Re: [Sursound] [allowed] Re: Recreating a 3d soundfield with lots of mics.....

[Rev Tony Newnham]

Hi

Indeed - there's a picture or two in one of his books, which I have here
somewhere.  I don't think he tried to mimic the piositions of instruments
within an ensemble though - except maybe the piano.  No time to look it up
at present 

Every Blessing

Tony

> -Original Message-
> From: sursound-boun...@music.vt.edu [mailto:sursound-boun...@music.vt.edu]
On
> Behalf Of Gerard Lardner
> Sent: 18 May 2013 01:23
> To: sursound@music.vt.edu
> Subject: Re: [Sursound] [allowed] Re: Recreating a 3d soundfield with lots
of
> mics.
> 
> I believe Gilbert Briggs of Wharfedale did something like this in the
1950s.
> He hired major concert halls and other public venues in the UK and USA to
give
> concerts comparing live with recorded sound. 

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Re: [Sursound] The commercial future of Ambisonics

[dw]

On 18/05/2013 02:17, Stefan Schreiber wrote:



On current headphones, neither stereo nor 5.1 sound really convincing. 
Therefore, the headphone companies and - some day - maybe even Apple 
etc. should look for ways to defeat the in-head and listening-fatigue 
effects on current devices. It is actually stunning that so few 
companies have tried to improve the listening experience on 
headphones. (Smyth Research, Beyer, some VR equipment, and who else?)


Stereo works just fine for me via my dummy head and £30 hd219 phones. 
Better than listening direct with my own ears (reduced crosstalk).
Ambisoncs looks very promising too, although the setup is very critical. 
There is limited source material, and none that I have found without 
'precious' copyright restrictions, so it cannot be demonstrated..  A 
Raspberry Pi does (stereo) 2X2 convolution from file to soundcard in 
realtime.

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Re: [Sursound] The commercial future of Ambisonics

[dw]

O
If we find some convincing ways to reproduce surround via headphones, 
a market could easily be developped. Other people might want to listen 
to (future) surround recordings via 6, "many" or zillions (WFS) 
loudspeakers at home. This never will be a mass market, but if 
(configuration independent) surround recordings can be done and 
distributed via defined formats, people could chose how they would 
listen to these recordings.


On current headphones, neither stereo nor 5.1 sound really convincing. 
Therefore, the headphone companies and - some day - maybe even Apple 
etc. should look for ways to defeat the in-head and listening-fatigue 
effects on current devices. It is actually stunning that so few 
companies have tried to improve the listening experience on 
headphones. (Smyth Research, Beyer, some VR equipment, and who else?)


Head-tracking is currently getting really cheap, and could easily be 
included into such products. (This is not what I or somebody else < 
believe >, it is a fact.)




One reason for binaural in-head localization can be 'faking it' with 
multi-miking.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fh4u4IKiXHU

I knew the Tardis was not real, but still...



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Re: [Sursound] Spatial Music Artist Stories

[Dave Malham]

Pity this starts off with the story about St. Marks in Venic, which may be
apocryphal.  See "Bryant, D. (1981) *“The „Cori Spezzati‟ of St. Mark‟s:
Myth and Reality” *in Early Music History, Cambridge 1981" where he says
that " ..in St Marks, at least, the eight-voice salmi spetzzati  of
Wollaert and Croce were not, as has been believed hitherto, performed
antiphonally, but rather, responsorially with four of the singers in one of
the groups and all the rest ... in the other (Bryant, 1981:169)",
contending that it is a misleading statement given by Zarlino in his Venice
1558 book Le institutioni harmoniche that gave rise to the supposition that
in St. Mark‟s the choirs were housed in the organ lofts on either side of
the choir (ie spatially separated). In fact; " Neither this assumption ...
nor the comments on which it is based are borne out by the contemporary
documents of St. Mark‟s. There are in fact four separate statements to the
contrary" (Bryant, 1981:175)

   Dave

On 16 May 2013 12:07, Timothy Schmele wrote:

> Maybe some nice reading material:
>
> http://www.roebroeks.nl/wp-**content/uploads/2013/02/**
> Spatial-Music-Artist-Stories1.**pdf<http://www.roebroeks.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Spatial-Music-Artist-Stories1.pdf>
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>



-- 
As of 1st October 2012, I have retired from the University, so this
disclaimer is redundant


These are my own views and may or may not be shared by my employer

Dave Malham
Ex-Music Research Centre
Department of Music
The University of York
Heslington
York YO10 5DD
UK

'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio'
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Re: [Sursound] The commercial future of Ambisonics

[Dave Malham]

On 16 May 2013 18:54, Stefan Schreiber  wrote:

>
>
> I am aware that Dave Malham quite recently has written that head-tracking
> wouldn't be a big deal, but I think otherwise. Didn't we talk about the
> solutions from Smyth Research, some years ago?
>
>

Moi?? Not that I remember. It would be odd, given the fact that, for me,
it's essential otherwise stuff just seems to stick behind me, never coming
to the front...


Dave



-- 
As of 1st October 2012, I have retired from the University, so this
disclaimer is redundant


These are my own views and may or may not be shared by my employer

Dave Malham
Ex-Music Research Centre
Department of Music
The University of York
Heslington
York YO10 5DD
UK

'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio'
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Re: [Sursound] The commercial future of Ambisonics

[Stefan Schreiber]

Dave Malham wrote:


On 16 May 2013 18:54, Stefan Schreiber  wrote:

 


I am aware that Dave Malham quite recently has written that head-tracking
wouldn't be a big deal, but I think otherwise. Didn't we talk about the
solutions from Smyth Research, some years ago?


   



Moi?? Not that I remember. It would be odd, given the fact that, for me,
it's essential otherwise stuff just seems to stick behind me, never coming
to the front...


   Dave



 



Sorry, this was a serious mis-read. My apologies!

Stefan





Been there, done that - albeit with other sensing technologies like the
earlier Polyhemus Tracker.  Then, of course, there was Jacques Poulin's
Potentiometre d'Espace  which was used to project Schaeffer's musique
concrete into space back in the early 50's - and even I am too young to
have actually heard that!  What I have found is that the movement of sounds
(particularly in towards the centre) just based on sonic perception - i.e.
without any visual feedback - is very difficult to control properly because
muscle memory is not good enough without a lot of rehearsal.

  Dave

On 5 May 2013 02:57, Iain Mott  wrote:



Em Sáb, 2013-05-04 às 17:46 -0400, Matthew Palmer escreveu:



> http://vimeo.com/65229978#at=5
>
> imagine using the oculus & a kinect to be able to assign 3 directional
> information to sounds to make music, virtual speakers corresponding to
 


real



> ones, hand is a brush
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Re: [Sursound] The commercial future of Ambisonics

[Dave Malham]

On 18 May 2013 19:34, Stefan Schreiber  wrote:

> Dave Malham wrote:
>
>  On 16 May 2013 18:54, Stefan Schreiber  wrote:
>>
>>
>> Moi?? Not that I remember. It would be odd, given the fact that, for me,
>> it's essential otherwise stuff just seems to stick behind me, never coming
>> to the front...
>>
>>
>> Sorry, this was a serious mis-read. My apologies!
>
> Stefan
>
>
Hey - no worries!

 Dave

>
> --**--**
> --**--
>
> Been there, done that - albeit with other sensing technologies like the
> earlier Polyhemus Tracker.  Then, of course, there was Jacques Poulin's
> Potentiometre d'Espace  which was used to project Schaeffer's musique
> concrete into space back in the early 50's - and even I am too young to
> have actually heard that!  What I have found is that the movement of sounds
> (particularly in towards the centre) just based on sonic perception - i.e.
> without any visual feedback - is very difficult to control properly because
> muscle memory is not good enough without a lot of rehearsal.
>
>   Dave
>
> On 5 May 2013 02:57, Iain Mott  wrote:
>
>
>  Em Sáb, 2013-05-04 às 17:46 -0400, Matthew Palmer escreveu:
>>
>
>  > http://vimeo.com/65229978#at=5
>>> >
>>> > imagine using the oculus & a kinect to be able to assign 3 directional
>>> > information to sounds to make music, virtual speakers corresponding to
>>>
>>
>> real
>>
>
>  > ones, hand is a brush
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-- 
As of 1st October 2012, I have retired from the University, so this
disclaimer is redundant


These are my own views and may or may not be shared by my employer

Dave Malham
Ex-Music Research Centre
Department of Music
The University of York
Heslington
York YO10 5DD
UK

'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio'
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