for 9 months? And why is I don't know, I just couldn't get hired anywhere such a bad response. Why is the abject truth so bad? It's a simple truth and for the average person, there's no shame in it. It's certainly not an unemployed individual's fault if hiring managers don't find in his or her favor. Well, maybe it is. Maybe the person doesn't have the creds. Maybe the person doesn't interview well. There again, maybe the economy stinks. Maybe it's NOT their fault directly. Even if you ask why you didn't get hired into a position, normally the response you get is We decided to pursue other candidates. And you still don't know why you don't have a job. I just find it to be a question, the asking of which there is little or nothing to gain. I find it nothing but embarrassing to an applicant. Sure, there is a reason. But for every application submitted, for every resume submitted, there can be a thousand different reason why one was not successful in securing employment. What an employer is doing by asking the question in the first place is asking the applicant to speculate, because the actual truth of the matter can never be known. The best response, and one I would LOVE to use one day would be I don't know. I'm sure all 9000 companies that I've applied with has their own reasons. Why don't you hire me and then it won't matter. Now I'm just venting. ... sorry. Tim From: Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Sent: Thu, September 16, 2010 3:21:33 PM Subject: Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application The significance isn't the crime itself, that you were tried, or what the verdict was. The significance is you falsified your application by omitting the fact that it occurred. Lying about it (or anything) on you application is a term of dismissal. It's that simple. JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for *FAILING TO DISCLOSE* their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... *From:* JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com mailto:j...@twingeckos.com *To:* Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com mailto:timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty,
free to good home - 2 sun pizza boxes (old style)
I have 2 remaining sun OS pizza box machines with spare hardware. I haven't used them in a couple of years. I managed to install openBSD on them and had once used them as a firewall and misc services. I cut my teeth on OpenBSD on these babies. They have been sitting on a shelf for about 2 years. these are the off-white (beige) models. I have some spare cards and memory modules to fit these things. if anyone wants them for either nostalgia or something firewall like, please e-mail me off list. since I can't travel (blind and room mates without a car) I would expect if you want them, coming to my place would be preferred. - Eric --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
I've heard of (3rd hand) cases where hiring managers immediately reject resumes of people that have been laid off on the thinking that they must have been laid off for a reason; that is, they weren't the star employees. Star employees are rarely laid off, even in bad work conditions. And since we're in terrible work conditions, hiring managers can afford to be very picky. I honestly don't know how true that is since I haven't met anybody first-hand that has experienced that. It is, of course, very difficult to prove such a thing. I *have* known several people that have not gotten jobs because they made too much money in their previous job. The reasoning is: you are obviously used to working at a higher pay grade than we're willing to pay you and so you're going to leave for a better job at the drop of a hat... better not to hire you at all. On 9/16/10 10:51 AM, AZ Pete wrote: Hi All, I thought I'd chime in here as I've seen many of these type of questions in my tenure in corporate IT. All that the hiring personell are looking for is someone who is creative, resourceful and doesn't give up. So, if you say you were unemployed from date X to date Y due to a lay off couldn't get hired due the a bad economy, believe me your application will be in the trash before you know it. Also, requesting information for the past seven years is completely unrealistic (and the hiring managers know this). They will only be interested in job history for up through the past year or two. A few other points to keep in mind: - The application's sole purpose is to weed people out. - Never, ever, ever, ever say you were fired. Even if you were fired, say you were laid off. - What you say on an application should always flatter you and tell them why they would benefit by hiring you. I was on a phone interview yesterday and this exact question arose. My last job ended over a year ago (lay off), but I've been doing contract work for the past year. When asked what I've been doing for the past year, I simply say that I've been doing IT contract work and I'm currently between contracts looking for interesting and challenging projects to pursue. She seemed very happy with my answer. There are a number of reasons you can put on an application to explain gaps in employment: - I chose to take a several months off to spend the summer with my family - I took several short term IT projects which I exposed me to new ideas and methods - I wanted to take a few months off to spend time training and updating my skill set One could argue that you are never really unemployed, just pursuing different avenues of learning and growing as a person. All of which makes you a much better employee for them to hire. Hope this helps. Peter Tim Bogart wrote: All, Please forgive me for my stupidity, but I've never been able to wrap my brain around this one. I am filling out an application for a major corporation and on it they wish me to provide dates of unemployment for the last seven years. That I get. The part I don't get is that they wish me to provide an explanation for those periods. Explain what? Why I was unemployed? I got laid off, or the contract expired or I got fired from the previous position. Or, why I was unemployed or why I couldn't find work? I dunno. Am I to explain why a company didn't want to interview me, or hire me, or didn't get presented with my resume? This one just dumbfounds me. To me, this is just a stupid way to word something. Oh, and by the way... nobody answers the help line. Nice... Any thoughts? Tim B. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list -plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
sun sparc pizza boxen spoke for
ok, the pizza boxen have been spoken for. thanks all for your interest. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 3:03 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would lirdless of the questions. Yes, the laws related to disclosure of convictions of traffic, misdemeaners and felonies for IT employment become vary vague, depending on situations where expungement, sealing or set aside are available. Some HR, head hunters and hiring IT managers have actually told individuals (including me recently) NOT to describe anything earlier than 7 years ago regardless of the questions wording on the application. *Be aware that even when items have been set aside or expunged, they can still exist in the background check databases, so while legally you do not have to disclose them if they do not specifically ask for items which have been sealed by the courts, you can still be fired with cause for failure to disclose, should they show up later* on a background check. Background check information disclosure and abuse is strictly controlled by federal laws but not enforced. In situations where a felony occurred more than 15 years ago, and the question asks if you have EVER been convicted of a felony, it's again generally better to disclose, On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:54, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: No. Maybe I didn't explain it clearly enough. No, they did not terminate people for having a brush with the law and being found innocent or acquitted or for whatever reason, were not convicted. They terminated those people for *FAILING TO DISCLOSE* their brush with the law, and the accompanying details on the application. Understandable in my mind. Tim... -- *From:* JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com *To:* Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us *Sent:* Thu, September 16, 2010 2:48:46 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application Hold on.. they fired people that were ACQUITTED of a crime? That seems a bit too far :( If a court can't find them guilty how can an employer? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 14:38, Tim Bogart timbog...@yahoo.com wrote: I like your response. At a company with which I worked for many years, many years ago used to send me email on a daily basis listing folks who had been terminated. Of those, many were terminated because of falsehoods on their applications. And of those, not nearly, but ALL were due to information omitted regarding some crime that the individual had committed. And they ran the gambit from robbery to murder. Yes, murder, believe it or not. But in fairness, of those, they involved folks who had been tried for murder and had been exonerated by some means (found not guilty, thrown out due to mistrial or other reasons) but the point is that they had concealed the facts regarding criminal activities (I mean seriously, how can you forget to list something like that, or how can you think it somehow doesn't qualify as something a potential employer would not be interested?) that are easily checked. Tim B. I'm sticking with Grandpa Jones here... True is stranger than fact. Hee-Haw --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Learning Drupal
Hi Keith: On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:16 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Hi, I need to support Drupal and am wondering if you can recommend a book, or any resource, that can take me from not knowing a thing to knowing enough. Thanks in advance! Keith Smith I love Drupal! The very best learning tool for Drupal is their site itself. Their forums are excellent also. Prerequisites are, of course, a good understanding of dynamic PHP/Mysql CMS systems and LAMP. So you would want to cruise through: 1) Apache2.conf (http.conf) [and all modules, rewrites and virtual host settings]; 2) Mysql (get a good Mysql graphic tool to view the databases [be sure you protect it on a production system] Mysql Development Tools are available to run right from Windows/Linux/OsX. 3) Php.ini and all settings should be familiar as well. For Drupal itself, I would start by clicking on everything available in the Admin portal to get an idea of what is organized how. Take special note of logging features and debug switches, of great use when supporting developers. I also suggest that you simply recreate your install including all modules on a Xen/Vmware platform or other personal development platform, and just get in and muck around? For advanced development theme, module modifications in CSS/PHP/Mysql, I suggest standard developmental process and regular PHP code change control, like SVN. -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT - Explaining periods of unemployment on an application
These are called yes answers, and for anyone getting a brokers license the trigger is arrest - so avoid getting paperwork if you can. Otherwise, don't leave it out. A yes answer is not necessarily a disqualification (felony financial fraud, ok yes - others, not so much). Other areas of disclosure include bankruptcy. The annual (for profit) corporation filing has a typical list of declarations - http://corporations.azcc.gov/filings/forms/cf0022.pdf On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 3:59 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: I've only ever seen applications ask if you've been convicted of a crime never just accused. If the question is 'accused' I would check yes and write 'I was falsely accused and was acquitted' next to it; if there wasn't room I'd check both boxes. Alternately I'd cross out the offending word and put convicted and check no. Anyone fired for undisclosed suspicion of a crime who has been acquitted should sue the heck out of that company. I can see if you were convicted and left it out where that would be grounds but if you were acquitted it's a different matter. Accusation!=guilt. People falsely accuse people of things they didn't do all the time. Police mistakenly arrest and charge the wrong person for a crime they didn't commit (some even are put to death though those people ARE convicted). I don't think it's fair to ask if someone has been accused of a crime but it's fine to ask if they have been convicted. More direct questions like 'have you ever stolen' are fine with me too. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 15:21, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: The significance isn't the crime itself, that you were tried, or what the verdict was. The significance is you falsified your application by omitting the fact that it occurred. Lying about it (or anything) on you application is a term of dismissal. It's that simple. JD Austin wrote: I'm glad I don't work somewhere like that. If I was acquitted/exonerated of a crime I wouldn't list it on an application either! I can't think of a reason anyone would. If it was a crime I'd been convicted of that was later expunged I would list it though; perhaps that is what you're referring to? --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: West Side Stammtisch - Cancelled
While we do not have the capacity on the Drupal to properly manage our Groups, such as role sign-ups, or phone numbers and volunteer coordination outside of email architectural digs that interfere with making the discussion email lists purely technical and low volume, I use my own site and gangplank for this project management. Google Apps provides great project management and groupware tools? Getting a good phone list is archaic, but useful? Embarrassing that we don't use the source, ennit? On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 6:55 AM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: On 09/16/2010 06:52 AM, Lisa Kachold wrote: I agree that each of our PLUG events need backup people willing to step up. That's how we work the hackfest? Indubitably. Is Chris Bardwell on this list? You up for it, Chris? On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:39 PM, Brian Cluff br...@snaptek.com wrote: Does this really need to be canceled tonight? If there is enough people that want to show up, this sort of event can get away without having it's sponsoring person show up every once in a while. I think we should get a raise of hands and if enough people are going to show up, go ahead and have a stammtisch. I'm guessing that at least one person that didn't check the list might show up anyway since it's too short of notice. Brian Cluff On 09/15/2010 09:38 AM, Tuna wrote: Hi, I have put this off for too long. Since last month, I have started school at EMCC. I have a class that about completely overlaps the stammtisch times. As such, I am unable to show up tonight. I suggest we reschedule for Friday nights. Does that work with everyone? We've never had a Friday event before. -andrew --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Learning Drupal
On 09/16/2010 07:16 PM, keith smith wrote: I need to support Drupal and am wondering if you can recommend a book, or any resource, that can take me from not knowing a thing to knowing enough. One of the biggest parts of learning Drupal is the data model it uses (nodes and types of nodes), and how modules work together and what modules there are. Learning about nodes is easy once you know that's what you need to know. Learning how the modules interact with each other is a bit more complex, there are literally thousands of modules that are published on the Drupal website including a few pretty essential ones that don't ship with Drupal by default (in case you are installing). A few books I have on Drupal: Using Drupal (O'Reilly) http://books.google.com/books?id=LVz8q2qYQNUC http://www.usingdrupal.com/ Using Drupal is fairly comprehensive and goes through the data model, users, nodes, what modules are, and spotlights many of the top modules and has a few examples of websites and what modules you put together to make it happen. It mostly focuses on functionality. Going through some of the examples will be helpful, certainly this is one of the first books you would want to look at. More specialized books include: Pro Drupal Development (Apress) http://books.google.com/books?id=aWYOGXQShegC http://apress.com/book/view/1430209895 For low, code-level customization, creating your own modules, etc, Pro Drupal Development covers writing a module; integrating with Drupal libraries like menus, themes, nodes, users, i18n, etc; and some of the libraries it ships with like JQuery. Drupal 6 Themes (Packt Publishing) http://books.google.com/books?id=1RfbOAAACAAJ https://www.packtpub.com/drupal-6-themes/book Drupal 6 Themes covers how to change the style of blocks, nodes, or entire themes, and how to write a new one. Using Drupal has a nice chapter on themes and how the system works, which is probably adequate. Austin Wright. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: going M$ free
Hi! On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Technomage_Hawke technomage.ha...@gmail.com wrote: I quit using M$ after my eyes became unusable for even large print. I Haven't tried NVDA (an open source speech synth for windows) yet. However that doesn't matter now as I use a mac with voiceover. I spent just under $400 for a used Imac intel machine and purchased snow leopard for $29.00 from amazon and have had accessibility ever since with no special setup or spending nearly $2,000 for JFW (software and card and training). So far, mac has been a lifesaver for me. I can read the mails from Plug, browse web sites and generally do all I could do before (except play video games). I wanted to setup Adrian knoppix under virtual-box but had a snag. The live cd would work fine but the install would crash almost as soon as the kernel was done loading. If I can't configure it there and be able to configure end to end, then I won't be able to do the same on my currently inaccessible powerbook g3. Does anyone have any alternative suggestions? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5a8XaJIdpQ4 knoppix 6 on virtualbox Knoppix Adrienne can be remastered for Live CD on a MAC Virtualbox. A Virtualbox installation of knoppix 6.0, while difficult, can be done. Follow up to determine the reason for the crashing and use the forums to resolve your issue. Believe me, it's probably you display or video settings, and so easy and so worth it to get it going. http://www.google.com/#sclient=psyhl=enq=virtualbox+on+a+mac+os+x+guest+os+knoppix+6aq=faqi=aql=oq=gs_rfai=pbx=1fp=6f32b8af52b7e0b8 Convert an existing Knoppix 6.0 image (Vmware) to Virtualbox: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-convert-vmware-image-to-virtualbox-image.html * EMAIL YOUR EXACT ERROR CODE AND LOGS TO THIS LIST AND WE WILL HELP YOU!* If you can't get it going that way, with our help using standard troubleshooting process, go over to the installfest or come to my Gangplank Hackfest lab on the first Saturday next month and I will stay late to help you get it going? -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com http://it-clowns.com/wiki/index.php?title=Obnosis “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: going M$ free
Lisa, thanks for the heads up.. I am unable to even access the messages file on that partition. I may have to erase and start again. I really wish that my powerbook supported at least OS X 10.4.x then I could voiceover there. unfortunately apple decided to EOL the g3 thru G5 series machines after they went intel. :( That really leaves me with having to seek alternatives. One nice thing about snow leopard is that I can take linux code, peak/tweak it for OS X, set the compile flags for G3 and produce X apps that will run on a G3 and they will run (at least under 10.3.9 with te X app). I really would like to do the same under a VM'ed linux (intel - ppc) and make some more up to date packages for ppc linux. However, that will have to wait until I have a working linux on the G3 and have fully configured. BTW, does anyone have any suggestions for an X GUI that doesn't need a mouse for access? - Eric On Sep 16, 2010, at 8:15 PM, Lisa Kachold wrote: Hi! On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Technomage_Hawke technomage.ha...@gmail.com wrote: I quit using M$ after my eyes became unusable for even large print. I Haven't tried NVDA (an open source speech synth for windows) yet. However that doesn't matter now as I use a mac with voiceover. I spent just under $400 for a used Imac intel machine and purchased snow leopard for $29.00 from amazon and have had accessibility ever since with no special setup or spending nearly $2,000 for JFW (software and card and training). So far, mac has been a lifesaver for me. I can read the mails from Plug, browse web sites and generally do all I could do before (except play video games). I wanted to setup Adrian knoppix under virtual-box but had a snag. The live cd would work fine but the install would crash almost as soon as the kernel was done loading. If I can't configure it there and be able to configure end to end, then I won't be able to do the same on my currently inaccessible powerbook g3. Does anyone have any alternative suggestions? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5a8XaJIdpQ4 knoppix 6 on virtualbox Knoppix Adrienne can be remastered for Live CD on a MAC Virtualbox. A Virtualbox installation of knoppix 6.0, while difficult, can be done. Follow up to determine the reason for the crashing and use the forums to resolve your issue. Believe me, it's probably you display or video settings, and so easy and so worth it to get it going. http://www.google.com/#sclient=psyhl=enq=virtualbox+on+a+mac+os+x+guest+os+knoppix+6aq=faqi=aql=oq=gs_rfai=pbx=1fp=6f32b8af52b7e0b8 Convert an existing Knoppix 6.0 image (Vmware) to Virtualbox: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-convert-vmware-image-to-virtualbox-image.html EMAIL YOUR EXACT ERROR CODE AND LOGS TO THIS LIST AND WE WILL HELP YOU! If you can't get it going that way, with our help using standard troubleshooting process, go over to the installfest or come to my Gangplank Hackfest lab on the first Saturday next month and I will stay late to help you get it going? -- Office: (602)239-3392 ATT: (503)754-4452 http://it-clowns.com “These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people” --Abraham Lincoln --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
