Re: Tweedy quote /generations
Carl wrote: I think if you look at the P2 Survey you'll see the untruth of this. I'm convinced that alt-country is a (as Monsieur London puts it) "tailbust" and "gen-x" phenomenon. A glance around the audience at any alt-country show I've attended shows it skewing way to folks in their late-20s to mid-30s, with a smattering of younger and older. Hi Carl - first, let me say that I am not questioning anything which Jake posted or which you and he discussed. Interesting, well thought-out read and I can't wait for the Cliff Notes to come out on this However, I have a few comments if you will. I wouldn't at this point consider the P2 survey to be an accurate representation of the average listener and record buying/concert going public. A high percentage of listmembers are either music writers, critics, dj's, musicians, other industry personnel or those who have a deep love for and knowledge of music. It may not be fair to assume comparisons when persons involved in the industry have greater access to indie releases and a usually more saturated and comprehensive view of form and structure. So, while the P2 survey was insightful, I don't believe it should be taken as an accurate assessment as to what's going on in the minds of your average consumer. I've found most alt.country shows to be a mixed bag of patrons for the most part. I don't think I could say that one particular age group takes precedence. However, I do remember a BR5-49 show where the audience "looked" decidedly twenties to thirties and the same was true of a Freakwater and Marah show. But then, I also consider that many people of the baby boom age aren't routinely going to clubs or frequenting concerts. Most of their disposable income is outlayed elsewhere with perhaps a video rental on a Saturday night. Yet, that generation (whether first wave or second or the third wave "tailbust" as Jake referrred to it) grew up on folk, rock-n-roll, beatnik prose, protest marches, rockabilly, The Nashville Sound, traditional country, soul, motown, pop, the california sound, the philly sound, southern-rock etc; and we like those elements incorporated into the music we prefer to listen to. Alternative country seems to be "home" for many of us as opposed to new country or alt.rock. I would much rather listen to a good old Linda Ronstadt tune than suffer through the pop/country blandness which I find in recordings from say, Trisha Yearwood or JoDee Messina who have both listed Ronstadt as an influence upon their work. I do think it's correct to say that a certain percentage of the Gen X'ers are drawn to alt.country, but that may only be for the bands which evolved from the post-punk era. Even then, it seems to me that the main influence upon that group was more in the direction of radio-friendly metal (Van Halen, and its ilk), the glam-rock pop such as Duran, Duran and the emergence of hip-hop and rap. Country took a decided downturn for some time in the eighties until the "new traditionalist" style came along and took hold and for many of the Gen X era, country just wasn't "cool". So, for many of the now young to mid thirties crowd, I don't think country had much to do with their likes and dislikes, rather rock and punk was the driving influence. That group's attraction to alt.country may be in the style which uses a base of punk-rock for the body of their work. However, punk-rock is not lost on those born during the second or end wave of the baby boom generation. That generation in total experienced probably the most widely diversified stylings of popular music heretofore or since. It is only natural that we would be able to relate to the grand mixture of styles which alt.country provides. Tera The punk connection of the "insurgent" side in particular makes the demographics fairly easy to track. Refer back to the Wilson-London chronicles for various bafflingly vague descriptions of the broader implications of this general pattern. I do think it's important that alt-country has a Gen-X connection (and as Jake noted, even a few years difference in age has some important implications for where in musical-cultural history you'll stand). And I'd also assert New Country is much more boomer-oriented than is alt-country - thus HNC takes its rock influences from Billy Joel, not from the Clash. Carl W.
Re: Tweedy quote /generations
At 12:06 PM 3/5/99 -0500, you wrote: Tera wrote: - alt.country seems to be music for we aging baby boomers as opposed to alt.rock or new country which seems to target the teen to twenties crowd. Just a quick note as I gather breath to respond to Jake's epic call'n'response from yesterday - I think if you look at the P2 Survey you'll see the untruth of this. I'm convinced that alt-country is a (as Monsieur London puts it) "tailbust" and "gen-x" phenomenon. A glance around the audience at any alt-country show I'd disagree with this. Bands like Whiskeytown, Son Volt, and Wilco skew younger. I recognize the collecting passion in the voices of the customers that is one of you. That is, the "I must have EVERYTHING Whiskeytown released," passion. Same one I had for REM 15 years ago. The older folks, the ones with jobs and largely without .EDU at the end of the e-mail account, are more into the music. These are the 30-somethings and 40-somethings. At least, where I work this is how it shakes out. Jeff Miles of Music mail order http://www.milesofmusic.com FREE printed Catalog: (818) 883-9975 fax: (818) 992-8302, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Alt-Country, rockabilly, bluegrass, folk, power pop and tons more.
Re: Tweedy quote /generations
In a message dated 3/6/99 9:18:32 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The older folks, the ones with jobs and largely without .EDU at the end of the e-mail account, are more into the music. and less into the bands? wait. . .I'm confused. This often happens at the brink of a cosmic insight. Please keep going with this train of thought until I can catch up. Seriously. Linda
Re: Tweedy quote /generations
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The older folks, the ones with jobs and largely without .EDU at the end of the e-mail account, are more into the music. and less into the bands? wait. . .I'm confused. This often happens at the brink of a cosmic insight. Please keep going with this train of thought until I can catch up. Seriously. Linda Jeff's on a roll today, Linda (on the fluff list too)..and I think he IS getting at something true here too..as only somebody able to track actual record buyers responses would be! To those who for the latest thing is the First Fire, there is that throwing themselves into the thing they've heard, and they want to just breath in every ounce of it..(this accidental metaphor has got to go!)..But as wee get to having been around a little, and been through, uh, repeated incidents, the ol perspective starts to kick in, inevitably...and you get careful in a way that would only seem "tired" to the spanking new...careful to look for what's live and lasting in that music, wherever and from whenever you find it. For most listeners, life, omey and this tendency is going to rule out the full musical "perv" on anybody brand new in particular. I think that;s what Jeff's talking about--but I'd just add one special case asterisk here: for anybody crazed enoigh to be on P2 for long, these rules don't apply--.exactly. See, as WE get older, we do look around more broadly--but then termite right in obsessively on whoever turns out to grab us anyway. Lotsa times. Good for discussions--and good for record company and mail order sales, if w pay cash and don't still happen to be well-known working reviewer weasel types. Barry M.
Re: Tweedy quote /generations
Tera wrote: - alt.country seems to be music for we aging baby boomers as opposed to alt.rock or new country which seems to target the teen to twenties crowd. Just a quick note as I gather breath to respond to Jake's epic call'n'response from yesterday - I think if you look at the P2 Survey you'll see the untruth of this. I'm convinced that alt-country is a (as Monsieur London puts it) "tailbust" and "gen-x" phenomenon. A glance around the audience at any alt-country show I've attended shows it skewing way to folks in their late-20s to mid-30s, with a smattering of younger and older. The punk connection of the "insurgent" side in particular makes the demographics fairly easy to track. Refer back to the Wilson-London chronicles for various bafflingly vague descriptions of the broader implications of this general pattern. I do think it's important that alt-country has a Gen-X connection (and as Jake noted, even a few years difference in age has some important implications for where in musical-cultural history you'll stand). And I'd also assert New Country is much more boomer-oriented than is alt-country - thus HNC takes its rock influences from Billy Joel, not from the Clash. Carl W.
