Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-23 Thread Dave Malham
Easy enough to check this out with a router and a smartphone to make sureD
that there's no deadspots because of the walls. If there aren't any, this
would work well and would avoid the problem of user interference with
playback that a player-based system can have. Wi-Fi could also be used to
send regular clock signals out to a player app on the smartphones to
ameliorate such user interference since the app on resuming could continue
from the right place in the soundfile. With this approach deadspots would
be much less of a problem.

 Dave


On 23 February 2016 at 07:49, Bo-Erik Sandholm  wrote:

> IF you assume everyone has a smartphone, create a WiFi network and set up a
> real-time broadcast to listen to.
> That is probably the simplest way.
> Bosse
> On 23 Feb 2016 03:59, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
>
> > Thanks for all the thoughts guys - i'm going to go back through the
> thread
> > and do some further research on all the suggestions :)
> >
> > Best
> > Chris
> >
> > On 22 February 2016 at 08:52, Dave Malham 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > > More thoughts - if you are only concerned with all the players
> > starting
> > > at the same point and can tolerate a small amount of error at the end
> > > points (would have to be checked but should be of the order of no more
> > than
> > > a second or two at the end of half an hour), then I would go down the
> > > smartphone route. Avoids a lot of problems with rf signals. Again, the
> > guys
> > > at Hannah Bruce and Company have done something like it - see
> > > http://www.hannahbruce.org/tlott-app.html Note that I am connected
> with
> > > them so am not totally unbiased - tho' I did not do any of the work on
> > that
> > > project.
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > >
> > > On 21 February 2016 at 13:59, Dave Malham 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Thinking a bit more about this, the Raspberry Pi solution may not, in
> > > this
> > > > case, be the right one because of power consumption/battery life
> > > > considerations, though new "Zero" version may be better in this
> respect
> > > - I
> > > > can't find data on this yet, unfortunately.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The FM solution with distributed antennas should also work though
> > > > licensing would need checking against local regs.
> > > >
> > > >Dave
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 21 February 2016 at 09:37, Dave Malham 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way
> to
> > go
> > > >> because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a
> > > Rasberry
> > > >> Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even
> a
> > > >> modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player)
> the
> > > xtal
> > > >> clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the
> > end
> > > of
> > > >> 30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off
> > mobile
> > > >> phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something
> > > similar
> > > >> at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather
> than
> > > time
> > > >> (http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)
> > > >>
> > > >> Dave
> > > >>
> > > >> On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar <
> > > augustineleu...@gmail.com
> > > >> > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval
> > prison
> > > >>> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best
> be
> > > >>> might
> > > >>> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get
> > > >>> everyone
> > > >>> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not
> > the
> > > >>> most
> > > >>> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the
> > > Seinheizers
> > > >>> or
> > > >>> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter
> 
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar <
> > > >>> augustineleu...@gmail.com>
> > > >>> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to
> > test
> > > >>> one
> > > >>> > pair first though with walls etc
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm <
> > bosses...@gmail.com>
> > > >>> > wrote:
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power
> FM
> > > >>> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> > > >>> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> > > >>> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect
> > > several
> > > >>> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> BR Bo-Erik
> > > >>> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson" 
> > > wrote:
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> > Hi all
> > > >>> >> >
> > > >>> >> > Wondering if anyone 

Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-23 Thread Augustine Leudar
Good luck ! Let us know how it goes.

On 23 February 2016 at 07:49, Bo-Erik Sandholm  wrote:

> IF you assume everyone has a smartphone, create a WiFi network and set up a
> real-time broadcast to listen to.
> That is probably the simplest way.
> Bosse
> On 23 Feb 2016 03:59, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
>
> > Thanks for all the thoughts guys - i'm going to go back through the
> thread
> > and do some further research on all the suggestions :)
> >
> > Best
> > Chris
> >
> > On 22 February 2016 at 08:52, Dave Malham 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > > More thoughts - if you are only concerned with all the players
> > starting
> > > at the same point and can tolerate a small amount of error at the end
> > > points (would have to be checked but should be of the order of no more
> > than
> > > a second or two at the end of half an hour), then I would go down the
> > > smartphone route. Avoids a lot of problems with rf signals. Again, the
> > guys
> > > at Hannah Bruce and Company have done something like it - see
> > > http://www.hannahbruce.org/tlott-app.html Note that I am connected
> with
> > > them so am not totally unbiased - tho' I did not do any of the work on
> > that
> > > project.
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > >
> > > On 21 February 2016 at 13:59, Dave Malham 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Thinking a bit more about this, the Raspberry Pi solution may not, in
> > > this
> > > > case, be the right one because of power consumption/battery life
> > > > considerations, though new "Zero" version may be better in this
> respect
> > > - I
> > > > can't find data on this yet, unfortunately.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The FM solution with distributed antennas should also work though
> > > > licensing would need checking against local regs.
> > > >
> > > >Dave
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 21 February 2016 at 09:37, Dave Malham 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way
> to
> > go
> > > >> because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a
> > > Rasberry
> > > >> Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even
> a
> > > >> modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player)
> the
> > > xtal
> > > >> clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the
> > end
> > > of
> > > >> 30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off
> > mobile
> > > >> phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something
> > > similar
> > > >> at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather
> than
> > > time
> > > >> (http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)
> > > >>
> > > >> Dave
> > > >>
> > > >> On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar <
> > > augustineleu...@gmail.com
> > > >> > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval
> > prison
> > > >>> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best
> be
> > > >>> might
> > > >>> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get
> > > >>> everyone
> > > >>> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not
> > the
> > > >>> most
> > > >>> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the
> > > Seinheizers
> > > >>> or
> > > >>> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter
> 
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar <
> > > >>> augustineleu...@gmail.com>
> > > >>> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to
> > test
> > > >>> one
> > > >>> > pair first though with walls etc
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm <
> > bosses...@gmail.com>
> > > >>> > wrote:
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power
> FM
> > > >>> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> > > >>> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> > > >>> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect
> > > several
> > > >>> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> BR Bo-Erik
> > > >>> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson" 
> > > wrote:
> > > >>> >>
> > > >>> >> > Hi all
> > > >>> >> >
> > > >>> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone
> > > >>> solution?
> > > >>> >> I'm
> > > >>> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
> > > >>> experience
> > > >>> >> in
> > > >>> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need
> the
> > > >>> audio
> > > >>> >> to
> > > >>> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be
> > > >>> walking
> > > >>> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but
> quite
> > a
> > > >>> few
> > > >>> >> 

Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-22 Thread Bo-Erik Sandholm
IF you assume everyone has a smartphone, create a WiFi network and set up a
real-time broadcast to listen to.
That is probably the simplest way.
Bosse
On 23 Feb 2016 03:59, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:

> Thanks for all the thoughts guys - i'm going to go back through the thread
> and do some further research on all the suggestions :)
>
> Best
> Chris
>
> On 22 February 2016 at 08:52, Dave Malham  wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > More thoughts - if you are only concerned with all the players
> starting
> > at the same point and can tolerate a small amount of error at the end
> > points (would have to be checked but should be of the order of no more
> than
> > a second or two at the end of half an hour), then I would go down the
> > smartphone route. Avoids a lot of problems with rf signals. Again, the
> guys
> > at Hannah Bruce and Company have done something like it - see
> > http://www.hannahbruce.org/tlott-app.html Note that I am connected with
> > them so am not totally unbiased - tho' I did not do any of the work on
> that
> > project.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> > On 21 February 2016 at 13:59, Dave Malham 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Thinking a bit more about this, the Raspberry Pi solution may not, in
> > this
> > > case, be the right one because of power consumption/battery life
> > > considerations, though new "Zero" version may be better in this respect
> > - I
> > > can't find data on this yet, unfortunately.
> > >
> > >
> > > The FM solution with distributed antennas should also work though
> > > licensing would need checking against local regs.
> > >
> > >Dave
> > >
> > >
> > > On 21 February 2016 at 09:37, Dave Malham 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way to
> go
> > >> because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a
> > Rasberry
> > >> Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even a
> > >> modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player) the
> > xtal
> > >> clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the
> end
> > of
> > >> 30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off
> mobile
> > >> phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something
> > similar
> > >> at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather than
> > time
> > >> (http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)
> > >>
> > >> Dave
> > >>
> > >> On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar <
> > augustineleu...@gmail.com
> > >> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval
> prison
> > >>> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be
> > >>> might
> > >>> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get
> > >>> everyone
> > >>> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not
> the
> > >>> most
> > >>> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the
> > Seinheizers
> > >>> or
> > >>> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 
> > >>>
> > >>> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar <
> > >>> augustineleu...@gmail.com>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to
> test
> > >>> one
> > >>> > pair first though with walls etc
> > >>> >
> > >>> >
> > >>> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm <
> bosses...@gmail.com>
> > >>> > wrote:
> > >>> >
> > >>> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
> > >>> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> > >>> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> > >>> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect
> > several
> > >>> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> BR Bo-Erik
> > >>> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson" 
> > wrote:
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> > Hi all
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone
> > >>> solution?
> > >>> >> I'm
> > >>> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
> > >>> experience
> > >>> >> in
> > >>> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the
> > >>> audio
> > >>> >> to
> > >>> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be
> > >>> walking
> > >>> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite
> a
> > >>> few
> > >>> >> walls
> > >>> >> > etc.
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have
> > concerns
> > >>> >> about
> > >>> >> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to
> > mono
> > >>> >> then
> > >>> >> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
> > >>> >> >
> > >>> >> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
> 

Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-22 Thread Chris Timpson
Thanks for all the thoughts guys - i'm going to go back through the thread
and do some further research on all the suggestions :)

Best
Chris

On 22 February 2016 at 08:52, Dave Malham  wrote:

> Hi,
> More thoughts - if you are only concerned with all the players starting
> at the same point and can tolerate a small amount of error at the end
> points (would have to be checked but should be of the order of no more than
> a second or two at the end of half an hour), then I would go down the
> smartphone route. Avoids a lot of problems with rf signals. Again, the guys
> at Hannah Bruce and Company have done something like it - see
> http://www.hannahbruce.org/tlott-app.html Note that I am connected with
> them so am not totally unbiased - tho' I did not do any of the work on that
> project.
>
> Dave
>
>
> On 21 February 2016 at 13:59, Dave Malham  wrote:
>
> > Thinking a bit more about this, the Raspberry Pi solution may not, in
> this
> > case, be the right one because of power consumption/battery life
> > considerations, though new "Zero" version may be better in this respect
> - I
> > can't find data on this yet, unfortunately.
> >
> >
> > The FM solution with distributed antennas should also work though
> > licensing would need checking against local regs.
> >
> >Dave
> >
> >
> > On 21 February 2016 at 09:37, Dave Malham 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way to go
> >> because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a
> Rasberry
> >> Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even a
> >> modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player) the
> xtal
> >> clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the end
> of
> >> 30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off mobile
> >> phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something
> similar
> >> at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather than
> time
> >> (http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)
> >>
> >> Dave
> >>
> >> On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar <
> augustineleu...@gmail.com
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >>> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval prison
> >>> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be
> >>> might
> >>> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get
> >>> everyone
> >>> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not the
> >>> most
> >>> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the
> Seinheizers
> >>> or
> >>> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 
> >>>
> >>> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar <
> >>> augustineleu...@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test
> >>> one
> >>> > pair first though with walls etc
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm 
> >>> > wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
> >>> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> >>> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> >>> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect
> several
> >>> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> >>> >>
> >>> >> BR Bo-Erik
> >>> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson" 
> wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> > Hi all
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone
> >>> solution?
> >>> >> I'm
> >>> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
> >>> experience
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the
> >>> audio
> >>> >> to
> >>> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be
> >>> walking
> >>> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a
> >>> few
> >>> >> walls
> >>> >> > etc.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have
> concerns
> >>> >> about
> >>> >> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to
> mono
> >>> >> then
> >>> >> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
> >>> >> playback
> >>> >> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will
> >>> just
> >>> >> be a
> >>> >> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> has
> >>> >> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing
> >>> solution
> >>> >> > i've completely overlooked !?
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > Many thanks,
> >>> >> > Chris
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > Chris Timpson
> >>> >> > *Director*
> >>> >> > EarFilms
> >>> 

Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-22 Thread Jörn Nettingsmeier

On 02/21/2016 09:47 PM, Justin Bennett wrote:


The solution used in tunnels, caves, mines etc. is to use a
radiating cable instead of a normal antenna. This is a coax
cable that is designed to 'leak' part of the energy that
passes through it, usually by having some holes in the
shield (a standard coax won't work).


yes, that’s what I meant. There was for a long time a sound art piece
on the Afsluitdijk in the Netherlands by Moniek Toebosch that used
a leaky coax cable all along the dijk. Drivers could tune into the frequency
and listen to Angels.

very local and linear coverage!


thanks for pointing this out. i had heard about this technique before, 
but i was assuming that it works because the cable is like a line 
radiator and it's straight.
i'm no radio guy, so i'm applying acoustic principles here and may be 
totally wrong, but my reasoning is that at uhf, say 600 MHz, you end up 
with a wavelength of about half a meter. that means the distance between 
the leaks would have to be small compared to that. fine. should give you 
a uniform cylindrical field. but what if you follow a u-shaped or zig 
zag path because that's what the building is like, with a distance 
between the legs of the u that are a lot longer than the wavelength?
i would expect pretty fancy interference patters with loads of complete 
nulls all over the place. or is there some sort of near-field effect 
that makes the effect of parallel lengths of wire negligible?




--
Jörn Nettingsmeier
Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487

Meister für Veranstaltungstechnik (Bühne/Studio)
Tonmeister VDT

http://stackingdwarves.net

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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Justin Bennett
> 
> 
> On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 04:33:42PM +0100, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote:
>> On 02/21/2016 12:54 PM, Justin Bennett wrote:
>>> 
>>> thick walls would be a problem though. You could try running antenna wires 
>>> throughout the space?
>>> Don?t know if that would help.
>> 
>> i think that would actually make things a lot worse.
>> multiple senders interfere. you can only ever have one transmitter
>> working on a given frequency. if you wanted to hand over to another,
>> it would have to work on a different frequency, and the receivers
>> would have to support that kind of feature. I don't know any
>> headphones that can do it.
> 
> The solution used in tunnels, caves, mines etc. is to use a
> radiating cable instead of a normal antenna. This is a coax
> cable that is designed to 'leak' part of the energy that
> passes through it, usually by having some holes in the
> shield (a standard coax won't work).

yes, that’s what I meant. There was for a long time a sound art piece 
on the Afsluitdijk in the Netherlands by Moniek Toebosch that used
a leaky coax cable all along the dijk. Drivers could tune into the frequency
and listen to Angels. 

very local and linear coverage!

best, Justin
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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Jörn Nettingsmeier

On 02/21/2016 03:32 AM, Chris Timpson wrote:

Hi all

Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution? I'm
working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience in
a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio to
begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few walls
etc.

I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns about
the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono then
back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?

It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small playback
device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just be a
single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone has
tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing solution
i've completely overlooked !?


I guess the most straightforward approach would be little portable 
players started at the same time. If you splice a test tone and then 
five minutes of silence before the program material, you can have 
attendants start them before handing them to the audience.


Another solution might be IR-based systems as used by interpreters. They 
are quite resilient and easily handle multiple emitters. I don't know 
what their audio bandwidth is, however.



--
Jörn Nettingsmeier
Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487

Meister für Veranstaltungstechnik (Bühne/Studio)
Tonmeister VDT

http://stackingdwarves.net

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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Fons Adriaensen
On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 04:33:42PM +0100, Jörn Nettingsmeier wrote:
> On 02/21/2016 12:54 PM, Justin Bennett wrote:
> >
> >thick walls would be a problem though. You could try running antenna wires 
> >throughout the space?
> >Don’t know if that would help.
> 
> i think that would actually make things a lot worse.
> multiple senders interfere. you can only ever have one transmitter
> working on a given frequency. if you wanted to hand over to another,
> it would have to work on a different frequency, and the receivers
> would have to support that kind of feature. I don't know any
> headphones that can do it.

The solution used in tunnels, caves, mines etc. is to use a
radiating cable instead of a normal antenna. This is a coax
cable that is designed to 'leak' part of the energy that
passes through it, usually by having some holes in the
shield (a standard coax won't work).

Ciao,

-- 
FA

A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia.
It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris
and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)

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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Jörn Nettingsmeier

On 02/21/2016 12:54 PM, Justin Bennett wrote:


thick walls would be a problem though. You could try running antenna wires 
throughout the space?
Don’t know if that would help.


i think that would actually make things a lot worse.
multiple senders interfere. you can only ever have one transmitter 
working on a given frequency. if you wanted to hand over to another, it 
would have to work on a different frequency, and the receivers would 
have to support that kind of feature. I don't know any headphones that 
can do it.


--
Jörn Nettingsmeier
Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487

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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Dave Malham
Thinking a bit more about this, the Raspberry Pi solution may not, in this
case, be the right one because of power consumption/battery life
considerations, though new "Zero" version may be better in this respect - I
can't find data on this yet, unfortunately.


The FM solution with distributed antennas should also work though licensing
would need checking against local regs.

   Dave


On 21 February 2016 at 09:37, Dave Malham  wrote:

> Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way to go
> because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a Rasberry
> Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even a
> modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player) the xtal
> clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the end of
> 30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off mobile
> phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something similar
> at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather than time
> (http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)
>
> Dave
>
> On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar 
> wrote:
>
>> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval prison
>> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be
>> might
>> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get
>> everyone
>> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not the
>> most
>> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the Seinheizers
>> or
>> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 
>>
>> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar > >
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test
>> one
>> > pair first though with walls etc
>> >
>> >
>> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
>> >> transmitters? Or maybe
>> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
>> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
>> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
>> >>
>> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
>> >>
>> >> BR Bo-Erik
>> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Hi all
>> >> >
>> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone
>> solution?
>> >> I'm
>> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
>> experience
>> >> in
>> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the
>> audio
>> >> to
>> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be
>> walking
>> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few
>> >> walls
>> >> > etc.
>> >> >
>> >> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns
>> >> about
>> >> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono
>> >> then
>> >> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
>> >> >
>> >> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
>> >> playback
>> >> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will
>> just
>> >> be a
>> >> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if
>> anyone
>> >> has
>> >> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing
>> solution
>> >> > i've completely overlooked !?
>> >> >
>> >> > Many thanks,
>> >> > Chris
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Chris Timpson
>> >> > *Director*
>> >> > EarFilms
>> >> > T: +44 (0)7888 695770
>> >> > E: ch...@earfilms.com
>> >> >
>> >> > www.earfilms.com
>> >> > -- next part --
>> >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> >> > URL: <
>> >> >
>> >>
>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20160220/4b8ebefc/attachment.html
>> >> > >
>> >> > ___
>> >> > Sursound mailing list
>> >> > Sursound@music.vt.edu
>> >> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
>> here,
>> >> > edit account or options, view archives and so on.
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>> here,
>> >> edit account or options, view archives and so on.
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
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>> >
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>>
>>
>> --
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>> -- next part --
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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Justin Bennett

> On 21 Feb 2016, at 10:43, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote:
> 
> Hi all
> 
> Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution? I'm
> working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience in
> a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio to
> begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
> around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few walls
> etc.

I have, together with the Dutch sound artist Cilia Erens (she’s the real 
expert), done 
a simultaneous binaural event for about 50 people with a relatively simple FM 
wireless
headphone system, about 10 years ago - so old technology. I think they were
sennheiser wireless headphones. The hassle was checking the headphones each
performance for tuning and volume level, the controls of which were on each 
headset.

thick walls would be a problem though. You could try running antenna wires 
throughout the space?
Don’t know if that would help.

> 
> I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns about
> the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono then
> back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?

FM stereo transmission does this anyway doesn’t it? as far as I remember it’s 
broadcast
as a M/S signal. A mono receiver just picks up the M signal. A stereo receiver 
matrixes them 
together. The audio bandwidth is limited to enable both channels to “fit” into 
the frequency slot.

Binaural recordings still work OK on the radio, even with nothing above 15khz!

best wishes, Justin



Justin Bennett

jus...@justinbennett.nl
www.justinbennett.nl
http://jubilee-art.org/



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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Bo-Erik Sandholm
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xstereo+fm+transmitter.TRS0&_nkw=stereo+fm+transmitter&_sacat=0

Use a number of these transmitters, place them where needed for coverage.

Receivers like this ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AM-FM-Portable-2-Band-Digital-Tuning-FM-Radio-Stereo-Receiver-Earphone-DC-5V-/371361019544?hash=item5676d77698:g:c1cAAOSwLVZVgjFU

Headphones of own choice, maybe a low cost solution or all in one

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wireless-Stereo-Headphone-Headset-MP3-SD-Card-Music-Player-FM-Radio-LCD-Display-/361193831802?hash=item5418d47d7a:g:fKoAAOSwYGFUwK7U

Bosse
On 21 Feb 2016 10:24, "Augustine Leudar"  wrote:

> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval prison
> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be might
> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get everyone
> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not the most
> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the Seinheizers or
> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 
>
> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar 
> wrote:
>
> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test one
> > pair first though with walls etc
> >
> >
> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> >>
> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> >>
> >> BR Bo-Erik
> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi all
> >> >
> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution?
> >> I'm
> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
> experience
> >> in
> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio
> >> to
> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few
> >> walls
> >> > etc.
> >> >
> >> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns
> >> about
> >> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono
> >> then
> >> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
> >> >
> >> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
> >> playback
> >> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just
> >> be a
> >> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone
> >> has
> >> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing
> solution
> >> > i've completely overlooked !?
> >> >
> >> > Many thanks,
> >> > Chris
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Chris Timpson
> >> > *Director*
> >> > EarFilms
> >> > T: +44 (0)7888 695770
> >> > E: ch...@earfilms.com
> >> >
> >> > www.earfilms.com
> >> > -- next part --
> >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> > URL: <
> >> >
> >>
> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20160220/4b8ebefc/attachment.html
> >> > >
> >> > ___
> >> > Sursound mailing list
> >> > Sursound@music.vt.edu
> >> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
> here,
> >> > edit account or options, view archives and so on.
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> >>
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> >> >
> >> ___
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> >> Sursound@music.vt.edu
> >> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
> >> edit account or options, view archives and so on.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
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> >
>
>
>
> --
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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Dave Malham
Yep, I'm definitely inclined to think that wireless is not the way to go
because of the walls. I'm sure you could work something up with a Rasberry
Pi as a player with an rf trigger signal to start playing - or even a
modified mp3 player. If they were all identical (mp3 or Pi player) the xtal
clocks should easily keep playback within less than a second at the end of
30 minutes, something that might be problematic with playback off mobile
phones which is another alternative. Note that we've done something similar
at Hoxton Hall using BLE beacons to lock playback to place rather than time
(http://www.hannahbruce.org/small-choices.html)

Dave

On 21 February 2016 at 09:23, Augustine Leudar 
wrote:

> thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval prison
> walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be might
> be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get everyone
> to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not the most
> elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the Seinheizers or
> get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 
>
> On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar 
> wrote:
>
> > Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test one
> > pair first though with walls etc
> >
> >
> > On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
> >> transmitters? Or maybe
> >> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> >> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
> >> external antennas antennas to the device.
> >>
> >> Solution depends on your prison :-)
> >>
> >> BR Bo-Erik
> >> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi all
> >> >
> >> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution?
> >> I'm
> >> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound
> experience
> >> in
> >> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio
> >> to
> >> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
> >> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few
> >> walls
> >> > etc.
> >> >
> >> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns
> >> about
> >> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono
> >> then
> >> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
> >> >
> >> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
> >> playback
> >> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just
> >> be a
> >> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone
> >> has
> >> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing
> solution
> >> > i've completely overlooked !?
> >> >
> >> > Many thanks,
> >> > Chris
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Chris Timpson
> >> > *Director*
> >> > EarFilms
> >> > T: +44 (0)7888 695770
> >> > E: ch...@earfilms.com
> >> >
> >> > www.earfilms.com
> >> > -- next part --
> >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> > URL: <
> >> >
> >>
> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20160220/4b8ebefc/attachment.html
> >> > >
> >> > ___
> >> > Sursound mailing list
> >> > Sursound@music.vt.edu
> >> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
> here,
> >> > edit account or options, view archives and so on.
> >> >
> >> -- next part --
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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> >>
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> >> >
> >> ___
> >> Sursound mailing list
> >> Sursound@music.vt.edu
> >> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
> >> edit account or options, view archives and so on.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > www.augustineleudar.com
> >
>
>
>
> --
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> -- next part --
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As of 1st October 2012, I have retired from the University.

These are my own views and may or may not be shared by the University

Dave Malham
Honorary Fellow, Department of Music
The University of York
York YO10 5DD
UK

'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio'
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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Augustine Leudar
thinking about it you'll be lucky to get through thick medieval prison
walls with anything without expensive booster units etc. Your best be might
be a bit of fun - make it a bit theatrical and at the begining get everyone
to press "play" on their mp3 player at exactly the same time - not the most
elegant solution - but possibly the best ! Otherwise try the Seinheizers or
get the licence for a local fm frequency and hire a transmitter 

On 21 February 2016 at 09:11, Augustine Leudar 
wrote:

> Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test one
> pair first though with walls etc
>
>
> On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm 
> wrote:
>
>> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
>> transmitters? Or maybe
>> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
>> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
>> external antennas antennas to the device.
>>
>> Solution depends on your prison :-)
>>
>> BR Bo-Erik
>> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
>>
>> > Hi all
>> >
>> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution?
>> I'm
>> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience
>> in
>> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio
>> to
>> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
>> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few
>> walls
>> > etc.
>> >
>> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns
>> about
>> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono
>> then
>> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
>> >
>> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small
>> playback
>> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just
>> be a
>> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone
>> has
>> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing solution
>> > i've completely overlooked !?
>> >
>> > Many thanks,
>> > Chris
>> >
>> >
>> > Chris Timpson
>> > *Director*
>> > EarFilms
>> > T: +44 (0)7888 695770
>> > E: ch...@earfilms.com
>> >
>> > www.earfilms.com
>> > -- next part --
>> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> > URL: <
>> >
>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20160220/4b8ebefc/attachment.html
>> > >
>> > ___
>> > Sursound mailing list
>> > Sursound@music.vt.edu
>> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
>> > edit account or options, view archives and so on.
>> >
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>> edit account or options, view archives and so on.
>>
>
>
>
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>



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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-21 Thread Augustine Leudar
Seinheizer in ear monitor units are about the best. Youd need to test one
pair first though with walls etc


On 21 February 2016 at 07:32, Bo-Erik Sandholm  wrote:

> Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
> transmitters? Or maybe
> Just search for FM transmitter with google.
> You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
> external antennas antennas to the device.
>
> Solution depends on your prison :-)
>
> BR Bo-Erik
> On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:
>
> > Hi all
> >
> > Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution?
> I'm
> > working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience
> in
> > a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio to
> > begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
> > around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few
> walls
> > etc.
> >
> > I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns about
> > the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono then
> > back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
> >
> > It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small playback
> > device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just
> be a
> > single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone
> has
> > tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing solution
> > i've completely overlooked !?
> >
> > Many thanks,
> > Chris
> >
> >
> > Chris Timpson
> > *Director*
> > EarFilms
> > T: +44 (0)7888 695770
> > E: ch...@earfilms.com
> >
> > www.earfilms.com
> > -- next part --
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <
> >
> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20160220/4b8ebefc/attachment.html
> > >
> > ___
> > Sursound mailing list
> > Sursound@music.vt.edu
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> > edit account or options, view archives and so on.
> >
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Re: [Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-20 Thread Bo-Erik Sandholm
Maybe a FM receiver on the earphones and one or more low power FM
transmitters? Or maybe
Just search for FM transmitter with google.
You could use several on same frequency maybe, or just connect several
external antennas antennas to the device.

Solution depends on your prison :-)

BR Bo-Erik
On 21 Feb 2016 03:32, "Chris Timpson"  wrote:

> Hi all
>
> Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution? I'm
> working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience in
> a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio to
> begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
> around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few walls
> etc.
>
> I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns about
> the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono then
> back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?
>
> It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small playback
> device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just be a
> single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone has
> tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing solution
> i've completely overlooked !?
>
> Many thanks,
> Chris
>
>
> Chris Timpson
> *Director*
> EarFilms
> T: +44 (0)7888 695770
> E: ch...@earfilms.com
>
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[Sursound] Wireless Solutions for Binaural Event

2016-02-20 Thread Chris Timpson
Hi all

Wondering if anyone has suggestions for a wireless headphone solution? I'm
working on a live event that will be a 30mins binaural sound experience in
a medieval prison for 24 audience members at a time. We need the audio to
begin simultaneously for all audience members and they will be walking
around between 3 locations. The distances aren't huge but quite a few walls
etc.

I've been looking at silent disco type headphones but have concerns about
the quality and also that the signal apparently is converted to mono then
back to stereo during RF transmission. Anyone tested these?

It could be that we use wired headphones with some kind of small playback
device that can somehow be remotely triggered to play. There will just be a
single audio file that plays from start to finish. Wondering if anyone has
tried to build something similar, or perhaps theres an existing solution
i've completely overlooked !?

Many thanks,
Chris


Chris Timpson
*Director*
EarFilms
T: +44 (0)7888 695770
E: ch...@earfilms.com

www.earfilms.com
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