RE: 2 queries
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Amy Haugesag Sent: Monday, January 25, 1999 8:02 PM To: passenger side Subject: RE: 2 queries typical rock crit wouldn't necessarily know individual Mekons other than Jon Langford, Given the convulted history of the band and their propemsity for substance abuse I'd be surprised if individual Mekons know each other. Nicholas
Re: 2 queries
In a message dated 1/26/99 1:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm sure that's all true. But I was thinking, too, that it was more than just the pickiness and accepted standards of writers and editors at play here. I was thinking it was, you know, like, the law. . . . I'm guessing there's a difference in copyright law/requirents, although I don't think that makes much sense. I think it's more likely the application of the standard or the application of the law -- because a copyright is a copyright regardless of what the format of the item copyrighted is. Remember old 45's -- I remember as a kid not knowing what the name in parentheses under the performers name meant. It was the writer of the song. So at some time in music history there may have been a standard. I know this is minutia to some but I guess I find it pretty interesting. And one would think with Nashville being a "songwriters" town, that there of all places, credit would be given. But then again, didn't this start with Hazeldine? I don't have their CD or even know what label it's on -- I still think that smaller labels might not be following proper protocol but no one's called them on it. Then again maybe they have been called and we don't know. But I agree with whoever, it annoys the hell out of me when someone covers a song on a CD and doesn't properly credit it. You know -- BMI and ASCAP might be the place to clear this up. I'm too tired to go web surfing -- Curry -- that's your assignment for tomorrow g Deb I'll probably be digging into copyright tomorrow night in my studies -- but it will deal more with electronic documents g
Re: 2 queries
Part of learning about country music is learning where songs come from, and my sense is that that's true with various kinds of roots music - blues, Cajun and so forth, but I guess it's not so big a thing across the board. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/ Exactly, except I think we can go further and say that many critics today are just plain lazy and do not research the source and/or their workload is so considerable that they do not have the time. I would rather read no songwriting credit at all than to be given an erroneous one. When I read a review or liner notes for that matter, I want to believe that the credits listed are, in fact truthful. Further, I believe that an artists success depends just as much upon the song/songwriter as it does upon the artists interpretation as well as all of those engineers, musicians and various production people lurking in the background. Why shouldn't they be given accurate mention? What frequently bothers me is when a catalog is purchased by a recording company, transferred from ep to cd and distributed without so much as a nod to the songwriter. For instance, over the past few years I have been trying to replace my worn-out but beloved albums with cd's. In some instances, replacing the original song-for-song album is impossible; however in the case of "The Greatest Hits of..." or "The Best Of..." I frequently notice a lack of songwriting credits. For the younger generation who has never heard of a particular artist before but possibly has been curious enough to explore someone they've read about who has been an influence on a current "stars" career (or whatever else may stimulate their interest), I believe negating the songwriting credits or providing "false" credit is a disservice to the heritage of any musical form. Music is more than just the artist or his/her image. I f we wish to preserve our rich musical heritage, then I say we should accurately provide credit where credit is definitely due. Tera
RE: 2 queries/OKRA all stars
What are you talking about? My cd has *all* the songwriters credited. Course, mine is the original OKRA release, so what, do you have the re-release? Well, at any rate Jon, rest assured, the band and original label had all the songwriters by name listed.. -Original Message- From: Jon Weisberger [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, January 25, 1999 9:33 PM To: passenger side Subject: RE: 2 queries y'all are gettin' pretty het up, here. SOME of us are forgetting that one of the things this whole "whatever it is" does is introduce people to music and artists they wouldn't be familiar with otherwise by mix n matching people and songs. Heh, as it happens, that's one of my complaints about the Okra All-Stars CD, which has 9 covers out of 15 cuts, and not a single songwriter ID, never mind original artist names. Assuming that some of the purchasers are likely aware that Prince wrote "Purple Rain," that leaves 8 songs - some of them very good ones (including, BTW, "Wild And Blue") whose origins are completely hidden from view. There's no way of even telling which ones are the covers. Now, expecting an urban rock critic to dig deep enough to find out that liner notes might ton provide the comprehensiveness and accuracy of a country music encyclopedia, which, by the way, would have to be organized by song title, is, imho, asking an unreasonable amount. Maybe, but it would be nice to have songwriting credits, and it's a good reason to have liner notes that go beyond listing the musicians, the song titles, and a little list of thankyews. In my opinion, if they aren't there, it weakens the "introduction" aspect. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: 2 queries
re Tera; For the younger generation who has never heard of a particular artist before but possibly has been curious enough to explore someone they've read about who has been an influence on a current "stars" career (or whatever else may stimulate their interest), I believe negating the songwriting credits or providing "false" credit is a disservice to the heritage of any musical form. Music is more than just the artist or his/her image. I f we wish to preserve our rich musical heritage, then I say we should accurately provide credit where credit is definitely due. This is like my second "me too" post in a week but...I don't care g. Very well put, and I feel even *more* strongly about this, when the credits aren't on a record I just about blow my top. That, and when I'm at a live show where some band plays a number of lesser known songs and doesn't give cred to either the song origin or writer. Dan
RE: 2 queries/OKRA all stars
Leaping to defend the honor of his hometown musical community, Matt says: What are you talking about? My cd has *all* the songwriters credited. Course, mine is the original OKRA release, so what, do you have the re-release? and goes on, in another post: [Matt Benz] And if you ever find a copy of Hank McCoy's second album, not only does he provide notes about all the songs, usually listing original singers as well as writers, but for the album cover, he "copies" what I assume is a classic country album cover (he provides a Capitol (I think) catalog reference # ), and urges folks to visit the COuntry Music Hall O Fame. Now, the actual material might be hit or miss, but ya gotta like his spirit, Jon. Sure, absolutely - and yes, it's the re-release. Evidently something got lost in the translation, eh? Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: 2 queries
Dallas Clemmons wrote: I often wondered about this as a DJ, when frustrated by the lack of songwriting credits, and so I'll ask now: Why isn't this required? And does it have any bearing on royalties for airplay? I thought it did, assuming a record got enough spins for BMI or ASCAP to (literally) pay attention. TS
RE: 2 queries/OKRA all stars
I started to think maybe they didn't have the songwriters on the All Stars disc, but I realize that I wouldn't have known who wrote "14 Karat Mine" (Or is that Mind? Whatever) any other way cos I've never heard it elsewhere. Run, don't walk, to find a copy of the Gene Watson's Greatest Hits - the MCA one, not the Curb one; incredibly, "Fourteen Carat Mind" was Watson's only #1. Actually, now that I think about it, you oughta find a copy of the Curb one, too, which collects most of his Capitol hits that preceded his MCA signing - but "Fourteen Carat Mind" is on the MCA one. More synchronicity, BTW; the cut following that on the MCA album is "Speak Softly (You're Talking To My Heart)," written by bluegrasser Steve Spurgin, and one of the outstanding Randy Graham vocals on the second of the Doyle Lawson reissues I mentioned earlier. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: 2 queries
On Mon, 25 Jan 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Second, do you suppose that the persistent misattribution of "Wild And Blue" is an effort to cover up the fact that writer John Scott Sherrill gets cuts with the likes of Brooks Dunn? I think they're more afraid that someone will find the Billy Hill album. Just to keep the record straight, It was not Ndubb who proffered the Brooks Dunn cover-up theory, as this cut-and-paste might suggest. My name's tainted enough without such thoughts being attributed to me. g NW
Re: 2 queries
Jon Weisberger wrote: .Second, do you suppose that the persistent misattribution of "Wild And Blue" is an effort to cover up the fact that writer John Scott Sherrill gets cuts with the likes of Brooks Dunn? Damn. Jon's onto the conspiracy. OK. ..Plan B
Re: 2 queries
On Mon, 25 Jan 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know, both of these records have an edge that is missing for a lot of country (that's why it's Alt.) that may explain their appeal to people who favor rock over the slicker stuff. Or maybe it's "alt" simply because it's more poorly executed.g--don
Re: 2 queries
Don writes: Or maybe it's "alt" simply because it's more poorly executed.g Is this the beginning of a taste vs. chops thread? g I think they're executed just fine. Jim, smilin'
RE: 2 queries
-Original Message- From: Don Yates [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Still, I just don't consider John Anderson to be terribly obscure. Along with Ricky Skaggs and George Strait, he was one of the folks who paved the way for the New Traditionalist movement of the '80s. [Matt Benz] And Bottlerocket fans know that they claim Anderson as one of their first country influences, and have covered Wild Blue. Before the Mekons, etc
RE: 2 queries
Jeez, Neal, you've never heard "Swingin'?" I pretty much agree with Don in this regard - and my "theory" was just a way of poking a little fun at the idea that there's a Sony-driven effort to erase history when it comes to the Dixie Chicks - and more to the point, if a critic is going to go out of their way to label a song as being "from" an artist, that raises the bar to me in terms of what I expect in the way of their knowledge. FWIW, I had the same reaction when the HNC cover band opening for Sara Evans identified "Walk Softly On This Heart Of Mine" as a Kentucky Headhunters song, so it's not just rock critics involved here. Or maybe I should say, not always rock critics. And Jim, did you really mean to say that we might be reopening a "taste vs. chops" thread? It's "soul" that's usually the counterposed term; as far as I'm concerned, taste (as in, to play with taste) is practically a synonym for chops g. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: 2 queries
Sez bill f-w: but linda, "wild and blue" was a HUGE hit for john anderson, and saying so ain't snooty. and as much as i love the meke's version, it's not irk-worthy, either. rather, it's analagous to pointing out that nirvana, not tori amos, first gave us "smells like teen spirit." bill f-w Working on the timeline, here, I remember hearing Cathy Irwin singing "Wild and Blue" in her pre- and early Freakwater days. Maybe she and Janet BB introduced the tune to the Mekons? And John Anderson's got funky country soul eking out his pores. He's a good'n. I thought I heard from a reputable source that he's got some kind of distant family relations to Merle *and* Lefty. Mighta been hyperbole, but when he sings, I listen. Except for (shudder) "Swingin'". I can't go there. Kelly
RE: 2 queries
I think it's safe to guess that the critic in question probably just assumed that Mr. "Sherry" was a member of the Mekons It does surprise me, though, that a writer would hear a fairly traditional-sounding country tune like "Wild and Blue" (even as done by a rock-influenced band like Hazeldine) and assume it was written by the Mekons. Unless of course that writer had never actually heard the Mekons either, which I guess is a possibility. At that point of ignorance, it seems like a wiser course would have been simply to give the song's title and avoid mentioning anyone else altogether g. I guess it's a good illustration of different attitudes in rock and country; there have been so many covers, and such a division between songwriters and performers in the latter that it seems pretty much like second nature to check this kind of thing out before committing to paper. Part of learning about country music is learning where songs come from, and my sense is that that's true with various kinds of roots music - blues, Cajun and so forth, but I guess it's not so big a thing across the board. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
