Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Huh... that is interesting. I haven't heard of a such thing. I'll see if it's allowed and if so I'll use it. On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 12:16 AM, Rob Landry 41001...@interpring.com wrote: If they scanned your computer they'd find no open ports, because the tunnel is an outbound connection. The actual open port would be on your home machine, but connections mae to it would go (through the tunnel) to your campus machine. I know this may sound peculiar but it does work. I have a Rivendell system hiding behind a firewall in North Carolina that appears to have no open ports, but the machine is accessible through a port on my computer here in Massachusetts. On Mon, 27 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: ...and that's what would make it not work. Campus does not allow ANY port to be open on any computers on their network. I can open SSH port on computer not located at college but not on the one that is at college. Almost. The port would be open on the campus computer, but ONLY for incoming requests made via the SSH tunnel from the other end. Nothing else ( even itself ) would be able to find it. ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Oh okay nvm I see what you're going at when it somes to SSH... I thought you meant have a port open on the campus computer... which wouldn't be permitted. But you're talking having a port open on the web server computer, am I correct? ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Well actually just Use SSH and just reverse tunnel port 80/stream/whatever normal ports you need from your moms house and tunnel them to your dorm PC. You can still run the whole thing over the tunnel. You can tell ssh what ports and where to tunnel them to. Since you initiated the tunnel outbound, and your moms computer is actually receiving the inbound connects your at least in the grey area with their terms. You can also run shorewall to ensure there are no incoming ports open IT can find. -- Don Russell, CBRE CBNT W9DRR - ARRL OES, Technical Specialist http://www.socialengineer.us On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio xana...@gmail.com wrote: Oh okay nvm I see what you're going at when it somes to SSH... I thought you meant have a port open on the campus computer... which wouldn't be permitted. But you're talking having a port open on the web server computer, am I correct? ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Alright here's what I've decided to try and do for a set up. This was suggested by my campus network security... as being the best option if it is possible. Please let me know if it is possible and how to do it. It's different from the original planned set up. Computer 1 located at my Mom's house: Will host both the web server AND rivendell server. It will contain everything, including the rivendell web interface and the music library. Computer 2 located at the college campus: Will be a rivendell client... able to perform operations on the rivendell server (any program, including rdadmin, rdlogedit, rdcatch, and rdairplay). ...and somewhere inside this set up will need to be the ability to stream the radio using Darkice to a third party streaming provider... and the college computer will need to be able to stream live from say a microphone to this third party. ...I heard about Samba server... would that work for a set up like this? If so, how do I start? ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
On Monday 27 February 2012 03:30:59 pm Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: ...I heard about Samba server... would that work for a set up like this? If so, how do I start? Samba is an implementation that pretends to be a Microsoft server, warts and all. It's purpose is to out wit Microsoft's deliberate incompatibility with anything they didn't get paid for. -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com Remember, drive defensively! And of course, the best defense is a good offense! ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Patrick, Please, don't ignore the Tyndale's advices. Did you compress the songs in the Rivendell Library using MP2, or are you using uncompressed WAVs? If you have uncompressed WAV files, you will need a VERY robust network connection between your mom's house and the college (maybe about 10 Mb/s) to get the files transferred in realtime from the Rivendell server to your computer in the college. This means that, in your mom's house, the UPSTREAM connection must be at least 10 Mb/s and your college should let you download data at this bitrate. If you compress all your Rivendell library to MP2, you'll need less bandwith (maybe 512 kb/s), but still it is a great bandwidth, and you'll be affected by the latency and other issues. Bye. 2012/2/27 Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio xana...@gmail.com Alright here's what I've decided to try and do for a set up. This was suggested by my campus network security... as being the best option if it is possible. Please let me know if it is possible and how to do it. It's different from the original planned set up. Computer 1 located at my Mom's house: Will host both the web server AND rivendell server. It will contain everything, including the rivendell web interface and the music library. Computer 2 located at the college campus: Will be a rivendell client... able to perform operations on the rivendell server (any program, including rdadmin, rdlogedit, rdcatch, and rdairplay). ...and somewhere inside this set up will need to be the ability to stream the radio using Darkice to a third party streaming provider... and the college computer will need to be able to stream live from say a microphone to this third party. ...I heard about Samba server... would that work for a set up like this? If so, how do I start? ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
...sorry but who's the Tyndale? Do you know of a batch converter or a way to convert automatically in Rivendell from WAV to MP2? I have a lot of cuts. ...the MP2 option will work... I can still do it... but like you said it will slow down my website badly... and I cannot afford any faster internet plan. On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:18 PM, Luigino Bracci lbra...@gmail.com wrote: Patrick, Please, don't ignore the Tyndale's advices. Did you compress the songs in the Rivendell Library using MP2, or are you using uncompressed WAVs? If you have uncompressed WAV files, you will need a VERY robust network connection between your mom's house and the college (maybe about 10 Mb/s) to get the files transferred in realtime from the Rivendell server to your computer in the college. This means that, in your mom's house, the UPSTREAM connection must be at least 10 Mb/s and your college should let you download data at this bitrate. If you compress all your Rivendell library to MP2, you'll need less bandwith (maybe 512 kb/s), but still it is a great bandwidth, and you'll be affected by the latency and other issues. Bye. 2012/2/27 Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio xana...@gmail.com Alright here's what I've decided to try and do for a set up. This was suggested by my campus network security... as being the best option if it is possible. Please let me know if it is possible and how to do it. It's different from the original planned set up. Computer 1 located at my Mom's house: Will host both the web server AND rivendell server. It will contain everything, including the rivendell web interface and the music library. Computer 2 located at the college campus: Will be a rivendell client... able to perform operations on the rivendell server (any program, including rdadmin, rdlogedit, rdcatch, and rdairplay). ...and somewhere inside this set up will need to be the ability to stream the radio using Darkice to a third party streaming provider... and the college computer will need to be able to stream live from say a microphone to this third party. ...I heard about Samba server... would that work for a set up like this? If so, how do I start? ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: ...also forgot to mention https port 443 is already being used for the website on my web computer, and so is port 80... both for the website. I don't think SSH would work then on the same port. It won't. If you really need both 80 and 443 for your Web site, you'll have to make ssh connections to a different port. The standard is 22. Try connecting to it from campus and see if it works. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: See, the deal is the music library for Rivendell MUST be located on the same computer that hosts the web server, otherwise I cannot upload music from my station website which I really need. I don't think I understand. How does one upload anything from a Web site? Unless you mean download... in which case the connection from your campus-located computer would be outbound not inbound. At one of my clients, the station Web site is hosted on a computer at the studio, but Rivendell runs at the transmitter site, with /var/snd on a local hard drive there. There is a second copy of Rivendell on a computer in the production studio with a copy of the audio library in /var/snd on a local hard drive there. A script wakes up every five minutes and scans the Rivendell CUTS table for changes; it then copies the corresponding audio file and the contents of the CUTS and CART table records to the Rvendell system at the transmitter site, where another script drops the audio file into /var/snd and updates the local CUTS and CART records. If I had to do this through a firewall that didn't allow inbound connections, I'd use a reverse SSH tunnel. I am doing that for two other clients. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
On Saturday 25 February 2012 10:21:30 am Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: Hello. I'm needing to make a quick and sudden change to my Rivendell setup since I'm moving away to college. My college will not permit the use of anything that listens for inbound connections on the internet network. Thus, I need to split my Rivendell setup from one to two computers... and I'm going to need help on how to do it and if it's possible. I'd look at PPP over SSH. In other words, a VPN, which setting up is well beyond the scope of this list. Google is your friend. -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com Machines certainly can solve problems, store information, correlate, and play games -- but not with pleasure. -- Leo Rosten ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
SSH connections I fear would probably also not be permitted at my college campus for fear they would think I'm either hacking a computer or using another computer to bypass their proxy. Rivendell 2 uses rdxport.cgi to import music, am I correct? It has to access this through an http tunnel I think... does it? Now, when people from the internet want to upload something to the station, they use a form which uses rdxport.cgi. Now, if the music library were located at the college campus computer, UH OH! Their firewall will block rdxport.cgi from being able to import the music onto my campus computer... for that would be considered an inbound connection (web server computer, which contains rdxport.cgi and the upload forms is requesting upload of the music to the campus computer) . Thus, the only other workaround is that the music library must be located at the same computer as the web server (thus rdxport.cgi would make no requests to the campus computer... it'd simply upload locally to the web server computer)... however the music still has to somehow be accessible from my campus computer in rdairplay. If rdairplay were to access the music from the webserver computer that would be a downstream connection (campus computer requests connection to web server computer)... which is permitted. I can draw a diagram of what I'm trying to explain if it helps. On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 12:40 PM, Cowboy c...@gwis.com wrote: On Saturday 25 February 2012 10:21:30 am Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: Hello. I'm needing to make a quick and sudden change to my Rivendell setup since I'm moving away to college. My college will not permit the use of anything that listens for inbound connections on the internet network. Thus, I need to split my Rivendell setup from one to two computers... and I'm going to need help on how to do it and if it's possible. I'd look at PPP over SSH. In other words, a VPN, which setting up is well beyond the scope of this list. Google is your friend. -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com Machines certainly can solve problems, store information, correlate, and play games -- but not with pleasure. -- Leo Rosten ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Hi Patrick How far is the campus computer from you home? If it's close enough disconnect it from the campus network... and set up a wireless network to your house... so essentially the station computer is on your home network. I've heard of high gain wireless networks going 2 or 3 kms (1 - 2 miles. Cheers Geoff On Sun, Feb 26, 2012 at 9:30 AM, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio xana...@gmail.com wrote: SSH connections I fear would probably also not be permitted at my college campus for fear they would think I'm either hacking a computer or using another computer to bypass their proxy. Rivendell 2 uses rdxport.cgi to import music, am I correct? It has to access this through an http tunnel I think... does it? Now, when people from the internet want to upload something to the station, they use a form which uses rdxport.cgi. Now, if the music library were located at the college campus computer, UH OH! Their firewall will block rdxport.cgi from being able to import the music onto my campus computer... for that would be considered an inbound connection (web server computer, which contains rdxport.cgi and the upload forms is requesting upload of the music to the campus computer) . Thus, the only other workaround is that the music library must be located at the same computer as the web server (thus rdxport.cgi would make no requests to the campus computer... it'd simply upload locally to the web server computer)... however the music still has to somehow be accessible from my campus computer in rdairplay. If rdairplay were to access the music from the webserver computer that would be a downstream connection (campus computer requests connection to web server computer)... which is permitted. I can draw a diagram of what I'm trying to explain if it helps. On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 12:40 PM, Cowboy c...@gwis.com wrote: On Saturday 25 February 2012 10:21:30 am Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: Hello. I'm needing to make a quick and sudden change to my Rivendell setup since I'm moving away to college. My college will not permit the use of anything that listens for inbound connections on the internet network. Thus, I need to split my Rivendell setup from one to two computers... and I'm going to need help on how to do it and if it's possible. I'd look at PPP over SSH. In other words, a VPN, which setting up is well beyond the scope of this list. Google is your friend. -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com Machines certainly can solve problems, store information, correlate, and play games -- but not with pleasure. -- Leo Rosten ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: SSH connections I fear would probably also not be permitted at my college campus for fear they would think I'm either hacking a computer or using another computer to bypass their proxy. If you can make outbound SSH connections from your campus, you can make a connection to your home machine that sets up a reverse SSH tunnel. For instance, you can make port 22 on your campus machine show up as port 1100 on your home machine; then when your home machine wants to connect to the campus one it makes a connection to localhost port 1100. I've been using this technioque for several months now, and while there are pitfalls -- for instance, the need to reestablish the connection if something breaks it -- I find it answers quite well. If you can't make outbound SSH connections on port 22, set your home machine to accept SSH connections on port 443. That port is unlikely to be blocked because it's the standard port for https. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
The campus will not permit ANY open ports on my computer there. I do have a wireless network but it is low power and I cannot afford a high power network, which unfortunately I will be more than 2 miles away from where the web server computer will be located (probably like 7-10 miles away). On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 6:54 PM, Rob Landry 41001...@interpring.com wrote: On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: SSH connections I fear would probably also not be permitted at my college campus for fear they would think I'm either hacking a computer or using another computer to bypass their proxy. If you can make outbound SSH connections from your campus, you can make a connection to your home machine that sets up a reverse SSH tunnel. For instance, you can make port 22 on your campus machine show up as port 1100 on your home machine; then when your home machine wants to connect to the campus one it makes a connection to localhost port 1100. I've been using this technioque for several months now, and while there are pitfalls -- for instance, the need to reestablish the connection if something breaks it -- I find it answers quite well. If you can't make outbound SSH connections on port 22, set your home machine to accept SSH connections on port 443. That port is unlikely to be blocked because it's the standard port for https. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
...also forgot to mention https port 443 is already being used for the website on my web computer, and so is port 80... both for the website. I don't think SSH would work then on the same port. On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 8:37 PM, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio xana...@gmail.com wrote: The campus will not permit ANY open ports on my computer there. I do have a wireless network but it is low power and I cannot afford a high power network, which unfortunately I will be more than 2 miles away from where the web server computer will be located (probably like 7-10 miles away). On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 6:54 PM, Rob Landry 41001...@interpring.com wrote: On Sat, 25 Feb 2012, Patrick Schmalstig / WRRJ Radio wrote: SSH connections I fear would probably also not be permitted at my college campus for fear they would think I'm either hacking a computer or using another computer to bypass their proxy. If you can make outbound SSH connections from your campus, you can make a connection to your home machine that sets up a reverse SSH tunnel. For instance, you can make port 22 on your campus machine show up as port 1100 on your home machine; then when your home machine wants to connect to the campus one it makes a connection to localhost port 1100. I've been using this technioque for several months now, and while there are pitfalls -- for instance, the need to reestablish the connection if something breaks it -- I find it answers quite well. If you can't make outbound SSH connections on port 22, set your home machine to accept SSH connections on port 443. That port is unlikely to be blocked because it's the standard port for https. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Is it possible to have a 2-computer Rivendell setup like this?
Hi, The big thing I'd worry about is network latency and potential downtime if something goes wrong - to do what you're proposing is going to require quite a bit of bandwidth to go from your studio to your music library computer. Especially if you're going over the public Internet, and going through campus firewalls, would there be enough bandwidth with a fast enough connection on each end for a reliable connection to be able to play your audio files consistently? And even if it is fast enough, what happens if part way through playing audio you suddenly lose that connection - a DSL or Cable modem gets unplugged or loses power, the campus firewall sees the activity and closes those connections, a router on the public internet dies and traffic ends up suddenly going over a different route, etc etc. If it were me I'd go on the side of caution and have the music library on the same network as the playout machine - whether that's on the actual playout machine or on another machine connected to the same network. If it were me what I'd do is have the music library on the studio computer (or at least on another computer within the radio station on the same network preferably plugged into the same switch). On the web server - unless there's some other need to run Rivendell I'd avoid running it. I'd put together a web page page which would simply allow people to upload files to the web server and it would dump the files into a generic protected storage area on that server. On the studio / Rivendell machine I'd write a script which would go out to the web server machine, log into the protected area (WGET, FTP, SFTP. VPN over SSH, or anything like that - take your pick), download any files which have been uploaded and then dump them into a dropbox, delete the files after they'd been downloaded. Then I'd schedule the script through CRON to run however often want it to run each day. It wouldn't give the instantaneous result of someone uploading a file to the website and having it automagically appear in the Rivendell database, but if someone did upload a file you know it would appear after the next scheduled download of that file from the web server machine (for example if you scheduled the script to run every hour, then I'd know if I uploaded a file at 3:30, it would end up in the Rivendell database just after 4:00) By taking this approach you'd be avoiding potential issues with your campus firewall and also potentially upsetting the campus IT people since all connections to your web server would be outbound. You'd also eliminate the problems that could occur with network latency if you were trying to mount the share across the internet. Anyways, those are just some thoughts. Lorne Tyndale Now, when people from the internet want to upload something to the station, they use a form which uses rdxport.cgi. Now, if the music library were located at the college campus computer, UH OH! Their firewall will block rdxport.cgi from being able to import the music onto my campus computer... for that would be considered an inbound connection (web server computer, which contains rdxport.cgi and the upload forms is requesting upload of the music to the campus computer) . Thus, the only other workaround is that the music library must be located at the same computer as the web server (thus rdxport.cgi would ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://lists.rivendellaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
