Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I feel you, man...Sorry for the late comment, but I have the same feelings when I watch the docs on the marine's Pacific campaigns with no mention of the black marines who did there fair share of fighting in that war... --- On Sat, 6/27/09, votomguy wrote: From: votomguy Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, June 27, 2009, 10:39 AM I have Brothers in Arms. :) I'm a little sick of the Tuskgee Airmen tho. Too many of our folk only know them. I'm surprised you forgot the 92nd infantry Division. I have their unit patch as well as the unit patch of the 555th. They were the first Smoke Jumpers. Also the 555th was folded into the Screaming Eagles during the Vietnam War. I've met several of those guys. You should see their faces light up when you ask them about being a paratrooper. I always get pissed when I see D-Day landings with all white troops. **shudder** And I know about the 9th and 10th. Especially the 10th as they fought alongside the infamous Roughriders, but pretty much had to take Roosevelt under their wing as they were the only unit in the Spanish American War that had combat experience. Sorry got a little carried away there, but when you look at the fact that blacks have been fighting for this country before it was a country (cough, cough 7 Years War cough). ok I'll try to behave now --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > You have hit my passion...Blacks in WWII. Since my dad was on a few ships > during the War, > including the USS Colorado, and the Ajax, and he was in the Philippine > campaign, I developed > a passion for books about how Blacks were treated. I'm sure I don't have to > tell you about the 761st Tank > Battalion and General Patton, or the 9th and 10th Cavalry, or the 555th > (Triple Nickle) Paratrooper battalion... > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com] On > Behalf Of votomguy > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:52 AM > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the > books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ > military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main > character (real characters not cheeseballs) . I took to studying the Black > presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general > (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I > would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way > towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my > favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do > they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2% 40yahoogroups. com> ups.com, > Milton Davis wrote: > > > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > > > > From: votomguy > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2% 40yahoogroups. com> ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article > (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books > because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never > publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom > simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > wrote: > > > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will > set > > > up book > > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > > Women, and > > > even try to get the to read some of Ms.
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
No problem. It's all good. --- On Sat, 6/27/09, wlro...@aol.com wrote: From: wlro...@aol.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, June 27, 2009, 4:37 AM OK I know I am late, but please forgive, I did not know you were an author. --Lavender From: Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:38 PM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I got a bit of advice from a writer friend of mine.He told me my audience was anyone who reads. He told me don't tell them my book is either science fiction or fantasy, just tell them what it's about. Get them into the story, not the genre. It's worked pretty well so far. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Reece Jennings wrote: From: Reece Jennings Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 7:36 PM It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set up book clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black Women, and even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to pre-judge and reject without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course.. I think a lot of women are cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be because black females read a lot more than we brothers. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 >From : "Reece Jennings" To : I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans.. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
PS: My bus company driver number is 555... _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Reece Jennings Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 12:01 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I LOVE your zeal, my friend, and I love that our family here has indulged my passion. I knew about the 92nd, but I left them out because I couldn't remember the exact unit, and I was trying to be a little brief. Also, the AlCan highway and the Black Engineers... _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of votomguy Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 11:39 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I have Brothers in Arms. :) I'm a little sick of the Tuskgee Airmen tho. Too many of our folk only know them. I'm surprised you forgot the 92nd infantry Division. I have their unit patch as well as the unit patch of the 555th. They were the first Smoke Jumpers. Also the 555th was folded into the Screaming Eagles during the Vietnam War. I've met several of those guys. You should see their faces light up when you ask them about being a paratrooper. I always get pissed when I see D-Day landings with all white troops. **shudder** And I know about the 9th and 10th. Especially the 10th as they fought alongside the infamous Roughriders, but pretty much had to take Roosevelt under their wing as they were the only unit in the Spanish American War that had combat experience. Sorry got a little carried away there, but when you look at the fact that blacks have been fighting for this country before it was a country (cough, cough 7 Years War cough). ok I'll try to behave now --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > You have hit my passion...Blacks in WWII. Since my dad was on a few ships > during the War, > including the USS Colorado, and the Ajax, and he was in the Philippine > campaign, I developed > a passion for books about how Blacks were treated. I'm sure I don't have to > tell you about the 761st Tank > Battalion and General Patton, or the 9th and 10th Cavalry, or the 555th > (Triple Nickle) Paratrooper battalion... > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com] On > Behalf Of votomguy > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:52 AM > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the > books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ > military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main > character (real characters not cheeseballs). I took to studying the Black > presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general > (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I > would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way > towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my > favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do > they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, > Milton Davis wrote: > > > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > > > > From: votomguy > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article > (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books > because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they nev
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I LOVE your zeal, my friend, and I love that our family here has indulged my passion. I knew about the 92nd, but I left them out because I couldn't remember the exact unit, and I was trying to be a little brief. Also, the AlCan highway and the Black Engineers... _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of votomguy Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 11:39 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I have Brothers in Arms. :) I'm a little sick of the Tuskgee Airmen tho. Too many of our folk only know them. I'm surprised you forgot the 92nd infantry Division. I have their unit patch as well as the unit patch of the 555th. They were the first Smoke Jumpers. Also the 555th was folded into the Screaming Eagles during the Vietnam War. I've met several of those guys. You should see their faces light up when you ask them about being a paratrooper. I always get pissed when I see D-Day landings with all white troops. **shudder** And I know about the 9th and 10th. Especially the 10th as they fought alongside the infamous Roughriders, but pretty much had to take Roosevelt under their wing as they were the only unit in the Spanish American War that had combat experience. Sorry got a little carried away there, but when you look at the fact that blacks have been fighting for this country before it was a country (cough, cough 7 Years War cough). ok I'll try to behave now --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > You have hit my passion...Blacks in WWII. Since my dad was on a few ships > during the War, > including the USS Colorado, and the Ajax, and he was in the Philippine > campaign, I developed > a passion for books about how Blacks were treated. I'm sure I don't have to > tell you about the 761st Tank > Battalion and General Patton, or the 9th and 10th Cavalry, or the 555th > (Triple Nickle) Paratrooper battalion... > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com] On > Behalf Of votomguy > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:52 AM > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the > books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ > military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main > character (real characters not cheeseballs). I took to studying the Black > presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general > (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I > would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way > towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my > favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do > they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, > Milton Davis wrote: > > > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > > > > From: votomguy > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article > (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books > because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never > publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom > simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > wrote: > > > > > > It might be a combination
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I have Brothers in Arms. :) I'm a little sick of the Tuskgee Airmen tho. Too many of our folk only know them. I'm surprised you forgot the 92nd infantry Division. I have their unit patch as well as the unit patch of the 555th. They were the first Smoke Jumpers. Also the 555th was folded into the Screaming Eagles during the Vietnam War. I've met several of those guys. You should see their faces light up when you ask them about being a paratrooper. I always get pissed when I see D-Day landings with all white troops. **shudder** And I know about the 9th and 10th. Especially the 10th as they fought alongside the infamous Roughriders, but pretty much had to take Roosevelt under their wing as they were the only unit in the Spanish American War that had combat experience. Sorry got a little carried away there, but when you look at the fact that blacks have been fighting for this country before it was a country (cough, cough 7 Years War cough). ok I'll try to behave now --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > You have hit my passion...Blacks in WWII. Since my dad was on a few ships > during the War, > including the USS Colorado, and the Ajax, and he was in the Philippine > campaign, I developed > a passion for books about how Blacks were treated. I'm sure I don't have to > tell you about the 761st Tank > Battalion and General Patton, or the 9th and 10th Cavalry, or the 555th > (Triple Nickle) Paratrooper battalion... > > > _ > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of votomguy > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:52 AM > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the > books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ > military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main > character (real characters not cheeseballs). I took to studying the Black > presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general > (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I > would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way > towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my > favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do > they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, > Milton Davis wrote: > > > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > > > > From: votomguy > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article > (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books > because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never > publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom > simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > wrote: > > > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will > set > > > up book > > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > > Women, and > > > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > > > pre-judge and reject > > > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I > think > > > a lot of women are > > > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > > > > > > > _ > > > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
OK I know I am late, but please forgive, I did not know you were an author.
--Lavender
From: Milton Davis
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:38 PM
To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi
press?
I got a bit of advice from a writer friend of mine.He told me my audience
was anyone who reads. He told me don't tell them my book is either science
fiction or fantasy, just tell them what it's about. Get them into the story,
not the genre. It's worked pretty well so far.
--- On Thu, 6/25/09, Reece Jennings wrote:
From: Reece Jennings
Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in
mainstream sci-fi press?
To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 7:36 PM
It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women
will set up book
clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black
Women, and
even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to
pre-judge and reject
without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course.. I
think a lot of women are
cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF.
From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com]
On Behalf Of Milton Davis
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM
To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in
mainstream sci-fi press?
I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my
experience most of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that
might be because black females read a lot more than we brothers.
--- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter
wrote:
From: Martin Baxter
Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in
mainstream sci-fi press?
To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM
That comprises a graduating class of considerable note.
-[ Received Mail Content ]--
Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler
underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400
From : "Reece Jennings"
To :
I love her. She's my favorite because of the social
aspect of her writing.
I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!)
Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might
have something to do
with it! :o)
_
From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@
yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Milton Davis
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM
To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler
underrated in mainstream
sci-fi press?
I know plenty young black science fiction fans that
credit Octavia Butler as
the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old
school science
fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and
Ellision. I like
Butler's work, but I consider it more social science
fiction. She deals more
with relationships and issues rather than the technical
aspect of science
fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think
that's the reason
her prose seems to have special appeal to black female
science fiction fans.
I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say
I'm a fan. She was a
greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her
respect among the
sci/fi elite if not the mainstream.
--- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote:
From: B. Smith
Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler
underrated in mainstream
sci-fi press?
To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM
She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as
the legendary hard
sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary
side of the genre and
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
You have hit my passion...Blacks in WWII. Since my dad was on a few ships during the War, including the USS Colorado, and the Ajax, and he was in the Philippine campaign, I developed a passion for books about how Blacks were treated. I'm sure I don't have to tell you about the 761st Tank Battalion and General Patton, or the 9th and 10th Cavalry, or the 555th (Triple Nickle) Paratrooper battalion... _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of votomguy Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:52 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main character (real characters not cheeseballs). I took to studying the Black presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. --- In scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm right. > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > From: votomguy > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro <mailto:scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set > > up book > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > Women, and > > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > > pre-judge and reject > > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > > a lot of women are > > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > > > > _ > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com] On > > Behalf Of Milton Davis > > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most > > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 > > From : "Reece Jennings" > > To : > > > > I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing.. > > I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) > > > > Of course, we are both 1947 Ca
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
Thanks. The story certainly looks interesting. It's just made my wishlist. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > There's a brother at blacksciencefictionsociety.com named Ronald T. Jones > that writes excellent military sci/fi. I have his book Chronicle Of The > Vindicator. He's currently submitting manuscripts to publishers. You should > Chronicles if you get a chance. > > --- On Fri, 6/26/09, votomguy wrote: > > > From: votomguy > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Friday, June 26, 2009, 2:52 PM > > > > > > > > > True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the > books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ > military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main > character (real characters not cheeseballs) . I took to studying the Black > presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general > (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I > would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way > towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my > favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do > they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > > right. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > > > > From: votomguy > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this > > was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because > > black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the > > books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that > > maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > > wrote: > > > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will > > > set > > > up book > > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > > Women, and > > > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > > > pre-judge and reject > > > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > > > a lot of women are > > > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > > > > > > > _ > > > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogro ups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Milton Davis > > > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience > > > most > > > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > > > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > > sci-fi press? > > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > > > > > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > > >
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
There's a brother at blacksciencefictionsociety.com named Ronald T. Jones that writes excellent military sci/fi. I have his book Chronicle Of The Vindicator. He's currently submitting manuscripts to publishers. You should Chronicles if you get a chance. --- On Fri, 6/26/09, votomguy wrote: From: votomguy Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, June 26, 2009, 2:52 PM True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main character (real characters not cheeseballs) . I took to studying the Black presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > From: votomguy > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this > was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because > black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the > books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that > maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > wrote: > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set > > up book > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > Women, and > > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > > pre-judge and reject > > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > > a lot of women are > > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogro ups.com] On > > Behalf Of Milton Davis > > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most > > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 > > From : "Reece Jennings" > > To : > > > > I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing.. > > I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) > > > > Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do > > with it! :o) > > > > > > _ > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups.
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
True. I love the hard science/ military scifi books so those were always the books that I looked for. I got tired of not being able to find hard science/ military scifi books writen by blacks or that have blacks as the main character (real characters not cheeseballs). I took to studying the Black presence in WWII and I picked up a couple of books. Alot of males in general (hey let's face it white guys don't read as much as everybody thinks). I would love to see another book like Dark Matter come out. It went along way towards pointing me to Black scifi writers. I always took solace in my favorite comic writers (Dwayne McDuffie and Christopher Priest). Not only do they write comics, but they also write comics I can read. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have > sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all > women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm > confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing > more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced > that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm > right. > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: > > > From: votomguy > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM > > > > > > > > > Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this > was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because > black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the > books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that > maybe publishers don't want black men to read. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" > wrote: > > > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set > > up book > > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > > Women, and > > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > > pre-judge and reject > > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > > a lot of women are > > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > > > > _ > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com] On > > Behalf Of Milton Davis > > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most > > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 > > From : "Reece Jennings" > > To : > > > > I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing.. > > I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) > > > > Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do > > with it! :o) > > > > > > _ > > > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On > > Behalf Of Milton Davis > > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM > > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > > > > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school scie
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I got a bit of advice from a writer friend of mine.He told me my audience was anyone who reads. He told me don't tell them my book is either science fiction or fantasy, just tell them what it's about. Get them into the story, not the genre. It's worked pretty well so far. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Reece Jennings wrote: From: Reece Jennings Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 7:36 PM It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set up book clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black Women, and even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to pre-judge and reject without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think a lot of women are cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be because black females read a lot more than we brothers. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. -[ Received Mail Content ]------ Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 >From : "Reece Jennings" To : I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans.. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I do book signings at least once a month. The majority of the books I have sold have been to black women. I did a book club meeting last year, all women. I have a book club meeting sheduled in August, all women. I'm confident I'll find more black men willing to read my books and I am seeing more interest among the brothers, especially the young ones. I'm convinced that when made aware of what's available the brothers will come. I hope I'm right. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: From: votomguy Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 9:07 PM Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set > up book > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > Women, and > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > pre-judge and reject > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > a lot of women are > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com] On > Behalf Of Milton Davis > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 > From : "Reece Jennings" > To : > > I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing.. > I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) > > Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do > with it! :o) > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On > Behalf Of Milton Davis > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like > Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more > > with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science > fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason > her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. > > I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a > greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the > sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro > > ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > of the
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
Before the hiphop/street novel craze, my mom told me about an article (this was in the 90s) that said that Publishers refuse to publish books because black men don't read enough. To which I replied, "If they never publish the books then how will we ever find anything to read." My mom simply said that maybe publishers don't want black men to read. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, "Reece Jennings" wrote: > > It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set > up book > clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black > Women, and > even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to > pre-judge and reject > without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think > a lot of women are > cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. > > > _ > > From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Milton Davis > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most > of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be > because black females read a lot more than we brothers. > > --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: > > > > > From: Martin Baxter > Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM > > > That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 > From : "Reece Jennings" > To : > > I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. > I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) > > Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do > with it! :o) > > > _ > > From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On > Behalf Of Milton Davis > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > > > > > > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like > Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more > > with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science > fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason > her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. > > I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a > greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the > sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro > > ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the > > week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro > > ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? > v=JQdwk8Yntds > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds >
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
It might be a combination of all of that, Milton. Yes, Black Women will set up book clubs, and discuss books, etc. But when I mention Sci-Fi to most Black Women, and even try to get the to read some of Ms. Butler's books, they tend to pre-judge and reject without looking. So I keep it to myself...except here, of course. I think a lot of women are cutting off a vast expanse of great reading by pre-judging SF. _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 1:38 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be because black females read a lot more than we brothers. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 >From : "Reece Jennings" To : I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I know a lot a black male fans of Butler. I just seems in my experience most of her fans I've met were black females. But then again that might be because black females read a lot more than we brothers. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:37 PM That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 >From : "Reece Jennings" To : I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
Frank Hebert's Dune was the first science fiction novel that made me saw 'wow!' I was a big Philip Jose Farmer fan, and I like the Conan series, not necessarily Robert E. Howard. I liked the Elric novels, too. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 4:16 PM When I first came into fandom back in '74, my public library had barely 300 SF/fantasy books on the shelves, the vast majority were British SF writers (because the associate librarian who gave herself the job of stocking the section came from Oxfordshire) . I learned the trade from Moorcock, Aldiss, Brunner and Stapledon, though I count Zelazny as my primary influence. -[ Received Mail Content ]---------- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:22:09 - >From : "votomguy" To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com She wasn't what got me into scifi, but she did inspire me to start writing scifi. I remember my mom bringing home Adulthood Rites for me and being so excited that there were actually black people that wrote scifi. Adulthood Rites was the only book that she wrote. (what can I say I cut my scifi teeth on Battletech Novels) She did inspire me to believe that black people could not only write scifi, but get it published as well. While her style of scifi may not be my cup of tea, that doesn't stop me from including her in the greats. I can't stand Assimov (I think he's a little overrated) but he's up there. At least, Octavia Butler never got too full of herself. (cough cough Heinlein cough) --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's > work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with > relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, > which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose > seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed > everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater > writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite > if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > > > > > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of > > the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
Assimov's short stories were much better than his novels. As far as science fiction novels, I never doubted that black people could write them; I always asked myself why weren't we writing them. Then I was introduced to the business of publishing and discovered why. --- On Thu, 6/25/09, votomguy wrote: From: votomguy Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, June 25, 2009, 2:22 PM She wasn't what got me into scifi, but she did inspire me to start writing scifi. I remember my mom bringing home Adulthood Rites for me and being so excited that there were actually black people that wrote scifi. Adulthood Rites was the only book that she wrote. (what can I say I cut my scifi teeth on Battletech Novels) She did inspire me to believe that black people could not only write scifi, but get it published as well. While her style of scifi may not be my cup of tea, that doesn't stop me from including her in the greats. I can't stand Assimov (I think he's a little overrated) but he's up there. At least, Octavia Butler never got too full of herself. (cough cough Heinlein cough) --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's > work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with > relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, > which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose > seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed > everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater > writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite > if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > > > > > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" > wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of > > the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > > >
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
That comprises a graduating class of considerable note. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:22:52 -0400 From : "Reece Jennings" To : I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I love her. She's my favorite because of the social aspect of her writing. I've been a Black Male all say (peeking to make sure!) Of course, we are both 1947 Cancerians, so that might have something to do with it! :o) _ From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Milton Davis Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:32 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro <http://us.mc459.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro <http://us.mc459.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=scifinoir2%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds> v=JQdwk8Yntds >
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
When I first came into fandom back in '74, my public library had barely 300 SF/fantasy books on the shelves, the vast majority were British SF writers (because the associate librarian who gave herself the job of stocking the section came from Oxfordshire). I learned the trade from Moorcock, Aldiss, Brunner and Stapledon, though I count Zelazny as my primary influence. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? Date : Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:22:09 - From : "votomguy" To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com She wasn't what got me into scifi, but she did inspire me to start writing scifi. I remember my mom bringing home Adulthood Rites for me and being so excited that there were actually black people that wrote scifi. Adulthood Rites was the only book that she wrote. (what can I say I cut my scifi teeth on Battletech Novels) She did inspire me to believe that black people could not only write scifi, but get it published as well. While her style of scifi may not be my cup of tea, that doesn't stop me from including her in the greats. I can't stand Assimov (I think he's a little overrated) but he's up there. At least, Octavia Butler never got too full of herself. (cough cough Heinlein cough) --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's > work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with > relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, > which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose > seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed > everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater > writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite > if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > > > > > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of > > the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
She wasn't what got me into scifi, but she did inspire me to start writing scifi. I remember my mom bringing home Adulthood Rites for me and being so excited that there were actually black people that wrote scifi. Adulthood Rites was the only book that she wrote. (what can I say I cut my scifi teeth on Battletech Novels) She did inspire me to believe that black people could not only write scifi, but get it published as well. While her style of scifi may not be my cup of tea, that doesn't stop me from including her in the greats. I can't stand Assimov (I think he's a little overrated) but he's up there. At least, Octavia Butler never got too full of herself. (cough cough Heinlein cough) --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's > work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with > relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, > which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose > seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed > everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater > writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite > if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > > > > > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" > wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of > > the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > > >
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I totally agree with your assessment. I consider Octavia Butler one of the foremost practictioner of a new genre I call "Social Economic" fiction, or SE. SE is also the field I dabble in. ~rave! http://twitter.com/ravenadal http://theworldebon.blogspot.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Milton Davis wrote: > > I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as > the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science > fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's > work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with > relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, > which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose > seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed > everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater > writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite > if not the mainstream. > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: > > > From: B. Smith > Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream > sci-fi press? > To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM > > > > > > > > > She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard > sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in > some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. > > --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" > wrote: > > > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter > > of the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, > > they've become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of > > the week than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the > > SF/fantasy shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. > > Nine times out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is > > solely by what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be > > that easy, even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > > > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > > > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi > press? > > > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > > > From : George Arterberry > > > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds > > >
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
I know plenty young black science fiction fans that credit Octavia Butler as the beacon that led them to science fiction. I'm an old school science fiction fan, raised on Assimov, Delany, Herbert and Ellision. I like Butler's work, but I consider it more social science fiction. She deals more with relationships and issues rather than the technical aspect of science fiction, which we all know gets more attention. I think that's the reason her prose seems to have special appeal to black female science fiction fans. I enjoyed everything I've read by her but I can't say I'm a fan. She was a greater writer than I'll probably ever be and got her respect among the sci/fi elite if not the mainstream. --- On Wed, 6/24/09, B. Smith wrote: From: B. Smith Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 1:19 AM She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of > the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've > become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week > than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy > shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times > out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by > what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, > even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > >From : George Arterberry > To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds >
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press?
She's highly regarded but not given the same respect as the legendary hard sci-fi types. Her work falls into the more literary side of the genre and in some ways she was more highly regarded outside the genre. --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, "Martin Baxter" wrote: > > George, it's possible, but I see her lack of props as being more a matter of > the mainstream SF press not knowing what the frell it's doing. IMO, they've > become like the music industry, more interested in the flavor of the week > than actual decent work. When I go to the bookstore and browse the SF/fantasy > shelves, the stuff I see is so derivative as to be embarrassing. Nine times > out of ten, I can figure out what the story inside the covers is solely by > what pose the characters on the cover are striking. Shouldn't be that easy, > even for a guy with my brain. > > > > > -[ Received Mail Content ]-- > Subject : [scifinoir2] Is Octavia Butler underrated in mainstream sci-fi press? > Date : Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:10:06 -0700 (PDT) > From : George Arterberry > To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com > > > I've rarely seen her represented in so-called mainstream press. > > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds >
