why __repr__ affected after __getattr__ overloaded?

[Roc Zhou]

Now I have to design a class that overload __getattr__, but after
that, I found the __repr__ have been affected. This is a simple
example model:
#!/usr/bin/env python

class test:
def __init__(self):
self.x = 1
def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
try:
return self.__dict__[attr_name]
except KeyError:
self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
return self.__dict__[attr_name]

t = test()
print t.x
print t.y
print type(t)
T = t
print T.x
print t

So far, I want the operation print t still return test instance
at ..., but the reuslt is:
sh$ python test.py
1
inexistent
type 'instance'
1
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File testtree.py, line 23, in ?
print t
TypeError: 'str' object is not callable

I also tried to overload __repr__ itself:

#!/usr/bin/env python

class test:
def __init__(self):
self.x = 1
def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
try:
return self.__dict__[attr_name]
except KeyError:
self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
return self.__dict__[attr_name]
def __repr__(self):
return 'test.__repr__'

t = test()
print t.x
print t.y
print type(t)
T = t
print T.x
print t

But the result remains:
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File testtree.py, line 23, in ?
print t
TypeError: 'str' object is not callable

So why? What is the principles?

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why __repr__ affected after __getattr__ overloaded?

[Roc Zhou]

Now I have to design a class that overload __getattr__, but after that, I
found the __repr__ have been affected. This is a simple example model:
#!/usr/bin/env python

class test:
   def __init__(self):
   self.x = 1
   def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
   try:
   return self.__dict__[attr_name]
   except KeyError:
   self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
   return self.__dict__[attr_name]

t = test()
print t.x
print t.y
print type(t)
T = t
print T.x
print t

So far, I want the operation print t still return test instance at
..., but the reuslt is:
sh$ python test.py
1
inexistent
type 'instance'
1
Traceback (most recent call last):
 File testtree.py, line 23, in ?
   print t
TypeError: 'str' object is not callable

I also tried to overload __repr__ itself:

#!/usr/bin/env python

class test:
   def __init__(self):
   self.x = 1
   def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
   try:
   return self.__dict__[attr_name]
   except KeyError:
   self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
   return self.__dict__[attr_name]
   def __repr__(self):
   return 'test.__repr__'

t = test()
print t.x
print t.y
print type(t)
T = t
print T.x
print t

But the result remains:
Traceback (most recent call last):
 File testtree.py, line 23, in ?
   print t
TypeError: 'str' object is not callable

So why? What is the principles?
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Re: comparing two lists and returning position

[Neil Cerutti]

On 2007-06-22, hiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi there, I have a 2 lists.. for simplicities sake lets say the are:

 l1 = [ 'abc' 'ghi' 'mno' ]

 l2 = [ 'abc' 'def' 'ghi' 'jkl 'mno' 'pqr']

 what I need to do is compare l1 against l2 and return the position
 of where each object in l1 is in l2

 ie: pos = 0, 2, 4

 Thanks in advance, -h

Come, come! You can try harder than that.

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gettext and __doc__ for class methods?

[Roc Zhou]

from gettext import gettext as _

__doc__ = _(module docstrings)

class test:
   __doc__ = _(class docstrings)
   def __setattr__(self, attr_name, value):
   _(class method docstrings)

But I found when the module and class docstrings take effect(must use
__doc__ to specify it), the class-method gettext docstrings takes no effect,
only:
   def __setattr__(self, attr_name, value):
   class method only english docstrings
has effect.

So any suggestions?

Thanks.
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Type of __builtins__ changes from module import to execution?

[Adam Hupp]

I've noticed some unexpected behavior with __builtins__ during module
import.  It seems that during module import __builtins__  is a dict
but at all other times it is a module.

For example, if the file testmod.py has these contents:

print type(__builtins__)
print has str attr, hasattr(__builtins__, 'str')

The output differs depending on how it is run:

$ python ~/testmod.py
type 'module'
has str True

vs.

$ python -c 'import testmod'
type 'dict'
has str False

Anyone know if there a reason for this behavior?Is it a bug?  I've
seen this in 2.4 and 3.0.

-Adam

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Re: Issues with nonfunctioning VTK under python 2.5

[Robert Kern]

Eric Carlson wrote:

 Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Please bring these bug reports to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and possibly make
a ticket on our Trac.

  https://mail.enthought.com/mailman/listinfo/enthought-dev
  https://svn.enthought.com/enthought

Thanks.

-- 
Robert Kern

I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma
 that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had
 an underlying truth.
  -- Umberto Eco

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Re: subprocess.popen question

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

On Jun 21, 1:22 am, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 En Wed, 20 Jun 2007 22:28:06 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:





  On Jun 20, 7:50 pm, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:
  En Wed, 20 Jun 2007 20:02:52 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
   On Jun 20, 1:46 pm, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   wrote:

   cmd = [gawk, -f, altertime.awk, -v, time_offset=4, -v,
   outfile=testdat.sco, i1.sco]
   Now, what do you want to do with the output? Printing it line by  
  line?
   output = subprocess.Popen(cmd,  
  stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
   lines = output.splitlines()
   for line in lines:
  print line

C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py
   Traceback (most recent call last):
File C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py, line 14, in
   last_line = subprocess.Popen([cmd],
   stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 593, in __init__
   errread, errwrite)
File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 793, in _execute_child
   startupinfo)
   WindowsError: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
   Script terminated.

   I can write it out as a batch file and then run it but that is a messy
   hack..

  If cmd is a list of arguments, like the example above, you should use
  subprocess.Popen(cmd,...) (like the example above, too).

  I had cut and pasted the example in to get that error...  could it be
  a problem with ms windows??? (I am at a library computer befour work
  so that ended my testing)

 Note the call to subprocess.Popen- is the first argument [cmd] or cmd?
 What do you get with print repr(cmd)?
 Do you have gawk installed on that machine too?

 --
 Gabriel Genellina- Hide quoted text -

 - Show quoted text -

gawk is installed..  I do fine when I just call gawk I get all the
options to use with it but the minute I try to use the options with it
I have problems.  I have done it with batch files but then I would
have to write out a batch file and then run the batch file.  seems
like more work than I should have to do to use options with a command
line program..  I have done this in other cases with os.startfile and
other cases and would like to fix it.

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Re: Changing the names of python keywords and functions

[Martin v. Löwis]

 koristiti OS- (THIS IS MY IMAGINARY EXAMPLE OF KEYWORD),
 my program must write this code in some user file, but my
 program must read this command like: import os.How
 can I do something like that??
 The keywords are listed in Grammar/Grammar. You need to edit
 this file, then recompile.
 
 To clarify, are you suggesting changing the source code of the Python
 implementation and recompiling it?

Correct.

 If the keywords are changed in the Python executable, won't that break
 the import of any Python module written for the standard keywords --
 such as many of those in the standard library?

Most certainly, yes.

 My understanding of the original poster's requirement was that the
 keywords should be additional to, not replacement for, the existing
 Python keywords.

So he should make them additional in the grammar, too.

It is entirely beyond me *why* the OP wants to do that, but changing
the compiler would be the proper way of implementing that change.

Regards,
Martin
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Re: comparing two lists and returning position

[Paul Rubin]

hiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 what I need to do is compare l1 against l2 and return the position
 of where each object in l1 is in l2
 
 ie: pos = 0, 2, 4

Is it September already?

from itertools import izip
pos = map(dict(izip(l2, count())).__getitem__, l1)

Heh heh heh.
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Re: How to Encode Parameters into an HTML Parsing Script

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Thu, 21 Jun 2007 23:37:07 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:

 So for example if I wanted to navigate to an encoded url
 http://online.investools.com/landing.iedu?signedin=true rather than
 just http://online.investools.com/landing.iedu   How would I do this?
 How can I modify the script to urlencode these parameters:
 {signedin:true} and to associate them with a specific url from the
 urlList

If you want to use GET, append '?' plus the encoded parameters to the  
desired url:

py data = {'signedin':'true', 'another':42}
py print urlencode(data)
signedin=trueanother=42

Do not use the data argument to urlopen.

-- 
Gabriel Genellina

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Re: why __repr__ affected after __getattr__ overloaded?

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Fri, 22 Jun 2007 00:30:43 -0300, Roc Zhou [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
escribió:

 Now I have to design a class that overload __getattr__, but after
 that, I found the __repr__ have been affected. This is a simple
 example model:

You are creating many attributes with value inexistent, even special  
methods. Put a print statement and see what happens:

 #!/usr/bin/env python

 class test:
 def __init__(self):
 self.x = 1
 def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
 try:
 return self.__dict__[attr_name]
 except KeyError:
   print Now creating:,attr_name
 self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
 return self.__dict__[attr_name]

-- 
Gabriel Genellina

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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Robert Brown]

Stephen R Laniel [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 Granted, in a dynamic language we won't always (maybe won't
 often) have a situation where the types are known this well
 at compile time. But sometimes we will. And it would be nice
 to catch these before the program even runs.

 So my question is: would bolting on static type checking
 when we can, no type checking when we can't be too much
 to ask?

Common Lisp allows the programmer to optionally provide type declarations to
improve readability or performance.  Certain implementations of Common Lisp,
such as cmucl and sbcl, check type declarations at compile time, employ type
interence to generate efficient machine code, and insert run time checks
when the compiler can't prove at compile time that variables have their
declared types.
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Re: Google breaks international charset messages

[Ben Finney]

Evan Klitzke [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Ironically, you're sending out us-ascii encoded emails as well.

Yes, because I was (a) replying to a message already in that encoding,
and (b) that encoding was sufficient to encode all the characters in
my message.

Where the original poster's message says that he posted a message with
Chinese characters, and the message was munged by Google to the
us-ascii charset.

-- 
 \   It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once.  |
  `\ -- David Hume |
_o__)  |
Ben Finney
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Re: subprocess.popen question

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Fri, 22 Jun 2007 01:05:36 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:

   cmd = [gawk, -f, altertime.awk, -v, time_offset=4, -v,
   outfile=testdat.sco, i1.sco]
   output = subprocess.Popen(cmd,
  stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
   lines = output.splitlines()
   for line in lines:
  print line

C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py
   Traceback (most recent call last):
File C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py, line 14, in
   last_line = subprocess.Popen([cmd],
   stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 593, in __init__
   errread, errwrite)
File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 793, in _execute_child
   startupinfo)
   WindowsError: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
   Script terminated.

   I can write it out as a batch file and then run it but that is a  
 messy
   hack..

  If cmd is a list of arguments, like the example above, you should use
  subprocess.Popen(cmd,...) (like the example above, too).

  I had cut and pasted the example in to get that error...  could it be
  a problem with ms windows??? (I am at a library computer befour work
  so that ended my testing)

 Note the call to subprocess.Popen- is the first argument [cmd] or cmd?
 What do you get with print repr(cmd)?
 Do you have gawk installed on that machine too?

 gawk is installed..  I do fine when I just call gawk I get all the
 options to use with it but the minute I try to use the options with it
 I have problems.  I have done it with batch files but then I would
 have to write out a batch file and then run the batch file.  seems
 like more work than I should have to do to use options with a command
 line program..  I have done this in other cases with os.startfile and
 other cases and would like to fix it.

Ok, but please check *what* are the arguments to Popen. If cmd is a *list*  
as shown on the first quoted line on this message, you should call  
subprocess.Popen(cmd, ...) as shown on the third line on this message, but  
your traceback shows that you are using Popen([cmd], ...)
Can you see the difference?

-- 
Gabriel Genellina

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Re: Python's only one way to do it philosophy isn't good?

[Robert Brown]

Neil Cerutti [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 On 2007-06-21, Douglas Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 A prime example of this is how CLOS, the Common Lisp Object System was
 implemented completely as a loadable library (with the help of many
 macros) into Common Lisp, which was not an OO language prior to the
 adoption of CLOS.

 Is there a second example? ;)

There are many useful macro packages that syntactically extend Common Lisp.
Here are a few representative examples.


compan implementation of list comprehensions
http://rali.iro.umontreal.ca/Publications/urls/LapalmeLispComp.pdf

iterate a domain specific language for expressing complex iteration
http://common-lisp.net/project/iterate/

screamersupport for nondeterministic programming
http://www.cis.upenn.edu/~screamer-tools/screamer-intro.html

cl-who  a domain specific language for HTML generation
http://weitz.de/cl-who/

parenscript a domain specific language for JavaScript generation
http://common-lisp.net/project/parenscript/
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Re: Internationalised email subjects

[Martin v. Löwis]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb:
 That's really strange.  The chinese characters I am inputing into the
 post are not being displayed.  Basically, what I am doing is this:
 
 h = Header('(Some Chinese characters inserted here', 'GB2312')

What encoding do Some Chinese characters have at that point?

1. Don't try this at the interactive prompt. It will completely confuse
   you. Instead, use IDLE.
2. In IDLE, put
  # -*- coding: utf-8 -*-
  into the top of the source code file.
3. Write the header as a Unicode string, i.e. with a u prefix
4. Explicitly encode it, such as

h = Header(u'(Some Chinese characters inserted here'.encode('GB2312'),
'GB2312')

If you are *not* inserting the characters from the Python source
code directly, go back to my original question: What are the
characters encoded in?

HTH,
Martin
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assert annoyance

[Paul Rubin]

So I have some assert statements in my code to verify the absence of
some impossible conditions.  They were useful in debugging and of
course I left them in place for real runs of the program.  Umpteen
hours into a run, an assertion failed, and of course since failure
was impossible, I didn't catch the exception so the whole program
crashed.  I don't know what I'd have done with the exception anyway,
since it would have had to be caught at an outer scope where the
data I cared about was no longer around, or else I'd have had to
predict in advance what I needed to examine and pass that as a
an arg to the assert statement.

What I really want is for any assertion failure, anywhere in the
program, to trap to the debugger WITHOUT blowing out of the scope
where the failure happened, so I can examine the local frame.  That
just seems natural, but I don't see an obvious way to do it.  Am I
missing something?  I guess I could replace all the assertions with
function calls that launch pdb, but why bother having an assert
statement?
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Re: Python's only one way to do it philosophy isn't good?

[Douglas Alan]

Terry Reedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 | It allows the community to develop language features in a modular way
 | without having to sully the code base for the language itself.
 [etc]

 Some of the strongest opposition to adding macros to Python comes
 from people like Alex Martelli who have had experience with them in
 *multi-person production* projects.  He claimed in various posts
 that the net effect was to reduce productivity.  So convince us (and
 Guido!) that he is wrong ;-)

I'm not convinced that Guido is wrong because I know that he has at
least occasionally mused that he might someday consider a macro
facility for Python.

Alex Martelli, on the other hand, although an extremely smart guy,
seems to me to often be over-opinionated and dismissive.

Regarding being on a project where people used macros poorly, I've
also been on projects where people did a poor job of OO design, and a
non-OO design would have been better than the crappy OO design that
was ultimately used.  Does that mean that we should remove the OO
features from Python?

Paul Graham made it rich implementing Yahoo Stores in Lisp, and claims
that heavy use of macros is one of the reasons that he was able to
stay well-ahead of all the competition.  So, maybe Paul and Alex can
duke it out.  Personally, I like Paul's style better.  And he's made a
lot more money using his theory of software design.

 But I would prefer you somehow try to help make usable multi-arg and 
 predicate dispatch a reality.

Alas, I can't stand programming in C, so there's no way I'm going to
dive that deeply into the CPython code base.  If I could help
implement it in Python itself, using a good macro facility, sign me up!

|oug
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Re: comparing two lists and returning position

[Charles Sanders]

Paul Rubin wrote:
 
 from itertools import izip
 pos = map(dict(izip(l2, count())).__getitem__, l1)

or probably less efficiently ...

  l1 = [ 'abc', 'ghi', 'mno' ]
  l2 = [ 'abc', 'def', 'ghi', 'jkl', 'mno', 'pqr']
  pos = [ l2.index(i) for i in l1 ]
  print pos
[0, 2, 4]

Charles
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Re: why __repr__ affected after __getattr__ overloaded?

[Roc Zhou]

I know what's wrong. Thank you. And I think
try:
return self.__dict__[attr_name]
is unnecessary, because python will do it itself for us.

So now I have to overload __str__, but how can I make self.__str__
print as builtin str(): at here, I want get the result like:
test instance at 0xb7bbb90c
?

On 6 22 ,   12 55 , Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 En Fri, 22 Jun 2007 00:30:43 -0300, Roc Zhou [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 escribió:

  Now I have to design a class that overload __getattr__, but after
  that, I found the __repr__ have been affected. This is a simple
  example model:

 You are creating many attributes with value inexistent, even special
 methods. Put a print statement and see what happens:

  #!/usr/bin/env python

  class test:
  def __init__(self):
  self.x = 1
  def __getattr__(self, attr_name):
  try:
  return self.__dict__[attr_name]
  except KeyError:

print Now creating:,attr_name

  self.__dict__[attr_name] = 'inexistent'
  return self.__dict__[attr_name]

 --
 Gabriel Genellina


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Re: Problem with using ConfigParser.py

[David Wahler]

On 6/22/07, shridhar kurhade [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,
 Thanks for your reply. I tried changing the ownership and it looks as below:
 #  ls -l /home/ast/ast-linux.conf
 -rw-r--r-- 1 ast ast 7936 Jun 21 11:11 /home/ast/ast-linux.conf

 But when I try to read through browser, it gives permission denied error:

 [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/home/ast/ast-linux.conf' targetsandbox

 Also other files in the /home/ast/ have ast:ast as ownership.
 Can you please tell me if there any other problem with this?

That looks OK, but as I said before, you need to check the permissions
on the /home/ast directory. What's the output of ls -ld /home/ast?
It needs to grant execute permissions to the user or group that the
script is running as.

If that looks OK, you might want to try calling os.getuid() and
os.getgid() from your script, to make sure it's running under the same
UID/GID you think it is.

-- David

P.S. When using Gmail, it's better to use Reply to All instead of
Reply; that way your messages continue to go to the mailing list,
and other people can help you.
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Re: Python live environment on web-site?

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

On Jun 21, 1:18 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thomas Lenarz) wrote:
 Hi all,

 I was wondering if there was a python-live-environment available on a
 public web-site similar to the ruby-live-tutorial on

 http://tryruby.hobix.com/

 I would prefer something which allows to paste small scripts into a
 text-field, to run them on the server, and to be able to read the
 produced output of the script.

 I searched using google but didn't come across such a site. However, I
 imagine there must be at least one

 Thanks for any hint,

 Thomas



Crunchy.

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Re: python website

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

On Jun 21, 12:53 am, Martin Skou [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 The Daily Python-URLhttp://www.pythonware.com/daily/


pythonpapers.org

:)

-T

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Re: subprocess.popen question

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Wed, 20 Jun 2007 22:28:06 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
 On Jun 20, 7:50 pm, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 En Wed, 20 Jun 2007 20:02:52 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
  On Jun 20, 1:46 pm, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:

  cmd = [gawk, -f, altertime.awk, -v, time_offset=4, -v,
  outfile=testdat.sco, i1.sco]
  Now, what do you want to do with the output? Printing it line by  
 line?
  output = subprocess.Popen(cmd,  
 stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
  lines = output.splitlines()
  for line in lines:
 print line

   C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py
  Traceback (most recent call last):
   File C:\dex_tracker\pipe1.py, line 14, in
  last_line = subprocess.Popen([cmd],
  stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0]
   File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 593, in __init__
  errread, errwrite)
   File C:\Python25\lib\subprocess.py, line 793, in _execute_child
  startupinfo)
  WindowsError: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
  Script terminated.

  I can write it out as a batch file and then run it but that is a messy
  hack..

 If cmd is a list of arguments, like the example above, you should use
 subprocess.Popen(cmd,...) (like the example above, too).

 I had cut and pasted the example in to get that error...  could it be
 a problem with ms windows??? (I am at a library computer befour work
 so that ended my testing)

Note the call to subprocess.Popen - is the first argument [cmd] or cmd?
What do you get with print repr(cmd)?
Do you have gawk installed on that machine too?

-- 
Gabriel Genellina

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Split file into several and reformat

[bomber71]

Hi,

I want to take read an input file (sels.txt) that looks like:

Begin sels
   sel1 = {1001, 1002, 1003, ...
   ...
   1099}

   sel2 = {1001, 1008, 1009 ...
   ...
   1299}
End sels

And turn it into an output file for each of the sels in the input file, i.e
sel1.txt:

L1001
L1002
L1003
...
L1099

and sel2.txt:

L1001
L1008
L1009
...
L1299

And so on. Many thanks,
Wayne
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Re: Python live environment on web-site?

[Daniel Nogradi]

  I was wondering if there was a python-live-environment available on a
  public web-site similar to the ruby-live-tutorial on
 
  http://tryruby.hobix.com/
 
  I would prefer something which allows to paste small scripts into a
  text-field, to run them on the server, and to be able to read the
  produced output of the script.
 
  I searched using google but didn't come across such a site. However, I
  imagine there must be at least one


 Crunchy.


As far as I remember the pypy people also put together a publicly
available python console in javascript. Actually it's a whole xterm I
think and one can start python in there.

HTH,
Daniel
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Re: string formatter %x and a class instance with __int__ or __long__ cannot handle long

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Thu, 21 Jun 2007 00:24:28 -0300, Kenji Noguchi [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
escribió:

 Example2 -- pass an instance of a class with __int__()
 class X:
 ... def __init__(self, v):
 ... self.v = v
 ... def __int__(self):
 ... return self.v
 ...
 y = X(0x8000)
 %08x % y
 Traceback (most recent call last):
   File stdin, line 1, in ?
 TypeError: int argument required


 The behavior looks inconsistent.  By the way __int__ actually
 returned a long type value in the Example2.  The %08x allows
 either int or long in the Example1, however it accepts int only
 in the Example2.   Is this a bug or expected?

It is a bug, at least for me, and I have half of a patch addressing it. As  
a workaround, convert explicitely to long before formatting.

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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[David Kastrup]

Twisted [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 On Jun 20, 12:39 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Joel J. Adamson) wrote:
 The point is that the responsibility to customize is on the user.

 Given that in its out-of-the-box configuration it's well-nigh unusable
 without a printed-out cheat sheet of some kind, of the sort that
 were supposed to have died out in the 80s, getting it customized poses
 something of a catch-22 for anyone trying to get started using it.

Catch 22 is the right phrase here: just catch Emacs 22 and get
started.  Its out-of-the-box configuration is quite sensible.

What was the last version you said you actually tried out?

-- 
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs: terminology buffer and keybinding

[David Kastrup]

Twisted [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 On Jun 20, 5:37 pm, David Kastrup [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 ...spewing...babbling...

 I won't dignify your insulting twaddle and random ad-hominem verbiage
 with any more responses after this one. Something with actual logical
 argumentation to rebut may be another matter of course.

 One more GG issue: those stupid star ratings. So potentially
 prejudicial. So easy to game, as evidenced by your managing to somehow
 vote 82 times(!) against one of my posts in a matter of minutes.

It has not occured to you that actually thousands of people read those
postings?  And they are heavily crossposted to boot (redirecting
followup to comp.emacs, I would suggest everybody else do the same).

And you have really nothing worthwhile to contribute.  So if there is
some rating system (I don't use Google Groups so can't tell) in place,
your postings would certainly be good candidates for downrating.

Not that this posting of mine is much better, and actually the
followup-to comp.emacs would indicate that this is about Emacs.
However, you have still not given any information about what, if any,
version of Emacs your very vaguely expressed experiences are supposed
to have come from.

 So far I've found a less-impressive method to game them -- it's not
 hard to get throwaway accounts elsewhere, send yourself there a
 gmail invite, and create many GG accounts.

And you wonder that people don't find it worthwhile reading you...

 Handy to get around their onerous posting limits. Handy for stuffing
 the star-vote ballot boxes with multiple votes, too, but there's no
 way I can see to generate 82 of them that fast by that method, and
 that much logging in and out in that short a time using different
 accounts but from just one IP address is sure to come up on Google's
 radar somehow, with unpredictable but probably bad results.

Uh, is there some monetary compensation for star ratings?  Or what's
the deal?  Really, if somebody can come up with a better group for
followups, feel free to direct there.

 How did you do it? I'm guessing they stop the link for voting
 appearing as a usable link on the page for a) your own posts and b)
 the ones you've voted for, but the link's URL still works, so if you
 use a script to keep fetching the appropriate URL ...

What a crazy obsession.

-- 
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Emacs topic

[Gabor Urban]

Hi guys,

I kindly ask you to stop this topic. Though I see the importance to have a
good editor for programming, this is outside of the focus of a Python
mailing list.

The open source world offers a lot of very good tools to edit source files,
even for cross-platform development. Emacs is one of them, and IMHO could be
set as an efficiency/proficiency standard. But if it does not fit to your
fingers or working style, do not use it.

I am open to personal debate outside of this list,

Gabor
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Bruno Desthuilliers]

Stephen R Laniel a écrit :
 On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 12:59:28PM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Then you should use another language.
 
 This is what I meant about knowing how Internet discussions
 go.
 
Please let not forget the context.

You said:
I'm new to Python,

and then :
if I *want* strong static type-checking, why shouldn't I be able to get 
it?

You obviously don't know Python enough to understand why static 
typechecking doesn't belong to Python. Trying to explain would be a 
waste of time, because you have to experiment it in real-life situation 
to fully understand.

So to put things briefly, Python with static typechecking would not be 
Python anymore - it would be another language. Which implies that if you 
want static typechecking, you'll have to use another language one way or 
another.
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Diez B. Roggisch]

kaens schrieb:
 On 6/20/07, Diez B. Roggisch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 That is exactly the problem - there is no some more static typing.
 There is static typing - or not. You can't have it just a bit.
 
 Couldn't a language be made so that if you declared a variable like, say:
 
 string foo = I'm a string
 
 it would be a string, and always a string, and if you declared a 
 variable like
 
 foo = i'm a dynamic variable
 
 it would be considered dynamic?
 
 This doesn't seem like it would be too hard to add in to a language
 that already had dynamic typing (But then again, I am inexperienced -
 although interested in - language design).

It isn't too hard. All it needs is a bucket at a name that contains a 
type reference.

But what you DO with that is the hard thing. Just enforcing types at 
runtime is easy. Making JIT-compilation for such code and then put 
guarding statements around it - somewhat harder, but easier than full 
type inference.

But the OP wanted compile-time static typing checks. And _thats_ 
virtually impossible unless _everything_ is statically typed. And even 
if it is, the ClassCastExceptions of Java prove that.

Take this classic example from the java-world that is statically 
correct, but will fail at runtime

class A

class B extends A

B[] bs = new B[100];
A[] as = bs;
as[0] = new A();


The problem here is that the as-array has less type information, and 
because of polymorphism rules is allowed to actually hold an B-array. 
But that can't allow mere A-objects to be assigned to it!

So the JVM introduces a runtime type check here.

Mixing static and dynamic type information like proposed will only make 
this problem more severe, as you know even less about your types. Thus 
the whole purpose of static checking vanishes, and the whole thing 
shifts to a purely runtime checking.

 It seems to me like this could be really useful, but I'm not aware of
 any language implementing something like this.

Which _might_ be a hint... :)

Diez
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Bruno Desthuilliers]

Stephen R Laniel a écrit :
 On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 09:41:09PM +0100, Michael Hoffman wrote:
 If you asked Java programmers why you couldn't turn *off* Java's static 
 type checking if you wanted to, you'd probably get a similar response.
 
 Perhaps it would help for me to explain what I'd like.
 
 Under both Perl and Python, I've found myself
 having/wanting to write things like so:
 
 def my_func( int_arg, str_arg ):
 try:
 int_arg = int( int_arg )
 str_arg = str( str_arg )
 except ValueError:
 sys.stderr.write( Args are not of the right type\n )
 sys.exit(1)
 

Just a question : what will happen if you get rid of the try/except 
block ?-)

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Re: Split file into several and reformat

[Bruno Desthuilliers]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit :
 Hi,
 
 I want to take read an input file (sels.txt) that looks like:
 
(snip)
 
 And turn it into an output file for each of the sels in the input file, i.e
 sel1.txt:
 
(snip)
 and sel2.txt:
 
(snip)


 And so on.

Yes, fine. All this is documented here:

http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#before

 Many thanks,

You're welcome.


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Re: visual gui ides for python/jythpn

[kromakey]

Thanks, I'll take a look at these.
Kromakey

On 20 Jun, 22:10, Peter Decker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On 6/20/07, kromakey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Hi,

  Are there any free visual GUI IDE's available for python/jython, which
  have a drag and drop form designer similar to Visual Studio or
  Delphi ?

 Watch these screencasts, and then check out Dabo:

 http://leafe.com/screencasts/dataenvironment1.htmlhttp://leafe.com/screencasts/dataenvironment2.html

 Dabo's site ishttp://dabodev.com.

 --

 # p.d.


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Re: Help With Better Design

[Bruno Desthuilliers]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit :
(snip)
 I would like to be able to get a good hold of the concept
 state machines ?
 
 Well both state machines and classes (objects).  That may be a bit of a
 tall order to take on all at once but the concepts seem to be quite
 related.

They are, since OO was born from the use of state machines for 
simulation (the Simula language). But you can do state machines with a 
database and a procedural language too, and FWIW, the state machine 
aspect of OO is more often very informal and ad hoc.

 I already have a great deal of material on Classes so good to
 go there.

Don't confuse classes with OO. The OO in OOP means 
object-oriented, not class-oriented, and nothing in the most basics 
definitions of OO [1] requires nor even imply the notion of class. 
This notion is mostly an artifact for easing the definition of a family 
of objects having similar implementation, and some 00 languages managed 
to get by without classes (look for prototype-based languages - the 
most known being javascript). wrt/ Python, classes are actually objects 
too, and instances have a reference to their class. Since one can 
dynamically modify the instance object - class object relation at 
runtime, we're quite close to prototype-based languages !-)


[1] an object is defined by an identity, a state and a behaviour.
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Making decimal default datatype for floats during runtime

[Stefan Sonnenberg-Carstens]

Hi,
I was wondering if there are any tricks around to
do some sort of changing types, float in particular.
I do many operations like summing etc on lots
of floats and always have to do some extra checks where
results are heading 0.0, like round(n,10) for example.
My idea was to tell python in some way not to take the type
float but decimal in an implicit fassion.
It that possible ?

And, is it still true for python 2.4/2.5 that one needs to do
a = Decimal(str(aFloat))
instead of
a = Decimal(aFloat)
as it is in python 2.3 ?

And, at least, has some tried to link (lib)python against tc_malloc
and benchmarked it ?

Thx in advance.
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[M�ta-MCI]

Hi!

Given that one can add/replace/remove methods and attributes
dynamically either on a per-class or per-instance basis, and even
dynamically change the class of an object, I fail to see how static
typechecking could be meaningfull.

Et toc !






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Re: Invisible processes in Win2K

[M�ta-MCI]

Hi!

When you lock (the cpu), interactive mode is off.
You can try to use services, who run independently of sessions. But...






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Re: DFW Pythoneers Meeting THIS Saturday

[peter]

OK.  Not my intention to start a flame war, but as DFW did not mean a
thing to me (other than being my late father in law's initials) I was
a bit peeved about the assumption that everybody would understand it.
I think posts which are essentially local should make this clear to
all in the title.

I hope the meeting goes well.



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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[Sascha Bohnenkamp]

E M A C S
i e n o w
g g d n a
h a   t p
t b   i p
  y   n i
  t   o n
  e   u g
  s   s
  l
  o   y
  f

  m
  e
  m
  o
  r
  y
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[Sascha Bohnenkamp]

 Windows text editors are not normal: most are devoid of all but the most
 primitive functions and are further hampered by having an interface that
 required frequent time wasting hand transfers from keyboard to mouse
 because, if they provide keyboard equivalents at all, these are
 remarkably unmemorable and/or undocumented.

well ultra-edit, textpad, source-insight etc. pp are better than that
(and run on windows)
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For Python programmers in Egypt

[Mohammad Tayseer]

Dear Pythonistas

My company, Silverkey, is going to hold a demo day on 07/07/2007. We are going 
to make a comparison between static languages and dynamic languages. I'm going 
to represent the dynamic languages side.

If you are in Egypt, we will be happy to meet you.
http://www.demoday.us/

Thanks


Mohammad Tayseer
http://spellcoder.com/blogs/tayseer

 
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Looking to embed python into html like mason

[Steven W. Orr]

Does something like that exist?

TIA

-- 
Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like a banana. Stranger things have  .0.
happened but none stranger than this. Does your driver's license say Organ ..0
Donor?Black holes are where God divided by zero. Listen to me! We are all- 000
individuals! What if this weren't a hypothetical question?
steveo at syslang.net
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Re: Invisible processes in Win2K

[Tim Golden]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I'm running a Python program on M$ Windows 2000 as a test monitor. The 
 program 
 should close various processes, mostly Application error-windows, as they 
 are 
 created. This works fine until the screensaver gets active or until I press 
 Ctrl-Alt-Del and choose Lock my computer. At that point, my Python program 
 cannot see any change when a Application error pops up. Without locked 
 computer, it can identify these windows and close them, but I want it to do 
 this with the computer locked as well.

I have no chance of checking this out the moment,
but ISTR that when a computer is locked, the
desktop is actually the desktop of a different
(special screensaver) session. Exactly what effect
this will have on your program I'm not sure; it
presumably depends on the interaction between
the session/desktop and the various .Enumxxx
routines.

TJG
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Error while installing Python2.5.1

[zaperaj]

I use red hat 9 which comes with python2.2 installed in it. Wanting to
use the latest version, i downloaded python 2.5.1 from the official
python website. After downloading, i performed the following steps,
but there is some error during the configuration process and hence i'm
not able to run the make command after this. Following is the
sequence of events that happened in my terminal:

[EMAIL PROTECTED] root]# tar xfz Python-2.5.1.tgz
[EMAIL PROTECTED] root]# cd Python-2.5.1
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python-2.5.1]# ./configure
checking MACHDEP... linux2
checking EXTRAPLATDIR...
checking for --without-gcc... no
checking for gcc... no
checking for cc... no
checking for cc... no
checking for cl... no
configure: error: no acceptable C compiler found in $PATH
See `config.log' for more details.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python-2.5.1]# make
make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found.  Stop.

If anybody can help... Thanx!

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Re: Python and (n)curses

[peter]

 You could write your own little console interface, tailored to
 your needs, which is implemented using curses on Unix, and the
 effbot's 'console' on Windows.

Indeed, that's basically what I have done.  Just can't help thinking
how much simpler (and so less error prone) it would have been had
there been some pre-existing crossplatform module.

Peter

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Re: Looking to embed python into html like mason

[Stefan Behnel]

Steven W. Orr wrote:
 Does something like that exist?

Many of them, as usual :)

http://wiki.python.org/moin/WebProgramming

Stefan
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Re: Error while installing Python2.5.1

[Pavel]

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 10:03:43 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 checking for --without-gcc... no
 checking for gcc... no
 checking for cc... no
 checking for cc... no
 checking for cl... no
 configure: error: no acceptable C compiler found in $PATH
 See `config.log' for more details.

It appears you have no C compiler installed. You should be able to get one  
of those from your distribution's repositories. If you can't, upgrade to  
something debian-based.
/pavel

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Re: string formatter %x and a class instance with __int__ cannot handle long

[Kenji Noguchi]

2007/6/20, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 In your second example y is an instance of class X...not an int.  y.v
 is an int.  Are you hoping it will cast it to an int as needed using
 your method?  If so, I think you need to do so explicitly...ie %08x
 % int(y)

 ~Sean

I confirmed that %08x % int(y) works. And yes, I'm hoping so.
It actually works that way if the v is less than or equal to 0x7.
Please try the test script.  It's essentially the same test with
some more print statements.  All but test d-3 appears to be ok.


2007/6/20, Gabriel Genellina [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 It is a bug, at least for me, and I have half of a patch addressing it. As
 a workaround, convert explicitely to long before formatting.

I'm interested in your patch.  What's the other half still missing?

Thanks,
Kenji Noguchi


---88---8---
#!/usr/bin/env python

class X:
   def __init__(self, v):
   self.v = v
   def __int__(self):
   print Hey! I'm waken up!
   return self.v

def test(arg):
   print 1,type(int(arg))
   print 2,%08x % int(arg)
   print 3,%08x % arg

a = 0x7fff
b = X(0x7fff)
c = 0x8000
d = X(0x8000)

print test a ; test(a)
print test b ; test(b)
print test c ; test(c)
print test d ; test(d)
---88---8---

And here is the result
test a
1 type 'int'
2 7fff
3 7fff
test b
1 Hey! I'm waken up!
type 'int'
2 Hey! I'm waken up!
7fff
3 Hey! I'm waken up!
7fff
test c
1 type 'long'
2 8000
3 8000
test d
1 Hey! I'm waken up!
type 'long'
2 Hey! I'm waken up!
8000
3 Hey! I'm waken up!
Traceback (most recent call last):
 File stdin, line 23, in ?
 File stdin, line 13, in test
TypeError: int argument required
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Indenting in Emacs

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Hello,
Does anyone know how to make python-mode correctly indent nested lists
and dictionaries. I hate indenting Django url patterns and Zope
Archetypes schemas by hand, because python-mode indents them in
incorrect and ugly way.

Here's how it should be:
StringField('reference',
widget=StringWidget(
   description='Position reference'
)),

Here's how python-mode indents this code:
schema = BaseSchema.copy() +  Schema((
StringField('reference',
widget=StringWidget(
description='Position reference'
)),

I can provide examples of how ugly it indents nested dictionaries/
lists/tuples, but I think that everyone using emacs already have seen
that.

py-version is 4.78

Are we doomed to manually indent python lists in Emacs?

I didn't find any patches fixing indentation in python-mode.
Eugene

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Re: SimplePrograms challenge

[Pete Forman]

Steve Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  The BankAccount example is about as small of a complete class
  example that I could come up with, even though it's complete only
  a basic level.  It would be good to have a larger class example
  that fleshes out the concept a bit more, even if it's just
  BankAccount revisited.  I have some free time next time, I'll try
  my hand at it.

I guess I didn't put enough smilies in my post.  Your example is
simple and small which is correct for the context of the
SimplePrograms page.  Classes should precede unittest as the latter
uses a new style class.

Perhaps the thing to do is to add links to the tutorial for those
seeking further enlightenment.  If your page gets much bigger it will
lose its original attraction.
-- 
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WesternGeco  -./\.-   by myself and does not represent
[EMAIL PROTECTED]-./\.-   the opinion of Schlumberger or
http://petef.port5.com   -./\.-   WesternGeco.
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Re: SimplePrograms challenge

[pelon]

*** New Thread

#5 has been bothering me.

def greet(name):
print 'hello', name
greet('Jack')
greet('Jill')
greet('Bob')

Using greet() three times is cheating and doesn't teach much and
doesn't have any real world use that #1 can't fulfill.

I offer this replacement:

def greet(name):
 This function prints an email signature#optional doc
string highly recommended
print name +  can be reached at,#comma prevents
newline from being printed
print '@'.join([name,  google.com])
greet('Jill')

I think it's important to teach new pythonistas about good
documentation from the start. A few new print options are introduced.
And as far as functionality goes, at least it does something.


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Can python access windows clipboard

[MaHL]

Can I use python to copy something(like a string) to the clipboard, so
that I can paste it somewhere else. Is there a way to do this?

Thanks very much!

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Re: Indenting in Emacs

[Michael Hoffman]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hello,
 Does anyone know how to make python-mode correctly indent nested lists
 and dictionaries. I hate indenting Django url patterns and Zope
 Archetypes schemas by hand, because python-mode indents them in
 incorrect and ugly way.
 
 Here's how it should be:
 StringField('reference',
 widget=StringWidget(
description='Position reference'
 )),
 
 Here's how python-mode indents this code:
 schema = BaseSchema.copy() +  Schema((
 StringField('reference',
 widget=StringWidget(
 description='Position reference'
 )),

I get:

schema = BaseSchema.copy() +  Schema((
 StringField('reference',
 widget=StringWidget(
 description='Position reference'
 )),

I'm using py-version $Revision$. Oops! Anyway, try to install the 
latest python-mode, whatever that is, if it isn't 4.78.
-- 
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Re: Internationalised email subjects

[bugmagnet]

Seems some characters are missing from my last post.  The line that
says:

h = Header('  ', 'GB2312')

should say:

h = Header('  ', 'GB2312')


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Re: SimplePrograms challenge

[pelon]

And while I'm at it...

Although Guido's tutorial was a great place to start when I first came
to python I would have learned more and faster had SimplePrograms
existed. My only complaint with the python documentation is the dearth
of examples. The PHP documentation is chock full.


Steve,

You introduced this as a challenge. Why not make it so? JUST FOR FUN I
propose that blank lines and comments not be counted. There should
probably be an upper and lower limit on new concepts introduced. There
should be an emphasis on common, real world functionality. The
standard library should be used freely (although limited to the most
common modules).

I don't mean to turn this game into something too formal and serious,
but it's obvious from the enthusiasm shown on this thread that
pythonistas take their fun seriously.

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Re: Can python access windows clipboard

[Ant]

On Jun 21, 9:59 am, MaHL [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Can I use python to copy something(like a string) to the clipboard, so
 that I can paste it somewhere else. Is there a way to do this?

The following requires Mark Hammond's win32all package (http://
sourceforge.net/projects/pywin32/):

import win32clipboard, win32con, random

text = Some text to stick on the clipboard

win32clipboard.OpenClipboard()
win32clipboard.SetClipboardData(win32con.CF_TEXT, text)
win32clipboard.CloseClipboard()

--
Ant...

http://antroy.blogspot.com/


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Re: Internationalised email subjects

[bugmagnet]

That's really strange.  The chinese characters I am inputing into the
post are not being displayed.  Basically, what I am doing is this:

h = Header('(Some Chinese characters inserted here', 'GB2312')

And when I run this code, I receive the following error message:

UnicodeDecodeError: 'gb2312' codec can't decode bytes in position 2-3:
illegal multibyte sequence

Any idea what I may be doing wrong?  How do I convert Chinese
characters into something like p\xf6stal in the original code posted
by Martin?  Can someone point me in the right direction?  I'm not even
sure what class/method to look into for this.

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Re: metaclasses and performance

[Mirko Dziadzka]

Lenard Lindstrom [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
 I don't know if C asserts are active in release Python, but for 
 new-style classes one thing that happens during attribute lookup is that 
 an object's class is asserted to be an instance of type. 

Thank's for the explanation. My Linux distribution does not set NDEBUG
when compiling the python package so asserts are still in place.  A self
compiled python does not use the asserts and is 20% faster in my micro
benchmark.

Mirko

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Re: Can python access windows clipboard

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:59:06 -0300, MaHL [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:

 Can I use python to copy something(like a string) to the clipboard, so
 that I can paste it somewhere else. Is there a way to do this?

Yes, using the pywin32 extensions that you can download from Sourceforge

py from win32clipboard import *
py OpenClipboard()
py EmptyClipboard()
py SetClipboardText(Hello from Python!)
11272196
py CloseClipboard()

Ctrl-v: Hello from Python!

-- 
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Re: Can python access windows clipboard

[Michael Hoffman]

MaHL wrote:
 Can I use python to copy something(like a string) to the clipboard, so
 that I can paste it somewhere else. Is there a way to do this?

If you're using Cygwin Python you can just open /dev/clipboard and work 
on that.
-- 
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[anno4000]

Dave Hansen  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in comp.lang.perl.misc:

 Speaking of which, vi is a piece of wombat do.  ;-)

You can have Emacs when you pry it from my cold hypertrophied
escape-pressing pinky!

Anno
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Re: Can python access windows clipboard

[MaHL]

thanks a lot!

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Re: Split file into several and reformat

[half . italian]

On Jun 20, 10:45 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 I want to take read an input file (sels.txt) that looks like:

 Begin sels
sel1 = {1001, 1002, 1003, ...
...
1099}

sel2 = {1001, 1008, 1009 ...
...
1299}
 End sels

 And turn it into an output file for each of the sels in the input file, i.e
 sel1.txt:

 L1001
 L1002
 L1003
 ...
 L1099

 and sel2.txt:

 L1001
 L1008
 L1009
 ...
 L1299

 And so on. Many thanks,
 Wayne

hehe...

After Bruno's suggested read, go here: http://docs.python.org/tut/

Look at the string module.. specifically .strip() and .split(,)
Also look at reading files and perhaps lists.

for line in open(filename.txt, 'r').readlines():
handle_the_line()

Good Luck.

~Sean

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install paramiko on AIX (ActiveState)

[loial]

I need help installing paramiko on ActiveState python on AIX 5

I am new to python so need info on how to download and install
paramiko

AIX box does not have internet connection so presume cannot use
ez_setup.py?

Can anyone help?

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Re: Python's only one way to do it philosophy isn't good?

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Wed, 20 Jun 2007 17:23:42 -0400, Douglas Alan wrote:

 But Scheme has macros isn't a justification for why Python should
 have them.
 
 No one ever gave that justification.  The justification is that they are
 *good*.
 
 Macros are a way to abstract syntax the way that objects are used to
 abstract data types and that iterators and generators abstract control,
 etc.

But why is the ability to abstract syntax good?

One criticism of operator overloading is that when you see X + Y you have 
no real idea of whether it is adding X and Y together, or doing something 
bizarre.

Now allow syntax to be over-ridden as well, and not only can't you tell 
what X + Y does, but you can't even tell what it *means*. Maybe its a for-
loop, calling the function Y X times.

The usual response is That's insane, no sane programmer would do that!, 
and that's true as far as it goes (except for the programmers who are 
just too clever for their own good). Nevertheless there is a real issue 
there. When I program in Python, I always know what the syntax means, 
because there is no possible way it can be changed. That's one less thing 
I have to keep in my head, one less thing to worry about.

Sometimes, more freedom is not better. If you had a language that let you 
redefine the literal 1 to mean the integer zero, wouldn't that make it 
much harder to understand what even basic arithmetic meant?

If I wanted a bondage-and-discipline language, I'd use something with 
static typing and declared variables and a compiler that made sure my 
shoelaces were tied correctly before I did anything. But I don't, I use 
Python, and I appreciate the dynamic typing and runtime errors and the 
relatively few compiler checks.

But that doesn't mean I want a language where anything goes -- there's a 
balance between too little freedom and too much. If Python became the 
sort of language where I had to think about every module imported, every 
function called, just to be sure that 1+1 would equal 2, I'd have to 
reconsider whether Python was the language for me. There would have to be 
some serious advantages before I'd be comfortable.


-- 
Steven.
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Re: Python live environment on web-site?

[André]

On Jun 21, 3:00 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 On Jun 21, 1:18 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thomas Lenarz) wrote:



  Hi all,

  I was wondering if there was a python-live-environment available on a
  public web-site similar to the ruby-live-tutorial on

 http://tryruby.hobix.com/

  I would prefer something which allows to paste small scripts into a
  text-field, to run them on the server, and to be able to read the
  produced output of the script.

  I searched using google but didn't come across such a site. However, I
  imagine there must be at least one

  Thanks for any hint,

  Thomas

 Crunchy.

Unfortunately, as far as I know, Crunchy is not (yet) hosted on any
publicly accessible server.

Here are two try Python sites:
http://www.datamech.com/devan/trypython/trypython.py
http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/try_python/

If you want to know more about Crunchy, the latest version is located
at code.google.com/p/crunchy

André

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Re: Internationalised email subjects

[Gabriel Genellina]

En Thu, 21 Jun 2007 06:23:43 -0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:

 That's really strange.  The chinese characters I am inputing into the
 post are not being displayed.  Basically, what I am doing is this:

 h = Header('(Some Chinese characters inserted here', 'GB2312')

 And when I run this code, I receive the following error message:

 UnicodeDecodeError: 'gb2312' codec can't decode bytes in position 2-3:
 illegal multibyte sequence

If you execute: print some chinese characters, do you get the right  
results?
Are you sure your system is using gb2312? In case you don't know and don't  
trust autodetection, try something like this:

py from unicodedata import *
py name(á.decode(latin-1))
'NO-BREAK SPACE'
py name(á.decode(cp850))
'LATIN SMALL LETTER A WITH ACUTE'

The first attempt shows the wrong name, so my console *cannot* be using  
latin-1. With cp850 I got the right results, so it *might* be cp850 (it  
may also be another encoding that happens to match this single character).  
Further tests may reveal that it is actually cp850.
You should try with some chinese characters and see if your encoding is  
actually gb2312.

-- 
Gabriel Genellina

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Re: something similar to shutil.copytree that can overwrite?

[Ben Sizer]

On 20 Jun, 11:40, Justin Ezequiel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 On Jun 20, 5:30 pm, Ben Sizer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  I need to copy directories from one place to another, but it needs to
  overwrite individual files and directories rather than just exiting if
  a destination file already exists.

 What version of Python do you have?
 Nothing in the source would make it exit if a target file exists.
 (Unless perhaps you have sym-links or the like.)

I have 2.5, and I believe the behaviour I saw was that it exits if a
directory already exists and it skips any files that already exist. It
certainly wouldn't overwrite anything.

--
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Globals in nested functions

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

def f():
a = 12
def g():
global a
if a  14:
a=13
g()
return a

print f()

This function raises an error. Is there any way to access the a in f()
from inside g().

I could find few past discussions on this subject, I could not find
the simple answer whether it is possible to do this reference.

-
Suresh

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Re: How to hide a program?

[jvdb]

Hi all,

thanks very much! it was indeed how i compiled to .exe
After using the windows= , my issue was solved. Thanks to all who took
the time on helping me.

Jeroen

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Re: fetching text from the screen

[Juergen Kareta]

Gabriel Genellina schrieb:
 En Mon, 18 Jun 2007 09:13:16 -0300, Juergen Kareta [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
 escribió:
 
 I'm thinking about a python script which fetch some text from the screen
 independent of what application provides the text on the screen. In this
 regard it should be similar to the babylon software: www.babylon.com


 Here my thoughts:

 1) getting the mouse position
 2) calculate a adequate rectangle around the mouse position
 3) fetch the screen content in this rectangle
 4) use a OCR library to get the text out of 3)
 5) do something usefull with it.
 
 
 On Windows, I'd try first using WindowFromPoint to get a window handle,  
 and the sending it a WM_GETTEXT message. This should work for all 
 windowed  controls that contain text of some kind. I'd use your generic 
 approach  when this doesn't work.
 
Hi Gabriel,

thanks for your interesting suggestions. I'll try that to figure out, 
how it works in different situations.

Jürgen
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[Karsten Wutzke]

On 17 Jun., 17:13, Xah Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Yaawn!

   Xah
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 ∑http://xahlee.org/

Hmm I just had to think about the C64/Amiga etc. game California
Games... The game displayed a comment when the player broke his neck
the 13th time when BMXing:

Geek of the week!

Karsten

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Re: visual gui ides for python/jythpn

[Kelvie Wong]

If Qt/PyQt is an option, I'd recommend the Qt designer.  There is the
odd dual license that they have, though.

On 6/21/07, kromakey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Thanks, I'll take a look at these.
 Kromakey

 On 20 Jun, 22:10, Peter Decker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  On 6/20/07, kromakey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
   Hi,
 
   Are there any free visual GUI IDE's available for python/jython, which
   have a drag and drop form designer similar to Visual Studio or
   Delphi ?
 
  Watch these screencasts, and then check out Dabo:
 
  http://leafe.com/screencasts/dataenvironment1.htmlhttp://leafe.com/screencasts/dataenvironment2.html
 
  Dabo's site ishttp://dabodev.com.
 
  --
 
  # p.d.


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-- 
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Re: Globals in nested functions

[Duncan Booth]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 def f():
 a = 12
 def g():
 global a
 if a  14:
 a=13
 g()
 return a
 
 print f()
 
 This function raises an error. Is there any way to access the a in f()
 from inside g().
 
 I could find few past discussions on this subject, I could not find
 the simple answer whether it is possible to do this reference.
 
'global' means global to the module, it prevents the lookup happening in 
current or nested scopes.

Simple answer:

You can access an object referenced by a nested scope variable and you 
can mutate the object accessed in that way, but you cannot rebind the 
name to a different object without resorting to hackery.

To get the effect you want, simply use a mutable object:

 def f():
class v:
a = 12
def g():
if v.a  14:
v.a=13
g()
return v.a

 f()
13

and as soon as the code starts looking at all complex, refactor that so 
the class is the thing you interact with:

 class F(object):
def g(self):
if self.a  14:
self.a = 13
def __call__(self):
self.a = 12
self.g()
return self.a

 f = F()
 f()
13
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Re: Split file into several and reformat

[Neil Cerutti]

On 2007-06-21, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 I want to take read an input file (sels.txt) that looks like:

 Begin sels
sel1 = {1001, 1002, 1003, ...
...
1099}

sel2 = {1001, 1008, 1009 ...
...
1299}
 End sels

 And turn it into an output file for each of the sels in the input file, i.e
 sel1.txt:

 L1001
 L1002
 L1003
 ...
 L1099

 and sel2.txt:

 L1001
 L1008
 L1009
 ...
 L1299

 And so on. Many thanks,

I think I'd put together a simple grammar and then write a
recursive descent parser that spit out my output files. But
that's just because I find that kind of thing fun. ;)

-- 
Neil Cerutti
I'm tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to
play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok. --Shaquille O'Neal
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Re: Indenting in Emacs

[Steven W. Orr]

On Thursday, Jun 21st 2007 at 10:11 +0100, quoth Michael Hoffman:

=[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
= Hello,
= Does anyone know how to make python-mode correctly indent nested lists
= and dictionaries. I hate indenting Django url patterns and Zope
= Archetypes schemas by hand, because python-mode indents them in
= incorrect and ugly way.
= 
= Here's how it should be:
= StringField('reference',
= widget=StringWidget(
=description='Position reference'
= )),
= 
= Here's how python-mode indents this code:
= schema = BaseSchema.copy() +  Schema((
= StringField('reference',
= widget=StringWidget(
= description='Position reference'
= )),
=
=I get:
=
=schema = BaseSchema.copy() +  Schema((
= StringField('reference',
= widget=StringWidget(
= description='Position reference'
= )),
=
=I'm using py-version $Revision$. Oops! Anyway, try to install the 
=latest python-mode, whatever that is, if it isn't 4.78.

Ok. I'm not stupid but I do not see a 4.78 anywhere even though I see refs
from google. I have 4.75 The SVN tree doesn't seem to even have that. 

I checked the latest copy out from sourceforge and that was 4.75 too.

Can someone please tell me where to find the latest?

-- 
Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like a banana. Stranger things have  .0.
happened but none stranger than this. Does your driver's license say Organ ..0
Donor?Black holes are where God divided by zero. Listen to me! We are all- 000
individuals! What if this weren't a hypothetical question?
steveo at syslang.net
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Re: Downloading from a clean url

[D.Hering]

Evan Klitzke wrote:
 On 6/20/07, D.Hering [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  General:
  How do I download a page's data from a clean url.
 
  Specific:
  I'm using PyQt's QHttp and QUrl classes for requests and acquiring the
  response, but I can't figure out how to access a page's data without
  knowing the file of the url's path. For instance http://kde.org

 If the page is omitted, as in your example of http://kde.org, the page is /

Right, but so far I'm not able to get a response unless I actually
provide the actual page and it's extension in the path of the url. For
instance /page.html or /this/path/to/page.html ...etc.



 --
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[notbob]

On 2007-06-21, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 You can have Emacs when you pry it from my cold hypertrophied
 escape-pressing pinky!

LOL!

nb
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Re: Split file into several and reformat

[Amit Khemka]

On 6/21/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 I want to take read an input file (sels.txt) that looks like:

 Begin sels
sel1 = {1001, 1002, 1003, ...
...
1099}

sel2 = {1001, 1008, 1009 ...
...
1299}
 End sels

 And turn it into an output file for each of the sels in the input file, i.e
 sel1.txt:
snip

Once you have read Bruno's pointers ! Have a look at
http://aspn.activestate.com/ASPN/Cookbook/Python/Recipe/521877

cheers,

Amit Khemka --
Co-founder: OnYoMo
website: www.onyomo.com
wap-site: www.owap.in
Home Page: www.cse.iitd.ernet.in/~csd00377

Endless the world's turn, endless the sun's Spinning, Endless the quest;
I turn again, back to my own beginning, And here, find rest.
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Re: Reading multiline values using ConfigParser

[Carsten Haese]

On Thu, 2007-06-21 at 02:51 +, Phoe6 wrote:
 On Jun 20, 10:35 pm, John Krukoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
   Is there anyway, I can include multi-line value in the configfile? I
 
 
  Following the link to RFC 822 (http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc822.html)
  indicates that you can spread values out over multiple lines as long as
  there is a space or tab character imeediately after the CRLF.
 
 Thanks for the response. It did work!
 
  config = ConfigParser()
  config.read(Testcases.txt)
 ['Testcases.txt']
  output = config.get(Information, Testcases)
  print output
 
 tct123
 tct124
 tct125
  output
 '\ntct123\ntct124\ntct125'
 
 
 However, as I am going to provide Testcases.txt to be user editable,
 I cannot assume or ask users to provide value testcases surronded by
 spaces. I got to figure out a workaround here.

Since you don't actually need a multi-line entry but rather a list of
single-line entries, you could ask your users to enter something like
this:

TestcaseCount=3
Testcase1=tct123
Testcase2=tct124
Testcase3=tct125

HTH,

-- 
Carsten Haese
http://informixdb.sourceforge.net


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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[Martin Gregorie]

Sascha Bohnenkamp wrote:
 Windows text editors are not normal: most are devoid of all but the most
 primitive functions and are further hampered by having an interface that
 required frequent time wasting hand transfers from keyboard to mouse
 because, if they provide keyboard equivalents at all, these are
 remarkably unmemorable and/or undocumented.
 
 well ultra-edit, textpad, source-insight etc. pp are better than that
 (and run on windows)

I said MOST, not all!

To your list I'd add PFE and a Windows port of microEmacs, which has 
almost nothing in common with EMACS except some key bindings.

But to return to your point: how many Windows users actually install the 
editors we've listed? I bet most never get past Wordpad. I've even found 
  people using Word, of all things, to edit BAT files and program source.

I'd give long odds that Windows users who use editors other than Wordpad 
are using the one that came with whatever IDE they've installed, simply 
because integrated editors are much more common in Windows-only IDEs 
that they are on *nixen. My guess is that this is because the standard 
editors (Wordpad, edlin) are so bad.


-- 
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gregorie. | Essex, UK
org   |
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Re: Making decimal default datatype for floats during runtime

[Carsten Haese]

On Thu, 2007-06-21 at 09:34 +0200, Stefan Sonnenberg-Carstens wrote:
 Hi,
 I was wondering if there are any tricks around to
 do some sort of changing types, float in particular.
 I do many operations like summing etc on lots
 of floats and always have to do some extra checks where
 results are heading 0.0, like round(n,10) for example.
 My idea was to tell python in some way not to take the type
 float but decimal in an implicit fassion.
 It that possible ?

No. Explicit is better than implicit.

 And, is it still true for python 2.4/2.5 that one needs to do
 a = Decimal(str(aFloat))
 instead of
 a = Decimal(aFloat)
 as it is in python 2.3 ?

Of course:
 0.1
0.10001

Should Decimal(0.1) be Decimal(0.1) or Decimal(0.10001)?
Until Python can read your mind, you'll have to specify which one you
want by passing in a string containing all the digits you want to keep.

-- 
Carsten Haese
http://informixdb.sourceforge.net


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strip() 2.4.4

[Nick]

strip() isn't working as i expect, am i doing something wrong -

Sample data in file in.txt:

'AF':'AFG':'004':'AFGHANISTAN':'Afghanistan'
'AL':'ALB':'008':'ALBANIA':'Albania'
'DZ':'DZA':'012':'ALGERIA':'Algeria'
'AS':'ASM':'016':'AMERICAN SAMOA':'American Samoa'


Code:

f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')

for line in f1:
print line.rsplit(':')[4].strip('),

Output:

Afghanistan'
Albania'
Algeria'
American Samoa'

Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

Thanks in advance.
Nick

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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Stephen R Laniel]

On Thu, Jun 21, 2007 at 06:23:01AM -0700, Nick wrote:
 Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

Is it possible that you actually have whitespace at the end
of the line? So then strip() is looking for an apostrophe at
the end of the line, not finding it, and therefore not
stripping it?

-- 
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[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cell: +(617) 308-5571
http://laniels.org/
PGP key: http://laniels.org/slaniel.key
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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[linuxprog]

Stephen R Laniel a écrit :

On Thu, Jun 21, 2007 at 06:23:01AM -0700, Nick wrote:
  

Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?



Is it possible that you actually have whitespace at the end
of the line? So then strip() is looking for an apostrophe at
the end of the line, not finding it, and therefore not
stripping it?

  

that should work for you ?

f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')

for line in f1:
  print line.rsplit(':')[4].rstrip().strip('),

maybe you got some \n \r at the end of each line
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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Roy Smith]

In article [EMAIL PROTECTED],
 Nick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 strip() isn't working as i expect, am i doing something wrong -
 
 Sample data in file in.txt:
 
 'AF':'AFG':'004':'AFGHANISTAN':'Afghanistan'
 'AL':'ALB':'008':'ALBANIA':'Albania'
 'DZ':'DZA':'012':'ALGERIA':'Algeria'
 'AS':'ASM':'016':'AMERICAN SAMOA':'American Samoa'
 
 
 Code:
 
 f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')
 
 for line in f1:
 print line.rsplit(':')[4].strip('),
 
 Output:
 
 Afghanistan'
 Albania'
 Algeria'
 American Samoa'
 
 Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

No clue, I can't reproduce it, but here's some ideas to try.

1) It helps to give more information.  Exactly what version of python are 
you using?  Cut-and-paste what python prints out when you start it up 
interactively, i.e.:

Python 2.4 (#1, Jan 17 2005, 14:59:14) 
[GCC 3.3.3 (NetBSD nb3 20040520)] on netbsd2

More than likely, just saying 2.4 would tell people all they need to 
know, but it never hurts to give more info.

2) Try to isolate what's happening.  Is the trailing quote really in the 
string, or is print adding it?  Do something like:

temp = line.rsplit(':')[4].strip(')
print repr (temp[0])

and see what happens.

3) Are you sure the argument you're giving to strip() is the same character 
that's in the file?  Is it possible the file has non-ascii characters, such 
as smart quotes?  Try printing ord(temp[0]) and ord(temp(')) and see if 
they give you the same value.
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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Stephen R Laniel]

On Thu, Jun 21, 2007 at 01:42:03PM +, linuxprog wrote:
 that should work for you ?

I reproduced the original poster's problem by adding one
extra space after the final ' on each line. I'd vote that
that's the problem.

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Re: Globals in nested functions

[Bjoern Schliessmann]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 def f():
 a = 12
 def g():
 global a
 if a  14:
 a=13
 g()
 return a
 
 print f()
 
 This function raises an error. Is there any way to access the a in
 f() from inside g().

Yes. Pass it to g when calling the latter and let g return the
result.

def f():
a = 12

def g(parm):
if parm  14:
return 13
else:
return a

a = g(a)
return a

print f()

Strange refactoring though.

Regards,


Björn

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We are Microsoft.  What you are experiencing is not a problem; it is
an undocumented feature.

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newbie question: parsing street name from address

[cjl]

P:

I am working on a project that requires geocoding, and have written a
very simple geocoder that uses the Google service.

I would like to be able to extract the name of the street from the
addresses in my data, however they vary significantly. Here a some
examples:

25 Main St
2500 14th St
12 Bennet Pkwy
Pearl St
Bennet Rd and Main st
19th St

As you can see, sometimes I have the house number, and sometimes I do
not. Sometimes the street name is a number. Sometimes I simply have
the names of intersecting streets.

I would like to be able to parse the above into the following:

Main St
14th St
Bennet Pkwy
Pearl St
Bennet Rd
Main St
19th St

How might I approach this complex parsing problem?

-CJL

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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[Roy Smith]

In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], David Kastrup [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Kaldrenon [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  I'm very, very new to emacs. I used it a little this past year in
  college, but I didn't try at all to delve into its features. I'm
  starting that process now, and frankly, the thought of it changing -
  already- upsets me. I don't feel like the program ought to change in
  order to accommodate me.
 
 Actually, the E in Emacs stands for extensible.  Part of the
 appeal of Emacs is that you can change it to accommodate you.

Actually, the E in Emacs stands for Editor.  And the macs part stands 
for Macros.  As in Editor Macros.  It started out as a bunch of macros 
written in TECO.
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Conceptualizing Threading

[JonathanB]

I have a multi-access problem that I'm pretty sure needs to be solved
with threading, but I'm not sure how to do it. This will be my first
foray into threading, so I'm a little confused by all of the new
landscape. So, I'm going to lay out the problem I'm facing and if
someone could point me towards a good example of what I need to do,
that would be great. I read THE tutorial, and while it made since to
me in an esoteric sense, I'm not sure how to implement it.

I have a program which will be logging who took what orders. These
orders need to have sequential order numbers. SR001001, SR001002,
SR001003, etc. Problem is I'm not sure how many people will be
accessing this program at the same time. I thought about separating
the order number into its own file and the having a function open it,
read it, increment it, write it, and close it really quick to limit
the chance of two people pulling the same number. Then I heard found
threading.

So this sounds like a consumer/producer problem, right? So I think I
need to use a Queue to crank out quote numbers and have the users
connect to the queue to get their number. Does that mean I'm looking
at two separate programs, a server and a client? Where do I separate
the programs? I was just about to give up and have quote number
assignment be manual (with error checking), but I thought I should
check here first and see if someone could help me wrap my brain around
this problem. You'll never learn if you never try, right?

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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Neil Cerutti]

On 2007-06-21, Nick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 strip() isn't working as i expect, am i doing something wrong -

 Sample data in file in.txt:

 'AF':'AFG':'004':'AFGHANISTAN':'Afghanistan'
 'AL':'ALB':'008':'ALBANIA':'Albania'
 'DZ':'DZA':'012':'ALGERIA':'Algeria'
 'AS':'ASM':'016':'AMERICAN SAMOA':'American Samoa'


 Code:

 f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')

 for line in f1:
 print line.rsplit(':')[4].strip('),

 Output:

 Afghanistan'
 Albania'
 Algeria'
 American Samoa'

 Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

Most likely it's the newline at the end of each record that's
getting in your way.

You can double-strip it.

for line in f1:
print line.strip().rsplit(':')[4].strip(')

-- 
Neil Cerutti
The world is more like it is now than it ever has been before. --Dwight
Eisenhower
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Re: The Modernization of Emacs

[David Kastrup]

Roy Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], David Kastrup [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:

 Kaldrenon [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  I'm very, very new to emacs. I used it a little this past year in
  college, but I didn't try at all to delve into its features. I'm
  starting that process now, and frankly, the thought of it changing -
  already- upsets me. I don't feel like the program ought to change in
  order to accommodate me.
 
 Actually, the E in Emacs stands for extensible.  Part of the
 appeal of Emacs is that you can change it to accommodate you.

 Actually, the E in Emacs stands for Editor.  And the macs part
 stands for Macros.  As in Editor Macros.  It started out as a
 bunch of macros written in TECO.

It's not like I did not know this.  Don't ask me what got into my head
here.

-- 
David Kastrup
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Bjoern Schliessmann]

Stephen R Laniel wrote:
 On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 12:59:28PM -0700,
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Then you should use another language.
 
 This is what I meant about knowing how Internet discussions
 go.

I agree. I also notice that (rather newbie-) OPs with not-so-simple
questions are easily offended by technical answers. I'd love to
know why.

Regards,


Björn

-- 
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terrorist activities

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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Peter Otten]

Nick wrote:

 strip() isn't working as i expect, am i doing something wrong -
 
 Sample data in file in.txt:
 
 'AF':'AFG':'004':'AFGHANISTAN':'Afghanistan'
 'AL':'ALB':'008':'ALBANIA':'Albania'
 'DZ':'DZA':'012':'ALGERIA':'Algeria'
 'AS':'ASM':'016':'AMERICAN SAMOA':'American Samoa'
 
 
 Code:
 
 f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')
 
 for line in f1:
 print line.rsplit(':')[4].strip('),
 
 Output:
 
 Afghanistan'
 Albania'
 Algeria'
 American Samoa'
 
 Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

As others have already guessed, the problem is trailing whitespace, namely
the newline that you should have stripped

for line in f1:
line = line.rstrip(\n)
print line.rsplit(:, 1)[-1].strip(')

instead of suppressing it with the trailing comma in the print statement.
Here is another approach that might work:

import csv
for row in csv.reader(f1, delimiter=:, quotechar='):
print row[-1]

that should work, too.

Peter
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Re: strip() 2.4.4

[Nick]

On 21 Jun, 14:53, Neil Cerutti [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On 2007-06-21, Nick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



  strip() isn't working as i expect, am i doing something wrong -

  Sample data in file in.txt:

  'AF':'AFG':'004':'AFGHANISTAN':'Afghanistan'
  'AL':'ALB':'008':'ALBANIA':'Albania'
  'DZ':'DZA':'012':'ALGERIA':'Algeria'
  'AS':'ASM':'016':'AMERICAN SAMOA':'American Samoa'

  Code:

  f1 = open('in.txt', 'r')

  for line in f1:
  print line.rsplit(':')[4].strip('),

  Output:

  Afghanistan'
  Albania'
  Algeria'
  American Samoa'

  Why is there a apostrophe still at the end?

 Most likely it's the newline at the end of each record that's
 getting in your way.

 You can double-strip it.

 for line in f1:
 print line.strip().rsplit(':')[4].strip(')

 --
 Neil Cerutti
 The world is more like it is now than it ever has been before. --Dwight
 Eisenhower

Thank you all very much for your input, the above solved the problem
as most of you had already pointed out.

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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Stephen R Laniel]

On Thu, Jun 21, 2007 at 03:55:48PM +0200, Bjoern Schliessmann wrote:
 I agree. I also notice that (rather newbie-) OPs with not-so-simple
 questions are easily offended by technical answers. I'd love to
 know why.

One doesn't like to get meta on such things, as so often
happens, so I'll be brief. The way I read my original post
was like so: I know lots of people have probably had a
similar question, so please point me to a canonical answer
is there is one. So here's the question To me, an
appropriate answer there is, That's a good question, and
many people have asked it. Here's why it's unlikely that
static type-checking makes sense in the context of Python,
and why it couldn't just be added in pieces. We got there
eventually, but only after what seemed to me to be a bout of
rudeness. Now, maybe my own followup clarified something
that I should have included in the original.

Use another language is not a technical answer. Python
could not adopt static typing without substantially changing
the language and destroying what everyone loves about it,
and here are examples of where the problem shows up is.

But I've just gone meta, so I'll stop.

-- 
Stephen R. Laniel
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cell: +(617) 308-5571
http://laniels.org/
PGP key: http://laniels.org/slaniel.key
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Re: PEP 3107 and stronger typing (note: probably a newbie question)

[Peter Decker]

On 6/21/07, Bjoern Schliessmann
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Stephen R Laniel wrote:
  On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 12:59:28PM -0700,
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Then you should use another language.
 
  This is what I meant about knowing how Internet discussions
  go.

 I agree. I also notice that (rather newbie-) OPs with not-so-simple
 questions are easily offended by technical answers. I'd love to
 know why.

Oh, c'mon. The OP was asking for an explanation, and got an indignant
response. There is a world of difference between explaining *why*
Python is the way it is, and getting the equivalent of a 4-year-old's
Because! as a reply.

To someone who admits that he is largely unfamiliar with the language,
it would seem obvious that Python is lacking something that is
important in other languages. An explanation as to why this would be
Bad Thing for Python would be a helful response.

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