Re: [Biofuel] Microchipping babies

[Jason Katie]

i see stories, but no references. i can understand the worry, but is it a 
leak, or has this fella been handed a mindgame designed to make us paranoid?

this could go either way, but personally i find it to be a stretch at best.

- Original Message - 
From: Marylynn Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 9:29 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Microchipping babies


 This was sent through from another list

 http://www.arcticbeacon.com/11-May-2006.html

 Mary Lynn Schmidt



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Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator PV Modules

[Jason Katie]

in theory, if one could find a way to waterproof the back of a PV cell it 
could be used as the heat-side plate in this concentrator/boiler found at 
(or after) http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/solar/page_46.htm you could 
safely increase the power range of a smaller PV cell without too horrible of 
a heat loss. the problem is finding a sealing substance that wont melt or 
burn under these 1200*F temperatures.


- Original Message - 
From: logan vilas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules


I am working with the idea of building my own Concentrator with about 50
 times the mirror space then collector space. That Is why the question was
 asked in the first place I was wondering if placeing a 50watt solar panel 
 at
 the focal point would increase the power output. I've read that it is more
 then 100% liner increase in power output when increasing the amount of 
 light
 on it. a normal panel at 50 watts would be 2500 watts at 50 suns. I know 
 it
 would need to be kept cool. due to the fact that they are only 20-30%
 efficent, but I could use the coolant to heat my biodiesel processor, then
 the hot water going into my home before a tankless heater. If I were to 
 get
 a grid tied inverter It would suppliment my normal power useage and maby
 with netmetering it might come close to canceling out my power 
 requirements
 alltogther. a simple temp sensor could be used so if the temp is over 150f
 in the coolant it will shut down and not collect the sun anymore. As for a
 solar tracker that is relative easy with very simple electronics. The 
 setup
 to hold everything would be a simple build for most people who can make
 their own biodiesel processor. And If I base it off a 7 meter dish I can 
 get
 those free. I just have to use the labor to remove it.

 Logan Vilas
 - Original Message - 
 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 3:59 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules


I am speaking mostly from experience, from what I have seen work and
 fail in the field, and what I can buy to install for my clients. The
 reason I talk about trackers on large poles is because that is what is
 commercially sold right now (at least in the US, europe is ahead of us
 in many areas).  And the biggest reason I see for failed systems is
 lack of maintenance (mostly batteries, but also anything that moves).
 Also, the number of new innovative PV systems that I have seen come on
 the market over the years, only to dissapear within another year...
 We're still basically doing the same thing as PV was in the 70's, with
 incremental improvements in efficiency and incremental cost decreases.
 I called the concrentrating PV exotic merely because I can't call up
 one of 200 some suppliers and buy one that meets all current
 electrical code, whereas I can with silicon PV modules.  Maybe another
 breakthrough is coming, but in the mean time, alot of people will keep
 using coal generated power because they are waiting for those
 breakthroughs.  I would rather see working PV systems going in today,
 even if they aren't all that high tech, rather than people thinking
 they have to wait before solar energy can work for them -- and in the
 mean time continuing to support coal and oil.   It's not that I want
 to limit the new technology, but what I have seen is that the
 layperson holds out the possibility of a paradigm shift in the
 technology in the future as a reason to do absolutely nothing now.
 And if I recall, the original question was about concentrating
 sunlight on a normal old PV module -- which isn't the best idea --
 they tried that at the carrizo solar plant in the early 80's, and a
 few years later, a whole lot of used Mud-lams (because the encapsulant
 turned varying shades of brown) flooded the market for off-grid use.

 I do admit that this list's members are not your average layperson,
 and most of us won't just use the news of new inventions as an excuse
 for procrastinating, so I apologize for that.

 Zeke


 On 5/12/06, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 By now, you may have noticed my resistance to conventional wisdom
 whenever
 someone gives negative feedback about a particular energy scheme. Here 
 is
 an
 example.

 The idea of concentrating light onto PV cells is a relatively new idea 
 in
 some circles. What to do about waste heat is a natural progression in 
 the
 discussion of such technology. But, why is it seen as such an obstacle -
 especially when schemes for harvesting waste heat are so abundant in
 energy
 related discussions?

 You wrote: ...regular PV is cheap enough that the simplicity of not
 having

 moving parts will probably outweigh any advantage of trying to get more
 from
 the same amount of silicon.


 The sweeping statements are getting old Zeke. Adding trackers become
 advantageous when you run 

[Biofuel] Police Brutality in Ohio

[D. Mindock]

This is happening in America, land of the free  home of the brave. America 
is becoming a land of no compassion for
common folk who protest against the crimes of BushCo. Even peace loving 
pacifists are
being put into FBI databases. Anyone who loves peace and hates war is seen 
as a
terrorist to the Oval Office where our Great Decider presides.
Peace, D. Mindock
http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=1029Itemi 

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Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water

[chris davidson]

it seems sea water (or possibly even grey water) could possibly leave behind evaporite deposits.i don't know how these systems work though, or whether the water is actually evaporated, but i had assumed that clean water would be needed. salt water could be theway to go...?-chris Message: 2Date: Fri, 12 May 2006 22:48:12 +From: "Terry Dyck" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on waterTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgMessage-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowedIf you can use grey water or
 salt water there would not be a problem.  If the water used has to be clean drinkable water there is a problem.Terry DyckFrom: chris davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on waterDate: Thu, 11 May 2006 09:14:57 -0700 (PDT)Another issue concerning the Car Powered by Water: Even if the  invention works as he claims it does, i don't think water is the answer  for a fuel source for cars. Yeah, it has basically no pollution and  all, but what would happen
 to the water supply when everbody and their  mom wants to "fill up"? I think most of us know what a valuable  resource water is, and the pressing concerns for its availability in  the coming years. Irrigation for crops and feed crops already consumes  approx 85%-90% of the industrial water usage of the water supply (40%  of that comes from groundwater tables) -and a lot of that is lost to  evaporation/transpiration. Just a thought...   -Chris  ___
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[Biofuel] Radio Interview with Dr Mills of Blacklightpower.com

[D. Mindock]

This is a recent addition to the 
BlackLightPower website. Dr Randell L.Mills is an
articulate, energetic, speaker for his 
new way to create energy from
hydrogen whichhe saysbegin to 
end the fossil fuel era in 100 man-years. 
Peace, D. Mindock

May 6, 2006
Energy 
Week, FM Radio News Channel 97.5 Houston, TX - Interview (Segment 
1) (Segment 
2) with Dr. Randell Mills and Alan M. Lammey, Energy Analyst and Consultant 
(the interview runs for approximately 20 minutes) 
(www.FmNewsChannel975.com) (www.HoustonEnergyAnalyst.com) 

http://www.blacklightpower.com/Energy 
Week Segment 1 050606.mp3 Segment 1 
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Energy 
Week Segment 2 050606.mp3 Segment 2 
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[Biofuel] Now Is the Time for a Left-Right Alliance

[D. Mindock]

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/node/10305Now Is the Time for a Left-Right AllianceA rebel alliance already 
exists that could stop Bush administrationattacks on the Constitutionby 
Thomas R. EddlemI'm currently a life member of the John Birch Society 
and formerlyserved on the staff of the organization for 13 years.So 
why should any left-winger reading this care a fig about what I haveto 
say?Because of a conversation I had with another conservative 
magazinewriter recently. In frustration at the unconstitutional excesses of 
theBush administration, I blurted out to him: "The only people doing 
anygood out there are the people at Air America." I expected to shock 
himwith the statement, but his two-word reply shocked me: "And 
MoveOn.org."We were both exaggerating for effect, but fact is, as my 
journalistfriend continued, "We probably only disagree on, maybe, 25 percent 
ofthe issues." I'd have put the percentage a little higher, though 
Itacked an ending onto his sentence: ".and those issues aren't 
especiallyimportant right now."When Air America started, I told 
myself and my friends that it wouldfail because it would be redundant. The 
Left already controls all thetelevision networks besides Fox, along with 
most of the majornewspapers. But here we are a year later, and the most 
penetrating newsanalysis on television is - and I'm not exaggerating here - 
JonStewart's Daily Show on Comedy Central.I tuned into the Boston 
Air America affiliate when I became a communityradio talk show host almost 
two years ago, thinking that I could use afew of their wild statements as a 
springboard to bounce my counterpoint.And although I got a few yuks out of 
quips about "Airhead America," Ifound that I agreed with the hosts more than 
I disagreed with them.They criticized the Bush administration for 
deceiving us into the Iraqwar. No problem there. They criticized Alberto 
Gonzales for his torturememos. Again, no problem. They criticized deficit 
spending, the PATRIOTAct, and corporate welfare. Hurray, hurray, and 
hurray!So I called into a few "progressive" radio talk shows, 
identifyingmyself as a "right-wing radio talk show host," and explained 
myunderstanding of these issues. Stephanie Miller told me that I was 
a"not a very good right-winger." A liberal show host at my radio 
stationeven called me a "liberal."But my views haven't changed one 
bit since I joined the John BirchSociety during the Reagan administration. 
So this is not a conversionstory.What's changed is that the Bush 
administration has simply gotten thatbad and that, according to some polls, 
we are almost at the point wheremost genuine conservatives realize 
it.Thomas R. Eddlem is a native of the Boston area of Massachusetts 
and agraduate of Stonehill College. He is a radio talk show host 
inSoutheastern Massachusetts and is a frequent contributor to The 
NewAmerican magazine.
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Re: [Biofuel] Police Brutality in Ohio

[Appal Energy]

How about a little less emotionally charged, speech and a little more of 
the facts? Nothing personal. Just that the link you offered was 1,000% 
lopsided.

Here's a slightly more factual bit, almost devoid of facts in comparison.

http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=1482Itemid=184

I'm sure that if one were to dig a little deeper there could be found a 
more thorough description of the events.

While it sounds like a legit beef, it would be great to be afforded 
details, not whitewash on one side or hype on the other.

If you do this stuff long enough, you soon realize that facts are your 
best friend and uber emotions all too frequently alienate potential 
advocates.

Todd Swearingen



D. Mindock wrote:

This is happening in America, land of the free  home of the brave. America 
is becoming a land of no compassion for
common folk who protest against the crimes of BushCo. Even peace loving 
pacifists are
being put into FBI databases. Anyone who loves peace and hates war is seen 
as a
terrorist to the Oval Office where our Great Decider presides.
Peace, D. Mindock
http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=1029Itemi 

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[Biofuel] Fw: Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism

[D. Mindock]

This is kooky stuff, but these Dominionists are part of 
the base of BushCo.IMO, they've highjacked
Christianity and made it into a perversely dark image 
of itself. 
Peace, D. Mindock


http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2006/05/12/goldberg/print.html



"Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism"Across the United States, 
religious activists are organizing to establish an American theocracy. A 
frightening look inside the growing right-wing movement. 
By Michelle Goldberg
May. 12, 2006 | A teenage modern dance troupe dressed all in black took their 
places on the stage of the First Baptist Church of Pleasant Grove, a suburb of 
Birmingham, Alabama. Two dancers, donning black overcoats, crossed their arms 
menacingly. As a Christian pop ballad swelled on the speakers, a boy wearing 
judicial robes walked out. Holding a Ten Commandments tablet that seemed to be 
made of cardboard, he was playing former Alabama Supreme Court justice Roy 
Moore. The trench-coated thugs approached him, miming a violent rebuke and 
forcing him to the other end of the stage, sans Commandments. 
There, a cluster of dancers impersonating liberal activists waved signs with 
slogans like "No Moore!" and "Keep God Out!! No God in Court." The boy Moore 
danced a harangue, first lurching toward his tormentors and then cringing back 
in outrage before breaking through their line to lunge for his monument. But the 
dancers in trench coats -- agents of atheism -- got hold of it first and took it 
away, leaving him abject on the floor. As the song's uplifting chorus played -- 
"After you've done all you can, you just stand" -- a dancer in a white robe, 
playing either an angel or God himself, came forward and helped the Moore 
character to his feet. 
The performance ended to enthusiastic applause from a crowd that included 
many Alabama judges and politicians, as well as Roy Moore himself, a gaunt man 
with a courtly manner and the wrath of Leviticus in his eyes. Moore has become a 
hero to those determined to remake the United States into an explicitly 
Christian nation. That reconstructionist dream lies at the red-hot center of our 
current culture wars, investing the symbolic fight over the Ten Commandments -- 
a fight whose outcome seems irrelevant to most peoples' lives -- with an 
apocalyptic urgency. 
- - - - - - - 
- - - - -

On November 13, 2003, Moore was removed from his position as chief justice of 
the Alabama Supreme Court after he defied a judge's order to remove the 2.6-ton 
Ten Commandments monument he'd installed in the Montgomery judicial building. On 
the coasts, he seemed a ridiculous figure, the latest in a line of grotesque 
Southern anachronisms. After all, Moore is a man who, in a 2002 court decision 
awarding custody of three children to their allegedly abusive father over their 
lesbian mother, called homosexuality "abhorrent, immoral, detestable, a crime 
against nature, and a violation of the laws of nature and of nature's God upon 
which this Nation and our laws are predicated," and argued, "The State carries 
the power of the sword, that is, the power to prohibit conduct with physical 
penalties, such as confinement and even execution. It must use that power to 
prevent the subversion of children toward this lifestyle, to not encourage a 
criminal lifestyle." He's a man who writes rhyming poetry decrying the teaching 
of evolution and who fought against the Alabama ballot measure to remove 
segregationist language from the state constitution. 
To the growing Christian nationalist movement, though, Roy Moore is a martyr, 
cut down by secular tyranny for daring to assert God's truth. 
It's a role he seems to love. The battle that cost Moore his job wasn't his 
first Ten Commandments fight. In 1995, the ACLU sued Moore, then a county 
circuit judge, for hanging a Ten Commandments plaque in his courtroom and 
leading juries in prayer. As Matt Labash recalled in an adulatory Weekly 
Standard article, "The conflict's natural drama was compounded when the 
governor, Fob James, announced that he would deploy the National Guard, state 
troopers, and the Alabama and Auburn football teams to keep Moore's tablets on 
the wall." 
That case reached an ambiguous conclusion in 1998, when the state supreme 
court threw out the lawsuit on technical grounds. By then, Moore had become a 
star of the right. Televangelist D. James Kennedy's Coral Ridge Ministries 
raised more than $100,000 for his legal defense fund, and Moore spoke at a 
series of rallies that drew thousands. His right-wing fame helped catapult him 
to victory in the 2000 race for chief justice of the state supreme court. 
Moore installed his massive Ten Commandments monument on August 1, 2001, and 
from the beginning, he and his allies used it to stir up the Christian 
nationalist faithful. He gave videographers from Coral Ridge Ministries 
exclusive access to the courthouse on the night the monument was mounted, and on 
October 14, D. James 

[Biofuel] Fw: Diebold security flaw worst ever!

[D. Mindock]

These Diebold machines are the ace up the sleeve for the neo-con Repugs 
here in the U$ of A. November 2006, the next
big election, for seats in US Congress, is fast approaching. Peace, D. 
Mindock
  ==

What do you think? The t r u t h o u t Town Meeting is in progress. Join the 
debate!

Scientists Call Diebold Security Flaw Worst Ever
By Ian Hoffman

Inside Bay Area
Thursday 11 May 2006

Critics say hole created for upgrades could be exploited by someone with 
nefarious plans.
Computer scientists say a security hole recently found in Diebold 
Election Systems' touch-screen voting machines is the worst ever in a 
voting system.
Election officials from Iowa to Maryland have been rushing to limit the 
risk of vote fraud or disabled voting machines since the hole was reported 
Wednesday.
Scientists, who have conferred with Diebold representatives, said 
Diebold programmers created the security hole intentionally as a means of 
quickly upgrading voting software on its electronic voting machines.
The hole allows someone with a common computer component and knowledge 
of Diebold systems to load almost any software without a password or proof 
of authenticity and potentially without leaving telltale signs of the 
change.
I think it's the most serious thing I've heard to date, said Johns 
Hopkins University computer science professor Avi Rubin, who published the 
first security analysis of Diebold voting software in 2003. Even describing 
why I think it's serious is dangerous. This is something that's so easy to 
do that if the public were to hear about it, it would raise the risk of 
someone doing it This is the worst-case scenario, almost.
Diebold representatives acknowledged the security hole to Pennsylvania 
elections officials in a May 1 memo but said the probability for exploiting 
this vulnerability to install unauthorized software that could affect an 
election is considered low.
California elections officials echoed that assessment Friday in a 
message to county elections chiefs.
But several computer scientists said Wednesday that those judgments are 
founded on the mistaken assumption that taking advantage of the security 
hole would require access to voting machines for a long time.
I don't know anyone who considers two minutes lengthy, if it's that, 
said Michael Shamos, a Carnegie Mellon University computer science professor 
and veteran voting-systems examiner for the state of Pennsylvania.
It's the most serious security breach that's ever been discovered in a 
voting system. On this one, the probability of success is extremely high 
because there's no residue Any kind of cursory inspection of the machine 
would not reveal it.
States using Diebold touch screens are going to have to fix it because 
they can't have an election without having a fix to this, he said. 
Otherwise, states risk challenges from losing candidates while being unable 
to prove easily that the machines worked as designed.
At least two states - Pennsylvania and California - have ordered tighter 
security and reprogramming of all Diebold touch screens, using software 
supplied by the state and a method opened by the security hole. Local 
elections officials then must seal certain openings on the machines with 
tamper-evident tape.
David Wagner, an assistant professor of computer-science at the 
University of California, Berkeley and a technical adviser to the California 
secretary of state's office, said the new measures should minimize risks in 
the June 6 primary.
Elections officials in Georgia, which uses Diebold touch screens 
statewide, said existing state rules already are sufficient.
Bev Harris, founder of BlackBoxVoting.org, a nonprofit group critical of 
electronic voting, said she isn't sure reprogramming and sealing the touch 
screens will fix the problem.
Voting machines often are delivered to polling places several days 
before elections, and the outside case of Diebold's touch screens is secured 
by common Phillips screws. Inside, a hacker can take advantage of the 
security hole, as well as access other security holes, without disturbing 
the tamper-evident seals, Harris said.
Ultimately, there's no way to get rid of the huge security flaws in the 
design, she said.
  ---








 

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Re: [Biofuel] Torture and/or Nuking Iran -- was Re: disinformation Poll in favor of Nukes on Iran

[Keith Addison]

Kieth
Sounds like the game of telephone: each person whispering into 
anothers ear and periodically telling what they
heard;  the morphing of messages from one to another CEO TO BLADn 
TO BUSH TAKES SO LONG BECAUSE the path is NOT LINEAL,  the messages 
path are 3D and of course loopy, maybe even ribosomic and possibly 
sexual; GOOD luck.

I'm okay Irv, I'm not complaining about anything. It's a view that 
fits a lot of other things, worth passing on I thought. Good news, I 
suppose.

I think it's more than 3D. I mentioned memes because they'd just come 
up, but I have an idea how it works, more or less.

 Just think of that: Osama bin Laden just morphed into the CEO of
 ExxonMobil. Ain't that something.

No wonder they can't find the guy. :-)

Regards

Keith


Irv
* 

-Original Message-
 From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: May 10, 2006 3:58 PM
 To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Torture and/or Nuking Iran -- was Re: Poll 
in favor of Nukes on Iran
 
 Lots of people are commenting that Americans are waking up en masse.
 
 One view I get of it comes from what many American applicants to join
 the list tell listadmin.
 
 In the last year the numbers of applicants rose steadily overall, a
 considerably steeper rise than a year previously. The global
 distribution remains the same - very global!
 
 There were always a number of these people among the US contingent:
 
 Results of previous PIPA/Knowledge Networks poll [May 04]:
 
 - A 57% majority believed Iraq was either directly involved in
 carrying out the 9/11 attacks or had provided substantial support
 to al-Qaeda
 - 82% either said that experts mostly agree Iraq was providing
 substantial support to al Qaeda or experts are evenly divided on
 the question
 - 45% believe that evidence that Iraq was supporting al Qaeda
 has been found
 - 60% believe that just before the war Iraq either had weapons of
 mass destruction or a major program for developing them
 - 65% said most experts say Iraq did have them or that experts are
 divided on the question
 - estimates of the number of US troop fatalities in Iraq varied widely
 - 59% were unaware that the majority of world public opinion is
 opposed to the US war with Iraq
 - asked how many nuclear weapons the U.S. has, the median estimate
 was 200 (the actual number is 6,000)
 
 These beliefs are closely correlated with intentions to vote for Bush.
 
 They often give personal detail, but there tends to be a sameness of
 view. They'd often tell listadmin they were interested in biofuels
 because they didn't want to put their money in the pockets of
 terrorists.
 
 Over the last eight months it's been changing, there's a curve.
 
 It changed from terrorists to terrorist nations, and then to unstable
 Middle Eastern regimes. Muslims continued to be favourite unpopular
 people not to put your money in the pockets of (and worse). Around
 that time (post-Katrina) people also started mentioning environmental
 benefits as a possible by-product of using biofuels. Then the actual
 amount they didn't want to give to whoever it was started getting
 much more important as the gas price rose, but the environment got
 more important too, even unto climate change. Climate change slowly
 started changing into global warming, and everything got more intense
 as the gas price kept rising. The number of people who just wanted to
 (or had to) save money rose with it. Government started creeping up
 the unpopularity chart, though mostly only obliquely mentioned, and
 it hasn't made it to the bigtime yet. More recently, indepence from
 foreign oil shot right up, displacing unstable Middle Eastern
 regimes, which fell right down in unpopularity. Foreign oil is still
 right up there, but it was joined by Big Oil companies, and then by
 ExxonMobil, and then by ExxonMobil's retiring CEO with his $400
 million gold watch.
 
 Just think of that: Osama bin Laden just morphed into the CEO of
 ExxonMobil. Ain't that something.
 
 Nobody has yet said they want to make biodiesel because they hate
 Iran. (But they have said that about Saudi Arabia.) Iraq comes into
 it occasionally but never the Iraqis, except maybe as being not worth
 investing more dead soldiers in. Oil and war are sometimes linked,
 especially more recently.
 
 What's all this off-topic political crap got to do with BIODIESEL?
 
 LOL!
 
 It's a list joke. That's what these folks used to say here, and some
 still do. Some who hate ExxonMobil's CEO still say that.
 
 They're moved by memes, as Godwin would say. Just because they think
 something new now doesn't mean they've worked anything much else out
 yet. It doesn't even mean they're aware they thought (felt) something
 different yesterday.
 
 Can you project the curve forward? Who is it they're going to end up
 wanting to make biodiesel so they don't have to put money in his
 pocket?
 
 An 

Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax

[D. Mindock]

Hi Jim,
   Well, I hope the election in Nov 2006 is relatively honest. I feel uneasy
about it. Just too many Diebold and ESS touch-screens will be in use. But, 
if, the
Demos manage to get a majority in Congress after Nov 7, I hope they do the
impeachment of Bush/ Cheney without delay. And then work to unwind
all the damage BushCo has done to the USA, Iraq, etc..
Will the Demos, those that are heavily corporate backed, really try to 
reverse the
harm done? assuming that the Demos do achieve a majority in both the House
and Senate. Will they vote for impeachment knowing how much Big 
Biz/Oil/Drugs
loves Bush and Cheney? I wonder. Perhaps, even if the Demos win in Nov 
things
might not change as much as we Progressives would like. But we can hope, 
huh?
Peace, D. Mindock

- Original Message - 
From: JJJN [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 11:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax


 Hello D.,
 I like what you said and I would like to interject my thoughts on this
 below,

 D. Mindock wrote:

Hi Zeke,
   I must say that I agree with all you've said. After I sent out my
irresponsible message, I felt like I may have misread you. And
I did, so I am glad that I did  sorry too if I bugged you. I
should have known better. Argh!
   Yeah, we need the Democrats and moderate, i.e. true, Republicans


 I feel that as long as the party system is alive and well we will
 continue to have this kind of leadership, we need a way to elect
 responsible leaders that is not driven by hype, money and retoric, Sorry
 but I don't have the wisdom to offer up what vehicle that may be.

too that are sick of BushCo's lavish spending, etc., to both
work together to tame the monster that's demolishing the
USA from the WH. Bush and Cheney are not Republicans but
are radicals with a scary agenda. Bush/Cheney are not even
Americans but corporate creatures with corporate values which means
no morals, no sense of helping the citizenry improve their lives.  They
just want to do, and are doing, anything they can to increase corporate
power
and wealth. It is a house of cards they're building.
  You're correct in that there is a large number of people who'd like
to be rid of Bush and Cheney.

 Not enough though, and when we implode the fall will be great.

 This is largely untapped source
that can help usher out the two idiots in the WH via impeachment.
   Does anyone know why the Democrats are remaining largely silent
at this crucial time?

 Why bother, You will see Americans elect record numbers of Democrats in
 the elections this fall they don't need to do anything. If they do
 the fickle public may turn on them so why not ride the tide.

 Are they afraid of attacks from the Bush propaganda
machine? Is the TV media afraid of letting uppity Democrats, like 
Feinstein,
on
their pundit shows?
   Peace, D. Mindock


 Well anyway luck
 Jim




I was referring to the Democratic party leadership -- stuff like going
along with Bush on anything, kicking Paul Hackett out of the Ohio
senate race, running people like Ken Salazar for senate in Colorado,
not getting their members organized behind people like Feinstein to
really oppose the Bush agenda, apoligizing for Colberts comments,
etc.  There are individual ones who I have alot of respect for --
some of the ones you mentioned, even Dean before he took over the
Democratic party.  There are even individual Republicans who I have
liked (though none come to mind right now).But as a party, the
Democrats most defining characteristic seems to be weak spinedness.

Perhaps I am wrong that enough people in this country oppose Bush, and
for the democrats to truely stand up and oppose him would cost them
support.  If so, we are really in a bad situation.  But I think that
there are enough people who don't agree with the bush agenda that if
one of the political parties was to actually stand up and fight it
full force, people would actually support them.  It almost seems that
right now, there is more press about the splits within the republicans
and various congressional republicans taking Bush to task for stuff.
Why aren't the Democrats as a whole jumping on this opportunity?  It
seems like they don't even support their member who are willing to
take him on.


On 5/12/06, D. Mindock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Zeke,
  If you are talking about Democrats (note the use of capital D) like
Congresswoman DeGette of
Colorado, Hillary Clinton, Joe Liebermann, and others of this ilk then
I would have to agree. Even Kerry leaves a lot to be desired.
  But if you are referring to Sen. Feinstein of Wisconsin, Congressman
Kucinich of Ohio, the late Paul Wellstone, etc., then I must strongly
disagree.
   The problem is that one label does not fit all. So making a blanket
statement like you've made is irresponsible, imo.
Peace, D. Mindock




I would say agree that the democrats are not very good socialists --
morons would be the 

Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax

[Michael Redler]

Hakan,I read your post and I have to say;if I set aside the stuffwe already talked about, the stuff with which I already disagreed (providing an extensive explanation as to why), and the stuffof which most people are already aware, I find myself in full support of you comments.Thank you!MikeHakan Falk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Mike,You mentioned Gulags and if I am not wrong, US have something very similar or worse in Gutanamo. It is also now clear that people got kidnapped by US and sent to secret jails or other nations for "questioning". The principle and use are roughly the same as the Gulags.Yes, the democrats are not using "Stalinist" methods, but Bush is doing his best. You
 are right, the democrats are not there yet, it is the republicans. I assume that they are using the tax dollars for it also. Stalin hijacked the communist idea and built an apparatus to spy and control the citizens. Stalin's USSR had little to do with Lenin's communist ideas.Today we know that there were links between Lenin and the financial powers in Europe and US. Lenin in his French exile was financially supported and it was "corporate" powers who worked on a "regime change" and "democracy" in Russia. Stalin was probably a "dark horse" in this and an uneducated leader, who was unsuitable to lead Russia into the "industrial revolution". He was a product of a backlash and an unwanted surprise.The pattern for Lenin, follows the pattern that later brought AH to power in Germany. He also built Gulags/Gutanamos to control the people. AH clearly had "corporate support" and western ideas.This were the big
 historical dictators, helped and supported by corporations. Then we have numerous small examples in Europe, Far East, Africa and South America and the current backlash against them. History take 100 years to write and it not until now, that we start to get perspective on what happened in the period before the Russian revolution and WWI.HakanAt 00:12 13/05/2006, you wrote:Someone asked:"i believe someone referred to the socialist/communist farce in the USSR asStalinist? would that be a fitting label?"If I understood the question correctly, it was (tongue-in-cheek) about using the label "Stalinist" on Democrats. Of course, I could be mistaken. In any event, I have no idea how Cuba entered the conversation.You wrote: "...this philosophy to use non national soil is a step further."I don't understand what you are trying to say. I'm guessing you are
 referring to Russia using Cuba to extend it's expansionist agenda. If true, I'm not sure where it fits into the conversation.MikeHakan Falk wrote:Mike,Gulags yes, but it is in Cuba of course and a bit warmer thanSiberia, this philosophy to use non national soil is a step further.Assassinate, we do not really know, if we exclude Iraq of course. InIraq it is FFA, except for the English who prosecute their militaryif they murder Iraqi civilians and they find out about it.HakanAt 23:22 12/05/2006, you wrote:Only if they can use tax dollars to build gulags and assassinatewith impunity.We're not their
 yet.MikeJason  Katie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:i believe someone referred to the socialist/communist farce in the USSR asstalinist? would that be a fitting label?- Original Message -From: "Zeke Yewdall"To:Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 9:29 AMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu HoaxI would say agree that the democrats are not very good socialists --morons would be the best description I can think of for them.On 5/12/06, Michael Redler
 wrote:Ray,Democrats make piss-poor socialists and to imply that that they are, isaninsult to socialists. If Teddy Kennedy ran in a true socialist election,Idoubt that he would get a single vote - even if he were the onlycandidate.However, there are candidates who run as members of the socialist party.They are clearly noticeable by their intelligent and articulate responsestothe issues, their concern for the working class, and virtual invisibilityinthe "mainstream" media.Camejo's campaign gives the right
 answershttp://www.socialistworker.org/2003-2/470/470_04_Camejo.shtmlThe Democrats aren't a solutionhttp://www.socialistworker.org/2003-2/461/461_04_OtherLetters.shtml#DemsThe presidential campaigns of Socialist Party leader Eugene Debshttp://www.socialistworker.org/2004-2/514/514_08_Debs.shtmlMikeRay in Atlanta GA wrote:Unfortunately, both the socialists, whoops Democrats, and the
 fascists,excuse me, I mean Republicans, are all busy breaking their necks to jumpon Shrub's band wagon.Ray in Atlanta GAD. Mindock wrote:This seems to be inline with the idea of a police state. Collect allthe info on citizens possible to be stored ina huge database. The cuckoo bird flu scare (a hoax) is to get us toacceptthat anyone can be detained for silly reasons along with the databaseofyour airline flights. Whenthey say the data is to be maintained for at least two months, you canbelieve it will be much longer than that. 

Re: [Biofuel] Police Brutality in Ohio

[D. Mindock]

Todd,

   The conversion of our country into a police state is not
something I can take lightly. I am POed at what's
happening. I hate seeing the promise of America being trashed by
a couple of oil barons and their henchmen, oh, and Ms. Rice.
The facts were there in the link I gave. If you wish to dig deeper, be 
my
guest. In this day and age of disinformation originating from
propaganda disseminated by the US gov, paid for by our tax dollars, who
are you going to trust?
   Have you seen the reportage from the Miami FTAA convention
where people, some elderly, who were peacefully protesting were brutally 
assaulted?
The USA is becoming a huge gulag, one day at a time, imo. The incident
in Ohio with Carol Fisher was not an isolated incident.
Your link, to the same site, is not in disagreement with the link I 
gave.
It's just an update. Same story, same site. I don't know how you can say
my link was lopsided.

Peace, D. Mindock  PS Another update below:

May 11, 10pm: Carol Fisher has been released!  We'll send out more info when 
we have it.  In the meantime, this is an excellent development. But it's 
also NOT over.

We don't know what the judge and other authorities will do next.  Carol's 
sentencing date is June 2. She still faces 3 years in jail and thousands of 
dollars in fines.  We plan to appeal the verdict and challenge all the gross 
violations of her rights.


Click here to find out what you can do to help.

==
- Original Message - 
From: Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 6:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Police Brutality in Ohio


 How about a little less emotionally charged, speech and a little more of
 the facts? Nothing personal. Just that the link you offered was 1,000%
 lopsided.

 Here's a slightly more factual bit, almost devoid of facts in comparison.

 http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=1482Itemid=184

 I'm sure that if one were to dig a little deeper there could be found a
 more thorough description of the events.

 While it sounds like a legit beef, it would be great to be afforded
 details, not whitewash on one side or hype on the other.

 If you do this stuff long enough, you soon realize that facts are your
 best friend and uber emotions all too frequently alienate potential
 advocates.

 Todd Swearingen



 D. Mindock wrote:

This is happening in America, land of the free  home of the brave. 
America
is becoming a land of no compassion for
common folk who protest against the crimes of BushCo. Even peace loving
pacifists are
being put into FBI databases. Anyone who loves peace and hates war is seen
as a
terrorist to the Oval Office where our Great Decider presides.
Peace, D. Mindock
http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_contenttask=viewid=1029Itemi


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Re: [Biofuel] More Gardening News - micro ley farming

[pan ruti]

Ola ,Keith As Brazil is one of the leading exporter of meat and chicken , this ley farming information bring the old , the new all available information in one place is best done. Animalanimal wastesmicrloagaefish and prawn organic gardening using integrated reuse of water is our system modeling work for small scale farmer under our study for comunity developments.In this context I find very important the Ley system for sutainable food, feed, fertilzer and fuel. This can more sustainable the actual production system .Thanking youPannirselvam Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is about using ley farming rotational grazing techniques
 on micro-farms. An overview so far.Ley farming is the lost half of organic growing. It was used alongside scientific composting in an integrated system developed by Friend Sykes, Newman Turner and others with Sir Albert Howard, as well as George Stapledon, in the 1930s to 50s. These were the pioneers of organic growing. Ley farming was based on previous work a hundred years ago by Robert Elliot of Clifton Park ("The Clifton Park System of Farming", see the Small Farms Library at Journey to Forever).In the 60s, after the pioneers died, organic farming was shunted aside by the chemical interests and industrialised farming, and ley farming was forgotten. The most important texts on it are in our Small Farms Library, with more coming, and this has led to a recent revival in ley farming."Sow a piece of land with a good pasture mixture and then divide it in two with a fence. Graze one half heavily and
 repeatedly with cattle, mow the other half as necessary and leave the mowings there in place to decay back into the soil. On the grazed half, you've removed the crop (several times) and taken away a large yield of milk and beef. On the other half you've removed nothing. Plough up both halves and plant a grain crop, or any crop. Which half has the bigger and better yield? The grazed half, by far. "Ley Farming" explains why "grass is the most important crop" and how to manage grass leys. Leys are temporary pastures in a rotation, and provide more than enough fertility for the succeeding crops: working together, grass and grazing animals turn the land into a huge living compost pile."The rotating grassland produces dairy products and beef or mutton, and the effect of the cow manure on the grass and the soil builds up enough soil fertility to grow succeeding crops for three or four years. After usually three years the
 enriched grass turf is disced into the land to fertilise the grain and other crops to follow, three or four years later that field goes back under grass with cattle or sheep. It's a sustainable, largely self-sufficient organic system, with low input, high output and high quality produce. Here's more about it:http://snipurl.com/q4xqRe: [Biofuel] seeding a forage pastureHere's the ley farming section at the Small Farms Library:http://journeytoforever.org/farm_library.html#leySmall Farms Library - Ley FarmingIMO ley farming is THE sustainable farming system, it's complete, and it's very flexible. List member Andres Yver, working at his new ley farm in Argentina, described it as the cheap and easy way of farming.I started working on this 23 years ago, and soon came to focus on small-farm applications. I said in my previous post in this occasional thread, "About the best the small-scale folks
 can do is to follow the traditional Chinese-style farming methods of the East. It's basically gardening more than farming, they tend to each individual plant, there's no mass-production, production rates are very high and it's sustainable. It's one weakness perhaps is in gearing animals to the land. That's what we're doing here, integrated Chinese-style small-scale farming using organic methods and livestock grazing systems. It fits very well with our work with biofuels and energy, a model for sustainable food and fuel farms of the future."And:"We have to deal with city farmers on one hand, gardeners basically, often with very little or no land, and on the other hand with farmers, who go about things in a quite different way, and there's not very much common ground between the two. Or rather there's a no-man's-land, at the peripheries of the cities and towns where rising land values break up the farms into
 small parcels awaiting development, where you find people like smallholders and homesteaders, or folks with 600 sq meters of land like us, or 300 sq yards of back garden like you Robert."Nobody pays any attention to these people but they grow a large amount of food, maybe as much as the city farmers do (15%+ of the world's supply). Gardening techniques don't always suit them very well and neither do farming techniques. For instance, try to find some half-useful information on how to grow wheat in a 20-metre raised bed. You can't even find a sowing rate that isn't geared to large fields and big machines, there's nothing that takes account of the extra care you can take with 

Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax

[JJJN]

Hello D,
Hope is all we have now,  but as long as either party is in charge and 
The masters of greed are in the background buying them off and ruling 
the country for their ends,don't plan on any change very soon but there 
will be some long TALK TALK TALK and mudslinging and so we go.down 
down down and then ?.

My best,
Jim

D. Mindock wrote:

Hi Jim,
   Well, I hope the election in Nov 2006 is relatively honest. I feel uneasy
about it. Just too many Diebold and ESS touch-screens will be in use. But, 
if, the
Demos manage to get a majority in Congress after Nov 7, I hope they do the
impeachment of Bush/ Cheney without delay. And then work to unwind
all the damage BushCo has done to the USA, Iraq, etc..
Will the Demos, those that are heavily corporate backed, really try to 
reverse the
harm done? assuming that the Demos do achieve a majority in both the House
and Senate. Will they vote for impeachment knowing how much Big 
Biz/Oil/Drugs
loves Bush and Cheney? I wonder. Perhaps, even if the Demos win in Nov 
things
might not change as much as we Progressives would like. But we can hope, 
huh?
Peace, D. Mindock

- Original Message - 
From: JJJN [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 11:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax


  

Hello D.,
I like what you said and I would like to interject my thoughts on this
below,

D. Mindock wrote:



Hi Zeke,
  I must say that I agree with all you've said. After I sent out my
irresponsible message, I felt like I may have misread you. And
I did, so I am glad that I did  sorry too if I bugged you. I
should have known better. Argh!
  Yeah, we need the Democrats and moderate, i.e. true, Republicans


  

I feel that as long as the party system is alive and well we will
continue to have this kind of leadership, we need a way to elect
responsible leaders that is not driven by hype, money and retoric, Sorry
but I don't have the wisdom to offer up what vehicle that may be.



too that are sick of BushCo's lavish spending, etc., to both
work together to tame the monster that's demolishing the
USA from the WH. Bush and Cheney are not Republicans but
are radicals with a scary agenda. Bush/Cheney are not even
Americans but corporate creatures with corporate values which means
no morals, no sense of helping the citizenry improve their lives.  They
just want to do, and are doing, anything they can to increase corporate
power
and wealth. It is a house of cards they're building.
 You're correct in that there is a large number of people who'd like
to be rid of Bush and Cheney.

  

Not enough though, and when we implode the fall will be great.



This is largely untapped source
that can help usher out the two idiots in the WH via impeachment.
  Does anyone know why the Democrats are remaining largely silent
at this crucial time?

  

Why bother, You will see Americans elect record numbers of Democrats in
the elections this fall they don't need to do anything. If they do
the fickle public may turn on them so why not ride the tide.



Are they afraid of attacks from the Bush propaganda
machine? Is the TV media afraid of letting uppity Democrats, like 
Feinstein,
on
their pundit shows?
  Peace, D. Mindock


  

Well anyway luck
Jim




  

I was referring to the Democratic party leadership -- stuff like going
along with Bush on anything, kicking Paul Hackett out of the Ohio
senate race, running people like Ken Salazar for senate in Colorado,
not getting their members organized behind people like Feinstein to
really oppose the Bush agenda, apoligizing for Colberts comments,
etc.  There are individual ones who I have alot of respect for --
some of the ones you mentioned, even Dean before he took over the
Democratic party.  There are even individual Republicans who I have
liked (though none come to mind right now).But as a party, the
Democrats most defining characteristic seems to be weak spinedness.

Perhaps I am wrong that enough people in this country oppose Bush, and
for the democrats to truely stand up and oppose him would cost them
support.  If so, we are really in a bad situation.  But I think that
there are enough people who don't agree with the bush agenda that if
one of the political parties was to actually stand up and fight it
full force, people would actually support them.  It almost seems that
right now, there is more press about the splits within the republicans
and various congressional republicans taking Bush to task for stuff.
Why aren't the Democrats as a whole jumping on this opportunity?  It
seems like they don't even support their member who are willing to
take him on.


On 5/12/06, D. Mindock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




Zeke,
 If you are talking about Democrats (note the use of capital D) like
Congresswoman DeGette of
Colorado, Hillary Clinton, Joe Liebermann, and others of this ilk then
I would have to agree. Even 

Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water

[bob allen]

I automatically reject anything which

1. appears to violate extremely simple laws of thermodynamics
2. is supported by testimonial, rather than hard data.
3. doesn't currently sell power to the grid with the device, even though claims 
are made of power 

production.

I guess I just have a lower tolerance for fraud, or at least a higher standard 
for proof.



D. Mindock wrote:
 Bob,
You have your mind set already to reject this. This guy
 is a successful inventor and businessman.
   Did you bother to read the wikipedia reference? I think
 not. You already know it, right? If you did you'd have seen
 that energies are created that are not readily explained. Things
 have changed from the 1970's, new discoveries are being
 made.

sure, but the laws of thermodynamics is not one of those things that have 
changed.
toodles.


   Peace, D. Mindock
 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 8:26 AM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water
 
 
 D. Mindock wrote:
 Bob,
 The inventor was
 quite adamant that over unity was being achieved in the early years of
 development.
 overunity implies (to me anyway) that you get more energy out than you put 
 in.  If that is the case,
 why isn't this guy a bazzillionare?  why isn't he selling power all over 
 the globe? I'll tell you
 why, 'cause it ain't so.


 I think he stopped using this phrase so as not to be seen
 as a whacko (all breakthrough inventors are seen as such).
 no, he stopped using it because he couldn't support the claim with real 
 data.


  He was getting
 a lot of people interested but that was all.
 Anyway, some
 scientists have found temperatures being generated through cavitation to
 be off the charts. Something strange is going on.
 I don't see anything strange.  I say a lecture on the subject of the use 
 sonoluminesence in the 70's
 up put energy in, and you get work -light and heat.

  Everytime there is a
 a dramatic change in physics, there are always those that think it is
 blasphemy, for awhile. (Cold fusion is still under a dark cloud, but it
 refuses
 to go away. Wonder why?)
 because people want to believe that endless energy abounds just around the 
 corner?

  Then as the science behind it becomes more widely
 accepted, there is a rapid change towards acceptance. Sonoluminescence
 is such a thing.
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonoluminesence
 yes, but there is nothing magical or which violates any physical laws 
 involved here.

   Temperatures of over a million degrees K. have been found inside
 collapsing bubbles. Excerpt from wikipedia:
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavitation

 Cavitating water purification devices have also been designed, in which 
 the
 extreme conditions of cavitation can break down pollutants and organic
 molecules. Spectral analysis of light emitted in sonochemical reactions
 reveal chemical and plasma based mechanisms of energy transfer. The light
 emitted from cavitation bubbles is termed sonoluminesence.
 sonochemistry and sonoluminesence have been around for years, big deal

 Peace, D. Mindock  P.S. Now the term bubble fusion is entering the 
 lexicon
 of physics.
 along with N-rays, polywater, over-unity devices?


 - Original Message - 
 From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 7:52 AM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water


 there is a big difference in the process of heating a liquid via
 ultrasonic energy input (NOTE
 ENERGY INPUT) and claiming to extract energy from nowhere.


 D. Mindock wrote:
 Dingel says he wants the money from his inventions to go directly
 to the people of the Phillipines. If he were a charlatan he would want
 the money for himself and then disappear with it. IMO, I think he's
 got something and I hope he finds a foundation, investor, etc., he
 trusts enough to get his technology tweaked  mass produced. But the
 chances
 are slim at best. It is the same with other inventors like him. One
 exception,
 (there may be others?) from Rome, Georgia, stopped using the phrase 
 over
 unity and
 was able to get his product which uses cavitation to heat up
 water, to market. He's now got a successful business going.
 But if he were using this to power cars, which he doesn't, I doubt
 if he would be in business. See: http://www.hydrodynamics.com/
 Peace, D. Mindock


 - Original Message - 
 From: robert luis rabello [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 11:48 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Car runs on water


 miki de mla wrote:


 I guess we just have to see the gadget to believe his claims...
 Be skeptical.  Eyes can be deceived.

 robert luis rabello
 The Edge of Justice
 Adventure for Your Mind
 http://www.newadventure.ca

 Ranger Supercharger Project Page
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/



 ___
 Biofuel mailing 

[Biofuel] Wood

[Mike Weaver]

I heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well, better than 
hickory or elm.  On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12 rounds to 
split and I use a
very heavy maul.

Some wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost 
shatters.  Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and 
doesn't burn worth a hoot.  Skip willow entirely.

Locust is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o seasoning as 
it is very dry.  Elm is very wet and and I usually have to season it for 
a good long time.
I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I used to hate it because it's a 
weed tree, but now I like it as it burns well, grows quickly and is easy 
to get.

-Mike


Jason  Katie wrote:

oak in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real monster to split 
w/o a hydraulic ram splitter

- Original Message - 
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst


  

Ah, interesting definition.  I've never tried to split anything like
oak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they might not
split nicely.

On 5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


As I understand it, hardwoods when split with an axe will not necessarily
'go with the grain' of the wood, whereas softwoods (fir, hemlock, etc)
will... Nice smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, which 
hardwoods
can, but not always will...

HTH Al


- Original Message -
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst


  

Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For example, aspens
have much softer wood than do larch.  I'm not sure of a technical
definition -- a certain hardness or strength or something?  Or in this
case it seems like we're looking for a certain chemical composition,
which could vary with soil type as well?

Z

On 5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I'm not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I think
  

Walnut
  

and Maple are hardwoods.  I'm not sure about elm and cherry.

Sounds to me like it'd be a good source.

--Scott Burton

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason  
Katie
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst

my father is a forester, and is very much involved with resource
  

management
  

(hes the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, every 
three
years a logging company is called in to thin out a small section of 
the
park, and these sections are rotated every cycle. my father collects 
the
tops from the trees that are removed and cuts them for firewood, 
which
  

is
  

all oak, walnut, maple, cherry, and elm. would this group of woods be 
a
suitable supply of ash for KOH? i know the article calls for 
hardwood,
  

but
  

there are some non-pine varieties that dont qualify.

anyway, im rambling. this supply would be a good way to heat an 
alcohol
distillery or even just basic home heating, but there need not be any
  

real
  

waste of energy in the pursuit of wood ash, and anyone with a rain
  

barrel
  

can make their own KOH.


there are a thousand ways around any obstacle but the most fitting is
  

the
  

least obvious.

Jason


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Re: [Biofuel] Wood

[Thomas Kelly]

Mike,
Have you ever split straight grained ash?
Sections 2 feet in diameter yield to 1 or 2 swings of the axe with a 
soulful cracking sound. Makes one feel a bit like Paul Bunyan. Burns good 
seasoned or not.
 Only problem is, many were killed off by disease several years ago here 
in Northeast US. For a while there was plenty of standing dead to take. I 
still have two living ash trees on my property, but wouldn't think of 
cutting them down.
 I've never had a complaint about splitting oak, unless its real knotty.
  Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:54 AM
Subject: [Biofuel] Wood


I heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well, better than
 hickory or elm.  On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12 rounds to
 split and I use a
 very heavy maul.

 Some wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost
 shatters.  Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and
 doesn't burn worth a hoot.  Skip willow entirely.

 Locust is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o seasoning as
 it is very dry.  Elm is very wet and and I usually have to season it for
 a good long time.
 I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I used to hate it because it's a
 weed tree, but now I like it as it burns well, grows quickly and is easy
 to get.

 -Mike


 Jason  Katie wrote:

oak in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real monster to split
w/o a hydraulic ram splitter

- Original Message - 
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst




Ah, interesting definition.  I've never tried to split anything like
oak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they might not
split nicely.

On 5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


As I understand it, hardwoods when split with an axe will not 
necessarily
'go with the grain' of the wood, whereas softwoods (fir, hemlock, etc)
will... Nice smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, which
hardwoods
can, but not always will...

HTH Al


- Original Message -
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst




Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For example, aspens
have much softer wood than do larch.  I'm not sure of a technical
definition -- a certain hardness or strength or something?  Or in this
case it seems like we're looking for a certain chemical composition,
which could vary with soil type as well?

Z

On 5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I'm not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I think


Walnut


and Maple are hardwoods.  I'm not sure about elm and cherry.

Sounds to me like it'd be a good source.

--Scott Burton

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason 
Katie
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst

my father is a forester, and is very much involved with resource


management


(hes the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, every
three
years a logging company is called in to thin out a small section of
the
park, and these sections are rotated every cycle. my father collects
the
tops from the trees that are removed and cuts them for firewood,
which


is


all oak, walnut, maple, cherry, and elm. would this group of woods be
a
suitable supply of ash for KOH? i know the article calls for
hardwood,


but


there are some non-pine varieties that dont qualify.

anyway, im rambling. this supply would be a good way to heat an
alcohol
distillery or even just basic home heating, but there need not be any


real


waste of energy in the pursuit of wood ash, and anyone with a rain


barrel


can make their own KOH.


there are a thousand ways around any obstacle but the most fitting is


the


least obvious.

Jason


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Re: [Biofuel] Wood

[Fritz Friesinger]

Hi,
we up here in Canada split the Wood rigth in the 
cold winter,when everything is hard frozen.It takes half the efford to due the 
job!The hardes Maple,Birch,Ash and Oak splits very well wth a simple strike of 
an Axe.
Elm is an other thing,almost not splittable by hand 
since the crossgrain holds the Fibres very good together,but Elm (dry) burns 
very well and leafs almost no Ashes.
The cathegorys of softwood and hardwoods are 
basically wrong in Context,as it was mentionned before,Larch or Tamarack ist a 
very hard pinacaea(confere)Tree and should therefore not be classified as 
softwood!
Larch is one of the northern hemisphere best Wood 
for construction and in northamerica not commercialized becaus it was to havy to 
float (in the old Times) and for american constuction not suitible becaus to 
hard to nail.
I am working on a project to build prefab 
doublewalled Loghomes from Larch.
Larchwood is very decayresistent and therefore 
suitible to build chemicalfree houses sinze the wood will be treatet with 
Linseedoil only.
The Concept of my project is standing,there are 
only a few minor hurdles to finalize it.
Oh and to add,i know of houses built from Larchwood 
with more than a few hundret jears of age,thats what i call 
sustainable..
Fritz

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Thomas 
  Kelly 
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 12:26 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Wood
  Mike, Have you ever split straight 
  grained ash? Sections 2 feet in diameter yield to 1 or 2 
  swings of the axe with a soulful cracking sound. Makes one feel a bit like 
  Paul Bunyan. Burns good seasoned or not. Only 
  problem is, many were killed off by disease several years ago here in 
  Northeast US. For a while there was plenty of standing dead to take. I 
  still have two living ash trees on my property, but wouldn't think of 
  cutting them down. I've never had a complaint 
  about splitting oak, unless its real 
  knotty. 
  Tom- Original Message - From: "Mike Weaver" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: 
  Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:54 AMSubject: [Biofuel] WoodI 
  heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well, better than 
  hickory or elm. On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12" rounds 
  to split and I use a very heavy maul. Some 
  wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost 
  shatters. Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and 
  doesn't burn worth a hoot. Skip willow entirely. Locust 
  is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o seasoning as it 
  is very dry. Elm is very wet and and I usually have to season it 
  for a good long time. I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I 
  used to hate it because it's a weed tree, but now I like it as it 
  burns well, grows quickly and is easy to get. 
  -Mike Jason  Katie wrote:oak 
  in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real monster to 
  splitw/o a hydraulic ram splitter- 
  Original Message - From: "Zeke Yewdall" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: 
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: 
  Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel 
  CatalystAh, 
  interesting definition. I've never tried to split anything 
  likeoak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they 
  might notsplit nicely.On 
  5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:As I understand it, 
  hardwoods when split with an axe will not 
  necessarily'go with the grain' of the 
  wood, whereas softwoods (fir, hemlock, etc)will... Nice 
  smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, 
  whichhardwoodscan, but not always 
  will...HTH 
  Al- Original 
  Message -From: "Zeke Yewdall" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: 
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: 
  Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] New 
  Biodiesel 
  CatalystOften 
  all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers 
  arecalled softwoods, but that's not really true. 
  For example, aspenshave much softer wood than do 
  larch. I'm not sure of a technicaldefinition -- 
  a certain hardness or strength or something? Or in 
  thiscase it seems like we're looking for a certain 
  chemical composition,which could vary with soil type 
  as 
  well?ZOn 
  5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:I'm 
  not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I 
  thinkWalnutand 
  Maple are hardwoods. I'm not sure about elm and 
  cherry.Sounds to me 
  like it'd be a good 
  source.--Scott 
  Burton-Original 
  Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED][mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  On Behalf Of Jason 
  KatieSent: 
  Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PMTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: 
  Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel 
  Catalystmy father is a 
  forester, and is very much involved with 
  resourcemanagement(hes 
  the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, 
  everythreeyears a 
  logging company is called in to thin out a small section 
  ofthepark, and 

Re: [Biofuel] Microchipping babies

[Debra]

Thank you Marylynn, I wasn't aware of this site. Deborah Howard
- Original Message - 
From: Marylynn Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 10:29 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Microchipping babies


 This was sent through from another list

 http://www.arcticbeacon.com/11-May-2006.html

 Mary Lynn Schmidt



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Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism

[Gustl Steiner-Zehender]

Hallo Folks,

Saturday, 13 May, 2006, 07:07:20, you wrote:

DM This  is  kooky stuff, but these Dominionists are part of the base
DM of BushCo. IMO, they've highjacked Christianity and made it into a
DM perversely dark image of itself.
DM Peace, D. Mindock

Christian  reconstructionism  or dominionism use the language of the
religious right but they are not Christian by any means.  Bush and his
crew are dominionists themselves.  This is an evil lot.  The organized
church  hijacked  the  teachings  and religion of Jesus (which was not
Judaism despite his being raised a Jew) so the dominionists had a good
example  to  follow.  And  no,  I do not wish to nor will I get into a
theological  discussion  of  the  bit  I  put  in  parens  about Jesus
religion  as  my time and energy is needed elswhere presently.  I will
say  that if you want to know what I mean that you mind the indwelling
light and let that lead you to an understanding.

Happy Happy,

Gustl
-- 
Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns.

We can't change the winds but we can adjust our sails.

The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, 
soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, 
without signposts.  
C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters

Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, 
daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht 
gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden.

Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't
hear the music.  
George Carlin

The best portion of a good man's life -
His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love.
William Wordsworth



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Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax

[DHAJOGLO]

Two Davids, how funny,

I didn't comment about you or anything on Rush.  I mearly responded to Keith's 
comment about the way we politicise issues.  Rush is a deaf, racist, drug using 
moron.  If he happened to say something worth while I'm sure it was on accident.

I'm not to concerned about the actual flu.  I was simply pointing out the 
worthless tripe being spread from the dhs.  If the flu mutates and a pandemic 
hits so be it.  Its nature's way of kicking us around for a change.  I have 
faith that the massive drug companies will come up with a costly way to cure 
the rich, and the rich will figure they need a few of us minions to wipe there 
arses, thus spreading a little cure around here and there.

David,
   Please illuminate me. Which statement did I make that is complete
agreement with Rush? I think you've misread me, by a mile. Rush
said the bird flu is a hoax? I had no idea that he had the balls to
take on Rumsfeld, a major beneficiary of this hoax. But if he did
then I agree with him. Mostly I think Rush is a mouthpiece for
the Repug propaganda machine  to be avoided.
Yeah, bugs mutate. So what? Unless you have the perfect match,
the vaccine is a waste. It is better by far to keep one's immune system
in perfect working order, all the time. You are letting the Fear Machine
of our leaders get to you, imo.
Peace, D. Mindock

- Original Message -
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 9:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax


 D. Mindock wrote:

 You know, I'm just flat amazed to find Mr Mindock, whom I regarded as
 about as liberal as they come, in complete agreement with Rush Limbaugh
 and the rest of the conservative radio gang on anything.  And here it
 is, in black and white.

 FWIW, which isn't much, I don't think bugs care at all about
 conspiracies, politics, or big drug companies.  I think bugs mutate.
 Whether bird flu eventually mutates into something that can be passed
 from person to person because of agribusiness, free range birds, or pigs
 being fed infected chickens doesn't really matter once it starts to
 spread.

 --- David

  This seems to be inline with the idea of a police state. Collect all
 the info on citizens possible to be stored in
 a huge database. The cuckoo bird flu scare (a hoax) is to get us to
 accept
 that anyone can be detained for silly reasons along with the database
 of your airline flights. When
 they say the data is to be maintained for at least two months, you can
 believe it will be much longer than that. Just like
 your online traffic through your ISP, all of it, is to be maintained
 for at least a year thanks to a proposal by US Congresswoman DeGette
 (D-CO). Yes, she calls herself a Democrat. We need to write our
 Congress reps that this BS won't fly with us. It is wrong that the NSA
 and the Pentagon are spying on us.  BushCo is a fear based, secretive,
 devisive, newspeak government that is totally controlled by corporate
 powers. I think this is the definition of a fascist regime. No wonder
 the world is becoming terrified of our goverment. Bush and Dead-Eye
 Dick appear to be out-of-control.
 Work for Peace, D. Mindock


   The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax



 Bird FluA plan to quarantine sick airline and ship passengers in order
 to combat a potential bird flu outbreak has outraged health experts,
 airlines, and civil libertarians.

 *Three-Day Quarantine*

 Sick passengers would be identified by flight attendants, pilots and
 cruise ship crews. Passengers identified as sick could be detained in
 quarantine for as long as three days.

 *Detailed Information*

 The proposed rules would also require airlines to collect detailed
 contact information from their passengers, including the names of any
 traveling companions and precise information regarding travel plans.
 The information would be stored for at least two months, and would be
 provided to the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) at any time the
 government asked for it.

 USA Today
 http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2006-04-24-flu-quarantine_x.htm
 April 25, 2006

 

 Dr. Mercola's Comment:

 If this news concerns you, believe me, you're not alone. Many health
 experts, as well as airline personnel and the American Civil Liberties
 Union (ACLU), feel the same way about the various provisions of this
 plan.

 The ACLU argues that the plan basically gives the government a free
 pass to detain whomever it wants to. The airline industry is balking
 at the $100-million-plus cost of creating and maintaining the huge
 passenger information database required.

 Georgina Graham, head of global security for the International Air
 Transport Association, also pointed out that it's ludicrous to give
 the job of identifying sick people to flight crews who have no medical
 training.

 It's starting to look like there's a 

Re: [Biofuel] The Hidden Agenda Behind the Bird Flu Hoax

[DHAJOGLO]

Jason and or Katie

Perhaps isolationist is not exactaly correct... let me clarify.

On Thursday, May 11, 2006  7:22 PM, Jason  Katie wrote:


if the US is so isolationist, why do we keep getting our nose broken for
sticking it in other people's business?


My view is that our general population has retreated into an egotistical 
nationalism (nothing new really).  And as a result we conviently ignore the 
rest of the world.  We've writen off the UN, we want to build walls around 
ourselves to keep others out and we don't really pay attention to the rest of 
the world unless resources are on the line.

Its correct that we are sticking out noses here and there.  I posit that 1% is 
making the decisions and 99% wants to close the border and turn off the light 
so the neighbors think we're gone.  Isolationist may not be exact but big walls 
and ignoring treaties and international authorities is very close wouldn't you 
say.

and then there is the fact that in no way can we stop or contain something
we cannot even adequately define, because there is a good chance it was
designed to be undefinable, i mean, think about it- there was a logbook
style title for the bird flu almost before it was discovered (H5N1). tell
me that wasnt a little bit fast? while it may or may not be part of some
huge nasty corporate black book conspiracy that you can never believe until
it has been officially denied, it just doesnt look good for the large
factory farms. the problem is, they will blame the little guys for raising
tainted birds until they are regulated out of existence, and then the fact
that factory farming is the biggest cause of the bird flu will just all of a
sudden pop up in the mainstream, and the poultry industry will roll over and
die, taking a big chunk of the present food supply with it.

hoax or no, its still gonna get ugly.

Agreed.  My point is that that 1% above knows this and will never admit that we 
can't handle the uglyness and thus the pundit machine is given carte blanche to 
run away with the conspiracies.

Forgive my spelling as I was typing this from a console with limited spell 
checking features.

-dave



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Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator PV Modules

[Zeke Yewdall]

This is exactly what I did my master's thesis on.  The concept works
pretty well from a theoretical perspective.  I was just investigating
using water cooling for non-concrentrating PV, but it would work even
better for concentrating PV.  You shouldn't really have to deal with
1200F, at least if you are talking about water, because the maximum
working temp for a water based fluid is probably about 400F or so??
(assuming antifreeze additives and increased pressure).  Depends on
how much pressure you are talking about I guess.

On 5/13/06, Jason  Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 in theory, if one could find a way to waterproof the back of a PV cell it
 could be used as the heat-side plate in this concentrator/boiler found at
 (or after) http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/solar/page_46.htm you could
 safely increase the power range of a smaller PV cell without too horrible of
 a heat loss. the problem is finding a sealing substance that wont melt or
 burn under these 1200*F temperatures.


 - Original Message -
 From: logan vilas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:54 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules


 I am working with the idea of building my own Concentrator with about 50
  times the mirror space then collector space. That Is why the question was
  asked in the first place I was wondering if placeing a 50watt solar panel
  at
  the focal point would increase the power output. I've read that it is more
  then 100% liner increase in power output when increasing the amount of
  light
  on it. a normal panel at 50 watts would be 2500 watts at 50 suns. I know
  it
  would need to be kept cool. due to the fact that they are only 20-30%
  efficent, but I could use the coolant to heat my biodiesel processor, then
  the hot water going into my home before a tankless heater. If I were to
  get
  a grid tied inverter It would suppliment my normal power useage and maby
  with netmetering it might come close to canceling out my power
  requirements
  alltogther. a simple temp sensor could be used so if the temp is over 150f
  in the coolant it will shut down and not collect the sun anymore. As for a
  solar tracker that is relative easy with very simple electronics. The
  setup
  to hold everything would be a simple build for most people who can make
  their own biodiesel processor. And If I base it off a 7 meter dish I can
  get
  those free. I just have to use the labor to remove it.
 
  Logan Vilas
  - Original Message -
  From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 3:59 PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules
 
 
 I am speaking mostly from experience, from what I have seen work and
  fail in the field, and what I can buy to install for my clients. The
  reason I talk about trackers on large poles is because that is what is
  commercially sold right now (at least in the US, europe is ahead of us
  in many areas).  And the biggest reason I see for failed systems is
  lack of maintenance (mostly batteries, but also anything that moves).
  Also, the number of new innovative PV systems that I have seen come on
  the market over the years, only to dissapear within another year...
  We're still basically doing the same thing as PV was in the 70's, with
  incremental improvements in efficiency and incremental cost decreases.
  I called the concrentrating PV exotic merely because I can't call up
  one of 200 some suppliers and buy one that meets all current
  electrical code, whereas I can with silicon PV modules.  Maybe another
  breakthrough is coming, but in the mean time, alot of people will keep
  using coal generated power because they are waiting for those
  breakthroughs.  I would rather see working PV systems going in today,
  even if they aren't all that high tech, rather than people thinking
  they have to wait before solar energy can work for them -- and in the
  mean time continuing to support coal and oil.   It's not that I want
  to limit the new technology, but what I have seen is that the
  layperson holds out the possibility of a paradigm shift in the
  technology in the future as a reason to do absolutely nothing now.
  And if I recall, the original question was about concentrating
  sunlight on a normal old PV module -- which isn't the best idea --
  they tried that at the carrizo solar plant in the early 80's, and a
  few years later, a whole lot of used Mud-lams (because the encapsulant
  turned varying shades of brown) flooded the market for off-grid use.
 
  I do admit that this list's members are not your average layperson,
  and most of us won't just use the news of new inventions as an excuse
  for procrastinating, so I apologize for that.
 
  Zeke
 
 
  On 5/12/06, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  By now, you may have noticed my resistance to conventional wisdom
  whenever
  someone gives negative feedback about a particular 

Re: [Biofuel] Wood

[Mike Weaver]

I don't mind splitting elm but I do it in very short pieces.  It grows 
in a swirl so long pieces are no fun.  On the other hand it keeps a long 
time and there is a lot free for the taking.  Last year I burned red 
oak, box elder (waste of time, but free and already cut) silver maple 
(not great but free) a lot of mulberry (good) chestnut good, pear, good, 
Holly ok to good.  And some real junk like basswood and so forth that I 
cut into stove size when cleaning up the yard.  This year I've already 
got 2-3 cords red oak.  I'll split it over the Summer.

Fritz Friesinger wrote:

 Hi,
 we up here in Canada split the Wood rigth in the cold winter,when 
 everything is hard frozen.It takes half the efford to due the job!The 
 hardes Maple,Birch,Ash and Oak splits very well wth a simple strike of 
 an Axe.
 Elm is an other thing,almost not splittable by hand since the 
 crossgrain holds the Fibres very good together,but Elm (dry) burns 
 very well and leafs almost no Ashes.
 The cathegorys of softwood and hardwoods are basically wrong in 
 Context,as it was mentionned before,Larch or Tamarack ist a very hard 
 pinacaea(confere)Tree and should therefore not be classified as softwood!
 Larch is one of the northern hemisphere best Wood for construction and 
 in northamerica not commercialized becaus it was to havy to float (in 
 the old Times) and for american constuction not suitible becaus to 
 hard to nail.
 I am working on a project to build prefab doublewalled Loghomes from 
 Larch.
 Larchwood is very decayresistent and therefore suitible to build 
 chemicalfree houses sinze the wood will be treatet with Linseedoil only.
 The Concept of my project is standing,there are only a few minor 
 hurdles to finalize it.
 Oh and to add,i know of houses built from Larchwood with more than a 
 few hundret jears of age,thats what i call sustainable..
 Fritz

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Saturday, May 13, 2006 12:26 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Wood

 Mike,
 Have you ever split straight grained ash?
 Sections 2 feet in diameter yield to 1 or 2 swings of the axe
 with a
 soulful cracking sound. Makes one feel a bit like Paul Bunyan.
 Burns good
 seasoned or not.
  Only problem is, many were killed off by disease several
 years ago here
 in Northeast US. For a while there was plenty of standing dead to
 take. I
 still have two living ash trees on my property, but wouldn't think of
 cutting them down.
  I've never had a complaint about splitting oak, unless its
 real knotty.
   Tom
 - Original Message -
 From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:54 AM
 Subject: [Biofuel] Wood


 I heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well,
 better than
  hickory or elm.  On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12
 rounds to
  split and I use a
  very heavy maul.
 
  Some wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost
  shatters.  Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and
  doesn't burn worth a hoot.  Skip willow entirely.
 
  Locust is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o
 seasoning as
  it is very dry.  Elm is very wet and and I usually have to
 season it for
  a good long time.
  I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I used to hate it because
 it's a
  weed tree, but now I like it as it burns well, grows quickly and
 is easy
  to get.
 
  -Mike
 
 
  Jason  Katie wrote:
 
 oak in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real
 monster to split
 w/o a hydraulic ram splitter
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
 
 
 
 
 Ah, interesting definition.  I've never tried to split anything
 like
 oak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they might not
 split nicely.
 
 On 5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 As I understand it, hardwoods when split with an axe will not
 necessarily
 'go with the grain' of the wood, whereas softwoods (fir,
 hemlock, etc)
 will... Nice smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, which
 hardwoods
 can, but not always will...
 
 HTH Al
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  

Re: [Biofuel] Wood

[Mike Weaver]

Knot that I know of!

I usually burn what I can scrounge, but draw the line at poplar and some 
pine.  Not worth the trouble.

Thomas Kelly wrote:

Mike,
Have you ever split straight grained ash?
Sections 2 feet in diameter yield to 1 or 2 swings of the axe with a 
soulful cracking sound. Makes one feel a bit like Paul Bunyan. Burns good 
seasoned or not.
 Only problem is, many were killed off by disease several years ago here 
in Northeast US. For a while there was plenty of standing dead to take. I 
still have two living ash trees on my property, but wouldn't think of 
cutting them down.
 I've never had a complaint about splitting oak, unless its real knotty.
  Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:54 AM
Subject: [Biofuel] Wood


  

I heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well, better than
hickory or elm.  On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12 rounds to
split and I use a
very heavy maul.

Some wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost
shatters.  Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and
doesn't burn worth a hoot.  Skip willow entirely.

Locust is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o seasoning as
it is very dry.  Elm is very wet and and I usually have to season it for
a good long time.
I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I used to hate it because it's a
weed tree, but now I like it as it burns well, grows quickly and is easy
to get.

-Mike


Jason  Katie wrote:



oak in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real monster to split
w/o a hydraulic ram splitter

- Original Message - 
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst




  

Ah, interesting definition.  I've never tried to split anything like
oak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they might not
split nicely.

On 5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




As I understand it, hardwoods when split with an axe will not 
necessarily
'go with the grain' of the wood, whereas softwoods (fir, hemlock, etc)
will... Nice smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, which
hardwoods
can, but not always will...

HTH Al


- Original Message -
From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst




  

Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For example, aspens
have much softer wood than do larch.  I'm not sure of a technical
definition -- a certain hardness or strength or something?  Or in this
case it seems like we're looking for a certain chemical composition,
which could vary with soil type as well?

Z

On 5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




I'm not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I think


  

Walnut


  

and Maple are hardwoods.  I'm not sure about elm and cherry.

Sounds to me like it'd be a good source.

--Scott Burton

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason 
Katie
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst

my father is a forester, and is very much involved with resource


  

management


  

(hes the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, every
three
years a logging company is called in to thin out a small section of
the
park, and these sections are rotated every cycle. my father collects
the
tops from the trees that are removed and cuts them for firewood,
which


  

is


  

all oak, walnut, maple, cherry, and elm. would this group of woods be
a
suitable supply of ash for KOH? i know the article calls for
hardwood,


  

but


  

there are some non-pine varieties that dont qualify.

anyway, im rambling. this supply would be a good way to heat an
alcohol
distillery or even just basic home heating, but there need not be any


  

real


  

waste of energy in the pursuit of wood ash, and anyone with a rain


  

barrel


  

can make their own KOH.


there are a thousand ways around any obstacle but the most fitting is


  

the


  

least obvious.

Jason


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Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
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--
No virus 

Re: [Biofuel] biodiesel from algae in New Zealand

[Tonomár András]

Hello,

I hav also red about algees before and got me into thinking about a ship
based BD
plant flooting around the oceans.

I would be into something like this.

Do we have any info on how to...???

Andrew


 A commercial facility has produced the first biodiesel derived from
 wild sewage algae in New Zealand.  Full article here:

 http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1ObjectID=10381404

 ___
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 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

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Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator PV Modules

[Hakan Falk]

Zeke,

Thermal solar panels can reach surface temperatures around 400
degree Celsius, but with pump or thermal driven circulation the water
temperatures will not reach boiling temperature and open system can
be used. I have such a system on my roof. Generally the efficiency
is around 35%. The normal PV cells have 8 to 12% efficiency and
the new high efficient ones around 34% efficiency, need cooling
in concentrator applications. If the concentrator is not too efficient,
they can be mounted on an air cooling device, similar to what is used
for electronic components, otherwise they must have liquid cooling.

Design criteria for thermal solar panels was researched by Spanish
and Swedish Universities in Almeria, Spain, in 1960's. This was used
by a Swedish company, that now deliver 70% of the world market for
commercial thermal solar elements. They are delivered in rolls, cut to
size and the space for the liquid is then expanded with air pressure.

This is my understanding of the quite interesting current technological
situation. Since you did your master on solar panels, it would be very
interesting to get your view on where this is moving and perspective on
future possibilities.

Hakan


At 00:29 14/05/2006, you wrote:
This is exactly what I did my master's thesis on.  The concept works
pretty well from a theoretical perspective.  I was just investigating
using water cooling for non-concrentrating PV, but it would work even
better for concentrating PV.  You shouldn't really have to deal with
1200F, at least if you are talking about water, because the maximum
working temp for a water based fluid is probably about 400F or so??
(assuming antifreeze additives and increased pressure).  Depends on
how much pressure you are talking about I guess.

On 5/13/06, Jason  Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  in theory, if one could find a way to waterproof the back of a PV cell it
  could be used as the heat-side plate in this concentrator/boiler found at
  (or after) http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/solar/page_46.htm you could
  safely increase the power range of a smaller PV cell without too 
 horrible of
  a heat loss. the problem is finding a sealing substance that wont melt or
  burn under these 1200*F temperatures.
 
 
  - Original Message -
  From: logan vilas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:54 PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules
 
 
  I am working with the idea of building my own Concentrator with about 50
   times the mirror space then collector space. That Is why the question was
   asked in the first place I was wondering if placeing a 50watt solar panel
   at
   the focal point would increase the power output. I've read that 
 it is more
   then 100% liner increase in power output when increasing the amount of
   light
   on it. a normal panel at 50 watts would be 2500 watts at 50 suns. I know
   it
   would need to be kept cool. due to the fact that they are only 20-30%
   efficent, but I could use the coolant to heat my biodiesel 
 processor, then
   the hot water going into my home before a tankless heater. If I were to
   get
   a grid tied inverter It would suppliment my normal power useage and maby
   with netmetering it might come close to canceling out my power
   requirements
   alltogther. a simple temp sensor could be used so if the temp 
 is over 150f
   in the coolant it will shut down and not collect the sun 
 anymore. As for a
   solar tracker that is relative easy with very simple electronics. The
   setup
   to hold everything would be a simple build for most people who can make
   their own biodiesel processor. And If I base it off a 7 meter dish I can
   get
   those free. I just have to use the labor to remove it.
  
   Logan Vilas
   - Original Message -
   From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 3:59 PM
   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules
  
  
  I am speaking mostly from experience, from what I have seen work and
   fail in the field, and what I can buy to install for my clients. The
   reason I talk about trackers on large poles is because that is what is
   commercially sold right now (at least in the US, europe is ahead of us
   in many areas).  And the biggest reason I see for failed systems is
   lack of maintenance (mostly batteries, but also anything that moves).
   Also, the number of new innovative PV systems that I have seen come on
   the market over the years, only to dissapear within another year...
   We're still basically doing the same thing as PV was in the 70's, with
   incremental improvements in efficiency and incremental cost decreases.
   I called the concrentrating PV exotic merely because I can't call up
   one of 200 some suppliers and buy one that meets all current
   electrical code, whereas I can with silicon PV modules.  Maybe another
   breakthrough is coming, but in the mean time, alot 

Re: [Biofuel] Wood

[Zeke Yewdall]

I agree with Fritz.  Larch is great -- probably the best for building
(in the northwest US at least, where cottonwood and aspen is the only
broadleaf tree of any size).  I've tried to remove larch stumps 40
years after they were cut, and they are still largely as hard as rock
-- very dense red heartwood that doesn't seem to rot very fast.  It
also makes great firewood, easy to split, the trees for the most part
have no limbs on them, and the bark falls right off (if you let it dry
standing about 5 years after it dies).  I'm a little bummed that larch
doesn't grow here in Colorado, as the pines here are a bit inferior
for both firewood and construction.  And larches make pretty forests
too -- sort of fernlike looking (foliage pattern is actually the same
as true cedars from the middle east), and turning yellow and shedding
their needles in the fall.  Of course we have the aspens here for
adding some fall color.


On 5/13/06, Fritz Friesinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 Hi,
 we up here in Canada split the Wood rigth in the cold winter,when everything
 is hard frozen.It takes half the efford to due the job!The hardes
 Maple,Birch,Ash and Oak splits very well wth a simple strike of an Axe.
 Elm is an other thing,almost not splittable by hand since the crossgrain
 holds the Fibres very good together,but Elm (dry) burns very well and leafs
 almost no Ashes.
 The cathegorys of softwood and hardwoods are basically wrong in Context,as
 it was mentionned before,Larch or Tamarack ist a very hard
 pinacaea(confere)Tree and should therefore not be classified as softwood!
 Larch is one of the northern hemisphere best Wood for construction and in
 northamerica not commercialized becaus it was to havy to float (in the old
 Times) and for american constuction not suitible becaus to hard to nail.
 I am working on a project to build prefab doublewalled Loghomes from Larch.
 Larchwood is very decayresistent and therefore suitible to build
 chemicalfree houses sinze the wood will be treatet with Linseedoil only.
 The Concept of my project is standing,there are only a few minor hurdles to
 finalize it.
 Oh and to add,i know of houses built from Larchwood with more than a few
 hundret jears of age,thats what i call sustainable..

 Fritz


 - Original Message -
 From: Thomas Kelly
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org

 Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 12:26 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Wood

 Mike,
 Have you ever split straight grained ash?
 Sections 2 feet in diameter yield to 1 or 2 swings of the axe with a
 soulful cracking sound. Makes one feel a bit like Paul Bunyan. Burns good
 seasoned or not.
  Only problem is, many were killed off by disease several years ago here
 in Northeast US. For a while there was plenty of standing dead to take. I
 still have two living ash trees on my property, but wouldn't think of
 cutting them down.
  I've never had a complaint about splitting oak, unless its real knotty.
   Tom
 - Original Message -
 From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:54 AM
 Subject: [Biofuel] Wood


 I heat w/ wood and in my experience oak splits pretty well, better than
  hickory or elm.  On the other hand, I tend to cut in in 12 rounds to
  split and I use a
  very heavy maul.
 
  Some wood, like pear, burns well and it easy to split, as it almost
  shatters.  Other wood, like box elder, is impossible to split and
  doesn't burn worth a hoot.  Skip willow entirely.
 
  Locust is hard to split but you can burn it pretty much w/o seasoning as
  it is very dry.  Elm is very wet and and I usually have to season it for
  a good long time.
  I've changed my opinion of mulberry - I used to hate it because it's a
  weed tree, but now I like it as it burns well, grows quickly and is easy
  to get.
 
  -Mike
 
 
  Jason  Katie wrote:
 
 oak in fact does not split cleanly, and hickory is a real monster to split
 w/o a hydraulic ram splitter
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:38 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
 
 
 
 
 Ah, interesting definition.  I've never tried to split anything like
 oak or hickory or such, so I didn't even think that they might not
 split nicely.
 
 On 5/12/06, A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 As I understand it, hardwoods when split with an axe will not
 necessarily
 'go with the grain' of the wood, whereas softwoods (fir, hemlock, etc)
 will... Nice smooth splits, no splintering off to one side, which
 hardwoods
 can, but not always will...
 
 HTH Al
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
 
 
 
 
 Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
 called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For 

Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator PV Modules

[Logan Vilas]

The main concern would be thermal transfer rates of the materials that the
cell is made out of and max temp the cell can handle. I know PV are made
from silicone, but is there any more depective terms for the material? For
example all Iron is not steel and every version of it has different thermal
transfer rates. What is the maximum working temp of PV modules? From Those
two things I can calculate the maximum amount of concentration that should
work. Also approximately how large is a 50watt panel?

I can pick a PV module then based on size and material thermal transfer I
can calculate the thermal transfer it would have in BTUs. I would then
divide by 3.4 and that's the number of watts it can have aimed at it.
There's approximately 1000watts per square meter energy from the sun. The
mirrors are about 92% reflective and I would figure there it going to be
about 10% loss to heating the air between the PV and the mirrors. 82.8
percent of the energy will be transferred to the PV. That's 828watts per
square meter of mirrors. Divide the thermal transfer by 828 and that's the
max concentration that can be focused at that cell to keep it at the same
temp as the input temp of the coolant you are using. 

The overall design should be engineered to keep the cell within working temp
limits without loosing much of the power gain, so under 200F (I'm guessing),
while being able to dissipate 100% of the heat that is concentrated. It
would need to dissipate all the heat because of the chance that no
electricity will be used and all the energy will become heat. When 20-30% of
the energy is being turned into electricity then the cell temp will remain
an equal percentage lower. At these temps it could be done with water and no
additives, but a closed system with relief valve would be best otherwise the
water would evaporate. 

I am thinking a closed loop system of filtered and dewatered UVO. I have
firefighting material called fire blockade that can be added at 1% mixture
and that will ensure the oil is nonflamiable. That would cause the fluid to
not boil off or spontaneously combust.

Logan Vilas

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 5:30 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules

This is exactly what I did my master's thesis on.  The concept works
pretty well from a theoretical perspective.  I was just investigating
using water cooling for non-concrentrating PV, but it would work even
better for concentrating PV.  You shouldn't really have to deal with
1200F, at least if you are talking about water, because the maximum
working temp for a water based fluid is probably about 400F or so??
(assuming antifreeze additives and increased pressure).  Depends on
how much pressure you are talking about I guess.

On 5/13/06, Jason  Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 in theory, if one could find a way to waterproof the back of a PV cell it
 could be used as the heat-side plate in this concentrator/boiler found at
 (or after) http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/solar/page_46.htm you could
 safely increase the power range of a smaller PV cell without too horrible
of
 a heat loss. the problem is finding a sealing substance that wont melt or
 burn under these 1200*F temperatures.


 - Original Message -
 From: logan vilas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:54 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Concentrator  PV Modules


 I am working with the idea of building my own Concentrator with about 50
  times the mirror space then collector space. That Is why the question
was
  asked in the first place I was wondering if placeing a 50watt solar
panel
  at
  the focal point would increase the power output. I've read that it is
more
  then 100% liner increase in power output when increasing the amount of
  light
  on it. a normal panel at 50 watts would be 2500 watts at 50 suns. I know
  it
  would need to be kept cool. due to the fact that they are only 20-30%
  efficent, but I could use the coolant to heat my biodiesel processor,
then
  the hot water going into my home before a tankless heater. If I were to
  get
  a grid tied inverter It would suppliment my normal power useage and maby
  with netmetering it might come close to canceling out my power
  requirements
  alltogther. a simple temp sensor could be used so if the temp is over
150f
  in the coolant it will shut down and not collect the sun anymore. As for
a
  solar tracker that is relative easy with very simple electronics. The
  setup
  to hold everything would be a simple build for most people who can make
  their own biodiesel processor. And If I base it off a 7 meter dish I can
  get
  those free. I just have to use the labor to remove it.
 
  Logan Vilas


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[Biofuel] Wood ash lye - was Re: New Biodiesel Catalyst

[Keith Addison]

How about this: make sodium hydroxide from table salt, using PET 
bottles, flashlight batteries, glue and so on.

http://snipurl.com/qes2
[biofuel]  Making methanol and lye - was Re: [biofuel] Another 
biodiesel from etha

http://snipurl.com/qes3
Re: [biofuel] Re: Hydrogen Economy

You also end up with hydrogen and chlorine, which I guess you could 
turn into hydrochloric acid, not sure quite how though (nor how to 
concentrate it after that). Nor if you could still do that after 
drying the lye (energy-in).

If you deacidify WVO with lye water you can treat the stuff you 
remove this way (soapstock, more or less):

Thus an equimolar amount of calcium chloride may be directly added 
to the soapstock and prompt separation of the calcium soap by 
precipitation from a relatively pure saline (NaCl) solution will 
ensue. Calcium soaps are useful industrial ingredients, for instance 
as demoulding agents.

It's a few years since I did all this, I can check it out, but IIRC, 
if you used NaOH as the catalyst, you can do that with the glycerine 
by-product too. You end up with a calcium soap that resists water, 
like Dubbin, good water-proofer and release agent, and then you can 
use the electrolysis method in the archives links to turn the salt 
solution back into lye.

With KOH catalyst you'd get calcium soap plus I suppose KCl, muriate 
of potash, chemical fertiliser, but maybe you could make KOH from it 
by the same method used to make NaOH from table salt.

Some people use HCl instead of phosphoric acid to separate the 
glycerin by-product layer, as here:
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_glycsep.html
Separating glycerine/FFAs

Industry does it with sulphuric acid. With HCl instead of sodium 
phosphate you'd end up with sodium chloride, more table salt, which 
you could turn into more NaOH. At least I think you'd end up with 
sodium chloride, maybe other salts too, but you still might get a 
usable lye.

Might be worth a check, but don't take my word for it.

Best

Keith


Hi all

Re the lye, I think it's just a matter of doing it. Measure the ash 
lye against a standard, 0.1% NaOH solution titration of a WVO 
sample, so you have an idea of how much to use, and brew a series of 
test batches with it.

You might have to keep doing that every time you made a fresh lye 
from a new batch of wood ash. From previous: Trouble is the content 
of wood ash varies widely. Another problem is that the KOH is mixed 
with potassium carbonate, and some sodium too. Which may not be as 
big a problem as it sounds.

I got an email from a student experimenting with woodash KOH, I told 
him I was forwarding it to the list and he could follow the 
discussions here (he's not a list member):

From: josh waters
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 15:36:00 -0500
Subject: Biodiesel and home made Lye

Dear Keith,

   As a newcomer to the world of eco-friendly fuels and its small 
scale manufacture I would like to personally thank you and all the 
contributors to Journey to Forever for the priceless wealth of 
information that is made available. Now, with that being said, I 
have prepared a batch of lye water following the soapmaking steps 
listed on the site, and then proceeded to boil out all moisture in 
the solution to attempt to make powdered lye.(a picture of the 
water has been included) As the water boiled out, a thin, 
dry crust  of what i can only assume is lye was left in the bottom 
of the pan. (which will never be used for cooking purposes again!) 
The crust was then scraped out of the pan, collected, weighed and 
bagged. A small sample of the 'lye' was dissolved in a quantity of 
distilled water and then checked with Litmus paper (which read 
approx. 14-ish) (photo also included) While I understand this to be 
a fairly strong alkali I dont real ly know if this is in fact lye. 
Questions, comments, and criticism would be greatly appreciated and 
will hopefuully determine whether or not I can use this substance.

Thank you once again,

Joshua Waters,

18

Student

Joshua sent me two photographs, I uploaded them here:

http://journeytoforever.org/bflpics/Lyewater.jpg
http://journeytoforever.org/bflpics/lyelitmustest.jpg

Best

Keith


  - Original Message -
  From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
 
 
   Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
   called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For example, aspens
   have much softer wood than do larch.  I'm not sure of a technical
   definition -- a certain hardness or strength or something?  Or in this
   case it seems like we're looking for a certain chemical composition,
   which could vary with soil type as well?
  
   Z
  
   On 5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I think
  Walnut
and Maple are hardwoods.  I'm not sure about elm 

[Biofuel] Wood ash lye - was Re: New Biodiesel Catalyst

[Keith Addison]

Hi all

Re the lye, I think it's just a matter of doing it. Measure the ash 
lye against a standard, 0.1% NaOH solution titration of a WVO sample, 
so you have an idea of how much to use, and brew a series of test 
batches with it.

You might have to keep doing that every time you made a fresh lye 
from a new batch of wood ash. From previous: Trouble is the content 
of wood ash varies widely. Another problem is that the KOH is mixed 
with potassium carbonate, and some sodium too. Which may not be as 
big a problem as it sounds.

I got an email from a student experimenting with woodash KOH, I told 
him I was forwarding it to the list and he could follow the 
discussions here (he's not a list member):

From: josh waters
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 15:36:00 -0500
Subject: Biodiesel and home made Lye

Dear Keith,

   As a newcomer to the world of eco-friendly fuels and its small 
scale manufacture I would like to personally thank you and all the 
contributors to Journey to Forever for the priceless wealth of 
information that is made available. Now, with that being said, I 
have prepared a batch of lye water following the soapmaking steps 
listed on the site, and then proceeded to boil out all moisture in 
the solution to attempt to make powdered lye.(a picture of the water 
has been included) As the water boiled out, a thin, dry crust  of 
what i can only assume is lye was left in the bottom of the pan. 
(which will never be used for cooking purposes again!) The crust was 
then scraped out of the pan, collected, weighed and bagged. A small 
sample of the 'lye' was dissolved in a quantity of distilled water 
and then checked with Litmus paper (which read approx. 14-ish) 
(photo also included) While I understand this to be a fairly strong 
alkali I dont real ly know if this is in fact lye. Questions, 
comments, and criticism would be greatly appreciated and will 
hopefuully determine whether or not I can use this substance.

Thank you once again,

Joshua Waters,

18

Student

Joshua sent me two photographs, I uploaded them here:

http://journeytoforever.org/bflpics/Lyewater.jpg
http://journeytoforever.org/bflpics/lyelitmustest.jpg

Best

Keith


  - Original Message -
  From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 6:57 AM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
 
 
   Often all broadleaf trees are called hardwoods, and all conifers are
   called softwoods, but that's not really true.  For example, aspens
   have much softer wood than do larch.  I'm not sure of a technical
   definition -- a certain hardness or strength or something?  Or in this
   case it seems like we're looking for a certain chemical composition,
   which could vary with soil type as well?
  
   Z
  
   On 5/11/06, Scott Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm not an expert in these matters, but I know that Oak and I think
  Walnut
and Maple are hardwoods.  I'm not sure about elm and cherry.
   
Sounds to me like it'd be a good source.
   
--Scott Burton
   
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason 
Katie
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
   
my father is a forester, and is very much involved with resource
  management
(hes the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, every
three
years a logging company is called in to thin out a small section of
the
park, and these sections are rotated every cycle. my father collects
the
tops from the trees that are removed and cuts them for firewood,
which
  is
all oak, walnut, maple, cherry, and elm. would this group of woods be
a
suitable supply of ash for KOH? i know the article calls for
hardwood,
  but
there are some non-pine varieties that dont qualify.
   
anyway, im rambling. this supply would be a good way to heat an
alcohol
distillery or even just basic home heating, but there need not be any
  real
waste of energy in the pursuit of wood ash, and anyone with a rain
  barrel
can make their own KOH.
   
   
there are a thousand ways around any obstacle but the most fitting is
  the
least obvious.
   
Jason
 


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Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
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[Biofuel] Wood ash lye - was Re: New Biodiesel Catalyst

[Keith Addison]

 From another list, four years ago:

Okay, try this:

Find some used drums or other containers,  spend a day running 
around seeing how much used cooking grease you can obtain for 
free from resatraunts. Once you get home with the stuff, strain 
it through a couple thicknesses of old bath towells. Then add 2 
cups LYE (leached from wood ashes),  1 pint alcohol (moonshine 
etc.) to each 5 gallons, stir well. Allow to set over night to 
settle, then siphon the liquid off, leaving the thick glycerin in 
the bottom of the container.

This stuff makes a perfect substitute for DEISEL FUEL (I've run 
one of my tractors on it for a decade!),  if you'll add some 
kerosene deodorizer, it works great in lamps  kerosene heaters 
as well!

LOL!

The person who sent it to me disagreed and referred him to JtF, but 
the guy with the undead tractor told him it was disinformation.

Anyway, I guess that's the margin for screwing it up with 
experimental wood ash lye catalyst, it'll take at least ten years not 
to kill your tractor yet. Even a PDi should be okay for the legendary 
dozens of miles. Always look on the bright side of life, ta-dum.

This is what Mother Earth News said long ago when it was still Mother 
Earth News:

Punch drain holes in the bottom of a five-gallon can, place a 
five-inch layer of straw inside, fill the container with ashes, and 
mount it on top of another five-gallon can. Then pour water into the 
upper vessel and, as it trickles through (a slow process when done 
correctly), add a little more each day until the lower can is nearly 
filled with . . . homemade lye water.

Boil the solution in the lower can until a chunk of potato will 
float on its surface and then use it in your favorite soap recipe or 
in any other way that you need dissolved lye around the homestead. 
(And be careful! It can burn just as badly as the lye you buy in a 
store.) 



Best

Keith



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason 
Katie
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 4:57 PM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] New Biodiesel Catalyst
   
my father is a forester, and is very much involved with resource
  management
(hes the coordinator) at a forest preserve where i grew up, every
three
years a logging company is called in to thin out a small section of
the
park, and these sections are rotated every cycle. my father collects
the
tops from the trees that are removed and cuts them for firewood,
which
  is
all oak, walnut, maple, cherry, and elm. would this group of woods be
a
suitable supply of ash for KOH? i know the article calls for
hardwood,
  but
there are some non-pine varieties that dont qualify.
   
anyway, im rambling. this supply would be a good way to heat an
alcohol
distillery or even just basic home heating, but there need not be any
  real
waste of energy in the pursuit of wood ash, and anyone with a rain
  barrel
can make their own KOH.
   
   
there are a thousand ways around any obstacle but the most fitting is
  the
least obvious.
   
Jason


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/