Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
Absolutely nothing, or hundreds of our stand-ins would have issues :) Absolutely nothing for the static kine state either, since for years we've used compensation tricks changing that in unison to transform changes. There are a lot of this with that can make bad things happen that are borderline superstitious, but barring the odd bug here and there over the years I've yet to see something that couldn't be explained by the user misunderstanding or misusing features or properties. Skinning and related properties in Soft are by far some of the most solid and transparent out there. On Thu, Oct 31, 2013 at 7:54 AM, Eric Thivierge ethivie...@hybride.comwrote: I think he's referring to the Static_KineState transforms. Out of curiosity, what bad things can happen from neutral poses on meshes and deformers? Skinning uses the global xfo for calculations so the neutral pose has no affect on that.
Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the "rest shape" of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! --
Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
If your nulls have moved since you initially did the bind yes. Select the mesh Envelope Reset Actor. Watch for a shift of one of the nulls. One probably has moved for some reason. If your nulls are in a good place where you want them, you can use the current positions of the nulls for the bind pose but selecting all of them and doing a Envelope Set Reference Pose. On Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:35:17 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the rest shape of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! --
RE: Envelope Operator funkyness
Yes, also you may have inadvertently moved the 'center' (Button top right) of the skin element after the mute. Reset the center if that the case. Also, doing a “set reference poses” should alleviate this, I think you must do it on the deformers (bone elements) and skin. Save ur scene first;) -manny -Original Message- From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Thivierge Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:40 PM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Envelope Operator funkyness If your nulls have moved since you initially did the bind yes. Select the mesh Envelope Reset Actor. Watch for a shift of one of the nulls. One probably has moved for some reason. If your nulls are in a good place where you want them, you can use the current positions of the nulls for the bind pose but selecting all of them and doing a Envelope Set Reference Pose. On Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:35:17 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the rest shape of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! -- attachment: winmail.dat
RE: Envelope Operator funkyness
Check to see if you're using the 'approximated' envelope operator which skips some calculations. Matt From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sergio Mucino Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 1:35 PM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Envelope Operator funkyness Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! [cid:image001.gif@01CED576.663BDEE0] On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the rest shape of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! -- [cid:image001.gif@01CED576.663BDEE0] inline: image001.gif
Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
Transforms stored in the nulls?...do you mean neutral pose? if so remove those, neutral pose is not meant for meshes or deformers as bad things can happen. Some TDs don't like them at all, but I find they work just fine on icon controls. On Wed, Oct 30, 2013 at 3:46 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com wrote: Check to see if you’re using the ‘approximated’ envelope operator which skips some calculations. ** ** Matt ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Sergio Mucino *Sent:* Wednesday, October 30, 2013 1:35 PM *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com *Subject:* Re: Envelope Operator funkyness ** ** Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the rest shape of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! -- -- -=T=- image001.gif
Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
Thanks a lot guys! Set Reference Pose fixed it. I'm not sure how the pose could have changed, since as I said, these nulls are created by a script, and they are cluster constrained to a mesh, so I would not be able to move them. Anyway, the problem seems to be gone. Great! One more new thing learned today :-) . Cheers! On 30/10/2013 4:44 PM, Manny Papamanos wrote: Yes, also you may have inadvertently moved the 'center' (Button top right) of the skin element after the mute. Reset the center if that the case. Also, doing a “set reference poses” should alleviate this, I think you must do it on the deformers (bone elements) and skin. Save ur scene first;) -manny -Original Message- From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Thivierge Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:40 PM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Envelope Operator funkyness If your nulls have moved since you initially did the bind yes. Select the mesh Envelope Reset Actor. Watch for a shift of one of the nulls. One probably has moved for some reason. If your nulls are in a good place where you want them, you can use the current positions of the nulls for the bind pose but selecting all of them and doing a Envelope Set Reference Pose. On Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:35:17 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the "rest shape" of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! --
Re: Envelope Operator funkyness
I think he's referring to the Static_KineState transforms. Out of curiosity, what bad things can happen from neutral poses on meshes and deformers? Skinning uses the global xfo for calculations so the neutral pose has no affect on that. On Wednesday, October 30, 2013 4:52:27 PM, Eric Turman wrote: Transforms stored in the nulls?...do you mean neutral pose? if so remove those, neutral pose is not meant for meshes or deformers as bad things can happen. Some TDs don't like them at all, but I find they work just fine on icon controls. On Wed, Oct 30, 2013 at 3:46 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com mailto:ml...@carbinestudios.com wrote: Check to see if you’re using the ‘approximated’ envelope operator which skips some calculations. __ __ Matt __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ *From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Sergio Mucino *Sent:* Wednesday, October 30, 2013 1:35 PM *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com *Subject:* Re: Envelope Operator funkyness __ __ Taking a closer look, this is happening when I do the mesh binding. The mesh shifts a bit right away (no need to go through the weights editing step). Could it be related to transforms stored in the nulls I'm using to deform the mesh? I don't see how something like this could have been introduced, since all nulls were created by a script... anyway, just exploring all the options. Thanks for any help! On 30/10/2013 4:29 PM, Sergio Mucino wrote: I'm seeing something a little bit odd, and I was wondering if it was normal, or if someone else had seen it before. I've got a quite complex mesh that I'm enveloping to a set of nulls. Everything is ok. I then do a Smooth Envelope Weights on the mesh, and then maybe tweak some weights using the Edit Weights table. Once I'm done, if I take the Envelope operator and mute it/unmute it, I can see the verts of the mesh shift positions. Sometimes (on other meshes) its by a super tiny bit. Other times (as in this mesh) it is more noticeable. I was wondering why this would be. Am I doing something that somehow disturbs the rest shape of the mesh stored by the operator (if it is that way how it works)? Can this cause problems down the road? Can it be prevented? Thanks for any comments! -- -- -=T=-
