Re: Copying filters to another account & upgrading from v. 1.42

[A . Curtis Martin]

; attachments in the current user's attachment directory 
(useful if an account's home directory changed its place)
- - Attachments were not forwarded
- - List Index out of bounds error when combining unfinished split message
- - Help button in PGP window didn't work
- - Attachment size was calculated with 2 extra bytes...
- - Fix for late binding of attachments
- - Filters were not copied correctly
- - /Mailto parameter was not working without a user implicitly set
- - Buttons "Wait for completion" confirmation were messed up
- - Bugs with copying/opening URLs from HTML viewer
- - Dial-up Monitor should now work under Windows NT
- - New icons in dial-up monitor
- - Bug with displaying of messages with the first textual part having the "filename" 
parameter set...
- - Fixed memory leaks from around the program
- - VCF could not be viewed from messages
- - List Index out of bounds error when combining unfinished split message
- - %COOKIE="file" was not adding "Cookie"
- - Logger's window width was not restored
- - Filters applied to a message not from the source folders did not update the actual 
folder.
- - Account changing in the editor did not force address grid to redraw
- - Bugs with entering time intervals when the time divider is other than ":"
- - Bug with sudden stops at conversion of Pegasus (and other) mailboxes
- - Bug with hanging when a template contained a %LANGUAGE="" macro


Version 1.44

+ Possibility to append messages to UNIX-mailbox on export.
+ Quotation prefix length limit setting in message editor properties.
+ Advanced page in Sorting office with additional conditions for a filter.
+ Configurable Add/Delete address filter action.
+ It is now possible to associate a filter with a hotkey.
* Images referenced by "Content-Location" are now shown in HTML.
+ %QClipboard/%QuoteClipboard macro.
+ %OneLine/%SingleLine macro.
+ %QuoteStyle macro
* It is possible to use apostrophes and double quotes in macro parameters.
* Most of confirmation dialogue boxes now use OK/Cancel instead of old Yes/No. It was 
impossible to cancel such boxes by pressing Escape key.
+ "Save all attachments" command.
* Warning on opening attachments.
* All types of attachments can be deleted.
* Message|Attachment menu in message browser windows.
* File names of text attachments are shown in tabs.
* Actual file names are shown in braces in attachment list.
- - PGP key import didn't work - it was always grayed.
- - The program could hang while importing a message with a line starting with "begin 
etc.."

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Patience is a virtue, it's just not one of my better virtues "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/1 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgDbH/AXeSHuB5k3EQKd/wCglPz2Dvw/9hmK4w5kJ9709jlMAlIAoOAy
3Jml6gZdUJ0vI92AggfTpNHf
=kTzW
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Copying filters to another account & upgrading from v. 1.42

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 2 Nov 2000 00:22:41 -0600, Douglas Hinds wrote these
comments about 'Copying filters to another account & upgrading from v. 1.42':

DH> One down, one to go: What about copying filters to another account?
DH> Any way to do that? A default filter set?

No, no implementation of that to date. We had already mentioned copying
account.srx from one explorer account folder to another.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Even in this corner of the galaxy, Captain, 2+2=4 ... Spock "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/1 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgFSB/AXeSHuB5k3EQK69ACgns2rXmGZWmCFeYSQciS+8MT71sIAoMoS
cHl6oAnp+MAJtliFnWZi5+0n
=ANNG
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Filters

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 2 Nov 2000 11:10:02 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote these
comments about 'Filters':

NA> I think you can only choose one AB as your default for add/delete. It
NA> would be nice to have the option to check which AB's the address is added
NA> to. Perhaps we can put that on the wish list. :o)

There's a work around. You can create a filter to add the selected
message/s address/es to your address book. If you look at the action
section in the filter rule configuration dialog, you'll see that you can
specify which address book group to add the address to. Assign a hot key
for the filter and disable "check the selected message against this
rule".

At present, if I wish to add an address to the TB List AB group, I just
hit my hot key CTRL-ALT-Z. I have another address book group set as the
default.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "As a matter of fact, no, I don't have a life. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/1 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgIO//AXeSHuB5k3EQLt0wCfRVTU2Cl+xQHwRm3NzDcmzB+xj64AoNEC
+FpG7Ho59urD0MUiYFmzo5Q6
=oIHw
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Address book & reply queries

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 10:23:23 +, Andy wrote these
comments about 'Address book & reply queries':

A> 1.  I  did  a  search  using  my address book on an LDAP server, got a
A> couple  of  results,  but  now  all  the  entries in my personal local
A> address book have disappeared.

Unfortunately, those addresses are gone. Did you do a backup? The same
thing happened to me recently.

I assume you local address's are in a green coloured book. This is
because the address book has been associated with a LDAP server. When
you do an LDAP server search, the matches are entered in the LDAP server
associated book and the previous addresses deleted. Create address books
for your personal addresses and for each address book, go into the
properties and under the LDAP tab, disable the option 'This address book
is associated with a LDAP server.'

A> 2. I know I can use F4 to quote selected text in a reply, but how do
A> I do this if I want to "reply all" as opposed to just reply?

It's a pity the  operator, while hitting the reply toolbar
button, doesn't work with reply-to-all.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "He who laughs last probably made a backup. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/2 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgP1QfAXeSHuB5k3EQLYjgCfUVSTqe6CCUnC+b8FcYvn5/rnY/AAoKlN
XBt778wETt4rPgLieeoRQrG/
=c2fz
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Deletion options with IMAP4

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 4 Nov 2000 15:55:00 +0100, Johannes M. Posel wrote these
comments about 'Deletion options with IMAP4':

JMP> I would WHOLEHEARTLY welcome this one, especially for the cookies!
JMP> Please please please ;)

What about the cookies? I have a feeling you may already be able to do
what you're referring to.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "It's easier to obtain forgiveness than permission. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/2 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgRIQPAXeSHuB5k3EQKmywCffX7vaQiKOKmBJk9424eUG84lZewAoNNE
Qw5JFsAnyasybo5VivfDI3s8
=m3LC
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Found a kludge to selectively delete messages from IMAP server

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 01:10:43 -0500, Kiyan Azarbar thoughtfully wrote
the following:

[snip]
ML>> Check out a macro called %QUOTESTYLE in the help file.

KA> Ahah. Ok, I'll look it up. But isn't it weird that there should be
KA> no radio buttons for it? Or isn't it weird that quotestyle is not
KA> defined in the account templates explicitly, replaced instead by
KA> those radio buttons?

The %Quotestyle macro was added by the TB! developers just a few
versions ago. It was not long ago that we could only define quote
prefixing at only the account level.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "George Orwell was an optimist. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgU/sPAXeSHuB5k3EQJDdQCgoJOQv9leF/xSpRFZzdIFK8a/UZQAn08b
CdlmqhksSxs2xc8Bql11Gt6T
=IVS7
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Moving Folders2

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 12:23:38 +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote these
comments about 'Moving Folders2':

ztod> Well, maybe I really am just too stupid. Drag-and-Drop doesn't work at
ztod> all. When I hold the left mouse button down and try to drag a folder
ztod> to its new destination, the only that's moving is the selection
ztod> indicator.

Do you hold down the  key while doing the drag and drop operation?
It will not work unless you do so.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "NUMBER CRUNCHING: Jumping on a Computer. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVGxfAXeSHuB5k3EQIKBACfUlgGgoimPuwoCUAVmNOzJIwrN1UAoKYu
uuh+3PZ6Mdw8LpMYVnPbuNZO
=ajmH
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Access Violation when encrypting with S/MIME

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 05 November, 2000, 6:34 AM, I saw Gerd's comments made on
 Sun, 5 Nov 2000 11:19:11 +0100, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

GE>   whenever I encrypt a message I get the following error:
GE>   "Access violation at address 00507BD2. Read of address ."

I see that you're using a beta version of TB!. You really should post
this problem on the TBBETA list.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Reality is always more conservative than ideology. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVGEPAXeSHuB5k3EQJzswCeITAg7668WC41OFK4KnM0XMu4eCcAoNaz
Eze8hl554j2s2fHCbLapJO7b
=iBDn
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Filters only MOVE messages?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 05:41:52 -0500, canderson wrote these
words of wisdom:

c> Do filters only MOVE messages? I need them to also COPY. Can it?

Yes. The option to do this is listed under the 'action' tab of the
message filter rule configuration dialog.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "You have to be sharp to be on the cutting edge. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVFivAXeSHuB5k3EQL9LgCgzzHeKKriZWArOQZjQC7vg5HMdT8AoJqJ
/2jbKDu5Dg7/DiJHLbsymWHY
=6Pma
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Moving Folders2

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 12:48:44 +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] graced us with
these comments:

ztod> Yes, now it works. Thanks for the advice. I'm not that stupid
ztod> after all.. :-)

Getting worried were you? :-)

On another note, the list charter rules prohibits the use of excessive
quoting.

May I make a suggestion. In your reply template for this discussion
list, replace the %quotes macro with the following. Be sure that it's
all in a single line:

%quotes="%SETPATTREGEXP=""(?is)(^-BEGIN PGP 
SIGNED.*?\n(Hash:.*?\n)?\s*)?(.*?)(^(-*?\s*?--\s*\n|_{40,}\s*\n|-BEGIN PGP 
SIGNATURE)|\z)""%REGEXPBLINDMATCH=""%text""%SUBPATT=""3"""

Hit reply to my previous message and see what happens. My signature and
all the PGP related stuff should be automatically trimmed.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Brevity is the soul of lingerie. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVL7vAXeSHuB5k3EQLPIQCgoTg3JLyJ9pkCmeUcDDgWy+sstEEAn1LT
v+11ebpDT8Osus74Tq+Gjezt
=/YXl
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Turbosport/The Bat! 1.47 problem?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 01:05:49 -0500, Kiyan Azarbar graced us with
these comments:

KA> you're right, it isn't, but it just seemed unusual to me at the
KA> time... no other client that I know of makes use or keeps track of

this will be a common thought that goes through your mind
when using TB!. :-))
KA> that information, so it took getting used to.

KA> I suppose you're right. It would be useful to use "received" instead
KA> of created, in the case that the sender's computer time is totally
KA> screwed up.

This is more common than I thought. Sorting by received time eliminates
that problem (yes, I'm another of those who finds the received time
column useful). However, sorting by received time could screw up message
sorting if someone's message took a long time to reach your server. I've
noted this to be far less of a problem than screwed up message creation
time.

KA> But then again, what is the "created" time? Does that get put onto
KA> the message by the MUA (client) of the user, or does the MTA (smtp
KA> server of the ISP, or local smtp server which I assume is configured
KA> correctly w.r.t. time) do that?

Well, TB! places a creation time for its messages in the headers and
this is the *exact* time that I see appear when I receive replies to my
messages. The MUA being the one that inserts the created time would
explain the frequency of totally erroneous message times. :-/ I assume
that if the MUA doesn't include a creation time then the MTA does this.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "2400 Baud makes you want to get out and push!! "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVFCvAXeSHuB5k3EQI/zQCg5eE9ZygTyRJ0nHFAmMHB9rjYHngAoLQz
CFufp/Ayl6Bc2dAqHd3LsC8V
=WX5a
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Access Violation when encrypting with S/MIME

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 14:35:13 +0100, Gerd Ewald wrote these
comments about 'Access Violation when encrypting with S/MIME':

GE> I agree with you if it was a problem of the beta-version. I forgot
GE> to write that this error occured with Version 1.47 Halloween and
GE> 1.46. I only installed the beta because it has an improved S/MIME
GE> support. But this made no difference.

GE> Still a TBBETA-topic?

Now that you've clarified, no it's not. :-) But to prevent confusion you
must include that vital piece of information you left out which is that
the problem exists in the latest official release version or whatever
other versions you wish to include.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Predicting the future of technology is fraud with peril! "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgVrHfAXeSHuB5k3EQL1oQCeMtyBtJyA1ymRdl3rZXn6r/jtshwAn3sg
mdeDcL65KUDsO5Tg9HVc8Sc3
=V0Ap
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: ! will not work with Efax send

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, 5 Nov 2000 14:43:21 -0500, canderson wrote these
comments about '! will not work with Efax  send':

c> I am unable to get thebat! to work with Efax. When it is time to send
c> the fax, a dialog box from thebat! comes up asking which account I
c> should use and asks for the password. I give it the password but it
c> says the password is incorrect.

What password did you define? Your pop account password. If so, that is
not what is being asked for. You can secure each of your accounts in TB!
so that mail in the protected accounts cannot be seen unless the
password is known. If you have not secured any of your accounts, leave
the password field blank and move on.

To avoid that window popping up at all and you wish to send IMAP related
mail using one ISP, go into the account properties for that ISP account
and enable " This account is the default for mailto: URL's"

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "If you try to fail, and succeed, which have you done? "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgXJYvAXeSHuB5k3EQIUnwCfe43epNhmZD7d+/aCrn+c13l2pocAoM4l
GEadBhG3ehmK+SXfJscVm2s3
=kfsG
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Moving Folders2

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, 6 Nov 2000 23:48:00 +0100, Urban wrote these
words of wisdom:

>> Hit reply to my previous message and see what happens. My signature and
>> all the PGP related stuff should be automatically trimmed.

U> Can I do something similar for a print template?

Yes. Replace the %text macro in the print template with:

[one line]

%SETPATTREGEXP="(?is)\n*(^-BEGIN\sPGP\sSIGNED.*?\n(Hash:.*?\n)?\s*)?(.*?)(^(-*?\s*?--\s*\n|_{40,}\s*\n|-BEGIN\sPGP\sSIGNATURE)|\z)"%REGEXPBLINDMATCH="%text"%SUBPATT="3"

[one line]

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Best way to dispose of the Borg: Give them Windows 3.1. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/3 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgdU5vAXeSHuB5k3EQJqWgCg9x4ngLAVr6Oz9zAHXQ5cN9x6sIgAn15A
bQQy1bTf+ps2RAgudpH+O7v3
=fKNP
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Bug in PGP handling of The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 07 November, 2000, 7:14 AM, I saw Juergen's comments made on
 Tue, 7 Nov 2000 15:23:52 +0900, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

JS> I found a reproduceable bug in 1.47 Halloween Edition:

JS> If I get a PGP encrypted mail and decrypt it, TB creates a new
JS> decrypted copy of the message. But if I reply to THIS decrypted
JS> mail with an encrypted text (Menu: Encrypt Entire Text or
JS> Sign & Encrypt Entire Text) and try to send it, I get an error message:

JS> Access Violation at address 0050415E. Read of address 0008.

JS> This error is reproduceable all the time. The reply to the 'original'
JS> (encrypted) mail is never a problem.

JS> I work with Win2000SP1 and PGP 6.5.8.

JS> Can somebody confirm this?

I can't reproduce the problem here after doing what you describe, though
you should still report it.

Also, if you reply to the decrypted version of a message, it will be
automatically encrypted upon sending. TB! appends '(PGP Decrypted)' to
the subject of the decrypted version and this is how it knows to encrypt
the message automatically. You therefore shouldn't have to be encrypting
and signing manually in this situation. You'll actually be encrypting
twice.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Wait! Clinton's How to Serve Taxpayers -- it's a COOKBOOK! "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgfzBPAXeSHuB5k3EQKUpQCg+hJLvhsJXsGjKWphAC6L9ZIB6p8AnjjO
u6x8kgSs460ARY1comyvMXTh
=Vip7
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Trying to unsubscribe

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Tue, 7 Nov 2000 08:04:47 +, Jamie Dainton graced us with
these comments:

IG>> I've sent two messages to the unsubscribe address
IG>> [EMAIL PROTECTED], but without success. Could you remove
IG>> me from the list, please?

JD> Mark: Are you sure we're not allowed to flame these people? It's hard
JD> to resist. Must flame, must launch up USENET and IRC. Can not resist.

We usually handle this sort of thing off-list so as to avoid creating a
thread off the inappropriately posted message as is happening now.

JD> Why did you send it to the entire list. I hope one day you read
JD> the archives and see your mistake preserved to all eternity. 

This likely falls on deaf ears and had no effect whatsoever. :-) It's
far more practical and less time consuming to simply hit the delete key
and move on.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Beware of Geeks bearing gifs. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgf1PfAXeSHuB5k3EQKlxwCeOVzOzbdKmPcDULQ0seeF4t/SYmQAoOaP
VG/hQayc3dYqIkn1momZ/VMg
=wHUd
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Bug in PGP handling of The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 07 November, 2000, 8:24 AM, I saw Juergen's comments made on
 Tue, 7 Nov 2000 22:21:20 +0900, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

JS> This is interesting, I didn't thought about that. But I am so
JS> suspicious that I like to see it encrypted before I click the 'send'
JS> button...I don't want to send a businessplan unencrypted to a
JS> Hotmail account and give my good ideas Microsoft for free :)

JS> I would like to have a button 'encrypt and send' which shows first
JS> the encryption as optical feedback and then sends it.

JS> Anyway, thanks for the hints!

I know what you mean :-), but for what it's worth, I've been using this
auto-encryption feature for a long time and it works without fail.

However, and a big 'however' at at that  if you read encrypted mail
using PGP Tray's viewer, and then reply by copy and pasting the viewer
contents in the reply message, you'll definitely have to encrypt the
reply yourself. You may then prefer this method:

Place the cursor in the encrypted message body with PGP tray (and it's
hot-key feature) running.

Hit  and this will display the decrypted message in a
separate viewer. Copy the desired text from it to the clipboard and then
reply to the encrypted message pasting the copied text as a quote. You
can then manually encrypt the message, as you prefer, when finished.

Note that you can avoid quoting any encrypted text by hitting
 for the reply or holding down  while hitting
the reply toolbar button.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Apple (c) Copyright 1767, Sir Isaac Newton. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOggEhvAXeSHuB5k3EQLIywCgvzyGDDJ/XqnmSgFOOV9t6ZUmVbkAoMWE
RDkFdJBwY3CYVk/B0dnmzeZT
=m7Yb
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: filter - if read & color coded move

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Tue, 7 Nov 2000 09:11:20 -0500, Jan Rifkinson wrote these
comments about 'filter - if read & color coded move':

JR> In my group colors, I have one labeled "ToDo"

JR> I'd like to automatically move msgs read in any inbox folder that
JR> are marked with the ToDo color to a ToDo folder.

JR> Possible?

Hmmm. Actually it is. :-) You can create a filter who's search string is
'e' and location 'Kludges', meaning that it will match *any* message
based on a string search. The next thing to do is go to the advanced tab
in the filter rule configuration and enable 'Message is associated with
a colour group' and select the 'ToDo' colour group from the drop down
list. That should restrict the filtering to only messages associated with
the colour group.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Don't thank me for insulting you. It was my pleasure... "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOggUbfAXeSHuB5k3EQJslQCg+mxsbhLNyufDBbzwvYhF0ee9uPkAoKzJ
6hWLRv0zst1UCxEZl9aBoo0k
=nBYH
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: filter - if read & color coded move

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 08:00:43 -0500, Jan Rifkinson graced us with
these comments:

JR> Let's focus on folder structure & filter placement for a moment as
JR> it applies to this filter.

Are you moving messages with the 'ToDo' colour code from only the Inbox?

JR> Under the Inbox the folder structure includes 12 other folders.

OK. Do you wish to move messages with the 'ToDo' colour code from these
other folders as well?

JR> I have set the above described filter & placed it @ the bottom of
JR> the list of "read" filters. The 3 filters that precede it all have
JR> the option "continue processing with other filters" selected.

OK, but note that if any of the three preceding filters moves messages
to another folder, none of the messages that are moved will get a chance
to be filtered by your newly created filter. A filter rule will hand a
message off to be processed by other filters, if and only if its
filtering action doesn't involve moving the matching messages to another
folder.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Impropriety is the soul of wit. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOglXYfAXeSHuB5k3EQKw+QCffPECxJIAl5UNcBlmhgpKDcg9dRkAoNHA
XW06GgW45lAg7fEevhJhx59C
=fvDW
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: setting TB! to text view

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:36:36 -0800, Ming-Li wrote these
words of wisdom:

[...]
ML> Looks like we have different ideas in mind. I was merely suggesting
ML> TB to recognize the right signature line in a PGP-signed message and
ML> strip the extra PGP kludges automatically as many do now with those
ML> spectacular macros (thanks to you and other RE experts on the list)
ML> WHEN creating a reply. Nothing in the message base need to be
ML> changed.

ML> That being said, I don't mind when it's going to happen.

PMMail2000 Pro does something very similar to what you propose. Whe you
open a PGP signed message, none of the signature related stuff is
displayed in the message viewer. However, in the status bar is a
statement that the message is PGP signed and whether or not the
signature is valid. It's therefore nice and unobtrusive, and secondly,
the signatures are checked automatically. I long for some means to
automatically check PGP signatures without a separate popup window
having to be dealt with for each check.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Silence is more eloquent at times than words. "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgsJi/AXeSHuB5k3EQJ++wCfcFl97l0AxUsaA9chpYot6AGgIyYAoMSI
BITAqmPgA3q5HB1C+8p+Oeos
=MchH
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: filter - if read & color coded move

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 10:59:26 -0500, Jan Rifkinson wrote these
words of wisdom:

A. Curtis>> OK, but note that if any of the three preceding filters
A. Curtis>> moves messages to another folder, none of the messages that
A. Curtis>> are moved will get a chance to be filtered by your newly
A. Curtis>> created filter.

JR> OK, I removed the "continue processing with other filters" option
JR> now & put it @ top of the list.

OK. The placing of the filter at the beginning of the list is fine.

If you're using this single filter you'll have to run it manually for
each folder. If you wish the filtering to be done automatically in all
intended folders, you need to create a filter for each folder you wish
this filter type to work on, setting the source folder for each filter
accordingly. It's really not that bad  just copy the filter for each
folder by hitting the copy button and then go through, changing the
source folder for each. It may take a little effort to setup but it sure
beats having to manually run the filter repeatedly on each of the source
folders.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "2 + 2 = 4 (for the time being). "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgsLWfAXeSHuB5k3EQK0igCeNmJHq5X5FaYomeBrFhjp3evbffEAoMao
3q+hD2uskuXGxGg8IsIFQGlm
=XPUH
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: filter - if read & color coded move

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 16:41:17 -0500, Jan Rifkinson thoughtfully wrote
the following:

JR> In fact this process was *very* easy & seems to be working. Thanks
JR> for seeing this thru with me.

My pleasure as always Jan. :-)

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Honeymoon: time between I do and you'd better "
_
TB! v1.47 Halloween Edition (S/N CCA4F9B8)
Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgsmw/AXeSHuB5k3EQITlwCgsyRM4M1Am9+SilXK+v4RMzJh8kcAoL66
xvLmmulZn/0RaD7AFZF2sG6n
=kvkL
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Editor: How to delete selected areas of text ?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 13:45:59 +0100, Nils Willuweit wrote these
comments about 'Editor: How to delete selected areas of text ?':

NW>  I'm afraid this might be a stupid question:
NW>  When I select words with my mouse and press the backspace-button -
NW>  nothing happens... but I wanted those selected words to be deleted !!
NW>  Why does TB behave differently to other editors ? Is there any way to
NW>  switch this to 'normal' ?

In your editor preferences, 'Overwrite blocks' should be enabled while
'Persistent blocks' should be disabled.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Solution: A more subtle problem. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/4 (S/N CCA4F9B8)
Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgvzIvAXeSHuB5k3EQLLpwCdE8C/xJ9Ey7pxQ+v8zU7uYZCwhSkAn0a0
zMm6uAGSmWneIcvE5a+xmB+s
=oQ/g
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Trying to make a "anti-spam filter" in The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

When I saw Christian's message about "Trying to make an "anti-spam
filter" in The Bat! ", I just had to make these comments:

CD> I have been playing around with the possibility to make a filter in
CD> The Bat! that actually gets rid of most spam.

CD> My approach has been to make a filter that moves all mail that isn't
CD> specifically addressed to me to a "Suspected Spam" folder.

Yes, this is my approach as well. I also create filters (placed before
this BCC messages filter) that will catch legitimate mail that is BCC'd
rather than addressed directly to me. Most discussion list messages,
newsletters and such are not addressed directly to me.

CD> The problem is however that BCC'ed mail ends in this spam folder
CD> since I wouldn't be in the recipients list.

You need to systematically create filters for legitimate mail that is
BCC'd to you. It will never be thorough so you need to have the spam
folder. After a while it will become very thorough indeed. :-)

CD> I also make exceptions for mailing lists I am signed up for, and
CD> finally add some expressions to filter on like "ADV" "AD" "$$$" etc.

I haven't even found it necessary to create a filter on key words as you
gave above.

CD> I have also looked at anti spam software, but most of it require
CD> that the software check mail on the server before The Bat! can
CD> import the mail which complicates matters too much

Exactly. I'd need a cable modem or DSL to use a system like that. :-/

CD> I am quite sure now this BCC problem will be a trade-off when
CD> implementing aggressive filtering like this, but I would like to ask
CD> anyway if someone successfully has created effective anti spam
CD> filtering in The Bat!?

With your system well setup as I have done, 99% of spam will reach the
spam folder and it will be very unusual for legitimate mail to reach it.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/4 (S/N CCA4F9B8)
Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgw3P/AXeSHuB5k3EQLwCQCdHQnigcLV423J1hpP9q52OH6Ov4MAoKAe
FbPfofyQeF3hLRhPL+kHF5hI
=OmO3
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: threaded view?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 10 November, 2000, 1:38 PM, I saw Kiyan's comments made on
 Fri, 10 Nov 2000 13:30:51 -0500, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

KA> Sorry to clog up the list again, but I can't find anything in the
KA> Help or in the FAQ on a threaded list view. Most mail clients allow
KA> you to thread things, which is especially good for mailing list
KA> folders... but I haven't unlocked how to do this in TB yet. I hope
KA> it's possible (or maybe it's another feature for v2?)

KA> I don't need full instructions, but just a quick pointer to the
KA> right location to learn about it.

It helps a lot if you explore the menus of TB!.

Anyway, go to View -> View Threads by -> and select what you'd like to
use for threading, i.e., reference headers, subject.

Be sure also to look at our FAQ's page for other info which may be
useful. http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/FAQ.html

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Simon says: don't be so suggestible. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/4 (S/N CCA4F9B8)
Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOgxBLfAXeSHuB5k3EQIYGQCg+tqNLI376jDMxtJANZv1YOcqgvAAoLPI
ofASw6Tchsy4kysVUCzJscnV
=eIy4
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Trying to make a "anti-spam filter" in The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 06:45:40 -0800, Ming-Li graced us with
these comments:

[..]
ML> Spammers change email addresses frequently, so it's up to you to
ML> decide whether it's worth the effort and adjust your strategy
ML> accordingly. Personally, I don't use any spam filter, for I've got
ML> very few so far. :)

I never filter spammer messages directly. At the moment I have 16
messages in my spam folder which will hold messages no longer than 3
days! As you can see, I really have a spam problem. :-) None of the 16
messages are legitimate and I rarely receive spam directly addressed to
me though its beginning to happen more often. I can't help but delete
those, though I'll attempt to do a traceroute on the source and if
successful send a complaint to the relevant ISP.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Procrastination: The art of keeping up with yesterday. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/4 (S/N CCA4F9B8)
Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOg1yzfAXeSHuB5k3EQL0TACeOOqluEijlsyzaKKArbDK7Vm9TrsAnjVE
wxrmT20PhnndR43q/Pz0+GxH
=CL/c
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Trying to make a "anti-spam filter" in The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 20:08:19 -0800, Ming-Li thoughtfully wrote
the following:

ML> If TB provides a "bozo bin" as Gravity or XNews do, or at allow AB
ML> entries or filter items to expire after certain days as Agent does,
ML> filtering spammers directly would be much easier and more practical.

The bozo bin principle will work with newsreading because 'bozos' are
posters, whose messages you wish not to read. They aren't spammers so
they use a fixed address . although mind you there are some
professional bozos who tend to change their addresses.

ML> That's bound to be more often. They haven't done it often because
ML> they are sending identical messages to a bunch of addresses. Since
ML> they don't want you to know who else are among the recipients, they
ML> resort to the BCC trick. With Word (or other word processors), MAPI,
ML> and mail-merge, sophisticated spammers have begun to use
ML> personalized spam. Since you're the only recipient of a particular
ML> message, they don't shy from putting your name in the To field.
ML> That's why I miss the bozo bin so much.

Don't these spammers change their addresses and sources for each spam
message that they send?

>> though I'll attempt to do a traceroute on the source and if
>> successful send a complaint to the relevant ISP.

ML> That's nice, but time is a scarce resource. :(

It's really not that bad when I use Neotrace and TB!'s templates. I
created a complaint template. I then look in the Kludges and run a trace
on the DNS address from which the message originated. 50% of the times
I'll find the ISP. I then copy the ISP info from Neotrace, include it in
the spam complaint and send the message to them. This all takes about
10-15secs per message. I do other things while Neotrace does its thing
so I don't count the traceroute time.

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Re: envelope-to header

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:36:51 +, Marck D. Pearlstone graced us with
these comments:

[..]
MDP> Not sure what you mean by this. The SMTP RCPT TO is taken from the
MDP> "To:" address line. The SMTP FROM envelope is taken from the
MDP> "From:" address. What is an "envelope-to" header? Is it a special
MDP> x-header? can you use X-Ray to add it in (I forget the URL but it's
MDP> in the archive somewhere)?

The link to X-Ray is <http://xraysoft.cjb.net/>

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Re: Trying to make a "anti-spam filter" in The Bat!

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 12 November, 2000, 10:24 AM, I saw Ming-Li's comments made on
 Sun, 12 Nov 2000 06:57:33 -0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

ML> I want a bozo bin exactly because spammers (email or newsgrouop ones
ML> alike) change their addresses often, for a well-implemented bozo bin
ML> lets you decide when a blocked/killed address should expire. [..]

Aaahh! That, I didn't know. :-)

ML> They do, but they may not be changing that often. That's why an
ML> expiration period is important.

True.

ML> All I have to do is just forward the spam message to our Anti-Spam
ML> Team, and they'll do the tracing and filing complaints. If
ML> complaints don't work, they can block it. Nice, isn't it? :)

Yeah. I wish I had such a team to forward my tons of spam to. It would
appear that my ISP doesn't implement any antispam measures. I really get
a lot. Up to 6 spam messages per day.

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Re: Help! My icons disappeared.

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:08:49 -0500, Jan Rifkinson graced us with
these comments:

JR>  Where did my icons go?

Have you restarted TB!?

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Re: Filtering query

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 14 November, 2000, 9:06 AM, I saw Kevin's comments made on
 Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:01:33 GMT, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

KT> Thanks for the help and to Marck, problem solved.

Just to add to that. If you have a sender who uses the same name but
multiple addresses, you can filter using the sender name *without the
quotes*.

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Re: Filtering query

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:33:00 GMT, Kevin Tea wrote these
words of wisdom:

KT> Just as a follow on, is it better to use sender/recipient locations or
KT> kludges?

You should always be as precise as possible with your filter string
location. This will avoid the filter matching messages you don't want it
to. It's possible to be precise when using the Kludges but this will not
be the case when using just the e-mail address as the filter string to
search for.

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Re: Filtering query

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 14 November, 2000, 10:47 AM, I saw Jan's comments made on
 Tue, 14 Nov 2000 10:01:22 -0500, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

A. Curtis>> [...]  It's possible to be precise when using the
A. Curtis>> Kludges  but this will not be the case when using
A. Curtis>> just  the  e-mail address as the filter string to
A. Curtis>> search for. [...]

JR>   This  begs  the question: what are the appropriate
JR>   use of kludges as a filtering agent? TIA

For filter string searches where you wish to be broad in your search or
in searches where the string location cannot be more specifically
defined such as the string "Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]" which I
use to filter TBUDL mail. This is one example of doing a Kludges
string match that is very precise. It's more precise that using :

String: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Location: Recipient

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Re: Sorting by Subject AND Date

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 14 November, 2000, 6:22 PM, I saw Rev.'s comments made on
 Tue, 14 Nov 2000 14:43:20 -0600, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

RBBC>>> Threading seems to work fine, except that threads are shown
RBBC>>> unexpanded and when you delete a message, instead of going to
RBBC>>> the next message in the thread, it goes to the top message of
RBBC>>> the next thread, so I gave up on threading.

Really? I have threading by references enabled here and I sort by
received time in *descending* order. When I delete a message in a thread
I'm moved to the next message. This is with the Halloween Edition
version that you're using. The messages are always in the right order
as I read from one message to the next unread message in the thread.

>> Try View/Display/All Messages, together with View/Sort by/Received Time
>> and View threads by/Subject. That should sort the messages correctly for
>> you, and when you delete a message, it will jump to the next message in
>> the thread.

RBBC> Nope.  In fact, when I did that, I see my question as a child of your
RBBC> answer.

You have to select sort by -> received time  *and* sort by -> descending
order.

RBBC>   Messages in other threads on this list are also out of order.
RBBC> Ditto when I set the sort to sent time (which I believe might be
RBBC> likelier to give the desired result).

Sent time depends on a valid system clock time on the part of the sender
which is too often incorrect. The received time poses less of a problem
so I use it instead. In fact I have no problem with it at all.

RBBC> And when you click on the trashcan icon on a message in a thread,
RBBC> even an expanded thread, the thread collapses and the focus goes
RBBC> to the next thread.

Not my experience here at all. Hmmm.

RBBC> Now, I don't know about you, but when I've finished reading a message
RBBC> in a thread and delete it, the next thing I want to read is the next
RBBC> message in the same thread.

Yes and here, I'm moved to the next message in the thread. If I'm at the
end of a thread, I'm moved to the first message in the next thread. What
hasn't been fixed is the delete entire thread behaviour. We're still
being taken to the beginning of the message list instead of being moved
to the next thread after the deleted one.

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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 15 November, 2000, 5:24 PM, I saw Susanne's comments made on
 Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:00:05 -0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

S> Just a question about the time showing up in the message list as the
S> received time. I was used to and prefer it to be the time it was
S> received on the server, but with The Bat it seems to be the time I
S> download the mail.

S> Is there a way to change this?

I'm afraid not.

Personally, I prefer the received time as TB! defines it. After-all, it
doesn't really matter to me when the server received the message because
I haven't personally received it until I have downloaded it. Knowing
when the mail hit my inbox is therefore more useful. I can tell others
when I downloaded their messages.

As I said .. just my $.02. :-)

S> I tried sorting it by the time created instead, but that doesn't
S> work well for me either,

It tends to be problematic because some senders do not have their PC
Clock times set correctly.

S> since I receive mail from different time zones and everything gets
S> mixed up that way.

The time zones shouldn't affect the sorting because the client
compensates for this by taking the time zones into consideration when
sorting. TB! actually reflects this in the creation times it places in
the message list and the %ODATE, %OTIME macros, by converting each
senders message creation time to your time zone.

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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:49:53 -0800, David Tod Sigafoos wrote these
comments about 'Received time':

ACM>> Personally, I prefer the received time as TB! defines it. After-all, it
ACM>> doesn't really matter to me when the server received the message because
ACM>> I haven't personally received it until I have downloaded it. Knowing
ACM>> when the mail hit my inbox is therefore more useful. I can tell others
ACM>> when I downloaded their messages.

DTS> Please sir ..
^^^
Curtis or Allie will do much better, thanks. :=)

DTS> since it is part of the rfc header wouldn't it be possible to expose
DTS> this information and allow the users to determine which time to use.

The received time for TB! is not a part of the RFC Headers. TB!'s
received time is the time each message reaches your inbox.

DTS> For example I receive many many mails during the night and so have
DTS> many many mails with 1 receive time in the morning.  it is not
DTS> possible to read them in any order as they all have the same receive
DTS> time.

Even though they have the same received time or almost the same, :=),
they're sorted in the correct order. The received time is to the nearest
minute and not the nearest second. :=) It works much better for me when
I sort by received time rather than creation times.

What you could do is sort by received time but display the message
creation time.

DTS> if i were allowed to see them according to the time my server
DTS> received then then I could follow the thread of thought.

There's no facility for doing so at present. A regex macro to extract
the time your server received the message could be written but it cannot
be used to manipulate what the columns show.

DTS> sorry to interrupt

You didn't, so there's nothing to be sorry about. :=)

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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:11:58 +, Manfred Ell wrote these
words of wisdom:

[..]
ME> This is exactly the reason why I use the Creation-Time on the TB
ME> lists!! The Received time doesn't work (for me) well enough here.

Why not sort by received time but use the creation time column? You
don't have to have the received column enabled to sort by received time.

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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:24:14 -0800, Susanne contributed this to the
collective wisdom of the human race:

>> The time zones shouldn't affect the sorting because the client
>> compensates for this by taking the time zones into consideration when
>> sorting. TB! actually reflects this in the creation times it places
>> in the message list and the %ODATE, %OTIME macros, by converting each
>> senders message creation time to your time zone.

S> This doesn't seem to work for messages from Germany. I get a lot of
S> them, mixed in with mail from the US and several other countries and
S> the german ones are always out of order. Or does this have to do with
S> the mail program the other person uses?

Yes, it very well could have something to do with it. If the time zone
on the senders computer is wrong the message times will be wrong and not
sort accurately with other messages especially if they're involved in a
thread. If the senders PC clock is not properly set and off by even an
hour, it could mess up the message sorting for an e-mail based
conversation. TB!'s received time deals with this problem nicely.

What you can do is sort by received time but display the 'created'
message list column. You should see the German messages fall into order.
You're really in a difficult bind if there's an inordinate delay in the
time the message takes to reach your local server from the sender as
well as the senders PC Clock being incorrectly set.

Why not post a sample RFC header for one of the German messages. We
could examine it and tell if there's an inordinate delay with respect to
its reaching your local mail server.

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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 15 November, 2000, 8:51 PM, I saw Susanne's comments made on
 Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:43:14 -0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

>> Why not post a sample RFC header for one of the German messages. We
>> could examine it and tell if there's an inordinate delay with respect to
>> its reaching your local mail server.

S> If you explain to me what an RFC header is and how to make it show
S> up, I'd be happy to post it . Though it will probably be tomorrow,
S> since I'm starting work in an hour.

Hit  and you'll see a lot of message information appear
at the beginning of the message. Copy that and send it.

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Re: Archiving Question

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 16 November, 2000, 6:50 AM, I saw Manfred's comments made on
 Thu, 16 Nov 2000 09:39:56 +, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

>> Here's what I do, I have two list folders, TBUDL and TBUDLArchive.  I
>> have one incoming filter to put everything into the TBUDL folder.  I
>> then use read filters to move the messages into the Archive folder.

ME> This works great if I read the messages and they are marked read
ME> automatically, but if I mark the messages read manually the filter
ME> doesn't work and the messages don't move to the destination folder.

ME> Bug or feature? And how can I get it working?

I don't know what to say for sure. I guess it's more a bug than not.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Get the facts first - you can distort them later! "
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Re: How to reply with an email

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 10:57:50 -0800, syv graced us with
these comments:

s>   How can I reply with a preset email message, like a
s>   stationary in Eudora?

Oh definitely. TB! is where it's at for that sort of thing. :=)

I invite you to read a document on this very topic in the TB! FAQ pages.
  http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/templates.html


- --
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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:01:10 -0800, Susanne thoughtfully wrote
the following:

S> Of course, now I can't find any of the German messages that did
S> this. All of the current ones behave normally.
S> Here is one of several US mails that claim to have been received
S> the day before they were created, though.
S> Maybe you can explain what is going on with those?
[ headers snipped ]

Well there are two important header lines there:

a) Received: from ei.egroups.com (ei.egroups.com [208.50.99.235])
by eagle.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3-EL_1_3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA20192
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:26:04 -0800 (PST)
 ^
 This is the time your local server
 received the message.

b) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:29:19 -0800
   ^
   This is the message creation time as usually defined by the senders
   e-mail client.

The message took 3 minutes and 15 seconds to reach you which is very
reasonable.

However, the senders creation time is one day ahead of the servers
receive time. Somebodies time is erroneous and guess which one I think
it is  the senders of course. :=) You need to ask the sender of this
message to check and adjust their PC Clocks date. The time is most
likely OK.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
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"On a scale of 1 to 10, 4 is about 7. "
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 21:14:20 +, Doug Weller wrote these
comments about 'Editing received messages':

DW> Thanks, but right now I can click on Edit Message in Calypso, edit the
DW> message/subject line, and then click on the disc
DW> icon to save it (having clicked on remove rich text (HTML) if it wasn't
DW> plain text).

DW> That's a lot easier!

You only need to do that export - edit - import routine if you wish to
preserve the message headers. If not, you can drag and drop the messaage
to the outbox, open the message from there, edit it and then replace it
in the folder you dragged it from.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Flying saucers are real, the Air Force doesn't exist. "
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Re: Constant Re-Downloading of old messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 16 November, 2000, 4:51 PM, I saw Tony's comments made on
 Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:54:57  -0600, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

TATM> I have a copy of The Bat 1.47 which has the same sickness that every
TATM> version of the Bat I've ever used has had.

TATM> If I leave copies of my mail on the server at work, a Qmail / Linux
TATM> machine, The Bat re-downloads the old messagessometimes every week
TATM> or so, sometimes, as today, every five minutes.

TATM> This is gradually driving me crazy. I need to leave the messages on
TATM> the server; how do I stop The Bat from pulling them over again?

The Bat! will leave messages on the server and not re-download
previously downloaded messages depending on the mail server software. I
have no problem whatsoever with TB! re-downloading messages, even though
I leave all my messages on the server. The problem seems to lie with the
mail server.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Do not fear death so much but rather the inadequate life. "
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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 16:47:19 -0500, A . Curtis Martin contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:

ACM> The message took 3 minutes and 15 seconds to reach you which is very
ACM> reasonable.

This is wrong ... sorry. :=)

Your local mail servers received time is:
Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:26:04 -0800 (PST)
While the senders creation time is:
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:29:19 -0800
The times are completely out of whack, because the creation time is
ahead of your local mail server received time in all respects, ie.,
both date and time. He needs to set both his PC Clock date and time.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now. "
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Re: Received time

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:01:28 -0800, Susanne wrote these
comments about 'Received time':

S> Thanks for checking this out for me.

No problem. :=)

S> I have a few more messages like this, but I assume it's probably
S> the other person's computer settings causing the problem there,
S> also.

It very likely is. The header structure is pretty much the same in all
the messages and you could check for yourself to make sure. You should
try it. It's not as bad as it seems. 

S> I'll just go with sorting by time received and display the created
S> column.

This works neatly.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Matrimony isn't a word, it's a sentence. "
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 23:27:15 +, Marck D. Pearlstone contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:

[...]
ME>> There are no 2 equal users. One wants one feature, which the other
ME>> hates. This is called: democracy

MDP> Of  course. And I have exerted my democratic right to state an opinion
MDP> on the subject :-).

It's difficult to mix what is your opinion with a 'moderatorial'
reprimand or warning. The whole message tends to be taken as being
'moderatorial' in nature. :=)

[..]
MDP> BTW:  I  still  believe  that  am correct about it being intrinsically
MDP> "wrong"  to edit received messages for filing. I also accept that I am
MDP> probably in the minority in holding that position :-).


I have a folder called 'List Gems'. If I see a very informative message
posted, I copy it to my 'List Gems' folder. If the subject is totally
off-base with the content, I used to give it a nudge in the right
direction by modifying it. It makes it easier for me to tell what each
message gem is about. :=)

The same goes for my shareware registrations. I register a LOT of
software, being a software freak and all. :=))) I used to change the
subjects to help me know which registration info is for which software.
  :=)

After all that's said, I have recently stopped doing all that since the
introduction of memo's. I do agree with Marck's concern and memo's have
provided a nice, perhaps superior means of describing what the message
is about without interfering with it's content.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Patience is a virtue, it's just not one of my better virtues "
_
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 16 November, 2000, 7:43 PM, I saw Marck's comments made on
 Fri, 17 Nov 2000 00:34:19 +, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

MDP> To be fair, I don't mind it that much. I prefer the "drag it to the
MDP> outbox, edit and replace it" method of changing a message because
MDP> at least it also changes the "received" time of the message from
MDP> that of the original. This method disconnects the new version of
MDP> the message from any pretence of being a true record of the
MDP> original.

I do prefer dragging the message to the outbox and modifying it there.
It messes up the headers and more or less totally invalidates the
message as you said. :=)

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Reality is an obstacle to hallucination. "
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 19:22:39 -0500, Mike Yetto graced us with
these comments:

MY> I completely agree that editing received messages leaves them tainted
MY> and untrustworthy.  I would like to request that this never be done to
MY> TB.

I tend to agree here. There are two ways of modifying received messages
using TB! as it is. They're a tad more tedious than what Becky and
Calypso provide, but this should be the case since making it easy for
the passing user encourages the practice rather than discourage it.

Incoming messages shouldn't be modified ..but .. if you must do it, it
can be done. :=)

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Have it OUR way. Yours is IRRELEVANT. At BORGerKing. "
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Re: Selected quote with Reply to All

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 16:34:50 -0800, Clif Oliver graced us with
these comments:

CO> Since having spotted the message on this list about being able to
CO> select a block of text when reading a message, pressing F4, and
CO> replying with just the selected text quoted, that has become one of my
CO> favorite shortcuts.

CO> I have been looking for the equivalent function for Reply To All.  But
CO> I haven't been able to find one.

CO> Anyone know if this is possible?

No, it's presently not possible.

Another way to reply to only quoted material is to hold down the shift
key while pressing the reply button.

I do ardently hope that the developers will make this  operator
work with the reply-to-all button as well.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"A single fact can spoil a good argument. "
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 10:06:54 +, Manfred Ell thoughtfully wrote
the following:

ME> The only problem I see here is for a memo to get automatically displayed if
ME> there is a memo for a message and to hide itself if there isn't.

You know that there is a column provided for displaying memos using the
message listing, right?

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Solution: A more subtle problem. "
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Re: Selected quote with Reply to All

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 10:32:52 +, Manfred Ell graced us with
these comments:

ME> Now this one was new for me. What a jewel. Why didn't they put it in
ME> a menu?

It's in the menu's. For the main TB! window, it's in the specials
sub-menu of the the 'message' menu. If the folder view window, it's in
the 'specials' menu.

ME> Why not the default action for the reply button? So easily missed!

The Bat! originally didn't support quoting selected text and I can
vividly remember the debating on this list in support of and against its
implementation. I'm almost sure the vigourous debating was the reason
behind its not being implemented as a default action. Those who don't
want it will not be hindered by it, and those who need it can easily use
it.

They forgot to include the reply-to-all command in the implementation.
:=(

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Never say, Oops!; always say, Ah, interesting! "
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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When I saw Manfred's message about "Editing received messages ",
I just had to make these comments:

>> You know that there is a column provided for displaying memos using the
>> message listing, right?

ME> I now, yes, but with all those columns and a laptop display of 800x600..

ME> You understand...

Perfectly. :=) I work with a 1600x1200 resolution and still complain.

- --
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Re: Selected quote with Reply to All

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 14:56:05 +, Manfred Ell contributed this to the
collective wisdom of the human race:

ME> I've said it before and I say it again. TheBat is IMHO the best and
ME> most powerful email client out there. (It lacks some common features
ME> like HTML, no flames please).

TB!'s editor doesn't support composing HTML mail (I personally don't see
why it couldn't or shouldn't). Otherwise, TB! does have HTML support. It
has its own internal viewer. :=) The internal viewer will not retrieve
images or other web-page components which are embedded in documents as
links. This is a favourable setup for security reasons. Security that
isn't appreciated until one gets bitten, I hasten to add. :=)

Some may also complain that TB!'s internal viewer will not display
certain HTML documents as they should. Well, although the W3C (World
Wide Web Consortium) exists to try to maintain standards in the various
markup languages, deviations from what is standard still very much
exist, and many pages continue to display differently even between the
major browsers. If the HTML document doesn't display correctly with
TB!'s internal viewer, then double click the HTML attachment and it
will be displayed in your favourite browser.

I know it's inconvenient for some, but the security benefits behind such
an implementation isn't really appreciated until one is bitten before
using TB!, or when one is not bitten using TB! while everyone else
around them is being bitten when using Outlook( Express)?.

I guess it's all up for debate and God knows, this topic has had its
fair share of debating. Everyone knows the 'benefits' of HTML support as
you see it. My aim here is to simply summarize, for the newcomers around
here, how those of us who prefer TB!'s type of support feel. :=)

One cannot really expect TB! to be the end all and be all of solutions
for every user but I do hope that they continue to uphold a model of
secure e-mail management that is rapidly becoming unpopular, it would
seem. :=/

None of what I said so far is officially from Ritlabs or its developers,
so we don't know how development will proceed in this regard. It will
certainly depend on the target customer base and what they want.

ME> But to learn it with the info provided is quite impossible. This
ME> group is great but one cannot expect the "normal" (business)user to
ME> join this group to get the program working the way he likes it (or
ME> better is used to from the client he's coming from). The help files
ME> are outdated and a lot of stuff is missing.

I agree here.

ME> Cannot somebody take the online information, convert it to a online
ME> HTML-help file or PDF document, let them put an option in the help menu
ME> for this and include the lot in the distribution file. Shouldn't be
ME> difficult and would help a lot.

Do you know how to do this? I do prefer the new HTML based Windows help
system myself. I think it would take quite a bit of time and effort to do
this conversion. Then the burning question arises. Why convert it when
it lacks so much information? I certainly wouldn't want to merely
convert it. I would wish to add to it which is what we do through the
FAQ pages completely written and maintained by users as yourself.

ME> What do you think? Marck, Curtis, Stefan

:=) I see that you put Marck and I in the same line as Stefan. Marck and
I are TB! users just like you. We bought our licenses just as you did.
TBUDL and TBBETA were started by a TB! user just as yourself. We have no
special influence, as far as I can see, over what Ritlabs does with
respect to TB!.

On-line documentation lies smuggly in the hands of Ritlabs as it should.
I hope that they're reading you on this issue because it's a personal
pet peeve of mine. :=)

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Re: Extracting all addresses from a folder?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 09:23:48 -0800, Bubba wrote these
comments about 'Extracting all addresses from a folder?':

B> Is it possible to extract all of the email addresses from a folder
B> either to the Address Book or to an external file? If so, will this
B> procedure also eliminate all duplicate addresses?

Unfortunately AFAIK, no. :=( This lacking feature has been brought up on
a few occasions and even just the other day I needed it. I had to
painstakingly add the !!26!! addresses that were in the CC: header text.

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Re: Extracting all addresses from a folder?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 18:42:14 +0100, Roel wrote these
words of wisdom:

My answer was off-base big time. What computed was collecting multiple
addresses within a single message, such as a long CC: List.

B>> Is it possible to extract all of the email addresses from a folder
 ^
 Ooops, I wasn't
 reading, but
 scanning.
 Sorry. :=)
B>> either to the Address Book or to an external file?

R> Select all the messages in the folder, right-click => specials => add
R> sender/recipient to address book
 [..]

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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 17 November, 2000, 1:09 PM, I saw Ming-Li's comments made on
Fri, 17 Nov 2000 09:45:15 -0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

OK, Ming; I'll take your 'preambulatory' cue, :=), and start by saying
that I was thinking of declaring this thread a dead horse, but the
maturity of the discourse has been so good that I've not only changed
my mind, but have also decided to respond to some of what you wrote.

ML> I believe you're going a little too far here by accusing Doug coming
ML> on board solely (or mostly) on the purpose of promoting a competing
ML> product. I didn't feel that way, and I still don't after reading it
ML> a couple more times. Thomas said:

This is why he added his disclaimer statement at the end which I thought
would have diffused the situation. :=)

ML> Risking over-generalization, I feel you've been a little testy
ML> recently whenever someone mentions a competing product, especially
ML> when he/she posts with that product, and asks about features TB
ML> lacks.

H. This is perhaps unreasonable. The last incident of a similar
reprimand was when when someone asked if TB! supported a particular
feature. Someone else, posting with another client, and who in the past
stated his preference for this other client, not only misinformed the
user that TB! did not support said feature, but went on to encourage the
enquiring user where he could get his preferred client.

Marck stepped in and I agreed on that account.

The incident before that involved both Marck and myself *supporting* a
particular posters comments in favour of an alternative client after he
was admonished for doing so by another member.:=)

So, yes, I find your assessment to be an over-generalization. :=)

ML> Some of you suggest while it can be done, it should be discouraged.
ML> E.g., Allie said:

ACM>> There are two ways of modifying received messages using TB! as
ACM>> it is. They're a tad more tedious than what Becky and Calypso
ACM>> provide, but this should be the case since making it easy for
ACM>> the passing user encourages the practice rather than discourage
ACM>> it.

My attitude towards it is the same as with HTML mail. Did you read what
I recently wrote about HTML mail? The short of it is that I feel it
definitely has its place but it shouldn't be encouraged as the thing to
do with impunity or willy-nilly.

ML> Again, I don't agree. Just as physical mail we receive (or books we
ML> own, etc.), what we like to do with the copies we own is totally our
ML> business. If your argument holds, moreover, then why don't we take
ML> away the trash can in TB? :) Or why should we allow people to change
ML> the "Save" template,

That's for my own purposes and the message cannot be sent out, even
accidentally.

ML>  or delete attachments,

Expecting ones attachment to be saved elsewhere and/or deleted is an
accepted norm.

ML> or delete the html part?

the same goes for HTML versions.

:=) It's a matter of degree. The fact that an inch is acceptable doesn't
mean the whole 9 yards is fine.

ML> Or why do we allow forwarding messages in text (rather than MIME
ML> attached)?

When I see forwarded messages as text, my hackles raise in that I know
it could be altered.

To me, it's all a matter of degree.

ML> There're as many legitimate reasons to modify a received message as
ML> to delete it.

Deleting a message cannot be compared. :=)

ML> If needed, one can save a copy of the original. What's wrong with
ML> that? The official list archives of TBUDL and TBBETA cross out
ML> senders' email addresses, for good reasons. Why can't the users do
ML> similar things, to mail in his/her own mailboxes?

To me, it's all a matter of degree. This alteration is made known as
well.

[..]

ML> That proves you're still a great moderator, Marck, and I tip my hat
ML> to you. :)

:=) Ditto.

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A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
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Re: Extracting all addresses from a folder?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 19:11:41 +0100, Roel contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:
ACM>> My answer was off-base big time. What computed was collecting multiple
ACM>> addresses within a single message, such as a long CC: List.

R> for doing exactly that:
R> - create a manual filter, using a catch-all-phrase ('e' in kludges etc)
R> - by actions, set it to add addresses to the address book,
R>   using 'to + cc (+bcc)' or 'all'

R> Works like a charm & you can even select the group :-)

Hehehehehe.  I don't think I'll ever learn all there is to
know about what TB! can do for you. Thanks. This suggestion of yours is
finding its niche in my 'List Gem's' folder. :=)

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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 17 November, 2000, 1:36 PM, I saw Manfred's comments made on
 Fri, 17 Nov 2000 18:15:07 +, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

[...]
ME> Let's keep our eyes on the competition folks! There is something to learn
ME> (aka implement).

... or learn not to implement. :=)

I find it a bit concerning that you feel the need to say that. :=)

Whatever would make you feel that we aren't doing that? 

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A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 17 Nov 2000 19:09:10 +, Doug Weller thoughtfully wrote
the following:

[...]
DW> Well, I hope you accept that I intended to cause no offense and am
DW> genuinely interested in The Bat as an alternative. However, given
DW> your strong position on this and guessing that you might have
DW> influence on its development, The Bat might never have this feature
DW> that I think is essential for my needs.

We, the moderators, are users of TB! like yourself. We are neither Ritlabs
employees, part of their technical team, nor part of their development
team. We have no more influence over what is implemented from what is
not than the rest of the members of this list. If this were not the case
I'd be a very happy camper since I'd have all the features that I
desired. :=)

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Re: Editing received messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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Hi Doug,
 On Fri, 17 Nov 2000, at 22:34:39 [GMT +] you wrote:

 [..]
> Any comments from anyone as to how it is with thousands of messages (yes, I
> know that
> might be considered a bad idea, but it happens!).  Other clients are very
> slow to open
> and I wouldn't be surprised, or put off terribly, if The Bat were also.

I'm a stickler for message formatting.

I'm curious as to how your message formatting get's to look like how
it's displayed above. I'm quite sure this was not your intention and
that you would have preferred if it looked like this:

> Any comments from anyone as to how it is with thousands of messages
> (yes, I know that might be considered a bad idea, but it happens!).
> Other clients are very slow to open and I wouldn't be surprised, or
> put off terribly, if The Bat were also.

Are you accustomed to hitting the return key thus creating your own hard
returns? This brings me to one of the reasons why I'm attracted to TB!
so much  it doesn't reformat text upon sending, so the formatting
you see before you send, is the formatting the recipient will receive.

Outlook, Outlook Express, Eudora, Calypso all suffer from the bad model
of wrapping text upon sending ... not while editing. This wrapping on
sending, oh so wrongfully, includes quoted material.

Anyway, to answer your question, TB! handles thousands of messages very
well, but its performance depends a lot on the performance of your hard
disk. I presently have 35,000 messages across 2 accounts in TB!. On my
older drive, TB! opened very quickly. Even though, you see the message
tallying going on (this takes a few moments), TB! is already downloading
mail. It's beautifully multi-threaded, you see. :=) I have a folder here
containing 7000 messages. When I opened it on my older hard disk, I had
to wait for about 5 seconds for the message list to appear. Now that I
have my new, faster hard disk, TB! starts even more quickly and the
folder message numbers are tallied almost immediately. The message list
of the 7000 message folders appears in less than a second. :=)

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A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
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Re: please help out a lamer

[A . Curtis Martin]

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When I saw Vandor's message about "please help out a lamer ",
I just had to make these comments:

VG> I'm new to The Bat and I have this little annoying problem:

:=) Yes.

VG> When I am writing a reply to messages from one of my friends, his
VG> (now quoted) lines don't get wrapped (I hope it's the right word :),
VG> instead they become very long and I have to scroll my window to
VG> follow them.

TB!'s editor will faithfully quote the senders text with the senders
formatting preserved. TB!'s editor is a WYSIWYG editor. How the
formatting appears is exactly how the intended recipient will see it.

TB!'s message viewer, however, has the added ability of window wrapping
long lines of sender message text automatically. This is why the senders
text appeared wrapped when you read it.

VG> So far I couldn't find an automated solution to this.

This was a point of discussion some time back, the request made being
that TB!'s editor should automatically wrap these long lines of text
when quoting. The concensus was that auto-wrapping long lines really
aught to be made optional or be tied to the auto-format mode. Ritlabs
attention has however been on other aspects of TB! rather than its
editor, so this issue has not yet been addressed.

VG> The messages look ok when I'm reading them in the inbox, and get
VG> "messed up" only when I try to reply.

They aren't really messed up when you reply. :=)

Let me demonstrate and I'll put you unto an annoyance with TB!'s viewer
that I've found.

I need a long line of text so I will not wrap this very paragraph that I'm writing. Go 
into the editor preferences and disable autowrapping. Now come back to this paragraph 
and look at it. You will see it as I sent it, i.e., as a single long line of text.

When you reply to this message, you'll see the above paragraph in it's
true formatting glory, i.e., as a single line of text.

Now my annoyance with TB!'s viewer is that a good example of a long line
of text which really shouldn't be wrapped is a regex macro. Now, if a
regex macro is window wrapped by the viewer and you attempt to copy and
paste the macro from the viewer, the pasted version will be wrapped. The
viewer apparently hard-wraps when it does so. Therefore, if I need to
copy and paste a long line of text that has been wrapped by TB!'s
viewer, I have to go into the editor preferences and disable
auto-wrapping (who would intuitively think that an editor setting would
affect the message viewers behaviour anyway?). When I reopen the
message, no window wrapping will be done and I can then safely copy and
paste exactly as formatted. Another way to do this is to hit reply and
copy and paste from the editor window. Ever wonder why so many holler
that their regex macros are not working? They have to be fiddling to get
the macro in a single line when all they really should have needed to do
was a simple copy and paste operation? :=)

My appeal, therefore, is for an easy toggle switch to disable
auto-wrapping in the message viewer. Wrapping in the editor really
shouldn't be tied to wrapping in the viewer but if it has to stay that
way I'll live. :=)

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A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
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Re: Macros (Regexp): Two questions.

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 07:07:39 -0500, Brian Clark wrote these
comments about 'Macros (Regexp): Two questions.':

BC> I'm a new user; I'm waiting on my key to get mailed to me :-) and I
BC> must say this client rocks.

Indeed it does and welcome to TBBETA. :=)

BC> Can anyone tell me if there is a variable that holds just the initials
BC> (or whatever is chosen for the quoted text -- be it initials or first
BC> name, etc.). If I have Initials chosen, and I replied to my own e-mail,
BC> I'd get BC> for the quotes prefix.

Well, you can either do it globally via the account properties default
reply template properties or you can do it selectively with the
%Quotestyle macro.

BC> I've tried returning the value of %QUOTESTYLE but it's always empty.
BC> :\

Firstly, the %Quotestyle macro *must* precede the %quotes macro in your
reply template. If you place it after the %quotes macro, it will not
work.

The next, is that to produce initials, you use "I", i.e.,
%QUOTESTYLE="I"

See the help on this:

QUOTESTYLE=”expression” - specify the quotation sign prefix used after
this macro. Expression can be any of the following:

NONE - use an empty prefix (a standard)
I - use initials of the sender of the original message

IF - use the first initial of the sender of the
 original message

N - use the full name of the sender of the original message
F - use the first name of the sender of the original message
L - use the last name of the sender of the original message
=text - use the “text” as the prefix, e.g. %QUOTESTYLE=”=-|”


BC> I'm trying to get something along the lines of (when replying):

BC> (BC == "Brian Clark") [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

BC> To do that, I've been hacking various versions of this:

You don't need a regex macro to do that. :=)

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Re: Macros (Regexp): Two questions.

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 18 November, 2000, 10:04 AM, I saw Brian's comments made on
 Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:20:23 -0500, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

ACM>> Indeed it does and welcome to TBBETA. :=)

BC> Why beta? :-) You mean my client or this list? I noticed there was a
BC> Beta list, but I thought this was the plain 'ol users' list..

My mistake. That should be TBUDL. :=)

[..]
BC> Yep, done this, but I *do* I like the way TB! does the work. The thing
BC> is that I don't know how to copy the prefix it uses in %Quotes into
BC> the first line -- the (BC == "Brian Clark") part.

BC> I've tried this, with no effect:

I think I understand what you desire now. You wish to just output the
initials for the recipient name for your use. I thought you wanted to
quote using initials. Well, in your case you do need a regex macro.

This has proven to be tedious for me as well. The closest I could come
to a working regex macro is:


%SETPATTREGEXP="(?i)\A\b(\S)\S*?\.?\b\s(\b(\S)\b\.?\s)*\b(\S)\S*\b"%REGEXPBLINDMATCH="%TONAME"
 %SUBPATT="1"%Subpatt="3"%Subpatt="4"


It looks complicated but I tried simpler expressions and they wouldn't
work. This expression however barfs on single names. If it is used on a
single name such as Allie, it outputs "Ao". I don't know where the
character "o" comes from. But it always follows the initial of the
single name.

It will not work with names that use a first initial such as mine:
A. Curtis Martin. My attempts to prevent this, which I thought would be
straightforward, only breaks the macro. :=/

It however works nicely on two word names and two word names with an
initial in the middle.

Maybe someone would like to attempt tweaking it to make it work across
the board. I need a break. :=)

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Best way to dispose of the Borg: Give them Windows 3.1. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhbarvAXeSHuB5k3EQLfGwCcDVDLx+AWV4OltqfM7fMipZrHLkwAoJwY
wJN0Gc/01/4rRiif+GNlNzZ8
=Y5hu
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Memo Auto-View Feature?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 11:06:26 -0800, Nick Andriash contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:

NA> I seem to have a problem with the *automatic* opening of Memo's
NA> attached to messages. To create a memo, I have to check View/Memo
NA> Auto-view to bring up the memo. After creation, I hit the "Save"
NA> button, and can then see the first 6 or 7 letters of the memo in my
NA> Memo column (width set at 40).

NA> My problem is that I can find no easy way to *open* the memo again, for
NA> try as I may, I cannot get the memo to *open* when I view the message
NA> which has the memo. Having View/Memo Auto-view checked does not seem to
NA> make any difference. I find I have to manually open the memo by accessing
NA> the View/Memo Auto-view menu, and if it is already checked, I have to
NA> access it again to get the memo to open. :o(

NA> Perhaps I am misled by the term *auto-view*?

Everything works fine for me provided I work with the main TB! windows
folder list with the preview pane enabled. Memo's are displayed in the
memo auto-view window when I toggle it on. As I move from one 'memoed'
message to another, the memo in the viewer changes as it should.

However, none of this happens is the preview pane is toggled off. You
can't even associate the memo auto-view window with a folder view
window. If you need to view memo's with the memo auto-view window, you
have to do it with the main windows message list.

The folder view windows have been consistently lagging in supported
functionality. The same problem existed with address auto-viewing and
it was fixed. I guess we'll have to wait for it to be fixed here as
well. :=(

These problems with memo-autoview has been present since its
implementation so though I'm using a beta version at present, I know the
problem exists with the latest official release and prior versions as
well.

- --   ,
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Gambling: The sure way of getting nothing for something. "
_
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhbhY/AXeSHuB5k3EQLuWwCghxppK2IaCDPaorpakKBBfm9vTUQAoPS1
mCdThu51IE4ZpLVI6RkGJdn/
=Rp+S
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Problems (Why don't these things get fixed?)

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 15:32:12 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] thoughtfully wrote
the following:

lan> Can you guy please make The Bat work with PGP 7.0?

I would assume Ritlabs is working on that. :=) They couldn't do anything
prior to the release of the international version and its source.

lan> And can I get an option to disable AUTOCOMPLETE EVERYWHERE!!, I
lan> don't want it anywhere, it is very bad. If I send a message to my
lan> girlfriend with the subject "Hello sexy", and then to my boss, with
lan> the subject of "Hello", and start typing away & press send, my boss
lan> gets a nice letter saying "Hello sexy". That's really stupid, and
lan> bad. It is a pain in the ass having to always check if that has
lan> happened. PLEASE LET ME TURN IT OFF!!

ROTFL!!.. ROTFL!! I know what you mean.

lan> Same with the address field autocomplete, plenty of problems with
lan> that also.

Unfortunately there's no way of doing this via the TB! interface. You'd
have to go to the registry.

You can change all the following values from 40 (the default) to zero.

HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/History strings
(try this one first and see of the others have been changed to zero as
well. If not, you'll need to change them as well)

HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/History Strings/SUBJ HISTORY/Count
HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/History Strings/TO HISTORY/Count

Remember to backup the RIT key and exit TB! before starting.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"If all goes well, you've overlooked something! "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhbkkvAXeSHuB5k3EQLv0wCdHa/omclhbVcgOJA5/uHLCpXtExMAoJO8
tbvli+M2iaaxq7h6Q49HtNVb
=3MOO
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Memo Auto-View Feature?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 13:03:25 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote these
words of wisdom:

ACM>> Everything works fine for me provided I work with the main TB! windows
ACM>> folder list with the preview pane enabled. Memo's are displayed in the
ACM>> memo auto-view window when I toggle it on. As I move from one 'memoed'
ACM>> message to another, the memo in the viewer changes as it should.

NA> I'm not sure I follow you here Allie. I have View/Split Mode/Full Height
NA> Account Tree checked, so I have my tree on the left, the message list on
NA> the top right, and the preview pane below.

This is my exact setup as well.

NA> When I come to a message that has a memo, I *have* to go to View/Memo
NA> Auto-view to make sure it is checked, and the memo will show.

Or hit ?

NA> Now, when I try to go the very next message in the thread (which
NA> also has a memo), I lose the memo window, and have to go back to
NA> View/Memo Auto-view to uncheck it, and then I have to bring it up
NA> again to re-check it to see the next memo.

Sounds like you don't have 'always on top' enabled. As a result, when
you select a new message the memo-autoview window disappears from view.
Right click the memo-autoview window and enable the 'always on top'
option.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Religion without heart is enslavement. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhbw/fAXeSHuB5k3EQKJDgCeIS7Zt5WbrNdUPkwubCPQlG5k5ZsAoJm/
MKwXmcD2c9jfdh8eZFc9SbhW
=7Zuz
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Memo Auto-View Feature?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 13:36:14 -0800, Januk Aggarwal contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:

JA> That's the main reason I don't use it myself.  It would be very nice
JA> if the memo window could be docked onto the side or bottom of the
JA> preview window.  I dislike separate windows for related information.

The same goes for the PGP signature verification window. It's
unnecessary. The same information could be given in a status line which
the main TB! window lacks.

Another option for viewing memos would be to add the same functionality
as was done with the folder list. If you pass the mouse over any folder
and one of the columns is not visible, a popup hint shows what is not
visible. Perhaps a similar thing could be done for the memo entries, in
that holding the mouse over the memo displays the full memo as a pop-up
hint.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Do NOT look into laser with remaining eyeball! "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhcPEvAXeSHuB5k3EQIB8wCgjc2kEdxrlDSF136pW2LOuUyfVaAAni08
u5VQNnWrhaIKKa+khoxt8MoX
=8ZXn
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Memo Auto-View Feature?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sat, 18 Nov 2000 19:42:18 -0500, Jan Rifkinson contributed this
to the collective wisdom of the human race:

Allie>> Another option for viewing memos would be to add the same
Allie>> functionality as was done with the folder list. If you pass
Allie>> the mouse over any folder and one of the columns is not
Allie>> visible, a popup hint shows what is not visible.

Adjust the size of your folder tree so that either the names of the
folders are not fully displayed or the total messages column isn't
displayed. Now pass the mouse over the folder and you'll see a little
pop-up hint appear giving you the full information on what's not
visible.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Oxymoron: Student teachers. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhcjHPAXeSHuB5k3EQJJqwCfQTDGE+ucVoD9+C+zxs1YFYDb3nUAni8F
XeytndxuLJQhlEudrCzsm5sQ
=ZrtO
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Dispatching mail on server and filter actions

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sun, 19 Nov 2000 14:00:11 +0100, Luca graced us with
these comments:

L> Is there any way to perform filtering actions when dispatching mail on
L> server? E.g., can I automatically kill all emails form a certain
L> author, or with a certain header, directly on my pop/imap server
L> without downloading the message body?

Yes. Through the selective downloads filter set.

L> "Selective download" item in sorting office seems to be a nice one,
L> but I can't find any help about it. Is there any more specific doc
L> than TB's online help about that and the "dispatch mail on
L> server" function?

The documentation is rather poor and the Selective Download item is a
revamp of the original Kill-filters item. Luckily it's very
straightforward to use.

Open the Selective downloads section and hit the new button. Select the
area in the message headers the search string is located.

Type in your search string/s in the box provided. No quotes are required
unless you wish to make the string case sensitive. Simply type each
string in its own line like a list by hitting the return key to start a
new line.

Under the advanced tab you can chose to Kill the message, i.e., delete
it or to simply ignore it.

You may then chose your string/s detection method.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"He who laughs last probably made a backup. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhfmBfAXeSHuB5k3EQKBJQCeI55XVAAHX490wwklRc6xop2xveYAoKh8
wt9mvj0yfGJ5gdjKmSQHedJl
=OaB7
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: The Bat! - bug report

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sun, 19 Nov 2000 13:10:47 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote these
words of wisdom:


NA> No, I think it's OK to discuss it here on TBUDL, because it has existed
NA> for many versions, including the Halloween Edition. The instructions to
NA> see this bug in action are simple:

NA> 1) Create a new message, and begin typing until you have 3 sentences
NA> completed.

NA> 2) Now, go to the very first word in the 3rd sentence, and begin to
NA> backspace it out. You will find that as you backspace out the last
NA> character in the word, that your cursor ends up at the *beginning* of the
NA> last word in the 2nd sentence. I just tried it on this very line, and as I
NA> backspaced out the word "last", my cursor ended up before "the" on the end
NA> of the previous line.

This is a very old bug that has been affecting TB!'s editor. I couldn't
quite put a finger on it initially and thought that it was just me
playing tricks on myself. However, I know it exists though I haven't
found a way to consistently reproduce it. Also, I can't remember the
last time I was bitten by it.

I can't reproduce the problem the way you instructed. :=(

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"Nostalgia isn't what it used to be. "
_
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhhH7PAXeSHuB5k3EQLlywCg/cOAwOX1aw1pgu2LQvFRYaN9qVQAoMqe
EZeCaDVijr5DH1DFuLALYJ65
=ARh5
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Received/created dates not showing

[A . Curtis Martin]

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When I saw Doug's message about "Received/created dates not showing ",
I just had to make these comments:

DW> I'm slowly figuring this all out, but I've got a problem I can't
DW> figure at all -- a number of new messages are showing up with only the
DW> time in the received and created columns, no date. This is obviously a
DW> pain.
[..]

This is normal behaviour on the part of TB!. Any message that you
receive on the present day will only have a time associated with it.
When the current days date is the same as the received message, only the
time will be displayed. As soon as the messages creation or received
date is not the same as the current days date, the date is then
displayed.

I rather like it. It's a nice way of easily visualising which messages
arrived today.

- --
A. Curtis Martin  |  Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey

"On a scale of 1 to 10, 4 is about 7. "
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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iQA/AwUBOhhFy/AXeSHuB5k3EQKoPgCgn8qp9lVw0IxNZ/89NI/kyc8Y7YQAn1VX
pGjyKYtAn9IgJUsp8q7bkjo6
=+GVL
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Re: The Bat! - bug report

[A . Curtis Martin]

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When I saw Nick's message about "The Bat! - bug report ",
I felt like making these comments:

[..]
NA> No Januk, I can't reproduce it now either, but only moments before I was.
NA> Believe me, the bug exists... it's just intermittent, and difficult to
NA> pinpoint.

This has been my exact experience as well. Do you use the auto-format
mode Nick? It tends to happen to me in that mode.

- --
A. Curtis Martin [Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]
PGPKey:<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey>

'PCMCIA: People Can't Memorize Computer Industry Acronyms'
_
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iQA/AwUBOhhSUvAXeSHuB5k3EQLDZgCgnP5NT1Ax4hnsHD5pWNmaPsSMzQQAoNid
cSHGdHw0vQjiSR3Gy9rU14ek
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Re: Filters

[A . Curtis Martin]

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I thought I'd comment on Brian Clark's contribution to the list,
sent on Sun, 19 Nov 2000 20:00:19 -0500:

BC> Personally, I can't get the color groups and filters to work together.

BC> I've tried setting up a filter to highlight any e-mail sent by me navy
BC> blue.

BC> Incoming filter is as follows:

BC> Name: Brian Clark
BC> Source Folder: Inbox
BC> Move messages to folder: Inbox
BC> Strings: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
^^
is this 'om' or 'com'?
BC> Location: Anywhere

Location should be set to 'sender' or else you'll be changing the colour
of a lot of messages that aren't from you.

BC> Present: Yes
BC> Rule is: Active

BC> Under Actions Tab:

BC> Set messages colour group to: Myself (this is a color group I made,
BC> obviously)

BC> Options tab:

BC> Continue processing with other filters : checked
BC> Regular expressions: checked for the heck of it.
 ^^
 NOOO!!! Not for the heck of it. Switch it off!!
 It will treat your address as a regular
 expression, although in your case the only
 metacharacter present is '.' and it being there
 shouldn't pose a problem.


BC> Advanced tab:

BC> Message is associated with a Colour Group: Myself

Switch this off. The message is not yet colour coded so this will break
your filter. This option is telling the rule to attempt a match only on
messages colour coded as 'myself'. But no incoming message has been so
coded as yet.

BC> I also placed a copy of the same filter in Read Messages filters, as
BC> well. Same settings.

What is your aim with the read messages filter.

- --
@~@@~@
 | A. Curtic Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'My other computer is a HAL 9000.'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/7 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOhh6//AXeSHuB5k3EQL4xgCgpv7AtAtvre/7H4YbEbBqJ48nOZMAoL/p
4gAr9Z6eVxBofBPwi6mO9p3S
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Re: Filters

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Sun, 19 Nov 2000 20:10:32 -0500, Brian Clark thoughtfully wrote
the following:

BC>> Strings: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

BC> Just so you know, the above was a typo. I meant .com obviously..

Not so obvious. This is a common reason for filters to mysteriously not
work. You could have simply copied and pasted the string from your
filter rule and that error would have definitely broken it. :=)

- --
@~@@~@
 | A. Curtic Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Do fish get thirsty?'
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Re: Filters

[A . Curtis Martin]

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When I saw Brian's message about "Filters ",
I felt like making these comments:

ACM>> Location should be set to 'sender' or else you'll be changing the
ACM>> colour of a lot of messages that aren't from you.

BC> Yes, I tired that first. No effect; that's why I chose Anywhere. But I
BC> don't understand how it would change the color of messages not from
BC> me? I mean, I hope there is only one [EMAIL PROTECTED] :-)

Look in the headers of every message sent to the address
[EMAIL PROTECTED] and you'll see the said address in the headers.
Take this message from you to which I'm replying. In the headers is:

 Received: from dutaint.com (unverified [203.130.233.8]) by
 mail.kasnet.com (Vircom SMTPRS 4.4.184) with ESMTP id
 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
^
That's my address in it. If I
set up my colour code filter the
way you did, this TBUDL message
would be colour coded as a
message from myself. You have to
set the location to 'sender'.

BC>>> Regular expressions: checked for the heck of it.
ACM>>  ^^
ACM>>  NOOO!!! Not for the heck of it. Switch it off!!
ACM>>  It will treat your address as a regular
ACM>>  expression, although in your case the only
ACM>>  metacharacter present is '.' and it being there
ACM>>  shouldn't pose a problem.

BC> LOL. OMG, yeah I should have known that. But it should still pick up in
BC> this case, as you mentioned.

Phew!! I'm glad you took the exclamations in the right spirit. 

BC> Ahh, the Advanced tab setting was the problem. :-D

Yes, this was what was making it not work at all.

BC> I'm too lazy to send test messages to myself. Heheheh.. really,
BC> almost.

Go into your network& administration settings and enable "allow local
delivery". This makes you able to test incoming filters without using
the mail server. You can easily resend any of your messages instead of
creating new ones to send, changing the To: address accordingly. It's
really no big deal. :=)

BC> Thanks for your help in finding the solution.

No problem. :=)

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Save the whales. Collect the whole set.'
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Re: Capacity to hold large numbers of messages

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Mon, 20 Nov 2000 10:09:01 +, Jamie Dainton wrote these
words of wisdom:

JD> Well I've got TB working well with 1 mails per folder and have
JD> tried 3 mails per account. There is more information available in
JD> the archive. From what I can remember I think the theoretical limit
JD> was about 2^32 mails in a folder while the practical limit was about
JD> 15000 per folder on a 500MHz machine w/128MB ram.

 and a good hard disk. A speedy hard disk makes a profound
difference on how quickly those large folders open.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Fer Sell Cheep: 1 Bran New Spel Chekker. Nevur Usd.'
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Re: Two questions

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Mon, 20 Nov 2000 18:08:48 -0500, Leonard S. Berkowitz thoughtfully
wrote the following:

LSB> 1. I added a new folder in a folder with many other folders. How
LSB> can I have these lowest level folders display alphabetically?

To arrange the folders alphabetically, hit the Folder tab at the top of
the folder list. Choose 'yes' to the process folders prompt.

LSB> 2. What is the name of the address book and where is it?

At the file level? .  it's in the /The Bat!/Mail directory. All
'*.abd' files are address book files. They're however not in plain text.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'The first step to making a dream come true is to wake up'
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Re: Expand all threads?

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 14:17:50 -0600, Rev. Bob 'Bob' Crispen graced us with
these comments:

RBBC> Is there a way to do this.  The documentation (for once) seems to be
RBBC> silent on the subject.

<*>


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 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'The Majority is never right unless it includes me.'
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Re: Another question on filters and templates

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Mon, 20 Nov 2000 20:58:18 +0100, David van Zuijlekom graced us with
these comments:

JA>> String  Location Presence
JA>> ^Subject.\s*send.pgp.keys   Kludges  Yes

DvZ> I don't know why, but this doesn't work for me. If I use this regexp
DvZ> in my filter string it doesn't even match "send_pgp_keys".
DvZ> Can someone please help me?

I suspect that you don't have 'regular expressions' enabled in your
filter rules options.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic'
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Re: Acting on message text strings

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 19:25:31 -0800, Januk Aggarwal thoughtfully wrote
the following:

i3

JA> The other variation I have:

JA>   
%SETPATTREGEXP="(?is)(.*?)\s(.*?mailto:)*?(\S*?@\S*?)(\s|\n)"%REGEXPBLINDMATCH="%TEXT"%SUBPATT="3"

JA> Gives:
JA>   [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
JA>  ^
JA> Except for the trailing > this is very close to what we want.  Any
JA> ideas how to remove this last problem?

You need to do the match but not include it in the output.
Something like:
(?is)(.*?)\s(.*?mailto:)*?(\S*?@\S*(?=[>]*))(\s|\n)


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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Remember, UNIX spelled backwards is XINU.'
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Re: Word Wrapping

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 23 November, 2000, 12:39 AM, I saw Thomas's comments made on
 Thu, 23 Nov 2000 12:26:13 +0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

ACM>> Well, the printing will be done within the margins specified. If the
ACM>> text has lines that exceed the margins, they'll either not be fully
ACM>> printed or wrapped.

TF> This does make sense (even though not all programs work like this),
TF> but why are the margins on printing smaller than on screen, even
TF> though the paper is wide enough? Am I missing a menu item where I
TF> can adjust this?

The fonts used to print are different and most likely larger than what
you use on screen. You can customise the fonts and print margins via
'print setup'.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Patience is a virtue, it's just not one of my better virtues'
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Re: Dispatching mail on server and filter actions

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 12:31:50 +0100, Luca wrote these
comments:

L> Thanx. I only can't understand what's the "manual only" choice used
L> for: I can't see how to activate rules manually, in selective
L> downloading.

I don't know myself. :=)

L> Most important, I guess there's no chance to perform other actions
L> besides kill/ignore ones, isn't it?

Unfortunately no.

Unless you download and delete the messages upon receiving them.

L> I mean templates, macro ... I'd like to be able do send automated
L> replies to the authors that I kill.

If this is to spam then that is largely pointless. Spammers rarely use a
valid e-mail address.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
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'Oxymoron: Stuck in traffic.'
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Re: Word Wrapping

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 14:45:22 +0800, Thomas Fernandez graced us with
these comments:

TF> Thanks, now I looked in the print setup. Margins are at 25.3974 mm
TF> (this number is the default!) and the fonts are for text: Courier New,
TF> 10 points.

Same for me.

TF> For the display (editor), I use a margin of 70 characters and also a
TF> font of Courier New at 10 points (no comments about taste, please: I
TF> like Coruier New much more than Andale Mono).

How can you use Courier??!! 

TF> So, now I have to calculate how many millimeters 70 characters need in
TF> order to make the hardcopies look like the emails on screen, or how to
TF> I synch this?

Your documents should print fine unless you have quoted material that is
wrapping beyond your 70 characters.

TF> Next question: May this be another UI issue?

This is an issue with printing anywhere.

The only way out of this is to make the viewers margins mirror that of
your print settings . or print preview support.

- --
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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Procrastination Day Has Been Postponed!'
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Re: Warning about attachments

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 11:28:00 +0200, Raoul Comninos graced us with
these comments:

RC> Whenever I try to open attachments I get a message warning me of the
RC> potential harm of a virus. How can I PERMANENTLY get rid of this
RC> warning so that I can simply open my attachments?

You have to edit the registry.

Go to HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/ProtectAllowOpen
  HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/ProtectDisableOpen
  HKCU/Software/RIT/The Bat!/ProtectWarnOpen

You can tailor the extensions to suit your needs.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Words are not food, though sometimes we must eat them.'
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Re: Dispatching mail on server and filter actions

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 13:32:35 +, Jamie Dainton wrote these
words of wisdom:

L>>> I mean templates, macro ... I'd like to be able do send automated
L>>> replies to the authors that I kill.

ACM>> If this is to spam then that is largely pointless. Spammers rarely use a
ACM>> valid e-mail address.

JD> Try reading Inoshiros guide to blocking spam at www.thock.com

That article goes into how to trace the origin of spam, not how to
filter it.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'11th Commandment: covet not thy neighbour's Pentium.'
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Re: Word Wrapping

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Thu, 23 Nov 2000 22:08:44 +0800, Thomas Fernandez wrote these
comments:

ACM>> How can you use Courier??!! 

TF> Did I say "no comments"? 

Just being a nag. :=)

ACM>> Your documents should print fine unless you have quoted material that is
ACM>> wrapping beyond your 70 characters.

TF> Thanks. I have quoted material, as incoming messages are written with
TF> Outlook, and yes, these parts are usually the ones looking funny when
TF> printing. However, they look OK on screen. I want them to look on
TF> paper as they look on screen. WYSIWYG being the keyword.

That's because the message viewer window wraps or its width spans more
than 70 characters. My message viewer is now over 90 characters wide. A
90 character line will therefore not wrap when looked at in the viewer
but will be wrapped when printed.

ACM>> The only way out of this is to make the viewers margins mirror
ACM>> that of your print settings .

TF> You forgot to tell me how to convert number of characters into
TF> millimeters. ;-)

You know what I mean. :=) Test your system. See how many characters you
can print per line. Adjust your viewer to that character number width.

You can't really do anything about this anyway. If the lines are too
long they have to be wrapped to be printed.

TF> while this seems a good idea, I don't know how it would help in this
TF> case. If I *know* it wouldn't print right, what would I do?

Exactly. :=) The only solution would be to reformat the message
manually.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Trust me, I'm a lawyer..'
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Re: Dispatching mail on server and filter actions

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Fri, 24 Nov 2000 08:24:01 +, Jamie Dainton graced us with
these comments:

ACM>> That article goes into how to trace the origin of spam, not how
ACM>> to filter it.

JD> But if you can trace the origins of spam it will help you block
JD> mails. There is a list of open relay servers floating about the
JD> internet. If you set a filter which checks for the open relays you
JD> can create an interesting spam filter.

I've been doing some of that, but not only is it time consuming but it's
an art-form. You get better as you do a LOT of tracing.

What you're proposing is not impossible but not practical for most.\

Filtering spam by exclusion as Marck mentioned works very well and can
be setup and forgotten. You set the spam folder to be purged of old mail
at your preferred time. If you wish to fight spam, trace them and report
them or make SpamCop do it for you.

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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
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'Clarvoiants meeting canceled due to unforseen events.'
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Re: Images embeded in HTML doesn't display.

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On 24 November, 2000, 8:10 AM, I saw Marck's comments made on
 Fri, 24 Nov 2000 10:23:02 +, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

NG>> If I've got this wrong, someone please tell me (but I hope I haven't)

MDP> You  haven't. Nicely put. Although images of themselves are not likely
MDP> to  be viral, the principle stands. More importantly, an off-line mail
MDP> reader should certainly *not* perform implicit on-line functions, like
MDP> fetching non in-line images.

This is an excerpt from a document I read:

"One approach is to send the victim an e-mail message that contains what
is known as a webbug or tracking GIF. This is a URL referring to an
image file that would be retrieved from a web server, presumably one
operated by the sender, at the time that the e-mail message is
displayed. The sender can then consult the web server's log files to
obtain information about the victim's web browser and operating-system
type."

- From this information, they can then know your machines vulnerability
and can then exploit. The Outlook model that so many seem to love the
convenience of is not the way to go.

- --
@~@========@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Seeing is deceiving. It's eating that's believing.'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/8 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOh5qwPAXeSHuB5k3EQJlsQCgl1d3ZpiC3dhRaZTJRwoKZl8NQCUAoO1I
IhDbfwU07QIYtnFFxd+4/vsA
=YVzz
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: PGP Auto Decrypt

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 24 Nov 2000 16:46:27 -0500, Brian Clark wrote these
words of wisdom:

GE>> Ctrl-Shift-D Decrypt and Verify (lookout: the DLL creates a decrypted copy
GE>> of the msg and leaves the encrypted one untouched)

GE>> Ctrl-Shift-C Verify signature

BC> Hey hey, this isn't working for me.. :\

BC> Ctrl+Shift+D does nada.. is it something I've done? :-)

Make sure the message in the message list is in focus when using these
shortcuts. If the message viewer is in focus they don't work. Another
small short coming for Ritlabs to work out. These shortcuts really aught
to work whether the message or it's body is in focus.

BC> Is there some place I can get a list of ALL of the shortcuts for TB!?

Yes. Via the TB! FAQ pages:

http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/FAQ.html

- --
@~@========@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Using yesterday's technology to solve today's problems, tomorrow'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/8 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOh7+TfAXeSHuB5k3EQLsogCcCyghQ07SxFtlK78TU+9h9bq2z3sAnRmJ
ZZstbax05UsKY7wBXYoMCbBt
=98o1
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: dealing with digests

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, 25 Sep 2000 17:30:28 -0700, Januk Aggarwal wrote:

JA> TB has a great MIME digest viewer.  Hey Syafril, I seem to remember a
JA> discussion about MIME digests way back.  Does your server support that
JA> type of digest?  If so, now that TB supports MIME digests (quite
JA> nicely too), perhaps that would be a better format?

JA> The advantages of MIME digests are numerous, but the biggest is that
JA> you reply to the individual message, not to the digest.

Additionally, since it displays the digest messages in a virtual folder,
you may thread the messages etc. :-) It's as if you downloaded them
separately.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "And the only thing the Borg left was this Macintosh... "

Using TB! v1.46d «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for message and sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOdBMVPAXeSHuB5k3EQJxigCfcu1YuwsBwk1QxlCTYL2yR6QYVXYAn2es
KkejR4hdNEGX/9cS96wgUgfw
=d8gi
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: wishlist (was Re: Main Window in Bat!)

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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On Tue, 26 Sep 2000 09:20:26 +0100, Jamie Dainton wrote:

JD> Or they could just look in the TBUDL archives. Also no one even seems
JD> to read the welcome message or help file anymore. Frequently there are
JD> posts that could easily be answered if people just looked at the help
JD> file.

This may be true but when some subscribe to this list, witness the warm
community atmosphere, and the prompt answering of questions, they feel
tempted to ask questions here instead of *always* first going through
the help file or the FAQ's. Afterall, if you shoot a question of
clarification at the help file it doesn't respond.

JD> TB! and it's help file is not at fault it's just faulty users.

I beg to disagree here. A lot of TB!'s help consists of overviews. Only
the experienced and those like myself who take long periods of time
experimenting, going through long periods of trial and error will learn.
A more detailed help would go a long way here. TB! 's help is not the
only one that I have used or read and I really have to disagree.

JD> For some more advanced topics TBUDL is good but recently we seem to
JD> be swamped with very simple questions. Other people have noticed
JD> this and commented on it (on and off list). The other problem is
JD> that the condensed knowledge of TBUDL in pdf format would be larger
JD> than Office 2K, I would no be happy if I downloaded a 2MB program
JD> with a 15MB help file, most of which I'd never use.

You're exaggerating here Jamie, for effect, I suppose but the help could
really be more detailed in areas.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Have it OUR way. Yours is IRRELEVANT. At BORGerKing. "

Using TB! v1.46d «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for message and sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOdCU4PAXeSHuB5k3EQLlegCgpmKCJfGMc0l5e04Mk/GVNdKyUAgAoJvW
mzNQUVMAagzS09C32UByR3al
=GpPD
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Keep Message in Base / Purging

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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  On Sat, 14 Oct 2000 09:06:22 -0400, dMb wrote:

  
d> I just ran the Purge option, yet I still have messages in the folder
d> that are dated October 9, 2000 (both created and received). I would
d> have assumed that the oldest messages would be dated October 10, 2000.

d> The one extra day is happening in all folders, regardless of the
d> setting. While it's not a huge issue, I was wondering if anyone else
d> is seeing this happen?

Yes, I've noted this and have just been compensating for it by taking it
into account when configuring the purge options. When I want a 1 week
purge I define 6 days etc.

- --
A. Curtis Martin..
Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA  |  PGP Key ID: 0xEE079937
PGP Key: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey
- ---
** "Daddy, what does FORMATTING DRIVE C: mean? "

Using TB! v1.47 Beta/7 (S/N CCA4F9B8) «» Win2k Pro SP1

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOehxbfAXeSHuB5k3EQJbQgCfWdeL9/hzhy6pCcuku1VtVW2IK7wAoLut
d+PU17Kgk/Ruu4bIntly7uOU
=Q/cd
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Mime Forwarding (was: Using TB! to scan Digest Mode)

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 05 December, 2000, 3:29 PM, I saw Thomas's comments made on
 Tue, 5 Dec 2000 22:14:54 +0800, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

JR>>Marck, thanks for your quick reply; I found it & tried it & now can
JR>>see what MIME format can do. Trouble is, when would it *not* be a
JR>>good option to use & what would it look like?

TF> Any forwarded mail looks like an attachment, and you have to click on
TF> it to open it. Now, if you have ever received a message that was
TF> forwarded and forwarded and forwarded ... again by 27 people who use
TF> MIME forwarding, you end up clicking 27 times on attachments before
TF> you can see the original message the whole fuss is about (usually a
TF> lame joke).

With Pegasus Mail, if you double click the MIME attached message while
holding down a key (I forgot which), it will drill down to the original
message avoiding you having to open all the attachments. This I found to
be amazingly useful when needed and hope the Ritlabs guys will look into
it at some point.

- --
@~@============@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'...I'm sorry, Reality is not in service at this time.'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/9 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi1Qu1fJ62ArBxfiEQLFJACfdtggHUeMAVeWfjyvEAFjTi2nVKwAoKET
6Y6LqaotHjkVK1r+j+IJt4xG
=bdb5
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Mime Forwarding (was: Using TB! to scan Digest Mode)

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, 6 Dec 2000 12:12:06 +0800, Thomas Fernandez thoughtfully wrote
the following:

ACM>> With Pegasus Mail, if you double click the MIME attached message
ACM>> while holding down a key (I forgot which), it will drill down to
ACM>> the original message avoiding you having to open all the
ACM>> attachments. This I found to be amazingly useful when needed and
ACM>> hope the Ritlabs guys will look into it at some point.

TF> Wouldn't this mean you don't see any comments someone might have made
TF> in the line? Not all MIME forwards are jokes, you see.

Thanks. I didn't know that. :=) Actually I wasn't thinking of Jokes
alone. I personally don't receive only jokes MIME forwarded multiple
times.

TF> I've received business emails MIME forwarded, and it is in fact
TF> important to see whether the third receipient (and mail-forwarder)
TF> made a comment, or the seventh.

Well, in those cases, you manually drill down to the original message.

Remember that I said you open the first MIME attached message holding
down a particular key and it will drill down to the original message. If
you don't hold down the key, things will happen as in TB!.

- --
@~@====@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'I'm not tense, just terribly A*L*E*R*T!!'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/9 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi3tyFfJ62ArBxfiEQKsggCeLEgkOXbeqoir3XBUDQXOQYPyMFkAnjJf
aH3MVSzOTNn06kklrpQ9qfiV
=14Gu
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Two E-Mails with one account?

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

I thought I'd comment on Johan Svahn's contribution to the list,
sent on Wed, 6 Dec 2000 11:54:03 +0100:

JS> Is it possible to filter mail into a certain folder and then set up
JS> The Bat so that when I reply to emails from that folder a different
JS> name and use I different from, reply to and name is those emails? Is
JS> my original email address still visible in the headers?

Yes. Use filters to move the messages to the desired folder.

If you wish to use a different name but the same e-mail address, as I do
with this list, use the %FROM macro in your reply template. If you wish
to be thorough, change the names using both the %FROM and %REPLYTO
macros.

Syntax: %FROM="your name "
%REPLYTO="your name "

If you wish to use another account, i.e., different e-mail address, then
use the %ACCOUNT="account name" macro to automatically switch the
account.

- --
@~@============@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'The world is a cynic's playground.'
__
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi4splfJ62ArBxfiEQJKhgCfXlB2aU0NJA8I1qfdFPgd+oegNiAAn2Km
xUTT3IshcdhrQtWzMjylcSrw
=MS5e
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Using TB! to scan Digest Mode

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 06 December, 2000, 7:34 PM, I saw Douglas's comments made on
 Wed, 06 Dec 2000 17:34:44 -0600, and thought I'd add my $0.02 worth:

 [...]
DH> Marck's view - which I respect and appreciate. However, I hope I've
DH> cleared some of the doubts you have held regarding the validity of
DH> my using it. (Have I)? All that's happening is clearly documented in
DH> the introductory text I add (and in the headers and kludges, if you
DH> know where to look and how to interpret that).

I only have one reservation here. If you were to redirect a message to
me, I will not easily realize that the message is from you. It will
appear to be from the original sender. My filters for your messages will
not move the redirected messages to your folder. The only way to make the
distinction is to either open the message and read the addition you made
in the message body, or to examine the message headers.

If I wish to do a simple search of all messages from you (alt click on
your name in the From column), I'd have a problem with your redirected
messages since the "From" address for the messages you redirected to me
wouldn't be yours.

IOW's, it presents an awkward logistic problem that forwarding was
designed to fix. Forwarding makes it very clear that the message is from
you and not the original sender. I can easily spot a message you
forwarded to me in my message list as opposed to one you redirected to
me.

If you ask me, I think redirecting is really for special situations
where you really wish the messages to be redirected to another address,
either not really caring if the recipient doesn't realize the message
was sent by you, or where you wish the recipient to receive the message
with the original senders address as the from address.

My passing impression Douglas, is that you're bending over backwards to
justify redirecting in situations when it's really the awkward thing to
do and where forwarding would be more appropriate.

But that's just my $0.02. You've already explained extensively why you
redirect , and as Marck said, in the end, to each his own.

- --
@~@@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Clarvoiants meeting canceled due to unforseen events.'
__
TB! v1.48 Beta/9 | Windows NT 5.00.2195 (Service Pack 1)

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi7eUlfJ62ArBxfiEQLGGQCgkOskB+DdmwmVE1X9wkYRz4pW1LYAoJsm
6cAZfFeGGs7cDEQfpNzcgaII
=D2rK
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: how to gatther addressees

[A . Curtis Martin]

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On Wed, 6 Dec 2000 20:19:35 -0500, Jan Rifkinson thoughtfully wrote
the following:

[...]
JR> I'm wondering if there isn't some way that TB! can help me automate
JR> the process of gathering all the contributors addresses for the thank
JR> you part of this process.

You could create a new address book group and then make a filter to add
sender addresses to the newly created address book group. Assign the
filter a hotkey.

You can then select all the messages to be MIME forwarded and hit the
filters shortcut. All the addresses will be gathered and added to the
address book group which you can then use to send your message.

- --
@~@====@~@
 |     A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'Oxymoron: Sure bet.'
__
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi7qQFfJ62ArBxfiEQKWUACfeGxafDcT/wgciKRZLYtpkk1cef0AoMYB
P6RRa1MqKW9E6tGv+kZPe32b
=cjff
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: OT: Spanish (was:Re: ISP limits number of recipients to 10...)

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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I thought I'd comment on Thomas Fernandez's contribution to the list,
sent on Thu, 7 Dec 2000 16:23:14 +0800:

[...]
TF> Swear words do exist in English as they do in Spanish. And they make
TF> neither language any warmer. The usage of the language is it that
TF> makes the listener feel comfortable or not, not the amount of swear
TF> words you know and throw in.

TF> disclaimer: Part of this message was written with tongue-in-cheek.

I trust that this thread will be no longer be continued here but either
privately or on TBOT. Break it up here guys. You've each had your say.

- --
@~@============@~@
 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'It is bad luck to be superstitious.'
__
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Comment: Digitally signed for sender verification.

iQA/AwUBOi9xDlfJ62ArBxfiEQI+RwCfdmmGXjeDBXGwFxvA/RAFAly9CbMAn3UZ
StOm3WDoOGSu4cU9PqUreTX/
=ttpT
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Re: Using TB! to scan Digest Mode

[A . Curtis Martin]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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On Thu, 7 Dec 2000 12:48:06 +0800, Thomas Fernandez thoughtfully wrote
the following:

ACM>> I only have one reservation here. If you were to redirect a message to
ACM>> me, I will not easily realize that the message is from you. It will
ACM>> appear to be from the original sender.

TF> The average recipient (using OL or OE) will have no way of knowing
TF> that it was not sent from the original sender.

That's true since many either cannot examine and make sense out of
message headers or even know that they exist. :=)

TF> I use redirect (whihc is correctly called "bouncing" in the RFC's)
TF> when a message was sent to me by mistake and should have been sent
TF> to someone else. I send it to the correct recipient - without any
TF> alteration - and he will never know that is was missent from the
TF> start.

Indeed this is 90% of the occasions when I redirect messages myself.

TF> If I do want the final recipient know this came via me, I will use
TF> forward.


- --
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 | A. Curtis Martin  [List Moderator TBUDL/TBBETA]  |
 | PGPKey: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=SendAlliePGPKey |
@_@   (Opinions given are mine and not those of RITLABS)   @_@

'My keyboard has an F1 key. Where is the NASCAR key?'
__
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8
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iQA/AwUBOi9x8VfJ62ArBxfiEQK1ggCfYeiq2/0HAIhsN+KTR5i57PxjdU8AnAk8
5lcVWOC6fhWeIGNr9yOU1lmt
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