Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, k5in wrote: This is directed to you: If I have a DB413 and I am going to use it on 441.950 you are saying there will be some down tilt in the pattern? This doesn't bother me. I am more curious than anything about this antenna that is due to go up 140ft on a tower in a couple of months. That's entirely dependent on the split the antenna was designed for. I'm sure there are others here who can hazard a better guess. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR Disinformation Analyst
RE: [Repeater-Builder] OT: Making PDFs
Mac ? hahaha try one of the free pdf generators like cutepdf To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com From: da...@wcf.com Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 15:55:51 -0700 Subject: [Repeater-Builder] OT: Making PDFs At 15:37 3/22/2009, Kris Kirby wrote: No way around it unless I want to lose PDF authoring capability. Buy a Mac Actually WordPerfect makes beautiful PDF files and has for years... -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE gomberg1 at wcf dot com All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html -- _ View photos of singles in your area. Click Here http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fdating%2Eninemsn%2Ecom%2Eau%2Fchannel%2Findex%2Easpx%3Ftrackingid%3D1046247_t=773166080_r=Hotmail_Endtext_m=EXT
[Repeater-Builder] Re: OT: Making PDFs
Sorry Dave, Didn't get that you started the new thread and wasn't having a problem...but was just making a comment ... A bit dense here. Larry - N7FM --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Dave Gomberg da...@... wrote: At 15:37 3/22/2009, Kris Kirby wrote: No way around it unless I want to lose PDF authoring capability. Buy a Mac Actually WordPerfect makes beautiful PDF files and has for years... -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE gomberg1 at wcf dot com All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html -
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps
At 03:53 PM 03/22/09, you wrote: --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Kris Kirby k...@... wrote: The results, I would say in practical terms, is that a DB-224 cut for 165MHz isn't a bad thing. You'll experience some uptilt. But matching the antenna to a 50-ohm transmitter is another issue altogether. So the question is, does anyone have an out-of-service DB-224 (hopefully on the ground) that was custom built for amateur service that dimensions can be lifted from from? I have access to 316 stainless tube am willing to take a shot at fabricating replacement elements. Martin http://www.repeater-builder.com/db/db-224-a-and-e.pdf The drawing has both the A model (150-160MHz) and the E model (138-150Mhz) measurements. The PDF is courtesy Skipp, a frequent contributor to this mailing list. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps (followup)
I wrote, and sent too s At 03:53 PM 03/22/09, you wrote: --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Kris Kirby k...@... wrote: The results, I would say in practical terms, is that a DB-224 cut for 165MHz isn't a bad thing. You'll experience some uptilt. But matching the antenna to a 50-ohm transmitter is another issue altogether. So the question is, does anyone have an out-of-service DB-224 (hopefully on the ground) that was custom built for amateur service that dimensions can be lifted from from? I have access to 316 stainless tube am willing to take a shot at fabricating replacement elements. Martin http://www.repeater-builder.com/db/db-224-a-and-e.pdf The drawing has both the A model (150-160MHz) and the E model (138-150Mhz) measurements. The PDF is courtesy Skipp, a frequent contributor to this mailing list. There is also this one - http://www.repeater-builder.com/db/db-224e-diagram-dz.pdf donated by Doug Zastrow WB0UPJ. The info sheets from both Skipp and Doug were loaded onto the server over two years ago (in January 2007), so the data has been around a while. I'd like to see a similar measurement sheet for the DB224-JJ (the 220 MHz version). And on the page at http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/ant-sys-index.html there are the Decibel DB-224 catalog data sheet and the later one from when Andrew took them over. Plus the Andrew DB224 Installation Instruction Sheet Plus, courtesy of John Lock KF0M there is a scan of the the three-page packing insert / instruction sheet that came in the box with the DB-224 Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
On Mar 22, 2009, at 7:18 PM, n...@no6b.com wrote: By now I've already managed to get the original PDF downconverted to something everyone should be able to read. Then again, unless you're going to print it HTML is the most universal format. Actually straight ASCII is the most universal. :-) /me puts on my computer curmudgeon voce... Darn kids and their fancy graphics! (GRIN!) -- Nate Duehr, WY0X n...@natetech.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
On Mar 22, 2009, at 5:11 PM, Jeff DePolo wrote: I have a Sinclair 8-bay with half-wave element to mast spacing stored in the Sitemaster, but it was swept from the far end of 600' of 1-5/8 with a topside TX-RX crossband coupler. It's spec'ed for 406-512 MHz. I can't keep track of Sinclair's model numbers, it's probably a SD318- HF2P2SNM, previously known as a SRL310C8NM*2-2. I can send you the sweep anyway if you want it. It talks extremely well. --- Jeff WN3A Hi Jeff, that's interesting data. I was more curious whether or not you had any antennas easy to add to the tests, or any locals nearby with different types of Sinclairs around/available to add to the data while you have the test range setup, so to speak. Not important enough to go hunting too hard for them though. The data you shared on the DB antennas is very useful to a lot of folks, I'm sure! I've always had good luck with Sinclairs, and they've always worked well, but I've never seen anything other than the manufacturer's published specs on them. They do seem to work well, all of them. We've used the 2-bay 1/4 wave spacing, the 4-bay 1/2 wave spacing, and the 8-bay 1/2-wave spacing models (a mix of VHF and UHF) on various repeaters. The most surprising has been the performance of the little 2-bay 1/4 wave spacing antenna on one particular site. -- Nate Duehr, WY0X n...@natetech.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
Check the antenna for VSWR at that frequency BEFORE it goes up. It's probably going to be borderline. - Original Message - On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, k5in wrote: If I have a DB413 and I am going to use it on 441.950
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Master II station 66 split conversion to 56 split
Well, that's good news. Maybe that's why I could find no references to the replacement procedure. I suppose that NHRC is being cautious in case mileage varies. 73 de Morris KI4IUA -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jim Brown Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 6:04 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Master II station 66 split conversion to 56 split I have retuned 10+ GE Mastr II exciters - base/moble and have never had to change a component. Put the ICOM in for the new frequency and tune per the manual. I use a Bird milliWatt meter that has a 250 mW full scale and an internal 50 Ohm load to finish the tuning, after going through the test points with a Simpson 260. Peaking the previous stage and dipping for the input to the next stage as per the tuning instructions will give you a working exciter as long as there is no component issue in the exciter. 73 - Jim W5ZIT --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Morris Dillingham mdi...@nnwifi.com wrote: From: Morris Dillingham mdi...@nnwifi.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Master II station 66 split conversion to 56 split To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 2:20 PM Now that you have helped me close out the old Spectrum issues, can anyone point me to the list of caps and their new values to convert the exciter board of a Master II station? On the NHRC site I see mention of the need to change out a dozen or so caps but no other references. 73 de Morris KI4IUA
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Master II station 66 split conversion to 56 split
Since we are retuning to 147.330 transmit and 147.930 receive, we are at the end of the band that should help. Thanks to all for the reassurance. 73 de Morris KI4IUA -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of n...@no6b.com Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 6:36 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Master II station 66 split conversion to 56 split At 3/22/2009 15:03, you wrote: I have retuned 10+ GE Mastr II exciters - base/moble and have never had to change a component. Put the ICOM in for the new frequency and tune per the manual. Same experience here, except that if you want to put one on the 144.390 APRS frequency you may find that some exciters don't quite make it down that far. Bob NO6B Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: [Repeater-Builder] OT: Making PDFs
At 3/22/2009 23:34, you wrote: Mac ? hahaha try one of the free pdf generators like cutepdf As stated in my previous post, none of these low-end PDF solutions are usable for my application. Bob NO6B
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
At 3/23/2009 01:29, you wrote: On Mar 22, 2009, at 7:18 PM, n...@no6b.com wrote: By now I've already managed to get the original PDF downconverted to something everyone should be able to read. Then again, unless you're going to print it HTML is the most universal format. Actually straight ASCII is the most universal. :-) Not on this group, thanks to Yahoo stripping extra spaces from the text. Bob NO6B
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
Thanks, Bob. Apparently you and I are in the same boat. I have the full version of Acrobat 5 installed, and if I try to upgrade the reader only, it corrupts the entire installation. And I'm too cheap to go out and spend the $$$ for a new version. ;-) Thanks! Mark -N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of n...@no6b.com At 3/22/2009 16:43, you wrote: I got to the page, but the file wouldn't open... Mark - N9WYS It's likely you also have Acrobat (Reader) 5.0. Rather than drag this sub-thread out, I remoted into another computer that does have a current Adobe install downconverted the PDF (attached). Bob NO6B
[Repeater-Builder] Sinclair Q2220E
Does anyone have experience using this model on 2 meters? Do they provide enough practical isolation for single antenna, 600kc split? (Sinclair Q2220E 4 Cavity VHF BpBr Repeater)
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Sinclair Q2220E
Yes, but we modified/replaced the loops in the cavities to get better performance. No changes were made to the harness as I recall. I don't recall the Pass/Rejectfigures at the moment (but they were comparable to other 4 cavity 2 mtr. duplexersor slightly better, but the duplexer has been operating on the K4SLB 2 mtr. rptr. in Kissimmee Fl for the last year and a half. You'll need access to a service monitor with a tracking generator at least to make the mod. It's a reasonably simple mod. and all that was required was some #14 Ga. bare copper wire, a soldering iron and your time and access to the SM. Other may have different ideas or suggestions. Doug N3DAB --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Terry wx3m.te...@... wrote: Does anyone have experience using this model on 2 meters? Do they provide enough practical isolation for single antenna, 600kc split? (Sinclair Q2220E 4 Cavity VHF BpBr Repeater)
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Sinclair Q2220E
I did use one on 2 meters however never was able to get more than about 65Db Isolation. Worked OK as long as we kept the transmitter power low. Gary - K7NEY Terry wrote: Does anyone have experience using this model on 2 meters? Do they provide enough practical isolation for single antenna, 600kc split? (Sinclair Q2220E 4 Cavity VHF BpBr Repeater)
RE: [Repeater-Builder] OT: Making PDFs
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com From: n...@no6b.com Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 08:19:36 -0700 Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] OT: Making PDFs At 3/22/2009 23:34, you wrote: Mac ? hahaha try one of the free pdf generators like cutepdf As stated in my previous post, none of these low-end PDF solutions are usable for my application. a clue ? Bob NO6B _ Looking to change your car this year? Find car news, reviews and more http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fsecure%2Dau%2Eimrworldwide%2Ecom%2Fcgi%2Dbin%2Fa%2Fci%5F450304%2Fet%5F2%2Fcg%5F801459%2Fpi%5F1004813%2Fai%5F859641_t=762955845_r=tig_OCT07_m=EXT
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
At 09:01 3/23/2009, Mark wrote: Thanks, Bob. Apparently you and I are in the same boat. I have the full version of Acrobat 5 installed, and if I try to upgrade the reader only, it corrupts the entire installation. And I'm too cheap to go out and spend the $$$ for a new version. ;-) Mark, my morality about this is that if Adobe screws something up so that I need a whole new version, I will buy it ANYWHERE I can (at the lowest price). I generally support getting real copies from vendors, but when the vendor screws me, I return the favor -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE gomberg1 at wcf dot com All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html -
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel dipole array sweeps
At 09:01 3/23/2009, Mark wrote: Thanks, Bob. Apparently you and I are in the same boat. I have the full version of Acrobat 5 installed, and if I try to upgrade the reader only, it corrupts the entire installation. And I'm too cheap to go out and spend the $$$ for a new version. ;-) Mark, my morality about this is that if Adobe screws something up so that I need a whole new version, I will buy it ANYWHERE I can (at the lowest price). I generally support getting real copies from vendors, but when the vendor screws me, I return the favor -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE gomberg1 at wcf dot com All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html -
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Kris Kirby k...@... wrote: On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, k5in wrote: This is directed to you: If I have a DB413 and I am going to use it on 441.950 you are saying there will be some down tilt in the pattern? No, there will be no downtilt or uptilt with a corporate-fed stacked dipole antenna. The main lobe may become fatter, and sidelobes may increase, but their elevations remain the same. Jeff's earlier post explained it very clearly. Kris, I believe that your findings are a result of having real ground under an antenna, in which case you'll find similar data no matter what kind of antenna you model. Laryn K8TVZ
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps
Folks, I have the received plenty of information on dimensions via email. Thanks! Despite the increase in weight, I am considering using 6016-T6 rod for the elements, rather then tubing. I know that rod can be bent without kinking on a tight radius. It also welds a lot easier then thin wall tubing. The other option is to laser or water jet cut the elements out of plate, instead of being bent from round stock. That being said, will the element being square affect the pattern? The total cross section can be engineered to remain the same (circle vs square). The additional rigidity eliminate the need for the insulator between the driven element and the dipole bracket. I do have a concern re using a tin plated copper terminal on a copper center conductor, bolted to an aluminum mast/element with a stainless steel mechanical fastener. Anyone have access to stainless steel lugs that can be compression crimped (with real tooling, not a pair of pliers) that are for a #10 stud and fit the center conductor of the coax? Martin /W2RWJ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps
Jeff, Well, for that matter anybody that wants to answer. How long is the mast supposed to be on a DB413? I have one with a mast that is 12ft in length. Does it really matter when it is 140ft in the air, 40 inches off the side of a tower? Brian, k5in - Original Message - From: Jeff DePolo To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 2:49 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps I'd be interested in seeing what you have. Back in the old days of Decibel, they would send you good info if you were able to get to the right person. I haven't had that kind of success since Andrew bought them out. Just this week I came across a non-catalog Decibel antenna on a tower (the one where this DB413 is going). It was a Decibel DB478E-JJ fiberglass omni. I can't find it any of my catalogs, nor on the web. I'm fairly certain it's a 220 MHz antenna based on the -JJ suffix. I also have a DB420 that has a factory label on it that says 450-482 MHz. There's a lot of custom stuff out there from the old Decibel, too bad Andrew has drastically cut back on the special-order products... --- Jeff WN3A -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom, N6MVT Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 5:10 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps On a somewhat related notes...I had to do some research on the rare (and not currently made) down tilt models from db products. I have some paperwork with measurements and notes on them from their archives. Not complete or easy to read (originally faxed) but it helps to determine if you might have a 4 or 9 degree downtilt harness and other related parts measurements. If someone is in need of them I can either e-mail or perhaps post on this site. Also, I have seen some of the dipoles get modified with short stainless machine screws+nuts drilled through the top bottom of the dipole elements, to help get the Return Loss even better at lower freqs. Not sure what, if any, skewed pattern is introduced by doing the machine screw mod or not. Quite often it's hard to tell any changes in the field unless it is very drastic. Tom No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 03/21/09 17:58:00
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Sinclair Q2220E
Is it possible to provide any more details in regard to the mod you made? Thanks, Jim _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of n3dab Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 12:45 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Sinclair Q2220E Yes, but we modified/replaced the loops in the cavities to get better performance. No changes were made to the harness as I recall. I don't recall the Pass/Rejectfigures at the moment (but they were comparable to other 4 cavity 2 mtr. duplexersor slightly better, but the duplexer has been operating on the K4SLB 2 mtr. rptr. in Kissimmee Fl for the last year and a half. You'll need access to a service monitor with a tracking generator at least to make the mod. It's a reasonably simple mod. and all that was required was some #14 Ga. bare copper wire, a soldering iron and your time and access to the SM. Other may have different ideas or suggestions. Doug N3DAB --- In Repeater-Builder@ mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com yahoogroups.com, Terry wx3m.te...@... wrote: Does anyone have experience using this model on 2 meters? Do they provide enough practical isolation for single antenna, 600kc split? (Sinclair Q2220E 4 Cavity VHF BpBr Repeater)
[Repeater-Builder] Fw: [DSTAR_DIGITAL] FCC Ruling on Repeater Definition
Federal Communications Commission Washington, D.C. 20554 March 23, 2009 DA 09-657 Mr. Gary R. Mitchell President, Northern California Packet Association P.O. Box K Sunnyvale, CA 94087 Re: Petition for Declaratory Ruling filed December 5, 2007 Dear Mr. Mitchell: This is in response to the petition for declaratory ruling that you filed on December 5, 2007, requesting that the Commission clarify the definition of a repeater in the amateur service rules. 1 A repeater in the amateur service is defined as [a]n amateur station that simultaneously retransmits the transmission of another amateur station on a different channel or channels. 2 You seek clarification of whether the word simultaneously in the definition refers to the signal information being retransmitted, or to the fact that the receiver and transmitter must both be active at the same time while acting on the same signal information. Section 97.205(b) of the Commission's Rules specifies the bands on which amateur repeater stations may operate. 3 You state that some amateur radio operators are operating on bands other than those set forth in Section 97.205(b) with systems that are essentially voice repeater stations, but that digitize and retransmit the user's voice, on the theory that because there is a small delay in retransmitting the signal of another amateur station, the signal is not simultaneously retransmitted and, therefore, the system is not a repeater. 4 Prior to 1994, a repeater was defined as [a]n amateur station that automatically retransmits the signals of other stations. 5 The Commission revised the definition in order to clarify that certain accommodations for message forwarding systems do not apply to other operating activities such as repeaters and auxiliary stations. 6 The Commission proposed to define a repeater as [a]n amateur station that instantaneously retransmits the transmission of another amateur station on a different channel or channels, but ultimately replaced instantaneously with simultaneously because commenters noted 2. that there is always a small propagation delay through a repeater. 7 As one commenter explained, The word `simultaneously' in this case means that the repeater is receiving and transmitting concurrently, whereas each signal might be slightly displaced in time between receive and transmit. 8 To be able to repeat another station's transmission, a repeater must be able to receive a transmission from another station and retransmit it. Because the word simultaneously in the definition is used to modify retransmit, we believe it refers to a repeater station's transmitter being active when retransmitting the signal received by the repeater station's receiver from another amateur station. We conclude, therefore, that simultaneously as used in the definition of a repeater refers to the receiver and transmitter both being active at the same time. Accordingly, IT IS ORDERED that, pursuant to Section 4(i) of the Communications Act of 1934, as amended, 47 U.S.C. § 154(i), and Section 1.2 of the Commission's Rules, 47 C.F.R. § 1.2, the Petition for Declaratory Ruling filed on December 5, 2007 by Gary R. Mitchell IS GRANTED to the extent indicated above. This action is taken under delegated authority pursuant to Sections 0.131 and 0.331 of the Commission's Rules, 47 C.F.R. §§ 0.131 and 0.331. FEDERAL COMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION Scot Stone Deputy Chief, Mobility Division Wireless Telecommunications Bureau 1 See Petition for Declaratory Ruling (filed December 5, 2007) (Petition). 2 See 47 C.F.R. § 97.3(a)(39). 3 47 C.F.R. § 97.205(b). 4 Petition at 1. 5 See 47 C.F.R. § 97.3(a)(35) (1993). 6 See Amendment of Part 97 of the Commission's Rules Concerning Message Forwarding Systems in the Amateur Service, Report and Order, PR Docket No. 93-85, 9 FCC Rcd 1786, 1788 ¶ 6 (1994). 7 Id.; see American Radio Relay League (ARRL) Comments at 16; Colorado Council of Amateur Radio Clubs Comments at 3. 8 See ARRL Comments at 16.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps
It doesn't matter if you can achieve the required element-to-element spacing and the top of the mast extends several inches beyond the top of the top element and the bottom of the mast extends several inches below the bottom of the bottom element. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: k5in To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:46 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps Jeff, Well, for that matter anybody that wants to answer. How long is the mast supposed to be on a DB413? I have one with a mast that is 12ft in length. Does it really matter when it is 140ft in the air, 40 inches off the side of a tower? Brian, k5in - Original Message - From: Jeff DePolo To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 2:49 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps I'd be interested in seeing what you have. Back in the old days of Decibel, they would send you good info if you were able to get to the right person. I haven't had that kind of success since Andrew bought them out. Just this week I came across a non-catalog Decibel antenna on a tower (the one where this DB413 is going). It was a Decibel DB478E-JJ fiberglass omni. I can't find it any of my catalogs, nor on the web. I'm fairly certain it's a 220 MHz antenna based on the -JJ suffix. I also have a DB420 that has a factory label on it that says 450-482 MHz. There's a lot of custom stuff out there from the old Decibel, too bad Andrew has drastically cut back on the special-order products... --- Jeff WN3A -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom, N6MVT Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 5:10 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Decibel dipole array sweeps On a somewhat related notes...I had to do some research on the rare (and not currently made) down tilt models from db products. I have some paperwork with measurements and notes on them from their archives. Not complete or easy to read (originally faxed) but it helps to determine if you might have a 4 or 9 degree downtilt harness and other related parts measurements. If someone is in need of them I can either e-mail or perhaps post on this site. Also, I have seen some of the dipoles get modified with short stainless machine screws+nuts drilled through the top bottom of the dipole elements, to help get the Return Loss even better at lower freqs. Not sure what, if any, skewed pattern is introduced by doing the machine screw mod or not. Quite often it's hard to tell any changes in the field unless it is very drastic. Tom No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1970 - Release Date: 03/21/09 17:58:00
[Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting
I am seeking advise ...but if I can be pointed to the right direction, I will be most appreciative. This summer, I plan to take down my Cellwave Station Master (repeater antenna) for service, maintenance or painting. Over the years, moss and algae set in and the bright white fiberglass finish is beginning to disappear. I seek advise on the following: 1. What cleaning agent would be best to take down foreign objects in the antenna 2. What paint if any...or preparation therof before application is neglegible in the optimum performance of this antenna. This antenna has served us well over the years. 3. Other recommendation. thanks chris
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting
Chris, This question comes up quite often, but I will repeat the standard response. Go here: www.rfsworld.com/index.php?p=276l=1listName=applicationnotesindexVal=1 If you have any other questions about Celwave Stationmaster antennas, contact the Tech Support folks for more information. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of chris Inos Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 5:00 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting I am seeking advice ...but if I can be pointed to the right direction, I will be most appreciative. This summer, I plan to take down my Celwave StationMaster (repeater antenna) for service, maintenance or painting. Over the years, moss and algae set in and the bright white fiberglass finish is beginning to disappear. I seek advice on the following: 1. What cleaning agent would be best to take down foreign objects in the antenna 2. What paint if any...or preparation thereof before application is neglegible in the optimum performance of this antenna. This antenna has served us well over the years. 3. Other recommendation. thanks chris
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Asntenna Painting
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, chris Inos chris_i...@... wrote: This summer, I plan to take down my Cellwave Station Master (repeater antenna) for service, maintenance or painting. When in doubt, go right to the source! http://www.rfsworld.com/index.php?p=276l=1listName=applicationnotesindexVal=1 I have the same information as a FAX
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Sinclair Q2220E
Terry, Yes, I tried using a Q2220E duplexer on a 2m repeater, with a 600 kHz split, but quickly realized that it was not up to the task. It simply does not have sufficient isolation at a 600 kHz split to be useful at 2m. It is specified to have 70 dB of isolation at a 500 kHz split, but you need 71 dB of isolation for a 1 (one) watt transmitter working with a 0.3 uV receiver- according to CommShop for Windows. Part of the problem is that the Q2220E duplexer uses the Res-Lok design, wherein the coupling between cavities of each pair is via a machined port between them, rather than a cabled coupling loop that can be adjusted. Although this particular duplexer is advertized as capable of 500 kHz splits, it is aimed for applications with at least a 3 MHz split. Quite a difference, there! Although you may find significant desense of 3 to 10 dB to be okay, I shoot for zero dB of desense- and that means 95 to 100 dB of isolation with most practical repeaters. Choose wisely... 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Terry Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 11:29 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Sinclair Q2220E Does anyone have experience using this model on 2 meters? Do they provide enough practical isolation for single antenna, 600kc split? (Sinclair Q2220E 4 Cavity VHF BpBr Repeater)
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting
from memory 1 good boat fiber glass cleaner ( where gloves !! the glass splinters HURT !) 2 a good gel coat ( type of paint sotra again boat supply store) Make sure there is no metal in the paint ( or Gel Coat ) 3 after the gel coat a good sealer to the gel coat I dont think I would say a wax .. but I could be wrong I have seen gel coat used .. ( I cant find the web site any more) if you go that route take a lot of pic's and provide info for other users .. I hope this helps Rick On Mon, Mar 23, 2009 at 7:59 PM, chris Inos chris_i...@yahoo.com wrote: I am seeking advise ...but if I can be pointed to the right direction, I will be most appreciative. This summer, I plan to take down my Cellwave Station Master (repeater antenna) for service, maintenance or painting. Over the years, moss and algae set in and the bright white fiberglass finish is beginning to disappear. I seek advise on the following: 1. What cleaning agent would be best to take down foreign objects in the antenna 2. What paint if any...or preparation therof before application is neglegible in the optimum performance of this antenna. This antenna has served us well over the years. 3. Other recommendation. thanks chris
[Repeater-Builder] off topic
Any one know what or how a kenwood tk-710 VHF mobile radio is programmed? I have cables for kenwoods but can't find any software. This is an older radio. Maybe it still has crystals? Google is not my friend this time! Thanks, Mike Ka2NDW
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting
--- On Mon, 3/23/09, chris Inos chris_i...@yahoo.com wrote: From: chris Inos chris_i...@yahoo.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Asntenna Painting To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 7:59 PM I am seeking advise ...but if I can be pointed to the right direction, I will be most appreciative. This summer, I plan to take down my Cellwave Station Master (repeater antenna) for service, maintenance or painting. Over the years, moss and algae set in and the bright white fiberglass finish is beginning to disappear. I seek advise on the following: 1. What cleaning agent would be best to take down foreign objects in the antenna 2. What paint if any...or preparation therof before application is neglegible in the optimum performance of this antenna. This antenna has served us well over the years. 3. Other recommendation. thanks chris Here is a file I picked up several years ago. Antenna Painting Instructions The following is courtesy Celwave This is what I received when I asked them for a recommendation of what to use in refinishing my 18 year old PD455 Celwave receives requests for advice about refinishing weathered antenna radomes or changing the radome color for aesthetic reasons. We do not take a position on any manufacturer's paint. However, Sherwin-Williams seems to make a product, which should be compatible with radomes and not interfere with the antenna's electrical performance. The following suggestions are not a substitute for detailed instructions and mix ratios provided by the paint manufacturer. RADOME MATERIAL (Standard Color) CELWAVE PRODUCT LINE 1. Spun Epoxy Fiberglass (Blue) Penetrator Antennas (AxR, BxR Series) 2. Polyester Impregnated Fiberglass (White) Stationmaster Antennas (PDxx Omni Series.) 3. Polyester Impregnated Fiberglass (Grey) FR CELlite Panel Antennas (AP18, 19 Series) 4. ASA (Grey) FR CELlite Panel Antennas (AP90 Series) 5. AES/ABS (White or Grey) US Panel Antennas (Other APxx Models) 6. Gel Coated Fiberglass Tubing (White) Marine Antennas (Cel-1, 3 etc.) Notes: FOR RADOME MATERIAL USE THIS FINISH #1, #2, #3 Primer and Top Coat #4, #5 Primer may be required (Top Coat retention may be tested with adhesive tape after paint dries) #6 Requires Pre-Treat (Acid Etch) to remove gloss, then Primer and Top Coat SHERWIN-WILLIAMS PRODUCTS: Etch P60G2 Wash Primer Primer D61H75 Polane 2.8 Plus Spray Fil Top Coat Polane Type HS 2.8 Plus Polyurethane SURFACE PREPARATION: Removal of surface contamination is normally accomplished by using an alcohol solvent, ethanol, propanol, isopropanol, or butanol. A ten percent solution of methyl ethyl ketone in water can also be used whenever stubborn oil or grease is encountered. APPLICATION PROCEDURES: Painting to be done indoors, as the uncured product is sensitive to moisture. Apply one coat of Polane 2.8 Plus Spray Fil D61H75 Primer. It is designed to fill and/or hide profile and surface imperfections on metal castings, structural foam, plastic and wood. Apply one coat of Polane HS 2.8 Plus Polyurethane Enamel Monochromatic Intermix Color System F63 Series. FOR FURTHER S-W PRODUCT INFORMATION CONTACT: Ralph Stadalman - Product Finishing Representative The Sherwin-Williams Company Chemical Coating Facility 3165 Tucker Road Bensalem, PA 19020 Voice = (215) 638-0104 Fax = (215) 638-1008 Rev: #5 10/05/98 DLS File: PAINT.doc End
Re: [Repeater-Builder] FCC Ruling on Repeater Definition
George Henry wrote: Federal Communications Commission Washington, D.C. 20554 March 23, 2009 DA 09-657 Mr. Gary R. Mitchell President, Northern California Packet Association P.O. Box K Sunnyvale, CA 94087 Re: Petition for Declaratory Ruling filed December 5, 2007 Dear Mr. Mitchell: This is in response to the petition for declaratory ruling that you filed on December 5, 2007, requesting that the Commission clarify the definition of a repeater in the amateur service rules. snip for brevity It's always good to see a Federal agency get it right!!! Jim WD8CHL
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: [DSTAR_DIGITAL] FCC Ruling on Repeater Definition
On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Eric Lemmon wrote: Perhaps it would serve the public interest better if the actual document were presented, rather than a copy of the text. See the attached. 5 The Commission revised the definition in order to clarify that certain accommodations for message forwarding systems do not apply to other operating activities such as repeaters and auxiliary stations. 6 The Commission proposed to define a repeater as [a]n amateur station that instantaneously retransmits the transmission of another amateur station on a different channel or channels, but ultimately replaced instantaneously with simultaneously because commenters noted 2. that there is always a small propagation delay through a repeater. 7 As one commenter explained, The word `simultaneously' in this case means that the repeater is receiving and transmitting concurrently, whereas each signal might be slightly displaced in time between receive and transmit. 8 To be able to repeat another station's transmission, a repeater must be able to receive a transmission from another station and retransmit it. Because the word simultaneously in the definition is used to modify retransmit, we believe it refers to a repeater station's transmitter being active when retransmitting the signal received by the repeater station's receiver from another amateur station. We conclude, therefore, that simultaneously as used in the definition of a repeater refers to the receiver and transmitter both being active at the same time. The only interesting wrinkle in this is that a linear transponder doesn't retransmit. The signal is never decoded to baseband and retransmitted. Or is it? With I+Q demodulation and remodulation, this could be a point of argument. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR Disinformation Analyst
