Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Andy Townsend]

On 29/09/2017 19:40, Philip Barnes wrote:



Each needs a case by case survey, any can be motor_vehicle=private or 
destination.


I don't think that's what 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Rjw62/PRoW_Table is trying to 
say - it's saying "there are no motor vehicle rights granted by the 
existence of a restricted byway sign" whereas "there are non-motorised 
vehicle rights".  I probably wouldn't use "=designated" where it says 
(though I know many people do), but other than that I'd agree with what 
it says.  The access column is labelled "Minimum Access Tags", so it is 
just a minimum.


Re "vehicle", strictly speaking you can legally drive a coach and four 
down a restricted byway.  Most of the time you won't physically be able 
to, of course, but that's the difference between what's legal and what's 
practical.


Best Regards,

Andy


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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Philip Barnes]

On Fri, 2017-09-29 at 18:59 +0100, Bob Hawkins wrote:
> 
> Jerry
> I thank you for your helpful reply.
> One of my difficulties with Restricted Byways is the use of 
> motor_vehicle=no as shown in Robert Whittaker’s table, http://wiki.op
> enstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Rjw62/PRoW_Table.  
> I use vehicle=yes in almost all cases, but there are properties on
> Restricted 
> Byways, as in this case, where I judge that tag to be inappropriate,
> to say the 
> least.

Hi Bob
I had never seen page, it does seem very misleading. Vehicle is an odd
tag, as a vehicle normally includes a bike. Those restrictions kind of
apply to public access by motor_vehicles.

There are two sorts of access when applied to rights of way, those
defined by the designation and what we have a right to do. But then
there are private rights too. You cannot put a blanket motor_vehicle=no
on a right of way, other than a byway it should not have yes but rights
of way (footpaths/bridleways/restricted byways) will often form access
to properties or fields. 

Each needs a case by case survey, any can be motor_vehicle=private or
destination.

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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Bob Hawkins]

Jerry
I thank you for your helpful reply.
One of my difficulties with Restricted Byways is the use of motor_vehicle=no as 
shown in Robert Whittaker’s table, 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Rjw62/PRoW_Table.  I use vehicle=yes in 
almost all cases, but there are properties on Restricted Byways, as in this 
case, where I judge that tag to be inappropriate, to say the least.
Bob

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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[SK53]

One simple rule of thumb: if the postman & delivery drivers go that way
it's =destination not =private.

"Private" roads, better called unadopted roads often get mapped with
access=private in the first instance. This is better reserved for places
where access is clearly limited by a gate or other barrier, as usually the
class of users regarded as entitled to use the road is broader than the
owners. See discussion of "The Park Estate" a few months back.

Jerry

On 29 September 2017 at 16:27, Bob Hawkins  wrote:

> David
> I should have made it clearer: the two signs of which I wrote are one
> above the other at the start of the one Restricted Byway – that, perhaps,
> is the complication.
> Bob
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Bob Hawkins]

David
I should have made it clearer: the two signs of which I wrote are one above the 
other at the start of the one Restricted Byway – that, perhaps, is the 
complication.
Bob

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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Philip Withnall]

On Fri, 2017-09-29 at 14:06 +0100, David Woolley wrote:
> On 29/09/17 13:56, Bob Hawkins wrote:
> 
> > In the absence of the image, the two signs read as follows: 1. In
> > white 
> > on blue: Oxfordshire County Council/No vehicles beyond this point
> > except 
> > for access. 
> 
> motor_vehicle=destination
> 
> >  2. In white on green: RESTRICTED BYWAY/PRIVATE
> > ROAD/NO 
> > vehicle access except for residents.  I should appreciate views on
> > the 
> 
> motor_vehicle=private
> 
> My reasoning, the first one allows all comers, as long as they are 
> visiting.  The second one requires explicit permission, either from
> the 
> land covenants or from a resident.

It would be good if this were added as an example on the wiki, if one
doesn’t exist already.

Philip

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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Andy Townsend]

On 29/09/2017 14:06, David Woolley wrote:


 2. In white on green: RESTRICTED BYWAY/PRIVATE ROAD/NO 
vehicle access except for residents.  I should appreciate views on the 


motor_vehicle=private 


Does the sign really mean "no vehicle access" or "no motor vehicle access"?

As I understand it a restricted byway is normally "vehicle=yes; 
motor_vehicle=no" and I'd normally tag them like that.  Of course there 
may be other restrictions (e.g. traffic regulation orders) in effect at 
a particular time.


Best Regards,

Andy

PS: for images I'd normally add them to an image hosting site like 
imgur.com and link to the result from the email.


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Re: [Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[David Woolley]

On 29/09/17 13:56, Bob Hawkins wrote:

In the absence of the image, the two signs read as follows: 1. In white 
on blue: Oxfordshire County Council/No vehicles beyond this point except 
for access. 


motor_vehicle=destination

 2. In white on green: RESTRICTED BYWAY/PRIVATE ROAD/NO 
vehicle access except for residents.  I should appreciate views on the 


motor_vehicle=private

My reasoning, the first one allows all comers, as long as they are 
visiting.  The second one requires explicit permission, either from the 
land covenants or from a resident.


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[Talk-GB] Access and other tags for a particular Restricted Byway

[Bob Hawkins]

I wished to attach an image of road signs in Shiplake, Oxfordshire, but was 
informed the file was too large.
In the absence of the image, the two signs read as follows: 1. In white on 
blue: Oxfordshire County Council/No vehicles beyond this point except for 
access.  2. In white on green: RESTRICTED BYWAY/PRIVATE ROAD/NO vehicle access 
except for residents.  I should appreciate views on the correct and complete 
treatment for access, motor_vehicle and vehicle keys, or anything else in this 
case, bearing in mind routing.  I find it difficult to know how to tag 
Restricted Byways correctly, often.  The Way is 25506222.
With regards
Bob Hawkins

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