Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
Le 28/10/2017 à 11:27, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-28 06:48, Richard PALO wrote: Le 28/10/2017 à 01:12, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-27 22:27, Richard PALO wrote: So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is there for information. ?? I thought that stock receptions used the order prices (not the invoiced price) for stock valuation on the stock move. Has this changed, or do I misunderstand the workflow? That is, it is frequent here to have invoices based upon [one or more] deliveries. You should know the price of the product when you validated the quotation and at worst when you receive the goods so you can update the price on the move. Indeed, that is my point. With respect to promotions, sale_promotion is only for sales and not purchases. It seems that it should be neutral, but I imagine you suggest in this case that a purchase_promotion module be devised If you want but I do not think it is a generic feature because as I said most of companies will never encode all the rules of suppliers supposed that they know it. At best they will have a spreadsheet with the price list (and some will be per quantity) which can be uploaded as product supplier price. But the common behaviour is to just adapt the price from the received quotation. This workflow will be improved by the new purchase_request_quotation: https://bugs.tryton.org/issue6175 And even I'm wondering if the unit_price should not be editable on more state than draft and not required before confirmed. It is a good idea to analyse the use cases. I personally believe there are many who value 'verification' and 'update when needing correction' as opposed to manual data entry with greater risks. The latter also greatly complicates control of *unusual* price variations which necessitate rectification by the supplier. Nobody is exempt of errors, but the general rule is to reduce their heads popping up and certainly catch them when they do... not to mention avoiding any increase in the PO => Reception => Invoice entry/validation time. That is, there are companies that may already be on the critical path time-wise to get their monthly VAT reports ready... They don't necessarily have the budget to double their staffing in order to do so. As for quotations, those are prior to selecting the products from a specific supplier for confirmation ... there is no guarantee that a supplier will offer special pricing on all items (which is frequently only on certain non "consumable" articles). (RFQs may [in some cases] be machine generated and comprehensive) RFQ's never send the habitual price with the request to the supplier... it remains extremely useful to have 'a' price present in the draft order preparation to evaluate the price quotation received (sometimes the special price negotiation is just beginning!). cheers, -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/1a8a2309-5492-05ed-50fa-a13de1b05ad6%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-28 06:48, Richard PALO wrote: > Le 28/10/2017 à 01:12, Cédric Krier a écrit : > > On 2017-10-27 22:27, Richard PALO wrote: > >>> So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is > >>> there for information. > >>> > >> > >> ?? I thought that stock receptions used the order prices (not the invoiced > >> price) for stock > >> valuation on the stock move. Has this changed, or do I misunderstand the > >> workflow? > >> That is, it is frequent here to have invoices based upon [one or more] > >> deliveries. > > > > You should know the price of the product when you validated the > > quotation and at worst when you receive the goods so you can update the > > price on the move. > > > > Indeed, that is my point. > > With respect to promotions, sale_promotion is only for sales and not > purchases. > It seems that it should be neutral, but I imagine you suggest in this case > that > a purchase_promotion module be devised If you want but I do not think it is a generic feature because as I said most of companies will never encode all the rules of suppliers supposed that they know it. At best they will have a spreadsheet with the price list (and some will be per quantity) which can be uploaded as product supplier price. But the common behaviour is to just adapt the price from the received quotation. This workflow will be improved by the new purchase_request_quotation: https://bugs.tryton.org/issue6175 And even I'm wondering if the unit_price should not be editable on more state than draft and not required before confirmed. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171028092730.GC6037%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
Le 28/10/2017 à 01:12, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-27 22:27, Richard PALO wrote: So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is there for information. ?? I thought that stock receptions used the order prices (not the invoiced price) for stock valuation on the stock move. Has this changed, or do I misunderstand the workflow? That is, it is frequent here to have invoices based upon [one or more] deliveries. You should know the price of the product when you validated the quotation and at worst when you receive the goods so you can update the price on the move. Indeed, that is my point. With respect to promotions, sale_promotion is only for sales and not purchases. It seems that it should be neutral, but I imagine you suggest in this case that a purchase_promotion module be devised -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/b9289fd0-0c4d-a2eb-29c7-1324702fbb29%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-27 22:27, Richard PALO wrote: > > So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is > > there for information. > > > > ?? I thought that stock receptions used the order prices (not the invoiced > price) for stock > valuation on the stock move. Has this changed, or do I misunderstand the > workflow? > That is, it is frequent here to have invoices based upon [one or more] > deliveries. You should know the price of the product when you validated the quotation and at worst when you receive the goods so you can update the price on the move. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171027231248.GA6037%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
Le 26/10/2017 à 10:09, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-26 07:19, Richard PALO wrote: Le 25/10/2017 à 13:57, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-25 13:47, Richard PALO wrote: I believe there should be some additional things to consider, typically for suppliers where instead of communicating net prices to their [professional] clients, there are: We don't try to compute instead of the supplier because you do not know how they compute and any way, it is not needed. The current supplier price list per quantity is good enough for approximation. I don't understand what you say here. You can not compute in place of the supplier because you will compute wrong. Also supplier will mostly never tell you what computation they do. Well, I guess we disagree on this point. A 'sale' is an *agreement* on the 'price' of *the* 'article'. Frequently the supplier agreement is based on such a formula as mentioned prior. 1. Fixed reductions : typically by category of product. (e.g. public price - 50%) Supported by sale_promotion This is not the same, promotion is only a punctual reduction, either global or by specific line on the invoice... it is not 'permanent' like the habitual price list conditions are. No sale promotion are not necessary limited in time. The start/end date are optional. What I meant is that a sale 'promotion' is over and above the habitual supplier agreement, and that the existing invoice reduction scheme seems to handle this okay. 2. Compound reductions : e.g. 35% + 15% => (public price * (100%-35%)) * (100%-15%) Supported by price list I see the formula possibility with hard coded coefficients, but I can't seem to get the price list to work at all on suppliers anyway... it simply igores it and uses only the price_unit value on the suppliers form of the product. No price list are not for supplier on purpose. (though I wonder if the patches for issue3797 may cause any problem here?) Already manage: https://codereview.tryton.org/40731002/diff/60001/purchase.py#newcode1139 By the way, I tried the standard approach... Purchase order -> reception -> Invoice and directly with invoice (which loses the supplier specifics from issue3797), but neither seem to understand the supplier price list as configued on the supplier price list as it seems to be only for 'sales' and not 'purchases'. Now if you really want it you can create a custom module purchase_price_list, it will be very easy to implement. Ah, this is indeed the issue I encounter I guess :-( Will need to do this asap! It is primordial to support these on price lists for suppliers as it is unacceptable to force entering line by line standard supplier conditions on articles purchased. There may be hundreds or thousands of lines per month to enter! The forms are already way too verbose for any real-life volume. So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is there for information. ?? I thought that stock receptions used the order prices (not the invoiced price) for stock valuation on the stock move. Has this changed, or do I misunderstand the workflow? That is, it is frequent here to have invoices based upon [one or more] deliveries. -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/4c7c5faa-f94d-80cd-ff97-dec29f551215%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-26 07:19, Richard PALO wrote: > Le 25/10/2017 à 13:57, Cédric Krier a écrit : > > On 2017-10-25 13:47, Richard PALO wrote: > >> I believe there should be some additional things to consider, typically > >> for suppliers > >> where instead of communicating net prices to their [professional] clients, > >> there are: > > > > We don't try to compute instead of the supplier because you do not know > > how they compute and any way, it is not needed. The current supplier > > price list per quantity is good enough for approximation. > > > > I don't understand what you say here. You can not compute in place of the supplier because you will compute wrong. Also supplier will mostly never tell you what computation they do. > >> 1. Fixed reductions : typically by category of product. (e.g. public price > >> - 50%) > > > > Supported by sale_promotion > > > This is not the same, promotion is only a punctual reduction, either global > or by specific > line on the invoice... it is not 'permanent' like the habitual price list > conditions are. No sale promotion are not necessary limited in time. The start/end date are optional. > >> 2. Compound reductions : e.g. 35% + 15% => (public price * (100%-35%)) * > >> (100%-15%) > > > > Supported by price list > > > I see the formula possibility with hard coded coefficients, but I can't seem > to get the price > list to work at all on suppliers anyway... it simply igores it and uses only > the price_unit > value on the suppliers form of the product. No price list are not for supplier on purpose. > (though I wonder if the patches for issue3797 may cause any problem > here?) Already manage: https://codereview.tryton.org/40731002/diff/60001/purchase.py#newcode1139 > By the way, I tried the standard approach... Purchase order -> reception -> > Invoice > and directly with invoice (which loses the supplier specifics from > issue3797), but neither > seem to understand the supplier price list as configued on the supplier price > list as it seems > to be only for 'sales' and not 'purchases'. Now if you really want it you can create a custom module purchase_price_list, it will be very easy to implement. > It is primordial to support these on price lists for suppliers as it is > unacceptable > to force entering line by line standard supplier conditions on articles > purchased. > > There may be hundreds or thousands of lines per month to enter! The forms are > already > way too verbose for any real-life volume. So do not fill it. You do not need to have the supplier price, it is there for information. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171026080917.GG3623%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
I believe as well that supplier purchase categories could or should probably relate to purchase.product_supplier as opposed to being dumped on product.template cheers -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/9c2c41a3-3130-f427-9b30-7c07b6e19d0f%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
Le 25/10/2017 à 13:57, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-25 13:47, Richard PALO wrote: I believe there should be some additional things to consider, typically for suppliers where instead of communicating net prices to their [professional] clients, there are: We don't try to compute instead of the supplier because you do not know how they compute and any way, it is not needed. The current supplier price list per quantity is good enough for approximation. I don't understand what you say here. 1. Fixed reductions : typically by category of product. (e.g. public price - 50%) Supported by sale_promotion This is not the same, promotion is only a punctual reduction, either global or by specific line on the invoice... it is not 'permanent' like the habitual price list conditions are. 2. Compound reductions : e.g. 35% + 15% => (public price * (100%-35%)) * (100%-15%) Supported by price list I see the formula possibility with hard coded coefficients, but I can't seem to get the price list to work at all on suppliers anyway... it simply igores it and uses only the price_unit value on the suppliers form of the product. (though I wonder if the patches for issue3797 may cause any problem here?) 3. There may be as well volume discounts (in absence of a different article reference number) Supported by sale_promotion again, not the same as with 1. 4. I understand there may be fixed price reductions too (that is, not a percentage) in the currency used, e.g. 1€ (or 1£ or 1€) or what have you... Also supported by price list and sale_promotion even if it is highly doubtable because of the currency. same as 2. By the way, I tried the standard approach... Purchase order -> reception -> Invoice and directly with invoice (which loses the supplier specifics from issue3797), but neither seem to understand the supplier price list as configued on the supplier price list as it seems to be only for 'sales' and not 'purchases'. It is primordial to support these on price lists for suppliers as it is unacceptable to force entering line by line standard supplier conditions on articles purchased. There may be hundreds or thousands of lines per month to enter! The forms are already way too verbose for any real-life volume. -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/792dc140-e197-0542-a2c5-8c14c5352a05%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-25 13:47, Richard PALO wrote: > I believe there should be some additional things to consider, typically for > suppliers > where instead of communicating net prices to their [professional] clients, > there are: We don't try to compute instead of the supplier because you do not know how they compute and any way, it is not needed. The current supplier price list per quantity is good enough for approximation. > 1. Fixed reductions : typically by category of product. (e.g. public price - > 50%) Supported by sale_promotion > 2. Compound reductions : e.g. 35% + 15% => (public price * (100%-35%)) * > (100%-15%) Supported by price list > 3. There may be as well volume discounts (in absence of a different article > reference number) Supported by sale_promotion > 4. I understand there may be fixed price reductions too (that is, not a > percentage) in the > currency used, e.g. 1€ (or 1£ or 1€) or what have you... Also supported by price list and sale_promotion even if it is highly doubtable because of the currency. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171025115755.GX3623%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
Le 25/10/2017 à 10:43, Cédric Krier a écrit : On 2017-10-24 08:29, Gonzalo wrote: The problem is complex, I will try to explain it the best I can. We are trying to use Tryton + GNU Health for a clinic. The clinic has a kind of subscription/insurance where you paid an amount per month and you get an amount of services to use (for example, 3 medical consultation free...). So should be able to know the amount of this products/services uses by a person in the last month, and the price will depend on this. To make things more complicated, the subscription can be per family too, i.e., if your son uses the total of medical consultation that you had free, you will have to pay. I tried to use price_list but I don't understand how it works. Anyway, I think you can’t consider the historic with that. No price list is really not the right solution. I think you should automatically append to the invoices deduction line with negative line for each product that is eligible for the deduction. I believe there should be some additional things to consider, typically for suppliers where instead of communicating net prices to their [professional] clients, there are: 1. Fixed reductions : typically by category of product. (e.g. public price - 50%) 2. Compound reductions : e.g. 35% + 15% => (public price * (100%-35%)) * (100%-15%) 3. There may be as well volume discounts (in absence of a different article reference number) 4. I understand there may be fixed price reductions too (that is, not a percentage) in the currency used, e.g. 1€ (or 1£ or 1€) or what have you... In these cases, the public list price is communicated when updated, as are the reduction coefficients, according to what is negotiated. There is, therefore, an impact on the price list... Naturally a broker may have this on both supplier and client price lists. It seems that currently the pricing and price list schemas don't deal with these common practices. cheers, -- Richard PALO -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/635d2cf3-7233-bfcc-9c1e-fc368b1c79c3%40free.fr.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-25 10:30, Sergi Almacellas Abellana wrote: > El 24/10/17 a les 17:29, Gonzalo ha escrit: > > So should be able to know the amount of this products/services uses by a > > person in the last month, and the price will depend on this. > > The sale_promotion [2] module can be used to generate a promotion on the > sales. One option is to generate a promotion code on each subscription > consumption. Subscription codes can be filled by on_change when setting > the party. Promotion will not ensure that it applies only for the quantity per month of each products. > > To make things more complicated, the subscription can be per family too, > > i.e., if your son uses the total of medical consultation that you had free, > > you will have to pay. > > > That will be a fact of only selecting the promotion, when used by one of > the members of the familty. Indeed I think the subscription should be linked to the sale and invoice to know what to apply. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171025085356.GV3623%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
On 2017-10-24 08:29, Gonzalo wrote: > The problem is complex, I will try to explain it the best I can. > We are trying to use Tryton + GNU Health for a clinic. The clinic has > a kind of subscription/insurance where you paid an amount per month > and you get an amount of services to use (for example, 3 medical > consultation free...). > So should be able to know the amount of this products/services uses by > a person in the last month, and the price will depend on this. > > To make things more complicated, the subscription can be per family > too, i.e., if your son uses the total of medical consultation that you > had free, you will have to pay. > > I tried to use price_list but I don't understand how it works. Anyway, > I think you can’t consider the historic with that. No price list is really not the right solution. I think you should automatically append to the invoices deduction line with negative line for each product that is eligible for the deduction. -- Cédric Krier - B2CK SPRL Email/Jabber: cedric.kr...@b2ck.com Tel: +32 472 54 46 59 Website: http://www.b2ck.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/20171025084331.GT3623%40kei.
Re: [tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
El 24/10/17 a les 17:29, Gonzalo ha escrit: First, sorry for my english. The problem is complex, I will try to explain it the best I can. We are trying to use Tryton + GNU Health for a clinic. The clinic has a kind of subscription/insurance where you paid an amount per month and you get an amount of services to use (for example, 3 medical consultation free...). The sale_subscription [1] module can be used to generate a montlhy invoice for invoicing the insurance. So should be able to know the amount of this products/services uses by a person in the last month, and the price will depend on this. > The sale_promotion [2] module can be used to generate a promotion on the sales. One option is to generate a promotion code on each subscription consumption. Subscription codes can be filled by on_change when setting the party. To make things more complicated, the subscription can be per family too, i.e., if your son uses the total of medical consultation that you had free, you will have to pay. That will be a fact of only selecting the promotion, when used by one of the members of the familty. Hope it helps. [1] http://doc.tryton.org/4.4/modules/sale_subscription/doc/index.html [2] http://doc.tryton.org/4.4/modules/sale_promotion/doc/index.html -- Sergi Almacellas Abellana www.koolpi.com Twitter: @pokoli_srk -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/92d951b9-c655-16ba-63e4-ffe84bf3980b%40koolpi.com.
[tryton] Discount per family and per amount of products in a month
First, sorry for my english. The problem is complex, I will try to explain it the best I can. We are trying to use Tryton + GNU Health for a clinic. The clinic has a kind of subscription/insurance where you paid an amount per month and you get an amount of services to use (for example, 3 medical consultation free...). So should be able to know the amount of this products/services uses by a person in the last month, and the price will depend on this. To make things more complicated, the subscription can be per family too, i.e., if your son uses the total of medical consultation that you had free, you will have to pay. I tried to use price_list but I don't understand how it works. Anyway, I think you can’t consider the historic with that. Thanks for your time -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "tryton" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tryton/dd8c14fd-d061-410e-af48-f2dd6ff84260%40googlegroups.com.
