[RBW] Re: Friction Shifting Issues with my Old Clem

[Bill Schairer]

I'd have someone check the derailleur hanger adjustment.

How many miles are you getting on each cassette?  How about chains?  
Smallest cogs will wear the fastest.  If you are riding a lot on the big 
ring and the smallest cogs, maybe get a bigger big ring that will put your 
usual pedaling in the middle of the cassette?

Bill S
San Diego

On Thursday, March 14, 2024 at 9:34:05 AM UTC-7 Vincent Tamer wrote:

> Thank you guys. The suntour shifters don't bug me so much as I may have 
> made it out in the initial post. I was just not sure if they were causing 
> this wear on the rear cassette or not. I only have a double crank and 
> rarely cross chain. Usually I'm on the largest toothed chainring on the 
> front which aligns with the smaller two on the rear. However there may have 
> been an instance recently where I cross chained that did the damage. I'll 
> have to take a closer look but this info helps. Thanks!
>
> On Thursday, March 14, 2024 at 1:41:11 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:
>
>> Vinvent, the Sunrace shifters ratcheting is there only as part of the 
>> tension holding friction mechanism. It was in use well before indexed came 
>> to be in use. That indexed shifters happen to click once per shift change 
>> in unrelated to the ratcheting clicks of the friction variety. I've not 
>> used those shifters in particular, I've only used Sun Tour Power ratchets 
>> and other pure friction shifters. My best "advice" for those Sunrace 
>> shifters is to forget about the clicks altogther as *they are not 
>> designed for one click per gear shift.* Just adjust the lever by feel 
>> and sound of the cogs. If you've never used friction shifters before this I 
>> can see how the clicking may appear confusing if mistaking the friction 
>> ratcheting sound with indexing clicks, but they're two distinctly different 
>> mechanisms. Some readers here have ended up replacing those particular 
>> Sunrace shifters with a more normal ratcheting friction shifters on the 
>> outside, like the Riv Silver or Microshift or vintage Sun Tour. 
>>
>> The grinding and wear of the two smallest cogs appears from varying 
>> angles of the chain as you use a given ring with a given cog. It's called 
>> "cross-chaining". For example, riding in the smallest ring of triple crank 
>> like yours and the smallest cogs of the cassette is asking the chain to 
>> flex laterally to angles past their limits of efficiency. Even the middle 
>> ring and smallest two cogs has a fair amount of friction from the angles, 
>> depending on the chainline(how far the center-rings are from the center of 
>> the seat tube). Hence, you'll hear and feel what you describe and will wear 
>> the cogs down faster than usual if consistently ridden that way. 
>>
>> Here's cross-chaing explained : 
>> https://wickwerks.com/support/crosschaining/
>> On Wednesday, March 13, 2024 at 11:40:52 PM UTC-4 Vincent Tamer wrote:
>>
>>> I have an on going issue with my friction shifting setup on my 2016 
>>> complete Clem.
>>>
>>> I believe this will be my third cassette replacement now. Each time the 
>>> two smallest cogs are damaged/stripped for some reason, so that when I 
>>> pedal there is some crunching & ghost shifting. I cannot pedal with full 
>>> force on the first two gears.
>>>
>>> I’ve had issues with this since day one and I have a feeling it is due 
>>> to the 2016 complete clem’s shifting setup even though I’ve had it adjusted 
>>> and have explained to two different bike technicians.
>>>
>>> The shifter setup is odd, Riv even commented on how it was a little 
>>> strange in the Clem intro Pdf that was floating around for the longest time 
>>> (cannot find it now). I'm hoping someone knows what I'm talking about!
>>>
>>> These suntour shifters are set up in a reverse position and that they 
>>> have some kind of ratcheting mech in them. The clicks don’t always coincide 
>>> with a shift and maybe that has created some bad friction shifting form on 
>>> my part. Outside of that I’m at a loss for why I am having issues with 
>>> stripped cogs. 
>>>
>>> I’m considering switching to an indexed set up even though I don’t want 
>>> to but before I do, does any one have any wisdom they can shed on this 
>>> situation? Thank you!
>>>
>>> Pics are attached, of the whole bike (for fun) and of the shifter. I'll 
>>> grab some shots of the gears as well when I can.[image: 
>>> DSCF7718_sml.jpg][image: shifter.jpg]
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Bill Schairer]

Steven,

Lately, I've been running mostly Schwalbe Racing Ralph 50mm tires but i've 
run 28's and 32/33/34 tires as well.  Unfortunately, i think Schwalbe has 
abandoned tubulars altogether.  I have accumulated several of the Racing 
Ralphs but after that, I'm not sure that anything comparable is available.  
I know, at one time, one could special order from Dugast or maybe FMB but I 
don't know about now.

On Friday, March 8, 2024 at 6:21:26 PM UTC-8 Jason Fuller wrote:

> I know this has been pretty well covered by now, but I'm finally going to 
> add my two cents as well. I have ridden a few, but I think that anecdotes 
> are only going to take you so far because of the wide range of preferences 
> on the speed-comfort continuum. Based on your replies, I feel quite 
> confident that both the Homer and the Hillborne would be perfectly suited: 
> comfortable as heck, don't feel overbuilt, not super fast but not sluggish 
> either. If you're fine with caliper brakes I can't find a good reason to 
> push one over the other. My Hillborne has been with me for close to 4.5 
> years now, I've ridden it 10,400km and counting, and it has been my 
> favourite bike every day that I've owned it. I flip-flop between Albatross 
> and Noodles and it's great with either. 
>
> If you aren't buying right away, the upcoming Charlie H Gallop would be a 
> worthy contestant too, I'm betting. I had the prototype and it was a 
> compelling combination of the long wheelbase Rivs with the lighter tubing 
> Rivs.  
>
> On Saturday 2 March 2024 at 10:56:38 UTC-8 cfic...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I really like the Rivendell approach to bikes and bike technology with 
>> the idea of a more upright posture and a long wheelbase for long rides at a 
>> comfortable pace, but it seems like the models all lean heavily to what 
>> they call "country bikes."  I like to ride from my house, and that means 
>> riding almost exclusively on smooth (mostly) pavement. Can anyone suggest 
>> which models are better suited for road riding? Reading and comparing the 
>> descriptions, it seems that the Homer might be a good choice, or possibly 
>> the Appaloosa or Atlantis? Or the new Charlie Gallop, though I haven't 
>> heard much about how it is supposed to ride? I tried a Roadini (which I 
>> recently listed here and sold), but I think it was too big for me. I never 
>> felt comfortable on it. Maybe I just needed it in the right size. 
>>
>> I would like the bike to work well with drop bars because of the multiple 
>> hand positions and they're just what I'm used to. I tried a bike with swept 
>> bars recently, but found I wasn't comfortable on longer rides. And when 
>> riding on streets with minimal shoulder width, I felt like I was going to 
>> catch the end of them on mailboxes or other obstacles. Maybe there's a 
>> handlebar in Rivendell's catalog that works well for road riding?
>>
>> I'd appreciate any comments, especially if someone does this type of 
>> riding and has tried several of these models. Thanks.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Bill Schairer]

My Atlantis rolls on tubulars.

Bill S 
San Diego

On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 5:54:54 PM UTC-8 Max S wrote:

> Do eet! 
>
> - Max "Knock-knock... Hi! Have you heard the good news about carbon 
> tubulars?.." in A2
>
> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 2:26:30 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> I have a tubular wheel set for my Roadeo also.  We're a GANG
>>
>> BL in EC
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 11:15:09 AM UTC-8 cz...@sonic.net wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Max -
>>>
>>> If you are one of two people worldwide that run sew-ups on a Riv, I am 
>>> the other one. I had Rich build a set of wheels for sew-ups so I could run 
>>> them on any of four Rivs (my wife would not tolerate 33mm tires on the 
>>> Hubbuhubbuh after riding 71mm tires).
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Corwin
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:15:09 AM UTC-8 Max S wrote:
>>>

 *"My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:*
 *Off With 'is 'ead!!!*
 *Pure blasphemy. I love it." *

 Well, yes, thank you – shock and awe was part of the intent for this 
 Halloween special "Iron Pumpkin" build  :-) 
 BTW, those wheels are tubulars... I might be one of two people 
 worldwide that run sew-up tires on a Riv?.. 

 - Max "totally tubular" in A2
 On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:25:59 AM UTC-5 mathiass...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> @Max
> My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:
> Off With 'is 'ead!!!
> Pure blasphemy. I love it.
>
> I reckon we can't complain -- they don't make SILVER carbon wheels 
> yet. You're forgiven.
>
> [Extra blather: Personally, I can't get into single speed. I went as 
> far as not shifting for a week on my commute in order to see if I wanted 
> to 
> go SS for that purpose. 
> Can't do it. Even my snow bike has an IGH and I use the low and middle 
> gears every ride.]
> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 6:50:06 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Now *that's* got to be the most different, unique, idiosyncratic 
>> Rivendell build I've seen; kudos for doing things your way!
>>
>> Reminds me of a mountain bike I saw parked at my WDC apartment back 
>> about 1987 with (IIRC) Scott AT-4 bar, disc wheels, and 1.5" Fatboy 
>> slicks.
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 5, 2024 at 4:23 PM Max S  wrote:
>>
>>> Here's my favorite Riv for pavement (and dirt) riding (tires and 
>>> wheels are #1 and #2 concerns, saddle-to-bar drop is #3, and close 
>>> behind 
>>> that is picking a reasonably fast color): 
>>>
>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
>>>
>>> - Max "orange you glad I didn't say banana?" in A2
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 4:18:43 PM UTC-5 J J wrote:
>>>
 Chuck, I believe the best Rivendell for pavement riding is 
 whichever Rivendell that fits you well and is comfortable for your 
 body, 
 that pleases you mechanically and aesthetically, that is within your 
 budget, and that accomplishes whatever goals for the type of riding 
 you 
 hope to do. 

 You said you will be riding mostly on pavement. Pavement riding is 
 a broad category, and there are many different modes and types of it. 
 Will 
 it be "practical" pavement riding (like commuting or hauling stuff 
 from the 
 supermarket), relaxed cruising on a weekend morning, or racing in a 
 group? 
 Will you occasionally venture off road? All of the above?

 One of the things that makes Rivs so wonderful is their 
 versatility. This is what I value about Rivs above all else, which is 
 why I 
 gravitate to the various All Rounders. An Atlantis, for example, can 
 be set 
 up many different ways and it will be brilliant in the various guises. 
 Swap 
 a handlebar or tires (either wider or narrower, or to or from slicks 
 and 
 knobbies) and you have a bike with different character suited for a 
 different type of riding, all while retaining the Rivendell feel. 

 If you want a "road" bike strictly speaking, there are a lot of 
 great suggestions in this thread. In the end it comes back to your own 
 subjectivity, and your sense of the kind of riding you will be doing.

 Good luck with your search!

 On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 2:01:43 PM UTC-5 heike...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> Hi Chuck--as you asked about the Appaloosa and a drop-bar 
> alternative, I'll chime in: I have a 51" 650B Appaloosa with Nitto 
> Choco bars 
> ,
>  
> which Riv describes thus: "It's also good for road bikes instead of a 
> drop 

Re: [RBW] Re: Trip Report: Death Valley February 2024

[Bill Schairer]

Thanks for the great report!

Bill S 
San Diego

On Sunday, March 3, 2024 at 9:39:25 PM UTC-8 Keith P. wrote:

> Sounds like an amazing trip!
> k.
>
> On Mar 3, 2024, at 8:33 PM, Diana H  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Is there a way to post photo's? I tried to post just a single photo and 
> kept getting error's that the message was too long. So here is a link to 
> some photo's.
>
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/m6ymTWsmPXiiwr8P9 
>
>
> On Sunday, March 3, 2024 at 8:19:20 PM UTC-8 Diana H wrote:
>
>> Map: 
>> https://www.gaiagps.com/map/?loc=9.6/-116.8781/36.7032=GJ70zopvv3HDAIv6yQW94aTs=09fa1491-18a7-4735-83a2-eb164d4ba0ba
>>
>> Total miles: ~165 miles 
>> Total Elevation Gain: ~14,400 ft 
>>
>> *Intro: *
>>
>> The inspiration for this route came from the Bikepacking.com- Echo-Titus 
>> Canyon , but Titus 
>> Canyon is currently closed to all traffic (including bicycles), so we were 
>> looking for a way to extend our tip another day. We added Rhyolite Canyon 
>>  from the Dirty 
>> Freehub.
>>
>>  
>>
>> *Bicycles*
>>
>> Diana’s Bike - 2022 Platypus (50 cm, 38x24 crank, 650Bx43mm GravelKing SK 
>> Knobby tires, Nitto Choco handlebar, and a 9-speed cassette)
>>
>> Ran’s Bike – 2023 Kona Sutra (stock parts except the tubeless 2.1 inch 
>> tires)
>>
>> Mikes Bike – 2022 Salsa Cutthroat (stock parts, 2.2 inch tubeless tires)
>>
>>  
>>
>> *Day 1. Rhyolite Rumble*
>> Total Miles: 46
>> Average Speed 8.6mph
>>
>> We drove from Reno to Spicer Ranch. Spicer Ranch is an amazing campground 
>> and the owner runs it entirely on donations. Clean bathrooms, hot showers, 
>> picnic tables, what else could you ask for? Please donate if you stay here. 
>>
>> Our plan today was to ride load-less and ease our way into the trip. We 
>> arrived at Spicer Ranch a little after 10am and were biking by 10:45am. The 
>> first few miles went by quickly and we passed by several old mines. There 
>> is endless gravel to ride out here and you could easily spend the day 
>> exploring mine to mine. The road is pretty tough in places, but this is how 
>> it will be the entire trip.
>>
>> The excitement of beginning our adventure (and being unloaded) had us 
>> riding fast. We had great views riding toward Grapevine Mountains on 
>> amazingly packed gravel. I would get a flat somewhere along here but 
>> patched it up and moved on. 
>>
>> The views would continue but the road would deteriorate into more sand 
>> than gravel and had us pushing on a few occasions. Ran took a spill during 
>> a moment of lapsed attention when his tire hit the side of a wash. Luckily 
>> it was a slow fall and Ran would ride away with minor scratches. Later on 
>> in the day we hit some washboards and I was going too fast and I got a 
>> pinch flat. Patched that too, but the pinch flat happened right next to the 
>> valve and the patch didn’t hold. Replaced the whole tube just before 
>> Rhyolite. This whole time we saw nobody else on the trails.
>>
>> Rhyolite Ghost town is very interesting and they have a lot of eccentric 
>> statues/sculptures. Worth a visit here if you find yourself in the area. 
>> There were a lot of tourists here and it was little jarring after spending 
>> the whole day by ourselves. 
>>
>> The night caught us and to try to get back to camp quicker, we abstained 
>> from the gravel and rode back on highway 95. This was very unpleasant as 
>> it’s a 2-lane highway with 70 mph speed limits. Most everybody passed us 
>> with as much room as they could spare, and we could always hop onto the 
>> gravel sides if we needed. Once back at Spicer Ranch, we set up camp, ate 
>> our dinners, and all fell into peaceful sleep.
>>
>>
>> *Day 2: Spicer Ranch à Chloride City à Furnace Creek à Echo Canyon*
>>
>> Total Mileage: 66 Miles
>> Max Speed: 34.5mph
>> Average: 8.7mph
>>
>> This was a physically hard day!  We wanted more gravel riding today, so 
>> we decided to take Chloride City Road to meet up with Death Valley Road. 
>> The road to Chloride City is all uphill, riding on somewhat loose gravel, 
>> and many parts so sandy some pushing was needed again. The scenery did not 
>> disappoint though! Mike found a license plate from 1932! We harbored 
>> thoughts of going to see Chloride City Ghost Town, but upon seeing that 
>> Chloride City was another 2000 feet of elevation gain and having just 
>> climbed a very difficult 1500 feet, we opted to skip it.
>>
>> We thought we were going to be golden once we got to the turnoff to go 
>> down, but the decent from Chloride City road is difficult. Thank goodness 
>> it was downhill because otherwise we would have had to push our bicycles 
>> 50% more. It was extremely sandy and only the cars with the fattest of 
>> tires would be safe driving this path.
>>
>> Once we hit Daylight Pass Road it was jarring to *fly* down pavement to 
>> Hells Gate Viewpoint (my max speed was almost 35 mph and I’m sure I 

Re: [RBW] New bike decision (help!)

[Bill Schairer]

All interesting.  I just finished a week of gravel riding out of Patagonia 
AZ (highly recommended!) with a friend who is much more of a mountain/off 
road rider than myself.  He was on a Salsa Cutthroat and I was on my 2013 
Atlantis with 50mm tires.  I make no bike recommendations but my buddy 
suggested I get a Surly Krampus for the next time.  He has 4 or 5 various 
off road bikes.  The owner of Patagonia Bikes thought my bike was awesome 
but did comment upon seeing it that he now understood why I described the 
ride as "bumpy." If I were doing a LOT of that riding, I suppose I would 
consider another bike. As it is, at 70, I think my Atlantis will do.  I did 
lag the second half of our longest ride but that was me, not the bike.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, February 24, 2024 at 8:29:27 PM UTC-8 Patrick Moore wrote:

> This is very interesting; I thought all Riv models except the various road 
> models were "country bikes" but to hear the Gus compared to a Jones would 
> seem to be high praise, from what I read about the Jones (it's one of Bike 
> Snob's keepers in his current bike purge).
>
> I just gave away my sole mountain bike -- the much modified Monocog 29er 
> -- in favor of a fatter-tire second wheelset for my Matthews "road bike for 
> dirt,"  but I'll have to consider a Gus if I ever decide to get another 
> mtb. Question: Can you get a =/< 160 mm Q with a Gus? What kept me from 
> getting a Jones was the >160 mm Q.
>
> Patrick Moore, also closing in very rapidly on 69, in ABQ, NM.
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 24, 2024 at 1:57 PM Richard Rose  wrote:
>
>> I’ve not ridden a Platypus but I’ve yet to hear it described as a trail 
>> bike. Love, love, love my Clem on & off road but if things get dicey it’s a 
>> bit overwhelmed with the lower bottom bracket - compared to my Gus. The Gus 
>> or the new Susie (get one! Run do not walk!) are singletrack machines. Yes 
>> they are good for other duties as well but are conceived & built to be 
>> mountain bikes. I am blown away by it on rough, rooty & slightly rocky 
>> singletrack. It is every bit the mountain bike that a Jones is (I had one) 
>> which is of course highly regarded in that category. I’ve yet to experience 
>> a pedal strike on the Gus. I’ve had quite a few on the Clem. And I am 
>> pretty decent at avoiding them if I do say so. So, IMHO if what you are 
>> looking for is a singletrack bike get the new Susie or try to find a 
>> leftover one/Gus.
>> FWIW, I am closing on 69 years old & have ditched my full suspension bike 
>> in favor of the Gus. As you allude to, I am a bit less aggressive on the 
>> Gus vs. the Ibis. I think that’s is smarter at my age. No less fun though.:)
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: San Francisco Randonneurs 200k ride report

[Bill Schairer]

Such a refreshing write-up!!  The current obsession with "FKT"s for 
anything and everything has sort of turned me off.

Bill S
San Diego

On Tuesday, February 13, 2024 at 10:53:23 AM UTC-8 ttoshi wrote:

> Thanks for all the encouragement!  I am VERY lucky to have a custom Riv 
> made for randonneuring. 
>
> https://rivbike.tumblr.com/post/165236855564/toshis-custom-i-dont-care-who-you-are-or-what
>
> My new acquaintance on the AHH took a nice picture and I'm hoping to share 
> that here. 
>
> I agree with Bill regarding elevation.  I think the major difference from 
> other 200k events is the start in San Rafael instead of San Francisco cuts 
> off an up and over Camino Alto into Fairfax and the same out on the return 
> and the "oh so fun" climb out of Sausalito to the Golden Gate Bridge.  It's 
> always a challenge to end the ride with the hills.
>
> Speaking of Sausalito reminds me of one of my favorite randonnees ever, 
> where I rode with my 5 yr old son on a Populaire 110k on our tandem 
> (pre-Hubba times) in 2010.  The only way we could make the time cutoff was 
> to have my Skittle-powered son climbing out of the saddle and up the hill 
> to the bridge.  He was so inspiring that several other populaire riders got 
> motivated to finish too!  Now my son's in college and I'm eligible for a 
> senior discount at IHOP.  Time flies.
>
> I found an itty bitty picture from that day:
>
> [image: image.png]
>
>
> Toshi
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Ride Report - Santa Monica to Santa Barbara Century

[Bill Schairer]

"Omata One: How does one buy one? I didn't see a "Buy Now" button or a link 
to a dealer network."

Or even a price?

On Sunday, February 4, 2024 at 4:35:06 PM UTC-8 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Two very interesting adaptations. The Racing Basket weighs the same as the 
> custom rear rack on my Matthews #1. And getting digital GPS into an 
> anaolgue readout is very appealing.
>
> Omata One: How does one buy one? I didn't see a "Buy Now" button or a link 
> to a dealer network.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 3, 2024 at 2:03 AM Keith Paugh  wrote:
>
>> ... 
>>
>
>>- The “Racing basket 
>>” is just a 
>>Wald basket that they cut down to half height. (I think they look cool)
>>- The odometer/speedometer is a digital bike computer built into 
>>analog guts. Omata One  is name. They are so rad. 
>>Measures speed, time, distance, and elevation gain, and then syncs with 
>>your phone to record the data. Picked this one up used. 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Low q, low range 2x cranks

[Bill Schairer]

So, for example, the old TA Cyclotouriste cranksets, which are known for 
having a low Q, were designed when the rear ends were maybe 120 or 126 for 
use on frames that could maybe take 32mm  or so tires.  The stays didn't 
flare out from the bottom brackets as much as a lot of modern bikes built 
for 135mm rears and accepting wider and wider tires.  Compromises, 
compromises, you may find that a Hillborne just can't accept a Q of 150 
either because of chainring clearance or crank arm clearance.  I don't 
know. How much clearance do you currently have on your Hillborne between 
the end of the crank arms and the stays?  How much clearance between the 
chainrings and the chain stay?  You can go out and buy a narrow Q crank and 
find that you have to mount it to a longer spindle than it was designed for 
in order to get the necessary clearance or desired chainline putting you 
right back where you are now?

I don't know if pedal spindle lengths are standard but maybe there is a 
pedal out there or replacement spindles out there whereby one can bring the 
pedals inboard a few mm?  For my wife I had to buy pedal extenders to move 
her pedals out because she was clipping her ankle bones on the crank arms.

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 1:17:17 PM UTC-8 Adam wrote:

> I tapped the right place for info!
>
> The nerd crank database is EXACTLY what I was looking for. And Bill, 
> Justus, thanks for clarifying the chainline stuff. I think I get it, though 
> I'm not sure if I understand what BB will get a specific chainline, I'll 
> ask that question once I get farther along figuring this out.
>
> I do intend to run it as a 1X + granny. Realistically, where I live, the 
> chances of using the granny are non-existent, but I love climbing and on 
> the rare occasions I travel to bike, want the option.
>
> As far as WHY I'm interested in changing, I have an IRD defiant 46/30 on 
> another bike and I'm finding that I MUCH prefer that feel to the wider 
> stance on the Hillborne. I don't know for sure the exact measurements, but 
> I think the IRD is around 150 and the current triple I have on the 
> Hillborne is 160+
>
> thanks for the info. I'm going to poke around that database later.
>
> Adam
>
> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 1:13:19 PM UTC-6 Bill Schairer wrote:
>
>> "That's like asking why someone wants a longer/shorter stem..."
>>
>> Which could be a perfectly valid question to someone who has stated he 
>> has limited knowledge of such things.  The reason for the goal may 
>> determine the method of achieving it.  If the person I actually asked the 
>> question of takes offense, I apologize.
>>
>> Bill S
>> San Diego
>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:09:37 AM UTC-8 Josiah Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Uhh... because lower Q works better for some people? That's like asking 
>>> why someone wants a longer/shorter stem...
>>>
>>> Adam, with the VO cranks (if we're thinking of the same ones) if you can 
>>> get a set of arms without rings, TA rings will fit, which are available in 
>>> any tooth count down to 26 IIRC. 40/26 is definitely possible with the TA 
>>> 50.4bcd rings. You could also watch eBay etc for used TA cyclotouriste/pro 
>>> 5 vis cranks, which is what the VO and SunXCD cranks are copies of.
>>>
>>> Josiah Anderson 
>>> Missoula MT 
>>>
>>>
>>> Le mer. 10 janv. 2024 à 9:47 AM, Bill Schairer  a 
>>> écrit :
>>>
>>>> Since you stated you are a bit new to all of this, I am curious as to 
>>>> exactly why you are so focused on a lower Q?
>>>>
>>>> Bill S
>>>> San Diego
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 9:26:06 AM UTC-8 Adam wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Great ideas already. I have thought about the VO cranks, but want 
>>>>> slightly lower gearing if I'm going to the trouble of swapping.
>>>>>
>>>>> For Ron, or anyone else, does swapping the large ring for a bash guard 
>>>>> allow for a lower Q? I assumed that would stay the same?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm going to look at the Alex cycle option, your pic is exactly what I 
>>>>> want to do. Is there a clever way to piece something like that together 
>>>>> from older stuff on eBay? Guessing it may take knowledge I don't have 
>>>>>
>>>>> Adam
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 11:15:31 AM UTC-6 Ron Mc wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> adding a ps - another use of your triple cra

Re: [RBW] Re: Low q, low range 2x cranks

[Bill Schairer]

"That's like asking why someone wants a longer/shorter stem..."

Which could be a perfectly valid question to someone who has stated he has 
limited knowledge of such things.  The reason for the goal may determine 
the method of achieving it.  If the person I actually asked the question of 
takes offense, I apologize.

Bill S
San Diego
On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:09:37 AM UTC-8 Josiah Anderson wrote:

> Uhh... because lower Q works better for some people? That's like asking 
> why someone wants a longer/shorter stem...
>
> Adam, with the VO cranks (if we're thinking of the same ones) if you can 
> get a set of arms without rings, TA rings will fit, which are available in 
> any tooth count down to 26 IIRC. 40/26 is definitely possible with the TA 
> 50.4bcd rings. You could also watch eBay etc for used TA cyclotouriste/pro 
> 5 vis cranks, which is what the VO and SunXCD cranks are copies of.
>
> Josiah Anderson 
> Missoula MT 
>
>
> Le mer. 10 janv. 2024 à 9:47 AM, Bill Schairer  a 
> écrit :
>
>> Since you stated you are a bit new to all of this, I am curious as to 
>> exactly why you are so focused on a lower Q?
>>
>> Bill S
>> San Diego
>>
>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 9:26:06 AM UTC-8 Adam wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Great ideas already. I have thought about the VO cranks, but want 
>>> slightly lower gearing if I'm going to the trouble of swapping.
>>>
>>> For Ron, or anyone else, does swapping the large ring for a bash guard 
>>> allow for a lower Q? I assumed that would stay the same?
>>>
>>> I'm going to look at the Alex cycle option, your pic is exactly what I 
>>> want to do. Is there a clever way to piece something like that together 
>>> from older stuff on eBay? Guessing it may take knowledge I don't have 
>>>
>>> Adam
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 11:15:31 AM UTC-6 Ron Mc wrote:
>>>
>>>> adding a ps - another use of your triple crank, there are some 
>>>> virtually weightless bash guards out there if you want to make it a 
>>>> compact 
>>>> double.  
>>>>
>>>> [image: Rw6vTY9.jpg]
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:44:54 AM UTC-6 Ron Mc wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Adam, 
>>>>> take a look at VO Rando crank.  
>>>>> If you can find them, Sun XCD makes their 50.8 BCD and chainrings, 
>>>>> which I'm running on 2 bikes.  .  
>>>>> I was on SJS Cycles last night looking at rings, and noticed they 
>>>>> still have some T/A-5 chainrings.  
>>>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:15:06 AM UTC-6 Adam wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Adjacent to the triples thread, I'm thinking about moving away from a 
>>>>>> triple to a double in order to get a lower Q.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What are options for double cranksets that are around 40/26 or so? I 
>>>>>> think that would be doable with the Rene Herse cranks, but too much $$$ 
>>>>>> for 
>>>>>> me. Are there any cheaper options that will do that and give me a q in 
>>>>>> the 
>>>>>> 140s?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Second, drivetrain stuff is a little new to me. What determines how 
>>>>>> small a q factor a specific bike can have? I'm assuming chainstays play 
>>>>>> a 
>>>>>> role here? This hypothetical project is for a Hillborne, so I'd be 
>>>>>> curious 
>>>>>> what folks have used to get low q on their Hillbornes. I'm assuming I 
>>>>>> may 
>>>>>> have to change the BB as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Adam
>>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a82cfe04-9719-4991-9de9-ad164a0c59d6n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a82cfe04-9719-4991-9de9-ad164a0c59d6n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Low q, low range 2x cranks

[Bill Schairer]

Since you stated you are a bit new to all of this, I am curious as to 
exactly why you are so focused on a lower Q?

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 9:26:06 AM UTC-8 Adam wrote:

> Thanks,
>
> Great ideas already. I have thought about the VO cranks, but want slightly 
> lower gearing if I'm going to the trouble of swapping.
>
> For Ron, or anyone else, does swapping the large ring for a bash guard 
> allow for a lower Q? I assumed that would stay the same?
>
> I'm going to look at the Alex cycle option, your pic is exactly what I 
> want to do. Is there a clever way to piece something like that together 
> from older stuff on eBay? Guessing it may take knowledge I don't have 
>
> Adam
>
> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 11:15:31 AM UTC-6 Ron Mc wrote:
>
>> adding a ps - another use of your triple crank, there are some virtually 
>> weightless bash guards out there if you want to make it a compact double.  
>>
>> [image: Rw6vTY9.jpg]
>>
>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:44:54 AM UTC-6 Ron Mc wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Adam, 
>>> take a look at VO Rando crank.  
>>> If you can find them, Sun XCD makes their 50.8 BCD and chainrings, which 
>>> I'm running on 2 bikes.  .  
>>> I was on SJS Cycles last night looking at rings, and noticed they still 
>>> have some T/A-5 chainrings.  
>>> On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 10:15:06 AM UTC-6 Adam wrote:
>>>
 Hi all,

 Adjacent to the triples thread, I'm thinking about moving away from a 
 triple to a double in order to get a lower Q.

 What are options for double cranksets that are around 40/26 or so? I 
 think that would be doable with the Rene Herse cranks, but too much $$$ 
 for 
 me. Are there any cheaper options that will do that and give me a q in the 
 140s?

 Second, drivetrain stuff is a little new to me. What determines how 
 small a q factor a specific bike can have? I'm assuming chainstays play a 
 role here? This hypothetical project is for a Hillborne, so I'd be curious 
 what folks have used to get low q on their Hillbornes. I'm assuming I may 
 have to change the BB as well.

 Thanks!

 Adam

>>>

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[RBW] Re: Why do some bikes just feel consistently faster?

[Bill Schairer]

Ted,
I love your explanation!  My niece is a college crew coach and she also 
cycles.  I will have to ask her about "swing."

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, January 8, 2024 at 7:15:31 AM UTC-8 Ted Durant wrote:

Not to be overly contrarian, but ...

Planing is a terrible word for the phenomenon in question, which is when 
the flex characteristics of the bike are such that the energy stored in 
deformation (of the frame and all the attached parts) is efficiently 
returned to power the rear wheel during the lower power part of the 
pedaling cycle. When a boat planes, it rises out of the water, resulting in 
a large reduction in coefficient of drag. The equivalent on a bicycle would 
be the development of a vacuum around the bike and rider at a certain 
speed. That would be fun, but it's certainly not what's happening on earth. 
Ironically, there is a well-known and used term in Jan's back yard, for the 
exact phenomenon he is trying to describe. Rowers have long used the word 
"swing" to describe a shell and oars whose flex characteristics synchronize 
well with their strokes, allowing them to go faster for a given power 
output. Jan claims that bikes that "plane" magically increase a rider's 
power output, but the reality is that bikes that swing well waste less of 
the rider's  power. A better way to put it might be that such a bike puts 
more of the rider's power to the back wheel. 

The flex characteristics of the frame are important, of course, but the 
entire bicycle (and its rider) is a system of springs and in such a system 
the softer springs affect flex first, with the stiffer springs becoming 
more relevant as the forces increase. For most of us on this list, we don't 
spend a lot of time putting enough power into the pedals to get to the 
point where frame flexibility is significantly tested. At 57kg, I can tell 
you that I rarely put out that kind of power. I have a brevet bike made of 
.7/.4/.7 standard diameter tubing, and I can make that frame flex, but not 
for very long. That bike rides on 42mm tires at about 33 psi, and the tires 
are definitely the soft springs in that system.

I don't attribute aluminum, or stiffer frames in general, to an increased 
focus on cadence. Track cyclists have always been obsessed with cadence. 
With the introduction of multiple gear systems for road biking came the 
opportunity to develop notions of "ideal" cadence. Note that when Jan talks 
about frames "planing" for him, he almost always talks about it working for 
his preferred cadence. Stiff frames, in fact, reduce the importance of 
cadence, as they reduce the contribution of the frame to swing (for a given 
power input). For me, cadence is only important when going uphill or into a 
headwind. It is important because I need enough momentum in my feet to keep 
a steady speed. Without that momentum, I am repeatedly accelerating during 
the power phase and decelerating during the non-power phase. That is 
terribly inefficient. And that is why, as discussed in the recent thread on 
gearing, it is so important to have low gears in steep hills. Long before 
aluminum frames were a twinkle in Gary Klein's eyes, cyclists talked about 
"staying on top of a gear" when climbing. It meant to maintain a fast 
enough cadence that you were pedaling smoothly, maintaining a constant 
speed. Cyclists have also long talked about using smaller gears and a 
higher cadence to "work your heart, not your legs." 

So, I also don't have _the_ answer to why some bikes seem/feel/are faster 
than others. Many of my best Strava times on climbing segments and my best 
100km time are on my Heron prototype, which is a road frame but has the 
heavy rear stays from the touring frame. You can feel the weight of the 
stays (and the weight of the old SunTour freewheel) when you pick up the 
bike. Maybe it's just that I have so much invested in that bike that it 
inspires me to push a little harder. I tend to believe Jan's hypothesis 
that stiffness in the downtube and chainstays and flex in the top tube, 
relative to each other, help a bike swing in a way that returns energy to 
the rear wheel. Interestingly, old Reynolds tube sets were always spec'd 
that way, with thinner walls in the top tube than in the down tube. 
Somewhere along the way they switched to the Columbus standard, where top 
tube and down tube walls are the same. The Heron Road bikes have .1mm 
thinner top tube walls than down tube, and my prototype has extra heavy 
stays, so there you go.

Ted Durant
Milwaukee WI USA

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Re: [RBW] Why do some bikes just feel consistently faster?

[Bill Schairer]

Never ever have I heard this before.  All my bikes have been and are steel 
going back 50+ years.  I love a 3x9 half step with granny where I can dial 
in my cadence to that magic spot where things seem almost effortless.  It 
is almost like having a CVT.  I ride friction and shift more often than 
most, near as I can tell, even those riding indexed.  I'm not positive but 
I don't think I have ever been on an aluminum bike.  Not saying my way is 
right or wrong for anyone but me but it has absolutely nothing to do with 
the frame material.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, January 6, 2024 at 7:16:48 PM UTC-8 Ron Mc wrote:

> I have to take exception with you Patrick - the people I know who are 
> concerned with cadence came from aluminum bikes, never change their 
> cadence, can tell you what is their cadence, and are always shifting.  
> On a good steel frame, you spin and mash and, yes, you still change gears, 
> possibly not as often.  All of us on friction shifting anticipate and shift 
> early, and our "cadence" is all over the place.  
> Dailing into the sweet spot is never a constant rpm.  
>
> On Saturday, January 6, 2024 at 7:18:27 PM UTC-6 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Jan 6, 2024 at 6:16 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> ... Still, I think there are things "beyond your head" that make certain 
>>> bikes feel this way
>>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.matthewbcrawford.com/new-page-1-1 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Goals for 2024 (will they be S.M.A.R.T. ?)

[Bill Schairer]

My annual goals for the past for the past 7 years, going into the 8th have 
been Simple, Measurable, and Achievable - except I missed it in 2023 by 
about 70 miles due to filling a cancellation spot for hernia repair 12/26.  
I do have my High goal (6,000 miles) vs my Minimum goal (5,000 miles). 2023 
saw me fall short on both.  I guess the Relevance for me is the belief that 
the magic drug is exercise.  When my doctor wanted me to start statins I 
told her I'll use exercise and diet instead.  Like Bill L, I want to 
maintain my quality of life but I view it more as preventing an untimely 
end due to unnatural inactivity rather than an extension of life. There is 
a local guy I follow on Strava who is just a bit younger than my 70 years 
who did something like 15,000 miles in 2023!!  Much of that on gravel with 
enormous climbing.  That, for me, would definitely not qualify for Timely.  
Also, I sometimes wonder if there is a tipping point with respect to 
Relevance to health where one can get too much exercise?  If so, I somehow 
think my body would let me know.

I also like to get in at least one week of touring each year. I think I 
missed 2020 due to COVID, couldn't handle missing again in 2021 due to 
COVID so went anyway and got COVID on the tour. Oh well.

Prior to these past few years I had no specific goals.  I was pretty 
strictly a utilitarian cyclist rather than recreational (except for 
touring).  It was difficult for me to motivate myself to just go out and 
ride for the sake of riding even though I always enjoyed it.  Having the 
goal now motivates me to go out, even on most of those days when I really 
don't feel like it, and I never regret doing so.

Off to slow start in 2024, 1 mile around the neighborhood.  Hoping to get 
clearance from surgeon on the 9th.  I'm getting antsy...

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, January 5, 2024 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-8 George Schick wrote:

> ‘Vee get too soon oldt und too late schmart’  I love it. Sounds exactly 
> like some of the things my grandfather used to say.  I may have to make a 
> plaque for this myself.
>
> On Friday, January 5, 2024 at 11:08:36 AM UTC-6 John Dewey wrote:
>
>> All worthy goals…but beware the ‘ride your age’ program. I embarked on 
>> this years ago and found we too quickly reach the point where the math just 
>> doesn’t look so good…i.e. it’s all backwards. 
>>
>> My grandfather, who taught me all I ever needed to know about bicycle 
>> mechanics, had a goofy plaque over his workbench: ‘Vee get too soon oldt 
>> und too late schmart’. 
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 5, 2024 at 6:48 AM Bill Lindsay  wrote:
>>
>>> Often we do a goals thread, and there seems to me that there's a schism 
>>> on how to approach goals.  Some folks have very specific goals: i.e. 
>>> "average 10 miles a day over the year".  Others enjoy eschewing the 
>>> specificity: i.e. "have more fun on the bike".
>>>
>>> I'm a devotee of S.M.A.R.T. goals, which are (S)simple, (M)easurable, 
>>> (A)chievable, (R)relevant, (T)imply.  The notion of the S.M.A.R.T. goal has 
>>> improved my life in several ways and maybe in a way has saved my life. I'm 
>>> a compulsive person and I'm a numbers guy. I'm going to be compulsive about 
>>> *something 
>>> , *so if that something can be achievable and healthy, then that's a 
>>> good thing.  I've gotten into the habit of setting up tons of tiny 
>>> S.M.A.R.T. goals, and it sets me up to have a regular pattern of taking 
>>> W's.  
>>>
>>> My big picture goals for 2024 include:
>>>
>>> 10,000km ridden
>>> Summit Mount Diablo 5 times on 5 different bikes
>>> Put myself in the position to attempt my first 400k brevet
>>> Complete the Marin Mountains 200k brevet
>>> Complete 25% of every city in Contra Costa County on Wandrer
>>> Complete 25% of Marin County on Wandrer
>>> Ride 55 miles on my 55th birthday and kick off riding my age on my 
>>> birthday as a regular event
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> -- 
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>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Platypus for Clem L?

[Bill Schairer]

For those looking for light and zippy step through bikes, this one looks 
like one special bike:

"Albert Eisentraut Limited possibly one of a kind . I posted this bike on 
Bike forums and no one had seen one before , So most likely a special order 
. Small frame size. All Campagnolo Components. Stays are very chipped up as 
it sat between two mountain bikes in a shed at a yard sale. Bike appears to 
have little wear otherwise. Wheels are also campy period correct ,the ones 
found on the bike were tubular . Buyer can have either pair although no 
tires on the originals."

https://sandiego.craigslist.org/esd/bik/d/eisentraut-step-through-road-bike/7682405954.html

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, November 12, 2023 at 5:56:27 AM UTC-8 sarahlik...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> I had a different steel frame and all I can describe is that when I was 
> riding I felt like I was dragging every pound of that bike along, where 
> with the Platypus it feels like it is leaping forward. I just don't feel 
> it. Even as I have added racks, bags, fenders and I keep asking when it 
> will feel like a heavy bike. That has not happened yet.
>
> On Friday, November 10, 2023 at 10:46:30 AM UTC-8 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> Jake,
>> That is interesting that the bikes are about equal in weight but one 
>> rides "zippier and lighter". I've heard this before in comparing the Clem 
>> to the Platypus but I just don't know what qualities makes a bike feel 
>> zippier if it isn't lighter weight.
>> Thanks,
>> Doug
>>
>> On Friday, November 10, 2023 at 12:25:06 PM UTC-5 jake...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I agree with what Garth is saying about weight/size differences. 
>>> Depending on the respective builds and how the sizing falls, it's possible 
>>> that a Platypus could be every bit as long and heavy as a Clem. As people 
>>> in the 81-84cm pbh range, I have a 55cm Platypus and my dad has a 52cm 
>>> Clem, and the Clem is probably lighter in part due to the smaller wheel 
>>> size. Both are great bikes, and I do find the Platypus rides zippier and 
>>> lighter, but in terms of lifting, transport, and storage there is not much 
>>> difference between the two. Hope this helps!
>>>
>>> Jake
>>>
>>> On Thursday, November 9, 2023 at 4:06:09 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote:
>>>
 Chung, If your wife finds the Clem too long and heavy a Platypus is not 
 going to make a effective difference in regards to weight or maneuvering. 
 What would is a frame like a Soma Buena Vista (rim brake or disc) or Velo 
 Orange Polyvalent low kicker. Both have relatively typical chainstays and 
 wheelbases and are going to be easier to pick up and maneuver simply due 
 to 
 the fact that they have "normal" wheelbases and chainstays so are going to 
 be inherently lighter to begin with. There's a notable difference in 
 geometry though, with the VO being more low trail and the Soma mid-high. 
 Plus the Soma has quite steep seat tube angles so if using a Brooks you 
 may 
 not be able to get the seat back where you want. Thankfully they do both 
 use a 27.2 post though. 

 Note, the Platy isn't a step through either so all three compared to a 
 Clem are more like step around I suppose ! 


 https://bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=5b8578fd48f3a30004789cd9,5ee8f7ce7eaeb8001717ac2f
 ,

 On Thursday, November 9, 2023 at 2:53:48 PM UTC-5 Hoch in ut wrote:

 I don’t know about the Platypus, but my wife rides a Betty Foy. It 
 rides ligh/zippy  and she loves it. Currently has a Wald 137 front basket 
 and a Riv trunk bag. 
 They’re a bit hard to come by but Cheviot was essentially the same 
 bike. 

 Tires are 650b x 38 with fenders. Not sure I’d go larger. 

 On Thursday, November 9, 2023 at 9:21:50 AM UTC-7 chungeu...wrote:

 Hi,

 I bought a complete Clem L for my wife and she enjoyed riding it so far.
 However, she felt that it's a bit too much bike for her since she only 
 rides it on the pavement for the commute. She finds it too heavy when 
 storing it in a rack and bring it on the the commuting train.
 Since she still likes the step-through design, I wonder if swapping it 
 with the complete Platypus would solve her problem. Or, can we solve this 
 with lighter components (probably the wheelset and tires?) and some 
 cockpit 
 setup to make it more zippy?

 Best,
 Chung



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Re: [RBW] Re: Are Paul brakes worth the money?

[Bill Schairer]

Bill, double check to make sure the mounting bolts haven't loosened.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, October 7, 2023 at 3:50:35 AM UTC-7 Bill Fulford wrote:

> The brakes are cantilever with salmon pads. I assume that the are properly 
> mounted. The squawking began after about five months of riding. In the 
> beginning there was no noise.
>
> On Friday, October 6, 2023 at 10:50:09 PM UTC-4 ted.l...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> That noise is typical of a he salmon pads that ship on Paul brakes. 
>> salmon pads stop really well but I’ve had several pair on different bikes 
>> and different brake styles and after a bit they all started to make noise 
>> no matter how I adjusted them. I’ve also found that Paul Motolites in 
>> particular do not like having racks mounted to them. This made any existing 
>> brake noise multiples worse I assume due to the two sides being more rigid 
>> mounted together allowing for different resonance to occur and generate 
>> more noise. This was particularly apparent on my Gus I assume due to its 
>> unique front end geometry.
>>
>> My opinion on the Paul Motolites is mixed. On the one hand, they’re 
>> beautiful and the quick release mechanism is nice compared to typical 
>> v-brakes with the noodle holding it all together. The adjustment mechanism 
>> is also a work of arm and does make adjusting for different when sizes a 
>> bit nicer. However, I’m not sure they’re worth the money purely on the 
>> basis of function. To me they’re like a designer handbag. They make a nice 
>> accessory when paired with other nice accessories and a good outfit they 
>> can be stunning. But at the end of the day, a $5 handbag holds stuff as 
>> well as a $300 handbag. My $30 Shimano Alivio v-brakes stop my Appaloosa 
>> just as well as the $300 Motolites on my Gus. But my Gus is my pretty show 
>> bike that I take out on the town on a Sunny Saturday to get things at the 
>> farmer’s market. My Appaloosa is my daily driver. I lock it up outside of 
>> stores and restaurants and ride it, rain or shine, to work 5 days a week. 
>> It’s still a nice bike but the parts on it are more utilitarian in nature. 
>> The frame is the flashiest piece of kit on the whole bike and I like it 
>> that way.
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 6, 2023 at 10:24 PM Julian Westerhout  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Bill, 
>>>
>>> Which brakes are they?  Which pads are you using? Are they properly 
>>> slightly toed in? 
>>>
>>> Photos would help in making a diagnosis -- but I doubt the squawking is 
>>> due to the brakes themselves -- more likely to be pad type and/or setup. 
>>>
>>> Julian Westerhout
>>> Bloomington, IL 
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 6, 2023 at 7:54:00 PM UTC-5 Bill Fulford wrote:
>>>
>>>> I bought Paul brakes for my Atlantis and initially loved them. Now, 
>>>> however, they squawk like a stuck goose. I’ve cleaned the rims, sanded the 
>>>> pads but with no success. They were installed by a bike shop so I don’t 
>>>> think that’s the problem. It’s embarrassing to ride at times. I’m looking 
>>>> for suggestions to ease the noise. Thanks in advance. Bill
>>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, January 10, 2023 at 9:58:13 AM UTC-5 Bill Schairer wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have a set of cantilevers and a set of center pulls, both purchased 
>>>>> used off this list, I think.  What I really like about both sets is how 
>>>>> easy it is to disconnect and re-connect the straddle cables making wheel 
>>>>> removal and installation so much easier.  Even though I didn't pay full 
>>>>> retail they were still quite pricey compared to what I had.  I don't 
>>>>> regret 
>>>>> my purchases at all.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill S
>>>>> San Diego
>>>>>
>>>>> On Monday, January 9, 2023 at 9:29:03 AM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Paul brakes are worth it. 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you buy, try and decide you don't like them you can sell them for 
>>>>>> close to what you paid!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Monday, January 9, 2023 at 12:22:34 PM UTC-5 Jay Riley wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> PS: I'll always keep hydro brakes on the dual-suspension mtn bike.  
>>>>>>> They're cool!  The braking assignment is short, severe braking loads, 
>>>>>>> as 
>>>>>>> opposed to braking loads on

Re: [RBW] A College Clem

[Bill Schairer]

I'll take the middle ground.  Let him get the lay of the land before making 
a decision.

On Sunday, August 6, 2023 at 12:53:46 AM UTC-7 Luke Hendrickson wrote:

> Do it!!! What a way for him to think of your father and remember him. 
>
> On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 10:56:15 PM UTC-7 krhe...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> DON'T DO IT !
>>
>> I am collectively in the same thought as the others before my post. Save 
>> the Clem Smith Jr. "L"  for after his college years for him to thoroughly 
>> appreciate it, as a graduation present.  
>>
>> Yes, the likelihood of it getting stolen is very high in a college 
>> setting. Buy him a second hand bicycle to ride to college. If it does get 
>> stolen, you will be heart-broken and have a very difficult time forgiving 
>> yourself for allowing him to ride the Clem to college.  
>>
>> Rivendell bicycles are very special and their owners treat them well with 
>> the utmost care. 
>>
>> *The Clem will not fit on the bicycle rack of a transit bus. It is nearly 
>> 80" long.* 
>>
>> Kim Hetzel
>> Yelm, WA. 
>>
>> On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 9:23:44 PM UTC-7 Josiah Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> I'm going to go against others' strong opinions here. It probably 
>>> depends on where exactly he's going, but a Riv can be fine on a college 
>>> campus if he's careful. My Crust and Rivendell have both survived college 
>>> campus life at the University of Montana with me. I've had to use all sorts 
>>> of creativity for keeping them inside in Montana winters; they've ended up 
>>> under my bed, hanging in a closet, in the garage at work, in my living room 
>>> in the house I live in now, and the list goes on and on. When leaving them 
>>> locked up, my thinking is that they don't look like fancy modern bikes that 
>>> would be attractive to theives, and if they are locked well (I usually use 
>>> two u-locks if leaving for more than a couple hours) then the theives will 
>>> go for the abundance of basic modern mountain bikes locked with cables 
>>> instead. It's worked well for me for the past three years, and I know 
>>> several others who have ridden nice bikes on college campuses for many 
>>> years. Lock it up well, don't completely ignore it and it'll be fine. And 
>>> if it's not, then at least it was being loved and not just sitting around.
>>>
>>> Josiah Anderson
>>> Missoula, MT
>>>
>>> Le sam. 5 août 2023 à 19:56, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! <
>>> jonasa...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>>>
 It nearly kills me to say it, but my older son will be heading to 
 college in a year. Freshman aren’t to bring cars to campus, so that leaves 
 buses, bikes, and your own two feet for transportation. My boys have grown 
 up riding Clem Hs; this son rides a 52 cm cast-off from my husband (who 
 doesn’t ride, sigh). 

 My 6’3” Dad had a blue 59 cm Clem on order when he died suddenly in 
 2020, and his blue Clem has sat, boxed, waiting for my boy to grow into 
 it. 
 I lugged the gargantuan box up from the basement last week to see how if 
 the bike would fit. “Now that I’ve obtained optimal height,” my son is 
 fond 
 of saying… 

 Anyway, he’s 6’1” now (likely still growing) and I need him to decide 
 if he wants to stick with his old Clem H (that he was fond of) or settle 
 into this Clem L. Because whichever bike he chooses is getting new wheels, 
 dyno and fenders and going to college with him. At first he was opposed to 
 the idea of a new Clem; he liked his old Clem, thought it looked cool. But 
 after the - as he calls it - Big Bike was assembled, he really began to 
 like it. “It looks elegant,” he said. It really does, all long and lithe, 
 in blue and silver. He put his saddle and bags on the bike and we test 
 rode 
 it tonight. He said, “I am really liking the Big Bike. I like that my 
 knees 
 don’t have anything to hit (geez, were his knees hitting his bars?!) and 
 it 
 looks elegant. It feels more at home now that I have my old saddle on it.” 

 I have mixed feelings about sending him to college with this bike, 
 because it’s so nice. I also doubt he’ll be able to get it on a bus bike 
 rack - and I have no idea how often he will want to do that. His bike life 
 is totally unknown at this point. All I know is that I’m getting him dyno 
 because the kid has never remembered to charge a light in his LIFE and I 
 will not sleep at night without it.The 52 takes 650b wheels and the 59 
 takes 700c, so I don’t want to buy the wheels until I know which bike he 
 really wants. But as of now, he wants his new bike.

 I know people will say we should just get a beater. I know why that 
 would be advisable, but I also hate to think of a Clem languishing when it 
 could be serving a noble purpose. I’d love for him and his Clem to journey 
 through undergrad together.

 I am wondering…has anyone gone to college or sent their 

[RBW] Re: Tried and liked: Suntour Cyclone pretzel

[Bill Schairer]

I vote for buy a gauge and do it yourself.  I bought a Park DAG years ago 
after a wreck and have used it many, many times since.  No regrets.  
Haven't I watched your build videos?  You need this tool regardless.  That 
said, if a shop used one and aligned the hanger, I have a lot of trouble 
thinking the hanger is responsible for the jumping. In my experience, a 
misaligned hanger results in poor shifting, noisy drivetrain, and 
difficulty adjusting the high and low stops.  If it is jumping between 
gears, maybe, but then should be happening in all gears or at least never 
seem quite right no matter which gear?  If it is jumping on the same gear, 
I'd be thinking chain, cassette and/or chainrings?

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 8:20:22 PM UTC-7 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Okay, some mild updates. 
>
> I've bent and tweaked the hanger with crescent wrenches at least two dozen 
> times now. Worked on it during the miserable heat wave here and during 
> nicer weather yesterday. During the process I remove the chain and the 
> derailer, tweak the hanger, re-install the chain and derailer, test ride. 
> Repeat. Over and over! Every time I ride the bike the chain skips. 
>
> I've tried aligning by hand and eye. I've used a series of straight edges, 
> trying to reference off the cassette to the face of the derailer hanger 
> where the derailer sits. I can get the straight edges into plane with one 
> another but evidently that's not enough because the chain still jumps. 
>
> I feel like I can finesse this thing back into working order but I have so 
> far been unsuccessful. The hanger is relatively flat considering how 
> mangled it got. It's considerably better than it was. The bolt hole is 
> elongated but fortunately derailer bolts screw in nicely and the threads 
> feel good. Through all my uninstalling/reinstalling the bolts thread in 
> nicely each time. 
>
> One problem is that the guys at the LBS have put their dropout and hanger 
> alignment tools on the bike and they say the tools show things are aligned. 
> *But* they are also audibly and visibly weary of putting too much torque 
> on the hanger and seem to think it's going to shear off the frame if they 
> look at it funny. I don't think that's going to happen. I talked to Grant 
> about this twice now and he doesn't think that's going to happen, either. 
> He shared an acedote wherein he bent a derailer hanger through 180º of 
> motion several times before the hanger sheared off. I'm not moving mine 
> nearly as much, just a bit at a time. And today I heard Grant Petersen say 
> "Steel is magical." So I'm adding that to my lifetime book of memorable 
> quotes by notable people. 
>
> There's another shop in town but I get bad vibes every time I go in there 
> so I'm going to spare myself and stay away. I know if I go in there it'll 
> end up being a bad scene and I'll regret it. 
>
> I'm open to having a builder try to align the hanger, heat it up and shape 
> it or braze a new dropout onto the frame. But the builder I know and have 
> worked with before on three other bikes (this Hillborne included) has sold 
> his tools and retired. Two other nearby builders haven't returned my 
> messages. 
>
> Now I'm thinking the best next step is to drop > $100 on a derailer hanger 
> alignment tool and try it myself in the home shop. Looking at the Park Tool 
> DAG 2.2. This eliminates the hesitancy of other mechanics (I'm not afraid 
> to wreck the bike) and gives me a useful tool to have forever. 
>
> Full options going forward (as I see them, open to suggestions as always): 
>
>- Buy a gauge and adjust it myself until I'm satisfied or I give up 
>and advance to next option
>- Take it to a shop
>   - Go-to shop seems afraid to break my hanger, I don't think that's 
>   going to happen but they are audibly and visibly weary. 
>   - Other shop in town I avoid at all costs and don't want to take my 
>   bikes to them
>- Get a new dropout welded onto the bike
>   - I wouldn't mind doing this but I can't find a builder in my area
>   - Contacted three people. One retired, the other two haven't 
>   responded. 
>- Send it to Rivendell
>   - Grant thinks Mark or Antonio can fix the hanger. Cool!
>   - Grant said to send the bike stripped down, no fork. How are they 
>   going to align and test it to see if the chain jumps? 
>   - I don't relly want to freight the bike coast-to-coast twice. 
>   Not a dealbreaker, tho. 
>   - Grant said if Mark or Antonio can't get it he knows a builder who 
>   can do the repair but it could be three months before I get the bike 
> back.
>   - This leads me back to...
>- Buy a gauge and adjust it myself 
>
> If you've made it this far, wow, you are invested in this repair! Thanks 
> for checking in. I'll post more updates as they develop. 
>
> On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 11:03:10 PM UTC-4 Eric Marth wrote:
>
>> Thanks, 

[RBW] Re: Stolen custom 1995 Rivendell Road Standard (San Francisco)

[Bill Schairer]

I recovered a stolen bike (well the frame at least) by listing it on 
bikeindex.org.  Did you record your serial number? It didn't come back for 
over a year but...

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 11:03:19 PM UTC-7 Adrianna T wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> With a sad face I’m writing to say all the bikes in my building got stolen 
> today, including my beloved Riv. 
>
> Some of you helped me plan and figure out how to build it up some time 
> ago. 
>
> This is what it ended up looking like: 
>
> If you come across any of it (including just the frame) I’d be very glad 
> to hear from you. 
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Getting in over my head

[Bill Schairer]

In addition to all that has been said, I find gearing can make a huge 
difference.  I've geared each of my bikes for a different style of riding.  
My Atlantis is geared for loaded touring and currently has 50mm tires for 
off pavement capability.  It has lower gears and bigger steps between gears 
than the bike I prefer for an unloaded ride on pavement.  I think I am 
slower on the Atlantis because I have more trouble hitting the perfect 
cadence/effort for the particular conditions.  I also feel it is easier to 
pace with others with tighter gearing steps.  Having another rear wheel 
with a different cassette, your "club ride" wheel, might extend the 
capabilities of your Platy?

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, May 17, 2023 at 5:14:16 AM UTC-7 ascpgh wrote:

> Leah's true sufferfest may have been reduced tolerance to the over 
> necessity of all the "go-fast" gear, the seeming standard issue of the 
> average bicyclist, while under the duress of her 10/10ths performance. The 
> interesting part is that she did more on that ride than the rest. All their 
> stiffer, lighter and aero stuff just being cheat codes for the work at 
> hand. If part of her bicycling has to do with exercise and enjoying the 
> ride, Leah got more than them.
>
> We all find our sweet spot in bicycling, what we like, what rewards us, 
> what becomes our focus. On that path we evolve towards perfecting that and 
> it's jarring when contrast is implied (or obtusely verbalized). It is very 
> much a tangent to enjoy the process, its duration and the surroundings.
>
> Most advances have been shortcuts for reducing work or doing it in less 
> time so we could get back to the cave to paint another bison or the couch 
> for TV.  What cyclists do with the saved time and reduced effort is 
> interesting, if they are even aware of accruing it.  
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 4:31:20 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> I would also like to see a video of my suffering. And handlebar streamers 
>> and white basket will be forthcoming. 
>>
>> I wondered why I wasn’t faster in the downhill, too. I’m thinking it’s 
>> because though my bike is heavier, my bodyweight is less than theirs. I’m 
>> hard for the women to keep up with on the downhills…
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On May 16, 2023, at 11:43 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> I'd love to see a video of Leah suffering on the Platypus with handlbar 
>> streamers and white straw basket to keep up with the fast boys on carbon 
>> fiber. But good job, says someone whose fast days are long gone. 
>>
>> But Leah ought to be winner on the downhills. Long ago, as a spritely 
>> early 50-something, I rode with Gary "It was a bad year; only 9,000 miles" 
>> Blakely up the long Tramway climb. Downhill I continually pulled ahead 
>> because at 170 I weighed about 35 lb more than he. Bikes about the same (me 
>> #1 Riv custom, he refurbished -- by Mark Bulgier, IIRC -- Trek)
>>
>> 4 years ago I did  several rides with a group of engineers from Sandia 
>> labs, thanks to a friend who was then working there (he retired a couple of 
>> years ago). The others were all younger than I -- I would guess most in 
>> 3-0s and 40s with leader in early-mid 50s; I 64, friend 60 or 61 -- and 
>> rode derailleur bikes, mostly cf; I was on my '99 fixie gofast with 76" 
>> gear. 20, 30, and ??37? -- I bailed; see below -- rides. I bailed on the 
>> last one after facing a ~5 mile gradual uphill into Bernalillo with a 
>> headwind and gradually falling behind the group, tho' another rider very 
>> kindly shepherded me to the Bernalillo rest stop.
>>
>> But man, with the open road, tail wind, and downhill I was spinning out 
>> the 76" gear much of the way home.
>>
>> On Tue, May 16, 2023 at 9:18 AM Brian Forsee  wrote:
>>
>>> Sounds like you crushed it Leah! Way to get out of your comfort zone.
>>>
>>> Brian
>>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Son Hub advice

[Bill Schairer]

Personally, I would just get what you really want without thought of 
"future proof."

Bill S 
San Diego

On Saturday, April 15, 2023 at 5:42:53 AM UTC-7 peter...@gmail.com wrote:

> Disc hubs typically don't have the flange spacing as wide as a non-disc 
> hub. On a disc wheel, having the rim flexing from side to side isn't a 
> problem. But with rim brakes if the rim is flexing side to side it will be 
> rubbing on the brake pads, especially if you run your pads close to the 
> rim, as I do. So yes, you can certainly use a disc hub with rim brakes, but 
> it isn't ideal, unless you're a very light rider. For example, Linda and I 
> both have SON Deluxe hubs on our road bikes. I weigh about 40lbs more than 
> Linda. I use the Wide Body version and she uses the standard SON Deluxe. 
> Neither of us need to charge any electronics while we ride, so we don't use 
> the slightly heavier SON 28 hubs.
>
> On Sat, Apr 15, 2023 at 7:47 AM Peter Fray  wrote:
>
>> Hi, 
>>
>> I'm looking to get the Son dynamo hub. Considering it's price I'd rather 
>> make an informed (still quite impulsive) decision..hah!
>>
>> I have a bike with both rim and disc brake mounts (with QR) so I usually 
>> buy disc hubs, to future proof the hub purchase, but continue to run 
>> v-brakes (for now). Is this a sound approach to continue with this buy i.e. 
>> disc hubs with v-brake rims?
>>
>> Based on SON's website, I think Son28 would be appropriate considering 
>> it's better to charge devices at low speeds. So, in this case I would take 
>> the "SON 28 Hub Dynamo - 6-Bolt - QR".
>>
>> Thank you for your insight!
>> Peter
>>
>> -- 
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Peter White
>

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[RBW] Re: Front Derailleur Suggestions

[Bill Schairer]

I agree with Garth and Andy.  I've got an old Campy shifting a 50/45/26, a 
Suntour AR or Vx (I can't remember which) shifting 42/34/19 on my Atlantis, 
and whichever isn't on the Atlantis is on my Trek shifting 45/42/24.  I've 
also used Cyclones.  It often takes a bunch of fiddling and trial and error 
- I've had derailleurs work well on one bike but not another so, as Garth 
said, having a choice of several on hand and doing one's own work is the 
best way to go.  The old derailleurs are elegant, light, plentiful, cheap, 
and they just work.  I picked one of the Suntours up for free from a bike 
shop parts bin, all it needed was a cable clamping screw.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, February 25, 2023 at 2:47:13 AM UTC-8 ascpgh wrote:

> Shaped inner plates hate wide chainring choices, they're made for 
> corporate combinations to assure legal counsel of perfect shifting with 
> their derailleurs, shifters cassette combos and other spec. What I found 
> when building up my wide double (46/30) rando with RH cranks was that with 
> all the new FDs to try, my mechanic found the SunTour Superbe from my bag 
> of nearly NOS FD options fit and worked the best. Plus it doesn't try to 
> hide that it is made of metal, it is bright silver.
>
> A couple shots in album form:
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/eSqnCSt3WxrtfmkCA
>
> Tail of the cage not hitting the right chain stay, limiting how close to 
> the 46t ring it could be, chain line when on on the 30t not below the 
> intended interface of an origami inner plate sculpted for a very narrow 
> range of OEM chainring size combinations and a width of parallel cage 
> plates that permits operation across several cogs before trimming is 
> necessary. I'm quite happy with it.
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
>
> On Thursday, February 23, 2023 at 12:45:08 PM UTC-5 mmille...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I've been having a heckuva time getting my front derailleur to go from 
>> little to big without hopping over. Eventually, if I talked sweetly to it 
>> and said Hail Mary three times, it would usually settle. Even took it to an 
>> experience mechanic. He also lowered it, then slowly kept raising it up, 
>> and also kept working the limit screw. A fraction of a turn was difference 
>> between not reaching the big ring, or going over!
>>
>> It's a White Industries VBC with 46-28. FD is IRD compact triple Aplina. 
>> Friction Microshift thumbie. I think it's bottom pull. 
>>
>> [image: IMG_2391 Medium.jpeg]
>>
>> Any suggestions for different FD? May need different chain rings because 
>> of that big jump, but if I do that, I may be best off buying something else 
>> and selling these.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Matt
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Red Toyo Atlantis?

[Bill Schairer]

I'm guessing saddle height is measured from center of BB to top of seat in 
that chart?  If that is the case, my bike, as pictured, is right at the 
upper limit per the sizing chart.  I measure from the pedal spindle since 
not all my bikes have the same length cranks.   I was initially a little 
concerned about it being too small but, as I've used it for some off 
pavement touring, figure the extra bit of standover isn't a bad thing at 
all.  Maybe I've just gotten used to the visual of it but it doesn't look 
too weird to me and I've had no trouble getting all the touch points where 
I want them.

A big consideration for me was the likelihood of finding a larger frame 
somewhat local in how much time. I decided the likelihood wasn't good.  No 
regrets.

Bill
San Diego

On Tuesday, January 31, 2023 at 4:10:41 PM UTC-8 J J wrote:

> This thread has been so interesting. That red Atlantis is gorgeous. If 
> only it were the right size for me…
>
> Check out the photos of various configurations and setups in this very early 
> Atlantis brochure 
> ,
>  
> which is all about Toyo production. There are pointy lugs and non-pointy 
> lugs on the head tubes!
>
> Joe, I would always bet on your Riv knowledge and memory, :) but based on 
> this brochure it appears that the pointiness or roundedness of the lugs do 
> not in themselves indicate a move to Waterford production. 
>
> Very early Atlantis frames *lacked* braze-ons on the fork for racks, 
> which Grant extolled as a virtue (see below). How times have changed! I’ve 
> seen plenty of Atlantises with fork braze-ons, but I’m not sure when Grant 
> changed his mind about it. 
>
> “The racks cost about $120 each, but you can spend half that and still get 
> a decent rack. *Notice the front rack clamps on. Why no braze-on? Because 
> different front racks have different braze-on locations, and we didn't want 
> to rule out any front rack. The clamps work fine, and are compatible with 
> any rack.* Approximate price as shown, racks and all, about $2,600.”
>
> The brochure has a cool photo of Tetsuya lshigaki in the act of brazing. 
> Here’s a quote about Toyo:
>
> “We don't cut corners with the Atlantis. The frame has not changed 
> fundamentally since the first one in 2000. It was then and is still made in 
> a six-person custom frame shop, called Toyo, in Osaka, Japan. Toyo has been 
> hand-crafting superb, traditional bicycle frames for 30 years. It costs a 
> lot to make anything in Japan these days—particularly when it involves 
> human labor. But the quality of the Atlantis frame is superb, and the 
> price—about $1,300–is way less than you'd expect to pay for a frame this 
> good. The quality is what you'd expect out of Japan, and your Atlantis will 
> likely last the rest of your life.”
>
> Jim
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 31, 2023 at 4:29:49 PM UTC-5 homer...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Wow, you guys really are the source for all things Rivendell!!… I mean 
>> seriously, tracking down the original owner?… Smart!
>> Thanks to your assistance, I’ve decided to pass on this opportunity for 
>> the moment…
>>
>>  I think I’m going to wait for a 60cm and honestly I need to sell or 
>> trade my Jones LBW first, not only for the Atlantis money, but more 
>> importantly just to keep my wife happy
>> Again, Thank You So Much!
>>
>>
>> “Maranatha”!
>>
>>
>> On Jan 31, 2023, at 12:42 PM, Jeremy Till  wrote:
>>
>> I *think* this bike was formerly owned by (former list member?) Gino 
>> Zahnd, as evidenced by this photo from 2013, which I faved at the time: 
>>
>>
>> https://flic.kr/p/f8fyGT
>>
>> Gino does reference selling it in the comments on the photo.  
>>
>> -Jeremy Till
>> Sacramento, CA
>>
>> On Monday, January 30, 2023 at 9:27:02 AM UTC-8 homer...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I very curious about this bike. Honestly, I’ve just never seen a red 
>>> Atlantis?
>>> Does Anyone know what year this bike was made?
>>>
>>> Thanx folks 
>>>
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/vallejo-rivendell-atlantis-58/7578102714.html
>>>
>> -- 
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Are Paul brakes worth the money?

[Bill Schairer]

I have a set of cantilevers and a set of center pulls, both purchased used 
off this list, I think.  What I really like about both sets is how easy it 
is to disconnect and re-connect the straddle cables making wheel removal 
and installation so much easier.  Even though I didn't pay full retail they 
were still quite pricey compared to what I had.  I don't regret my 
purchases at all.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, January 9, 2023 at 9:29:03 AM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Paul brakes are worth it. 
>
> If you buy, try and decide you don't like them you can sell them for close 
> to what you paid!
>
> On Monday, January 9, 2023 at 12:22:34 PM UTC-5 Jay Riley wrote:
>
>> PS: I'll always keep hydro brakes on the dual-suspension mtn bike.  
>> They're cool!  The braking assignment is short, severe braking loads, as 
>> opposed to braking loads on a road or touring bike.
>>
>>
>> Jay
>>
>> Jay Riley, mobile 603-498-5199 <(603)%20498-5199>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2023 at 8:44 PM Jay Riley  wrote:
>>
>>> "the extra complication (bleeding) over the cable Pauls" has sent me 
>>> back to cables and calipers on 2 of my bikes.  Especially if I'm in hilly 
>>> and mountainous terrain, especially especially when touring with moderate 
>>> loads (35lbs) in that terrain, disc-brake pads wear out way faster than ol' 
>>> fashioned brake pads.  Hydraulic discs are super easy to squeeze and 
>>> modulate, and although my thumbs are already arthritic I can still stop 
>>> just fine w'cable brakes.  
>>>
>>> Jay
>>>
>>> Jay Riley, mobile 603-498-5199 <(603)%20498-5199>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2023 at 8:24 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>>
 Thanks, good to know.

 On Thu, Jan 5, 2023 at 6:06 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Klampers are great, the couple hydraulic systems I've tried (stock on 
> new bikes, I don't remember the brands) were marginally greater on the 
> road 
> but not worth the extra complication (bleeding) over the cable Pauls. 
> Your 
> results may vary on steep, rocky descents I don't ride. 
>
> Joe Bernard 
>
> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 4:46:22 PM UTC-8 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Philip: Can you (or can anyone else for that matter) say how the 
>> Klampers perform compared to TRP Hy Rds or to full hydraulics? I was 
>> just 
>> talking to my brother about the Hy Rds and wondering if the Kampers 
>> would 
>> be as powerful and modulate as well without the hydraulic complication.
>>
>> The Klampers have single-side pad actuation, right?
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2023 at 3:36 PM Philip Williamson <
>> philip.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> ... I do have a set of NIB Klampers I considered building a bike 
>>> around, but went with yet another canti-post bike (a Bruce Gordon, 
>>> woot!). 
>>>
>>
>>> Philip 
>>> Sonoma County, Calif (did it really just stop raining?) 
>>>
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>  
> 
> .
>


 -- 

 ---
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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 .

>>>

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[RBW] Re: Getting my groove back on with the Platypus - dealing with near misses

[Bill Schairer]

I keep at it.  As I learn the traffic patterns on my route it becomes 
easier to navigate safely.  I actually feel this when driving, walking or 
biking.  I don't know the NJ traffic laws but in CA, if I'm approaching an 
intersection (or even a parking lot) where I know lots of people turn 
right, I'll take the lane.  Otherwise, if someone passes me and puts on 
their right blinker, I pull out behind them in order to pass them on their 
left rather than chance that they are going to wait for me to pass them on 
their right before completing their turn.  But, when I take a lane it is at 
full gas and I yield the lane, demonstrably, as soon as safe to do so. I 
consider myself an actor - I want the drivers to be able to read my 
actions.  I want them to know I know they are there, that I might be in 
their way but that I am as going as hard as I can and will get out of their 
way as quickly as I can.  Yeah, some get pissed, some try to intimidate, 
some try to scare but I think it very, very rare (next to never) that 
anyone intends to do me harm.  Honestly, I experience all that when I'm in 
my car or on foot as well.  For some people, you will always be in their 
way no matter what so I try (too often unsuccessfully) not to take it 
personally as a cyclist when someone does something that I don't like.  
Lots of times, someone just makes a mistake.  I know I make them.  

Then, at night, I'll sometimes wobble my front wheel hoping the moving 
headlight will be more noticeable.  I have no idea if that is effective or 
not.

I don't use a mirror but have recently used a Garmin radar detector 
sometimes.  It can be useful but I don't find it essential and try never to 
rely on it.  I'm a huge believer in head checks (part of the "acting" 
business) - it is my blinker.  In traffic, I'll generally use three head 
checks, when I can, before I move.  The first very quick check gets my left 
ear out of the wind and alerts traffic I'm contemplating something; sounds 
clear - the second gives me quick shallow look; look and ears tell me 
following traffic knows I'm up to something and usually slows so now I take 
a third, deeper check to make sure I can move - arm signal and then an 
appreciative wave in thanks if someone slowed for me. For me, nothing comes 
anywhere close to a head check in getting motorists attention and 
response.  Maybe it is the clear indication to motorists that I am IN 
traffic, I am NOT some debris in the gutter?

The other thing I do is try to pick my times.  Sometimes as little as 10 or 
15 minutes can make a big difference in volume and patterns.

Of course, there are times when nothing seems to work but getting out of 
bed in the morning is risky yet I do it everyday.  Cycling gives me so much 
satisfaction that I deem it worth the risk.

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, December 28, 2022 at 9:20:54 PM UTC-8 Jason Fuller wrote:

> Sorry to hear that Jay.  I've been finding that drivers are getting worse 
> and worse every year - less patient, more distracted, more aggressive. 
> Plus, cars keep getting bigger and bigger as is safety of people outside 
> the vehicle isn't even a consideration (what the heck, FMVSS??).  I have 
> slid further and further into the belief that massive change to how North 
> Americans get around daily needs to happen, but I am not optimistic it'll 
> happen. It shouldn't be an extreme point of view to want a comprehensive 
> network of non-motorized pathways in every community. 
>
> Anyway, the way I've been dealing with this is: 
> - Avoid streets that are busy or that I've had bad experiences with, even 
> if it means a longer route
> - Take the sidewalk (and be slow and courteous around pedestrians) if I 
> need to, to feel safe
> - If on the street, I make sure to ride 3-4 feet from the curb so that I 
> am more visible and cars are less able to "squeeze" past me .. this one is 
> a challenge as I am a conflict avoider, but it is safer to be annoying to a 
> driver than to be unnoticed 
> - Use a mirror to be able to see cars behind me, and be always on alert 
> and like you say, never assuming a driver sees me unless I make eye contact 
> and they give me a cue 
>
> It's tragic that we have to accept these risks to get around by bicycle, 
> considering in doing so we're protecting those around us by not driving. 
> Not to mention children and all those who can't drive for one reason or 
> another. 
>
> On Wednesday, 28 December 2022 at 11:58:14 UTC-8 Jay LePree wrote:
>
>> Hi all:
>> I live in car-centric, crowded, northeastern NJ.  I joined a gym two 
>> towns over and ride my bike to the gym, about 3.5 miles each way.  I take 
>> the least busiest streets possible, but unfortunately, I need to ride 
>> through a semi-busy, though traffic-lit intersection.
>>
>> In my last 12 trips to the gym, I have had two near misses which could 
>> have been hits if I did not ride like Kent Peterson had described.  "Treat 
>> cars like big animals with poor 

[RBW] Re: Nivex on a Rivendell?

[Bill Schairer]

I'm intrigued but consider all the bits needed to make it happen and one is 
probably looking at more like $1,500 and, besides that, most of those added 
bits aren't available!?  I'm still intrigued, though.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, December 12, 2022 at 3:56:18 PM UTC-8 Garth wrote:

> I'm all peanut gallery on this one. I'm reminded of a Canadian rock band I 
> listened to as a teen named Max Webster. They had an album called "High 
> Class in Borrowed Shoes". I never really related much to that title until 
> right now.. and how underneath the inflated image of "high class" 
> resides the person, place or thing as it truly is. In this case, it's 
> "just" a derailleur regardless of the sales pitch and inflated sense of 
> worthiness. Not to diminish the "just", I mean that as the authenticity of 
> Existence. A derailleur is a marvelous and ingenious thing and no amount of 
> over or under inflating can change that. 
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Book recommendations for learning how to build up a bike

[Bill Schairer]

Thanks for this, I just ordered a copy on abebooks for less than $5, 
including shipping!  How can I lose?  Looked like there were plenty of 
copies available.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, November 28, 2022 at 1:22:33 PM UTC-8 ericf3 wrote:

> Found it. Hey' it's over 10 years old!
>
> It's All About the Bike
> the Pursuit of Happiness on Two Wheels
> Penn, Rob 
> 
>
> The bicycle is one of mankind's greatest inventions - the most efficient 
> self-powered means of transportation ever invented. Robert Penn has ridden 
> one most days of his adult life. In his late-20s, he pedalled 40,000kms 
> around the world. He's in the middle of a long love affair with the 
> bicycle. Yet, like cyclists everywhere, the utilitarian bike he currently 
> owns doesn't even hint at this devotion. Penn needs a new bike, a bike that 
> reflects how he feels when he's riding it - like an ordinary man touching 
> the gods.
>
> So Penn has designed and built his dream bike. He's got an artisan in 
> Stoke to hand-build a bespoke frame; he's travelled to San Francisco for 
> the perfect wheel, from Padua to Provence to find the perfect components - 
> parts that set the standard in reliability, craftsmanship and beauty. En 
> route, he tells the stories of the science, history and culture of 
> bicycles, extracting pertinent and quirky stories - the role of the bicycle 
> in women's liberation, the marvel of the tangent-spoked wheel, the 
> quasi-religious admiration for Fausto Coppi in Italy - that explain why we 
> ride, and why this simple machine remains central to humanity in the 21st 
> century.
> [image: image.png]
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: front deraileur dilemma

[Bill Schairer]

Steven,

I am using a Silver crank in conjunction with a Mountain Tamer 
(https://abundantadventures.com/mt_triple.html), which can be used with any 
crank without modification with a 74bcd that requires chainring spacers.  I 
have used this set-up on two different tours (about 400 miles on GDMBR, 
2800 miles riding to Alaska) without any issues at all, which I mention as 
evidence of real world practicality/reliability.  I don't know, 
availability may be an issue?

For kicks, I did experiment briefly with the Mountain Tamer in quad mode.  
It did work but I abandoned that set-up as too fiddly (as I recall, I had 
to modify a Silver bar-end shifter and the cage of a Suntour Cyclone 
derailleur to just barely be able to shift all 4 rings) and it was 
confusing. Now, as I write this, having a 26t between the 34 and 19 on the 
last tour almost makes me think the quad might have been worth it?  The 
34/19 shift always worked both ways but I didn't really like the jump. Then 
again, I really did need that 19/36 combo, not just once or twice.  Around 
town, as a quad it was total overkill.

I'm one who loves playing with my gearing and hates experimenting with 
handlebars.

Bill S 
San Diego

On Monday, November 28, 2022 at 8:18:23 AM UTC-8 Steven Sweedler wrote:

> Bill what crank are you using that allows a 19 T and who makes the 19 T.  
> Thanks, Steve 
>
> On Mon, Nov 28, 2022 at 9:58 AM Bill Schairer  wrote:
>
>> I'm not sure I understand the "so any older derailers won't work" 
>> comment.  My 2014 Atlantis with a Suntour Vx (from the 70's?) front 
>> derailleur shifts a 42/34/19 flawlessly.  I do use a chain catcher to 
>> prevent dropping the chain going to the 19.
>>
>> Bill S
>> San Diego
>>
>> On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 3:01:43 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Two teeth smaller shouldn't require a repositioning of the mech you were 
>>> using. Did you have a problem with it? 
>>>
>>> On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 2:50:52 PM UTC-8 chrisd wrote:
>>>
>>>> Decided to switch to a 42 big ring from a 44 on a Ritchey Logic triple 
>>>> CS (44/34/26) on my Rambouillet and tried a Skeleton Key FD but can't 
>>>> shift 
>>>> to the granny. My old shimano FD tail barely cleared the chainstay with 
>>>> the 
>>>> 44 so any older derailers won't work. Riv says the Skeleton works on 
>>>> triples but it's probably something to do with geo on the current 
>>>> models.Need a short cage FD. Thought of a mountain FD.  My brifters are 
>>>> old 
>>>> Campy so don't have to worry about indexing. Any suggestions?
>>>
>>>
>>>> -- 
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>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/58d8a5ab-49ed-4168-9eec-1df3541f925fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
> -- 
> Steven Sweedler
> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>

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[RBW] Re: front deraileur dilemma

[Bill Schairer]

I'm not sure I understand the "so any older derailers won't work" comment.  
My 2014 Atlantis with a Suntour Vx (from the 70's?) front derailleur shifts 
a 42/34/19 flawlessly.  I do use a chain catcher to prevent dropping the 
chain going to the 19.

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 3:01:43 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Two teeth smaller shouldn't require a repositioning of the mech you were 
> using. Did you have a problem with it? 
>
> On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 2:50:52 PM UTC-8 chrisd wrote:
>
>> Decided to switch to a 42 big ring from a 44 on a Ritchey Logic triple CS 
>> (44/34/26) on my Rambouillet and tried a Skeleton Key FD but can't shift to 
>> the granny. My old shimano FD tail barely cleared the chainstay with the 44 
>> so any older derailers won't work. Riv says the Skeleton works on triples 
>> but it's probably something to do with geo on the current models.Need a 
>> short cage FD. Thought of a mountain FD.  My brifters are old Campy so 
>> don't have to worry about indexing. Any suggestions?
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] SunTour Rachet Bar Ends shifting a Modern RD - Need to Trim??

[Bill Schairer]

John,
Suntour ratchet shifters will pull enough for your seven speed cassette.  I 
have used them up to 10 speed.

My take on trimming is that the modern chains and cassettes are the main 
factor in nearly eliminating the need to trim.  Muscle memory will take 
care of most of the rest.  I rotate regularly between 4 different bikes 
(two Suntour ratchet bar-ends and two downtube) all in friction mode so my 
muscle memory gets kinda messed up moving from one bike to another but it 
usually does not take long for me to get in sync. If stick with one for a 
while, trimming is generally not an issue.  I rode my Atlantis this past 
summer on a two month tour shifting a 9 speed 12-36 cassette with a Suntour 
ratchet bar end-shifter and honestly don't remember trimming but I'm sure I 
did from time to time.  I have also heard plenty of indexed systems that 
sure could've used some trimming.  I've also found that shifting up the 
cassette can be smoother if I make the shift under more power than in the 
old days. Sometimes I think that if Shimano had done the chain and cog 
engineering first, there might have been little need to do the shifter 
engineering for indexing. 

For whatever it is worth, I shift a LOT, I think more than most that I've 
ridden with who use indexed.

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 8:23:52 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Scott has covered this completely so I'll just add this from my experience 
> with various ratcheting style shifters: I've never noticed the specific 
> number of clicks per cog, what I *have *noticed is the ratchet feature 
> makes the "I have to move the lever this much to get a clean shift" action 
> easier to nail. I can't explain why it helps me, but I always had better 
> luck with them than pure friction levers. 
>
>
> On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 6:43:17 PM UTC-8 Scott wrote:
>
>> John:
>>
>> I'll attempt to add to the valuable information Dave and Nick have 
>> shared...
>>
>> When thinking about compatibility with shifters, RDs, and cassettes; keep 
>> in mind the RD does whatever the shifter (index, ratchet, or friction) 
>> tells it to do, hence the "dummy" comment. So you can for the most part 
>> eliminate the RD from your compatibility question.
>>
>> Your Shimano 8 speed shifter works with your Shimano 7 speed cassette 
>> because the "indexing" in the shifter is matched with the spacing between 
>> the cassette cogs; hence one click, one shift. So when you click a shift 
>> the shifter pulls the cable an amount that causes the RD to move (inboard 
>> or outboard) an amount equivalent to the distance between the cogs of the 
>> cassette. On a Shimano 8 speed cassette the distance between cogs is 4.8 
>> mm, so each time you shift with a Shimano 8 speed indexed shifter the RD is 
>> going to move 4.8 mm inboard or outboard. Shimano 9 speed cassettes have 
>> the cogs spaced 4.34 mm apart. You can see the problem if you were to use, 
>> for example, a Shimano 9 speed indexed shifter with an 8 speed cassette 
>> (one shift would move RD 4.34 mm, not the needed 4.8 mm between 8 speed 
>> cassette cogs) Your 8 speed shifter works on the 7 speed cassette because a 
>> limit screw on the RD doesn't allow it to move the full distance into the 
>> 8th position and the distance between cogs on a 7 speed cassette are the 
>> same as 8 speed: 4.8 mm. Indexing (space between cogs) is the same between 
>> Shimano 7 and 8 speed, so they play well together. If you were to use a 
>> cassette from a different manufacturer in which the distance between cogs 
>> was different from that of a Shimano cassette, then you'd likely run into a 
>> compatibility issue with your 8 speed shifter/non-Shimano cassette 
>> (assuming cog spacing was different from an 8 speed Shimano cassette).
>>
>> One can almost look at a friction shifter as allowing infinite 
>> adjustment. Riders that are good with them almost develop an indexing in 
>> their head/hand feel then fine tune after a shift. No indexing to a 
>> friction shifter so you can run a friction shifter with any make/speed 
>> cassette. Just have to find the sweet spot yourself.
>>
>> The ratchets move the shift cable in little bits (and the RD in little 
>> bits) I believe (I've never ran them. Someone, please, correct me if I'm 
>> wrong). So each click moves the shift cable a certain amount that in turn 
>> moves the RD a certain amount. You'd have to do some research to find out 
>> how much the RD moves with each click of your 1975s and then do some math. 
>> You know, at least with your Shimano 7 speed cassette, the cogs are spaced 
>> 4.8 mm apart. How much does the 1975 shifter move the RD each click? For 
>> perfect shifting on the 7 speed (or 8) cassette, the clicks (one, two, or 
>> three)/RD movement would have to add up to intervals of 4.8 mm. I doubt 
>> that's going to be the case, but fortunately there's a little wiggle room 
>> short of perfect that will obtain satisfactory shifting. At least 

Re: [RBW] saddle angle and lower back pain

[Bill Schairer]

I always thought I tilted my Brooks saddles up just a bit.  They look 
tilted.  But then I put a level on them out of curiosity and they were all 
actually level.  Point being, maybe all those saddles that appear to be 
tilted up in the pictures aren't actually?  Maybe that banana sway creates 
a bit of an optical illusion?

Bill S
San Diego

On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 5:49:16 PM UTC-8 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> I was a big doubter of Brooks saddles in general & the nose up thing in 
> particular. But, after fitting a B17 I quite liked it. Except I kept 
> sliding forward - and onto the narrow, uncomfortable part of the saddle. So 
> I started adjusting it nose up in very small increments. I think I have it 
> at just the right amount of tilt as I stay planted on the widest part of 
> the saddle. I now do not slide forward or backward & have zero pressure. Of 
> possible note I am very upright with the Bosco grips 2”-3” above the 
> saddle. The whole thing goes against everything my 50 years of cycling 
> taught me. Also, I had lower back surgery (microdiskectomy) three years ago 
> and my back always improves with a bike ride.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Nov 15, 2022, at 6:05 PM, Brian Turner  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I wanted to post a bit about an experience I've had lately to see if 
> anyone else here can relate, or provide some insights into: to preface, I'm 
> a relatively new Riv owner, a longtime cyclist in his late 40's with no 
> previous history of back pain (knock on wood), and someone who has always 
> ridden saddles at a level angle, at or slightly above bar height.
>
> As most of us on here do, I enjoy looking at photos of different setups 
> for all the many different Riv bikes produced over the years. One thing 
> I've noticed about a lot of folks' setup - especially the ones that are 
> more upright, and especially the newer models that are stretched out and 
> upright (Clem, Platy, Gus/Susie, Joe, etc.) - is that many riders tend to 
> tilt their saddles nose-up slightly, and some at rather pronounced angles. 
> I recall reading some posts recently published by Rivendell that 
> essentially recommend positioning the saddle this way on these types of 
> bikes.
>
> So, after getting my Gus built up back in the beginning of October, I took 
> the recommendation to heart, bolstered in part by all the evidence of many, 
> many photos showing owners enjoying their saddles set up this way. I tilted 
> the nose up at an angle that seemed appropriate, set my saddle height, and 
> off I went. It felt ok, but I always felt like I was sliding down the 
> backside of the saddle, and my body did feel like it was trying to get used 
> to the upright position of the bike. Since then, I've been riding my Gus a 
> lot. Many different types of terrain and varying distances. It's a joy to 
> ride of course, and has been extremely comfortable otherwise from the 
> get-go. i love it.
>
> However, something else started coinciding with my time on Gus; a nagging 
> lower back ache that seemed to be at its worse following a ride, and 
> continuing for a day or two afterwards. I recently took 5 days off the bike 
> and experienced no back pain during that time. It was then that I started 
> to wonder if it was all related to the saddle angle. This past week, I 
> started experimenting with setting my saddle up the same way it is on all 
> my other bikes. The only difference with this bike is that the bars are 
> much higher in relation to the saddle on my other bikes. After a couple of 
> days riding with the newly level saddle (including a 30 mi ride yesterday), 
> I'm experiencing no back pain like I was before. Maybe it's too early to 
> count out coincidence, but something tells me it's not.
>
> So this leads me to question the whole upwards tilt thing as it relates to 
> these types of Riv models and how folks ride them. I know everyone is 
> different, and there's always going to be those who prefer upward tilts, 
> downward tilts, extreme fore / aft, etc. but what exactly is it, 
> physiologically speaking, that skews towards the preference for the upward 
> saddle tilt for an upright riding position? I'm certainly no expert on bike 
> fit, but is there a logical justification for it, other than just personal 
> preference? Has anyone else here had a similar experience? I'm going to 
> keep it this way for a while to see if my hunch continues to bear fruit - 
> fingers crossed.
>
> -- 
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>  
> 

Re: [RBW] Re: What epoch of Rivster are you?

[Bill Schairer]

Thanks, Ryan and JJ.  Ian, I'm guessing they wanted to keep those lugs off 
that newish bridge surface.  The rest of the road was pretty much gravel, 
though I guess lugged wheels could make a mess of that as well.  I am sure 
they didn't have my bike in mind but, loving lugged frames, I thought it 
would be fun to get the pic and was looking for an opportunity to slip it 
in somewhere.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 10:06:11 AM UTC-8 Ian A wrote:

> Lugs in this instance normally relate to metal tracks or wheels on 
> agricultural or construction equipment. They tear up the asphalt.
>
> IanA
>
> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 4:16:35 AM UTC-7 Ryan wrote:
>
>> Ha ha ...missed the signwhat does that even mean, I wonder. Oh...lugs 
>> on tires ...got it.
>>
>> Great shot, Bill
>>
>> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 8:49:03 PM UTC-6 J J wrote:
>>
>>> That’s a perfect pic, Bill. Love it!
>>>
>>> On Nov 13, 2022, at 9:19 PM, Bill Schairer  wrote:
>>>
>>> I am firmly attached to lugs as well.
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> I snuck through without incident on my one and only Riv, 2013 Atlantis 
>>> on tour this past summer.
>>>
>>> Bill S
>>> San Diego
>>>
>>> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 9:34:49 AM UTC-8 Ryan wrote:
>>>
>>>>  ...but my heart is firmly attached to lugs, although...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
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>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/272607af-6792-4235-bf55-493e373e027fn%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/272607af-6792-4235-bf55-493e373e027fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>> 
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Video: Vintage lugged steel mixte restoration

[Bill Schairer]

I love all the mix and match you do to get EXACTLY the function you want.  
One's ability to do that is one of the things that make bicycles such 
wonderful, versatile tools/toys.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 3:57:29 PM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thanks so much, Elizabeth and Mike! I really appreciate it. If only I 
> could find a few nice, flat sheets of 3/4 plywood... for free!
>
> On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 3:24:23 PM UTC-5 michaels...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Great vid Eric! The field recordings are always a really nice touch. I 
>> agree with Paul definitely jealous of your workshop space and how organized 
>> it looks. If you do decide to expand your workshop, the process would make 
>> another great video!
>>
>> -Mike, SF
>> On Tuesday, November 1, 2022 at 8:11:13 AM UTC-7 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> That's a nice mixte, Paul, thanks for sharing. 
>>>
>>> Is that a Suntour Compe-V high normal front derailer? I *love* the cage 
>>> on those but don't think I'd be down for the high normal arrangement. 
>>>
>>> That's something that hasn't come up in all our discussions of rapid 
>>> rise, the few high-normal front mechs out there! 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, November 1, 2022 at 10:58:41 AM UTC-4 JohnS wrote:
>>>
 Nice looking mixte Paul. I see you have an Uno seat post as well. As I 
 recall the Shogun had an odd size, not too many options to chose from.

 JohnS

 On Monday, October 31, 2022 at 7:46:16 PM UTC-4 Paul in Dallas wrote:

>
>
>
>
> I've got the 1973 Nishiki low step 22" frame going and it's a nice 
> riding bike.
>
> I have a tan saddle on the way and a few other changes planned.
>
> Remarkable to think it will be 50 years old next year and going strong.
>
> When I get too decrepit to straddle a diamond frame perhaps I can 
> straddle this. 
> Ha! 
> Or acquire a low step Riv.
>
> Paul in Dallas.
> .
>


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Re: [RBW] Who is getting a Platypus?

[Bill Schairer]

Garth,
Thanks for posting that on the wolftooth pack hanger.  I didn't know about 
those.  I already have the Park tool but may get the wolftooth tool anyway 
- looks light, compact,  relatively easy to use, and reasonably priced.  
Also, I just like tools.  Possibly something to even take on tour.

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, November 4, 2022 at 1:03:49 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

> For RD hanger alignment, I looked at all that was available for high to 
> low. I grew up using the Campy beam style one so I was used to that method 
> using the rear rim to measure off of, and that's the most common. Still, 
> they're rather large and they rely on not only your rear wheel being true, 
> but the all the tolerances of the tool being tight, without play. I bought 
> the Wolf Tooth Pack Hanger Alignment tool instead as it uses the rear axle 
> as the reference point rather than the rim, so it's very compact and even 
> portable for those with bikes with aluminum hangers that go out of 
> alignment easily. Only the quick release kit is needed for bikes like ours. 
> It's very compact and easy to use. Here's a video with JIm Langley on how 
> to use it.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmLuO56e4Y=1
>
>
> https://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/products/pack-hanger-alignment-tool?variant=14719026790435
>
>
> https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0230/9291/products/WT_Hanger_Alignment_Tool_QR_Kit_02_800x.jpg
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] How to bond plastic knob to metal screw?

[Bill Schairer]

Oops, clean and lubricate the shaft AND all the other joints that are 
supposed to move when you turn the shaft.  Just do everything.

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:53:05 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

> I forget to add what Laing already mentioned, I figured the knob was 
> loosening because the shaft wasn't moving freely enough. Hence, people 
> overtighten the knob and break it in trying to compensate for the 
> resistance in the main shaft.  If lube isn't enough, a new main shaft kit 
> would apply.
>
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:47:10 AM UTC-4 cycli...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Epoxy
>>
>>
>> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:41:41 AM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I spoke too soon. Overnight, the loctite cured and now I can turn it 
>>> (with a ton of effort, but it works!). Now I can build up my wheel.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 6:46 AM lconley  wrote:
>>>
 Have you lubricated the other items along the threaded rod to reduce 
 the amount of torque required to rotated the rod? Boeshield would be good 
 for that. Lubricate the shaft (except for the knob/locknut) and the 
 tighten 
 the locknut real good against the knob. If that doesn't work, the just 
 keep 
 a wrench handy to turn the locknut against the knob when wanting to rotate 
 the shaft the opposite way from the knob.

 Laing

 On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:54:59 AM UTC-4 pi...@gmail.com wrote:

> Already tried red loctite. Doesn't work.
>
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 5:34 AM Eric Marth  wrote:
>
>> I'd try something like red Loctite first. Easy to find, easy to 
>> apply. 
>>
>> If that doesn't work you might try looking for a more robust 
>> replacement thread-on knob that has a set screw built in. Find our the 
>> pitch of your metal thread and check out McMaster-Carr for "threaded 
>> hole 
>> knobs." 
>>
>> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:24:49 AM UTC-4 pi...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I do have the locknut, but it doesn't help. It keeps the knob from 
>>> turning clockwise once it's snug against it, but counter-clockwise (the 
>>> unscrewing action) doesn't work.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 1:31 AM Garth  wrote:
>>>
 My first question then is "how was the knob attached to begin with 
 from the factory ?" 
 According to the photos, that style of knob was used on the TS-2, 
 this is yours yes ? (Sorry I don't know your name as it was not 
 included)

 So, ever inquisitive, whenever it comes to parts, I always refer to 
 original parts documents. According the stock photos and parts pdf, 
 *there 
 should have been a locknut for the knob to begin with*.  
 https://www.parktool.com/assets/doc/product/TS-2_instructions.pdf

 You may have a suitable nut on hand as Park likely uses common SAE 
 threading. If not you could contact Park and maybe they'll send you 
 one or 
 just go to the local hardware store. 

>>>








 On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:02:48 PM UTC-4 Josiah Anderson 
 wrote:

> Oh, rereading I see now that you're actually trying to get the new 
> knob to stay put. What if you used that same locknut idea, just with 
> one 
> nut pushing against the back of the knob? That would probably hold it 
> on 
> quite securely.
>
> Le jeu. 13 oct. 2022 à 21:00, Josiah Anderson <
> anderso...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>
>> The goal is to remove that threaded rod, right? I would try to 
>> find two nuts that fit on there and lock them together, like you 
>> would on a 
>> hub axle, and just use those to turn it. Alternatively you could 
>> wrap it in 
>> something soft (bar tape?) and turn it with vise grips or something. 
>> I 
>> don't think the broken plastic knob necessarily has to be involved 
>> in this 
>> process, unless I'm missing something, which is very possible.
>>
>> Josiah
>> Missoula, MT 
>>
>> Le jeu. 13 oct. 2022 à 20:53, Piaw Na  a écrit :
>>
>>> I broke the plastic knob on my truing stand (see attached 
>>> photo). I have a replacement knob from Park, but am discovering 
>>> that just 
>>> threading it on doesn't work --- when I need to turn the shaft 
>>> counter-clockwise it comes off the shaft instead of turning it. 
>>> I've 
>>> already tried red and blue loctite and those don't work on 
>>> metal/plastic 
>>> interfaces. Should I try epoxy next?
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the 

Re: [RBW] How to bond plastic knob to metal screw?

[Bill Schairer]

Sounds like you need to lubricate that shaft.  It shouldn't take a ton of 
effort to adjust.  I have one of those.

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:47:10 AM UTC-7 cycli...@gmail.com wrote:

> Epoxy
>
>
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:41:41 AM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I spoke too soon. Overnight, the loctite cured and now I can turn it 
>> (with a ton of effort, but it works!). Now I can build up my wheel.
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 6:46 AM lconley  wrote:
>>
>>> Have you lubricated the other items along the threaded rod to reduce the 
>>> amount of torque required to rotated the rod? Boeshield would be good for 
>>> that. Lubricate the shaft (except for the knob/locknut) and the tighten the 
>>> locknut real good against the knob. If that doesn't work, the just keep a 
>>> wrench handy to turn the locknut against the knob when wanting to rotate 
>>> the shaft the opposite way from the knob.
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:54:59 AM UTC-4 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 Already tried red loctite. Doesn't work.

 On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 5:34 AM Eric Marth  wrote:

> I'd try something like red Loctite first. Easy to find, easy to apply. 
>
> If that doesn't work you might try looking for a more robust 
> replacement thread-on knob that has a set screw built in. Find our the 
> pitch of your metal thread and check out McMaster-Carr for "threaded hole 
> knobs." 
>
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:24:49 AM UTC-4 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I do have the locknut, but it doesn't help. It keeps the knob from 
>> turning clockwise once it's snug against it, but counter-clockwise (the 
>> unscrewing action) doesn't work.
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 1:31 AM Garth  wrote:
>>
>>> My first question then is "how was the knob attached to begin with 
>>> from the factory ?" 
>>> According to the photos, that style of knob was used on the TS-2, 
>>> this is yours yes ? (Sorry I don't know your name as it was not 
>>> included)
>>>
>>> So, ever inquisitive, whenever it comes to parts, I always refer to 
>>> original parts documents. According the stock photos and parts pdf, 
>>> *there 
>>> should have been a locknut for the knob to begin with*.  
>>> https://www.parktool.com/assets/doc/product/TS-2_instructions.pdf
>>>
>>> You may have a suitable nut on hand as Park likely uses common SAE 
>>> threading. If not you could contact Park and maybe they'll send you one 
>>> or 
>>> just go to the local hardware store. 
>>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:02:48 PM UTC-4 Josiah Anderson 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Oh, rereading I see now that you're actually trying to get the new 
 knob to stay put. What if you used that same locknut idea, just with 
 one 
 nut pushing against the back of the knob? That would probably hold it 
 on 
 quite securely.

 Le jeu. 13 oct. 2022 à 21:00, Josiah Anderson  
 a écrit :

> The goal is to remove that threaded rod, right? I would try to 
> find two nuts that fit on there and lock them together, like you 
> would on a 
> hub axle, and just use those to turn it. Alternatively you could wrap 
> it in 
> something soft (bar tape?) and turn it with vise grips or something. 
> I 
> don't think the broken plastic knob necessarily has to be involved in 
> this 
> process, unless I'm missing something, which is very possible.
>
> Josiah
> Missoula, MT 
>
> Le jeu. 13 oct. 2022 à 20:53, Piaw Na  a écrit :
>
>> I broke the plastic knob on my truing stand (see attached photo). 
>> I have a replacement knob from Park, but am discovering that just 
>> threading 
>> it on doesn't work --- when I need to turn the shaft 
>> counter-clockwise it 
>> comes off the shaft instead of turning it. I've already tried red 
>> and blue 
>> loctite and those don't work on metal/plastic interfaces. Should I 
>> try 
>> epoxy next?
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the 
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 
>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/3a406f58-259b-4f22-a31b-8b3f01b724b5n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .

[RBW] Re: Bicycle Bus for Children

[Bill Schairer]

Great story!

Thanks,
Bill S 
San Diego

On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 1:50:04 AM UTC-7 ascpgh wrote:

> Very heartwarming to see so many embrace the activity. Sad that your stint 
> was marred by parent problems in continued participation and equipment 
> readiness. Not caring is a position kids learn because most things can be 
> presented to them in a manner that does elicit their care. 
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh 
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>> I came across this feel-good story about an Oregon school implementing a 
>> bicycle bus. The PE teacher leads it and he has 170 kids riding to school 
>> with him! I’ve pasted the link below, and if you are interested, you can 
>> Google Alameda bike bus and lots of stories surface. 
>>
>> I had a short stint leading a bicycle bus in Las Vegas several years ago. 
>> I ran into constant problems with it. I was the only parent, and there 
>> would always be a mechanical of one sort or another along the way. What to 
>> do? Stay with that child and make all the rest tardy? Leave that child and 
>> take the rest? Neither seemed right. The weather and the mile-long ascent 
>> home further complicated matters. The kids just didn’t have bikes that were 
>> up to the challenge and they preferred the ease of being driven. It was 
>> back to me and my kids in just a couple of weeks. I was so delighted to see 
>> that the featured school found a way. And with so many children, wow. What 
>> really tugged at my heartstrings was the quote about how adults have 
>> underestimated how social children are. They love to be outside with their 
>> friends. When I see the joy in the video and then think of the average 
>> child in the minivan in the carpool lane, well, what a bummer.
>>
>> Watch and be cheered!
>> Leah
>>
>>
>> https://twitter.com/nbcnightlynews/status/1580340119927939072?s=12=Sn8mABWroaBCuLzPHJwVSQ
>>
>> And 
>>
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2022/10/11/bike-bus-school-sam-balto/
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Do you Rapid Rise? (Share pics and thoughts)

[Bill Schairer]

My mechanical reasoning challenged mind does not get the apparently self 
evident "mechanically, logically, intuitively, low-normal/RapidRise 
derailers are better…"  If I cared that my shifters both went the same way 
to get to a lower gear I would probably go to a reverse pull front 
derailleur to achieve that.  I agree, I want my low NOW and my experience 
is I get that when I am pulling the derailleur not when the spring is.  To 
me, this is why a reverse pull front derailleur on a tandem is sometimes a 
solution to having trouble shifting to a granny on a tandem - the springs 
just seem to have trouble counteracting any chain tension.  It is easier on 
a single to release all the tension so the spring of normal pull front 
derailleurs usually handle that shift without too much trouble.  I also 
don't buy that low normal didn't take because of racers.  The slant 
parallelogram was a big success for Suntour because they actually were so 
much better even though the pros weren't using Suntour derailleurs.  I 
kinda think that if OM actually was so much better they also would have 
succeeded in the market.  I have nothing against them and think it is great 
that there are choices to meet various needs or desires, I'm just not 
personally moved. 

 I still find the Rene Herse rear derailleur the most intriguing of the 
small shop derailleurs.  If it could handle a cog larger than what FKT 
riders use I might even be tempted to give one a try.  Wait, I thought he 
sold those but I can't find them on their website??

Bill S 
San Diego

On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 10:59:39 AM UTC-7 eric...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Laing, I love the look of those mechs. The Le Tour, the Rally, and the new 
> Record. With the drillium it does seem they're harkening back to the cages 
> of the Shimano Crane. It almost looks like your picture is from their 
> research files! 
>
> Bill, I think you're right, we'd moan if we missed out. I think I'll get 
> one just to have one and to support such an insane project for a company of 
> Riv's size to undertake and, hopefully, see through to the end. 
>
> Were those Paul derailers any good? They look cool but I've never read any 
> accounts of how they worked (or didn't). 
>
> On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 11:40:11 AM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> This demographic is the type that will handwring over the price while the 
>> part is available, and then bellyache when it is not available anymore, 
>> finally bemoaning "if they ever bring it back I would buy two!"  :)
>>
>> It's what some people say about Paul rear derailers.  They were what 
>> $350?  They/we complained that they were expensive, then complained when 
>> they went away, and now you often see comments "I hope Paul reintroduces 
>> their RD!"  
>>
>> Anyway, I'm almost as into Rapid Rise as Grant is, so I bought a bunch of 
>> XT M751 when they were being closed out, so I have a lifetime supply.  That 
>> said, a bike company in 2022 developing their own rear derailer is kind of 
>> an awesome achievement, and I'm proud of Grant and the rest of those who 
>> worked on it.  I'd probably buy one even as an artifact of audacity.  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 8:18:56 AM UTC-7 Jay Lonner wrote:
>>
>>> Probably not, my vintage SunTour stuff is going strong on my existing 
>>> fleet, and future bike purchases will almost certainly have contemporary 
>>> drivetrains.
>>>
>>> Jay Lonner
>>> Bellingham, WA 
>>>
>>> On Sep 24, 2022, at 7:07 AM, lconley  wrote:
>>>
>>> I love the Campagnolo inspired textured surface and the Shimano Crane 
>>> GS (Schwinn Le Tour GT300) inspired drillium pulley cage. I will buy 
>>> one.[image: 
>>> Derailleurs (3)s.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Laing
>>> On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 9:41:55 AM UTC-4 eric...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 In case anyone missed it, Grant posted some updates 
 
  
 on their new derailer.

 Looks like they found another place to have them fabricated (no more 
 $350 samples for them) and that retail cost (for us!) will be $175. That's 
 about $125 more than I've ever paid for a rear derailer. What do you all 
 think? Would you spend the $175 for one of these when you can get a 
 vintage 
 Shimano rapid rise on ebay for way less? 

 Image below is latest design. I think they mentioned on instagram that 
 the red parts will *not* *be red.* Thank goodness. Give me silver with 
 black pulley wheels. If you thought that Shimano 600EX arabesque 
 flourishes 
 were too groovy, well, check out the peace sign detail in that pulley 
 cage. 



 [image: download.png]

 On Monday, August 29, 2022 at 5:34:42 PM UTC-4 cz...@sonic.net wrote:

> Really hard to make ends meet with a 20% markup. With a 10% or 20% 
> markup, you're more 

Re: [RBW] Re: Shipping / packing question

[Bill Schairer]

Best practice would be to remove the rear derailleur.  For future 
reference, I shipped and checked my Atlantis with Gordon racks front and 
rear as well as a Nitto decaleur rack and fenders all intact by using an 
electric bike box, which is larger and much sturdier than the more typical 
bike boxes.  Bike shop did the same shipping it home to me at end of tour.  
Disassembly and packing as well as re-assembly were so much easier.

On Thursday, September 22, 2022 at 9:16:55 PM UTC-7 maxcr wrote:

> Reporting back. 
>
> I managed to pack it, but I had to remove the rack. It was too long for my 
> box with the rack installed (see photo below before removing it). I also 
> had to remove the stem, I think short stems have a hard time getting 
> through the wheel.
>
> Another good tip I got was to use a dummy axle to protect the fork.
>
> Thanks everyone, I hope this works out... I'm planning to check it with 
> the airline (United intl) and it's the first time I'm doing this.
>
> Max
> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 12:00:21 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:
>
>> Thanks Joe, that makes sense!
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 11:35 AM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>
>>> If it fits with the rack on I'd leave it, that structure provides some 
>>> protection for the fork against crush damage. Put some foam or pipe 
>>> insulation on the rails and you're good to go. 
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 8:30:06 AM UTC-7 maxcr wrote:
>>>
 I'm about to pack my Atlantis to ship it home. I'm going to do it 
 myself but I'm wondering if I should remove the front nitto rack or ship 
 it 
 with the rack installed.

 What do you think?

 Max

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>>
>>
>> -- 
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>>
>

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[RBW] FS - wheels/rims

[Bill Schairer]

I have several 700C wheels I would like to move along.  These are available 
because I've converted all my 700C bikes to tubulars not because the wheels 
are old, worn out stuff I'm trying to unload.

First set is a budget build I did for a backup bike using new Shimano Deore 
HB-M510 and FH-M510 hubs laced to new CR18 36h rims using Wheelsmith 2.0 ss 
spokes.  The front wheel probably has about 1,000 miles on it of which 
about 400 were on my fully loaded Atlantis on the GDMR.  The wheel did 
well.  The rear probably has about half the miles but I'm not sure. It was 
not used on GDMBR.  I re-spaced it from 130 OLD to 137.5 as it was a 
placeholder on a tandem for a short while (never ridden that way).  I think 
it has only been ridden as 130 OLD.  I don't know, $30 each?

I also have a completely no-name rear wheel with a sticker on it that says 
for disc brake use only even though the rim has a machined brake surface.  
I purchased this wheel in Jasper and rode it 2200 HEAVILY loaded miles to 
Denali NP on my Atlantis this summer.  It has 36 spokes and a 135 OLD.  Hub 
can accept a disc.  I rode it with rim brakes.  By the time I got home the 
bearings were a bit tight.  I readjusted them and the wheel spins OK.  
Oops, looks like the rim has WIU dx18 sticker on it??  I'm sure it was 
machine built but it did the job and is quite true. Another $30?

Complete oddball is a front tandem wheel with Sansin sealed bearing hub 
laced with 48 spokes to a 27x1.125 Ukai rim.  The bearings are very rough.  
I'm not expecting to find a home for it but who knows.  If someone has a 
use for it as a wheel, just take it off my hands, otherwise, I'll 
disassemble it myself for the spokes.  I also have a matching 48h rim not 
laced to anything.

Rims:

700C 23/17 32h with a Rich Lesnik sticker on it.  Velocity?  It is from the 
front wheel of my Atlantis and replaced with a tubular rim, not because 
there was anything wrong with it.  I don't know how many thousands of miles 
on it but it has life in my opinion.  $25?

700C 20/13 36h Mavic.  Old rim but has some life. $10 or freebie if buying 
something else?

700C 20/15 36h Mavic Elite.  Relatively new, nice rim.  I should think 
under 5,000 miles on it.  Again, retired because of conversion. $40.

700C Velocity Dyad 40h.  Approximately 400 tandem miles.

27" Velocity Twin Hollow (Australia) 32 rim.  I think this was laced to a 
dynamo hub on a CL bike that I bought for the lighting system.  FREE

Mostly I am trying to show my wife I'm trying to de-clutter so talk to me.  
These are too nice to just put in the trash and it seems co-ops only want 
money not bikes or parts??

I'm in San Diego.  I"m not excited about the thought of shipping but...

Bill S 
San Diego


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Re: [RBW] Re: Differences between Sam Hillborne and A Homer Hilsen

[Bill Schairer]

In general, is one not able to tell from the serial number?

Bill S
San Diego

On Thursday, September 1, 2022 at 11:50:12 AM UTC-7 RichS wrote:

> That is a first class detail. Don’t believe it was on my formerly owned 
> 2014 Waterford Atlantis so perhaps the W was featured on certain models? I 
> am fond of concave seat stay caps though. Happy that they’re on my Sam.
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 1:06 PM, J J  wrote:
>
>> Laing, thanks for the interesting bit about Waterford-built frames. This 
>> is the first I hear. I never noticed the W as a deliberate W (as opposed to 
>> being strictly an embellishment) on my Waterford Hunqapillar, so it was 
>> cool to see it for what it is. I had to check the other Rivs in the stable, 
>> all Toyo built, and of course none has the W.
>>
>> Thanks again!
>>
>> [image: Hunq Waterford seat stay end.jpeg]
>> On Thursday, September 1, 2022 at 9:47:06 AM UTC-4 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> Don't Waterford frames have a distinctive seat stay end cap with a 'W" 
>>> in the recess - my Bombadil does. This is a better picture from the 
>>> Waterford site, but the same as my Bombadil:
>>>
>>> [image: 
>>> 6881680380_566caa3985_z-nwiouwjw51r3qwj11ieoc8axc7o69w290ux5x1it4w.jpg]
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, September 1, 2022 at 3:05:54 AM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 THAT'S it. I knew there was a difference between the two but couldn't 
 remember the detail change. But I think yours is backwards, my 
 recollection 
 is Toyo had two sets of bottle bosses and the later Waterford got the 
 third 
 set. 

 On Thursday, September 1, 2022 at 12:01:05 AM UTC-7 Hetchins52 wrote:

> Not sure that it is totally definitive but I expect the Toyo AHH to 
> have three water bottle boss pairs and the Waterford to have two pairs 
> (none under the down tube).
>
> David Lipsky
>
> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 7:11:42 PM UTC-7 James wrote:
>
>> I have an older AHH.  Anyone know how I can tell if it's Toyo or 
>> Waterford made?
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 5:52:35 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:
>>
>>> I had an older MUSA AHH 61 (2006-ish?) and a Taiwan Sam 62 
>>> (2015-ish) with 2TT and for a brief spell I also had a 2TT 58. All of 
>>> them 
>>> were 700C. I should also say that they are all gone at this point, 
>>> nothing 
>>> wrong with them except my own unnecessary searching for the next shiny 
>>> object.
>>>
>>> Both are amazing frames and can be set up very similarly - I think 
>>> your tires, racks and handlebars would probably determine the feel and 
>>> ride 
>>> more than the frame geo, tubing or anything else.
>>>
>>> Some details on the way mine were set up: both had front and rear 
>>> racks, sidepull brakes and short stems:
>>> AHH 700x38 + dropbars
>>> SH 62  700x44 + dropbars
>>> SH 58 700x42 + Albatross
>>>
>>> It has been said that the Sam is burlier or that the tubing on the 
>>> Homer is slightly lighter and the lugs are more elegant. To me, they 
>>> were 
>>> both equally capable, perhaps the 2TT Sam felt a tad stiffer 
>>> particularly 
>>> when loaded, but it certainly didn't feel slower. Also, at no point did 
>>> I 
>>> feel like my AHH couldn't carry as much as the Sam. 
>>>
>>> Are you trying to decide which one you'd buy? If so, I would choose 
>>> based on availability, color, badge, name, which one do you find more 
>>> beautiful? Oh and sizing: which one fits you better? If you can find a 
>>> frame where you fall in the middle of the suggested PBH range for 
>>> either 
>>> the Sam or the AHH I would choose that.
>>>
>>> Not sure if this helps, but I think Grant said it best when he said 
>>> it was hard to tell one from the other when you were riding them.
>>>
>>> Best.
>>> Max
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 4:38:49 PM UTC-4 John Hawrylak 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Dave Grossman

 What made your the Roadini a superior all around bike compared your 
 AHH-MUSA/MUJ  ???   Was the Roadini more lively, handle better, ride 
 better, or something else???   It seems the Roadini is more a pure 
 road 
 bike vs the all around nature of the AHH.Just curious.

 John Hawrylak
 Woodstown  NJ

 On Monday, August 29, 2022 at 10:25:19 PM UTC-4 Dave Grossman wrote:

> I have an older Homer (not sure if it is Waterford or Toyo but I'd 
> like to know actually) and having owned a Roadini I can say I find it 
> a 
> much superior all around bike.  I hadn't considered a Sam since I 
> have a 
> Hunq but I can do light touring and backpacking with my Homer if I 
> desire.  
> I rotate it in my commuter stable with the 

[RBW] Re: Going around in circles with shifters.

[Bill Schairer]

Having ridden for years with a front handlebar bag, I guess I'm just used 
to pushing the cables from the bar end shifters one way or the other to 
mount or unmount the bag.  That said, I now run my Atlantis with a DT front 
shifter and bar end rear shifter for two reasons unrelated to cable/bag 
interference - for some reason, my left hand is less tolerant of the 
shifting motion required for the bar end shifter than my right and, on past 
tours, my front derailleur has at times become balky in dirty conditions 
which I attribute partially to the derailleur spring having trouble 
overcoming the additional friction caused by dirty cable housing.  I find 
the front shift much more reliable and quick with less effort with the DT 
shifter.  On a two month tour just completed, I had zero troubles with 
front shifts despite lots of gravel and rain whereas one week tours on 
gravel of past with bar end required daily lubrication and exercise of the 
front derailleur and still things could get balky.  For whatever it is 
worth, a couple of the guys I toured with used brifters and suffered from 
similar issues.  The downside was the double shift to or from the granny 
was not nearly as smooth as with two bar ends but at least they always did 
happen.  I just don't worry much where I've got to push the cables from the 
bar ends. I have another bike with two bar ends and a bag which works just 
fine for me on day rides.

Bill S 
San Diego

On Thursday, August 25, 2022 at 2:44:26 PM UTC-7 bunny...@gmail.com wrote:

> I love all the replies and knowledge here. It's pretty fun.
>
> I did a little test. I put my RD in the biggest cog. I then shifted all 
> the way down to the smallest cog without pedaling to put slack in the 
> cable. Then I pulled the cable tight at the downtube. Then I shifted back 
> up to the biggest cassette without any derailleur spring tension in the 
> way. It actually felt pretty smooth. I never did this test BEFORE this 
> routing, so I have no control, though.
>
> I will say that just a couple days before I ran new cable that I put a 
> derailleur hangar extender on the rear so I could go up to a 32t rear cog 
> with my Ultegra 6500 derailleur. It works fine, but I wonder if some of the 
> shifting resistance is more about making larger cog jumps and running my 
> derailleur out of spec, and not entirely cable friction. Also, I've been 
> running the bike in indexed mode.
>
> So, step 1 is to go to friction mode and hang out on the smaller side of 
> the cassette; see if it feels any easier. If so I'll have to figure out 
> where to go. If not...
> Step 2, try the long floppy cable thing.
> Step 3. consider Tiagra 4703 and a 4700/5800/6800 long rear derailleur. I 
> have a 2x10 4700 setup on a budget carbon road bike and it was actually 
> pretty good. It looks like they have a 3x10 lever setup. I know that RD can 
> handle a 34, shifts smoothly, and is easy to set-up. Plus a 10s cassette 
> will still fit my older wheels.
>
> Or I just go back to a high end, ratchet, downtube shifter and learn to 
> love it ;) Keep this circle going!
>
> By no means should this kill the conversation, though. Chat away!
>
> Cheers!
> Ben
>
> On Thursday, August 25, 2022 at 12:15:35 PM UTC-7 Jeffrey Arita wrote:
>
>> Ben: I will add my 2 cents: we are big bar-end fans - they are on the 
>> bikes that have drop handlebars.  We only go friction - not indexed, so 
>> YMMV.  We use front racks and Wald baskets, and yes, depending upon your 
>> specific setup, the pair of long "U" cable and cable housing can get in the 
>> way.  Try routing the big U's under the Mark's rack and then zip-tie them 
>> to the rack so they are somewhat stationary.  Finally zip tie both U's 
>> together so they act like a single unit.  Yeah, it looks clunky but it 
>> might help keep those big U's under control.
>>
>> Good luck,
>>
>> Jeff
>> Claremont, CA
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 24, 2022 at 6:48:00 PM UTC-7 bunny...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey all! Just looking for some gear chat.
>>>
>>> I have a Rambouillet with drop bars. I'm finally getting everything 
>>> comfortable, but I've been around the block with my shifters.
>>>
>>> My bike came with 8 speed bar end shifters. However, when I did my first 
>>> configuration I mounted them on the downtube. They worked great. It was 
>>> kind of a bummer to reach down, but I went with it because I loved the 
>>> simplicity and getting the cables off the handlebars. 
>>>
>>> After a while I decided to put them back in the bar ends. I had 
>>> previously used bar ends for a long time, so it felt like home. However, I 
>>> have a front Mark's rack with a basket and the derailleur cables were 
>>> always getting in the way of the front stuff.
>>>
>>> So I just ran the cables fully under the bar tape and that install works 
>>> great to get stuff out of the way, but now my shifting performance is 
>>> pretty bad from the twisty cable runs; much worse than any other 
>>> configurations.
>>>

Re: [RBW] Do you Rapid Rise? (Share pics and thoughts)

[Bill Schairer]

>From time to time I have used reverse pull front derailleurs on a tandem 
because the springs of normal pull front derailleurs were of insufficient 
strength to reliably drop the chain onto the granny, a most undesirable and 
annoying thing.  Based upon that experience, I do not want to rely upon a 
spring to get me to a lower gear.  I've had well worn normal rear 
derailleurs have trouble getting to the smallest cog at times, or be a bit 
slow on the upshift - mildly annoying.  But, when I want a lower gear, I 
want it NOW.  I like my VGT's and Cyclones.  On the other hand, at my age, 
perhaps switching would confuse my brain enough to help ward off dementia.

The new Rene Herse derailleurs don't rely upon a spring either way, do 
they?  But then, they can't be used with cogs with as many teeth as I want.

Bill S
San Diego

On Wednesday, August 24, 2022 at 5:50:12 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> The rear derailleur on my first-gen Sam Hill, Riv's shop-floor model, was 
> equipped with an LX rapid rise rd. I used it for the first few miles with 
> the Silver bes (friction) and found that the action was very light and the 
> shifting very precise; certainly one of the most precise-shifting and easy 
> to shift rds I've used.
>
> But I didn't take to the reverse action and after a short while switched 
> to an equally light and precise shifting but normal direction road rd made 
> or sold by Nashbar; I forget the made-up brand name, but it's cheap and 
> easy to find and comes or came in road and mtb versions. 
>
> The LX worked very well, but I simply found the reverse lever action 
> annoying.
>
> On Mon, Aug 22, 2022 at 1:46 PM Eric Marth  wrote:
>
>> Do you run a Rapid Rise derailer? Do you like it? Have you had one before 
>> and just didn't get it? What's the *deal?*
>>
>> With all the commotion over Rivendell's plan to build their own 
>> production low-normal derailer I figured I'd try one out for myself. The 
>> first one I picked up was an XTR RD-M951 which I suspected had a bent 
>> pulley cage, some of you may remember I posted about this mech a few weeks 
>> ago. 
>>
>> I found this Nexave on eBay for $17 so figured I'd give it a shot. This 
>> model, to my mind, is *the* classic rapid rise derailer. Silver, shiny, 
>> long cage, external guide pulley, pivoting cable guide for a short bit of 
>> housing over the rear dropout. Grant mentioned that this was his favorite 
>> model, cosmetically. I like it, too. 
>>
>> So far I haven't put many miles on it but no complaints. I like getting 
>> into the easier gears with a light touch. I'm running the derailer on my 
>> Appaloosa with a Silver 38/24 crank and a 9-speed 11-36 cassette. It's 
>> wired up to the original Suntour Power Thumb shifters which are mounted in 
>> the reversed, under-hand style also known as the Riv-versed or Rivendell 
>> brifter style. 
>>
>> With the reverse-mounted shifters I did like pushing the lever away from 
>> me to get an easier gear with a high-normal derailer installed. That made 
>> sense. Pulling the lever to me for an easier gear is taking a bit of 
>> getting used to but the action required is so light that it's not a problem 
>> so far. 
>>
>> Unfortunately, I haven't yet been in a situation where I'm climbing and 
>> experience a mis-shift under torque resulting in the derailer bumping me to 
>> an easier gear. I'm looking forward to it, really. 
>>
>> One thing I can't get my head wrapped around is why Grant and Rivendell 
>> want to make this happen and go through so much trouble and expense. It is 
>> quite a complicated undertaking. It seems if you're into low-normal 
>> derailers they're out there if you look hard enough and have some patience. 
>> Perhaps it's just what they do and what they're about. They want something 
>> to exist that has gone out of production, they make it so, and that is the 
>> purest expression of their ethos and what they love about bikes and 
>> components. "Isn't this great? People should be able to find and use 
>> these!" 
>>
>> [image: IMG_1983.JPG]
>>
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Bill Schairer]

Swap a tire from one of the other bikes?

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:28:39 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Update to my advice, I also send my regards! ‍♂️
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:58:38 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
>> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
>> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 
>>> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
>>> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
>>> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
>>> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
>>> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
>>> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
>>> conversation for your consideration.
>>>
>>> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
>>> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
>>> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
>>> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
>>> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
>>> and holey and with very worn tread.
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
>>> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
>>> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
>>> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
>>> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
>>> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
>>> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
>>> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
>>> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>>
>>> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on 
>>> the Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
>>> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>>>
>>> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
>>> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
>>> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
>>> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>>
>>> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but 
>>> the lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. 
>>> That Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much 
>>> does that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
>>> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
>>> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
>>> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
>>> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
>>> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>>>
>>> It’s that basket. 
>>>
>>> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
>>> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
>>> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>>>
>>> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
>>> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
>>> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
>>> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
>>> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
>>> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
>>> got hesitation.
>>>
>>> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
>>> your advice and/or regards.
>>> Leah
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
>>> Michigan, enjoy!
>>> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Kevin,

 Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
 women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
 effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
 happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
 In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 

 As far as fitness, don’t 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Schairer]

It wouldn't hurt to check the alignment of the dropouts and derailleur 
hanger.

Bill S 
San Diego

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:05:45 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

>
> George, Have you ever cleaned/relubed the cassette/freewheel(whichever the 
> DA is) body itself ?  I know you've mentioned the bearings, but not the cog 
> host body. 
>
> I'm with you about the "more gears and wider dropouts" nonsense . I have a 
> good selection of Sachs and Suntour Ultra 6 and 7 speed freewheels of which 
> I'm seriously considering using for my upcoming Franklin custom. I'm really 
> not fond of anything to do with cassettes.The cassette so-called "solution" 
> was but a self-fullfilling sales pitch/excuse for "more more more". Hah 
> hah.  I have 2 sets of Specialized 126mm hubs of which I have converted in 
> the past to 135mm using a solid axle. I could have the frame spec'd to 
> whatever I want though, and buying more vintage NOS hubs of various widths 
> is not a problem. 
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:05:48 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the 
>> chain stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the largest 
>> cog outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis 
>> (Sedisport?) first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in 
>> order to squeeze more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear 
>> dropout spacing.  In my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with 
>> manufacturers trying to outdo one another with wider and wider dropout 
>> spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm 
>> running a 5-speed freewheel on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and 
>> everything works just fine all the time.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the 
>>> chain snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and 
>>> something back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between 
>>> small cog and chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under 
>>> heavy power the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in 
 all likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original 
 with the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another 
 (same manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette 
 had the same problems.


 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is 
> busted and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>
>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain 
>> is 
>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>
>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
>> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
>> with 
>> a Park chain gauge.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>
>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>
>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, 
>> and 
>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never 
>> noticed 
>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>
>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are 
>> in?*
>>
>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
>> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the 
>> same 
>> thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I 
>> ride 
>> in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring 
>> is 
>> only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
>> ridges at the top.
>>
>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>
>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you 

[RBW] Re: FREE - Thule top of car bike rack

[Bill Schairer]

Replied.  If I am slow to respond please needle me here as I am not in the 
habit of checking my gmail account.

On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 4:15:32 PM UTC-7 duh...@gmail.com wrote:

> Email sent!
>
> On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 3:18:39 PM UTC-7 Bill Schairer wrote:
>
>> I have an old Thule bike rack I would like to find a new home for.  It 
>> has old style feet for cars with a rain gutter.  The cross bars are square 
>> tubing.  I have to think different feet could be found for mounting on car 
>> without gutters but I don't know.  It includes a mount for carrying a bike 
>> upside down, a tandem mount (which can also be used for a single), and a 
>> wheel mount.  I am in San Diego and do not want to ship.  If anyone is 
>> seriously interested, I can try to dig up some pictures or drag it out and 
>> take some.
>>
>> Bill S 
>> San Diego
>>
>

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[RBW] FREE - Thule top of car bike rack

[Bill Schairer]

I have an old Thule bike rack I would like to find a new home for.  It has 
old style feet for cars with a rain gutter.  The cross bars are square 
tubing.  I have to think different feet could be found for mounting on car 
without gutters but I don't know.  It includes a mount for carrying a bike 
upside down, a tandem mount (which can also be used for a single), and a 
wheel mount.  I am in San Diego and do not want to ship.  If anyone is 
seriously interested, I can try to dig up some pictures or drag it out and 
take some.

Bill S 
San Diego

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[RBW] Re: A Quiet Ride and Thoughts of Bicycle Commuting

[Bill Schairer]

 

Retired now but bike commuted off and on for years in different cities/jobs 
etc.  It wasn’t until I retired that I learned how to ride recreationally.  
My approach was this:



   1. Figure out what route I would be riding and then ride it a few times 
   on off days and refine if possible/necessary.  Get comfortable with where 
   the bike will be during the day. 
   2. My jobs were generally suit and tie.  I kept as much as possible of 
   my work outfit at work.  If riding say 4 days per week, use day 5 for 
   swapping out supplies as necessary. 
   3. Only one job had a shower.  Others, got there early (also allowed for 
   rare mechanical, flat), cooled down at desk then sponge bathed and changed 
   in bathroom stall. 
   4. My experience was that anything under about 10 miles each way was 
   ideal in that it really didn’t add that much time to my commute and any 
   that it did counted as recreation/exercise so all was good. 
   5. Took me about two weeks to adapt.  First two weeks were a chore 
   adapting to traffic (and it adapting to you), getting my routine down, body 
   adjusting, getting in the mental mode that the bike is how I get to and 
   from work, no choice - within certain parameters,.  After that break in 
   period, the routine was easy and the commute a joy. I started each day as a 
   kid and didn't have to convert to adult mode until I was at work. It gets 
   easier and easier. 
   6. A positive I don’t see mentioned often is how predictable the commute 
   is.  I knew how long it would take me and very little could change that.  
   With a bike it is so much easier to adapt to construction, traffic 
   situations etc. 
   7. The more regular I was on what time I rode and where I rode, the more 
   considerate my fellow commuters were of me.  They were used to seeing me 
   and willing to accomodate me.  They knew I wasn’t a recreational rider 
   getting in their way but just another person getting to work.  Vary my 
   departure time by as little as 5 or 10 minutes and the new set of commuters 
   might be a little less forgiving.  I strongly believe considering myself as 
   any other vehicle and asserting my right to the road as well as obeying all 
   the traffic laws are important in gaining the respect of one’s fellow 
   commuters. 
   8. I suppose it can vary from commute to commute but I sometimes 
   preferred heavier traffic.  Speed differential is smaller, more protection 
   in intersections, and riding by bumper to bumper traffic is always a joy! 
   9. Fellow workers/friends/family may think you are weird but have 
   grudging respect.
   10.  Having a backup bike is nice. 

Bill S
San Diego
(commutes have been in LA, El Cerrito-Oakland, Concord-Walnut Creek, St 
Louis, San Diego)

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 7:09:42 AM UTC-7 Roberta wrote:

> Hi, Doug.
>
> My three month bike commute is two miles each way and it's the best way to 
> start the day and to clear my mind at the end of the day.  I was so 
> frazzled driving on the highway to our former office.
>
> I want my commute to be pleasant no matter the method, so I'm not 100% 
> riding, but it's close.  If it's below 30* or raining, I'll walk or 
> walk/bus. I also watch the weather, so if it's going to rain about the time 
> I leave, I'll leave early or late.  Or, I'll leave my bike at the office 
> and walk/bus home. I'm lucky that I have options.   I'm also lucky that I 
> can bring my bike into my office.  I leave work pants and shoes at the 
> office during the week and change them at work.  Also, although no route is 
> 100% safe for me, I try to ride on roads with bike lanes or on less 
> traveled roads if no bike specific lanes are available.  There are a lot of 
> reflectors and lights on my bike and me (I wear a good reflector vest).  I 
> need to start taking a lock, too, so if I want to stop somewhere on the way 
> home, I can.
>
> I settled on a single pannier.  It's plenty big for everything I carry.  
> Even though it does take up more space, I put my container-ed lunch in an 
> insulated sealable lunch bag, protecting my other items in case of a 
> container leak. 
>
> Now that days are longer and warmer after work, my plan (haven't done it 
> yet) is to ride right to the MUP after work for another 10 miles.  
>
> No matter biking, walking or walking/bus combo, it's all better than 
> driving in traffic.  I also feel better and am sleeping a bit better.
>
> Keep us informed!
>
> Roberta
>
> On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 9:41:39 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> I rode today and noticed the quietness of my Clem. The friction shifting 
>> is almost noiseless and the Silver2 shifter is perfect. The front shifter 
>> is the clickety Sun Race that works just fine but does make noise. After a 
>> somewhat stressful day at work the ride was just what I needed. I have 
>> considered commuting but haven't taken the plunge yet. My commute would be 
>> 50 minutes and about 9 miles each way I 

[RBW] Re: WTB: Riv silver chainring guard?

[Bill Schairer]

I have one that seems to match up well with a 38.  It is too small for a 42.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, April 16, 2022 at 11:40:08 AM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> In reference to Bill's question, you'll want to match guard size pretty 
> close to chainring size unless it's a singlespeed or IGH drivetrain. I 
> discovered the expensive way the Riv guard sits very close to the ring and 
> the chain will rub it in the small/hardest rear cog on a derailer bike if 
> the guard is notably bigger than the chainring..say 42t guard/36t ring. So 
> there's that! 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Saturday, April 16, 2022 at 5:37:22 AM UTC-7 Michael Morrissey wrote:
>
>> Anyone holding one? They've been out of stock for a while.
>>
>> M.
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Velotaxonomy: What are we, anyway?

[Bill Schairer]

Signing up for a charity ride might be a way to meet some like minded 
riders.  Something like an MS150 ride attracts all sorts of riders (or at 
least used to).  Hmmm, maybe not an option in these COVID times, are 
charity rides even going on these days?

Bill S
San Diego

On Tuesday, January 18, 2022 at 5:38:59 AM UTC-8 David Hays wrote:

> Great idea Richard. 
> I imagine if you use Strava you can find people who have ridden the same 
> stretch of trail you’re on. 
>
> On Jan 18, 2022, at 8:33 AM, Richard Rose  wrote:
>
> Leah, your trail system may hold an answer. I rely heavily on Facebook 
> groups for trail conditions & event / ride notifications. I have met many 
> other riders using these groups. Find those groups!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 18, 2022, at 7:39 AM, Leah Peterson  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> You all are funny. And that goes a long way when the topic is rather 
> demoralizing. Our RivSister, Pam Murray, has been a wonderful resource on 
> the subject. She has been a leader in her community because it didn’t offer 
> what she wanted - so she created it. She has a recorded presentation that I 
> will post here if she grants permission.
>
> Yesterday I cleaned and then rewarded myself with a trip to find the local 
> trailheads to the 2 rail trails that are famous here. I found both. They go 
> through wooded areas and fields and over covered bridges and all the way to 
> a historic port city on Lake Michigan. Bikes and horses in 
> spring/summer/fall, and snowmobiles in winter. I’ll have to drive to the 
> trail head, however. The trail is 33.5 miles one way.
>
> If I just cannot find like-minded riders, I suppose I can Lone Wolf it 
> until I get the lay of the land here and then I could organize a ride. I 
> can’t imagine myself in this role, but Pam says it’s possible, so it must 
> be. But I’m still holding out hope there is a group for me somewhere! 
>
> L
>
> On Jan 18, 2022, at 1:23 AM, Ian A  wrote:
>
> RivSisters is a pretty good name for a biker gang.
>
> IanA
>
> On Monday, January 17, 2022 at 10:22:29 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I SO could see Leah becoming the ringleader of her own bike gang. "Follow 
>> her, I'm not sure where she's going but it looks fun!" 拾‍♀️
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, January 17, 2022 at 8:51:39 PM UTC-8 John Rinker wrote:
>>
>>> Well, I do believe that when you find a group with whom (which?) to 
>>> ride, you'll show up on that beautiful Platy and cause quite a stir. At 
>>> which point you'll be able to choose your own direction and ride off with 
>>> any number of riders smitten by raspberry, steel and Ornithorhynchus close 
>>> behind. And, you'll become a group of your own. Have some possible group 
>>> names ready!
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> John 'A lone wolf who enjoys bumping into other lone wolves' Rinker
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 18, 2022 at 11:48:33 AM UTC+9 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>
 Minneapolis, Minnesota, Michigan, they're all the same.

 I'll think about a bobblehat pic. And after I think about it, I'll 
 wince. But the earflaps do work very well.

 On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 7:45 PM Leah Peterson  
 wrote:

> Patrick, who lives in Minneapolis? Not me! (And as the bikiest city in 
> the nation, yes they beat Portland, they certainly DO have such groups. 
> And 
> the most Rivs I have ever seen has been in Minneapolis, I will add.)
>
> Can we see the faux-Peruvian bobble hat in scarlet with fuzzy chin 
> ties?
> Leah
>
> > On Jan 17, 2022, at 9:40 PM, Patrick Moore  
> wrote:
> > 
> > I like to think of myself as a Velominatus, one of the cycling
> > enlightened, earnestly and exactingly preserving the Rules and the
> > Lore while wearing an expression of noble and aloof gravity befitting
> > the dignity of the responsibility, but I expect others just take me
> > for a dork on a bike, especially when I wear my faux-Peruvian bobble
> > hat in scarlet with fuzzy chin ties.
> > 
> > Slightly less in earnest: in ABQ there is the NM Touring Society 
> which
> > hosts daily rides year 'round and has 3 or 4 different ride levels
> > including "slow and friendly and we stop for everyone." I have twice
> > almost signed up only to forebear since they start at 7:30 or 8:30 in
> > the morning and I take pleasure in cycling only after about 10 am. My
> > mornings are in any event too busy, and in any event I prefer to ride
> > mid-day, even in the heat.
> > 
> > Pre-Covid I did several rides with a friend and q group of fellow
> > engineers and managers from Sandia National Labs, and that was fun 
> for
> > the occasional ride even tho' I had to get up at 4 to get ready for
> > and drive to the 6 am start; this was summertime, but 6 am rides are
> > Not My Thing. I do like to ride with said friend, but two is not
> > group.
> > 
> > I can't imagine that in a city like 

Re: [RBW] Re: Anticipating the 13-42 7 speed cassette

[Bill Schairer]

I love my 1x's, mostly with 9 speed cassettes but, I think, one 8 and one 7 
speed freewheel.  My favorite is a 42 up front with a 12-32 or 34 in back.  
I can go almost anywhere but, sometimes, I might feel a little more 
energetic, or have a tail wind and other times I might be feeling less 
energetic or have a headwind or that really steep hill.  No problem, as a 
SRAM marketer once said, I can completely change the character of my bike 
by changing the chainring but instead of having to get out a wrench and 
muck up my hands, I throw a lever one way or the other instantly 
"completely changing the character" of my bike.  No fuss no muss.

I think my favorite setup is 45/42/24 up front and, I think, a 12-32 (maybe 
it is 12-34?)9 speed cassette all in friction.  I get a wide range with 
steps tighter than a corncob with virtually no overlap.  It is a veritable 
CVT.  Finding odd tooth count chainrings in the 40's is the biggest 
problem.  

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 7:51:58 PM UTC-8 Johnny Alien wrote:

> I'm with Joe. The simplicity of a 1x setup just works so well for me. No 
> FD to mess with and less gears to overthink about. I don't see myself going 
> back to a 2x or 3x setup.
>
> On Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 10:09:01 PM UTC-5 kwi...@weimar.edu 
> wrote:
>
>> Best gear combination for me (Sierra mountain region) is a 46x30 on the 
>> front and a 13-34 or 36 7 speed on the back.  I get the 7 speed cassette by 
>> taking apart a 10 speed cassette and putting just 7 cogs on the hub (my 
>> rear hub is 120mm).  It works great with friction, and with the 120mm hub, 
>> I get a very quiet ride and a strong wheel.  My only gripe is that I am 
>> stuck with using the 11 tooth small cog.  
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2022 at 4:16 PM Garth  wrote:
>>
>>> This goes along with what I've always known is that we've long reached 
>>> the point of folly with not only bike parts but pretty much every thing we 
>>> use in our everyday living. I don't want or need a 1x geared bike as I'm 
>>> perfectly happy with "normal" triples and even doubles like a 36/46 and not 
>>> that silly granny/middle ring double and a micro cassette. Regardless of my 
>>> opinion about such setups I surely support anyone that wants to ride them. 
>>> Life thrives on variety, and it's a self-defeating blindness of 
>>> corporations like SRAM/Shimano that try to force people into using their 
>>> products by discontinuing perfectly good working parts. The quest for 
>>> control is death. Corporations are doing it with electric autos now too. 
>>> The time for relying on the big corpses has past. Now is the time for even 
>>> the seemingly smallest of operations to resurrect or continue all these 
>>> perfectly good working parts that aren't subject to the wavering 
>>> instability of change-for-changes-sake.
>>>
>>> I'm glad Riv is offering 7 speed stuff again as it should have never 
>>> been pushed aside in the first place.Not only is there room for everyone's 
>>> setups, it is the only "norm" that exists. 
>>> This distinct individuality is our Unity. It's inherent in/as our Being, 
>>> choiceless , changeless.  We can no more fall from grace that we can return 
>>> to it. We are pure Grace !
>>> On Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 3:39:02 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 I see Grant's point about triples, I just don't agree with it. My 
 custom runs a 36 × 11-51 11-speed and I love not messing with two shifters 
 and the chain-suck/drop issues that come with front derailers. One is 
 enough! (for me) 

 Joe Bernard

 On Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 12:24:26 PM UTC-8 dougP wrote:

> It'll be interesting to see what cog sizes the 13-42 has.  I imagine 
> the 13-34 will be the same as the old Shimano (13-15-17-20-24-28-34, 
> IIRC).  Matched up with a 24-36-48 triple it was an excellent, wide 
> range, 
> easy shifting drive train.  I also enjoyed his discussion of triples in 
> the 
> latest blahg.  It seems the supposed simplicity of eliminating the FD by 
> stacking more & thinner cogs in the back is really self-defeating.  
> Coupling an 11 or 12 cog cassette with a thinner chain a more sensitive 
> RD 
> & shifter doesn't smack of simplicity.  Kudos to Rivendell for also 
> resurrecting cassettes with 14 tooth small cogs.  
>
> dougP
>
>
>
> On Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 10:17:46 AM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> I'm also looking forward to the wide range 7 speed cassettes.  I 
>> really like the idea of a 7 speed rear hub as well as it would lower the 
>> dish of the wheel. I recall the old Phil wood 7 speed freewheel hubs 
>> were 
>> dishless (never could afford one when they were available). Not sure if 
>> that would be possible on a cassette hub. This cassette with a single 
>> ring 
>> up front would be great for around town and a double (or triple) up 
>> 

Re: [RBW] Bar end vs Downtube

[Bill Schairer]

I've been running a dt shifter up front and bar end on the rear on my 
Atlantis for some time now.  I've found I get better shifts up front this 
way for, maybe, two reasons - shorter cable run with less friction from 
housing and accumulated grit and much easier lever actuation.  I find 
pushing down on the shifter with my thumb much, much easier than pulling up 
the bar end.

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 5:55:20 PM UTC-8 Jeffrey Arita wrote:

> This discussion is timely.  We've been using bar ends for so long now that 
> shifting becomes instinctual.  However, I do use pretty decent sized 'U' 
> cable housing so that shifting is smooth.  The housing/cabling can get in 
> the way of handlebar bags, and as some have noted, it doesn't look the best 
> although it is functional.
>
> I just might try Steven's suggestion.  Thanks everyone,
>
> Happy Holidays!
>
> Jeff
> Claremont, CA
>
> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 4:45:22 PM UTC-8 Steven Sweedler wrote:
>
>> After many years of riding nothing but bar end shifters, I have switched 
>> to stem mounted shifters and find them very easy and convenient. They have 
>> a simple cable run, especially if your cables run onnyour downtube. Either 
>> hand can shift either derailleur. Worth considering. Steve
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 24, 2021 at 7:04 PM  wrote:
>>
>>> Years back I bought a used Rambouillet that came to me with down tube 
>>> shifters. I rode it that way for a while just to see what I thought of them 
>>> after at least a decade since the last time I used them.
>>>
>>> I can’t say they were horrible but I much prefer bar mounted shifters 
>>> since they make shifting easier and safer. I do like the look and the ease 
>>> of setup of down tube shifters but the ergonomics are lacking for me. I 
>>> ride a 58-60 cm frame.
>>>
>>> Robert Tilley
>>> San Diego, CA
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Dec 24, 2021, at 11:01 AM, atreya...@gmail.com  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I am debating bar end vs down tube shifters for the upcoming homer 
>>> build. I like the simplicity and aesthetics of down tube but concerned how 
>>> “inconvenient “ they could be given longish geometry of rivs. For non 
>>> racing and just riding for pleasure usecases does it matter .I am also 
>>> considering going downtube for FD and bar end for RD. If over time I find 
>>> downtube comfortable enough switch both to downtube . Would love to hear 
>>> groups thoughts and experience. 
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>> -- 
>> Steven Sweedler
>> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Night riding

[Bill Schairer]

Please don't ride with one of those blinding, pulsing, rear strobe lights.  
On my ride home last night somebody with one of those decided he had to 
pass me and I could barely see anything.  I guess he probably felt safer 
but he was definitely putting me at greater risk.  I also try to remember 
to put my ankle reflector bands on - the argument I read that made sense to 
me being that the motion clearly identifies one as a cyclist.  Cheap and 
easy so why not?

Bill
San Diego
On Monday, November 8, 2021 at 3:57:10 PM UTC-8 Adam wrote:

> I tried to post this yesterday, but it doesn't seem to have popped up.
>
> It's the time of year for riding at night. (??) I'd like to hear other 
> folks' strategies and recommendations for fun rides at night.
>
> My rides at night have mostly been 15-20 mile road rides, fairly fast. The 
> main problem I've had is relaxing, especially at higher speeds with the 
> reduced visibility. I've been curious about trail riding but haven't tried 
> it.
>
> thoughts? I'm not buying dynamos right now, but have adequate lights, 
> backups, vest, etc. I'm mostly looking for ride ideas, things not to do, 
> things that are more fun than they sound, etc.
>
> Thanks
>
> Adam
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa drive train guidance

[Bill Schairer]

I ran my MT as a quad for a very short time just to try it.  I agree with 
Patrick that the shifting was very finicky, I couldn't remember where I 
was, and it was just overkill for my purposes.  It was just a fun 
experiment.  I use MT as my granny for loaded off-road touring and it 
worked very nicely. Personally, I don't think I would use it in a double 
but is great for a triple. I used an Altus rear derailleur because it wraps 
so much chain.  I could (but wouldn't) run the whole cassette on the 19t 
ring.  With respect to other observations, yes, 24x36 is nice and low and 
what I use when back home but apparently  OP wants lower so the MT provides 
that option.  It may or may not be the best option for the OP.  I suppose I 
can walk faster than 19x36 on level ground while not pushing anything but 
in all my years of riding, I have never had someone pushing a bike pass me 
while I was riding and I have never passed someone riding a bike while I 
was pushing mine.  Pushing a loaded bike that wants to roll backwards on a 
steep hill is something that I have never found to be easy or enjoyable.  I 
avoid it when I can.

Bill S
San Diego


On Tuesday, October 12, 2021 at 9:18:12 AM UTC-7 J Schwartz wrote:

> I've never seen that thing before (Moutain Tamer)...Looks useful as long 
> as derailleurs can handle it.
> Would be fun to make a quad , something like 46/34/26/18 with a 12-34 in 
> the rear ...no need for large cassette or roadlink device
>
> On Tuesday, October 12, 2021 at 8:26:34 AM UTC-4 Bill Schairer wrote:
>
>> Check out the Mountain Tamer (
>> http://abundantadventures.com/mt_triple.html).  I use this with a 19t 
>> cog with Silver crankset and a 12-36 9 speed cassette on my Atlantis 
>> without any issues.
>>
>> Bill S
>> San Diego
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, October 11, 2021 at 7:34:55 PM UTC-7 Kushan wrote:
>>
>>> Michael - I already have a 24 tooth front chainring (as part of double) 
>>> so don't think it can go any lower.
>>>
>>> Joe and Nick - Thanks! Based on the clearance, I also suspected that I 
>>> would need an extender for the derailer hanger.
>>>
>>> Looking for others comments on impact of going from 9 to 10 speed. 
>>>
>>> On Monday, October 11, 2021 at 4:05:42 PM UTC-7 Michael Morrissey wrote:
>>>
>>>> What about a smaller chainring? I have a 32 tooth WolfTooth on my 
>>>> Appaloosa. 
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, October 11, 2021 at 6:26:52 PM UTC-4 Nick Payne wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I used a Goatlink (
>>>>> https://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/products/goatlink) when using a 
>>>>> GRX 810 RD (rated for 34t cassette) with an 11-42 cassette and two 
>>>>> chainrings up front. But you need a shadow RD for that to work, which 
>>>>> yours 
>>>>> isn't.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nick
>>>>>
>>>>

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Re: [RBW] Stolen 50cm Betty Foy

[Bill Schairer]

What color?  Picture?  List it on bikeindex.org.  Believe it or not, I did 
recover a frame by doing that.

Bill 
San Diego

On Saturday, October 2, 2021 at 8:17:33 PM UTC-7 Robert Tilley wrote:

> Sorry to hear that! Where did this happen in San Diego? I’ll keep an eye 
> out.
>
> Robert Tilley
> San Diego, CA
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 2, 2021, at 10:10 AM, Amy DeVaudreuil  wrote:
>
> My beautiful Betty Foy bicycle was stolen from my garage last night. I am 
> filing a police report and monitoring local (San Diego) craigslist and 
> Offer Up, but in case anyone sees a 50cm Betty Foy for sale somewhere, 
> please let me know so I can track down if it's my bike.
>
>
> Thank you!
> Amy DeVaudreuil
> amydeva...@gmail.com
>
> -- 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: anyone push their altus (m310) to a 36t rear cog?

[Bill Schairer]

I ran an Altus on my Atlantis with a 12-36 9 speed cassette and a 42/34/19 
triple for a week on the GDMBR and had no troubles other than being laughed 
at by another cyclist for my selection of a rear derailleur.  What can I 
say - it worked.  I decided to switch to the Altus for that ride because I 
had it and it has amazing chain wrap, which I thought would be desirable 
with that 19t granny.  It has been two years now and it is still on the 
bike.

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 8:51:11 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> What Doug said, it should be fine, Shimano rear derailers are usually good 
> for pushing a couple teeth bigger than listed. I believe - this is math 
> stuff I don't fully understand - some of the concern comes from if you're 
> running a wide-range triple crank *and *a big cassette..at some point in 
> there things get screwy. But most of us don't run triples that way and you 
> may not even have a big ring, just guard-middle-small. I say give it a 
> whirl! 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 6:20:31 PM UTC-7 Michael Baquerizo wrote:
>
>> bought a 11-36t cassette for my new appa and already have some altus' 
>> that i'd like to use ( i guess i have back up shimano rear in case they 
>> dont) but i realized it's supposed to be 34t max. anyone get it past that?  
>> tried looking elsewhere to no avail.
>>
>> keep seeing altus' on riv builds and it's growing on me aesthetically, in 
>> a riv sort of way. my back up is an m952 xtr rear. not a huge fan of the 
>> charcoal color so i'm not super excited to use it, but i guess i can get 
>> over that pretty quickly
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: 50.4 crankset opinions: VeloOrange, SUNXCD, Grand Bois

[Bill Schairer]

I've been running 3x9 with a TA crank and a Stronglight for years without 
any issues.  I also ran 3x10 for a while.  Currently have 47/44/26 TA and 
50/45/26 Stronglight (with TA rings) and they both shift quite well with no 
ramps and pins.  What are those for?  I think the Stronglight arms *had * a 
better finish than the TA's but I think they are harder to come by.

One and only one supplier and no odd tooth count rings are my biggest 
issues with Rene Herse.  I could probably get over the single supplier and 
cost if they offered odd tooth count.

Bill S
San Diego

On Friday, June 4, 2021 at 8:43:16 PM UTC-7 divis...@gmail.com wrote:

> Forgot those links:
>
>
> https://specialites-ta.com/pro-5-vis/196-693-pro-5-vis-plateau-specialites-ta-pro-5-vis-exterieur-80mm-8v-specialites-ta-pl50080302.html#/21,denture,40-dts
>
>
> https://specialites-ta.com/pro-5-vis/197-707-pro-5-vis-plateau-specialites-ta-pro-5-vis-interieur-intermediaire-80mm-8v-specialites-ta-pl50080102.html#/9,denture,26-dts
>
> I believe Velo Classique in Virginia is the US distributor for Specialites 
> TA. Obviously, there are also UK/European retailers that ship to the US.
>
> The one key drawback to 5-pin TA chainrings is that the rings aren't 
> ramped/pinned; you're effectively capped at an 8-speed rear. But really, do 
> you need more than 3x8 gears?
>
> Peter Adler
> specializing in beating dead horses in
> Berkeley, CA/USA
>
> On Friday, June 4, 2021 at 8:34:48 PM UTC-7 Peter Adler wrote:
>
>> Large selection of chainring sizes? *C'est très humoristique!*
>>
>> Specialites TA (still in business; still producing 50.4mm cyclotouriste 
>> chainrings in France, now in 7075 aluminum) make outers (attaches to 
>> crankarm) in all even increments from 40-52T, and inners (attaches to 
>> outers) from 26-42T.
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Dim lighting on SON hub/Edelux II headlight

[Bill Schairer]

Along the lines of adjusting beam, i keep tweaking mine until I get what I 
want then, in a dark garage, I walk the bike towards a wall to see where 
the cutoff line is that Peter talks about.  For my conditions, I think I 
like that line to be maybe 3-4 feet up the wall.  But, try that with the 
two bikes and see how they compare that way and adjust accordingly.  That 
may also be a more accurate way of judging light intensity?

 I  don’t have SON or SP hub but a shimano.  I’ve used the same wheel on 
two different bikes and feel there is some difference in the feel of the 
same hub between the two bikes. I am much more likely to feel a bit of 
vibration on the Atlantis at certain speeds than I am with the same wheel 
 on my Trek.  Maybe sound too.  Why?  I don’t know, just saying - different 
fork, stem, bars etc.

As for noise, there is so much wind noise etc in the one video I listened 
to that I couldn’t pick out anything in particular.  That said, I can’t 
remember what kind of fenders you have on the two bikes but I once mounted 
some metal Honjo’s on my Trek and I swear that rear fender was like a 
whisper disk transmitting and seemingly magnifying every sound of the drive 
train to my ears.  I removed those, sold them and installed plastic 
fenders.  Maybe not as pretty but much quieter! Just another thing to maybe 
consider.

At the end of the day, it may just be that everything about the C makes it 
a better in the dark ride than the P?  Sometimes that happens.

Bill S
San Diego

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 11:34:24 PM UTC-7 Ben Miller wrote:

> Leah, that'd be so cool if you could just bike over and we could put it up 
> in the stand for troubleshooting! I'd be all for that!
>
> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 6:02:27 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I'll use right/left, which is actually how I think about it when I'm not 
>> trying to sound like a smart guy who knows bike words. When you push the 
>> front shifter all the way to the hardest gear up front, it's pushing the 
>> derailer to the right as you're looking down at it. In that hard/hard gear 
>> front/back the chain is furthest over to the right, too. I think your front 
>> derailer isn't moving any further right to clear the chain, it's hitting a 
>> limit. That limit can be adjusted out so the derailer moves right a smidge 
>> more. Does that make sense? 
>>
>>
>>
>> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 5:54:45 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> This is exactly what I do. However, I know about trimming derailleurs 
>>> and so even when I nudge the front derailleur I cannot stop the chatter. 
>>> So, what can that mean? But it does go away in other gears. I’m stuck with 
>>> chatter in the HARD-HARD. (Leahspeak for whatever those gears are called. I 
>>> have no idea which one is “high” and which one is “low.” I know hard and 
>>> easy.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> On Apr 24, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>>
>>> I contend that only doing it in the big/small rings means the fd isn't 
>>> traveling far enough to clear the chain on that combo. On a 2-speed setup 
>>> like this it's common for the rider to use the friction shifter like index: 
>>> all the one way for the small ring, all the way the other for big. I think 
>>> she's shifting all the way and the derailer is stopping a smidge short. 
>>> Smartbrain 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 5:11:53 PM UTC-7 Garth wrote:
>>>
 The sound from the video is like a rhythmic ratcheting/creaking sound 
 as Leah pedals, it's not a FD rubbing sound as that has a smooth surface 
 and is higher pitched smooth metallic sound. I'm listening to it loud and 
 with headphones, eyes closed. 

 The obvious question is does the sound remain when not pedaling ? What 
 does what when you do what ? What doesn't ? 

 If I was a mechanic worth a penny I'd either ride with you to hear it, 
 or ride the bike myself, or have you ride around inside the store and run 
 along side. Just dropping it off and expecting them to experience what 
 you're experiencing in real time as you ride is rarely fruitful, as no two 
 people hear the same thing the same way, so it can become sort of a word 
 game of "it sounds like . ". 

 Anyways  "stuff going wrong" is like a cosmic *slight-of-mind*  
 joke we play on ourselves . What for , one may wonder ?
 Because we can. I ask for the sake of the ask, wonder for the sake of 
 the wonder .. it's Life for Life's sake . and there isn't anything 
 else. 

 On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 7:27:48 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Front derailers are the bane of my existence. I love the look of the 
> nice Campagnolo on my custom, but I'm super-OCD-fastidious about chain 
> rub 
> and constantly adjusting the shifter to avoid it. My Susie doesn't HAVE a 
> front derailer, all I have to do is shift the back. No chain 

[RBW] Re: Stolen Purple Rivendell Custom - SF East Bay Area

[Bill Schairer]

I sure hope it works for you.  Good luck!

Bill S 
San Diego

On Tuesday, April 13, 2021 at 8:06:32 PM UTC-7 Corwin wrote:

>
> I put the bike on bikeindex.org.
> On Tuesday, April 13, 2021 at 1:47:00 PM UTC-7 Corwin wrote:
>
>> I got the serial number from Mark. A few pictures attached.
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 13, 2021 at 7:48:03 AM UTC-7 Bill Schairer wrote:
>>
>>> A few years ago I had a Trek 720 stolen.  I posted on bikeforums.net 
>>> and was advised to list my bike on bikeindex.org.  I did so and did 
>>> recover the frame as a result about a year and a half later.  Fortunately, 
>>> I did have the serial number to list.  Without that, I suspect the listing 
>>> would not have been effective.  Now, if I'm looking at a used bike to buy, 
>>> I will search bikeindex to see if it might be listed.
>>>
>>> Bill S
>>> San Diego
>>>
>>> On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 12:44:34 PM UTC-7 dougP wrote:
>>>
>>>> That's a shame.  We should all keep an eye out for this bike.  Bikes 
>>>> stolen in LA often go to the Bay Area, &  vice versa, hoping to evade 
>>>> local 
>>>> eyes.  Probably a similar problem between Portland & Seattle.  
>>>>
>>>> dougP
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 11:32:38 AM UTC-7 Joe M. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So sorry to hear this what a shame. I'm down in Los Angeles but I'll 
>>>>> still keep an eye out for it.
>>>>> On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 11:08:53 AM UTC-7 Corwin wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi -
>>>>>>
>>>>>> While I was out of town, someone entered my garage and made off with 
>>>>>> two bikes. One of them was my purple Rivendell Custom. My understanding 
>>>>>> from my son is that the theft took place late on Thursday, March 31 or 
>>>>>> early on Friday, April 1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't think it's reasonable to expect to recover the bike - but 
>>>>>> just in case anyone sees it - I will post a few photos after this thread 
>>>>>> is 
>>>>>> established.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Corwin
>>>>>>
>>>>>

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[RBW] Re: Stolen Purple Rivendell Custom - SF East Bay Area

[Bill Schairer]

A few years ago I had a Trek 720 stolen.  I posted on bikeforums.net and 
was advised to list my bike on bikeindex.org.  I did so and did recover the 
frame as a result about a year and a half later.  Fortunately, I did have 
the serial number to list.  Without that, I suspect the listing would not 
have been effective.  Now, if I'm looking at a used bike to buy, I will 
search bikeindex to see if it might be listed.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 12:44:34 PM UTC-7 dougP wrote:

> That's a shame.  We should all keep an eye out for this bike.  Bikes 
> stolen in LA often go to the Bay Area, &  vice versa, hoping to evade local 
> eyes.  Probably a similar problem between Portland & Seattle.  
>
> dougP
>
> On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 11:32:38 AM UTC-7 Joe M. wrote:
>
>>
>> So sorry to hear this what a shame. I'm down in Los Angeles but I'll 
>> still keep an eye out for it.
>> On Monday, April 12, 2021 at 11:08:53 AM UTC-7 Corwin wrote:
>>
>>> Hi -
>>>
>>> While I was out of town, someone entered my garage and made off with two 
>>> bikes. One of them was my purple Rivendell Custom. My understanding from my 
>>> son is that the theft took place late on Thursday, March 31 or early on 
>>> Friday, April 1.
>>>
>>> I don't think it's reasonable to expect to recover the bike - but just 
>>> in case anyone sees it - I will post a few photos after this thread is 
>>> established.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>
>>>
>>> Corwin
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: First ride on Bleriot this year

[Bill Schairer]

Pretty bike.

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, March 22, 2021 at 3:01:18 PM UTC-7 Joel S wrote:

> Such a wonderful bike. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let's see your shop and workbench

[Bill Schairer]

Ha, thanks, Eric, but I inherited the color scheme from my wife.  I really 
don’t have an eye for that sort of thing.

Bill S
On Saturday, March 6, 2021 at 12:29:32 PM UTC-8 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Pretty rad, Bill! I like those yellow walls and the white plywood. Not 
> enough paint goes up in most shops. 
>
> On Friday, March 5, 2021 at 12:12:09 PM UTC-5 Bill Schairer wrote:
>
>> My wife's woodshop was in the garage but she moved it to commercial space 
>> so I converted the space to my bike shop.
>>
>> Bill S
>> San Diego
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Bill Schairer]

I would agree with those that have suggested tires and wheels as the most 
significant improvement one can make to improve the ride of a bike and, 
potentially, reduce weight.  I would disagree however with the idea that 
you have already taken that to the max with a quality, clincher, tubeless 
tire setup.  I would suggest seeing if you can find a quality *tubular 
*wheel-set 
that you could borrow(?) to see how you like them.  The wheel itself will 
be lighter.  The tire/tube may or may not be lighter than the equivalent 
sized tubeless tire BUT, my experience has been that a good tubular has 
about the same comfort as a  clincher (which tubeless is) 5 mm or more 
wider, and has superior road feel and handling characteristics.  Since you 
can run a narrower tire for the same comfort, you will probably also shed 
some more weight.  You can get a really dreamy ride on a 30-32mm quality 
tubular.  The only reason to go any wider would be for the float on soft 
stuff or for intense/rough off roading.

Bill S
San Diego

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 6:44:40 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Oh, wouldn’t we, Annie! I’ve only gotten a little ways in, but I had to 
> come back here and tell you thanks for the delight. ♥️
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 5:50 PM, anniebikes  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Leah, have you ever seen the options in Europe for step through bikes? I 
> wish we could have the opportunity to try all of them. Wouldn't we have fun!
>
> https://www.cyclingabout.com/a-complete-list-of-womens-touring-bikes-step-through-mixte/
>  
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 10:50 AM Leah Peterson  wrote:
>
>> 2 Thoughts:
>>
>> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had 
>> no idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>>
>> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte 
>> (mixte sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for 
>> the mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect 
>> combination of their colors.
>>
>> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
>> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
>> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit.  
>> But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
>> personal information!  
>>
>> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I 
>> lift weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me 
>> up in a bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about 
>> the best physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected 
>> the engine.
>>
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. 
>>
>> Those two bikes now have the same accessories (bags, phone mounts, 
>> aluminum Boscos, metal fenders, rear racks, dyno) save one thing - the Clem 
>> has a basket rack with a Wald. And yet, the Clem is just so much heavier. I 
>> know it when I carry either bike over the median that intersects my bike 
>> path. I know it when I pedal up Killer Hill. I know it when I lift the 
>> bikes onto my vehicle bike rack. And every single time I think, “I wonder 
>> what it would be like to have this Clem in a light-weight version.”
>>
>> Leah
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Jan 25, 2021, at 11:40 PM, Philip Williamson  
>> wrote:
>>
>> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
>> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
>> not all frames are mixtes 
>> 
>> .”
>>
>> To my eye, the Clem L design starts out as an “Anglais,” and kicks in a 
>> little “col de cigne” at the seat tube, for style.
>>

Re: [RBW] Selling my Green Sam Hillborne

[Bill Schairer]

Does Craigslist flag listings without any asking price?

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, January 10, 2021 at 4:28:59 PM UTC-8 Brendan Willard in SF wrote:

> BTW, a one have an idea why my Craigslist posting keeps getting flagged? 
> Text is exactly the same as here. 

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Re: [RBW] Ride suggestions for San Diego area

[Bill Schairer]

Sweetwater Summit Park has some trails and a fair amount of the Sweetwater 
River trail (at eastern end) is unpaved.
Most of Proctor Valley Rd is unpaved and connects into Millar Ranch Rd or 
Echo Valley Rd on the SE side of 
 San Miguel Mountain.
Otay Valley Regional Park has a little bit that ties into the Southern end 
of the Bayshore Bikeway which also ties into the western end, paved portion 
of the Sweetwater River bike path.  The Bayshore Bikeway with a ferry ride 
to/from Coronado makes for a nice ride, albeit paved, around the bay.
The afore mentioned military land can be accessed if one obtains a one year 
permit at Miramar Naval Air Station for the Stowe Trail.  It is a nice link 
between Santee  and Scripps Poway Parkway.(Santee Lakes - Sycamore Canyon)

Bill S
San Diego

On Thursday, December 10, 2020 at 5:42:30 PM UTC-8 Curtis wrote:

> Hello Mike,
>
> Welcome to San Diego.  The Laguna Mountains east of us offer some nice 
> dirt roads and trails.  A bit closer is Mission Trails Park which has some 
> roads/trails that might be more geared for mountain bikes. Check out both 
> places online.
>
> Ride well,
>
> Curtis
> El Cajon 
>
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2020, 2:49 PM Michael Williams  
> wrote:
>
>> Hey group.  I recently moved to San Diego and was wondering if any list 
>> members had any suggestions/ recommendations for San Diego County area. 
>> Something within a 30-45 drive from the city.  Looking for fire road/ mixed 
>> terrain/ gravel/ dirt,  anything really that’s gets away from traffic.   I 
>> know there’s probably modern MTB trails that might be too crazy for Rivs.  
>> Thank you!   -Mike
>>
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Stolen: Silver Clem L 59 SS (NYC)

[Bill Schairer]

I recovered a stolen Trek 720 because of a bikeindex.org listing.  It took 
over a year and it was trashed but I got it back.  Good luck.  The silver 
lining of that theft was that it gave me the needed excuse to buy my 
Atlantis.

Bill S
San Diego

On Thursday, December 10, 2020 at 10:24:44 PM UTC-8 janehr...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> It was taken from the stoop. No break-in!
>
> Wasn’t sure where to share this. I have also now posted it here: 
> https://bikeindex.org/bikes/958201. 
>
> Luckily this was my first bike theft in 44 years. Knock on wood. I still 
> have have a Bike-Tech Toyo from a bike shop internship in Germany in 1990. 
>
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 8:55 AM Justin Kennedy (Brooklyn, NY) <
> thesix...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> So sorry to hear this. Was it locked up or did someone break into your 
>> apt? I'll keep an eye out...
>>
>> On Thursday, December 10, 2020 at 2:54:07 AM UTC-5 janehr...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I am gonna start with the good news: Matthew Williams' post on this 
>>> forum about a 59 Clem Smith Jr on Craigslist Indianapolis helped me get a 
>>> replacement bike within a week (green H-frame Clem). Yay! Thank you, 
>>> Matthew and thank you, Josh in IN.
>>>
>>> Sharing the below details in case someone comes across my stolen bike:
>>> L-Style Clem Smith Jr., 59 cm, gray/silver frame (Serial A0A32CG0377) 
>>> with mostly silver polished components: Jones H-Loop bar, Paul Love Letter 
>>> levers, Crust/Nitto stem, White Industries crankset, Chromag Scarab pedals, 
>>> Eno SS Hub, SON dynamo hub, Edelux headlight, Honjo fenders, Rene Herse 
>>> front rack. Black components: Velocity Cliffhanger rims, Panaracer Gravel 
>>> King tires, Yepp rear rack, Brooks B67.
>>> Taken from my home in Brooklyn, NY,  November 18, 2020. 
>>>
>>> Two different Clems but both so fun! 
>>>
>>> -- 
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>> 
>> .
>>
> -- 
>
> Jan Ehrenberg
> c 415-606-5738 <(415)%20606-5738>
>

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[RBW] Re: Just Pics from Your Good Ride Thread

[Bill Schairer]

Otay Valley Regional Park.

Bill S
San Diego
On Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 9:33:25 AM UTC-8 Paul in Dallas wrote:

> Another longhorn pic.
>
>
> Paul in Dallas 
> [image: Image] 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Bombadil on its Archetypal Route (loads of photos)

[Bill Schairer]

Wonderful, Jason!

Thanks,

Bill S
San Diego

On Sunday, November 29, 2020 at 5:17:56 AM UTC-8 David Hays wrote:

> Thank you Jason. Beautiful and inspiring.
> David Hays
> Buffalo, New York  
>
> On Nov 28, 2020, at 11:50 PM, Jason Fuller  wrote:
>
> I had a particular route in mind when I bought this frameset from Joe, and 
> today I rode it (well, one version of it). It's just outside of town here 
> in Vancouver BC, and its quite special. We have an immense wealth of trails 
> on our north shore, though most are technical mountain bike or hiking 
> trails. I love those trails, but this route features the only extended 
> stretch of gravel that is fully closed to motorized traffic as well as the 
> only paved parkway that extends into the wilderness in this region. 
>
> I can ride it from my doorstep; it's about 11km to get to this paved 
> parkway - popular in summer, but pretty quiet nowadays. 
>
> 
>
> This path carves through the rainforest for about 5km, leaving cell 
> service behind, until a pretty hard-to-miss singletrack turnoff takes you 
> down a steep embankment to this grand clearing, known as The Spot among 
> friends here. Despite its established looks, it's both well hidden and hard 
> to access, and therefore goes unknown to many who ride this region. 
>
> 
>
>
> From here, my route follows a steep downhill stretch of singletrack to a 
> marsh, where a gravel access road begins and will take me a further 7km 
> into the valley and away from the city. 
>
> 
>
> This access road, called Spur 4, used to be charming double-track with 
> grass up the middle but it was graded this year with fresh gravel. 
> Unfortunate. Bears and cougars inhabit this area and humans are few and far 
> between - combine this with the lack of cell service and the fact you're 
> now over 10km into the woods, it can be pretty humbling to ride alone. 
>
> 
>
> A connector trail brings you back to the main parkway, where most people 
> are. It was a little wet today, but that's fine by me. I can't imagine life 
> without full-coverage fenders! 
>
> 
>
>
> Above is the view of the lake, which is as far as you can go. It was only 
> about 2:30 but already the sun was falling behind the tall peaks to the 
> west; I'm far enough north that it's getting dark shortly after 4pm now. 
>
>
> 
>
>
> The first leg of the return route is called the Hatchery Trail, and it's 
> the highlight of the whole route for me. It's a non-technical trail that 
> winds through the moss-rich forest, including placards with information on 
> local wildlife. It's beautifully maintained and quite wonderous, 
> considering the nearest vehicle parking is 10km away!   
>
> 
>
> This puts you back on the paved parkway, which I followed for the full 
> 10km back out of the forest. At the parking lot, I followed a steep 
> downhill connector trail to the trail network to the east. 
>
> 
>
> As I dropped in elevation I entered a pre-sunset fog. Combined with the 
> beginnings of a sunset, it really made for a cool effect with the moss and 
> lichen covered trees. 
>
> 
>
>
> The full route from my door falls a bit short of 60km, which is a nice 
> length for me - big enough to be rather epic, but can be done in about 4 
> hours and leaves me with a bit of gas in the tank so I'm not a wreck for 
> the rest of the evening! 
>
> Thanks for following along with my ride report / coming to my TED Talk! 
>
>
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>  
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB 126, 130, 135 good quality rear Freewheel hub.

[Bill Schairer]

Joel,

What did you wind up getting?

Bill S

On Wednesday, November 4, 2020 at 10:18:23 AM UTC-8 Joel S wrote:

>
> FW hub found.  
> On Saturday, October 31, 2020 at 10:30:08 PM UTC-4 Joel S wrote:
>
>>
>> 32 hole
>> On Saturday, October 31, 2020 at 7:11:27 PM UTC-4 Joel S wrote:
>>
>>> Just replied now I know what was in back.  
>>>
>>> On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 7:07 PM Bill Schairer  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Have a campy and a Dura Ace.  Sent pm with photo.
>>>>
>>>> Bill S
>>>>
>>>> On Saturday, October 31, 2020 at 12:25:30 PM UTC-7 Joel S wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Let me know what you have. 
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>> -- 
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>>>> .
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>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/8e88aa9e-00bf-48a5-b6e5-48047c6df02fn%40googlegroups.com
>>>>  
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/8e88aa9e-00bf-48a5-b6e5-48047c6df02fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>> -- 
>>> ~IMPORTANT~ Note to all~~ EMAIL ETIQUETTE
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>>> history, which includes my email address and maybe others. It is a courtesy 
>>> to me and others who may not wish to have their email addresses sent all 
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>>> addresses, prevents viruses from being propagated, and limits the 
>>> proliferation of spam. Also, please use the “BCC” area instead of “TO” and 
>>> “CC” when forwarding to several people at once.
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[RBW] Re: WTB 126, 130, 135 good quality rear Freewheel hub.

[Bill Schairer]

Have a campy and a Dura Ace.  Sent pm with photo.

Bill S

On Saturday, October 31, 2020 at 12:25:30 PM UTC-7 Joel S wrote:

> Let me know what you have. 
>
> Thanks
>

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[RBW] Re: Looking for silver ultegra 9s long cage RD

[Bill Schairer]

I have one (RD-6500).  It isn’t pretty.  The finish is sort of mottled and 
there is some road rash.  I think it is totally functional, I just decided 
to upgrade to VGT’S and Cyclones.

Bill S
On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 11:21:43 AM UTC-7 Sam Perez wrote:

> Any one have silver ultegra 9s long cage RD. Open to equivalent 
> alternatives will pair with DA 9sp down tube shifters.
>
> Thanks 
>

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[RBW] WAY OT - for the film photographers here...

[Bill Schairer]

Apologies if this is too OT but I've noticed a certain number of 
participants are film photographers.  I have an old but working (I think) 
Agnekolor Laminar Flow processor that I would like to dispose of without 
putting it in the landfill.  It is for processing color prints (or B for 
that matter) up to 11x14.  Anybody have an interest or know of a better 
place to find interest?  I actually sold it on Ebay for $1 a couple years 
ago but the buyer never picked it up and shipping to Hawaii from SD didn't 
make sense. Local used camera store had no interest.

I will not be offended if posting is deemed inappropriate and deleted.

Thanks and sorry,

Bill S
San Diego

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini day + request for a good looking crankset recommendation

[Bill Schairer]

Ooooh, but only one?

On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 7:07:54 PM UTC-7 Bill Schairer wrote:

>
> Probably to accommodate growing children as stokers.
>
> Bill S
> On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 1:36:29 PM UTC-7 Ash wrote:
>
>> Abraham, 
>>
>> Thanks for sharing another option!  I'm looking at the picture on their 
>> website: 
>> http://www.davincitandems.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/cranks-b.jpg
>>
>> Can't quite figure out why one of those crank arms as three peddle 
>> holes...
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, 16 September 2020 at 07:21:05 UTC-7 abraham nussbaum wrote:
>>
>>> I run a da Vinci <http://www.davincitandems.com/components/> tandem 
>>> triple crankset as a single speed. It's beautiful and unique. It's also 
>>> flexible, as I have previously ridden it as a double.
>>>
>>> So many great choices these days...
>>>
>>> [image: cranks-b.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 6:46:54 AM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>>>
>>>> Before I put the IRD double on the Roadini, I had a Holdsworth (similar 
>>>> to an IRD single) single 1x10 setup:
>>>>
>>>> [image: IMG_1774s.jpg]
>>>>
>>>> I run an NOS Spidel double crank with a single Sugino 
>>>> drillium chainring (3/32 chain so it can be used on a derailleur bike 
>>>> also) 
>>>> on my Frank Jones, Sr.
>>>>
>>>> [image: IMG_0126.jpg]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, both cranks a basically copies of the Campagnolo Nuovo Record.
>>>>
>>>> I currently am building an NOS Stronglight 93 (similar to the 
>>>> Stronglight 105 below) into a semi compact double:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [image: s-l1600.jpg]
>>>>
>>>> And of course there is always the 42/26 Rene Herse if you want to get 
>>>> really spendy:
>>>>
>>>> [image: IMG_0687 (2).jpg]
>>>>
>>>> Laing
>>>> Delray Beach FL
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 12:14:22 AM UTC-4, Ash wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> All, much appreciate all the recos.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now I know what to hunt for (if I choose to go the classics route on 
>>>>> eBay) or budget for (IRD/VO).  The Silver cranks are superb, but I feel 
>>>>> that it better suites (in terms of aesthetics)  a country bike like Sam 
>>>>> or 
>>>>> Atlantis.  
>>>>>
>>>>> In the past I have seen some bike pictures on this forum that had 
>>>>> really cool looking minimal crank sets that I would have loved to put on 
>>>>> the Roadini.  Wish I had asked the owners for details.  
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd be interested to hear if anybody has experience running 1x with 
>>>>> chainring that's not specifically designed for 1x.  In general I'm a fan 
>>>>> of 
>>>>> 2x setup.  I have Rivendell's Clipper wide low and XT 28/40t cranks.  
>>>>> They 
>>>>> have worked perfectly for me on various Riv-fied hybrids/MTBs, Appaloosa, 
>>>>> Atlantis and Susie.   After riding those bikes this Roadini doesn't even 
>>>>> feel like it needs multiple gears!  For the speeds I ride, there's no 
>>>>> need 
>>>>> for a chainring bigger than 44t ever.  If I compromise the top speed a 
>>>>> little more and go with single 40 or 42t chainring, I can probably manage 
>>>>> most uphill roads around here with 34t cog, provided the setup can be 
>>>>> reliable.
>>>>>
>>>>> Again, thanks for the pointers!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini day + request for a good looking crankset recommendation

[Bill Schairer]

Probably to accommodate growing children as stokers.

Bill S
On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 1:36:29 PM UTC-7 Ash wrote:

> Abraham, 
>
> Thanks for sharing another option!  I'm looking at the picture on their 
> website: 
> http://www.davincitandems.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/cranks-b.jpg
>
> Can't quite figure out why one of those crank arms as three peddle holes...
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, 16 September 2020 at 07:21:05 UTC-7 abraham nussbaum wrote:
>
>> I run a da Vinci  tandem 
>> triple crankset as a single speed. It's beautiful and unique. It's also 
>> flexible, as I have previously ridden it as a double.
>>
>> So many great choices these days...
>>
>> [image: cranks-b.jpg]
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 6:46:54 AM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> Before I put the IRD double on the Roadini, I had a Holdsworth (similar 
>>> to an IRD single) single 1x10 setup:
>>>
>>> [image: IMG_1774s.jpg]
>>>
>>> I run an NOS Spidel double crank with a single Sugino drillium chainring 
>>> (3/32 chain so it can be used on a derailleur bike also) on my Frank Jones, 
>>> Sr.
>>>
>>> [image: IMG_0126.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, both cranks a basically copies of the Campagnolo Nuovo Record.
>>>
>>> I currently am building an NOS Stronglight 93 (similar to the 
>>> Stronglight 105 below) into a semi compact double:
>>>
>>>
>>> [image: s-l1600.jpg]
>>>
>>> And of course there is always the 42/26 Rene Herse if you want to get 
>>> really spendy:
>>>
>>> [image: IMG_0687 (2).jpg]
>>>
>>> Laing
>>> Delray Beach FL
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 12:14:22 AM UTC-4, Ash wrote:
>>>
 All, much appreciate all the recos.

 Now I know what to hunt for (if I choose to go the classics route on 
 eBay) or budget for (IRD/VO).  The Silver cranks are superb, but I feel 
 that it better suites (in terms of aesthetics)  a country bike like Sam or 
 Atlantis.  

 In the past I have seen some bike pictures on this forum that had 
 really cool looking minimal crank sets that I would have loved to put on 
 the Roadini.  Wish I had asked the owners for details.  

 I'd be interested to hear if anybody has experience running 1x with 
 chainring that's not specifically designed for 1x.  In general I'm a fan 
 of 
 2x setup.  I have Rivendell's Clipper wide low and XT 28/40t cranks.  They 
 have worked perfectly for me on various Riv-fied hybrids/MTBs, Appaloosa, 
 Atlantis and Susie.   After riding those bikes this Roadini doesn't even 
 feel like it needs multiple gears!  For the speeds I ride, there's no need 
 for a chainring bigger than 44t ever.  If I compromise the top speed a 
 little more and go with single 40 or 42t chainring, I can probably manage 
 most uphill roads around here with 34t cog, provided the setup can be 
 reliable.

 Again, thanks for the pointers!




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Re: [RBW] Ever get pulled over by police while on your bike?

[Bill Schairer]

I got pulled over with siren and lights in St Louis County while commuting 
to work. I was riding on a frontage road that had a nice downhill ramp onto 
a state highway (not freeway).  The cop had somebody pulled over on the 
shoulder of the ramp and I blew by pretty fast, for a bike, and must have 
surprised him.  Shortly thereafter I heard the siren and pulled over 
expecting him to go by but he was pulling me over!?  He claimed it was 
illegal for me to be on that ramp (I can’t remember, it may have been 
shared with a ramp off the freeway) which was nonsense - I rode it every 
day.  Anyway, he did not cite me.

Bill S

On Saturday, September 12, 2020 at 7:05:44 PM UTC-7 Je Mar wrote:

> I was stopped once for blowing a stop sign in a wealthy “hills“ 
> neighborhood of Alexandria, Virginia. I was pretty peeved even though I was 
> “only” given a warning. 
>
> I stop at stop signs now, at least sufficiently to avoid another situation 
> like that. 
>
> On Saturday, September 12, 2020 at 9:47:09 PM UTC-4 Joel wrote:
>
>> Perfect.  
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Sep 12, 2020 at 8:28 PM Fullylugged  wrote:
>>
>>> Not pulled over, but a deputy pulled along side after I rolled through 
>>> one of those 8 sided signs you see at intersections and said, "You know 
>>> those STOP signs are for you too."  I said, "yes officer thank you for 
>>> reminding me." He waved and sped off.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
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>>>
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>>> .
>>>
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Rear derailleur to shift 10-speed close-ratio cassette with Bar Cons

[Bill Schairer]

Patrick,

I was running a 9sp 12-25 cassette with a Suntour Superbe Pro short cage 
and a 46/38/28 with down tube shifters and the derailleur is well named. 
 To my amazement I could run the entire cassette on each chainring with 
only the slightest sag small/small though in practice I don’t do that. 
 This appears to be way outside spec.

I then swapped wheels and crank and am now running a 14-28 7 sp freewheel 
with a 50/45/26 crank.  It does not like the 26/28 combo and doesn’t wrap 
enough chain in general on the 26t ring but is rideable. I will probably 
swap out the 26 for a 28 or a 30.

I am super pleased with the Superbe.  Though I haven’t ridden it with 10sp 
or barcons I have no reason to believe it wouldn’t be wonderful with both. 
 Since mounting it only recently I read on Disraeli Gears that some 
consider this derailleur to be the best shifting friction derailleur of all 
time.  I don’t have nearly enough experience to make such a claim myself 
but can well imagine it might be true.

Bill S

On Friday, September 11, 2020 at 10:33:40 AM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> More good news, then; thanks.
>
> I'm going to look for a medium cage rd to replace the old Dura Ace, which 
> I chose for "style" -- tho' it used to work well. But I really should have 
> a bit more chain takeup for the 42/28 chainset.
>
> Just talked to LBS who say that they straightened the hangar and the rd 
> still rubs, but it looks as if the rd itself is bent. We'll see.
>
> On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 10:43 AM Ted Durant  wrote:
>
>> On Friday, September 11, 2020 at 11:26:50 AM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>>> This is good to know; thanks. So basically, anything up to 10 speed but 
>>> forget 11 or 12. 
>>>
>>
>> I show 21.5 and 22.7mm of cable travel for Shimano 11-speed road and 
>> mountain, respectively, so it should still work. I don't have a number for 
>> 12-speed. Based on a quick online search, it appears the 12-speed Shimano 
>> is the same total derailleur movement as 11-speed mountain, so that should 
>> work, too. But that's probably going to make full use of the BarCon travel. 
>> In theory. And you know what they say about theory and practice ...
>>
>> Ted Durant
>> Milwaukee, WI USA 
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] WTB: Suntour front derailleur double

[Bill Schairer]

I have a Superbe that looks to be unused, Superbe Pro band clamp that has been 
used (substantially shorter cage and less bulk than the Superbe), Shimano 
fd-1055 that appears unused, and Shimano fd-5000 Sante showing light use.

Bill S

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[RBW] Back to work on the Custom

[Bill Schairer]

Wow!

Bill S

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell has the almost perfect crankset for me

[Bill Schairer]

I might add that the vintage front derailleurs seem to usually be lighter (If 
that matters) and, to my eye, far prettier (definitely matters) than the new 
stuff.  I ditched the stock front derailleur on my Atlantis simply because it 
was just too ugly for words. On top of that, vintage perform just fine and 
probably better than the new stuff if one likes to choose non-standard 
chainring combinations for truly customized gearing. About the only time I’ve 
experienced any advantage to a sculpted cage is shifting a triple on a tandem.

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Path Less Pedaled will review a Riv!

[Bill Schairer]

Lots of ads to endure!

Bill S 

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[RBW] Micro cracks on Velocity Dyad rim

[Bill Schairer]

I might not embark on an epic tour on the wheel but otherwise would not be 
overly alarmed.  I don’t think there will be catastrophic failure but, over 
time, the cracks (not that I see them) may become more pronounced.  Eventually 
you may find the wheel difficult to true.  I would expect many more miles of 
day rides around home.  On the other hand, I enjoy building wheels and might 
take this as an excuse to build a new wheel.

Bill S

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Re: [RBW] Re: 650b new Rivendell models (to me)

[Bill Schairer]

I recently installed Paul touring cantilevers on my Atlantis for no 
particularly good reason other than I wanted to.  I was very pleasantly 
surprised at how easy they were to set up and easy to release and reattach. 
 SO much easier than the stock Shimanos they replaced.  I’m running 50mm 
tires so like to release the brakes when removing and installing a wheel. I 
am getting some shudder up front and bought one of those fork mount cable 
stops but just haven’t been motivated enough to mount it yet to see if it 
addresses my problem as I’ve read it would.

Bill S

On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 2:41:38 PM UTC-7, Joel Stern wrote:
>
> Really nice. I may have to decide if I will use my side pulls (if I can) 
> or go to Cantis. Only used Cantis on my allrounder many years ago and sold 
> a NOS pair of Suntour Expert I think a couple of years back. I want 
> something easy to release and reattach. 
>
> Nice colors too. Beautiful bike
>
> On Sun, Jun 28, 2020 at 2:53 PM Joe Bernard  > wrote:
>
>> Here's a couple more photos. 
>>
>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/3wpygKkdeVfaAzh47
>>
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[RBW] Widest Slick Tires on Atlantis with Fenders

[Bill Schairer]

I think my Atlantis was built in 2014 or so.  I have run it with 50mm Schwalbe 
Mondials, which are hardly slicks, under SKS fenders (53mm outside edge to 
edge).  The Mondials actually measured about 47mm on my rims.  There was not 
enough clearance on the back with a BG rack installed.  I probably could’ve 
changed the mounting of the rack to provide needed clearance had I been so 
motivated.

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Bike Friday questions

[Bill Schairer]

My NWT is a 1x with an internal 3 sp/ 7 sp cassette hub. I think you need to 
run it with a chain guard to keep the chain on. I have from time to time made 
it a 2x but found, I guess with the short drive line, it would change 
chainrings on its own.

Bill S

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Re: [RBW] Dynamo Hub Recommendations

[Bill Schairer]

On the other hand, I try to remember that the Wilcox’s and King’s of the world 
are sometimes/often being paid to make the selections they do.  Kinda like Joe 
Namath using Aqua Velva?

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Re: [RBW] Travel bikes

[Bill Schairer]

Two bikes?  I’m having trouble picturing those tires.  Mine are 32mm and I 
have to let some air out to get them in the suitcase.  I’m wondering if you 
would have to remove the tires to fit the suitcase, or are you not going 
for a suitcase?  Looks like great build(s)!  Those should be able to most 
anything at all.

Bill S

On Tuesday, June 23, 2020 at 11:52:22 AM UTC-7, Jay Lonner wrote:
>
> Well I’ve traded a few emails with a rep from BF and he is in the process 
> of generating a quote. Here’s what I told him:
>
> - Dropouts, brazeons, cable guides etc. for disc brakes, linear pull 
> brakes, derailleurs, and Rohloff rear hubs. Maximum Frankenbike flexibility 
> basically, to allow for experimentation. 
>
> - Cliffhanger rims and the fattest tires that can handle fenders. Big 
> Apples 406x60 would be ideal. SON28 front hubs and LX or XT rear hubs. 36 
> spokes front and rear. 
>
> - 110/74 triple cranks, Sugino or Silver, 170mm. 9 speed cassette. Short 
> cage rear derailleur if possible, for ground clearance. A range of 15-90 
> gear inches. 
>
> - Paul Klamper brakes, Paul levers, Silver2 shifters. Jones loop h-bars. 
> (I’m still torn on the brakes - I’m biased in favor of rim brakes but he’s 
> making a good case for discs, and I guess I am curious to try them out.)
>
> - Chris King headsets, UN72 bottom brackets. 
>
> - Rear racks equipped, front decaleur compatible. 
>
> - Electric assist for my wife. 
>
> So that’s my first stab at a potential build, but I’d welcome feedback 
> from the list. Any glaring problems or missed opportunities that I should 
> be thinking about? I’ve never ordered a custom bike before - it’s kind of 
> fun to consider the possibilities...
>
> Jay Lonner
> Bellingham, WA
>
> Sent from my Atari 400
>
> On Jun 23, 2020, at 5:51 AM, Mark Roland  > wrote:
>
> 
> What is this "Just riding for fun" you refer to? Blasphemy. (Just ride;^)
>
> On Monday, June 22, 2020 at 7:44:38 PM UTC-4, Eric Norris wrote: If I’m 
> doing a very long ride at my destination (like a brevet or PBP), I will 
> bring a full-sized bike and pay the fee. If I’m just riding for fun, I 
> bring the Brompton.
>
>>
>> --Eric Norris
>> campyo...@me.com
>> Insta: @CampyOnlyGuy
>> YouTube: YouTube.com/CampyOnlyGuy  
>>
>> On Jun 22, 2020, at 3:25 PM, eddietheflay  wrote:
>>
>> or Dahon Allegro:
>>
>>
>> https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/dahon-allegro-breakaway-folding-bike-194833770
>>
>> On Thursday, June 18, 2020 at 4:41:28 PM UTC-7, Jay Lonner wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm interested in building up travel bikes for my wife and me. Our 
>>> intended use is credit card touring in continental Europe and the British 
>>> Isles. We also have a developing interest in cruising the Salish Sea, so 
>>> I'd like something small enough to store belowdecks out of the corrosive 
>>> marine environment, and that would be easy to get ashore via dinghy.
>>>
>>> It seems that there are many ways to proceed, ranging from S couplers 
>>> to 20" wheel designs like Bike Friday to rinko. All have their proponents 
>>> and detractors. My priorities are comfort, ease of assembly/disassembly, 
>>> avoidance of proprietary/specialized parts, and the ability to fit racks, 
>>> fenders, and lights. I prefer plodding utilitarian considerations to zippy 
>>> performance. 
>>>
>>> While our daily rides embrace Riv-approved technologies such as rim 
>>> brakes and friction shifting, I am open to other options for these proposed 
>>> travel bikes. When we're away from home I'm really looking for something 
>>> bombproof. Rear derailleurs strike me as a particular vulnerability, 
>>> especially on bikes with 20" wheels. At the moment I'm leaning towards 
>>> designs that utilize a Rohloff hub.
>>>
>>> Anyway, so many choices, so many tradeoffs - I'm stuck! What would you 
>>> do within the design constraints outlined above, if budget weren't really a 
>>> consideration? (That's one of the nice things about bikes - even an 
>>> extravagant build is super affordable compared to boats.)
>>>
>>> Help me RBW collective, you're my only hope!
>>>
>>> Jay Lonner
>>> Bellingham, WA
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>> .
>>
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Re: [RBW] Velocity Dyads and 50mm Tires

[Bill Schairer]

I did a week loaded on the GDMBR last summer with the DT TK540 on the rear and 
50mm Mondials.  I had no issues and wheel didn’t need any truing afterwards.  
As I recall it was an easy build and the rim has a very nice breaking surface.

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Travel bikes

[Bill Schairer]

Julian,

That sort of confirms my suspicion.  Six speeds wouldn’t do it for me.  I 
want range and smallish steps which is why all my bikes are 3x.  1x doesn’t 
interest me, 2x I hate.  In the end I can play with my BF gearing just as 
much as any of my other bikes and so it can always sub in.  For me, it is 
that versatility that is most important, while for Joe, it seems 
foldability is more important.  The joys of having choices!

Bill S

I can get this guy down into the teens:

[image: 393A0E84-8EAD-4910-AB4E-932F36C118B8.jpeg]


On Sunday, June 21, 2020 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-7, Julian Westerhout wrote:
>
> Bill, 
>
> I think that depends upon how you have both bikes set up. The Brompton is 
> available with 1to 6 gears, and i think the BF is available with 1 to 21 
> gears, with widely varying ratios., 
>
> In my case I have a 6-speed Brompton (3-speed internal plus a 2 speed 
> freewheel), my friend's BF has 18 gears (3 speed internal plus a 9 speed 
> cassette). I've not checked the actual gear inch range of both, but my seat 
> of the pants feeling is that the overall range is similar, but with bigger 
> jumps between gears on the Brompton, and that both have pretty wide range 
> gearing suitable for most types of terrain one would likely encounter -- 
> similar to what i'd regard as a well set up "regular" bike. 
>
> It is of course possible to get either with very different gearing, so...
>
> Julian Westerhout
> Bloomington, IL 
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, June 21, 2020 at 3:50:19 PM UTC-5, Bill Schairer wrote:
>>
>> Julian, 
>> Do the Bromptons have the same gear range as the BF?  The only folder 
>> I’ve ever ridden is my BF NWT with gearing range comparable to my “regular” 
>> bikes.  I’ve been under the impression, possibly false, that most folders 
>> don’t have that capability.  As far as folding and unfolding, I have no 
>> comparisons to make but, as I mentioned earlier, I folded and unfolded my 
>> BF every day when I used it for a commuter, which is to say it was easy 
>> enough that it didn’t discourage use.  I believe mine even required an 
>> additional step from the normal process.  Now, if I were to go out and try 
>> to fold mine now, I would fumble around a bit but if one is doing it 
>> regularly, it really isn’t any big deal. 
>>
>> Bill S
>
>

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[RBW] End-of-Spring Rides

[Bill Schairer]

I always look forward to your shots!

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Travel bikes

[Bill Schairer]

Julian, 
Do the Bromptons have the same gear range as the BF?  The only folder I’ve ever 
ridden is my BF NWT with gearing range comparable to my “regular” bikes.  I’ve 
been under the impression, possibly false, that most folders don’t have that 
capability.  As far as folding and unfolding, I have no comparisons to make 
but, as I mentioned earlier, I folded and unfolded my BF every day when I used 
it for a commuter, which is to say it was easy enough that it didn’t discourage 
use.  I believe mine even required an additional step from the normal process.  
Now, if I were to go out and try to fold mine now, I would fumble around a bit 
but if one is doing it regularly, it really isn’t any big deal.

Bill S

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[RBW] Travel bikes

[Bill Schairer]

I have a BF NWT and have done two one week semi-loaded tours on Route 66 with 
it, used it Australia, British Columbia on trails even,  in Austria, and 
commuted on it folding and unfolding it every day to ride in the elevator with 
me (I didn’t like my outdoor locking options).  Was going to take it to Japan 
in March but COVID struck. The bike has served me well.

Bill S

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Re: [RBW] Re: Just Pics from Your Good Ride Thread

[Bill Schairer]

Robert, yes, that runs from Santee Lakes up to Sycamore Canyon.  It is my 
understanding from someone who grew up in Santee that they used to run wild in 
there but then the marines cracked down on it.

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Lowrider racks on MIT Atlantis?

[Bill Schairer]

John,

The steel used is 1/2 inch by .14 inch because that is what I had on hand. 
 I suspect a lighter solution would work, aluminum maybe? I believe my 
Atlantis is a Waterford bike.  No spacers were required for either bike.  I 
don’t think it matters if braze-ons are above or below.  On the Atlantis 
they are higher than the rack and on the tandem below.  The tandem braze-on 
spacing appears very close to 165 and the Atlantis seems to be 220.  The 
rack appears to be in the 190 range.

Bill S

On Sunday, June 14, 2020 at 6:25:01 AM UTC-7, John Hawrylak wrote:
>
> Bill
>
> Looks like a great solution and it would seem to work if the fork brazeons 
> were below the rack mounting point, e.g., a BG rack on a fork with 165mm 
> brazeon spacing.
>
> Is the 1st picture the MIT Atlantis??  If so, it clearly shows the 
> braze-ons mounted higher on the fork than most racks require. 
>
> Did you have to use a spacer on the backside so the short connector clears 
> the tube of the rack??
>
> What gauge steel sheet did you use??
>
> John Hawrylak
> Woodstown NJ
>
> On Sunday, June 14, 2020 at 8:40:25 AM UTC-4, Bill Schairer wrote:
>>
>> My solution with the BG rack was to “fabricate” (cut a couple short 
>> pieces of steel flat stock and drilled two holes) a short steel connector 
>> piece from the rack mounting point to the braze on.  I’ve done it on two 
>> different bikes and it has been a rock solid solution that I, personally, 
>> think is cleaner looking than p-clamps or that tubus thing. I should think 
>> the same approach could be taken with almost any rack and, to my mind, is 
>> really no different than all the various mountings of racks with adjustable 
>> stays that I’ve seen.  I’ve had trouble loading pics recently but I’ll try 
>> again.
>>
>> [image: IMG_1012.jpeg]
>>
>> [image: 2019-07-15_14-42-04-0700.jpeg]
>> Bill S
>>
>> On Saturday, June 13, 2020 at 1:50:56 PM UTC-7, John Hawrylak wrote:
>>>
>>> I thought the 'standard' mounting point on the fork was 165mm from the 
>>> fork dropout.   Bruce Gordon used 7" (178mm) for his front rack, and 
>>> Waterford used his spacing in the late 90's and early 2000's.
>>>
>>> The RBW braze-ons look too high to fit the racks without odd looking 
>>> backward tilt.  They should have used 2 braze-ons:  1 for the low rider and 
>>> 1 for the front rack (mounted higher),  penny-wise, pound foolish
>>>
>>> John Hawrylak
>>> Woodstown NJ
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 13, 2020 at 4:31:28 PM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Is that lower-rear mount on the fork really for low rider racks? It 
>>>> looks like a high-mount for fender stays to me. 
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Brooks vs Berthoud Saddle Setback

[Bill Schairer]

I’ve never paid any attention to STA but all the discussions I’ve seen of it 
has me curious.  I just found this video on an angle finder app for smart 
phones - https://youtu.be/zNuGgBwirQ4

I think I’ll have to check it out.

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: Charlie H Gallop!

[Bill Schairer]

You mean like this?  Sorry, I couldn’t resist, a craigslist item


Bill S

On Tuesday, June 9, 2020 at 11:43:20 AM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> That Polyvalent Low-Kicker is a great looking bike, in my opinion.  I 
> think it illustrates how much better the Gallop may look with drop bars 
> closer to level with the saddle.  Some of you think a bike looks weird when 
> a tube curves.  Some of you don't like gaps that are bigger than you are 
> used to.  Some don't like to see drop bars way above the saddle (or way 
> below). 
>
> I'll give both machines (Gallup and Polyvalent low-kicker) a serious look 
> when their respective Geo charts come out.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Tuesday, June 9, 2020 at 11:09:22 AM UTC-7, Brian Campbell wrote:
>>
>> VO is offering something similar:
>>
>> https://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2020/05/mega-list-of-project-updates.html
>>
>> Drop tube/drop bar bikes are a " thing" now.
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Hot Waxing Chains

[Bill Schairer]

What I’m curious about is what results one with get with other lubes applied in 
the same manner as NSF.  Can’t wait for your report, Patrick.  Of course I can 
always try myself.  Count me skeptical of any magic in NSF but I am intrigued.

Bill S

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[RBW] WTB: Sugino Left Side Crankarm 170mm

[Bill Schairer]

I have a left side Sugino A-1 170.  Probably not a match?

Bill S

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[RBW] Re: help with rear derailer

[Bill Schairer]

I think this style may have been designed for a claw mount rather than a 
direct mount?  Sorry I didn’t get this all in one post.

Bill S

On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 9:27:30 AM UTC-7, Bill Schairer wrote:
>
> Let me try again with the photo
>
> [image: IMG_1126.jpeg]
>
>
> On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 9:25:37 AM UTC-7, Bill Schairer wrote:
>>
>> I have several Cyclone GT’s and have had this same problem with one of 
>> them.  I think there are two different mounting styles.  The one I had 
>> trouble with I solved by mounting it with a washer (don’t know what else to 
>> call it) type thing between derailleur and dropout pushing the derailleur 
>> outbound.  This did NOT cause issues shifting all the way in to biggest cog 
>> on a 9 speed cassette.
>>
>> Bill S
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 7:13:26 AM UTC-7, Patch T wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Bunch,
>>>
>>> Hoping you could help me work through throuble-shooting a friction 
>>> shifting issue on a rear derailer. I have a feeling it's actually a much 
>>> simpler issue than I think, and that I may already know the problem. But 
>>> looking for advice anyhow.
>>>
>>> PROBLEM: 
>>> -- rear derailer won't shift into highest gear on it's own 
>>> -- but it does when I apply forward motion with moderate pressure with 
>>> my right foot at about 2 to 3 c'clock position 
>>> -- all other gears shift fine, if not wonderfully
>>>
>>> CAVEAT: 
>>> -- I'm using vintage parts that may not play well. But I think they 
>>> could? All but one part are in great condition. So there's that.
>>>
>>> DRIVETRAIN: 
>>> -- rear derailer: *Suntour Cyclone GT long cage 
>>> <http://velobase.com/ViewComponent.aspx?ID=9C9A73FD-A345-4B2D-B524-66C9B1D79350=108=22>
>>>   
>>> the High limit screw is maxed out*
>>> *-- *front der: Suntour Cyclone
>>> -- have tried both 8 spd and 9 spd 11-32/36 cassettes with same issue, 
>>> *although 
>>> 8 speed is slightly better*
>>> -- White Ind M15 shimano body hub, with correct spacers
>>> -- yes, fresh chain
>>> -- Rene Herse double 44/28
>>> -- 113mm bottom brackett
>>> -- vintage suntour bar-cons (this is the only vintage item that is not 
>>> in near-perfect condition, in my amateur opinion)
>>> -- recently changed all cable and housing
>>>
>>> ALSO IMPORTANT: *the same bike has experienced great index shifting 
>>> with the following:*
>>> -- White Industries ENO crank with 42 tooth chainring
>>> -- same 113mm bottom brackett
>>> -- SRAM Rival road brake/shifters
>>> -- SRAM Rival rear derailer
>>> -- SRAM cassette 11spd, 11-42 
>>>
>>> THOUGHTS:
>>> -- this is a chainline issue; the WI crank has a wider Q that the Rene 
>>> Herse, so derailer can move chain outside easier?
>>> -- If the above is true, is the only solution a BB with longer spindles?
>>> -- I'm being overly optimistic with the actual abilities of the Suntour 
>>> Cyclone and should give up. Even though it easily wraps the lower gears.
>>> -- the derailer is in fact bent and I can't tell with my naked eye
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks everyone!
>>>
>>> Patch
>>> BK/NY
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: help with rear derailer

[Bill Schairer]

I have several Cyclone GT’s and have had this same problem with one of 
them.  I think there are two different mounting styles.  The one I had 
trouble with I solved by mounting it with a washer (don’t know what else to 
call it) type thing between derailleur and dropout pushing the derailleur 
outbound.  This did NOT cause issues shifting all the way in to biggest cog 
on a 9 speed cassette.

Bill S




On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 7:13:26 AM UTC-7, Patch T wrote:
>
> Hi Bunch,
>
> Hoping you could help me work through throuble-shooting a friction 
> shifting issue on a rear derailer. I have a feeling it's actually a much 
> simpler issue than I think, and that I may already know the problem. But 
> looking for advice anyhow.
>
> PROBLEM: 
> -- rear derailer won't shift into highest gear on it's own 
> -- but it does when I apply forward motion with moderate pressure with my 
> right foot at about 2 to 3 c'clock position 
> -- all other gears shift fine, if not wonderfully
>
> CAVEAT: 
> -- I'm using vintage parts that may not play well. But I think they could? 
> All but one part are in great condition. So there's that.
>
> DRIVETRAIN: 
> -- rear derailer: *Suntour Cyclone GT long cage 
> 
>   
> the High limit screw is maxed out*
> *-- *front der: Suntour Cyclone
> -- have tried both 8 spd and 9 spd 11-32/36 cassettes with same issue, 
> *although 
> 8 speed is slightly better*
> -- White Ind M15 shimano body hub, with correct spacers
> -- yes, fresh chain
> -- Rene Herse double 44/28
> -- 113mm bottom brackett
> -- vintage suntour bar-cons (this is the only vintage item that is not in 
> near-perfect condition, in my amateur opinion)
> -- recently changed all cable and housing
>
> ALSO IMPORTANT: *the same bike has experienced great index shifting with 
> the following:*
> -- White Industries ENO crank with 42 tooth chainring
> -- same 113mm bottom brackett
> -- SRAM Rival road brake/shifters
> -- SRAM Rival rear derailer
> -- SRAM cassette 11spd, 11-42 
>
> THOUGHTS:
> -- this is a chainline issue; the WI crank has a wider Q that the Rene 
> Herse, so derailer can move chain outside easier?
> -- If the above is true, is the only solution a BB with longer spindles?
> -- I'm being overly optimistic with the actual abilities of the Suntour 
> Cyclone and should give up. Even though it easily wraps the lower gears.
> -- the derailer is in fact bent and I can't tell with my naked eye
>
>
> Thanks everyone!
>
> Patch
> BK/NY
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Praise for the Hubbuhubbuh tandem

[Bill Schairer]

Robert,

Last year I took a Bruce Gordon frame into Joe Bell’s shop and he had it cold 
set to 130, checked the alignment, and re-aligned a Trek 720 fork for me all 
for $100 and a six pack (or was it a case?).  I wouldn’t want to fight your 
frame forever.

Bill S
San Diego

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Re: [RBW] Re: Joe's Custom

[Bill Schairer]

“ It's perfect. Comfortable, beautiful, with a nice springy ride..basically 
it's a Rivendell. But a Rivendell built to my size and riding style, with my 
CRAZY-good-looking choice of Joe Bell paint. I'm so glad I finally did this, I 
love it!”

Joe,

I had a custom touring bike built for me in 1978 and it is still the bike I 
ride the most.  42 years plus what you expressed  is what makes it so so worth 
it.  Congratulations.  That is YOUR bike and nobody else has one.

Bill S 

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