Re: Table Top machining
In a message dated 11/13/2000 7:16:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I bought a used Bridgeport mill even though it cost 25% more than new Asian mills. I know I can sell the Bridgeport for what I paid ten years from now. Clark, You are right on target with this comment! In fact I would turn down TWICE what I paid for my used Bridgeport purchased over ten years ago. I could never replace it for that amount. Good tools, well maintained are always a good investment and a pleasure to use. I used to think that Jet tools were somehow inferior to American made equipment. But now that I have owned them, I am very pleased with their accuracy, and quality. The only suggestion that I would make concerns cleaning them when they arrive. I helped a friend set up his new 9" swing Jet lathe and found that it had been well covered with a preservative for it's ocean voyage. This muck was everywhere, including the interior of the carriage. A complete dismantling and solvent cleaning removed the much and a fair amount of metal chips and shavings, left from it's manufacture. It is now a very reliable and vibrationless tool. A good cleaning, and care in set up are required with any tool purchhase, and you'll learn all about your machine if you've had it apart! Keith Taylor
Re: Messages keep bouncing
In a message dated 11/13/2000 7:16:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I bought a used Bridgeport mill even though it cost 25% more than new Asian mills. I know I can sell the Bridgeport for what I paid ten years from now. Clark, You are right on target with this comment! In fact I would turn down TWICE what I paid for my used Bridgeport purchased over ten years ago. I could never replace it for that amount. Good tools, well maintained are always a good investment and a pleasure to use. I used to think that Jet tools were somehow inferior to American made equipment. But now that I have owned them, I am very pleased with their accuracy, and quality. The only suggestion that I would make concerns cleaning them when they arrive. I helped a friend set up his new 9" swing Jet lathe and found that it had been well covered with a preservative for it's ocean voyage. This muck was everywhere, including the interior of the carriage. A complete dismantling and solvent cleaning removed the much and a fair amount of metal chips and shavings, left from it's manufacture. It is now a very reliable and vibrationless tool. A good cleaning, and care in set up are required with any tool purchhase, and you'll learn all about your machine if you've had it apart! Keith Taylor
Re: Old #201(Now Forney)
In a message dated 10/6/2000 4:55:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: To me at least, I can tell you if it's a Forney, but I'd have to look at it first. :] If it's a 2-4-4, it aint a Forney. Irrespective of what others may say, a TRUE Forney is either a 0-4-4, or an 0-6-4, period. Those are the wheel arrangements patented by Mathias Forney for use on elevated railways. Anything with a pilot truck is a modified Forney type. The Bedford and Billerica Forneys are avtually 4-4-0's!!! They were built to be run tank first! When they were sold to the Sandy River RR, in Maine, they were converted to run boiler first and then run as 0-4-4's. After their conversion, they were much harder on tracks, but at least the Engineer could now see where he was going! Keith Taylor
Re: Loco blower
In a message dated 9/27/2000 10:08:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't want to get technical, but aren't the fans used to "get steam up" really suckers, not blowers? The blowers are part of the locomotive, bleeding off steam pressure to create draught through the flues until exhaust takes over this function. : ) Hi Royce; You can refer to them either way. The blower that is part of the engine works by creating a partial vacumm in the smoke box by exhausting steam through a venturi. It is, in fact, sucking the fire from the fire box, just as a stack blower will do. Both electric suction fans and steam blowers do the same thing. When you put your hand near the stack it blows hot fire box gases into your hand. And both have used suction to accomplish this. The "Suckers" are us who buy these wonderful toys! Keith Taylor
Re: Age
In a message dated 9/22/2000 2:45:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wonder why that is?? I used to know the answer to that, but I forgot??? Keith
Re: Gordon's Sloppy Coat Tails
In a message dated 9/17/2000 5:46:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The real question is, how did Lunk know the tornado alert was just being issued when he woke me up? Dogs are VERY sensitive to air pressure drops! Since getting our little mutt from the dog pound, we don't need the weather channel any more. Our little guy can even tell when my daily nap is over, whether or not I agree. He doesn't seem to like the steamers at all, and he has a fit when I fire up the old Indian Motorcycle! Keith T. In the Maine woods where the leaves are a'changin!
Re: Gordon's Sloppy Coat Tails
In a message dated 9/17/2000 9:31:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I do. Unscrew all the way and apply almost any lube (that doesn't attack "O" ring) to ring and threads. Jim Crabb I do too, only I use Dow - Corning High Vacumm Silicone Grease. It's clean tenacious, and won't eat up the o-ring. Keith Taylor
Re: Hi
In a message dated 9/5/2000 2:48:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, aster acquiring the first two most men would have the third. Now Jim.naughty, naughty! Keith Taylor P.S. To Jim, Sorry I couldn't make it on Sunday! The Mogul has been tightened up all over and is waiting for another chance to strut her stuff!
Invisible Flame
In a message dated 8/29/2000 7:58:04 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Concerning the "invisible" flame of an alcohol wick, I once read somewhere that the flame can be made more visible by adding some baking soda to the fuel. Anybody have any information about that? Casey, I learned that tric from a surgeon. He was using a watchmakers alcohol lamp to sterilize his implements of torture before plunging them deeply into my sinus cavity. I noticed the flame was very visible even in the brightly lit examining room and asked him for the secret. He just added a pinch, literally, of baking soda to about 4 oz. of Alcohol and a brilliant orange flame resulted. I used this trick with the Aster King Arthur I had at that time. It worked very well and I never noticed any side effects from its use. I just wish I had the locomotive back! Keith Taylor Jefferson, Maine USA
Re: Deck for elevated track ...
In a message dated 5/25/2000 10:14:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Aluminum frames have been purchased but now we need to put some type of decking on it. Is decking necessary? Why not put the track on spans like full sizr RR's do and let the cinders and oil drop through to the ground? Granted, the only experience I have with elevated track is for 3-1/2" gauge, but I don't see the need for decking. Keith T.
Steam oil , Longer and still boring!
In a message dated 4/28/2000 8:07:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I've seen them on 2.5" gauge engines and they're not very attractive. On the bigger engines they can by hidden/disguised. Jim and List; Not only are the commercial lubricators large and ungainly in appearence, but I think they would deliver way too much oil. You can't regulate the output enough for use on smaller locos. There is a reason that the smaller gauges have traditionally used the displacement lubricators..they work! The main reason I don't use them on the bigger models is their occasional habit of gulping the lubricator dry in one shot. When the larger locos are drifting along, with the throttle shut, you have to open the cylinders to the atmosphere. If you don't, any many are not so equipped, a vacuum is formed by the pistons. This will suck a displacement lubricator dry real quick! Also will pull cinders from the smoke box into the cylinder bore. Cinders make a wonderful abrasive, which you don't really want in your cylinders. Small scale models don't suffer from this unless coal fired. They rarely are moving with the throttle shut, either, thus eliminating the vacuum created while drifting. On prototype pictures of steam locos, you may notice an object protruding from the steam chest. On PRR engines a circular object in the steam deliver pipe going from the smokebox to the piston valve cylinder. These are the drifting valves. Keith
Re: Steam oil , Long and boring!
In a message dated 4/27/2000 7:01:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am curious as to wheather you could fill me in on how the lube pumps work. For the sake of playing, could they be adapted to our small stuff? =) Just an oscillating cylinder within a tank that holds the oil. On test, they can be pumped by hand, using the ratchet drive that connects to the valve gear, to pressures over 1,000 psi. The design is pure LBSC. LBSC was a British author of many authoritative articles on live steam and the designer of an amazingly large number of successful miniature locomotives from "O" gauge through 4-3/4" and 5" gauge. Did the larger items use ringed pistons as IC engines do, or were they rubber/viton sealed also? If the former, this may be why. I'd think that the harder materials would be better at not wearing out with the water acting as lube. I don't know about anyone else's equipment, but mine is all cast iron cylinders, pistons and rings. Graphite is present in cast iron, and the porous nature of C.I. allows it to absorb oil and retain it. I believe Bill Van Brocklin uses teflon "O" rings with great success. H.J. Coventry's design for his 2-1/2" gauge pacific uses piston valves with no rings whatsoever! I have a Coventry pacific in 2-1/2" gauge and am familiar with several in this scale, 1/2" to the foot, that do not use any rings. I plan to follow suit and not use them either. If something works, I see no need to fix it! Keith
Re: Steam oil , Long and boring!
In a message dated 4/27/2000 7:44:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: BUT- I bet you all the tea in China that Morewoods pistons have graphite packing for rings! It sure does!
Re: Steam oil distributors?
In a message dated 4/26/2000 11:11:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I also got a piece of scotchbrite and put that on top of the lard in the Tupperware container. I use it on the table and ways of my milling machine, on the 1917 Seneca Falls Lathe, the band saw table, and the circular saw table in my garage shop. I Walt, In reading Holtzapffel's books on ornamental turning, he recommends "Neatsfoot Oil" for this same purpose. I don't know what a "Neat" is, or how big his feet are, but it sounds like a similar product! Keith Taylor
Re: Caboose Marker Lights
In a message dated 3/25/2000 6:42:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: When I saw the following response I realise how easy it is to pull the legs of these colonials!! Hey, how can you tell if someone is kidding about getting things backwards when they don't even know which side of the road to drive on? ( Official Note!! foregoing is meant in jest!!) Keith
Re: Drivers side
In a message dated 3/26/2000 7:36:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is it true that in your homeland the locomotive driver (that is the correct term there isn't it?) is on the starboard side (i.e., right side as in left and right, not as in right and wrong)? Walt, I'm under the impression that the British standard construction has the operator on the left, which is oposite of US practise where the engineer / operator is on the right side. You want the engineer / driver on the side of the engine closest to the signals. So if you run on the right, your motorman is on the right. If you run on the left, the motorman is on the left. Get enough of that Beefeaters and it will all start to make sense! Keith
Re: Caboose Marker Lights
In a message dated 3/25/2000 5:25:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Just my five pence worth. Your five pence will get you killed real quick around US railroads! You have it exactly backwards from actual practise. Keith
Re: Ruby tips (was New list member)
In a message dated 3/1/2000 5:28:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As crazy as it may sound, check with your local railroad maintenance yard. Many of them have cans of steam oil still lying around and if you take a pint jar they will give it away. I worked for Conrail and prior to that for the Lehigh Valley RR for over twenty years. In all that time I never saw a drop of steam cylinder oil anywhere. What would you think they were using steam cylinder oil for on today's railroads? If anything comes close to steam cyl. oil it's used in antique cars. Model T Fords use SAE 600w oil in the differential, not quite steam oil, less sulfur added, but the right viscosity. Keith Taylor - In sunny Maine!
Re: Michigan Boiler Code
In a message dated 2/20/2000 12:35:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have deputized list member Keith Taylor to approach Marty Knox to find out his thinking on the topic and have asked Keith to get back to the list. Hello List! I have a request in to Marty regarding this question. As soon as I hear from him, I'll forward the info. I have also asked Marty to join the list as his input will be valuable and I believe he is active in the smaller scales as well as large scale and prototype steam rtailroading. Keith Taylor
First Run!
Hello list! Last night at about 6:00 PM EST, my under construction Aster CS mogul breathed it's first breath. While not quite as involved as some of the large scale projects of mine, I certainly felt a sense of accomplishment when those tiny little drivers started whirring away! The bulk of the work of finishing is already finished and after attaching the boiler asssembly, all ready finished, and the detail piping, it should be a done deal. The last time I assembled an Aster model was about 20 years ago and the King Arthur 4-6-0. Now that 'm returning to small scales again, I really apppreciate the easy to handle sizes involved. The big question now is, what's next? My wife gets anxious when I pick up the Aster catalog! Keith Taylor in snowy Maine
Re: Driver Diameter.
In a message dated 2/18/2000 2:48:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As Keith rightly says, smaller wheels give greater torque. MIKE !! Finally, someone not telling me the inumerable ways I have found of being incorrect. I'm going to print this out and show my wife, she won't believe it! Keith
Re: Really Old Locomotive
In a message dated 2/16/2000 1:30:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It really has a colorful history, including hauling debris out into the San Francisco Bay after the big quake in 1906. I'd sure like to see a picture of it swimming ! All of my locomotive experience has led me to believe that steam locomotives sink! Keith Taylor
Re: O Ring Maintenance
In a message dated 2/13/2000 11:27:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Does anyone on the list even lubricate their engine'ss O rings? I know many O rings appear to be very unique and I would hate to look for a replacement if one failed. While I am very new to the real small scale live steam models, I have used lubricated "O" rings for years in my 3/4" scale models with excellent success. To date, not one has failed after in some cases 20 years of use. I lubricate the "O" ring when first assembling the model and haven't had to touch them since! If for some reason, I have the model apart for other reasons, I will renew the lube, but not because it has worn out. I'm sure the lube you have willwork very well for you. I have used Dow/Corning High Vacuum Silicone grease as that is what I had on hand. Keith Taylor
Re: Aster CS Mogul
In a message dated 2/6/2000 9:07:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The TME Vale of Rheidol locos in 16mil also have fully operating Walschaerts gear which can be notched up (by RC, even...). Not of terrible importance to chugging around the garden at narrow gauge speeds, but it does change the exhaust note, and is additional proof that it can be done in production models. The Aster CS mogul can be hooked up. Lap and lead are totally different functions from controlling cutoff. In fact the CS Mogul comes with directions on when it's advisable to use the shortened cutoff feature and the reverse quadrant is notched for several different cutoff settings. The lap and lead / combination levers in the 4 cyl. models are ther, I believe, only to give a more scale appearance, and do not contribute to the operating efficiency. Keith Taylor
Re: Aster CS Mogul
In a message dated 2/3/2000 4:13:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Would you agree that it bloody well CAN'T be a Stephenson? Lee; ABSOLUTELY !!! There is nothing about it that even remotely resembles a Stephenson's gear in any way All I meant to say was it is not a " true " Walschaerts due to the lack of a combination lever. It is certainly a Walschaerts derivative. There are many varieties of all valve gears to suit the local conditions on the road it was to be used on. There is a British preserved locomotive ( a black five LMS ten wheeler ) that has Stephenson's gear mounted on the outside! It's still a Stephenson's irrespective of it's location. I am awed by the amount of work you did to create that web site and hope you didn't construe my notes wrongly. I don't disagree with you on any point. The only point I wish to make is that the Aster valve gear should be described as modified (like Aster itself states) or a Walshaerts derivative. Only so that beginners will not be confused when they see a valve gear with the combination lever and assume it's not a Walschaerts. These locomotives are fun and it's going to be tough to get back to work on my 1927 Indian Scout when the mogul is complete. We'll have to compare notes on performance when we're done. Keith
Re: Aster CS Mogul
In a message dated 2/3/2000 4:13:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: AND your point about it not being a workable design in a full size prototype is not only well taken, but agreed to also. Lee; I also forgot to mention that in my opinion, the full size design wouldn't work in the model either! The amount of lap and lead involved is minuscule and the distance between the pivot point at the top of the lever would be measured in thousandths of an inch! This would mean pivot pins the size of cat hairs! Not very practical, by any means. I find the Aster design to be just fine. It's manageable to construct and not so fussy that a first timer can build it successfully and that will encourage the beginner to keep the steady course. Keith Taylor, in Maine where it's too cold to ride my motorcycle!
Asdter CS Mogul
Dear Lee and List; I believe that the argument about the CS Mogul Valve gear is whether or not it is a TRUE Walschaerts gear. The Aster Catalog and instructions for building the engine, refer to it a a modified Walscaerts gear. A true Walschaerts has it's lap and lead functions driven from the crosshead via the union link and combination lever, not from the eccentric or return crank. The major advantage of Walschaerts is the fact that the lap and lead can be changed without changine any of the functions provided by the return crank/eccentric. The Aster setup would be amazingly inefficient in a full size locomotive and whoever ordered it from the builder would get fired! In a model, this is, of course, of little importance. The location of the valve gear is not important, but how complete it is should be. I am about 2/3's of the way through assembling this model myself. It is a very nice model and I am very happy with the way it's turning out. I also really don't care what you call it's particular valve gear, so long as it does the job. But I think I will, as Aster does, refewr to it as a modified Walscaerts gear because it's missing a key element in Egide Walscaert's design. Keith Taylor - Jefferson, Maine where it's quite cold right now!
Re: scale
In a message dated 1/28/2000 5:08:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 1" scale is widely used in small-scale live steam, by the way. Kozo's famous engines are all 1" scale, standard gauge. But beware, they run on either 4.75" or 5" gauge track. Actually they are 3/4" scale and run on 3-1/2" gauge track! Which, at least, is somewhat standard the world over. Somewhere along the line they had to get something straight! Keith T
Re: H.J. Coventry 1/2 BO 4-6-2 blueprints
In a message dated 1/2/2000 4:41:33 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I would like to compare the boiler to the blueprints and try to determine an operating pressure. Hello Doug; I also have a Coventry 2-1/2" gauge BO P-7d pacific and drawings. The engine underwent several design changes over the years, particularly to the boiler. Does your model have a combustion chamber with vertical circulation tubes and does it have Nicholson Thermic Syphons? If so, that is the latest version of the boiler. Mine is the intermediate version with just superheat and no combustion chamber. Mine operates and behaves nicely at 80 PSI. When I tried to run it at 95 PSI to see if it was any livelier, it just slipped more. Your model should easily haul three full sized adults. I have searched high and wide trying to find the tracings and patterns for this model, so far unsuccessfully. If you find any info, would you please let me know? Sincerely, Keith Taylor
