Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears you are using SDL_Surface instead of SDL_Textures? https://wiki.libsdl.org/MigrationGuide#If_your_game_just_wants_to_get_fully-rendered_frames_to_the_screen One problem is blend modes - many of the pygame blend modes, including the default alphablend mode, aren't in SDL2. Different than the alpha blend mode in SDL_SetSurfaceBlendMode https://wiki.libsdl.org/SDL_SetSurfaceBlendMode, SDL_SetTextureBlendMode https://wiki.libsdl.org/SDL_SetTextureBlendMode, and SDL_SetRenderDrawBlendMode https://wiki.libsdl.org/SDL_SetRenderDrawBlendMode ? -- Jake
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
The cffi bindings have the downside that iOS doesn't work. On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 5:15 AM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: The cffi style bindings would be so tempting because they get away from all the binary challenges. Originally, the SDL bindings needed some utility C code to be useful. After a quick review of SDL2, that seems way less true. I was hoping to find better hosting on the Bitbucket site for open soure projects, but I could not. Not even I have access to the repo. (Not that I would have used it in the last many years). On 07/11/2015 05:20 PM, Lenard Lindstrom wrote: Hi Peter, On 15-07-10 07:47 PM, Peter Shinners wrote: I haven't been paying close attention to Pygame, but it doesn't seem controversial to say things have stalled. I haven't gotten much feedback from Rene, but I'd like to give him time to put something together. Some of the main things that may need help are: * Getting 1.9.2 actually released Much of the delay is due to logistics. With the loss of the automated build site a few years back there is no simple way to check a commit against all supported operating systems. It also limits user testing. I need someone to take over official Windows support from me, since I am stuck on Windows XP. I have the MinGW based dependency build chain working again for 32bit Windows, but did not get everything to build for 64bit Windows. So no official 64bit prebuilt libraries yet on the Bitbucket download page. Pygame 1.9.2 is nearly ready for release on Linux. I have tackled the Linux specific issues I could find, and am now going through the operating system independent issues. * Moving on to Pygame 2, whatever that means Yes, Pygame 2 is overdue. A while back I proposed we wait until Pygame 1.9.2 was released before starting on 2.0. The plan was to clear out the Pygame bugs with SDL 1.2 before moving on to SDL 2. But I also expected we would be done with 1.9.2 long before now. Anyway, a few months back I started a Pygame 1.9.2 patch, https://bitbucket.org/llindstrom/pygame-1.10-patch, that replaces SDL 1.2 with SDL 2.0 api calls. Though it uses SDL 2, it tries to remain Pygame 1.9.2 compatible, so adds no new SDL 2 features. It is only a bridge to Pygame 2.0. Though it fails unit tests and needs more work, it is usable now with SDL 2 from GIT (Earlier SDL 2 releases have buggy 24 bits-per-pixel surface support.). The structure of SDL 2 differs from SDL 1.2. It does not fit well Pygame's api. So I expect a significant redesign of modules and classes for Pygame 2. For instance, the display module will basically go away, replaced with a Window class. This is an opportunity to replace C coded extension modules with Cython and a Python level foreign function interface. Personally, I would like to see Pygame fully support PyPy as well as CPython. Also, some of the Pygame code can be separated out as stand-alone, Python independent, libraries to encourage support from outside the Pygame community. * Catch up on the Bitbucket pull requests The 5 member limit for a Bitbucket project team is a nuisance. * Website replacement and love * Migrate forum to Reddit (or community forum) It seems there are still many great people involved with the Pygame project. Perhaps I can help by getting those people the control they need to make progress. I'm completely detached from things at this point, so I don't have any context to jump in and try to change anything. What parts of the project are going well these days?
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
cases. I expect much of the code that defines extension classes will be rewritten. Pygame extensions to SDL, such as custom blitters, may be salvaged. Much of the work will be writing code to support the new SDL 2.0 features. There's also the problem of Texture vs Surfaces. For future code to be backwards compatible we can default to Texture. But if the user needs pixel access he will need to create a Texture and Surface. The 3 options are summarized: https://wiki.libsdl.org/MigrationGuide#Video I'm pretty sure it should be possible to make a version of pygame that runs existing pygame code while exposing new features to new code - allowing people to exploit much of their existing knowledge. and On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Lenard Lindstrom le...@telus.net wrote: Hi Jake, For the parts of SDL2 that did not see a major redesign, such as Surfaces, there are enough small differences that simply replacing SDL 1.2 calls with equivalent SDL 2.0 functions is not enough. The event types SDL2 posts has undergone some reorganization. There is no longer a clear mapping equivalence SDL 2.0 and 1.2 in some Do you think we should start pygame2 to support SDL2 design decisions rather than trying to support both old and new code at once? I figured if there was a time to make potentially breaking design changes to follow modern SDL, now would be the time to do it. If we decide pygame2 must be fully backward compatible, I was worried it would limit future changes. Or that supporting both old with new is adding too much complexity for something that might not be needed? -- Jake
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
I like the sound of all of this. On 07/13/2015 06:02 AM, René Dudfield wrote: Hi, a few notes: * I have dropped the ball, but would like to finish the new website and get 1.9.2 out the door. * pygame_sdl2 seems the best choice going forward. For backward compat reasons, platform support, and C/asm code is needed. Many things have been put into SDL and related libs already, and this is a good way to go to share with other SDL projects. * seul.org http://seul.org has only been used for the mailing list for a number of years (7 years maybe?). * there are many other considerations which the new website addresses. Reddit integration, and bitbucket is done. Also, fun is important, as is integration with youtube and other ways of sharing work (like playing music can be done on the new website too). * I have done some thinking with Tom about how to do a migration with pygame_sdl2 to the pygame infrastructure. * nothing has stopped contributors for 1.9.2 being released. Many people have admin access to the bitbucket repo, and there has been some work been done. * ... more to come. best, On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 6:10 AM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org mailto:p...@shinners.org wrote: Yes! I'm motivated to make some changes sooner than later. If we really need to we can do some amount of reverting. I think it's time to move off of the seul.org http://seul.org hosting Pygame has had since day 1. This was such a great choice back in 2004. But nowadays there's many options beyond sourceforge! As soon as we switch the DNS the pygame mailing list may be inaccessible. I think the following things should be in order before switching. 1. New website with some amount of placeholders or redirects to the popular pages of the current site. 2. New forum or mailing option. 3. Get documentation on readthedocs.org http://readthedocs.org? On 07/12/2015 05:05 PM, Jason Marshall wrote: René Dudfield, pygame's lead developer, has contributed significant Python, C and assembly code to pygame and has generously hosted the pygame.org http://pygame.org website for years. We all should be thankful for that. However, René has not been active on this mailing list for almost 3 months. I guess that René has new priorities that have overtaken his interest in pygame, so I think that he should pass his leadership role to a new leader or leadership committee. (I'd prefer a leadership committee so that pygame's development would not be so susceptible to stalling if one person's priorities change.) I have opinions on what the website's features should be and what pygame2 should be, but I don't think that we're ready to discuss those topics yet. We need active leadership first. To me, the pygame leader is the person (or people) in control of the official pygame.org http://pygame.org website. Fortunately, Pete Shinners is the person who keeps the pygame.org http://pygame.org name registered, so, even if René remains inactive, it would be technically possible Pete to redirect the pygame.org http://pygame.org name to a new official website that would be under different leadership. So here's the question for Pete: Pete, if René remains uninvolved, would you be willing to point pygame.org http://pygame.org at a new website? Jason PS. Sorry about the coup d'état suggestion, René. On Friday, July 10, 2015 10:05 PM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org mailto:p...@shinners.org wrote: I haven't been paying close attention to Pygame, but it doesn't seem controversial to say things have stalled. I haven't gotten much feedback from Rene, but I'd like to give him time to put something together. Some of the main things that may need help are: * Getting 1.9.2 actually released * Moving on to Pygame 2, whatever that means * Catch up on the Bitbucket pull requests * Website replacement and love * Migrate forum to Reddit (or community forum) It seems there are still many great people involved with the Pygame project. Perhaps I can help by getting those people the control they need to make progress. I'm completely detached from things at this point, so I don't have any context to jump in and try to change anything. What parts of the project are going well these days?
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
René, What aspects of being the lead developer website maintainer give you enjoyment and pride?And which parts of your roles are a bore or a nuisance to you? I want to help you to find the job in the pygame community that gives you the most satisfaction and maximizes the impact of your talents. I do not want people to have unrealistic expectations of you though, and I want to maximize the impact of others' talents too. Thanks, Jason On Monday, July 13, 2015 8:02 AM, René Dudfield ren...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, a few notes: - I have dropped the ball, but would like to finish the new website and get 1.9.2 out the door. - pygame_sdl2 seems the best choice going forward. For backward compat reasons, platform support, and C/asm code is needed. Many things have been put into SDL and related libs already, and this is a good way to go to share with other SDL projects. - seul.org has only been used for the mailing list for a number of years (7 years maybe?). - there are many other considerations which the new website addresses. Reddit integration, and bitbucket is done. Also, fun is important, as is integration with youtube and other ways of sharing work (like playing music can be done on the new website too). - I have done some thinking with Tom about how to do a migration with pygame_sdl2 to the pygame infrastructure. - nothing has stopped contributors for 1.9.2 being released. Many people have admin access to the bitbucket repo, and there has been some work been done. - ... more to come. best, On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 6:10 AM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: Yes! I'm motivated to make some changes sooner than later. If we really need to we can do some amount of reverting. I think it's time to move off of the seul.org hosting Pygame has had since day 1. This was such a great choice back in 2004. But nowadays there's many options beyond sourceforge! As soon as we switch the DNS the pygame mailing list may be inaccessible. I think the following things should be in order before switching. 1. New website with some amount of placeholders or redirects to the popular pages of the current site. 2. New forum or mailing option. 3. Get documentation on readthedocs.org? On 07/12/2015 05:05 PM, Jason Marshall wrote: René Dudfield, pygame's lead developer, has contributed significant Python, C and assembly code to pygame and has generously hosted the pygame.org website for years. We all should be thankful for that. However, René has not been active on this mailing list for almost 3 months. I guess that René has new priorities that have overtaken his interest in pygame, so I think that he should pass his leadership role to a new leader or leadership committee. (I'd prefer a leadership committee so that pygame's development would not be so susceptible to stalling if one person's priorities change.) I have opinions on what the website's features should be and what pygame2 should be, but I don't think that we're ready to discuss those topics yet. We need active leadership first. To me, the pygame leader is the person (or people) in control of the official pygame.org website. Fortunately, Pete Shinners is the person who keeps the pygame.org name registered, so, even if René remains inactive, it would be technically possible Pete to redirect the pygame.org name to a new official website that would be under different leadership. So here's the question for Pete: Pete, if René remains uninvolved, would you be willing to point pygame.org at a new website? Jason PS. Sorry about the coup d'état suggestion, René. On Friday, July 10, 2015 10:05 PM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: I haven't been paying close attention to Pygame, but it doesn't seem controversial to say things have stalled. I haven't gotten much feedback from Rene, but I'd like to give him time to put something together. Some of the main things that may need help are: * Getting 1.9.2 actually released * Moving on to Pygame 2, whatever that means * Catch up on the Bitbucket pull requests * Website replacement and love * Migrate forum to Reddit (or community forum) It seems there are still many great people involved with the Pygame project. Perhaps I can help by getting those people the control they need to make progress. I'm completely detached from things at this point, so I don't have any context to jump in and try to change anything. What parts of the project are going well these days?
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
Hi, a few notes: - I have dropped the ball, but would like to finish the new website and get 1.9.2 out the door. - pygame_sdl2 seems the best choice going forward. For backward compat reasons, platform support, and C/asm code is needed. Many things have been put into SDL and related libs already, and this is a good way to go to share with other SDL projects. - seul.org has only been used for the mailing list for a number of years (7 years maybe?). - there are many other considerations which the new website addresses. Reddit integration, and bitbucket is done. Also, fun is important, as is integration with youtube and other ways of sharing work (like playing music can be done on the new website too). - I have done some thinking with Tom about how to do a migration with pygame_sdl2 to the pygame infrastructure. - nothing has stopped contributors for 1.9.2 being released. Many people have admin access to the bitbucket repo, and there has been some work been done. - ... more to come. best, On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 6:10 AM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: Yes! I'm motivated to make some changes sooner than later. If we really need to we can do some amount of reverting. I think it's time to move off of the seul.org hosting Pygame has had since day 1. This was such a great choice back in 2004. But nowadays there's many options beyond sourceforge! As soon as we switch the DNS the pygame mailing list may be inaccessible. I think the following things should be in order before switching. 1. New website with some amount of placeholders or redirects to the popular pages of the current site. 2. New forum or mailing option. 3. Get documentation on readthedocs.org? On 07/12/2015 05:05 PM, Jason Marshall wrote: René Dudfield, pygame's lead developer, has contributed significant Python, C and assembly code to pygame and has generously hosted the pygame.org website for years. We all should be thankful for that. However, René has not been active on this mailing list for almost 3 months. I guess that René has new priorities that have overtaken his interest in pygame, so I think that he should pass his leadership role to a new leader or leadership committee. (I'd prefer a leadership committee so that pygame's development would not be so susceptible to stalling if one person's priorities change.) I have opinions on what the website's features should be and what pygame2 should be, but I don't think that we're ready to discuss those topics yet. We need active leadership first. To me, the pygame leader is the person (or people) in control of the official pygame.org website. Fortunately, Pete Shinners is the person who keeps the pygame.org name registered, so, even if René remains inactive, it would be technically possible Pete to redirect the pygame.org name to a new official website that would be under different leadership. So here's the question for Pete: Pete, if René remains uninvolved, would you be willing to point pygame.org at a new website? Jason PS. Sorry about the coup d'état suggestion, René. On Friday, July 10, 2015 10:05 PM, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: I haven't been paying close attention to Pygame, but it doesn't seem controversial to say things have stalled. I haven't gotten much feedback from Rene, but I'd like to give him time to put something together. Some of the main things that may need help are: * Getting 1.9.2 actually released * Moving on to Pygame 2, whatever that means * Catch up on the Bitbucket pull requests * Website replacement and love * Migrate forum to Reddit (or community forum) It seems there are still many great people involved with the Pygame project. Perhaps I can help by getting those people the control they need to make progress. I'm completely detached from things at this point, so I don't have any context to jump in and try to change anything. What parts of the project are going well these days?
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
Hi, On 15-07-13 04:09 AM, Jake b wrote: cases. I expect much of the code that defines extension classes will be rewritten. Pygame extensions to SDL, such as custom blitters, may be salvaged. Much of the work will be writing code to support the new SDL 2.0 features. There's also the problem of Texture vs Surfaces. For future code to be backwards compatible we can default to Texture. But if the user needs pixel access he will need to create a Texture and Surface. The 3 options are summarized: https://wiki.libsdl.org/MigrationGuide#Video Actually, Pygame Surfaces would stay about the same. What would go are such pixel format manipulations such as set_masks(). SDL2 has a strict policy on valid formats. Textures would be an addition. I see Textures as a limited form of Surface. In fact, Textures and Surfaces could share a common parent class. Also, SDL2 does support display surfaces and the flip and update operations. They are tied to individual windows rather than being global operations. I'm pretty sure it should be possible to make a version of pygame that runs existing pygame code while exposing new features to new code - allowing people to exploit much of their existing knowledge. and On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 8:48 PM, Lenard Lindstrom le...@telus.net mailto:le...@telus.net wrote: Hi Jake, For the parts of SDL2 that did not see a major redesign, such as Surfaces, there are enough small differences that simply replacing SDL 1.2 calls with equivalent SDL 2.0 functions is not enough. The event types SDL2 posts has undergone some reorganization. There is no longer a clear mapping equivalence SDL 2.0 and 1.2 in some Do you think we should start pygame2 to support SDL2 design decisions rather than trying to support both old and new code at once? I figured if there was a time to make potentially breaking design changes to follow modern SDL, now would be the time to do it. If we decide pygame2 must be fully backward compatible, I was worried it would limit future changes. Or that supporting both old with new is adding too much complexity for something that might not be needed? Pygame2 can never be fully backward compatible. SDL2 is more strict that SDL 1.2 in some areas. Overlays and cd rom support are gone. Pygame2 can support a large subset of Pygame1 though. -- Jake
Re: [pygame] Problem with pytmx and tiled
On 07/13/2015 09:01 AM, ck421 wrote: Hello, I am new to these forums and to pygame in general. I have been trying to use pytmx in order to load in a tiled .tmx file but I keep getting this error: File C:\Python32\lib\site-packages\pytmx\pytmx.py, line 258, in __init__ self.parse_xml(ElementTree.parse(self.filename).getroot()) File C:\Python32\lib\site-packages\pytmx\pytmx.py, line 280, in parse_xml self.add_layer(TiledTileLayer(self, subnode)) File C:\Python32\lib\site-packages\pytmx\pytmx.py, line 821, in __init__ self.parse_xml(node) File C:\Python32\lib\site-packages\pytmx\pytmx.py, line 864, in parse_xml data = b64decode(data_node.text.strip()) File C:\Python32\lib\base64.py, line 83, in b64decode raise TypeError(expected bytes, not %s % s.__class__.__name__) TypeError: expected bytes, not str I am running python 3.2.4 and pygame 3.2. The code I am trying to run is this: import sys, pygame, pytmx from pygame.locals import * tiled_map = pytmx.TiledMap(map.tmx) Like I said, I am new to this entire interface, so could anyone help me figure out this problem? I suspect that you are using an older version of PyTMX that doesn't have Py3 support. How did you get the library?
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
On 07/12/2015 10:05 AM, Paul Vincent Craven wrote: * I don't think a Pygame website needs to be build on Python. I've got the pygame.info http://pygame.info domain and I think a Wordpress site that has several verified contributers would be the way to go. Share the 'love' and efforts across several people. It isn't a requirement. However, I'm a full-stack developer who uses Python so that's what would make sense for me. Not a big fan of Wordpress to be honest.
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
Hi, As a long-time member here, I recall many *many* different attempts to redesign the website. Three in memory, which is several years. Probably more if I looked through my archives. The model is that someone gets fed up with the current design and mentions it on this list. There's some discussion and then everyone basically agrees that the old design is lacking at least somewhat, but there forms a schism between those who want to update the old site and those who want to start over. Usually, it devolves into the start-over people just going ahead and making the remake, hoping it will be adopted. The result is semi-promising, but since it is feature-deficient, no one wants to convert everything (and the website maintainer(s) remained basically quiet throughout the whole process anyway). Since there was no commitment to use it, the remake eventually dies and everyone forgets about it in disgust. Then, each time, I post a message like this and hope people will choose a different model this time. Ian
Re: [pygame] Problem with pytmx and tiled
Assuming you're using a PyTMX version 2.16.5, this looks like a bug in its Python 3 support. I'd try replacing data = b64decode(data_node.text.strip()) with something like data = b64decode(data_node.text.strip().encode()) and seeing if that improves anything. But this isn't a PyGame issue. Ian
[pygame] erratic behavior with 'display.update(Rect)'
Greetings! I am seeing what seems to be erratic behavior with 'display.update()' when used with a Rect argument. In all cases but one, it works fine with 'display.update(name of Rect object)'. In the exception case, it has no effect on the referenced Rect area. MY QUESTIONS Is it possible that the cause is that OPENGL is being used by pygame? The doc' mentions that 'display.update()' generates an exception when used with OPENGL. I'm wondering whether instead of generating an exception, it's being unstable. If display.update()' doesn't work with OPENGL, what do you use to update just one area of the display? I'm using Debian Stable out of the box. Regards, Tom Arnall On 7/10/15, Peter Shinners p...@shinners.org wrote: I haven't been paying close attention to Pygame, but it doesn't seem controversial to say things have stalled. I haven't gotten much feedback from Rene, but I'd like to give him time to put something together. Some of the main things that may need help are: * Getting 1.9.2 actually released * Moving on to Pygame 2, whatever that means * Catch up on the Bitbucket pull requests * Website replacement and love * Migrate forum to Reddit (or community forum) It seems there are still many great people involved with the Pygame project. Perhaps I can help by getting those people the control they need to make progress. I'm completely detached from things at this point, so I don't have any context to jump in and try to change anything. What parts of the project are going well these days? -- .. Faced with the possibility of its extinction, every species finds within itself powers unimaginable in the days of its complacency. They make the words of sounds and things their property and use them to divide us. But they will never own the words in our eyes. .. A strong drachma and global crowdfunding to pay for imports of necessities until her economy recovers. Either that or more bankster hell for all of us.
Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project?
In 2009, there was a prototype of a redesign of the pygame website. It was written in Python (Django) instead of PHP (SiteSwing). The redesign was not adopted and the people who had worked it lost interest in volunteering and left the pygame community. http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.pygame/24070/ The code for this redesign still exists at https://code.google.com/p/pygame/downloads/detail?name=pygweb1.0.tar.gzcan=2q= Jason Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android From:Daniel Foerster pydsig...@gmail.com Date:Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 4:03 PM Subject:Re: [pygame] What's next for Pygame project? On 07/12/2015 10:05 AM, Paul Vincent Craven wrote: I don't think a Pygame website needs to be build on Python. I've got the pygame.info domain and I think a Wordpress site that has several verified contributers would be the way to go. Share the 'love' and efforts across several people. It isn't a requirement. However, I'm a full-stack developer who uses Python so that's what would make sense for me. Not a big fan of Wordpress to be honest.
Re: [pygame] erratic behavior with 'display.update(Rect)'
On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 6:54 PM tom arnall kloro2...@gmail.com wrote: If display.update()' doesn't work with OPENGL, what do you use to update just one area of the display? There isn't a way to update a portion of the display using OpenGL. OpenGL expects you to redraw the screen from scratch every frame, and then flip to the next frame. How are you drawing to the screen? Are you using GL calls? Or pygame blits to the screen surface? The later doesn't work with OPENGL.
Re: [pygame] erratic behavior with 'display.update(Rect)'
On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 5:34 PM, Tom Rothamel t...@rothamel.us wrote: There isn't a way to update a portion of the display using OpenGL. OpenGL expects you to redraw the screen from scratch every frame, and then flip to the next frame. How are you drawing to the screen? Are you using GL calls? Or pygame blits to the screen surface? The later doesn't work with OPENGL. Yes and: Is it possible that the cause is that OPENGL is being used by pygame? On Windows, afaik, this only happens if you request it with the pygame.OPENGL flag. Nevertheless, inspecting the value of the following should say for sure: import os print(os.environ[SDL_VIDEODRIVER]) Pro-tip: IIRC, you can also *set* that value to whatever you like *before* you initialize PyGame. Some values http://sdl.beuc.net/sdl.wiki/SDL_envvars. Ian
