Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[David Paleino]

On Wed, 26 Jan 2011 19:44:46 +0100, Michael von Glasow wrote:

> [..]
> There seem to be some restrictions on the stops and their tagging. As 
> long as all stops are single nodes (not areas) and tagged as one of the 
> following:
> * railway=station
> * railway=tram_stop
> * highway=bus_stop
> * public_transport=stop_position
> 
> you should be fine. (Note that amenity=bus_station does not work.)

(and this is one of the things I wanted to fix, but I can't find the code and I
bet I'll end up in re-writing it by reverse engineering various SVGs...)

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Michael von Glasow]

On 01/26/2011 08:43 AM, Wojciech Kulesza wrote:

>
> Just compare your relation with the working one :)
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361959
> On first sight i'm wondering why you are mixing "railway=halt" and
> "railway=tram_stop"? Isn't all of it a tram line? Additionally you are
> missing "from=" and "to=" in your relation.
>
> Claudius

This was maybe not clear from my first email. I was not the author of 
those relations. I simply used openstreetbrowser.org 
 project to identify already-existing 
relations for trams/buses in Poznan/Poland and used them in that OSM API.


Is there anything i can do in order to get them in the correct format? 
I already got involved in some editing of OSM, through Portlach 
(flashbased tool), but this was more on adding some missing escalators 
and fixing non-connected islands in case of intersections.
I had to experiment a while to get my relations to be displayed the way 
I wanted; if I remember correctly, you need to:
* tag your relation as type=route; route=light_rail/subway/tram/bus 
(note that route=trolleybus is not supported, you'll get "No relation 
found")

* set the ref=* and network=* tags correctly
* not sure if you also need from=* and to=* but for sure it doesn't hurt 
(and the values get displayed, so it'll look better if you have them)

* add your stops with role=stop and make sure they're sorted correctly.

There seem to be some restrictions on the stops and their tagging. As 
long as all stops are single nodes (not areas) and tagged as one of the 
following:

* railway=station
* railway=tram_stop
* highway=bus_stop
* public_transport=stop_position

you should be fine. (Note that amenity=bus_station does not work.)

This will also work for lines mapped with two relations (or even four 
for Y-shaped relations).


Michael
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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Fips Schneider]

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On 26.01.2011 10:20, Michał Borsuk wrote:
> Am 26.01.2011 08:43, schrieb Wojciech Kulesza:
>>  >
>>  > Just compare your relation with the working one :)
>>  > http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361959
>>  > On first sight i'm wondering why you are mixing "railway=halt" and
>>  > "railway=tram_stop"? Isn't all of it a tram line? Additionally you are
>>  > missing "from=" and "to=" in your relation.
>>  >
>>  > Claudius
>>
>> This was maybe not clear from my first email. I was not the author of
>> those relations. I simply used openstreetbrowser.org
>>  project to identify already-existing
>> relations for trams/buses in Poznan/Poland and used them in that OSM API.
>>
>> Is there anything i can do in order to get them in the correct format?
> 
> That's a mess!
> 
> 1. Tram lines are normally represented by a single line on the map, not one 
> line
> per track

Please don't delete information, which is more accurate but rendered - in your
opinion - bad! If you think, this is wrong in your opinion, start to make a new
rendering in Mapnik!

> 2. Each route is represented by relation[s], so this
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/175610061 is completely wrong
> 
> 3. Tram stops have the wrong tags
> 
> I'd start with that...
> 
> 
> Greetings,
> 
> LMB

- - Fips

> 
> 
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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[ant]

Hi,

On 26.01.2011 09:20, Michał Borsuk wrote:

That's a mess!

1. Tram lines are normally represented by a single line on the map, not
one line per track


That's no problem, but if you do it that way, put tram stop nodes on 
each track. Better yet, add the platforms besides the tracks (Poznan has 
Bing imagery, doesn't it?)



2. Each route is represented by relation[s], so this
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/175610061 is completely wrong


What's wrong with that?



3. Tram stops have the wrong tags


Yes, should be railway=tram_stop

cheers
ant

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Frankie Roberto]

On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 8:20 AM, Michał Borsuk wrote:

That's a mess!
>
> 1. Tram lines are normally represented by a single line on the map, not one
> line per track
>

Generally, yes - but I've had occasion to map one line per track before.  If
you take the instance of a road where one side has an embedded tram track
open only to trams (going North), and the other side has an embedded tram
track but is open to both trams and road vehicles (going South).

I've mapped this situation with two parallel lines, both with oneway=yes,
and then with various access tags.  I couldn't think of any other way of
doing this?

Frankie

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Dominik Mahrer (Teddy)]

On 26.01.2011 09:20, Michał Borsuk wrote:

1. Tram lines are normally represented by a single line on the map, not
one line per track


This is what you think is correct.

Why don't you accept, that others want and do map more exact and more in 
detail then you?


Teddych

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Michał Borsuk]

Am 26.01.2011 08:43, schrieb Wojciech Kulesza:

 >
 > Just compare your relation with the working one :)
 > http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361959
 > On first sight i'm wondering why you are mixing "railway=halt" and
 > "railway=tram_stop"? Isn't all of it a tram line? Additionally you are
 > missing "from=" and "to=" in your relation.
 >
 > Claudius

This was maybe not clear from my first email. I was not the author of
those relations. I simply used openstreetbrowser.org
 project to identify already-existing
relations for trams/buses in Poznan/Poland and used them in that OSM API.

Is there anything i can do in order to get them in the correct format?


That's a mess!

1. Tram lines are normally represented by a single line on the map, not 
one line per track
2. Each route is represented by relation[s], so this 
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/175610061 is completely wrong


3. Tram stops have the wrong tags

I'd start with that...


Greetings,

LMB


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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Michał Borsuk]

Am 25.01.2011 20:03, schrieb Claudius Henrichs:

Am 25.01.2011 18:30, Wojciech Kulesza:

Was wondering if the planned changes to approach in mapping public
transport would have an impact on this service:
http://78.46.81.38/public_transport.html

While it behaves quite nicely for the examples provided there, it
works very bad for PT in Poland.

Compare this result:
http://78.46.81.38/api/sketch-line?network=ZTM+Pozna%C5%84&ref=1


with the appropariate relation in osm:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/79152

Just compare your relation with the working one :)
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361959
On first sight i'm wondering why you are mixing "railway=halt" and
"railway=tram_stop"? Isn't all of it a tram line? Additionally you are
missing "from=" and "to=" in your relation.


What is most urgently missing are the tram stops added to the relation. 
As for the service at 78.46.81.38, you can't expect it to work with just 
anything, because there's no standard. My routes have a similar problem.


Greetings,

LMB






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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[David Paleino]

On Tue, 25 Jan 2011 18:45:58 +0100, Tiziano D'Angelo wrote:

> Maybe you have to put roles forward_stop and backward_stop to stops if it's
> 1 relation for 1 line. It seems most stops have no roles at all Anyway you
> should also order the relations members by type ways - nodes for stops.
> Or the problem might be the fact that some stops are railway = halt and some
> other railway = tram_stop?

I found similar issues -- I wrote to who seemingly wrote the code, to access
the source code and maybe provide a patch, but haven't got any response so far.
Does anyone know if the code is publicly hosted?

David

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Claudius Henrichs]

Am 25.01.2011 18:30, Wojciech Kulesza:
Was wondering if the planned changes to approach in mapping public 
transport would have an impact on this service:

http://78.46.81.38/public_transport.html

While it behaves quite nicely for the examples provided there, it 
works very bad for PT in Poland.


Compare this result: 
http://78.46.81.38/api/sketch-line?network=ZTM+Pozna%C5%84&ref=1 



with the appropariate relation in osm:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/79152
Just compare your relation with the working one :) 
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361959
On first sight i'm wondering why you are mixing "railway=halt" and 
"railway=tram_stop"? Isn't all of it a tram line? Additionally you are 
missing "from=" and "to=" in your relation.


Claudius

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Re: [Talk-transit] Public Transport Line Diagram

[Tiziano D'Angelo]

Maybe you have to put roles forward_stop and backward_stop to stops if it's
1 relation for 1 line. It seems most stops have no roles at all Anyway you
should also order the relations members by type ways - nodes for stops.
Or the problem might be the fact that some stops are railway = halt and some
other railway = tram_stop?
Anyway check a working example:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/365296 - Line SIR1 network APS
Mobilità
ciao
Tiziano

On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 18:30, Wojciech Kulesza  wrote:

> Hi guys,
> i'm trying to follow your discussion on PT proposals.
> Was unable to participate due to lack of time. Now sick in bed, I hope to
> be able to at least dig through the discussion archives so i can try and add
> my two cents worth later on.
>
> Was wondering if the planned changes to approach in mapping public
> transport would have an impact on this service:
> http://78.46.81.38/public_transport.html
>
> While it behaves quite nicely for the examples provided there, it works
> very bad for PT in Poland.
>
> Compare this result:
> http://78.46.81.38/api/sketch-line?network=ZTM+Pozna%C5%84&ref=1
>
> with the appropariate relation in osm:
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/79152
>
> Why is this so not working for Poznan ?
>
> Regards,
> Qlex
>
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