Manually reindexing individual messages

[Marco Piovanelli]

Hi,

I have a filter that moves certain incoming messages (mostly junk)
to the trash.  One of the actions in this filter is "don't
index message content", as I figured I don't want to waste valuable
cpu time indexing messages that will be deleted right away most of
the time.

Sometimes, however, my filter catches legit messages, which
I manually move back into a regular folder.  Now my problem is,
these messages are ignored by FoxTrot™ searches, which I find
rather annoying.

Is there a way to manually reindex these messages, without
having to rebuild the entire index?



-- marco

-- 
It's not the data universe only, it's human conversation.
They want to turn it into a one-way flow that they have entirely
monetized. I look at the collective human mind as a kind of
ecosystem. They want to clear cut it. They want to go into the
rainforest of human thought and mow the thing down.

Re: My problems with PM

[Sean McBride]

A-NO-NE Music ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on 2005-08-10 22:34 said:

>Is there any way to stop this behavior?
>- When list pane in 3 pane view is focused, if you hit letter 'a' by
>mistake, PM goes into spinning beachball to find a message which subject
>starts with letter 'a'.  I really wish to stop this behavior.

Me too!  Just an example for the CTM guys, incase they do not see this
behaviour:

In a mailbox with 24130 messages, sorting by 'date', 'from', or
'subject' takes only about 1 second (great!) but pressing 'b' when
sorted by subject and with no message selected takes 54 seconds to
select the message!!  CPU usage does _not_ go to 100%, btw.

-- 
"we are now sucking almost 1000 barrels of oil from the ground every second"

Re: Basic UI requests

[Sean McBride]

Tim Hodgson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on 2005-08-11 06:21 said:

>>2) i wish there was a key to select the first unread message.
>>(Lets say I've just tabbed to the mailboxes pane, pressed up arrow
>>several times, and landed on the "PM list" mailbox, then I press tab to
>>get into the pane with the subjects.  Then I want to start reading from
>>the newest unread post.  What to do?  I have to page down several times,
>>then use the mouse to select the message.)
>
>After tabbing to the Subject pane, pressing the 'up' arrow will select
>the last message in the list. It's not necessarily the first unread
>message (I'm presuming you meant first rather than newest?), but it's
>quicker than scrolling down.

That's good to know, thanks.  But in a mailbox with thousands of
messages (mailing list) its not really faster.  And yes, I did mean
'first'. :)

Thanks,

-- 
"They that give up essential liberty to obtain temporary safety deserve
neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin

Re: Basic UI requests

[Tim Hodgson]

On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 10:59 pm -0400, Sean McBride wrote:

>2) i wish there was a key to select the first unread message.
>(Lets say I've just tabbed to the mailboxes pane, pressed up arrow
>several times, and landed on the "PM list" mailbox, then I press tab to
>get into the pane with the subjects.  Then I want to start reading from
>the newest unread post.  What to do?  I have to page down several times,
>then use the mouse to select the message.)

After tabbing to the Subject pane, pressing the 'up' arrow will select
the last message in the list. It's not necessarily the first unread
message (I'm presuming you meant first rather than newest?), but it's
quicker than scrolling down.

Having said that, I share your wish!

TimH

Re: My problems with PM

[Matthias Schmidt]

Hiro San,

get yourself a Japanese Keyboard. It has these convenient additional keys
left from the spacebar saying 英語 (English) and right from it saying か
な (Kana).
Just press English in any case. I made it a habit ... mostly ;-)

All the best

Matthias

---
Admilon Consulting GmbH
http://www.admilon.com
iChat/AIM: MatKoyasan
Tel. +81-736-56-3905
---

Am/On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:34:15 -0400 schrieb/wrote A-NO-NE Music:

>
>I have one more to add.
>
>Is there any way to stop this behavior?
>- When list pane in 3 pane view is focused, if you hit letter 'a' by
>mistake, PM goes into spinning beachball to find a message which subject
>starts with letter 'a'.  I really wish to stop this behavior.
>
>This is what's happening to me.
>[SPACE] is to scroll displayed message body, which I use a lot, almost
>all the messages viewing.  If I am back and forth between iChat and PM,
>I often forget my IME (Kotoeri) is engaged.  If I hit [SPACE] expecting
>to scroll the message body but with IME engaged, PM goes into looong
>spinning beachball to find message subject starts with 0x3000 (I think),
>and I have to go to make coffee :_(
>
>-- 
>
>- Hiro
>
>Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA
> 
>
>
>
>

Re: My problems with PM

[A-NO-NE Music]

I have one more to add.

Is there any way to stop this behavior?
- When list pane in 3 pane view is focused, if you hit letter 'a' by
mistake, PM goes into spinning beachball to find a message which subject
starts with letter 'a'.  I really wish to stop this behavior.

This is what's happening to me.
[SPACE] is to scroll displayed message body, which I use a lot, almost
all the messages viewing.  If I am back and forth between iChat and PM,
I often forget my IME (Kotoeri) is engaged.  If I hit [SPACE] expecting
to scroll the message body but with IME engaged, PM goes into looong
spinning beachball to find message subject starts with 0x3000 (I think),
and I have to go to make coffee :_(

-- 

- Hiro

[PROTECTED]
<[PROTECTED]> <[PROTECTED]>

Re: My problems with PM

[Matthias Schmidt]

this mostly also works fine for me, biut not always.

I have a problem with text attachment sent by windows mail-clients and
I'd like to see that CTM is going to solve that one.


All the best

Matthias

---
Admilon Consulting GmbH
http://www.admilon.com
iChat/AIM: MatKoyasan
Tel. +81-736-56-3905
---

Am/On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:33:05 -0400 schrieb/wrote Tom Miller:

>A-NO-NE Music sez:
>>
>>>- Long hyperlink, even with < and >. gets broken by extra space at
>>>return.  What I have been doing is to "unwrap" first then delete each
>>>space.  I wish this were easier.
>
>On 8/10/05, at 1:11 PM, Michael Lewis, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
>>I'd like to second this one. I don't remember this being an issue before
>>the latest versions, but I admit I could be misremembering. Has it always
>>been like this? If so, I must run into it just enough to know it happens,
>>but not enough that it's made me complain yet. Since someone else started
>>it :)
>
>I've seen this extra space problem before, but I just clicked on a URL
>that was on 3 lines and it worked perfectly.
>
>Tom Miller, 10.4.2 & 5.2.1
>...
>"The only time we see the middle of the road is as  
>we run from side to side." R.O.Clark 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: PM req: turn off specific warnings

[Andy Fragen]

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005, Mikael Byström said:

>PowerMail Engineering said:
>
>>>How do I turn off warnings that I have more than one mail filter reacting
>>>to spam values?
>>
>>You can't disable this warning. The reason is that the spam filter
>>assistant will only handle one spam action filter, so if you use the
>>assistant when you have multiple spam action filters, it will not work
>>as expected.
>
>OK, but as I said, as PM now can discriminate between spam values, why
>couldn't my handmade setup be considered kosher and stop the reminders by
>some explicit command?

I agree. I also have 2 filters whose conditions are "Spam rating greater
than 50". In my case that also triggers this warning. In one filter this
is the only criteria, in the second filter this is the first of several
criteria.

Jerome, are you saying that my second filter isn't firing 'cause I know
that it is. Maybe it's working because I'm using SpamSieve?

Andy

--
Andy Fragen

Re: delete account with existing messages?

[Damienn]

From Tim Lapin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on Wed, 10 Aug 2005 19:53:06 -0400
[01.53 CET]

>Now that is excellent news.  By contrast, if you delete an account in
>Apple's Mail.app it will actually delete the associated mail as well.
>The only way to prevent that is to move the mail out of its folder and
>into somewhere else first.  Of course you have to KNOW to do that beforehand.

Amazing!
Thanks for this info - now I'll advice my Mail.app-user friends not to
change ISP's, or change them but first their email applications as well. ;-)
What were Apple thinking? Messages belong to the account that delivered
them, rather than to their recipient? Oh my...

-- Damienn
___

If it walks out of your refrigerator, let it go.
- unknown

___

Re: Updating PM's UI?

[Mikael Byström]

H.R. Riggs said:

>I would have to say that rather than spend the time updating the UI at
>this point, I think the handling of attachments can be improved.
I find suggestions and opinion on in what order CTM should and should not
implement specific features to be quite wasteful and pointless. I suggest
what we should do at this list regarding features is to discuss their
merits and shortcomings and leave it to CTM to decide what to implement
and when.
>
>I used to religiously file attachments in the "appropriate" folder as
>they came in. I still do that with some attachments, but I find many
>don't really have an appropriate folder and I leave them in the
>Attachments folder. This means that the # of files in the Attachments
>folder is rather large. It would be nice if PM would automatically file
>the attachments in subfolders with names corresponding to the mail
>subfolders where the message is stored. This should apply, of course,
>only to attachments in the Attachments folder, not to those that I've
>moved out of it.

So you're suggesting an improvement to setting up just this functionality
in the filter section? This could be accomplished with a filter wizard or
similar. What other ways can you people imagine to achieve attachments
being moved to useful places automagically?
 
PM 5.2.1 | OS X 10.3.9 | Powerbook G4/400 | 768 MB RAM | 30 GB HD

Re: suggestion: easier filtering options

[Mikael Byström]

Mikael Byström said:

>Steve Abrahamson said:
>
>>Wizards are a software invention to band-aid badly designed software.
>>This is why Microsoft has a Wizard for everything.
>
>You guys do have a point, but making filters are *not* easy enough to do
>today. Suggest an improved GUI in this department then. How would the
>general interface functional structure look and work?

The main problem being that many users, that don't think like power
users, don't grok headers enough to build effective filters and sometimes
some messages would need some combination of field values to actually
catch some messages in, say, a mailing list. This happens to me from time
to time.

PM 5.2.1 | OS X 10.3.9 | Powerbook G4/400 | 768 MB RAM | 30 GB HD

Re: delete account with existing messages?

[Tim Lapin]

On   Wednesday, August 10, 2005,   PowerMail Engineering   sent forth:

>Mikael Byström wrote:
>
>>Ok, I forgot. What happens if I delete an account with existing messages
>>in the mail DB? Are they reassigned to another existing account or do
>>they become "account-less"?
>
>They will become account-less, which only means that the "account"
>column in the message list (if visible) will be empty. If you try to
>resend the message etc, the default account will be used instead.
>



Now that is excellent news.  By contrast, if you delete an account in
Apple's Mail.app it will actually delete the associated mail as well.
The only way to prevent that is to move the mail out of its folder and
into somewhere else first.  Of course you have to KNOW to do that beforehand.

Yet another reason to stick with PowerMail.


--
Tim Lapin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
G4/AGP/400OS 10.3.9PowerMail 5.2.1 640 MB RAM 40+40 GB HDs

Re: IMAP support (was"Re: Updating PM's UI?"

[Willem Smelik]

>In short IMAP messages should be made full citizens of PowerMail, making
>the distinction between IMAP and POP quite small. Why would a user have
>to know they are using IMAP. Why should we settle for less? Why should it
>work any other way?

I could not agree more.

Willem

Re: Basic UI requests

[Raul Vera]

Sean McBride wrote:

>2) i wish there was a key to select the first unread message.
>(Lets say I've just tabbed to the mailboxes pane, pressed up arrow
>several times, and landed on the "PM list" mailbox, then I press tab to
>get into the pane with the subjects.  Then I want to start reading from
>the newest unread post.  What to do?  I have to page down several times,
>then use the mouse to select the message.)
>

Or the oldest unread post, in case you want to read them in
chronological order.

--
Raúl Vera
Director
Orbit 3 Pty Ltd
http://orbit3.com

Re: Basic UI requests

[Sean McBride]

Joseph M Piazza ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on 2005-08-10 14:20 said:

>* Navigating between messages
>
>These functions are incredibly basic for any email application yet

This reminds me of some things I'd very much like to see improved.  I
use the "3 panes - long list" layout and use the tab key to move between
the 3 panes.

1) when using the up and down arrow keys in the mailbox pane, PM is
painfully slow.
(If a folder has many messages, it seems to be looking up the messages
to display the subjects, etc even though I don't want to see inside that
folder, it's just being passed over on the way to where I'm really going.)

2) i wish there was a key to select the first unread message.
(Lets say I've just tabbed to the mailboxes pane, pressed up arrow
several times, and landed on the "PM list" mailbox, then I press tab to
get into the pane with the subjects.  Then I want to start reading from
the newest unread post.  What to do?  I have to page down several times,
then use the mouse to select the message.)

#2 would be the biggest UI improvement for me.

My 2¢

--
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they
are free." - Goethe

Basic UI requests

[Joseph M Piazza]

When using PowerMail, I spend at least 90% of my time doing three things:

* Reading mail

* Deleting Mail (trash & permanent)

* Navigating between messages

These functions are incredibly basic for any email application yet
PowerMail's interface and workflow are -- to me, at least --
unnecessarily rigid. These functions are interrelated; it's difficult to
speak of one without talking about another.  There are a few basic
*additions*  and a few tweaks I've been requesting for years that I have
never seen addressed.



Message View


- I prefer my message window to be as tall as possible while having
the message list and folders at least partly visible.  (This was how I
used Claris Emailer)

- The only way to achieve this is by using a single message window
and step forward or back and optionally deleting messages.

* Suggestion: Add a three column browser layout: folders, message list,
message.  Add a zoom and hide gadget for each column and I may actually
use it.


View, Navigate, and Delete
--

- I delete the OVERWHELMING majority of messages immediately after
reading them.  Considering that it's not unusual for me to receive 100
or more messages a day, this is not a trivial issue.

- In the VAST majority of cases, I will delete and move on the next
message with a single action.  Unfortunately, there are only two ways to
do this and both can be clumsy:

<> The key combination "cmd-option-[" (or "]") is on the right
side of the keyboard meaning right handed users need to take their hand
off their mouse.  It is also awkward (for me, at least) to type: cmd-
index finder, option-thumb, "["-middle finger; using my thumb on cmb
forces me to press option with my finder nail -- ouch.

<> Option-mouse click requires two hands.

* Suggestions:

1. (a) Add new buttons (delete and navigate) for the tool bar (via
customization)

   (b) Allow the buttons to be turned into popups.  Claris Emailer
did this and web browsers have been doing for years; there is nothing
new or strange about adding this feature.

2. Allow the user to assign their own delete-navigate key combination.

Note:  None of these suggestions are mutually exclusive.


Navigate with new messages
--

- Using message windows the way I do, I leave at least one open all
the time.  When at the end of the message list, one of the navigations
buttons is disabled -- as it should be.  Unfortunately, when new
messages arrive, the button is not re-enabled.  There are two
workarounds, both obnoxious

<> click back, then forward.  This is very bad since on occasion
I can lose track of which message I'm on either because a click doesn't
register or my attention wavers for some reason.

<> close the message window and open a new one.  Oy, that's obnoxious.

* Suggestion:  just fix it already.


Spam and Navigation
---

- When marking a message as spam in a message window, the navigation
buttons don't work!  This is totally inconsistent; I expect it to behave
just like a delete.  Note: I don't use Spamsieve.

*Suggestion:  fix it.


Delete
--

- There are two -- and only two -- ways to permanently delete a
message immediately:

<> Use an AppleScript menu item

<> Empty the mail trash

I have a few problems with this:

1. Selecting an AppleScript item is a clumsy process (compared
to buttons and keyboard shortcuts).  This is generally a Good Thing(TM)
since permanent destruction should be more difficult for safety.
HOWEVER, as a commonly used function, it would be nice to allow it to be
less difficult. 

2. The location of the script and it's long name make it doubly
difficult to locate and select; the script menu is *very* cluttered.  A
quick scan of standard menus should make this obvious.  Improving the
situation by changing the name of the script, though simple, is a non-
trivial process.

3.  It is just plain strange; totally nonstandard.  Hundreds if
not thousands of applications allow permanent destruction with mere
dialog box protection.

4.  It's slow.

5.  Stranger still, it is exceeding easy to permanently delete
the *entire* contents of the trash with a preferences setting.  This one
scares me; a single misplaced click and -- poof!

* Suggestions:

1. Give us *standard* menu item.

2. Give us a keyboard shortcut, as an option.

2. If a message is already in the trash, make a delete permanent.
Claris Emailer did this and it is very intuitive.



  joe piazza


---
"Think outside the box -- the box isn't our friend." -- G. Herbert

Re: Updating PM's UI?

[H.R. Riggs]

I would have to say that rather than spend the time updating the UI at
this point, I think the handling of attachments can be improved. I made
the following suggestion a while back, but I repeat it now. I think
others have made the same/similar suggestion.

I used to religiously file attachments in the "appropriate" folder as
they came in. I still do that with some attachments, but I find many
don't really have an appropriate folder and I leave them in the
Attachments folder. This means that the # of files in the Attachments
folder is rather large. It would be nice if PM would automatically file
the attachments in subfolders with names corresponding to the mail
subfolders where the message is stored. This should apply, of course,
only to attachments in the Attachments folder, not to those that I've
moved out of it.

Ron

Re: My problems with PM

[Tom Miller]

A-NO-NE Music sez:
>
>>- Long hyperlink, even with < and >. gets broken by extra space at
>>return.  What I have been doing is to "unwrap" first then delete each
>>space.  I wish this were easier.

On 8/10/05, at 1:11 PM, Michael Lewis, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>I'd like to second this one. I don't remember this being an issue before
>the latest versions, but I admit I could be misremembering. Has it always
>been like this? If so, I must run into it just enough to know it happens,
>but not enough that it's made me complain yet. Since someone else started
>it :)

I've seen this extra space problem before, but I just clicked on a URL
that was on 3 lines and it worked perfectly.

Tom Miller, 10.4.2 & 5.2.1
...
"The only time we see the middle of the road is as  
we run from side to side." R.O.Clark 

Re: My problems with PM

[Michael Lewis]

A-NO-NE Music sez:

>- Long hyperlink, even with < and >. gets broken by extra space at
>return.  What I have been doing is to "unwrap" first then delete each
>space.  I wish this were easier.

I'd like to second this one. I don't remember this being an issue before
the latest versions, but I admit I could be misremembering. Has it always
been like this? If so, I must run into it just enough to know it happens,
but not enough that it's made me complain yet. Since someone else started
it :)

-- 
Michael Lewis
Off Balance Productions
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.offbalance.com

Re: Updating PM's UI?

[Damienn]

From Steve Abrahamson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:23:31 -
0500 [16.23 CET]

>Any plans in that area? Are you guys looking at that fresh coat of paint
>and general tidying that help make apps stay shiney and new?

Let me start by saying: I like very much PowerMail. Both its technology
and design.
I like its clean interface.
For now I only have one design suggestion: the option to change the white
background of its windows (Mail Browser and message composer window) to
some other colour (preferrably some shade of gray). Black text on light-
gray background is easier on the eyes than on white.
So I'd very much welcome the implementation of background colour change
in View Options (similar to the View Options in Finder windows' icon view
settings).
Everyone else who prefer the high-contrast, black-on-white approach would
simply leave this setting on default - as it is now.

-- Damienn
___

"We always believe our first love is our last,
and our last love our first." - Anonymous 

___

My problems with PM

[A-NO-NE Music]

While I have no intention of leaving PM, here are the things I am having
trouble with:

- I am involved with many beta testing.  When people send the bug report
with screenshots embedded within, and is not HTML formatted then I have
no idea which screenshot goes under which paragraph since the attachment
image file names are all generic.  I believe this is an AppleMail
compatibility issue.  I asked not to send embedded images but I was
screamed at, instead :-(

- As a non native English speaker, it is so difficult to read messages
sent from Entourage since these weird characters insertion, i.e., "I1m"
for I'm" is slowing my reading process very slow, and wish there were
any way to remedy this.

- Long hyperlink, even with < and >. gets broken by extra space at
return.  What I have been doing is to "unwrap" first then delete each
space.  I wish this were easier.

- I reported this a while ago but no one seems to be having the same
problem, that whenever I open proc/memory intensive app such as DAW with
a lot of samples loaded into RAM, PM gets unresponsive even after the
said app has been killed.  Every time, I have to restart PM to get the
response back.

-- 

- Hiro

[PROTECTED]
<[PROTECTED]> <[PROTECTED]>

Re: suggestion: easier filtering options

[Mikael Byström]

Tim Lapin said:

>Oh God no.  Please no wizards of any kind.  Rather put in place a proper
>help section.
There is some law of physics that forces you to use a wizard when there
are currently existing alternative ways, is there? Clearly a Wizard will
work for some and others, like you, can leave it alone. 
Just like with the Spam filter wizard today. You do know you can make
those spam filters yourself, right? You don't *have* to use it, though I
think  many find it easier to use a wizard than "understanding" spam
filters (nevermind that would be useful).

>However, while we're on the subject of filters, how about nested or
>complex filters:
>e.g.:   (A or (B and C))?
Yes, please.

PM 5.2.1 | OS X 10.3.9 | Powerbook G4/400 | 768 MB RAM | 30 GB HD

Re: suggestion: easier filtering options

[Mikael Byström]

Steve Abrahamson said:

>Wizards are a software invention to band-aid badly designed software.
>This is why Microsoft has a Wizard for everything.

You guys do have a point, but making filters are *not* easy enough to do
today. Suggest an improved GUI in this department then. How would the
general interface functional structure look and work?

PM 5.2.1 | OS X 10.3.9 | Powerbook G4/400 | 768 MB RAM | 30 GB HD

Re: Updating PM's UI?

[Mikael Byström]

Zeph said:

>As for the main thrust of this thread, I can't see any UI needing much
>changing.  It's clean, which is really all I care about -- nor have I
>heard any complaints from the 160 or so users here who would be prone to
>make noise about such a thing as a bad UI.  

Filters need improvement.

PM 5.2.1 | OS X 10.3.9 | Powerbook G4/400 | 768 MB RAM | 30 GB HD