[Talk-GB] State of the Map Scotland 2012 October 19-20th Initial Organisation

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

This is to announce that State of the Map Scotland 2012 is going to take place 
on October 19-20th in Edinburgh. See

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_Scotland_2012


This e-mail is only an initial call to review the organisation of the 
conference. There is no booking at this time but will be available in a couple 
of weeks.

Cheers

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[Talk-GB] State of the map Scotland 2012 booking now open

[Bob Kerr]

Slight change of plans,

Booking is now available

http://sotms.eventbrite.com/


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[Talk-GB] State of the map Scotland - Speakers and Sponsors

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

This years State of the map Scotland is a slightly different affair than last 
years due to a larger venue.

We are splitting both days into two, morning and afternoon. In the afternoon we 
are requesting speakers from other GIS or professional organisations to come in 
and speak about their work with maps. These talks do not have to be about 
Openstreetmap or free data but it would be good if there was some connection. 
This will allow us to use the conference as a meeting of minds between 
volunteer mappers and professional groups. We have 16 30 minute slots available 
in the two days and two conference rooms. This will be the formal side of the 
conference, The mornings will be reserved for Openstreetmappers in the non 
conference format.

Details of the Conference here

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_Scotland_2012


If anyone knows of any groups that would like to speak please let me know.

We are also looking for some small sponsorship to pay for Edinburgh University 
Staff who are needed to let us in.

Cheers


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Re: [Talk-GB] SotM 2013

[Bob Kerr]

Would October be too late?

If October is Ok and State of the map Scotland 2012 goes ok this year we may be 
able to put in a bid  here.
 



 From: Richard Fairhurst 
To: talk-gb OSM List (E-mail)  
Sent: Wednesday, 12 September 2012, 21:54
Subject: [Talk-GB] SotM 2013
 
Hello all,

This is just a little heads-up, nothing more.

Before too long it'll be time for OSMF to start soliciting bids to host the 
State of the Map conference next year.

This year was of course Tokyo, and last year Denver. So it might seem sensible 
that it returns to Europe for 2013 - and we haven't had a UK SotM since the 
first one (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_2007). The open 
source GIS conference, FOSS4G, is also coming to the UK next year - to 
Nottingham in September.

Perhaps some of you might like to start thinking about organising a bid? Lots 
of potential in the country where OSM was founded and which, in coverage terms, 
is only rivalled by Germany. Personally I'd love to see it in Oxford but don't 
have the time to help organise it, sadly!

cheers
Richard


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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Pub meeting on Tuesday 18th Guildford arms

[Bob Kerr]

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Upcoming_Pub_Meetings


We will be discussing among other things state of the map Scotland

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_Scotland_2012


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[Talk-GB] State of the Map Scotland : Edinburgh: This Friday 19th -20th October

[Bob Kerr]

OK,
We have an excellent venue
We have 67 booked in and are expecting another 30  walkins. We 
have an amazing set of speakers that are coming to meet with 
Openstreetmap.org because they realise how important it is becoming and 
share a common interest in the upsurge of interest in GIS
Speakers list here
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_Scotland_2012#Area_1:_Main_Presentation_Area_-_Schedule
We will have a small gallery of digital and paper maps, Spherical displays, and 
quadcopters.
It should be an excellent event, I hope you can make it

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[Talk-GB] Taginfo Golf Tags

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

I have been looking at TagInfo for  tags with golf= 

There are a number of tags which are golf=Tee instead of golf=tee. Is there any 
easy way that I find out where these tags are located so that I can correct 
them.

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Re: [Talk-GB] Taginfo Golf Tags

[Bob Kerr]

Thanks for all the help and the links,

As I have cleared up some of the obvious mistakes for the golf tag like using 
capital letters in tags, has there ever been a precedent where someone adopts a 
tag. For example if I say that I am going to adopt the golf=** in english 
for one year. I would put my name up on the wiki page as adoptee.

P.S.

I like the lines on the pitches and the way that the trees are done too.

Cheers

Bob



 From: Dave F. 
To: "Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org"  
Sent: Thursday, 11 April 2013, 15:59
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Taginfo Golf Tags
 


Thanks to Ed & John. I really like the white lines pitch markings. 

Dave F.

On 11/04/2013 02:38, John Baker wrote:

 
>
>
>The French OSM site has worldwide mapnik rendering of golf
courses and nifty sports pitches mapped too.
>
>http://tile.openstreetmap.fr/?zoom=16&lat=48.72648&lon=2.60806&layers=B0
>
>I imagine they will be migrated to osm.org when cartoCSS
eventually goes live.
>
>
>
>
>Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2013 01:35:41 +0100
>From: dave...@madasafish.com
>To: openstreetmapcraigmil...@yahoo.co.uk
>CC: Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Taginfo Golf Tags
>
>
>On 05/04/2013 15:04, Bob Kerr wrote:
>
>Hi,
>>
>>
>>I have been looking at TagInfo for  tags with golf= 
>>
>>
>>There are a number of tags which are golf=Tee instead of golf=tee. Is there 
>>any easy way that I find out where these tags are located so that I can 
>>correct them.
>>
>Hi Again Bob
>
>Just discovered in Taginfo there's a similar, but quicker site
  to the one I suggested earlier. In the top right of the screen
  there's an icon next to where it says XPI & JOSM (looks a
  bit like a 3 spoked steering wheel). Clicking on it takes you
  to another site. Left hand side you can amend the key &
  value then click Run.
>
>BTW, are there any renderings that show golf course details
  like tees, bunkers, greens etc? It's a shame mapnik doesn't.
>
>Cheers
>Dave F. 
>
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[Talk-GB] Writing a howto wiki page for mapping golf courses

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

I have been spending a lot of time looking at Taginfo and golf courses. I would 
like to layout the best way to map a golf course based on what I have found. 

I was thinking of creating a page "HOWTO map a golf course 2013"

This is not a proposal for tags, I would link to Taginfo pages of tags that are 
already used, this would just help with data consistency.

My reasoning comes from the idea that mappers like a challenge like a golf 
course, much like they do a zoo. In Scotland there are between 530-630 golf 
courses. This would be useful if the data were consistent. It would also get 
the golfing community talking about openstreetmap and there are a considerable 
number of golfers

Are there any precedents for HOWTO pages

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Re: [Talk-GB] Writing a howto wiki page for mapping golf courses

[Bob Kerr]

Thanks,

I have seen Richards page before but I am a lot further on, I have found out 
that there are something like 50 tags ranging from golf=tee_area, 
amenity=shelter, landuse=grass, golf=ball_washer. I noticed that there are even 
some folk that are attempting to put in pars and indexes. I just think that 
there is some documentation that needs to be done. So I am volunteering.

Is there no precedent for HOWTO documents like there are with other  opensource 
projects?

Cheers

Bob



 From: sk53.osm 
To: Bob Kerr  
Cc: "talk-gb@openstreetmap.org"  
Sent: Tuesday, 30 April 2013, 12:07
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Writing a howto wiki page for mapping golf courses
 


Have you seen Richard Weait's page on this subject : http://weait.com/node/21.

And fewer of those named ways to make the hole names look nice :-)

Jerry




On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 11:57 AM, Bob Kerr 
 wrote:

Hi,
>
>
>I have been spending a lot of time looking at Taginfo and golf courses. I 
>would like to layout the best way to map a golf course based on what I have 
>found. 
>
>
>I was thinking of creating a page "HOWTO map a golf course 2013"
>
>
>This is not a proposal for tags, I would link to Taginfo pages of tags that 
>are already used, this would just help with data consistency.
>
>
>My reasoning comes from the idea that mappers like a challenge like a golf 
>course, much like they do a zoo. In Scotland there are between 530-630 golf 
>courses. This would be useful if the data were consistent. It would also get 
>the golfing community talking about openstreetmap and there are a considerable 
>number of golfers
>
>
>Are there any precedents for HOWTO pages
>
>
>Cheers
>
>Bob
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Tidying up some shop tags

[Bob Kerr]

I assume that this is for the UK shops and not world wide using the uk taginfo 
site

http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org.uk/


cheers

Bob



 From: sk53.osm 
To: "Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org"  
Sent: Sunday, 5 May 2013, 14:25
Subject: [Talk-GB] Tidying up some shop tags
 


I propose to tidy up some shop=* tag values. I am not certain of the full 
scope, but here are ones I do know about:


* to shop=bookmaker from bookmakers, bookies, Bookmaker, Bookmakers, 
bookmarkers,turf_accountant [shop=betting has nearly as many uses as 
shop=bookmaker, and shop=gambling also exists]
* to shop=clothes from clothing [shop=fashion also exists]
* to shop=books from bookstore
* to shop=comics from comic, comicbook
* to shop=alcohol from off_licence, offlicense, offlicence, off_license
* to shop=vacant from shop=empty & shop=closed, shop=currently_unlet, 
shop=former_florist, shop=Vacant (but not shop=disused)
* to shop=pet from shop=pets, pet_shop
* to shop=carpet from shop=carpets (and various combos of CarpetRIght)
* to shop=beauty from shop=beauty_salon
* to shop=locksmith from shop=keycutting
* to amenity=fast_food, cuisine=fish_and_chips from shop=fish_and_chips
* to amenity=fast_food, cuisine=sandwich  from shop=sandwich shop
I think these all reflect reallocation to more widely used tags.
There are plenty of values of shop which would benefit from some consolidation, 
such as the many different varieties of shops selling furnishings (blinds, 
curtains, ) and sporting goods (golf,ski_hire ...) which could do with a 
single overall value and adjectival tagging for the detail.
I must say the combos shop=fish, shop=fishmonger and shop=fishing are likely to 
lead to confusion. In particular is shop=fish a fishmonger, a pet shop or an 
angling shop?

I am not sure if some people tag shop=laundry for dry cleaners or of they are 
always separate Personally it makes sense to combine cleaning services 
(ironing, repair, dry cleaning, steam laundry etc) of this type under a single 
tag.
Some retailers seem to cause particular problems in choosing an appropriate 
tag. Wilkinsons are variously tagged as supermarkets, hardware, variety and 
department_store. In addition the name is often entered without the 's'.
I'm sure others have noticed other things or have particular nit picking about 
shop=* values.
Regards,

Jerry





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[Talk-GB] Human Swarm 4od ITO Maps

[Bob Kerr]

Nice Seeing ITO maps including some with Openstreetmap attribution on Human 
Swarm last night

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/human-swarm/4od


The program is about how we make decisions depending on the weather. 

You can see the first flash oh ITO within the first minute. There is more

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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Pub meeting tommorow

[Bob Kerr]

Everyone welcome

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events


Cheers

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[Talk-GB] UN uses OSM as background map

[Bob Kerr]

Not sure if anyone else has seen this but I thought I would post.

UN uses OSM(Mapquestopen) as background for Global Risk Data Platform

http://preview.grid.unep.ch/index.php?preview=map&lang=eng
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Re: [Talk-GB] Historic Maps - Can you help?

[Bob Kerr]

Is there a web page that gives us a list of what is left to do.

We are going to have a SOTM for Scotland in October and I would be happy to 
help out georeferencing the maps, I can also put it up for a SOTM-Scot project

Cheers

Bob



 From: Steven Horner 
To: Rob Nickerson  
Cc: histo...@openstreetmap.org; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org 
Sent: Saturday, 13 July 2013, 18:18
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Historic Maps - Can you help?
 


I've used the NLS maps a lot and wish there were more maps from England 
available. Obviously this isn't a priority for them but would happily help in 
anyway I can. I have looked at their online georeferencer but almost all are 
done.
It's a shame the English equivelant aren't as open.
Steven

On 13 Jul 2013 12:51, "Rob Nickerson"  wrote:

Hi All,
>
>I have been speaking with the National Library of Scotland (NLS) about their 
>large collection of historic maps. Currently they provide a online collection 
>of historic maps as set out on their website [1]. Some of these are 
>georeferenced and can be used in OSM [2]. There is lots more left to scan and 
>georeference!! (Not all of them are Scotland maps, in fact there are many 
>non-UK maps too).
>
>Question: Is anyone interested in helping georeference historic maps? The 
>process is quite simple - NLS will do the scanning for us, we just need to 
>follow the georeferencing guide [3] using a suitable piece of software such as 
>QGIS (free). 
>
>If you are interested in helping, what maps would you like to see? I am 
>thinking maybe detailed Town Plans*, but we could also look at some emerging 
>places maps (e.g. Antarctica).
>
>Regards,
>Rob
>
>*) Some Scottish Town Plans have already been scanned and just need 
>georeferencing: http://maps.nls.uk/towns/index.html
>
>[1] http://maps.nls.uk/
>[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/National_Library_of_Scotland
>[3] http://geo.nls.uk/urbhist/guides_georeferencing.html
>
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[Talk-GB] State of the Map Scotland 2013 October 11-12 - Speakers

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

We are starting to organise speakers for State of the map Scotland. I know 
everyone will be busy with SOTM2013 but if there are people that would like to 
give talks at our event please let me know

Cheers

Bob
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[Talk-GB] State of the Map Scotland 2013 October 11th-13th

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

We have a good selection of speakers set up from outside the community on 
Friday for State of the map Scotland 2013 - Including International Rescue 
Corps.

We would like to see if there are volunteers that would like to present info 
for either the 20 minute of 10 minute sessions on the Saturday.

We are also having a hackday on Sunday at techcube and would welcome tutors to 
step forward to teach new folk basics as well as joining in on larger hacking 
projects

If there is any way of advertising the event that would also be useful.

Finally we will be looking for a different location for State of the map 
Scotland 2014. Preferably a little more north. Please let me know.

State of the map Scotland 2013  Details

wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_of_the_Map_Scotland_2013


Cheers

Bob
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[Talk-GB] State of the map Scotland 2013 - 6 days away

[Bob Kerr]

Counting down to State of the map Scotland 2013

wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_of_the_Map_Scotland_2013

Please send out messages to your social media of choice

Cheers

Bob
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Re: [Talk-GB] Notes feature

[Bob Kerr]

Maybe we could use it to make an note for mapping parties, social events and 
conferences too

Bob



>
> From: Brian Prangle 
>To: Talk GB  
>Sent: Sunday, 27 October 2013, 16:15
>Subject: [Talk-GB] Notes feature
> 
>
>
>It seems that some businesses are starting to use the notes feature to 
>identify their location, thinking it's just like Googlemaps perhaps. I think 
>we should encourage this by separating the notes function into 2 , adequately 
>labelled, one for " place your business/event here" and one for "map 
>improvement needed here"
>
>Regards
>
>Brian
>
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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Pub meeting Tuesday 10th

[Bob Kerr]

Tommorow Tuesday 10th there is a pub meetup in Edinburgh All welcome

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events

There is a possibility next year to have a conference with OSM, the Open 
Knowledge Foundation,Wikipedia and National Library of Scotland


Cheers

Bob

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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM in Linux Format magazine

[Bob Kerr]

Also in the Guardian an article

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jan/14/why-the-world-needs-openstreetmap

Cheers

Bob

On Fri, 17/1/14, Paul Williams  wrote:

 Subject: [Talk-GB] OSM in Linux Format magazine
 To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
 Date: Friday, 17 January, 2014, 0:01
 
 I'd
 like to report that there is not one - but two articles
 about OSM in the February 2014 issue of Linux Format
 magazine (this is actually the issue on sale now, in
 February they'll be selling the March issue!). This is
 the second time I've seen an OSM article in this
 magazine - there was previously one in November 2012.
 
 
 Firstly there is a two page question and answer style
 "What on Earth is OpenStreetMap" article, and then
 there is a four page tutorial on how to contribute to
 OpenStreetMap. In addition, on the "Who we are"
 section of page 3 it asks the magazine's writers
 "what kind of map they would like to make" - such
 as a "map of all local pubs, with a comprehensive guide
 to the available snacks" and to map "the hidden
 depths of Hull".
 
 
 Available now from all good newsagents (or at
 least from WHSmith) for £6.49.
 
 Cheers,
 Paul Williams
 (Paul The Archivist)
 
 
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Re: [Talk-GB] Possible vandalism? New Forth Road Bridge being changed to motorway from construction

[Bob Kerr]

I have sent a message as well

Cheers

Bob

On Sun, 9/2/14, Donald Noble  wrote:

 Subject: [Talk-GB] Possible vandalism? New Forth Road Bridge being changed to 
motorway from construction
 To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
 Date: Sunday, 9 February, 2014, 20:32
 
 Hi All,
 The user robbief14 [1] has changed sections of
 the M90 around the New Forth Road Bridge which are still
 currently under construction to live motorway. They had also
 deleted all of the tags for the current road bridge.
 
 I therefore reverted this changeset before
 further changes were made, and send a polite email asking
 why they had done it and if they realise they were affecting
 the map for everyone. 
 
 No response to this message, however they have changed
 the crossing back to motorway. See [2] below for relevant
 changesets.
 I would appreciate somebody else trying to
 contact this user.
 
 regards, Donald
 
 
 [1] http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/robbief14[2] 
 original changeset: http://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/20442315my
 revert:     http://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/20452252
 changed back to motorway again: http://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/20458591
 
 -- 
 Donald Noble
 http://drnoble.co.uk - http://flickr.com/photos/drnoble
 
 
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Re: [Talk-GB] Spread the OSM message (Steve Chilton)

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

OpenGlasgow are working with Shawlands academy

http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/55.83064/-4.28332

I have just been teaching the teachers how to use Openstreetmap. They are 
forming a project where they get the pupils to explore their community. 
It has just started but they have funding etc and should be finnished by the 
summer, I shall forward the details of the conference to them.

I would be willing to join up for some Glasgow mapping.

Cheers

Bob



On Thu, 13/2/14, Fozy 81  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Spread the OSM message (Steve Chilton)
 To: "talk-gb@openstreetmap.org" 
 Date: Thursday, 13 February, 2014, 18:33
 
 
 
 
 Hi Steve,
 
 I'll spread the word locally with the OSM community
 about SoC event in Glasgow and see if anyone can give a
 presentation.
 
 I like to think a lot of the map data is 'hidden' in
 Glasgow. What we miss in buildings etc we make up for in bus
 routes, cycle parking and 3D tags :-P
 
 But yes, a mapping party is always appreciated! There's
 a fair few notes on the map just around the university which
 could make a nice break for attendees to look at?
 
 But if you want to pick an area and go map - that would be
 great. Put it on the wiki and get the local mappers can
 support. 
 
 BTW There is a Glasgow OSM meetup is on the 18th
 August: 
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Scotland#Welcome
 
 Thanks,
 
 Tim
 
 
 > From: talk-gb-requ...@openstreetmap.org
 > Subject: Talk-GB Digest, Vol 89, Issue 15
 > To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
 > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 12:00:02 +
 > 
 > Send Talk-GB mailing list submissions to
 >  talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
 > 
 > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web,
 visit
 >  https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
 > or, via email, send a message with subject or body
 'help' to
 >  talk-gb-requ...@openstreetmap.org
 > 
 > You can reach the person managing the list at
 >  talk-gb-ow...@openstreetmap.org
 > 
 > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is
 more specific
 > than "Re: Contents of Talk-GB digest..."
 > 
 > 
 > Today's Topics:
 > 
 >1. Re: name=Flooding (jonathan)
 >2. Urban Data Hack, London, Feb 15th/16th (Dan S)
 >3. Re: Urban Data Hack, London, Feb 15th/16th
 (Robert Scott)
 >4. Re: name=Flooding (Shaun McDonald)
 >5. Spread the OSM message (Steve Chilton)
 > 
 > 
 >
 --
 > 
 > Message: 1
 > Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 12:25:48 +
 > From: jonathan 
 > To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
 > Cc: Kate Chapman 
 > Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] name=Flooding
 > Message-ID: <52fb684c@bigfatfrog67.me>
 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1;
 format=flowed
 > 
 > I agree it isn't, however, considering the current
 conditions some parts 
 > of the country are experiencing, the continuing weather
 forecasts of 
 > more to come and the fact that the ground water is so
 high that this 
 > water won't be going anywhere soon, then perhaps we
 should apply some 
 > tagging to areas that people have kindly already
 mapped.  Maybe highways 
 > should be marked as impassable?  The Highways Agency
 etc are producing 
 > such lists.
 > 
 > We would need to revisit these areas to remove it as
 they subside but 
 > this information is invaluable to many people,
 agencies, charities, gov 
 > departments etc.
 > 
 > There's also a historical benefit having  areas
 mapped as having 
 > previously flooded, either as live ways tagged
 accordingly or as old 
 > deleted ways that nevertheless are still accessible.
 > 
 > If the HOT team had been activated for this then we
 would be doing this 
 > sort of thing just as has been done in many other parts
 of the World.
 > 
 > I'm beginning to think we are not stepping up to
 provide this unique 
 > mapping requirement that no other mapping service is
 providing.
 > 
 > Jonathan
 > 
 > http://bigfatfrog67.me
 > 
 > On 10/02/2014 17:29, Steve Doerr wrote:
 > > Is this an appropriate use of the name tag?
 > >
 > >
 http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/search.php?q=Flooding%2C+Burrowbridge
 > >
 > > Steve
 > >
 > > ___
 > > Talk-GB mailing list
 > > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
 > > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
 > >
 > 
 > 
 > 
 > 
 > --
 > 
 > Message: 2
 > Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 12:46:08 +
 > From: Dan S 
 > To: Talk GB 
 > Subject: [Talk-GB] Urban Data Hack, London, Feb
 15th/16th
 > Message-ID:
 >

 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
 > 
 > Hi all -
 > 
 > Urban Data Hack, London, Feb 15th/16th, possibly
 interesting to people here:
 > http://urbandatahack.com/
 > They have some specific datasets to work with, not osm
 but geo.
 > 
 > (Is it appropriate to post this kind of thing on
 talk-gb ? I'm not
 > associated with the event, but just wondering if this
 kind of thing is
 > interest to this list.)
 > 
 > B

[Talk-GB] Crowdsourced boats to map the seas : BBC Article - video

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

Short video on crowndsourcing using GPS and depth guages from the BBC, suggests 
they will release the data

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-26231350

Cheers

Bob

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[Talk-GB] OS six-inch England ans Wales 1852-1952

[Bob Kerr]

This has been forwarded to me by Christopher Fleet from the National Library of 
Scotland

They are in the process of georeferencing the images but I thought it best to 
let you know now 



Subject: New website - OS six-inch England and Wales, 1852-1952

We are very pleased to announce the availability of a new website resource - 
zoomable colour images of the Ordnance Survey's six-inch to the mile (1:10,560) 
mapping of England and Wales. All our map digitisation work in recent years has 
been externally funded, hence the recent expansion of our map images beyond 
Scotland.

This is the most detailed OS topographic mapping covering all of England and 
Wales from the 1840s to the 1950s. It was revised for the whole country twice 
between 1842-1893 and between 1891-1914, and then updated regularly for urban 
or rapidly changing areas from 1914 to the 1940s. Our holdings are made up of 
37,390 sheets, including 35,124 quarter sheets, and 2,237 full sheets.

The easiest way of finding sheets is through a clickable graphic index using 
our 'Find by Place' viewer: http://maps.nls.uk/openlayers.cfm?id=39
This allows searching through a gazetteer of placenames, street names, 
postcodes and Grid References, as well as by zooming in on an area of interest 
with smaller-scale locational mapping as a backdrop.

The sheets are also available via county lists: 
http://maps.nls.uk/os/6inch-england-and-wales/counties.html

We plan to also make georeferenced mosaics available of the series by the late 
summer.

OS six-inch England and Wales home page: 
http://maps.nls.uk/os/6inch-england-and-wales/index.html

Further information:  
http://maps.nls.uk/os/6inch-england-and-wales/info1.html

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[Talk-GB] Police Scotland

[Bob Kerr]

Police Scotland are using our map

http://www.scotland.police.uk/your-community/edinburgh/

Cheers

Bob

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[Talk-GB] Ref names on Residential roads

[Bob Kerr]

On residential roads where there has been a ref= added is being rendered on 
Mapnik. Is this something new since I have not been checking recently. This is 
all over the highlands

https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/57.5695/-4.4282
Cheers
Bob



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[Talk-GB] Cities: Skylines - Openstreetmap data

[Bob Kerr]

Has anyone played with this, It seems to be getting good press
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416064574
Cheers
Bob

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[Talk-GB] Openstreetmap Foundation Charity Number

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I am just about to post an advert in the big issue for our International 
Development Fair
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_of_the_Map_Scotland_2015/Day_1

and I get to save paying vat if I have a charity number. I know the 
Openstreetmap Foundation company number
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Main_Page

Does anyone have any suggestions or will I just have to pay the VAT
Cheers
Bob

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[Talk-GB] State of the map Scotland International Development Fair

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I am just putting out a request for volunteers for the Openstreetmap 
International Development Fair on Wed 30th September in Edinburgh. I could do 
with some help to host the Openstreetmap table and to help people with the 
projectors for talks. The details of the event which is the first day of State 
of the map Scotland are here
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_of_the_Map_Scotland_2015/Day_1
please contact me if you  have some free time
All the best 

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[Talk-GB] Compass Rose

[Bob Kerr]

Hello,

I have a couple of Compass Roses that I have made. I am happy to make them 
available under a public domain licence.

I would like to make  the files available on the openstreetmap wiki but just 
wanted to check if this is appropriate before I make the page.

The files are smaller than 100Kb and will be available in SVG and PNG and I use 
the icon 64 format in Inkscape to create them.

Cheers

Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM UK publicity challenge

[Bob Kerr]

I have been working to promote openstreetmap in various magazines, here is what 
I have learnt.

You will get more interest from magazines that appeal to  a specialist group of 
people. For example I am presently contacting Geographical Magazine. (please 
don't contact them as I am already doing this)
http://www.geographical.co.uk/Home/index.html

I ask if they would be interested in a freely written article about 
Openstreetmap. A usual reply will be that they have not heard of it. I then 
send them an e-mail stating the following.
The Openstreetmap community is like wikipedia for maps.
The maps are copyright free and can be used in their magazine
There are over 100,000 contributors
The goal of the community is to create a copyright free map of the world
Some countries like the Netherlands have already been completed.
Openstreetmap was names as one of the top 100 websites by the guardian
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/dec/18/internet-websites

The map can be edited in any web-browser
I give examples of areas that have detailed mapping like Kew Gardens in London
I give topographical examples using the cycle map
I give examples of how large institutions like the National Library of Scotland 
can benefit their service by using ours. Here is a link to wikipedia, in the 
historical maps section if you click on the links you will see National library 
of Scotland maps from 1909 overlayed onto openstreetmap. This works because the 
Library wants to publisize their service
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craigmillar


This shows we are a big community, with specific goals and are recognised by 
other large institutions. We can have good coverage and flexibility with the 
data and for magazines they have an immediate benefit, once they realise this 
they will consider the benefit to their communities
It is important that you make sure that you know what they want rather than 
what we want.
There are lots of these specialist magazines around, 
Historians, Archaeologists, Developing countries magazines, Oxfam, United 
nations Development, Ramblers, climbers, Cycling magazines, Ancient monuments, 
Park Ranger magazines, Emergency services, Tourism, Local government magazines, 
Water management, Bird Watchers, Advertisers. choose one
These magazines have a community and would like to be able to print maps in 
their magazines. Openstreet map provides them a service and it will be a better 
service if they can encourage people that  are interested to help.
You will get far more attention from these people than from Government. 
Generally Government has only just heard of the phrase Open Source. It will 
take them another 10 years to understand it.
It is very important to not be pushy. They may not be interested in 
openstreetmap and this is usually the case if they have not heard of it before. 
If you are contacting them then once is enough because they will hear of it 
again from a diferent source and may become more interested. Politeness is very 
important.
If you want to set up publicity. Set up a wiki page that states which magazines 
have been contacted, date, if they are interested, Any articles written so that 
we don't hassle them too much.
Remember it is what will benefit them that is important.
All the best 
Bob








--- On Mon, 1/6/09, Richard Fairhurst  wrote:

From: Richard Fairhurst 
Subject: [Talk-GB] OSM UK publicity challenge
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Monday, 1 June, 2009, 8:24 PM

So how do we get some more publicity for OSM in the UK?

Here's one idea:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/travel/2009/may/24/cycle-holiday-britain-mike-carter

"Do you have any tips for Mike about great campsites or interesting  
B&Bs along the coast? Or perhaps you'd like to ride alongside him for  
a day? Contact Mike at get.car...@observer.co.uk"

Any OSMers who can get easily to the coast fancy doing this? (Gregory  
M? PeterIto?) Could be a nice bit of publicity for OSM in a national  
broadsheet.

Any more ideas?

cheers
Richard


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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM UK publicity challenge

[Bob Kerr]

Hello,
You are correct, but on a cold first contact, it is important to get them 
interested, and to let them know that the maps can be used in their magazines 
and will be beneficial to their readers. If I was to open up with a legal 
discussion on copyright then it would immediately bore the reader.
The main point is that this is something that they can use. On the second 
contact I can verify the terms of use by directing them to the appropriate link 
so they can verify that it is ok for them to use. To make sure that they know 
there are no legal problems for them in the future.
Cheers
Bob


--- On Wed, 3/6/09, David Earl  wrote:

From: David Earl 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM UK publicity challenge
To: "Bob Kerr" , "osm-gb" 

Date: Wednesday, 3 June, 2009, 11:03 AM

On 03/06/2009 11:42, Bob Kerr wrote:
> The maps are copyright free and can be used in their magazine

Err... they aren't copyright free.

David




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Re: [Talk-GB] printing from website

[Bob Kerr]

I agree a decent link near the permalink area for printing would help a lot. 
Printing extra pages is annoying too and should be taken into consideration as 
well, a trap that i've seen happen a lot is that the output is formatted for 
the US letter format and not A4, so local country considerations need to be 
thought about.
Cheers
Bob

--- On Mon, 13/7/09, WessexMario  wrote:

From: WessexMario 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] printing from website
To: "talk-gb OSM List (E-mail)" 
Date: Monday, 13 July, 2009, 1:57 PM



Mario Caves wrote:
> I agree with Jack on this one, I'm a long in the tooth IT pro and as 
> choosing the browser print option is often a waste of paper, it took 
> me months before I found out how well OSM formatted the browser print 
> option, so a 'print this map' link/icon/tag/button would go a long way 
> to helping 'ordinary' map users get more out of OSM.
>
>
> Jack Stringer wrote:
>> Not all websites are not as well designed as OSM. Often when you click
>> print you get 2 blank pages plus 3 with the adverts on them and 1 page
>> of the map, cut right in half on the area you wanted to see.
>>
>>
>> Jack Stringer
>>
>> ___
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>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
>>   
>

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[Talk-GB] Export Cyclemap

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
Is there any legal or other reason that there is not an option to export 
Opencyclemap tiles. In the 'format to export' opencyclemap is not there.
Cheers
Bob




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[Talk-GB] Tag:Water

[Bob Kerr]

I have recently been mapping rural areas in nicaragua an was thinking about 
water wells. I realised that water is easily of equal importance as Power. I am 
thinking about setting up a proposal to add Water as the the same importance as 
Power but I would just like to ask this list  before I start working on it. I 
would end up getting tags like this
water:drinking_water water fountainwater:faucet/tap water 
generalwater:Hydrant water fire in cities or for fire 
breakswater:well-manualwater:well-electricwater:well-historicwater:Water_towerwater:water
 treatmentwater:desalination
I put my first thoughts down at
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/water_well
Please reply here or on the water_well proposed features page
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] Tag:Water

[Bob Kerr]

Thanks for letting me know about that, I think that the proposal you mentioned 
would be better suited in Natural:wetland   
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dwetland
I personally think the drinking water infrastructure is has a higher 
importance, I am sounding out the list to see if It is worth putting in the 
effort to change it
Thanks
Bob
--- On Sun, 23/8/09, OJ W  wrote:

From: OJ W 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Tag:Water
To: "Bob Kerr" 
Cc: "Talk GB" 
Date: Sunday, 23 August, 2009, 11:02 AM

not to be confused with water cover

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Water_cover



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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Meetups: Glasgow Central Scotland

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
Kick starting a place for regular meetups in Edinburgh
I have added some basic information about people getting together in Edinburgh
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Mapping_Parties
The main aim of this is to get more people to add the catagory Users in 
Edinburgh to their profile so that it is easier to let them know if there is a 
meetup in Edinburgh.
After that I hope to organise a monthly or bimonthly meeting for Edinburgh, if 
successful then meetups in Glasgow and Central Scotland.
I hope to use the calendar feature of the wiki as the local schedule
Please send your thoughts to me or edit the wiki
Cheers
Bob






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Re: [Talk-GB] Edinburgh Meetups: Glasgow Central Scotland

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I aim to start fairly slowly, My aim is to get a regular meeting in Edinburgh, 
I think there may be enough people and interest to have a pub meeting once 
every two months. I am starting by getting people to 
add[[Category:Users_in_Edinburgh|YOUR USER ID HERE]]
on to their user page, this gives me a rough list of those that are in 
Edinburgh and may be interested. 
Shaun told me about the excellent
http://www.itoworld.com/
Osmmapper 
http://www.itoworld.com/static/osmmapper
to find out who has been editing recently and I have e-mailed them.
Once we meet up which I think will probably be the first Tuesday in September 
then we can decide the details. I am hoping that if we have meetings every two 
months then I can do the same in Glasgow and we can alternate months
It may be a little time before I get to Glasgow but if you know of a good 
location to meet at there I will post it to the Glasgow project page.
Cheers
Bob



 

--- On Wed, 26/8/09, Callum Noble  wrote:

From: Callum Noble 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Edinburgh Meetups: Glasgow Central Scotland
To: "Bob Kerr" 
Cc: "talk-gb OSM List (E-mail)" 
Date: Wednesday, 26 August, 2009, 3:29 PM

Hi Bob,

Sounds like a good idea.

I organized a meetup in Glasgow back in Feb '08. There were a few
Edinburgh people came through but in the end there weren't as many
people came as had posted to the list or on the wiki (there were only
4 of us in the end I think). Despite the poor turnout was good to put
some faces to the edits.

Since then I've not done much mapping but am going to start to try to
get back on top of things. I'd try to make it along to anything
organized in Glasgow.

Regards,
~ Callum

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Bob
Kerr wrote:
> Hi,
> Kick starting a place for regular meetups in Edinburgh
> I have added some basic information about people getting together in
> Edinburgh
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Mapping_Parties
> The main aim of this is to get more people to add the catagory Users in
> Edinburgh to their profile so that it is easier to let them know if there is
> a meetup in Edinburgh.
> After that I hope to organise a monthly or bimonthly meeting for Edinburgh,
> if successful then meetups in Glasgow and Central Scotland.
> I hope to use the calendar feature of the wiki as the local schedule
> Please send your thoughts to me or edit the wiki
> Cheers
> Bob
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
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>



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[Talk-GB] Meetup in Edinburgh Tuesday 22 September 2009 7.30pm Guildford Arms

[Bob Kerr]

Hello All,
There will be a meetup in Edinburgh at 7:30pm Tuesday September 22, 2009 at the 
Guildford arms
please see
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events
everyone welcome
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Locating Postboxes article Guardian

[Bob Kerr]

Hi all,
Just in case you missed it, there is an article in the Guardian about the 
location of Postboxes and post offices in the UK.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/sep/16/freedom-of-information-postboxes
It then leads to the place where we can put this info onto openstreetmap
http://www.dracos.co.uk/play/locating-postboxes/
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Social Meetup in Edinburgh, Naptan, 3D Buildings

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

Just a quick reminder that we will be having a social meeting for openstreetmap 
tommorow at the Guildford Arms

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events

Edinburgh has nearly all the streets named now, and people are starting to but 
in address numbers and details for places like the Astley Ainsley Hospital.

We will probably be discussing the import of the Naptan Data and the ability to 
make 3D buildings 

All welcome

Cheers

Bob


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[Talk-GB] Noname Layer

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
Is there any news about when the Noname layer is going to be updated. I believe 
there was a problem with the shear size of the data.
Cheers
Bob




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[Talk-GB] Glasgow social meetup contact

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
We had a successful first social meeting in Edinburgh, I am now looking to  
organise  the same thing in Glasgow. Is there anyone who is willing to be the 
contact point for Glasgow. This will mainly involve choosing a good pub and 
possibly some minor wiki edits on the Glasgow project page.
Please contact me off list.
cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Google Wave

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I have just been watching the presentation on Google Wave
http://wave.google.com/help/wave/about.html
I was wandering if in the future if this would be a useful tool for us, I was 
thinking along the lines of helping organising meetups and mapping parties for 
a local area. Any thoughts?
cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Glasgow Meetup Tuesday 17th November 2009 at 7:30pm

[Bob Kerr]

Hi All,
Just a reminder we will be having a pub meetup next Tuesday in Glasgow
Please see
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Glasgow#Social_Events
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] New York Times Article

[Bob Kerr]

Here is a link to a New York Times article that you may find interesting.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/17/technology/internet/17maps.html?ref=technology
OSM is mentioned later in the article
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Accuracy of OSM data in Athens

[Bob Kerr]

Thought you may be interested in this article.

http://povesham.wordpress.com/2009/11/25/openstreetmap-in-athens-–-as-accurate-as-london/
Cheers
bob


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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Meetup 7:30pm Tuesday 8th December 2009

[Bob Kerr]

Hello,

Just reminding the list there is an Edinburgh Meetup next Tuesday at 7:30 at 
the Guildford Arms


Please See


http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events




Everyone is welcome, come along and join us for a pint


Cheers


Bob


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[Talk-GB] Gaurdian top 100 websites

[Bob Kerr]

Openstreetmap made the Guardians top 100 again this year.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/dec/09/best-websites-internet
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] Grauniad top 100 websites

[Bob Kerr]

It was also in the grundian too :)
cheers
from going back to typing school
bob

--- On Thu, 10/12/09, David James  wrote:

From: David James 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Grauniad top 100 websites
To: "Talk-GB" 
Date: Thursday, 10 December, 2009, 13:58


> At 12:29 PM 10/12/2009, Bob Kerr wrote:
>>Openstreetmap made the Guardians top 100 again this year.
>>
>>http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/dec/09/best-websites-internet
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>Bob
>
> "A rights-free map created by people like you. Remarkably detailed and
> precise."
>
> I wonder if we can, er, borrow that tag-line?

Wouldn't that require a long discussion on licensing conditions with the
Grauniad? (insert smiley of choice ...)
-- 
David James



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Re: [Talk-GB] OS consultation out

[Bob Kerr]

On Page 56 of the document it says it proposes to release 
Streetview
http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/products/streetview/

I think this would be of most interest to us
This could give us shapes of houses, some geographical references , roads and 
road names
Cheers
Bob

--- On Wed, 23/12/09, Tom Chance  wrote:

From: Tom Chance 
Subject: [Talk-GB] OS consultation out
To: "talk-gb OSM List (E-mail)" 
Date: Wednesday, 23 December, 2009, 13:58

http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/ordnancesurveyconsultation

It would be good to submit a response from OSM contributors or the OSMF.


Tom


-- 
http://tom.acrewoods.net   http://twitter.com/tom_chance


-Inline Attachment Follows-

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[Talk-GB] 200,060

[Bob Kerr]

We are now over the 200,000 mark
http://www.openstreetmap.org/stats/data_stats.html
happy new year
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] [Edinburgh] Road Names

[Bob Kerr]

Very Cool,
I think it would be worth going over this at the next meeting, maybe we could 
put up a wiki page with the roads that are missing and plan the mapping party 
for areas that are particularly bad.
Excellent work
cheers
Bob

--- On Tue, 23/3/10, Chris Fleming  wrote:

From: Chris Fleming 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] [Edinburgh] Road Names
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, 23 March, 2010, 0:29


Cool I've hooked up a script to do a comparison with the street names in 
OSM and have put the results up at:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ah4ejhysSkMOdDktM0Jyb3Z5TGFQTjZkOHJ4RHlnVGc&hl=en

Overall on the first pass we match about 75% of the road names, although 
there are lots of 'Z' Class roads that we don't have.

I have also done a area by area comparison and have included this on the 
second tab of the spreadsheet some area's look very good and some quite 
poor. I hope to spend some time looking at an area and figuring out 
where we don't match in order to get any bugs out, but if anyone wants 
to make any comments then the spreadsheet *should* be writable.

Also let me know if there are any other fields that it would be useful 
to pull out of OSM.

Cheers
Chris



On 18/03/10 23:14, Dair Grant wrote:
> Hi,
>
> At this week's Edinburgh meet-up we discussed the Council's public road name
> list, and how to cross-reference it with OSM to check coverage/identify
> missing roads.
>
> Unfortunately the council data is only available as a set of tabular PDFs,
> which is hard to do anything useful with, so I've converted them into a
> single csv file:
>
>    
>
> I won't have time to do anything with it for a while, but have put it up in
> case anyone else from Edinburgh wants a go (the script is on github in case
> other councils have a similar problem).
>
>
> Sorry for spamming all of -gb, as this is pretty local to Edinburgh, but
> there's no talk-scot and everyone is on talk-gb.
>
> Having said that, we also discussed having a mapping party in/around
> Penicuik on April 10th, so for anyone in central Scotland/visiting the area
> then I think Bob will be sticking the details for that on the Edinburgh page
> on the wiki.
>
>
> -dair
> ___
> d...@refnum.com              http://www.refnum.com/
>
>
>
> ___
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>    


-- 
e: m...@chrisfleming.org
w: www.chrisfleming.org


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[Talk-GB] National Map Library of Scotland API

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I am please to let you know that the good people of the National Library of 
Scotland have released an API and data for a selection of maps throughout the 
UK. 
The library is very keen to engage the OSM community and if all goes well with 
this introduction will be happy to release further maps in the future.
The data released has some overlap with the data that we already have but it 
does go into more detail than ours. The license is also compatible with ours.
I am posting this here so that the information can get into the right hands and 
be verified etc.
You can either contact me about this or preferably through the contact e-mail 
on the API page.
Please remember this is the first time that they have done this. The National 
Library of Scotland is an important institution and would be very benificial 
for us to have them as our friends, any problems will be slowly ironed out so 
be respectful.
full details here
http://geo.nls.uk/maps/api/
Cheers
Bob




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Re: [Talk-GB] National Map Library of Scotland API

[Bob Kerr]

Hi, I have been in touch with them and they are keen that we should be allowed 
to use their data so that we can create derived information that we can use for 
Openstreetmap. They have told me that they are willing to use the Open Database 
Licence with OSM they may just need some clarification of some minor details 
I think the only problem is that that they have a great deal of much older maps 
which they hope to eventually put online. These images are the ones that under 
law they need to protect.
 However derived data from them they would be ok with.
Is there anyone on the list that has experience with licensing that could get 
in touch with them. I am happy to be an intermediary and I have met them more
 than once and they know me. I would just like a little backup because this 
could be very beneficial to us in openstreetmap and to the Library. It would be 
beneficial to the library because they get more interest and recognition
 for their work
If there are any people that are good at licencing please either contact me or 
to them directly
There contact information is on
http://geo.nls.uk/maps/api/
If you do contact them could you please CC me just to keep me in the loop
Cheers
Bob
--- On Wed, 5/5/10, Frederik Ramm  wrote:

From: Frederik Ramm 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] National Map Library of Scotland API
To: "Bob Kerr" 
Cc: Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
Date: Wednesday, 5 May, 2010, 20:08

Hi,

Bob Kerr wrote:
> The data released has some overlap with the data that we already have but it 
> does go into more detail than ours. The license is also compatible with ours.

Perhaps they could be approached cautiously and asked whether they would 
consider allowing derived information to be published under ODbL as it is still 
not
 entirely impossible that we'll want to use that license some time in the 
future.

Bye
Frederik

-- Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"



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Re: [Talk-GB] National Map Library of Scotland API

[Bob Kerr]

Superb and thanks,
Open Knowledge Scotland is the perfect venue to go forward with this
Cheers
Bob

--- On Sun, 9/5/10, Jo Walsh  wrote:

From: Jo Walsh 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] National Map Library of Scotland API
To: "Bob Kerr" 
Cc: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Sunday, 9 May, 2010, 15:34

dear Bob, all,

On 08/05/2010 18:17, Bob Kerr wrote:
> Hi, I have been in touch with them and they are keen that we should be
> allowed to use their data so that we can create derived information that
> we can use for Openstreetmap. They have told me that they are willing to
> use the Open Database Licence with OSM they may just need some
> clarification of some minor details

> Is there anyone on the list that has experience with licensing that
> could get in touch with them. I am happy to be an intermediary and I
> have met them more than once and they know me. I would just like a
> little backup because this could be very beneficial to us in
> openstreetmap and to the Library. It would be beneficial to the library
> because they get more interest and recognition for their work

Okay, Chris Fleet (the Map Librarian at NLS) will be presenting this service at 
Open Knowledge Scotland, and relevantly, Charlotte Waelde and Andres Guadamuz, 
old colleagues of Jordan Hatcher (of Open Data Commons/ODBL) at SCRIPT, they'll 
be doing a "clinic" on open data licensing issues.

So we can make sure everyone meets - Bob i see you're on the okscotland 
attendee list already which is great because we're well overcapacity - and even 
raise this as a test case at their clinic, if they have that kind of 
flexibility.

Bob, i did forward Chris and Petr the original mail from Frederik lasy week, if 
there's any followup I'll definitely cc you (and look forward to meeting on 
Thursday!)

I could also *try* asking JISC Legal, it would be useful to get stable advisory 
words wrt ODbL from them.

cheers,


jo
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Re: [Talk-GB] Map layer with OS Locator comparison from ITO - apostrophes

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I can easily understand that apostrophes and the name bypass are annoying, 
however I think there is an opportunity here. 
For example, bypass or by-pass. This highlights an inconstancy in the OS data, 
which will be useful for them to correct and standardise. 
Apostrophes are the same, they can convey different meanings for example we 
have some House O' Hill data in Edinburgh
after the OS and OSM data have been checked against each other then what is 
left is the most useful to both our groups and will disappear in time.
In Edinburgh we will have to do the same again because all the names of the 
streets and house numbers are controlled by the local council. I know that the 
OS data is not as accurate as the council data. So again we will be able to 
highlight the exact inconsistancies and once we have the exact data as the 
council then this highlights that OSM is a useful tool for the council to use.
Cheers
Bob 

--- On Sun, 13/6/10, Richard Mann  
wrote:

From: Richard Mann 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Map layer with OS Locator comparison from ITO - 
apostrophes
To: "Ed Avis" 
Cc: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Sunday, 13 June, 2010, 9:17

Differences on the naming of sections of trunk road (Southern Bypass
vs Southern Bypass Road) are also a little distracting.

Richard

On Sun, Jun 13, 2010 at 8:54 AM, Ed Avis  wrote:
> Could the OS versus OSM name comparison be changed to strip apostrophes from
> both names before comparing?
>
> See 
> http://oscompare.raggedred.net/?zoom=16&lat=51.54886&lon=-0.20997&layers=B0TF
> for example - neither OS nor OSM have any real consistency in whether to use
> apostrophe or not.
>
> I've no wish to re-open the great apostrophe debate on this mailing list, 
> rather
> I think it would be sensible to leave them to one side when doing the name 
> check.
>
> --
> Ed Avis 
>
>
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[Talk-GB] Mapping Party Edinburgh

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
We will be having a mapping party on Saturday 3rd July all welcome.
We will be mapping the Zoo and Corstorphine Hill Details here
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh/MappingParty/2010-07


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[Talk-GB] Mapping party Edinburgh

[Bob Kerr]

Just a Quick reminder, 
There will be a mapping party tomorrow 9:30 Sat 3rd July at Edinburgh Zoo
all welcome
Details here
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh/MappingParty/2010-07
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] The last 2%

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I have been using the OS_locator and musical chairs tools to focus on the areas 
of Edinburgh that needed checking. I have also been using the ITO analysis tool 
to check my progress.
http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/osm_analysis/
All of these have been very useful and much appreciated
I use the boundaries shown in
http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/opendata/viewer/
to focus my attention in one area
In Edinburgh we have about 87 roads to go. I know that there are many of these 
roads that conflict with the OS_Opendata names. This is due mainly to spelling, 
roads with two names, new builds that need survey etc. 
I believe that there are more roads marked as not in OSM than are marked in 
OS_Locator about 20 in the case of Edinburgh. I thought this may have been 
service roads or unnamed roads further outside the city, I found many of these 
but these do not seem to affect the scores of the OSM_analysis. I am not sure 
if this is me just missing roads or OS  database data quirks
Are there any hints or insights that people can give me to help me find the 
last few roads.
Once I have brought the number down I can then check with the council and have 
"Street sign, Official Council name, and OS_OpendData name" and then be able to 
report to OS.
On a slightly different note is there any plans to have the OS_locator squares 
marked as a dashed line if there is a tag present that says not:name. This 
would be useful for me to show that a street has already been checked
Many thanks
Bob













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Re: [Talk-GB] The last 2%

[Bob Kerr]

Hi, Thanks for the replies,
I think I may have found out something
If I look at Pentland Gardens
http://oscompare.raggedred.net/?zoom=18&lat=55.91088&lon=-3.21477&layers=B0TF
I have placed a tag
not = Pentlands Gardens
instead of not:name= Pentlands Gardens
so this would make the analysis out considerably in my area. Now that I have 
this information then this should make a difference. I was obviously just 
following the wrong tagging scheme. I think there may be others that are doing 
the same as me so it may be good to let people know.
 With the ITO world OS Locator from the above link. If the squares showing the 
names are all solid lines.
I suggest that if they don't match and contain the not:name tag then placing a 
dashed line around them would indicate that I have a conflict that has been 
looked at.
Eventually what I will be left with are the roads where there is dispute over 
the name and not mixed together with roads that have not been surveyed and 
named.
thanks for you help
Cheers
Bob







--- On Tue, 17/8/10, Shane Reynolds  wrote:

From: Shane Reynolds 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] The last 2%
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, 17 August, 2010, 13:09

Hi,

I am the developer who works on a number of products including OSM Analysis for 
ITO.

I am slightly confused about making the OS Locator box a dashed box if the 
not:name tag is present. When we do the processing if any street is found with 
the not:name tag matching an OS Locator street then these should not be flagged 
in the stats nor should they be drawn on the map. Are you saying that this is 
not the case and they are still appearing? If this is true then possibly there 
is a bug that I may want to address (we are usually a day behind the updated 
planet file so possibly its something to do with that?)


With regard to getting the figures down (in slight fear of being flamed as I am 
a very novice mapper) - with apostrophes, if the road sign has an apostrophe 
then I would say the apostrophe should be in OSM and if it is not then it is 
correct to flag it as a difference. However if the road sign does not have an 
apostrophe and OS Locator does then probably the road should have a not:name 
tag added with the apostrophe version of the name. This would remove any 
apostrophe issues. With regard to rural roads - if they have no road signs is 
it not better to use the OS Locator name rather than have no name at all as I 
think in general OS Locator has been proved to be pretty accurate? (apologies 
if in my ignorance I do not know that there is a good reason not to do this).


Shane



On 17 August 2010 12:34, David Groom  wrote:









Congratulations, only 87 roads (<2%) is an 
impressive achievement.
 
I'm struggling to reduce figures much on the Isle of Wight due to many road 
signs not have apostrophes (whilst OS Locator includes apostrophes), and 
many rural roads having no road signs at all
 
David
 

  - Original Message ----- 
  
From: 
  Bob Kerr 
  To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org 

  Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 11:53 
  AM
  Subject: [Talk-GB] The last 2%

  

  


  Hi,


I have been using the OS_locator and musical chairs tools to focus 
on the areas of Edinburgh that needed checking. I have also been using 
the ITO analysis tool to check my progress.


http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/osm_analysis/


All of these have been very useful and much appreciated


I use the boundaries shown in


http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/opendata/viewer/


to focus my attention in one area


In Edinburgh we have about 87 roads to go. I know that there are 
many of these roads that conflict with the OS_Opendata names. This is 
due mainly to spelling, roads with two names, new builds that need 
survey etc. 


I believe that there are more roads marked as not in OSM than are 
marked in OS_Locator about 20 in the case of Edinburgh. I thought this 
may have been service roads or unnamed roads further outside the city, 
I 
found many of these but these do not seem to affect the scores of the 
OSM_analysis. I am not sure if this is me just missing roads or OS 
 database data quirks


Are there any hints or insights that people can give me to help me 
find the last few roads.


Once I have brought the number down I can then check with the 
council and have "Street sign, Official Council name, and OS_OpendData 
name" and then be able to report to OS.


On a slightly different note is there any plans to have the 
OS_locator squares marked as a dashed line if there is a tag present 
that says not:name. This would be useful for me to show that a street 
has already been ch

Re: [Talk-GB] The last 2%

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I had originally placed a tag of not = Pentlands Gardens
I have now changed it to not:name = Pentlands Gardens
I have done this for consistency and to make sure the analysis works. I am not 
doing it to purely get the figures down. If I wanted to just get the figures 
down then I would just use the OS_OpenData name, but that would defeat the 
whole point of finding the anomalies. Which is what OSM, OS and the council all 
want. We all want to have the same accurate databases.




--- On Tue, 17/8/10, Dave F.  wrote:

From: Dave F. 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] The last 2%
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, 17 August, 2010, 17:27

 On 17/08/2010 16:18, Bob Kerr wrote:

Hi, Thanks for the replies,


I have placed a tag

not = Pentlands Gardens

instead of not:name= Pentlands Gardens


Bob

Are you saying you've amended or added a tag just to reduce the percentage 
value within ITO?

Cheers
Dave F.

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Re: [Talk-GB] apostrophe's WAS "The last 2%"

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
As stated by Ed
"I added not:name tags where I resurveyed to confirm whether the OS or OSM was 
correct and it was OSM. If it were OS then I corrected OSM based on my survey. 
So yes, not:name tags are added to reduce the percentage value, but also 
to save other mappers resurveying the same possible anomalies."
This is what I have been doing.
I need the anomalies to show up on the ITO tiles but I would like them 
highlighted in some way - like a dashed line to show that they are anomalies so 
I don't come back in two weeks time to recheck it because I have forgotten or 
to warn other folk not to just over write with the OS name.
After going over some of the roads in Edinburgh I have found different people 
using tag combinations like
not = %%%name:not = %%
as well as not:name= 
I have changed the ones that I have found to not:name
Eventually, what should be left on the tiles in Edinburgh is nothing but the 
anomalies. 
I would like the analysis to take out the roads that not:name. The reason is 
that if proves to me that I know that the road has been surveyed. What's left 
is a number say 10. These 10 probably do not have a name or they would show up 
on the ITO tiles. Therefore they are unclassified roads or maybe service roads, 
They could be roads further in the country or maybe extensions to a cul-de-sac. 
These are very difficult to find, I could spend hours and hours looking over 
the map trying to track these down. However if I know they exist then I can 
look into other methods to find them
Cheers
Bob
 

--- On Tue, 17/8/10, Chris Hill  wrote:

From: Chris Hill 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] apostrophe's WAS "The last 2%"
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, 17 August, 2010, 16:42

David Groom wrote:
> 
> - Original Message - From: "Shane Reynolds" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] The last 2%
> 
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I am the developer who works on a number of products including OSM Analysis
>> for ITO.
>> 
>> I am slightly confused about making the OS Locator box a dashed box if the
>> not:name tag is present. When we do the processing if any street is found
>> with the not:name tag matching an OS Locator street then these should not be
>> flagged in the stats nor should they be drawn on the map. Are you saying
>> that this is not the case and they are still appearing? If this is true then
>> possibly there is a bug that I may want to address (we are usually a day
>> behind the updated planet file so possibly its something to do with that?)
>> 
>> With regard to getting the figures down (in slight fear of being flamed as I
>> am a very novice mapper) - with apostrophes, if the road sign has an
>> apostrophe then I would say the apostrophe should be in OSM and if it is not
>> then it is correct to flag it as a difference. However if the road sign does
>> not have an apostrophe and OS Locator does then probably the road should
>> have a not:name tag added with the apostrophe version of the name. This
>> would remove any apostrophe issues.
> 
> Shane,
> great work on your OSM analysis tools.
> 
> My recollection of the discussion on this list in early June was that 
> "apostrophe" differences would not be tagged with not:name as this might have 
> a tendency to flood the not:name reports with minor issues.
> 
> It was also suggested (by me I'll admit) that on the ITO tiles that 
> differences due solely to apostrophes could be marked just in one pale 
> colour, so they could quickly and easily be distinguished from other errors.
> 
> David
OS have expressed an interest in these anomalies, including apostrophes that 
are different which ever way round. It is as much a difference as any other 
character missing. I suspect they know the few parts of the country where they 
are ignored. I have, therefore, been tagging apostrophe anomalies with not:name 
=* like any other.

As to the suggested colour changes I like the ITO tiles just as they are.

-- Cheers, Chris
user: chillly


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[Talk-GB] Pub meeting 29th September Edinburgh

[Bob Kerr]

Hello,
We will be having a pub meeting at 7:pm Wed 29th September 2010 at the 
Guildford Arms
We will be having a guest Ivan Sanchez Ortega who will be able to give us many 
different insights into the spanish mapping community.
We also may be planning our first mapping party to map one of the permanent 
Orienteering maps in Edinburgh and contacting the local Orienteering groups
More details here
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events
All welcome
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] OS Competition with Opendata

[Bob Kerr]

Hi
I noticed that there is a section in the OS competition for OS_OpenData
http://www.geovation.org.uk/geovationchallenge/
If we could encourage councils to release their data in a nice easy format then 
that would help us and OS to validate their data sets. The money could go to 
the OSM foundation.
The date for the close of entry is quite soon though
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] [Spam] oslVosm, OpenData Locator 2010 data and not:name

[Bob Kerr]

In Edinburgh The council have release their name set in 4 PDFs, it may be worth 
considering encouraging other councils to release their data in more friendly 
formats. There is a lot of government data coming out but there does not seem 
to be a consistent, easy to use format which has been decided on.
Cheers
Bob

--- On Mon, 4/10/10, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)  
wrote:

From: Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] [Spam]  oslVosm, OpenData Locator 2010 data and not:name
To: "'Peter Miller'" , "'Tim Francois'" 

Cc: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Monday, 4 October, 2010, 9:58

I also wonder if there is a step before the OS that can help consider the
discrepancies. The naming authority for the streets we have conflict is the
local authority so checking what the naming authority has in its database
may reveal whether the problem is with miss information or incorrect signing
on the ground.

Once the Birmingham folks have completed checks (getting closer now) then we
plan to check with Birmingham City Council to further evaluate.

Cheers

Andy

>-Original Message-
>From: talk-gb-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-gb-
>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Peter Miller
>Sent: 04 October 2010 10:15 AM
>To: Tim Francois
>Cc: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
>Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] [Spam] oslVosm,OpenData Locator 2010 data and
>not:name
>
>great news.
>
>Regarding the not:name tag at the OS, I think we need to be a bit patient.
>The OS is a large organisation and do take time to change. They are
>actually changing fast at present and have expressed enthusiasm for the
>not:name technique and I think it is just a matter of us using it for some
>time while it gets into their systems. We are going to do some more
>analysis on it at some point and will be working with the OS of the
>processes. It would be  shame if we gave up using it before they got into
>listening! In the mean time it is a useful way of stopping people checking
>a conflict that someone else has already determined is a error on their
>part.
>
>
>
>Regards,
>
>
>Peter
>
>
>
>On 3 October 2010 17:47, Tim Francois  wrote:
>
>
>    All,
>
>
>    1.    If there are any heroes left using oslVosm
>  [1] to compare OSM data with
>OS Locator data, I've just updated the script a little so that it now
>honours the not:name tags. Any highways which include a not:name tag are
>automatically assumed to be 100% correct in OSM, whatever OSL says, and are
>ignored in any further comparisons. This assumption may have to be reviewed
>at a later date...
>    2.    Anyone else using/noticed that the Locator data has been
>stealthily 'updated'? I remember Robert writing something about it a while
>back, but can't remember the conversation. In Bristol, a load of roads seem
>to have disappeared, whilst some more have been added. All in all, there
>were about 10 more roads than in the '2009' release. Anyone else notice
>differences?
>    3.    not:name. Are many people using it? Is it working? And are
>these being sent back to OS? The reason I added it to oslVosm is that it
>seems to be being used here in Bristol, so it is useful for 'accurate'
>numbers.
>
>    For those that may not be aware, oslVosm is a script which compares
>OSM data against OS Locator data, and can output a gpx, kml or wiki file of
>any discrepancies. It also tries to do some spell checking if it finds
>similar names. It is primarily aimed at people with a programming tilt, as
>it only works from the command line (and probably only in Linux). For those
>who want an easy to use interface, use Robert's excellent Musical Chairs
>[2] web interface or ITOs slippy map layer in Potlatch or JOSM [3].
>
>    Cheers
>    Tim
>
>    [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OslVosm
>    [2] http://ris.dev.openstreetmap.org/oslmusicalchairs/map and
>http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Using_OS_Locator_files#Browseable_OS_Loc
>ator_to_OSM_comparison_with_fuzzy_matching
>    [3]
>http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Using_OS_Locator_files#OSM_and_OSL_Diffe
>rences_as_Background_Tiles
>
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>
>
>
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>



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Re: [Talk-GB] Map layer with OS Locator comparison from ITO - apostrophes

[Bob Kerr]

Hi, 
I have found Musical chairs to be good to solve that problem
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OS_Locator_Musical_Chairs/FAQ
Cheers
Bob
--- On Thu, 4/11/10, Ed Avis  wrote:

From: Ed Avis 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Map layer with OS Locator comparison from ITO - 
apostrophes
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Thursday, 4 November, 2010, 14:23

I am sorry to reopen this topic but I think it would be a good idea to 
reconsider
the checking of punctuation in the OS Locator tiles.

Look at central Exeter for example:


Three-quarters of the differences reported here are in the presence or absence
of a single apostrophe.  This masks the more important discrepancies and makes
the report less useful.

I know that in principle, apostrophe differences can be resurveyed, tracked
down, investigated with phone calls to the council's naming department, etc.
But in practice many mappers will prefer to concentrate on substantial
differences and missing streets, considering punctuation less important.

Perhaps, then, a set of tiles can be produced which strips punctuation from
both the OSM and OS names before comparing?  This would clearly flag up the
things which need more urgent checking.

-- 
Ed Avis 


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[Talk-GB] ITO analysis Totals

[Bob Kerr]

Hi
I just did a quick totals on the ITO analysis page
Total roads in OS locator 849338
Total roads missing from OSM 295123
Missing change last 30 days -13909
average percentage complete 64.52
cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh pub meeting

[Bob Kerr]

We will be having a pub meeting in Edinburgh next Tuesday please see the 
Edinburgh page for details
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#News
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] Address list

[Bob Kerr]

Any thoughts on creating our own international postcode based on the short code 
used in OSM.
Cheers
Bob

--- On Sat, 11/12/10, Lester Caine  wrote:

From: Lester Caine 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Address list
To: "'talk-gb OSM List'" 
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 7:13

Chris Hill wrote:
> A new national Address list is to be created for England & Wales.
> 
> http://www.communities.gov.uk/news/newsroom/1786564

While the postcode location data has now been released, 'addresses' based on 
postcode is still licensed by Royal Mail and I think it is quite right that 
THEY are allowed to manage the 'PAF' (Postal Address File) which lists all of 
the locations they recognise to deliver to. The National Street Gazetteer is 
the basis for National Address Gazetteer or I think more accurately the 
National Land and Property Gazetteer. These cover 'addresses' in a different 
way so that all land can be identified and the reference to 'emergency 
services' is important here since in rural areas 'postcode' is not always even 
able to identify a building on fire if it has no postal existence.

Bottom line ... I think there is a 'gap' in the datasets that are being created 
which we can hopefully fill using the osm database. That is returning postcodes 
for addresses in a search. The one thing that I think 'free the postcode' 
failed on was not collecting the street name along with the location.

The question is, should we be adding postcode tags to existing street ways, or 
simply building a searchable database of street names to go with the existing 
geolocation table from OS? I am already building my own database, but a central 
facility would seem appropriate.

-- Lester Caine - G8HFL
-
Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact
L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk
EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/
Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk//
Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php

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Re: [Talk-GB] Waterways Map (was invisible)

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
On some rivers upstream there are points tagged for canoeing.
see
http://whitewater.quaker.eu.org/
I'm not sure if this will effect your work but I thought I should let you know.
The tags in this case are placed on the nodes inside the waterway=riverbank way
Cheers
Bob
--- On Thu, 20/1/11, James Davis  wrote:

From: James Davis 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Waterways Map (was invisible)
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Thursday, 20 January, 2011, 10:07


On 19 Jan 2011, at 21:28, Graham Jones wrote:

> Dealing with 'disused' was nice and easy - I have deleted disused locks 
> altogether and changed disused canals to a fainter, dotted line (see just 
> north of Carnforth near Lancaster).  I am not sure I have ever seen a 
> 'disused' canal - does this mean a ditch, or just an overgrown, impassable 
> canal?

Varies a lot, there's one that passes near my house and there's no sign that it 
ever existed, it's route has been tarmaced over forms part of a residential 
street. Further out of town it varies from a small gap between hedgerows (again 
not easily recognisable as a canal) to a ditch, to sections that still contain 
water and remnants of locks. From aerial photographs; the breaks in 
developments caused by the canal make the route very obvious.

James



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[Talk-GB] WebGL

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
Does anyone know if there has been any consideration on using OSM vector data 
with WebGL.
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis name tags

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I would like to support the idea of name:gd=* for Gaelic names. 
In Portree there are definitely two names in OS Locator for several roads
an example is 
highway: residentialname: Mill Parkname:gd: Pairc na Muilnesource: 
OS_OpenData_StreetView
at
http://oscompare.raggedred.net/?zoom=18&lat=57.4161&lon=-6.19&layers=B0TF
If there has not been an official vote on this type of tag then maybe a 
decision should be made because it will affect a
 lot of people making international language maps.
for example
http://osmalba.org/
I would be willing to help with some wiki work if needed to set up voting 
though I think a straight decision would be a lot easier.
Nice work on the new OSM Analysis by the way. Any chance of  totals in the 
table analysis page. It would give us a type of countdown clock for the uk
Cheers
Bob



--- On Thu, 20/1/11, Craig Wallace  wrote:

From: Craig Wallace 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis name tags
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Thursday, 20 January, 2011,
 17:44

On 20/01/2011 17:28, Peter Miller wrote:
> 
> On 20 January 2011 17:20, Tom Chance  > wrote:
> 
>     How about dialects?
> 
>     name:en
>     name:cy
>     name:gd
>     name:gv
>     name:sco
>     name:ga
> 
>     Whatever other regional languages we have.
> 
> 
> we believe that the OS Locator content is always in English. In the
> Western Isles the name field for roads in OSM often holds the Gaelic
> version with the English
 in en:name hence our support for that tag. Do
> tell me if I am wrong on that.

The OS Locator data does have Gaelic names in some places.
See for example Portree: 
http://oscompare.raggedred.net/?zoom=15&lat=57.41533&lon=-6.20179&layers=B0TF
Also some parts of Stornoway: 
http://oscompare.raggedred.net/?zoom=15&lat=58.21523&lon=-6.37094&layers=B0TF

Though it is inconsistent, with English names for some roads, Gaelic names for 
others. I have also noticed a few places where it seems to have both languages, 
so it has a separate box for each.
For Stornoway, the Gaelic names are in the name= tag, with name:en for English.
But for Portree it is mostly the English name in
 the name= tag, with name:gd for the Gaelic names. Its debatable which one 
should be considered the 'primary' name there.

Craig

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Re: [Talk-GB] Postcode centroids

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
A derived post-code based on Latitude and Longitude would work much better 
internationally and would give us something to hang other statistics on. the 
OSM short code could fit the bill.
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] pay_scale_area

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I am presently doing some tracing in Dumfries and there is a way which is 
marked public_transport=pay_scale_area. It is part of a Naptan import. The area 
seems to be vague and is cutting across a number of areas where I am doing some 
detailed work.
Is there a good reason that this should still be kept? 
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] Adding a further 250, 000 UK roads quickly using a Bot?

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,
I would back the use of such a bot but in area's that could do with the help 
and there are only a few of these now. There are a couple of small towns in 
Aberdeenshire that could do with a little boost. Just be careful. The rest will 
follow with a little patience
I think it is a skill that may be useful to learn and a preparation for other 
data sets such as hopitals, churches, schools. This could be used as an overlay 
and not necessarily an import and very useful for other less developed countries
There are a large number of motivations. If we have more publicity we can have 
more people
I would also like to point out the news of aerial image tracing
http://opengeodata.org/
leading to 
http://www.bing.com/community/site_blogs/b/maps/archive/2011/02/03/automatically-detect-roads-with-bing-aerial-imagery.aspx
Which leads to the video.
As far as I can make out, all data sources are incorrect in different ways. 
Some GPS surveys can be a mess,street name markers misspelled or wrong. 
Satellite imaging can be incorrectly georeferenced or out of date as are any 
data sources you can think of. 
I remember hearing that the district councils are getting together to release 
their "official" street name data. When this happens then OSM and OS data will 
converge so that we are all using the same names and then the street signs can 
be changed to the correct name.

Cheers
Bob 





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Re: [Talk-GB] Yahoo! areas (was pay_scale_area)

[Bob Kerr]

Makes sense to me
bob 

--- On Tue, 8/2/11, Andy Street  wrote:

From: Andy Street 
Subject: Re: Yahoo! areas (was pay_scale_area)
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Cc: "Bob Kerr" 
Date: Tuesday, 8 February, 2011, 16:54

On Wed, 2011-02-02 at 10:40 +, Bob Kerr wrote:
> 
> I am presently doing some tracing in Dumfries and there is a way which
> is marked public_transport=pay_scale_area. It is part of a Naptan
> import. The area seems to be vague and is cutting across a number of
> areas where I am doing some detailed work.
> 
> Is there a good reason that this should still be kept? 
> 

I've got a similar problem with ways showing the extent of hi-res Yahoo!
imagery (tagged boundary=yahoo, area=yes). I can't see any real use for
having this data in the database and if we were to do the same for other
imagery sources then it'd soon become a right old mess.

Any objections before I hit delete?

Regards,

Andy




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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM and "The Big Society"

[Bob Kerr]

The document just shows how out of touch and behind the times the politicians 
are. We're doing what they should have been doing decades ago. I think the 
present government is just trying to pride itself with what it thinks is a new 
idea and manipulating it for their own ends.
see
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/nov/17/ordnance-survey-maps-online
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2010/jan/21/timbernerslee-government-data
The fact that openstreetmap had started several years before these articles 
Tim berners-lee was the person of insight to the politicians to help start the 
Data.gov.uk free data movement which I think he has been doing since even 
before the Free Software movement was born many decades ago.
I am really glad that openstreetmap is not political this document is a little 
creepy
Cheers
Bob
--- On Sat, 5/3/11, Dave F.  wrote:

From: Dave F. 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM and "The Big Society"
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Saturday, 5 March, 2011, 0:21

On 02/03/2011 21:43, Robert Scott wrote:
> On Wednesday 02 March 2011, davespod wrote:
>> The Cabinet Office's "Office for Civil Society" has just published a report
>> citing "international examples of The Big Society". Case study number 1 is
>> OpenStreetMap:
>> 
>> http://www.arnaudriegert.com/wp-content/uploads/international-examples-big-society.pdf
> I feel dirty.

I know what you mean.

I don't want to get party political, but Cameron & his cabinet's examples of 
"Big Society" have been substitution volunteering, where some who got paid 
previously, is now expected to do it for free; i.e. Librarians. I don't want to 
be associated with that.

Dave F.



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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh Pub meet up

[Bob Kerr]

There will be an Edinburgh pub meeting at 7:00pm on Tuesday 15th march in the 
Guildford Arms
Please see
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#News
For Details
Cheers
Bob


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Re: [Talk-GB] new ITO Map service in beta

[Bob Kerr]

Excellent,
I have already discovered some discrepancies in Edinburgh using the layers 
layer. I am also not noticing any lag in displaying the data at this time.  I 
can also see the benefit of highlighting the schools and hope that in the 
future that maybe hospitals,doctors will be included
Well done
Cheers
Bob

--- On Fri, 18/3/11, Peter Miller  wrote:

From: Peter Miller 
Subject: [Talk-GB] new ITO Map service in beta
To: "Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org" 
Date: Friday, 18 March, 2011, 14:12

ITO are pleased to announce a set of new 'overlay maps' for OpenStreetMap which 
can highlights some of the data layers, such as speed limits, highway lane 
widths, whether rivers are navigable and if buildings have addresses etc.


The service is still very much in beta and may suffer if many people jump on it 
at the same time but lets see what happens.

The service is available here:
http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/ito_map/main


And a wiki description is available here:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/ITO_Map

We are starting with a service for a bounding box that included the UK and 
northern France, Holland, a bit of Germany and up to southern Norway and a 
separate bounding box including the bay area, SF. The tiles will always be 
based current daily diff planet data (with a 24 hour processing lag). We should 
never serve old tiles from old data. If the service is noticeably slow then 
please give it a break for a hour and then try again.


We will roll out the service to more areas as the system beds in and then 
globally over the next few weeks assuming that the servers hold up.

We will gather feedback over the next week or so and then many some changes to 
the service to iron out any wrinkles.




Regards,


Peter Miller
ITO World Ltd



-Inline Attachment Follows-

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[Talk-GB] Orienteering event map

[Bob Kerr]

I just saw this and I thought it was a good example of how to deal with future 
events

http://sloweb.org.uk/ollie/map/index.php
Cheers
Bob


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[Talk-GB] Tracing/Mapping Party Peebles for Sunday 10th April

[Bob Kerr]

Hi
We will be having a mapping party in Peebles on Sunday 10th April. We will be 
meeting with the local Orienteering group and we have been given permision to 
use the Canmore_ID extracted from 
http://canmoremapping.rcahms.gov.uk/
To find monuments to map.
We are not allowed to copy the OS map that is shown. If we are succesful then 
we hope to persuade them to use Openstreetmap as one of the base layers in 
their map
It is worth while also looking at 
http://free.findmaps.co.uk/
(I have already requested that they change the name "Urban Detail" to 
Openstreetmap
There is also much cycling, walking, canoeing, and Orienteering to do. So lots 
of tracing then getting out and about. We may even be featured in the local 
newspaper
please
 see
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh/MappingParty/2011-04-10
Cheers
Bob






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[Talk-GB] SABRE Maps

[Bob Kerr]

I just heard about this, I don't know anything about the group but I thought 
I'd pass it on since it's using openstreetmap
http://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/maps/
Cheers
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[Talk-GB] Open Data Challenge

[Bob Kerr]

A bit of cash maybe?
http://opendatachallenge.org/
Cheers
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Re: [Talk-GB] Open Data Challenge

[Bob Kerr]

Yep, same as
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2011
Cheers
Bob !
--- On Tue, 12/4/11, Steve Doerr  wrote:

From: Steve Doerr 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Open Data Challenge
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, 12 April, 2011, 15:03

On 12/04/2011 15:15, Bob Kerr wrote:

> A bit of cash maybe?

> http://opendatachallenge.org/

Headline sponsor: Google!

-- Steve


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Re: [Talk-GB] Things that aren't stations tagged railway=station

[Bob Kerr]

I agree
Cheers
Bob

--- On Tue, 19/4/11, Andy Allan  wrote:

From: Andy Allan 
Subject: [Talk-GB] Things that aren't stations tagged railway=station
To: "Talk-GB" 
Date: Tuesday, 19 April, 2011, 8:21

Hi All,

In making my recent transport map[1] I've found there's a (relatively)
large number of nodes in the UK tagged railway=station, when they
aren't stations (and often aren't any railways there, either). I'm
proposing that we don't tag former, disused or fictional stations in a
way that confuses mainstream users of OSM, in the same way we don't
tag proposed motorways as highway=motorway.

I realise that there are additional tags to try to indicate that they
don't exist (such as disused=yes) but I don't think this is a
particularly useful approach, given the near infinite numbers of extra
tags that could be thought up for fictional, planned,
was-planned-not-built-not-planned-any-more etc stations. Even the wiki
page for disused=yes suggests it's a bad idea[2], and that some other
"backwards-compatible" approach would be better. We have a
backwards-compatible approach for the disused and abandoned railway
lines already.

Would there be objections to changing the situation with UK railway
stations to bring it into line with highways/railway lines, e.g.
railway=disused, disused=station , or e.g. railway=abandoned,
abandoned=station? It's such a niche interest (well, seemingly much
less niche in the UK than elsewhere :-) ) that I don't think it helps
to tag things in their current scheme. I don't think this is
particularly controversial (my suggestions mirror the approach for
both highways and railway lines already), I've discussed it already
with a handful of people who have used the old approach, but I thought
it best to air it here too.

Cheers,
Andy

[1] http://www.gravitystorm.co.uk/shine/archives/2011/04/11/transport-map/
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:disused

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[Talk-GB] User Stats over 400 000

[Bob Kerr]

See

http://www.openstreetmap.org/stats/data_stats.html


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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

Is there any way that we can request the data in a standard easy to use format, 
one that we can requested from different councils throughout the uk. If we can 
do this, and use a standard tool for comparison I think it would be beneficial 
for us and the local councils. If there isn't should we make one?

Cheers

Bob


From: TimSC 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Friday, 3 June 2011, 11:45
Subject: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation


Hi all,

Some stats on OSM coverage of Kent. I tried to pair the records of KCC OpenKent 
with the OSM database. Assuming the KCC list is complete (which it is usually, 
but not entirely), we can estimate OSM's coverage in the area.

Schools: 618 of 915 (915 (67.54 %)
Pharmacies: 67 of 274 (274 (24.45 %)
Doctors: 33 of 286 (286 (11.54 %)
Libraries: 70 of 101 (101 (69.31 %)
Opticians: 12 of 170 (170 (7.06 %)
Hospitals: 24 of 33 (33 (72.73 %)

So, OSM is good on some features and poor on others. It seems "for profit" 
locations are not so well mapped, compared to public services.

My philosophy is that OSM omissions should be regarded as errors. With complete 
lists of addresses, we can go and find exact positions of these services. I am 
still unsure if this is compatible with the relicensing. This data is 
distributed under OGL (and sometimes OS OpenData too). Can LWG attempt to 
reduce the legal uncertainty of this, by a definitive statement?

Regards,

TimSC


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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation

[Bob Kerr]

Do you think that a heatmap of the different formats released by the councils, 
with an indication from us of preferred formats be worth considering. I know 
that Edinburgh council uses pdf but I don't have an idea of the status of other 
councils


cheers

Bob



From: TimSC 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Cc: Bob Kerr 
Sent: Saturday, 4 June 2011, 11:56
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation


 On 04/06/11 11:04, Bob Kerr wrote: 
Hi,
>
>
>Is there any way that we can request the data in a standard easy
to use format, one that we can requested from different councils
throughout the uk. 
That would be ideal because data standards enable sharing and use. On
the other hand, any barrier to councils releasing the data might be
used as an excuse not to share it at all. The problem is different
councils have different levels of commitment to open data. The most
popular formats from Kent seems to be Excel and RSS feeds. At least it
is not PDF!


If we can do this, and use a standard tool for comparison I
think it would be beneficial for us and the local councils. If there
isn't should we make one?
>
>
My locateservices CMS goes some way towards this. An alternative, for
data with high spacial accuracy (within GPS receiver accuracy), is to
import it directly into OSM and maintain the data there. Also, I think
the councils might be confused by any license beyond the most simple
(that is just a guess though), so sharing the data back with the source
might be problematic with OSM (with either the old or new license).

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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation

[Bob Kerr]

Hi,

In Edinburgh the list of public roads is available here

http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/177/register_of_public_roads/865/public_roads_in_edinburgh


The reason that I refer to this is that the Data from OS is not as accurate or 
up to date as this data. There is also some roads that are not named. I know 
from experience that the OS data is not fully correct and neither is OSM data. 
However as we are correcting the roads in edinburgh, this gets filtered back to 
OS which in turn goes to ITO and eventually we will all have the same correct 
data, It will take some time. We also have very few surveyors.

My point though is that we do have some data available from the council, and if 
we can create a heat map that shows which councils are releasing data then it 
may encourage others to do the same. My question is would it be worthwhile 
doing.

Cheers

bob



From: Richard Fairhurst 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Tuesday, 7 June 2011, 14:37
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OpenKent, OSM coverage estimation

TimSC wrote:
> I think you miss my point. The datasets contain more than just their
> postal address. If the licenses are compatible, we can mash up the data.

You don't need to put stuff into OSM to make it mashable-uppable. Most
competent licences will have a Collective Work/Database provision to
enable this.

>> And you should do that anyway.
> This implies I don't already, which is a false. (Otherwise, why are you
> telling me I should?)

Oh, cool. Sorry, I thought you were still using Yahoo imagery to trace
places you'd never been. Glad you've stopped. :)

> [...]
> Any what if the government dataset is open and stomps on OSM's attempt?

OS OpenData is easily the best free geodata available in the UK and I've
just used it (in preference to OSM) to make a lovely paper map, but it
hasn't killed OSM yet. :)

> (Don't bother saying "improve OSM" because that IS the approach we use
> and still the government set is better, in some cases.) Duplicating
> other open data sets seems a waste of time - as you seem to imply by
> resurveying stuff already available elsewhere.

In a few cases, manually importing data can indeed be a useful tool. The
high-resolution rivers and streams in VectorMap District are quite useful
_if_ you know the stream is indeed there, which obviously VMD doesn't tell
you. It's not really any better than using a combination of aerial imagery
and your own knowledge, but it can be useful, yes.

But this is pretty much only true where the data is impractical to survey
yourself. The canonical example is: if you import a town's roads, you get
a town's roads. If you survey a town's roads, you get a town's roads,
footpaths, cycle routes, pubs, etc. etc. I'm sure there's been an example
where an import has been significant in the success of OSM in the UK but
I'm struggling to think of one. Maybe someone else can help?

> I am not advocating we
> only import data either. A hybrid approach - import AND crowd source -
> is better. If you want crowd sourced surveying only, I suggest you start
> another project.

Fortunately, I _like_ the licence that 23135 people have said they'll move
their data to, and only 387 have said they won't (that's 98.4% vs 1.6%).
So I'm not planning to be one of the people moving to another project. :)

cheers
Richard




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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

[Bob Kerr]

I don't have any objection to a bot, so long as it is done carefully, 
especially here in the UK where there has been so much done already. I think it 
would be a useful tool which could be used not only in this country but 
especially for developing countries. If in the USA they imported the TIGER 
database with all its flaws and is now being healthily corrected and added to 
then the same will work here. Having a "complete" data set will allow 
programmers to release their data in graphical form on top of ours which in 
turn will help tell a story which is equally as important as a road map.

Google example from the Guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/interactive/2011/jun/08/life-expectancy-uk-health-mapped


Cheers

Bob


From: Peter Miller 
To: Brian Prangle 
Cc: "Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org" 
Sent: Thursday, 9 June 2011, 6:01
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

On 8 June 2011 21:20, Brian Prangle  wrote:
> The Warwick additions are all  names in  the defunct Stoneleigh Agricultural
> Show site. Must get over there and do a survey to see what's happening to
> any redevelopment there - unless anyone else wants to volunteer!
> I'm firmly of the opinion that this is not work for a bot unless a tag is
> added such as verified=no so we humans can search for what hasn't been
> surveyed. In Birmingham and Solihull I've personally surveyed every
> OS-Locator error  before editing it and we have a pretty impressive list of
> OS errors (210 not-names from 8966 road names)and they're not all
> apostrophes either! ( Going out to survey far-flung street name errors also
> has the added bonus of an incentive to do some other basic surveying and
> improvement to the map) That's why we're stuck at 99.5% - the ones left are
> just too far away and scattered to motivate me or the Local Authority hasn't
> replied to my requests to inspect the definitive record.
>  A bot will just replicate the OS errors and then we'll never find them! I'm
> also dubious that a lot of the progress to date has just been armchair stuff
> and we've just replicated any errors  that the OS might have.

I agree entirely, which is why the proposal includes a verified=no
field (it used to say 'surveryed=no' but I have just changed it on the
wiki given that verified is a more common name). It might be better to
clarify further as 'geometry:verified' or 'name:verified'. My concern
with the current arm-chair mapping approach is that it may not include
this verification tag and source:name. The bot would at least be able
to do it right and allow for a subsequent ground survey.

>That might be
> OK with most people but I've always seen OSM as proving that by local
> crowdsourcing, given enough mappers, we can produce more accurate data. Our
> problem in the UK is we don't have enough people on the ground and there's
> no consistent planned promotional effort to attract more people or -
>  even easier just re-attract some of the early pioneers back to active
> mapping - at least they've shown they're willing and able and some of them
> would be pretty impressed both with progress and the capability of the tools
> at our disposal now. How about some analysis of inactive users who have a
> significant number of edits (> 50?) and doing an email shot? I'm willing to
> draft a text for discussion

There are lots of reasons why we don't have more contributors and how
we could get more and lets all aim to build the community. What I
disagree with it the theory that OSM in the UK would be damaged as a
result of such an import. Netherlands is a good example that this does
not happen. For sure there would no longer be any 'dragons' left in
the form of blank spots on the map in GB but there is still plenty to
do including verification. I do however know that this is an 'over my
dead body' issue for some people in the community; my concern is that
other voices are being drowned out whenever the subject of imports in
general is raised and in particular this import.

There are many more levels to OSM. I am enjoying doing speed limit
hunting at present when travelling - plenty of blank spots on the map
and reminiscent of the days when we had no aerial photography and no
OS Open data when tracking down new roads! Why not see what is missing
in your area :)
http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/ito_map/main?view=5&lat=52.310633029288894&lon=-0.5165746127230731&zoom=8


Regards,


Peter

> Regards
> Brian
>
> On 8 June 2011 07:58, Peter Miller  wrote:
>>
>> Following on swiftly from Musical Chairs OSM Analaysis is now also
>> running with the new OS Locator data.
>>
>> Warwickshire is the biggest gainer/looser with 33 new names; over half
>> of the districts have got at least one new road and there are now only
>> 8 places still at 100%. We do  have 51 at over 99% and only 32 at
>> under 50%. There is serious work in Wales, parts of Scotland, the West
>> Midlands and Norfolk at present and in other places as w

Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

[Bob Kerr]

I agree with Andy about increasing the number of mappers is essential. With 
Cycle map he has increased the interest in the cycling communities. Getting 
interest and publicity is very difficult. I can see many other communities that 
we could encourage to start helping us, from NHS to golfers but we have no 
organised way of doing this at the moment. Using a bot to replace large 
sections of data in the UK is going to be counterproductive or destructive, 
especially as the UK is now 80% (road name)complete.  However restricting a bot 
by area to the size of small villages may help. I believe we can both encourage 
people to join us and use the a bot on small areas at the same time.

Cheers

bob


From: Andy Allan 
To: sk53_...@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Thursday, 9 June 2011, 16:45
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

On Thu, Jun 9, 2011 at 3:42 PM, Jerry Clough : SK53 on OSM
 wrote:

> In order to get  a better level of completeness in the UK what we need are
> more mappers.

Absolutely.

Everything we do should be focussed on helping get more mappers, or
helping the mappers we have get their jobs done more easily.
Everything that is a direct substitute for having more mappers is, at
best, a distraction from (what I see as) the desired goal. If we have
mappers, and lots of them, then - as we've now demonstrated - we can
get a glorious dataset.

Note that not everyone here shares the same goals - some people are
focussed on the data, others on the community. It might be worth
examining why we (collectively) have a tendency to discuss the data
all the time and I see very few discussions on community matters.

I find in most conversations, if the answer is "because we don't have
enough mappers yet" then the solution is not to bypass them with some
form of automation but to get more of them. Unfortunately to most
OSMers, community building seems hard (which it is), and writing bots
or doing imports seems easy (which it's not).

> A bot is putting short-term gain ahead of our long-term interests.

Indeed. What's more, all the effort that goes into writing bots,
discussing them, justifying them etc is time that hasn't gone into the
primary goal of recruiting and helping more people to OSM.

Cheers,
Andy

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Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

[Bob Kerr]

So the question is, who is going to come forward and write the bot, and who is 
going to come forward to write documentation.

Any takers

Cheers

Bob



From: Richard Fairhurst 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Friday, 10 June 2011, 20:09
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OSM Analysis New Data and bot

Ed Avis wrote:
> Richard Fairhurst writes:
>>But if we were to put as much effort into marketing OSM and
>>improving our tools as we do into writing and indeed discussing bots, 
>>the 40% areas would be fixed.
>
> If that were true, then it would be no contest.  Given the choice between
> spending some effort doing an import and the same effort to recruit a huge 
> army of mappers who can cover the whole country, any sane person would 
> go for the mappers.

Lemme give you an example.

There are some really eloquent people on these lists. Granted, some of them
are eloquently arguing nonsense, but nonetheless, some really eloquent
people who can explain things lucidly, entertainingly, and convincingly.

So why does our documentation suck so hard?

Writing good docs is not easy, but given the right people, it is certainly
no more difficult than writing a competent bot. Certainly I know which I'd
find easier (which makes it a bit ironic that I do programming for OSM
rather than writing, but hey). 

There is approximately one person in the entire world who has made an effort
on documentation - stand up and take a bow, Richard Weait - but he can't do
it all by himself. And here we are all merrily talking about bots, while
every day dozens of people are signing up for OSM, staring at the screen,
and thinking "um, what the fuck do I do *now*?".

So how do we start to convert some of those sign-up-but-never-edit people
into real mappers? Get a group together. Have a mailing list (private if
needs be) to discuss what you're doing. Find an install of Dokuwiki or
Wordpress or whatever turns you on. Write some really good,
beginner-friendly docs. Start small: an English-language guide to
contributing basic mapping to OSM. (Bells and whistles and
internationalisation can come later.)

This little step would do a whole lot more for OSM globally than some street
names in Dumfries & Galloway ever will. And you can start it today.

cheers
Richard



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[Talk-GB] Edinburgh pub meeting tomorrow

[Bob Kerr]

We are having a pub meeting tomorrow details here

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Edinburgh#Social_Events


We hope to be discussing State of the Map Scotland

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/State_Of_The_Map_Scotland_2011


cheers 

Bob
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[Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation

[Bob Kerr]

Hi, 

I was thinking last night about the ITO Analysis heat map as a tool that 
motivates people to look into doing some mapping in different area's.

http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/osm_analysis/map_browser


I was wondering what statistics are available that we could use to make an 
interactive visualisation/map of the quality/last time edited of the pages on 
the wiki.
I think analysing the whole wiki might be too confusing but maybe a smaller 
subset like tags might be worth experimenting on. If we had a map which shows 
which tags have been accepted, which are proposed and not voted on, which are 
proposed and abandoned, which set of tags are confusing or need to be 
rethought. I am definitely thinking of a map and not a series of graphs, I 
would need to be able to zoom in on a proposal that has not be acted on for a 
year so that I could deleted it,

If we gave the wiki page itself some tags

page=proposal

date:started=01/01/2011

voting=02/07/2011

If we had a voting tag then we can show which proposals are currently being 
voted on

spanish=no

needs translation

duplication= wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/

cleanup= yes

for areas that we need more documentation we can create a page then add the tag

page=not started


My mind is wandering a bit this morning so if this sounds daft please ignore

Cheers

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Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation

[Bob Kerr]

I am not going to delete anything, I am trying to suggest a method where we can 
take control of the wiki, in a similar way that we control the map data.

We tag the wiki pages

we could also use things like

page=application_description
page=instruction
page=introduction
page=reference

Cheers

Bob



From: woll 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2011, 16:31
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation


Bob Kerr wrote:
> 
> I would need to be able to zoom in on a proposal that has not be acted on
> for a year so that I could deleted it,
> 

Please don't delete 'old' proposals. They should 'never' be deleted, so that
next time someone thinks of a similar proposal they can use the previous one
as a starting point (or use it to realise why the proposal was not a good
one).

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Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation Proposal = dead

[Bob Kerr]

We could add proposal= dead to the wiki page then we can filter all the dead 
pages so see all the things that have been proposed and see what has been done 
before

Cheers

Bob


From: Bob Kerr 
To: woll ; "talk-gb@openstreetmap.org" 

Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2011, 16:43
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation


I am not going to delete anything, I am trying to suggest a method where we can 
take control of the wiki, in a similar way that we control the map data.

We tag the wiki pages

we could also use things like

page=application_description
page=instruction
page=introduction
page=reference

Cheers

Bob



From: woll 
To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2011, 16:31
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation


Bob Kerr wrote:
> 
> I would need to be able to zoom in on a proposal that has not be acted on
> for a year so that I could deleted it,
> 

Please don't delete 'old' proposals. They should 'never' be deleted, so that
next time someone thinks of a similar proposal they can use the previous one
as a starting point (or use it to realise why the proposal was not a good
one).

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Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation

[Bob Kerr]

Excellent, much better than my idea of tags

This would bring me to the visualisation done by Chris Harrison on visualising 
wikipedia

http://www.chrisharrison.net/projects/wikiviz/index.html


and

http://www.chrisharrison.net/projects/clusterball/


is there any value in something like this for increasing the quality of our 
wiki/documentation

Cheers

Bob





From: Andy Mabbett 
To: "talk-gb@openstreetmap.org" 
Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2011, 21:29
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Documentation and Visualisation


Have a look at how Wikipedia uses categories.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
On Jul 3, 2011 9:43 AM, "Bob Kerr"  wrote:
> Hi, 
> 
> I was thinking last night about the ITO Analysis heat map as a tool that 
> motivates people to look into doing some mapping in different area's.
> 
> http://www.itoworld.com/product/data/osm_analysis/map_browser
> 
> 
> I was wondering what statistics are available that we could use to make an 
> interactive visualisation/map of the quality/last time edited of the pages on 
> the wiki.
> I think analysing the whole wiki might be too confusing but maybe a smaller 
> subset like tags might be worth experimenting on. If we had a map which shows 
> which tags have been accepted, which are proposed and not voted on, which are 
> proposed and abandoned, which set of tags are confusing or need to be 
> rethought. I am definitely thinking of a map and not a series of graphs, I 
> would need to be able to zoom in on a proposal that has not be acted on for a 
> year so that I could deleted it,
> 
> If we gave the wiki page itself some tags
> 
> page=proposal
> 
> date:started=01/01/2011
> 
> voting=02/07/2011
> 
> If we had a voting tag then we can show which proposals are currently being 
> voted on
> 
> spanish=no
> 
> needs translation
> 
> duplication= wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/
> 
> cleanup= yes
> 
> for areas that we need more documentation we can create a page then add the 
> tag
> 
> page=not started
> 
> 
> My mind is wandering a bit this morning so if this sounds daft please ignore
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Bob

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[Talk-GB] UK broadband map from Telegraph

[Bob Kerr]

I Thought this might be of interest to a few

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/broadband/8620931/UK-broadband-mapped.html


I can't see any correlation between OSM uptake and broadband

Cheers

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