Desktop Team 20090106 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Hi,

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can find them 
along with activity reports here: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-06

Cheers, Rick


== Present ==

  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * David Barth (davidbarth)
  * Ted Gould (tedg)

== Actions from this meeting ==
  ACTION rickspencer3: Post Dx components table to wiki.ubuntu.com

  ACTION Riddell: Address inaccuracies in the Dx Component table (kwin 
has nothing to do with brightness)

  ACTION davidbarth: Specify back up plan for unpatched applications 
that use actions/timeouts

  ACTION rickspencer3, davidbarth, Riddell: specify support for Kubuntu 
and/or KDE apps running in GNOME expected for Jaunty

  ACTION rickspencer3: replace Konversation with Quassel on tracked 
components table

  ACTION  davidbarth: supply dates for when key apps (NM) will be 
patched to work with new notification daemon

  ACTION  asac to initiate major change process for libnotify and get 
patch on track for upstream inclusion

  ACTION  All: all specs should be drafted by end of this week

  ACTION  all: everyone to add some pet-bugs by next meeting

== Dx integration ==
Review components and timelines. A lengthy discussion ensued:
  * Kubuntu/KDE app plans were not sufficiently fleshed out to assess 
status. This should be resolved by the next meeting.

  * Messaging indicator work will include the indicator itself, as well 
as well as patched evolution and pidgin. Other apps will have to be 
patched by upstream/community. The Dx team will provide documentation 
and examples to facilitate this, though this will be available later in 
the cycle.

  * How to handle notifications that include an action and/or a timeout 
was not determined. This needs to be clarified asap.

== Meeting time ==
Did not have time to discuss

== Specs ==
  * All specs should be drafted by eow
  * Status of all Jaunty specs discussed and updated
  * List of Jaunty blueprints available here: 
https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty

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Desktop Team Weekly Summary, 2009-01-13

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes of the weekly meeting and activity reports. This 
can also be found here: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-13

NB: The currently scheduled ongoing time for this meeting is Tuesdays at 
16:30 UTC.

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
  * Martin Pitt (pitti) - holiday

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * Release Status
  * Review activity reports
  * Presentations in 2009
  * Move meeting back to 16:00 UTC?
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * Dx components table - davidbarth will update, so the following items 
are blocked until then
   * rickspencer3: Post Dx components table to wiki.ubuntu.com
   * Riddell: Address inaccuracies in the Dx Component table (kwin has 
nothing to do with brightness)
   * rickspencer3: replace Konversation with Quassel on tracked 
components table
   * davidbarth: supply dates for when key apps (NM) will be patched to 
work with new notification daemon

  * Action: davidbarth: Specify back up plan for unpatched applications 
that use actions/timeouts
   * Result: Plan is to patch existing notification daemon so that it 
only responds to the new notification daemon. Then when the new daemon 
receives a notification it can't handle, it passes the notification 
along to the old daemon to handle. Will review idea with seb128.

  * Action: rickspencer3, davidbarth, Riddell: specify support for 
Kubuntu and/or KDE apps running in GNOME expected for Jaunty
   * Result: Tentative Dx plans follow:
* Dx will evaluate the feasibility of creating a Kubuntu messaging 
indicator around the end of January.
* Dx will implement notifications as well as patch key applications 
to work with it in Kubuntu during Jaunty. This includes modifying 
knotify and Amarok, as well as working with KDE community to define 
correct UI.
* Jonathon will (continue to) be available to consult and answer 
questions regarding devel/packaging environment for KDE4.x

  *  Action: asac to initiate major change process for libnotify and get 
patch on track for upstream inclusion
   * Result: asac: patch landed upstream; firefox-3.2 package with that 
feature is in ~fta PPA for initial consumption/testing for Dx team. 
Next: backport to "old" branches (e.g. firefox 3.1, 3.0) and once we 
have samples for that send the major change process

  * Action: all: all specs should be drafted by end of this week
   * Result: Five specs aren't approved yet.
* Arne folding in input from MPT for both of his.
* asac to provide details for jaunty-desktop-network-changing
* seb128 to follow up with tedg regarding gdm upgrade

  * Action: everyone to add some pet-bugs by next meeting
   * Result: This was not done by everyone. Carrying this action over to 
next week. Everyone should do this by Friday.

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * asac to clean up jaunty-desktop-network-changing wiki; draft 
expected behavior and test cases
  * everyone tag 10 pet bugs by Friday
  * rickspencer3 to follow up with Maria regarding info for presenters

== Presentations in 2009 ==
No one is planning any presentations in 2009. Rick to follow up with 
Maria to ensure that she is getting the info that she needs.

== Move meeting back to 16:00 UTC? ==
No. Meeting stays at 16:30 UTC.

== Other Business ==
  * Welcome tkamppeter to desktop team meetings.
  * Riddell brought up that he is blocked on a few items by MIR process. 
Asac helping to resolve.

== Activity reports ==
=== Alexander Sack ===
 Mozilla 
  * nspr/nss SONAME mini-transition
   * no-change upload for 24 packages and pinged maintainers for a few
   others
   * next: fix a few build failures uncovered by this transition
  * xulrunner libnotify landing upstream and in mozillateam
  xulrunner-1.9.2 packaging branch; demo "firefox-3.2" packages are
  available in ~fta PPA.
   * started to backport patch to 1.9 branch
  * clarify status of semi-EOL mozilla 1.8.1 branch; seems they are
  committed to at least get the patches we (distros/other devs)
  backport approved for landing; later there might be a chance that we
  take over driver status of those branches - like we did for 1.8.0.
  * porting more security patches from 1.9 to 1.8.1/0 branches
  * coordinated with other distros (not all have answered); seems we
  can continue for now with collaborative maintenance of 1.8 branch.
  * helped debian security team in getting latest 1.8.0 backports
  released to stable-security for xulrunner (iceape, icedove was
  already done before).

=== Arne Goetje ===
  * discussion with mpt about the language-selector GUI. Mockups are in 
the spec. (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyLanguageSelectorImprovements)
  * 

Please Comment: Proposal to change the name of Applications -> Add/Remove...

[Rick Spencer]

All -

A proposal has been put forward to change the name of the 
"Add/Remove..." menu item.

Problem:
Platforms such as iPhone and Android have given users the expectation 
that there is a "place" that they can to in order to install new 
software. Ubuntu has good functionality for this, but the name 
"Add/Remove..." is not in line with users' expectations because it isn't 
a "place".

Solution:
Change the name of "Add/Remove..." to "Software Library".

Thoughts?

Cheers, Rick

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Re: Please Comment: Proposal to change the name of Applications -> Add/Remove...

[Rick Spencer]

On 01/15/2009 10:46 AM, Aaron Toponce wrote:
> Except those who are coming from Windows, which is a larger userbase
> than those coming from the iPhone or Android markets, are used to the
> Add/Remove programs in the Control Panel.
Actually, this has gotten kind of muddled in Windows. It is now 
something called "Programs and Features", which is yet another control 
panel that launches wizards for individual applications that you may 
have installed (or can install depending if you are in a corporate 
environment that supports it).

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Please Comment: Proposal to change the name of Applications -> Add/Remove...

[Rick Spencer]

On 01/15/2009 10:53 AM, Oliver Grawert wrote:
> i doubt she would have that thorough understanding from an opaque name
> like "software library" 
Interesting, so you feel that "software library" is opaque. Perhaps 
there is another "place" name that would have worked for her?

Cheers, Rick

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Re: Please Comment: Proposal to change the name of Applications -> Add/Remove...

[Rick Spencer]

On 01/15/2009 10:29 AM, Rick Spencer wrote:
> All -
> 
> A proposal has been put forward to change the name of the 
> "Add/Remove..." menu item.
> 
> Problem:
> Platforms such as iPhone and Android have given users the expectation 
> that there is a "place" that they can to in order to install new 
> software. Ubuntu has good functionality for this, but the name 
> "Add/Remove..." is not in line with users' expectations because it isn't 
> a "place".
> 
> Solution:
> Change the name of "Add/Remove..." to "Software Library".
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> Cheers, Rick
> 
I'd like to add an important element to the rationale and see if it 
impacts anyones thoughts.

I think the proposal addresses more than a usability problem, I think it 
was put forth also to capitalize on a perception opportunity. In other 
words, perhaps having a "place" to go is something that users think is 
rather cool. We have such a place, but we don't position it as such.

Does this change anyone's thoughts regarding the proposal?

Cheers, Rick

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Desktop Team Weekly Summary, 2009-01-20

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes of the weekly meeting and activity reports. This 
can also be found here: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-20

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce) - family emergency

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * Berlin Sprint activities
  * Presenting at conferences
  * "Changing Add/Remove..."
  * [[http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/|Sponsoring Overview 
update]]
  * Release Status
   * Dx Support
   * Open Office
   * Kubuntu
   * New GDM (PPA and Migration)
   * Device Kit
   * Pervasive Networking
   * Apport (hooks and backend)
   * Bug squash
   * Font selector GUI
   * xorg.conf GUI
  * Review activity reports
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
   * Action: asac to clean up jaunty-desktop-network-changing wiki; 
draft expected behavior and test cases
* Result: Mostly done, will go through and file bugs on apps that 
are misbehaving.
   * Action: everyone tag 10 pet bugs by Friday
* Result: all done, except Bryce. Some have tagged < 10
   * Action: rickspencer3 to follow up with Maria regarding info for 
presenters
* Result: Canonical would like to encourage participation and 
presenting at conferences. Rick to discuss with team members and 
encourage ideas.

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ArneGoetje, Seb128, all: set specs to "pending approval" so that 
Martin can sign off/provide feedback if still not done.
  * bryce: tag 10 pet bugs
  * rickspencer3: follow up on status of meeting attendance. What 
action, if any, is necessary for people to start signing up and attending?
  * rickspencer3: provide Jane and Chris community/team feedback 
regarding Add/Remove... renaming.
  * seb128: Get new GDM into universe this week.
  * rickspencer3: consolidate list of sprint topics, send to all along 
with other scheduled topics.

== Presentations ==
Canonical would like to encourage participation and presenting at 
conferences. Rick to discuss with team members and encourage ideas.

== Changing the Add/Remove ... ==
The team and community are overall supportive of the notion of changing 
the label as long as:
  1. Usable - users know what it is, and existing users aren't confused.
  2. Translatable
  3. Cooler than "Add/Remove..."
  4. Doesn't make the menu look bad, for example, by being too long
We should test whatever we come up with through user testing, or seb128 
could even integrate it into an alpha.

== Berlin Sprint ==
We discussed possible topics for the upcoming sprint. These are all the 
*proposed* topics only at this point:
  1. fix hotkey
  2. fix beamer/projector
  3. fix suspend/resume for everyone's laptop
  4. fix the intel driver in xorg for i855, 915 and 945 first
  5. fix machines that crash when user switching
  6. Session with Seb128 and Pitti on efficient bug management
  7. Work with Dx team to install new stuff on our laptops
  8. Fixing bugs where it is useful to pick brains of our colleagues
  9. Finish a great deal of language selector
  10. fixing bugs in apps that dont behave properly on network changes
  11. making sure our mysql changes get agreed and in
  12. measure everyone's desktop startup speed and work on making them 
faster
  13. Try not allowing GNOME Settings Deamon to force DPI of 96, even if 
overriding value in xorg.cof

== Release Status ==
=== Dx Support ===
davidbarth provided an update of the Dx team status:
  * mpt has reviewed all of main and universe. davidbarth believes they 
can patch all applications that use actions in time for Jaunty.
  * The last POR regarding handling notifications with actions had to be 
revisited. The Dx team has a recommendation, but it was not covered in 
this meeting.
  * Will drop patches patched applications as they are patched.
  * Already have good support from Mozilla (thanks to asac).
  * More on message indicator expected next week, including API
=== New GDM (Universe and Migration) ===
  * seb128 will upload the new GDM to universe this week.
  * no progress on migrations yet (not slated for Jaunty)

=== Device Kit ===
  * Latest DK and DK-power are in universe
  * Ted to package new GPM in a PPA, needs to work on his packaging branch
  * Jaunty will use version 2.24.3 of GPM, 2.25 requires new GPM, which 
is not ready

== Activity reports ==
  * All done on time

== Other Business ==
  * seb128 informs us that two things were removed from Alpha CD and 
moved to supported due to space constraints:
   * nautilus-cd-burner (brasero fulfills all the requirements)
   * deskbar-applet tracker to supported (disabled by default)
  * seb128 brings up that it might be time to revisit GNOME Settings 

Desktop Team Weekly Summary, 2009-01-27

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes of the weekly meeting and activity reports. This 
can also be found here: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-27

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)

== Apologies ==
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * sprint topics
  * Add/Remove...
  * Pet bug status
  * Language selector
  * Release Status
  * Review activity reports
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * Action: ArneGoetje, Seb128, all: set specs to "pending approval" so 
that Martin can sign off/provide feedback if still not done.
   * Result Arne: moved spec to pending just before the meeting. pitti 
to review asap
   * Result asac: NM spec doesn't really have an implementer, so will 
link to bugs and set to pending reviews
  * Action: bryce: tag 10 pet bugs
   * Result: has tagged pet bugs
  * Action: rickspencer3: follow up on status of meeting attendance. 
What action, if any, is necessary for people to start signing up and 
attending?
   * Result: Ensure that your attendance is recorded on the conference 
attendance wiki. These will most likely be mass Ok's at upcoming 
managers' meeting. If you need to get it done before, ping line manager 
or randa.
  * Action: rickspencer3: provide Jane and Chris community/team feedback 
regarding Add/Remove... renaming.
   * Result: Bounced back decision to rickspencer3.
  * Action: seb128: Get new GDM into universe this week.
   * Result: Done
  * Action: rickspencer3: consolidate list of sprint topics, send to all 
along with other scheduled topics.
   * Result: see internal sprint wiki

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up on status of security review for MIR
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to work with mvo/robbiew to get the work for 
Language selector done for Jaunty, community involvement?
  * ACTION: pitti to discuss costs and requirements of graphical non-X 
based installers with cjwatson
  * ACTION: pitti/asac to respond to MIR for Riddel/Kubuntu
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to compile spec work status and resend

== Sprint Topics ==
  * Dx: We will work with them to get a few of their features working at 
the sprint
  * Bug management: pitti/Seb128 to prepare workshop on efficient bug 
management
  * bryce wanted to ensure that his items for the sprint made it onto 
the wiki (they did)
  * pitti notes that the sprint agenda is quite full

== Add/Remove... ==
  * rickspencer3 thinks we should focus on this holistically in Jaunty +1
  * General agreement that there is no great name to change 
Add/Remove... to that conforms to requirements identified in the last 
meeting.
  * General agreement that there is a lack of clarity on the problem 
that such a name change would solve.
  * rickspencer3 will propose a more holistic approach to this problem 
in Jaunty +1 via blueprint and UDS. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareLibrary

== Pet Bug Status ==
  * A few team members have started to fix pet bugs.
  * rickspencer3 encouraged team to work on these and work together to 
make time for them, as it is meant to be a benefit of Jaunty cycle that 
there is time to work on these.

== Language selector ==
  * mvo wants to move responsibility to our team, can anyone help Arne 
with it in Jaunty?
  * no one on the desktop team has the bandwidth to pick this up. 
rickspencer3 will discuss with robbiew and mvo. Also, the idea of 
inviting a community member to participate was brought up.

== Release Status ==
  * As an experiment in tracking status on feature work, everyone sent 
in an update on individual specification work items:
|| who || done || postponed || started || blocked || not started || total ||
|| Riddell || 4 || 0 || 4 || 7 || 9 || 24 ||
|| asac || 2 || 1 || 2 || 0 || 3 || 8 ||
|| bryce || 4 || 0 || 5 || 1 || 2 || 12 ||
|| calc || 2 || 0 || 3 || 1 || 1 || 7 ||
|| pitti || 3 || 2 || 1 || 4 || 6 || 16 ||
|| seb128 || 1 || 0 || 1 || 2 || 1 || 5 ||
|| ArneGoetje || 0 || 0 || 0 || 0 || 1 || 1 ||
|| || 16 || 3 || 16 || 15 || 23 || 73 ||
  * Note that most "blocked" items refer to work items for helping other 
teams with certain tasks, and those teams have not yet asked for that 
help. Therefore, blocked status is not necessarily bad.
  * Note that this list only includes work captured in blueprints. 
Normal maintainer work, bugs, etc... are not captured here.
  * The full list is here: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-01-27/WorkItems

== gtk directfb ==
  * directfb is no longer supported by upstream. It is buggy and very 
time consuming to build.
  * Nothing in Ubuntu currently depends on it.
  * The server team would like to use GTK d-i graphical installer for 
9.04, which does depend on directfb.

Desktop Team 20090217 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find 
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-02-17

For minutes of previous meetings, please see DesktopTeam/Meeting.

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==

== Agenda ==

  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * NS/MI Status
  * Feature Freeze Readiness
  * Google Protocol Buffers/Main Inclusion
  * Staffing: Ken VanDine
  * Release Bugs
  * [[http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/|Sponsoring Overview 
update]]
  * Release Status
  * Review activity reports
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * ACTION: Martin to start discussion with Steve George, Colin Watson, 
and Rick Clark about requirements for graphical installer
   * Result: Martin to follow up after feature freeze for possible 
post-Jaunty consideration.
  * ACTION: Bryce to triage https://launchpad.net/bugs/309482
   * Result: Bryce has been tracking. Backtrace is now available, 
continuing investigation.
  * ACTION: Rick to clarify work items list (how to keep it up to date, 
and which things should be in in it)
   * Result: Rick sent a mail with some details, but hasn't been in the 
office to follow up

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to schedule pitti kenvandine seb128 call for Friday
  * ACTION: pitti to follow up with ArneGoetje tomorrow regarding the 
status of language selector gui, and will make the call regarding 
in/out/FFE.
  * ACTION: bryce to re-sponsor xorg.conf editor in time for feature 
freeze.
  * ACTION: Riddell to move individual work items that will not get done 
for Jaunty to new blueprints/specs for later releases.
  * ACTION: pitti to complete blueprint for straciatella

== NS/MI Status ==
  * Uploads ongoing all day today, possibly into tomorrow. A lot related 
activity on #dx.
  * Some ambiguity about how to handle upgrades (do upgrades replace the 
existing notification system?). This will likely require a post feature 
freeze exception. There is similar code in Intrepid for fusa.

== Feature Freeze Readiness ==
Reviewed specs and other work. In general, on track for feature freeze, 
aside from possible exceptions below.
=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
  * Language selector still needs some work. It may be doable to upload 
by FF, but an exception may be required.
  * ACTION: pitti to follow up with ArneGoetje tomorrow regarding the 
start of the feature, and will make the call regarding in/out/FFE.

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===
  * Lots of important work, but nothing bounded by FF.

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===
 Distro Work 
  * Sponsoring:  2 hrs xkeyboard-config, other X packages

 Xorg Work 
  * Worked more on historical driver pages - converted script to python
  * Merged -ati 6.10.99.0
  * Mega triaging of xorg, moving bugs to proper packages
   Reduced ~200 bugs in xorg to 18
  * Mega triaging of xkeyboard-config bugs, esp. bugs with patches or
   fixed upstream
  * Upload fix to 217908 for -openchrome
  * Uploaded xorg-options-editor into Universe
  * Validated security fix for fglrx #323327

 Misc 
  * Return home from sprint
  * File expenses from Berlin trip
  * Holiday Monday Feb 16th

 2-week Plan 
  * xorg.conf Backup/Recovery work
  * XSmoke testing
  * Integrate apport support into bulletproof-x mode
  * Focus on my assigned bugs list, bugs fixed upstream, and bug reports
   with patches attached.

 Blueprint Status 
  * Assist video driver upstreams and vendors with implementing KMS
support. :complete
  * Support the Dx team by consulting and helping with low level
packages. :complete
  * Create backend xorg.conf parser/writer :complete
  * Implement xorg.conf Validator :complete
  * Implement xorg.conf Options Data Store (man pages) :complete
  * Implement xorg.conf gui - GTK :started
  * Implement xorg.conf gui - Qt :not-started
  * Implement xorg.conf backup/restore functionality :started
  * Create X Historical Package Pages :started
  * Create X Smoke Tests :started
  * Verify EXA acceptance criteria met by Alpha-5 :started
  * Search help.ubuntu.com/wiki.ubuntu.com for ctrl-alt-backspace :started

=== Chris Cheney (calc) ===
* Uploaded openoffice.org 1:3.0.1-1ubuntu2 to jaunty
* Working on ooo split build packaging for jaunty ppa
* Weekly OOo Release Status Meetings
* Weekly desktop team meeting
* Lots of OOo bug triage
* Sun OOo Meeting : Feb 8 - Feb 12
* Feb 16 - US National Holiday

=== Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) ===
  * Kubuntu specs for Jaunty are lists of features tbd. FF dependent 
ones are done.
  * ACTION: Riddell to move individual work items that will not get done 
for Jaunty to new blueprints/specs for later releases.

=== M

Re: gnome-control-center

[Rick Spencer]

On 02/23/2009 05:29 AM, Matthew East wrote:
> I wonder if it would be appropriate for inclusion of
> gnome-control-center to be considered again for Jaunty.
> 
> I still think that the points made in my email below remain valid in
> Jaunty - for me the absence of a structured preferences menu is the
> main problem that stands out at me from Ubuntu's otherwise awesome
> desktop. There wasn't really a very comprehensive discussion of the
> issues when I raised this back in August 2008.
> 
> Oliver raised an objection that it takes 30 seconds for control-center
> to open, but I've tried it now on a few different computers and it
> always opens promptly: do we have any idea whether the problem Oliver
> experienced is common or a rare bug on certain hardware? In any event,
> perhaps it is solved now that 6 months further development has
> occurred.
> 
> Do other members of the desktop team have views on this issue?
> 
I find access to the various settings applications to be rather tedious 
and indirect through the gnome-control-center, so I prefer the way that 
Ubuntu does it (simply with the menus).

However, that's mho, I'm interested in other thoughts on the topic.


Also, for completeness, note that the control center is installed, by 
there is no GUI way to access it.

Cheers, Rick

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Desktop Team 20090224 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find 
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-02-24

For minutes of previous meetings, please see DesktopTeam/Meeting.

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)

== Apologies ==

  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  - vacation

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * Release Bugs/Release Status
  * [[http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/|Sponsoring Overview 
update]]
  * Performance Reviews and Goals
  * All Hands Presentations
  * rickspencer3 weekly goals
  * 9.04 Feature List
  * Review activity reports
  * enable metacity compositor by default? just on specific hardware? (asac)

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to schedule pitti kenvandine seb128 call for Friday
   * Result: Done
  * ACTION: pitti to follow up with ArneGoetje tomorrow regarding the 
start of the feature, and will make the call regarding in/out/FFE.
   * Result: discussed with Arne and Michael; this can land until UIF, 
so "go".
  * ACTION: bryce to re-sponsor xorg.conf editor in time for feature freeze.
   * Result: done
  * ACTION: Riddell to move individual work items that will not get done 
for Jaunty to new blueprints/specs for later releases.
   * Result: Moved individual work items to 
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Todo.
  * ACTION: pitti to complete blueprint for straciatella
   * Result: Done, in fact implemented 
(http://martinpitt.wordpress.com/2009/02/23/the-stracciatella-gnome-session/#comment-268)

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ACTION: Desktop team to revisit work items and adjust items that are 
"noise", or set items to postponed that obviously won't get done.
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to comment the repost the work items list, and 
to include comments with some suggestions, etc..
  * ACTION: bryce to set up an FFE for -ati 6.12.0, which will bring 
R6xx/7xx support.
  * ACTION: kenvandine to work with Dx team to identify changes for UIF, 
and also changes that might require a UIFE.
  * ACTION: Desktop team to review current goals and update as needed. 
Feel free to update outside the normal web site if it's easier to do so.
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to send reminder mail with appropriate info to 
desktop team to trigger all hands presentation submissions.
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up with design team regarding artwork 
and UIF dates
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to ask foundations team for measure of improved 
boot time for feature list
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to start a wiki page for brainstorming features 
for marketing
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up with dholbach wrt sponsoring and 
what the team should be doing
  * ACTION: kenvandine to log a bug on the look and feel of 
notifications on a non-composited desktop and follow up with Dx team.

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
  * As of 23:30 UTC 2009-02-23, we have no opened alpha-5 milestoned bugs.
  * asac working on Launchpad bug 199140 in network-manager "Network 
manager shows and connects to virtual interfaces" [High,Triaged] 
https://launchpad.net/bugs/199140
  * Launchpad bug 331618 in firefox-3.0 "make new tab behaviour 
consistent in Firefox" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/331618 
is blocked until we get feedback from firefox regarding the proposed change.

=== Work Item Numbers ===
  * When updating the work item page, please follow the syntax exactly, 
as the script for extracting the stats is brittle. 
(https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-02-24/WorkItems).
  * While we are making good progress, Wwe are above the trend line for 
beta freeze. That means that we are likely not to get all the work done 
on our list.
  * ACTION: All to revisit work items and adjust items that are "noise", 
or set items to postponed that obviously won't get done.
|| '''date''' || '''done''' || '''postponed''' || '''started''' || 
'''not started''' || '''blocked''' ||
|| 2009-01-27 || 16|| 3|| 16|| 23|| 15 ||
|| 2009-02-10 || 18|| 3|| 17|| 23|| 14 ||
|| 2009-02-17 || 28|| 4|| 16|| 16|| 9 ||
|| 2009-02-24 || 34|| 4|| 12|| 13|| 10 ||
{{attachment:burndown.png}}

=== FFEs ===
  * 331618 make new tab behaviour consistent in Firefox - see release 
status above
  * 329161 Transmission 1.50 should be considered for inclusion in 9.04
Others - this is okayed and underway
  * ACTION: bryce to set up an FFE for -ati 6.12.0, which will bring 
R6xx/7xx support.

=== UI Freeze ===
  * ACTION: kenvandine to work with Dx team to identif

Re: Meeting item: FUSA, passwords vs. session saving

[Rick Spencer]

On 02/27/2009 10:15 AM, Ted Gould wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Chris provided a patch for using PolicyKit and ConsoleKit in the FUSA
> applet that makes it so that if multiple people are logged in, you can
> get a password dialog, and shutdown the system.  The way that this works
> is that it asks ConsoleKit for the shutdown and restart actions and if
> they need a password asks PolicyKit to handle it.
> 
> One of the things that this changes is that we're shutting down using
> ConsoleKit instead of asking GDM to do the shutdown for us.  This means
> that we're not logging out of the session, and doing the equivalent to
> "sudo shutdown -h now" on the command line.  So, if the session manager
> supports saving sessions it won't, as we're not even asking it to.
> 
> This obviously isn't great.  But, this is fixed in the new GDM as it
> will use DBus and so we can get the PK messages from the request to GDM,
> and we can again start asking GDM to do the shutdown/restart for us.
> But, that's a solution for Karmic.
> 
> I feel like today we're given the choice between two bugs:
> 
>   * Don't allow restart/shutdown to work with multiple users
>   * Don't save sessions on restart/shutdown
> 
> I guess I'm writing this to see if anyone has any ideas.  Anyone?
> Perhaps we should discuss these two during the desktop meeting on
> Tuesday?  I'm kinda thinking about going with the password dialog, but I
> think this shouldn't be an individual decision.
> 
>   --Ted
> 
> 
Thanks Ted. I'll add this to the agenda.

Cheers, Rick

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Desktop Team 20090303 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find 
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-03-03

For minutes of previous meetings, please see DesktopTeam/Meeting.

== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)  

== Apologies ==
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter) - holiday

== Agenda ==
Due to the new GNOME release, UIF coming up in two days, and other items, we 
decided to have a short meeting this week. Reviewed outstanding items, and 
briefly touched on release status.

 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * [[http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/|Sponsoring Overview 
update]]
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: Desktop team to revisit work items and adjust items that are 
"noise", or set items to postponed that obviously won't get done.
  * Result: Not done, see below
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to comment the repost the work items list, and to 
include comments with some suggestions, etc..
  * Result: done
 * ACTION: bryce to set up an FFE for -ati 6.12.0, which will bring R6xx/7xx 
support.
  * Result: Done
 * ACTION: kenvandine to work with Dx team to identify changes for UIF, and 
also changes that might require a UIFE.
  * Result: Done, see: 
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=jaunty-uif
 * ACTION: Desktop team to review current goals and update as needed. Feel 
free to update outside the normal web site if it's easier to do so.
  * Result: Some progress, not everyone has revisited.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to send reminder mail with appropriate info to desktop 
team to trigger all hands presentation submissions.
  * Result: This was done by mdz. Note that the deadline is Monday the ninth.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up with design team regarding artwork and 
UIF dates.
  * Result: Done. There are actually three deadline dates that do not line up 
with other freezes, and they are not well defined.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to ask foundations team for measure of improved boot 
time for feature list.
  * Result: The foundations team is already including this. No action 
necessary for desktop team.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to start a wiki page for brainstorming features for 
marketing.
  * Result: rickspencer3 to simply post ideas from last week to the marketing 
team's wiki page.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up with dholbach wrt sponsoring and what the 
team should be doing
  * Result: No progress
 * ACTION: kenvandine to log a bug on the look and feel of notifications on a 
non-composited desktop and follow up with Dx team.
  * Result: Done (LP: #334063)

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to post ideas from last week to the marketing team's 
wiki page.

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
 * pitti is concerned about a lack of movement regarding RC bugs: 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
 * X appears to be shaping up as a hot area for Jaunty in terms of bugs and 
performance.
 * The Dx team may need some UIFE for certain bugs, such as 
https://launchpad.net/bugs/283095

=== Bugs ===
 Alpha 6 Bugs 
= asac =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/199140 : 
High : Fix Committed

 Beta Bugs 
= asac =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-vpnc/+bug/278153 
: Wishlist : Triaged

= bryce =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/313027 : 
Wishlist : Triaged

= calc =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/backport-util-
concurrent/+bug/305790 : High : Incomplete
 
= pitti =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/usplash/+bug/64147 : Low : In 
Progress

 Jaunty Bugs 
= asac =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubufox/+bug/281348 : High : Fix 
Committed
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ca-certificates/+bug/310999 : High 
: Triaged
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bug/323109 : High : 
Triaged
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/+bug/145716 : Medium 
: Triaged
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/328928 : 
Medium : Confirmed

= bryce =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-
intel/+bug/304871 : High : Triaged

= pitti =
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-themes/+bug/335888 : High : 
In Progress
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pyxdg/+bug/3697 : Medium : In 
Progress
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hal-info/+bug/305968 : Undecided 
: Incomplete

=== Exceptions ===
 * https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fi

Re: fontconfig vs. Gnome

[Rick Spencer]

On Thursday 05 March 2009 09:29:42 Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
> Alexander Sack wrote on 05/03/09 13:39:
> >...
> > "Hi, just wanted to tell you that I upgraded to jaunty and now my
> > fonts look great everywhere - on all my  monitors, even in all apps I
> > use. I am so happy that i don't need to fiddle with font configuration
> > - which i previously found to be hidden in the Appearence preference
> > dialog. BTW, I looked there now, but I will just leave the 'Automatic
> > shapes" checkbox enabled as it seems to do the right thing for
> > me. Thanks for your great work!"
> >...
>
> The point is, there are *multiple* better ways of doing that than by
> presenting two options that do exactly the same thing.
>
> Cheers
> --
> Matthew Paul Thomas
> http://mpt.net.nz/
mpt -

Could you please tell us exactly how you think this should work? What is your 
preference for how the user should configure the options?

Cheers, Rick

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Re: fontconfig vs. Gnome

[Rick Spencer]

On Thursday 05 March 2009 11:30:24 Alexander Sack wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 05, 2009 at 06:36:07PM +, Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
> > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Rick Spencer wrote on 05/03/09 17:44:
> > >...
> > > Could you please tell us exactly how you think this should work? What
> > > is your preference for how the user should configure the options?
> > >...
> >
> > If we think the setting recommended by fontconfig is likely good, it
> > should be the radio button selected by default in the Font preferences.
> > For example, if fontconfig recommends subpixel smoothing, "Subpixel
> > smoothing" should be selected by default in the Font preferences.
> >
> > To cater for the case of someone who changed the setting days or weeks
> > ago and isn't sure what to change it back to, the string
> > " (recommended)" could follow the label for whichever option is
> > recommended by fontconfig. For example, if fontconfig recommends Best
> > shapes for your display, that option could appear as "Best shapes
> > (recommended)".
> >
> > If fontconfig allows other useful options not available in the Font
> > preferences (such as a minimum size for anti-aliasing text, or never
> > anti-aliasing kanji), then they should be made available individually in
> > a future release. A take-it-or-leave-it "Automatic" checkbox would not
> > be an obvious way of setting those options either.
>
> Thanks for finally providing some input :). Anyway, I prefer
> incremental changes that bring us forward instead of not doing
> anything because we are blocked on ETOOMUCHTODO, or even
> EITSNOTUNDERSTOOD.
>
> That said, nothing is perfect and there are always ways to do things
> better, its just that you need a plan (and not just an idea) as in the
> end someone has to do the groundwork and implement it.
>
> In the long run gnome should speak fontconfig, I agree, but for now my
> approach seems reasonable, and honestly, its not really bad UI wise
> either. Also we need to learn what particular parts of fontconfig
> users would want to tweak. Offering everything would definitly lead to
> UI bloat. For now, its just automatic, vs. manual and using a checkbox
> for that isn't that bad - I like that and its a good start to build on
> top.
>
> So my suggestion: we do it as I suggested (we can always tweak here and
> there if its really a bad thing) now; then based on the experiences
> and feedback we get out of this, we can discuss and improve and
> finally come up with a perfect gnome UI for this, make a spec out of
> it and implement it.
>
>  - Alexander
Alexander,

This sounds a little complex. Could I (re)suggest that we simply force 
everyone to default to subpixel smoothing in Jaunty? In other words, still 
allow GNOME to override fontconfig, but have force a different option?

Cheers, Rick

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Desktop Team 20090310 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-03-10

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) - traveling

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * 9.10 planning process
  * All Hands Update
  * Release Status, Release Bugs
  * Review activity reports
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to post ideas from last week to the marketing 
team's wiki page.
   * Result: done

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ACTION: seb128 and bryce to investigate 
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/67188 
- problems with setting certain keyboard layouts
  * ACTION: calc and pitti to discuss 
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/305790 - getting certain java based 
build depends for OO to build in the build daemons.
  * ACTION: everyone hasn't already to submit a topic by eow (mandated 
by rickspencer3 :) )

== 9.10 Planning Process ==
FYI on progress for 9.10 planning. We are hosting a series of meetings 
with other canonical teams, called road map meetings. Some of you may be 
booked into one or two of them. There are 22 altogether. This will be 
very good fodder for UDS.

== All Hands Update ==
  * Everyone should have submitted at least one topic. If you haven't, 
please do so by March 13th (new deadline).
  * The track leads are reviewing and will let us know what topics are 
accepted.

== Release Status ==
In general, it appears that X is a hot spot for us related to bugs, and 
that most of the critical feature work is complete.

=== Bugs ===
Reviewed list of bugs currently targeted for Jaunty. See the wiki for 
the list.

=== Work Items ===
Note that a few items have been finished or postponed since the burndown 
chart was created, so we are hovering just above the desired trend line now.

Discussed which items should have a status change. Changes follow the 
"/". Note that Riddell was not at the meeting due to travel.

 Errors 
  * Riddell:Enhance timezone map for Kubuntu installer:being worked on 
by shtylman
  * Riddell:Add ability to filter out non-applications to 
KPackagekit:rgreening
  * Riddell:Change Konqueror to use kdewebkit by default if Qt 4.5 is 
out for Jaunty:blocked on upstream

 not started 
  * Riddell:Enable auto-login on user setup page in Kubuntu 
installer:not started
  * Riddell:Update OEM help page for Kubuntu:not started
  * Riddell:Update language page to show all languages at once in 
Kubuntu:not started
  * Riddell:Remove power profiles for primary powerdevil UI in 
Kubuntu:not started
  * pitti:Advice Dx Team Regarding where to store assets such as 
icon:not started
  * pitti:Advice Dx Team Regarding “Do not disturb systems”:not started

 blocked 
  * Riddell:Update partitioning labels to match GTK front end in KDE 
installer:blocked
  * Riddell:Use Kwallet password strength bar for password on user setup 
page-blocked On advanced setup replace GRUB line edit with a pre-seeded 
combo box:blocked
  * Riddell:Include Kolorpaint if space and agreed to at council 
meeting.:blocked
  * bryce:Support the Dx team by consulting and helping with low level 
packages.:blocked/done
  * pitti:Refactor packages and build system to support moving help 
files to language packs:blocked/postponed

 started 
  * Riddell:Collect feedback for problem areas when upgrading in 
Kubuntu:started
  * asac:Adobe Flash in partner repository with apturl:started
  * bryce:Implement xorg.conf backup/restore 
functionality:started/postponed - note that this does not ship
  * bryce:Create X Historical Package Pages:started/postponed - note 
that this down not ship
  * bryce:Create X Smoke Tests:started
  * calc:Get 3.1.0 split build into a PPA for English.:started
  * pitti:Advice Dx Team Regarding Compiz Plugin:started

== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===
  * network-manager 0.7.1 rc3 update for #jaunty
  * network-manager status icon discussions with #dxteam; look for 
options in code
  * network-manager security update sign-off; provide test cases to 
security team
  * upstream ifupdown system settings crash fixes for network-manager 0.7.1
  * subpixel smoothing investigation: develop patches for 
gnome-settings-daemon, gnome-control-center and gtk+2.0 to allow 
"automatic mode"; provide Arne with patches so he can start tweak 
fontconfig rules; next: upload simple fix "use rbga antialiasing by 
default", upload the whole lot to a PPA and get feedback
  * roll-out firefox/xulrunner security update
  * prepare nss security update
  * coordinating mbm u

Desktop Team 20090317 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-03-17

== Present ==
  * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
  * Alexander Sack (asac)
  * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
  * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
  * Chris Cheney (calc)
  * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
  * Martin Pitt (pitti)
  * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
  * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
  * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) - kubuntu meeting

== Agenda ==
  * Outstanding actions from last meeting
  * Announcements
  * Release Status
  * Beta preparedness
  * Review activity reports
  * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
  * ACTION: seb128 and bryce to investigate 
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/67188 
- problems with setting certain keyboard layouts
   * Result: unassigned this bug as it is really a collection of other 
bugs which should be tracked seperately
  * ACTION: calc and pitti to discuss 
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/305790 - getting certain java based 
build depends for OO to build in the build daemons. xom now works with 
openjdk.
   * Result: pitti succeeding in getting it to build with openjdk, but 
then the test suites broke. Will build with gcj for Jaunty if test suite 
failure causes problems.
  * ACTION: everyone hasn't already to submit a topic by eow (mandated 
by rickspencer3 :) )
   * Result: everyone now reports having submitted

== Actions from this meeting ==
  * ACTION: everyone to send rickspencer3 email wrt to people who should 
be sponsored for UDS
  * ACTION: asac to ping luke regarding 278095
  * ACTION: asac and mvo to complete Adobe in partner archive work
  * ACTION: rickspencer3 to ascertain the state of the artwork for the beta

== Announcements ==
  * UDS sponsorship: send rickspencer3 an email if there is someone that 
you feel is important to sponsor

== Release Status ==
=== Bugs ===
Everyone should be focused on beta mile-stoned bugs for the remaindered 
of the week. Follows are the currently High and Medium bugs targeted for 
Jaunty in the beta milestone, so these should presumably be fixed 
removed from the milestone by 2009-03-19.

 High 
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' || 
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' || 
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 278095 || MASTER crash in getenv() ... spi_atk_bridge_exit_func() || 
asac || In Progress || High || at-spi (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || 
ubuntu-9.04-beta || canonical-desktop-team || 
2008-10-26T23:21:10.303725+00:00 ||
|| 337869 || jaxme does not build with openjdk-6 || ccheney || Confirmed 
|| High || jaxme (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || ubuntu-9.04-beta || 
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-03-04T18:56:52.837035+00:00 ||
|| 305790 || MIR - move to main for openoffice.org 3 build-depends || 
ccheney || Incomplete || High || jaxme (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || 
ubuntu-9.04-beta || canonical-desktop-team || None ||
|| 340777 || Panel should add the messaging indicator for users 
upgrading || seb128 || Confirmed || High || gnome-panel (Ubuntu Jaunty) 
|| jaunty || ubuntu-9.04-beta || canonical-desktop-team || 
2009-03-10T21:44:41.406986+00:00 ||
  * 278095: this is already fixed by asac, but hasn't been uploaded. 
asac to ping luke regarding uploading the fix.
  * 337869: currently is being built with openjdk, however, the test 
suite is failing. Not clear if this is an issue. In any case, should be 
considered more or less complete, as we will be supporting this 
component by building it with gcj for jaunty if the test suite failures 
are a real problem.
  * 305790: fixed (much thanks to doko)
  * 340777: This is essentially the upgrade script for notify-osd and 
indicator-applet. Expected to be complete by 2009-03-18. Needs a little 
more testing.

 Medium 
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' || 
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' || 
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 309419 || jaunty:  Kubuntu panel doesn't extend all the way across 
desktop || jr || Confirmed || Medium || kubuntu-default-settings (Ubuntu 
Jaunty) || jaunty || ubuntu-9.04-beta || canonical-desktop-team || 
2009-03-10T06:23:48.594805+00:00 ||
|| 308060 || Include libmsn in main || jr || 

Desktop Team 20090331 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-03-24

== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)
 * Pedro Villavicencio (pedro)

== Apologies ==
 * robert_ancell

== Agenda ==
Compressing meeting to focus 
 * Hug/Bug Day (pedro)
 * LF summit
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

=== Moved to wiki/email ===
 * Desktop Summit
 * Karmic sprint dates
 * Meeting time

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * None

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: All - If you've got a blog, blog about X Hug day
 * ACTION: All - Contact pitti if there are people at Linux Foundations
that you want him to meet on your behalf

== Desktop Summit ==
 * http://www.grancanariadesktopsummit.org/
 * If you want to attend, you must submit talk(s), deadline April 10
 * For those who submit talks, but don't get accepted, you may still be
able to go

== Hug/Bug Day (pedro) ==
 * X related Hug day is planned for April 2nd -
http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/45
 * Please join for an hour or two if possible, See
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Triaging
 * It would help out if folks could blog about it, especially if they
have blogs on planet.ubuntu

== LF Summit ==
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter): Leading the
[[https://www.linuxfoundation.org/en/OpenPrinting/OpenPrinting_Summit_San_Francisco_2009|OpenPrinting
 Summit]] Wed-Fri April 8-10
 * Martin Pitt (pitti): Leading the
[[http://events.linuxfoundation.org/backport|Driver Backport Meeting]],
Fri April 10 
 * Let pitti know if there is anyone there you want him to talk to
 * Pitti will be reachable by email, make sure you catch him this week
for high priority items

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
=== Jaunty Targeted Bugs ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 348428 || Swithing to another user and then to anything else, freezes
laptop. Jaunty || bryceharrington || Confirmed || High ||
xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-03-26 23:47:22.559454+00:00 ||
|| 352307 || update-notifier message about recording mount passphrase ||
pitti || Triaged || High || ecryptfs-utils (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||
|| canonical-desktop-team || 2009-03-31 11:17:55.932138+00:00 ||
|| 304871 || [i845G] Fatal server error: Couldn't bind memory for BO
front buffer (Jaunty) || bryceharrington || In Progress || High ||
xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-02-04 16:05:50.270746+00:00 ||
|| 264336 || pgsql fails to start due to shared buffer setting greater
than kernel allows || pitti || Triaged || High || postgresql-common
(Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  || canonical-desktop-team || 2009-02-16
09:39:46.237983+00:00 ||
|| 337926 || vino: mouse cursor stays in upper left corner ||
bryceharrington || New || Medium || xfree86-driver-synaptics (Ubuntu
Jaunty) || jaunty ||  || canonical-desktop-team || None ||
|| 145716 || panel launchers break on upgrade || asac || Triaged ||
Medium || thunderbird (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2008-12-31 18:38:57.742883+00:00 ||
|| 271283 || [ooo-build] OpenOffice.org subpixel font rendering broken
with new cairo || asac || Triaged || Medium || openoffice.org (Ubuntu
Jaunty) || jaunty || ubuntu-9.04 || canonical-desktop-team || 2009-02-04
06:35:37.188598+00:00 ||
|| 348225 || Remove inline translations from .desktop files || pitti ||
Fix Committed || Medium || synaptic (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-03-25 10:29:01.770611+00:00 ||

=== Milestoned but not targeted bugs, importance=High ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 270303 || MASTER - firefox (intrepid): your browser has been updated
and needs to be restarted || asac || In Progress || High || ubufox
(U

Desktop Team 20090407 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-07


== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)

== Apologies ==
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell) - out of TZ
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter) - On travel to the
[[https://www.linuxfoundation.org/en/OpenPrinting/OpenPrinting_Summit_San_Francisco_2009|OpenPrinting
 Summit 2009 in San Francisco]]

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Meeting times
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: All - If you've got a blog, blog about X Hug day
 * ACTION: Contact pitti if there are people at Linux Foundations that
you want him to meet on your behalf

=== via email ===
 * Desktop Summit: Deadline to submit is this Friday
 * Karmic sprint dates: 3rd August to the 7th August
 * Meeting time: Everyone has updated [[../../MeetingTime|MeetingTime
wiki]]

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to send email to kick of meeting time discussion
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to get list of critical bugs from bryce, follow
up with release team to get correct bugs tracked.

== Meeting Time ==
 * Need to have a time or times so that certain people are not forced to
disrupt their sleep to attend
 * rickspencer3 proposes that we discuss via email

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
=== On Release Team Radar ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 353924 || Offline home page always English (browser language
hard-coded to en-US) || asac || In Progress || High || ubufox (Ubuntu
Jaunty) || jaunty || ubuntu-9.04 || canonical-desktop-team || 2009-04-02
16:18:41.518990+00:00 ||
|| 353898 || [i945GM] Display locks-up in various circumstances ||
bryceharrington || Triaged || High || xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu
Jaunty) || jaunty ||  || canonical-desktop-team || 2009-04-02
20:01:42.108969+00:00 ||
|| 349992 || [945 tiling] Low performance due to no A17 workaround ||
bryceharrington || Incomplete || High || xserver-xorg-video-intel
(Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  || canonical-desktop-team || None ||
|| 337608 || [i945] X crashes in fbBlt() when using Sun Java Plugin 6 +
firefox3.0 on Asus EEEPC 1000 || bryceharrington || Triaged || High ||
xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-04-03 15:14:04.879183+00:00 ||
|| 353090 || (jaunty) Text hidden on Who are you? step || robert-ancell
|| Fix Committed || High || ubiquity (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2009-04-01 12:39:21.873648+00:00 ||
|| 145716 || panel launchers break on upgrade || asac || Triaged ||
Medium || thunderbird (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||
canonical-desktop-team || 2008-12-31 18:38:57.742883+00:00 ||

Some discussion about whether the X bugs are truly Release Critical, and
whether there are other bugs that aren't labeled as such, but should
be. 
For example bug 356264 is widely reported, but not targeted.
ACTION: rickspencer3 to get list of critical bugs from bryce, follow up
with release team to get correct bugs tracked.

=== Milestoned, but not Release Targeted, Importance=High ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 270303 || MASTER - firefox (intrepid): your browser has been updated
and needs to be restarted || asac || In Progress || High || ubufox
(Ubuntu) ||  || ubuntu-9.04 || canonical-desktop-team || 2008-10-23
09:11:26.751443+00:00 ||
|| 283772 || Catalan help file is not included || ccheney || Incomplete
|| High || openoffice.org (Ubuntu) ||  || ubuntu-9.04 ||
canonical-desktop-team || None ||
|| 310353 || Default font size too large if using native DPI || asac ||
In Progress || High || gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) ||  || ubuntu-9.04
|| canonical-desktop-team || 2009-03-18 21:52:00.957050+00:00 ||
|| 323109 || network-manager integration

Desktop Team 20090414 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-14

== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * -intel
 * Gwibber
 * Translations
 * UDS Topics
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to send email to kick of meeting time discussion
  * done, discussion underway
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to get list of critical bugs from bryce, follow
up with release team to get correct bugs tracked.
  * done, release team tracking -intel issues for SRUs

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: Everyone to put their UDS topics on the wiki
 * ACTION: ArneGoetje to follow up with Riddell to ensure that 355814 is
fixed
 * ACTION: seb128 to investigate 338982

== -intel ==
=== Current Status ===
Bryce reports two fundamental issues:
 1. Unpredictable freezes on i965 chips. He believes the freezes were
introduced by the 7.3 to 7.4 Mesa upgrade. Unfortunately there are no
repro steps for the freezes, so hard to verify that reverting to 7.3
would fix the problem. Bryce is exploring reverting to 7.3 in an SRU if
the specific cause can not be determined and fixed.
 1. Poor performance on most intel hardware. Many people report that
Jaunty is significantly slower. Many users find using uxa solves the
perf issues, but introduces stability issues. Users also find the
enabling the "greedy" MigrationHeuristic improves perf significantly.
However, a path to turn on greedy by default re-introduces a segfault.
Users who simply add the greedy option to their xorg.conf do not seem to
run into this issue. Steps for enabling greedy can be seen here:
https://launchpad.net/bugs/359600. 

bryce continues to work on these issues, and the desktop team is
planning SRUs for fixes when they are discovered. rickspencer3 is also
re-engaging with Intel to see if they can provide more guidance on
solving these issues asap.

== Gwibber ==
Gwibber is a universe project that kenvandine has been working on to get
ready to use indicator-applet in Jaunty. Potential SRU if the changes
are unobtrusive.

== Translations ==
Final full export from Rosetta for the language-packs is currently
running, expected to complete tomorrow. 

Jono joined to introduce David Planella (dpm), new to the community
team. His role includes:
 * to help grow and extend our extensive translations community
 * to work with translations teams to help build best practice around
great translations
 * to work with upstreams to ensure we can participate as effectively as
possible with translations
 * to provide a resource inside Canonical to report to other teams the
status of translations

== UDS Topics ==
 * https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSKarmic/Prep/Desktop
Everyone agreed to put their UDS topics on the wiki, and we will discuss
in next week's team meeting.
ACTION: Everyone to put their UDS topics on the wiki

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
Currently targeted bugs ...
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 359392 || [i965] X freezes starting on April 3rd || bryceharrington
|| Triaged || Critical || xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) ||
jaunty || ubuntu-9.04 ||  || 2009-04-12 01:30:58.691446+00:00 ||
|| 355814 || [Kubuntu 9.04] Many items are in English while language is
set to Spanish || jr || Triaged || Critical || language-pack-kde-es
(Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || ubuntu-9.04 ||  || 2009-04-06
19:19:39.541759+00:00 ||
|| 353898 || [i945GM] X freezes typing quickly in Kmail when desktop
effects are enabled || bryceharrington || Triaged || High ||
xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||  || 2009-04-02
20:01:42.108969+00:00 ||
|| 337608 || [i945] X crashes in fbBlt() when using Sun Java Plugin 6 +
firefox3.0 on Asus EEEPC 1000 || bryceharrington || In Progress || High
|| xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty ||  ||  ||
2009-04-03 15:14:04.879183+00:00 ||
|| 338982 || evolution crashed with SIGSEGV during MAPI authentication
|| seb128 || Confirmed || High || evolution-mapi (Ubuntu Jaunty) ||
jaunty || ubuntu-9.04 ||  || 2009-03-26 11:30:23.725832+00:00 ||
||

Desktop Team 20090428 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-28

== Present ==
* Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
* Alexander Sack (asac)
* Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
* Bryce Harrington (bryce)
* Chris Cheney (calc)
* Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
* Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
* Martin Pitt (pitti)
* Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
* Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==


== Agenda ==
* State of Jaunty
* U1
* Launchpad Team and Kubuntu
* All Hands
* UDS
* Grand Canaria
* OEM team swapperoo
* Review activity reports
* Any other business

== Actions from this meeting ==
* ACTION: rickspencer3 to get definitive list of who has talks at all
hands to double check that everyone who has one is prepared

== State of Jaunty ==
* pitti reports that we are seeing a fairly normal number of SRUs for
this release, though there are no severe issues as of yet. Evolution
Data Server, and i965 are serious issues that are still being address.
* Generally consensus is that Jaunty we quite a solid release and that
users are reasonably happy with it.
* rickspencer3 stressed the need to move to karmic work asap. Asked that
people with access to i965 hardware volunteer to help with testing,
etc...

== U1 ==
* rickspencer3 mandated that the desktop team join and use U1
* Instructions to get started:
https://ubuntuone.com/support/installation/
* All employees currently have access, public beta is soon
* kenvandine discussed the topic briefly, and asked that everyone with
access please test as much as you can, starting April 29

== Launchpad Team and Kubuntu ==
* rickspencer3 spent time with launchpad leads in London. Interesting
perspective as users, also, three of them are big fans of Kubuntu.

== All Hands ==
* rickspencer3 encouraged team members to get their all hands talks
ready asap.
* there was some ambiguity regarding who got talks accepted and not.
rickspencer3 to follow up.

== UDS ==
* Got key partner related blueprints stubbed out
* pitti asks people to follow naming convention: desktop-karmic-*
* pitti and rickspencer3 to review UDS sessions by next meeting

== Grand Canaria ==
* rickspencer3 reminds team about opening night party
* rickspencer3 asks that everyone schedule to be there for opening night
party (as Canonical is hosting)

== OEM team swapperoo ==
* Reminder, that calc starts this starts on 5/1
* General plan is to slow OOo development during Karmic, as OEM staff
joining us should not be assigned to just OOo
* calc will still be available 20% time for consulting on OOo

== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===

* release bug triage ... staying on top - day and night
* workaround apturl issue that broke install of flash on live CD (LP:
#363798)
* network-manager-pptp 0.7.1~rc4.20090316+bzr23-0ubuntu3 uploaded and
approved for ubuntu/jaunty (LP: #364356)
* roll firefox/xulrunner security update 3.0.9
* investigate firefox/xulrunner 3.0.10 firedrill and prepare builds;
also found another
   variant for which 3.0.10 is still crashing
* release party

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===

* upgraded my home server from debian lenny to ubuntu jaunty. Took quite
some time but worked. :)
* bug triaging for language-selector
* work on my presentation for AllHands

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===
 Distro 

* Sent out 'Jaunty-Eve' thank-you's to X.org bug triagers
* Email catch up

 Xorg 

* X freezes on -intel
   - Reproduced freeze with various options suggested by upstream.
 Provided upstream with several more GPU dumps for each case.
   - Met with Eric Anholt in Portland to show reproduction of issue
   - Updated general Freeze troubleshooting page in wiki
   - Continued polishing documentation for new debugging tools
 https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/x-freeze-test
   - Reviewed all bug reports mentioning X freezes on intel, and
 notified them of the new tools, asking for them to provide
 dumps for their freeze issue.
 (28 bug reports)
   - Developed mechanism to do patch bisecting within quilt patching
 system so can git bisecting of Debian packages
   - Did extensive git bisecting/testing on mesa, no result
   - Tested Virtual settings - setting at >1606 seems to resolve.
* Helped various people with their X issues
* Create graph of bugs for major video drivers
* Wrote script to move bugs from xorg to more appropriate source
   packages.  Eliminates one big chunk of X bug drudgery.
* Enhanced script to add device name to -intel bug report titles
* Full triage on 'xorg' package
* Misc. fixup of scripts to account for launchpadlib changes
* Created script to itemize -intel bugs based on tagged symptoms
* Set up PPA for X driver updates
   - https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/x-updates/
   - Merged latest versions of several drivers
* UDS session planning

=== Chris Cheney (calc) ===
* Working on OOo 3.1.0 packaging.

Re: Desktop Team 20090428 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2009-05-01 at 20:12 +0100, Matthew East wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 6:44 PM, Rick Spencer  
> wrote:
> > Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
> > them and the irc log here:
> > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-28
> 
> {snip}
> 
> > == U1 ==
> > * rickspencer3 mandated that the desktop team join and use U1
> > * Instructions to get started:
> > https://ubuntuone.com/support/installation/
> 
> I'm a big fan of these meeting summaries, they are a great way to
> ensure that Ubuntu work is conducted publically, but this is a bit
> cryptic - I can't find anywhere on the wiki or the meeting log an
> explanation of what "Ubuntu One" is.
> 
> Could someone explain?
> 

Mathew,

I saw you got some good replies to your question. Another way to find
out what's up is to hop into #ubuntu-desktop on freenode and ask. You're
always welcome there.

Cheers, Rick


-- 
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop

Desktop Team 20090505 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-05-05

== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Tony Espy (awe)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

== Apologies ==
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) - Vacation
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell) - Out of timezone
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128) - Dx Team Sprint

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Welcome awe
 * UDS
 * Desktop Summit
 * Triaging versus Bug Fixing/Closing in Karmic
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to get definitive list of who has talks at all
hands to double check that everyone who has one is prepared 
  * Result: have pinged a couple of people, but haven't gotten such a
list yet, will carry over
  * Follow up: since the meeting rickspencer3 has gotten this info and
shared with effected parties via email

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: All - if you are going to desktop summit, add yourself to the
list on this page
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to create and schedule UDS sessions for bug
management

== Welcome awe ==
 * Tony (awe) is joining the desktop team 80% of his time for the Karmic
cycle. To start off he will be working with asac to identify some
interesting NM related work, and to engage in the UDS process.

== UDS ==
 * Most all blueprints have been submitted
 * rickspencer3 notes that there will be time set aside for impromptu
sessions at UDS
 * bryce thinks that there are too many xorg sessions planned, and will
pair them down.
 * rickspencer3 and pitti will review, sort, and prioritize sessions
 * rickspencer3 will schedule sessions
 * Consensus that QA and community needs to be part of the discussion

== Desktop Summit ==
Need a definitive list of who is going, and when. Also, do you have
papers to present.

|| '''who''' || '''when''' || '''what''' ||
|| rickspencer3 || core days || talk ||
|| robert_ancel |||| lightning talk ||
|| kenvandine || Mon - Thur ||  talk ||
|| seb128 || core days ||   ||
|| JonathanRiddell || sat - sat || distro track, Wednesday  ||

== Triaging versus Bug Fixing/Closing in Karmic ==
 * Discussion about doing the right amount of bug fixing versus bug
triaging versus other work.
 * rickspencer3 encouraged that the team to think "bold" about how to
address this in Karmic, discussion ensued.
 * rickspencer3 will schedule a UDS sessions to discuss.

== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===

 * Mozilla:
  * mozilla backports
  * yet another firefox security update
  * fix mozilla build failure in karmic that was uncovered by gcc 4.4
  * investigate daily bot + launchpad/soyuz issues; discussed with cprov
and identified why latest launchpad doesn't handle lots of uploads in
one batch properly anymore (LP: #371640)
  * mentor mozillateam members about how to maintain daily bzr branches
to get more eyes caring for those builds
  * work with Jazzva on fixing prism trunk builds

 * NetworkManager:
  * network-manager bug triage; evaluating fixes for jaunty SRU
  * finding root-cause for weird dbus permission issues for some PPP/VPN
users in jaunty; discussed and found potential fix for that with
upstream - LP: #371291 (PPP) + LP: #360818 (VPN)
  * finished network-manager 0.7.1 hardy backports for NetworkManager
and got verification from community that this works

 * Misc:
  * started to gather input from other teams on browser/network needs
  * more thoughts on karmic tasks

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
 * Dealing with Malayalam translations in Rosetta. The Malayalam
translators requested to revert all translated string back to upstream
(Packaged).
 * Discussion with Jeroen Vermeulen about the Malayalam translations and
rolling back to upstream translations in general.
 * Preparing talk for AllHands

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===

 * Sponsored: -intel (LP: #371544), mesa (LP: #368049), -ati
 * Karmic merges:  fglrx-installer, -ati, -nv
 * Wrote a getting started page for Ubuntu-X
   https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/SwatTeam
 * Started drafting a KMS howto:
   https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/KernelModeSetting
 * Focused most of week into solving X.org freeze bug.
   A suitable workaround was found and currently in testing.
 * Addressing various concerns about -intel performance.
   (Needs backports of kernel patches by kernel team.)
 * Triaging, upstreaming UXA bugs.  Wrote LPL script to report on
   current status of UXA bugs in lp and fdo.

=== Chris Cheney (calc) ===
 * Working on OOo 3.1.0 packaging. Almost done for all:
hardy/intrepid/jaunty/karmic
 * Had the following packages synced for OOo 3.1.0 - icu,
flute-openof

Desktop Team 20090609 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-06-09

== Present ==
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Tony Espy (awe)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  

== Apologies ==
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell) - out of timezone
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso) - out of timezone

== Agenda ==
 * Reviews
 * GIMP
 * Blueprints, specs, burndowns
 * Bug hygiene
 * Team Meeting: Eastern Edition
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * All: schedule a time for performance review
 * rickspencer3: create burndown chart script for blueprints
 * All: add work items to burndown chart as defined by burndown chart
script
 * All: unasign bugs that will not be addressed in Karmic, including
release targeted ones

== Reviews ==
 * Desktop team employees should schedule a time with rickspencer for
performance reviews

== The GIMP ==
 * rickspencer3 proposes pulling the gimp from the CD:
  * It takes up a lot of space that we need for couchdb, etc...
  * F-Spot has key features, like crop and red-eye removal
  * It's a power user tool, users shouldn't stumble into it
 * Discussion points brought up that
  * The gimp currently uses 26 megs of space, 20 of which are
documentation, which could be moved online
  * The gimp, though not totally user friendly, is very useful, and does
not require "importing" to edit
 * The current plan of record is:
  * Keep the gimp in the default install
  * If we need the room, switch the gimp to online only documentation
  * If we still need the room, kick it out altogether

== Blueprints, etc... ==
 * About 50% of the blueprints are approved
 * Decision was taken to track work items on the blueprint white boards
 * Burn down chart will be generated form whiteboards asap
 * In order to accommodate different work flow, the system may later be
extended to allow tracking with bugs as well

== Bug Hygiene ==
 * rickspencer3 asked that team members only have bugs assigned that
they intend to fix in Karmic
 * Rich discussion followed regarding bug usage
 * Little was concluded, except that a problem definition was needed
before progress could be made in the discussion

== Team Meeting: Eastern Edition ==
 * An addition team meeting will be added to accommodate team members in
Easter time zones.
 * The meeting will be at 23:00 UTC on Tuesdays. All are invited to
attend. 

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
We have many release targeted bugs across multiple previous releases.
Apparently, much of this is cruft that should be removed.

=== Karmic ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 376396 || pulls in phonon-backend-null || jr || In Progress || High
|| kdebase (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || karmic-alpha-2 ||  || 2009-05-14
08:54:25.159816+00:00 ||
|| 383444 || 2009i available - Timezone change for Bangladesh || pitti
|| Fix Committed || High || tzdata (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  ||
2009-06-05 08:58:35.200716+00:00 ||
|| 383230 || apport-collect should call programs with LC_MESSAGES=C ||
pitti || In Progress || Medium || apport (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
||  || 2009-06-03 15:52:29.687294+00:00 ||

=== Jaunty ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' ||
|| 314928 || [i915GM] MTRR entry gets removed when restarting xorg -
causes corruption on ttys || bryceharrington || In Progress || Critical
|| xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || jaunty-updates
||  || 2009-05-11 18:02:28.838832+00:00 ||
|| 361115 || nm-connection-editor crashs after clicking Cancel in the
add new connection dialog || asac || Fix Committed || High ||
network-manager-applet (Ubuntu Jaunty) || jaunty || later ||  ||
2009-04-15 14:17:16.476277+00:00 ||
|| 360905 || Network-Manager not seeing broadband card || asac || In
Progress || High || network-manager (Ub

Re: about empathy as the default IM application

[Rick Spencer]

I think switching to empathy is a fairly substantial change, and people
in good faith will and should question that change. 

However, given Danny's points, the fact that pidgin will stay available
and supported,  the responsiveness of the empathy developers, indeed all
the factors discussed at UDS, I see no reason to back off from the
decision made there.

Cheers, Rick


On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 18:00 -0400, Danny Piccirillo wrote:
> Ah, yes-- this discussion will keep coming up until it finally happens
> =]
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=7462614
> 
> 
> IMHO Empathy is great for most users, especially new ones, and it can
> replace poth pidgin AND ekiga. It lacks the basic features like the
> ones you mentioned, but i don't think they are showstoppers and
> including it in Karmic or the next release i'm sure would guarantee
> that all of those would be resolved within the release cycle. It is
> simple and integrates well, and we want to make Ubuntu friendly for
> NEW users. Old users who prefer the clutter and feature madness of
> pidgin will simply install it from Add/Remove (or not even have to if
> they run an upgrade). If Ubuntu switched to Empathy, it's development
> is going to get a big boost so the feature gap will close and
> eventaully reverse. Are people really defending Pidgin for the future
> of Ubuntu or as their pet IM client?
> 
> On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 15:35, Nicolò Chieffo
>  wrote:
> Hello everyone, I'm really interested in the new version of
> empathy
> which will have video and audio support.
> This will be a really great feature and a step towards a
> complete IM experience.
> 
> But on the other hand I'm quite worried of the empathy and
> telepathy
> status about basic features, which seem to be put aside in
> favor of
> new and strange ones.
> Maybe developers should help to implement them before empathy
> will
> replace pidgin, or lots of users will loose useful stuff like:
>   * Rich text messages (underline, bold, font, ...)
>   * Custom emoticons
>   * Protocol emoticons
>   * Msn chat with invisible users
>   * Msn send and receive offline messages
>   * Msn see windows live messenger buddy icons (only new
> versions of 2009)
>   * Msn file transfers
> 
> --
> Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
> ubuntu-devel-disc...@lists.ubuntu.com
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> http://www.google.com/profiles/danny.piccirillo


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Desktop Team 20090623 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-06-23

== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting

=== Announcements ===
 * pitti: Reminder: do you merges (https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html)
 * pitti:
[[https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+specs?searchtext=desktop-karmic-|spec
 status]]
 * Karmic Sprint is in Dublin
 
=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

=== Discussion ===
 * Paper cut bugs

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: kenvandine to investigate mozjz linkage and ABI/API policy
 * ACTION: kenvandine to work with asac regarding white listing of U1
 * ACTION: All - look out for paper cuts mail each week, and fix on if
possible.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to review how paper cut effort is working for
the team in two weeks.
 * ACTION: awe to review Audio spec and to comment on volume scaling

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: All - finishing adding work items to white boards by Thursday
  * Work items added, burndown chart running:
http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png
 * ACTION: All - finish spec drafting by Thursday and set them to
"pending approval" 
  * All specs have been through a round of review, some stragglers not
yet approved
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to ask davidbarth if the DXE team needs help
setting up burndown charts 
 * ACTION: MIR team, please review Kubuntu MIRs 
 * ACTION: pitti to slurp work items from Kubuntu wiki and integrate
into burndown 
  * Done
 * ACTION: All - review https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html and ask
pitti for assistance if needed
  * No status checked

== Karmic Sprint ==
 * Will be in Dublin
 * Go ahead and arrange travel
 * Check the wiki for all info

== Partner Update ==
 * [[UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status|Ubuntu One]]
 * DX Team - Waiting for iteration planning wiki page

== X Update ==
 * We are ahead of curve on merges
   * 11 packages need merge/sync, out of 92 updates since Jaunty.
   * 10 packages have upstream releases but not yet in Debian
   * Of these, 4 are high priority (xorg, -fglrx, -nvidia, and -intel).
All are in PPAs or git now.  Will be uploaded after testing.
   * git snapshots of xserver, -ati/KMS, & -nouveau/KMS are in PPAs

 * X.org in Karmic is working well
   * 2107 total open X bugs; this is high but the rate of open growth
bugs has leveled off, compared with the post-Jaunty period.
 * -nvidia and -intel are where most bug growth has occurred.
   * Kernel updates have solved nearly all -intel problems on Jaunty.
   * KMS on -intel is ready to switch on by default.  -ati / -nouveau
WIP.

 * xorg-edgers is proving itself, both for testing of various KMS bits,
and avoiding potential regressions in proposed updates.[0].  The Intel
upstream developers have also been quite pleased with xorg-edgers[1]; if
xorg-edgers makes life easier for upstream developers, maybe they'll be
recommending ubuntu more often.
   * 0: http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/drupal/xorg-edgers
   * 1: http://cworth.org/intel/driver_stability/

 * We are also now maintaining two "backport" style PPAs to provide
additional support options for past releases like Jaunty:
   * 'x-updates' for upgraded drivers
   * 'x-retro' for downgraded drivers

== Paper Cut Bugs ==
 * rickspencer3 asks who has fixed a paper cut bug.
 * some discussion of work and communication flow ensued. Some engineers
are being flooded with bug mail result from the effort.
 * rickspence3 provides guidance to consider paper cuts to be as
important as spec work, and for canonical engineers to invest at least
half a day every two weeks to the effort.
 * rickspence3 also advises looking our for the mail to ubuntu-devel
each week for that week's paper cuts, rather than trying to harvest them
from the launchpad project.
 * ACTION: All - look out for paper cuts mail each week, and fix on if
possible.


== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===

(two days on holiday)

 * finish spec work; add work items (was a bit work intensive)
 * update nspr to 4.7.5 in karmic
 * update nss to 3.12.3 in karmic; fixed crasher on buildd's caused
during lib signing
 * respin thunderbird in security PPA using latest nspr/nss in an
attempt to fix armel issues
 * more tbird + armel discussions
 * discussions about VMC and chrom{e,ium} with upstream
 * coordinate work split with es

Desktop Team 20090630 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-06-30


== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy (awe)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)
 * Tony Espy (awe)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)

== Apologies ==
 * Chris Cheney (calc)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting

=== Announcements ===
 * Everyone should have travel booked for Sprint
 * Desktop Summit starts eow, this week, who's going?

=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Translations Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

=== Discussion ===
 * What is in PPAs that should be in universe or main?

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: kenvandine to investigate mozjs linkage and ABI/API policy
* RESULT: no resolution yet, but mozjs is required, db uses it for
managing views, etc
 * ACTION: kenvandine to work with asac regarding white listing of U1
   * RESULT: need to file third part repo form
 * ACTION: All - look out for paper cuts mail each week, and fix on if
possible.
   * RESULT: Done
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to review how paper cut effort is working for
the team in two weeks.
 * ACTION: awe to review Audio spec and to comment on volume scaling 
  * RESULT: Done

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: kenvandine to organize uploading new FUSA applet and new GDM,
document workarounds
 * ACTION: hggdh, rickspencer3, pedro_ to install new gdm from
ubuntu-desktop ppa, report serious problems to seb128 and/or kenvandine
 * ACTION: ALL: provide feedback and help regarding Kubuntu browsers to
Riddel in #kubuntu-devel if desired
 * ACTION: All: run edgers until alpha 3, and then disable (if currently
running or otherwise interested)
 * ACTION: robert_ancell to discuss upstream of DXE FUSA applet wtih
seb128 and kenvandine
 * ACTION: ALL: install mozilla security update, report problems to asac

== Partner Update ==
 * [[UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status|Ubuntu One acceptance testing]]
 * Ubuntu One karmic integration blueprint is approved
 * Ubuntu One client packaging for Karmic is coming along, hopefully be
uploaded to REVU again today
 * DX team, FUSA changes should land end of the week, at least basic
functionality.
   * Once basic functionality is there, should we get it into karmic for
testing along with new GDM?

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * Kubuntu: KDE 4.3 RC 1 is in progress and will start uploading tonight
<>
 * Arora is now the default browser (pre-empting big discussion just
started by suse on the topic) <>
 * Kubuntu Tutorials Day was a big success, see logs
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuTutorialsDay <>
 * New council members vote is now under way 
 * Seeds for netbook version of Kubuntu created, waiting on changes to
the image building scripts to get merged in for images

== Xorg Update ==
 * Merge Status:
   * Mostly waiting on upstream releases at this point.
   * 12 packages need merge/sync, out of 92 updates since Jaunty
   * 7 packages have upstream releases but not yet in Debian
   * -fglrx and -nvidia completed PPA testing.  Now in Ubuntu.
   * mesa, xorg merges are done and in git; will be uploaded
Tuesday-ish.
   * A new xserver RC is available.  Will be merged soonish.
   * git snapshots of xserver, -ati/KMS, & -nouveau/KMS are in PPAs

 * X.org in Karmic is working well
   * 2069 total open X bugs, down 38 since last week
   * KMS on -intel is now on by default; relatively few bugs being
reported

 * Blueprints:  All Karmic blueprints complete

== Translations Update ==

 * Message sharing in Rosetta is done, translations in Jaunty and Karmic
are shared now.
 * Imports have started for Karmic
 * Contacted Kubuntu developers and asked them to review the current
Kubuntu related translation templates in Rosetta. Based on their
feedback, the Ubuntu Translation Coordinators team needs to approve new
templates, disable obsolete ones and rename templates that have been
moved.
 * After the first round of imports is done, and Kubuntu translations
are in reasonable shape we will generate initial language-packs for
Karmic (hopefully next week).

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
 * burndown chart isn't showing much movement this week,
http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png

== Archive Discussion ==
Discussed the user of PPAs versus using the archives early and often.
Discussed X as a special case where widespread testing is needed, but
where breakages cause a ton of work for bryce, even in development
releases. Barring specific cases, the consensus was that we should
strive to not things langu

Re: Gthumb as default image viewer?

[Rick Spencer]

On Thu, 2009-07-02 at 12:04 -0400, Andrew SB wrote:
> I think you touch on the real issue here. It's not so much a problem
> with viewing photos, as we all have noted there are already two
> options, EOG when you are in a folder and F-Spot for collections. The
> real problem is that those programs aren't image editors and the GIMP
> is a tool for advanced users. GThumb doesn't solve this problem
> either.
We have been discussing this on the desktop team as well. I would love
to see eog support cropping and red-eye removal (it already rotates). I
think that this, along with f-spot, would cover the key user scenarios.

I think that f-spot is a good program, and a lot of users do manage
large photo libraries, and it is appropriately tuned for those users in
those scenarios.

Cheers, Rick


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Desktop Team 20090714 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-07-14


= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)

== Agenda ==

=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * quickly
 * Review activity reports

=== Discussion ===
 * Pitti: empathy in alpha-3
 * asac: test bluetooth front ends

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to create trackable feature areas for DXE team
 * ACTION: kenvandine to facilitate discussion between SteveA and asac
regarding firefox extension
 * ACTION: everyone try both bluetooth front ends, report experience to
asac next team meeting
 * ACTION: TheMuso to test accessibility of empathy built with webkit

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: kenvandine to organize uploading new FUSA applet and new GDM,
document workarounds
   * RESULT: DONE, FUSA isn't ready yet and new GDM is mostly working.  
 * ACTION: hggdh, rickspencer3, pedro_ to install new gdm from
ubuntu-desktop ppa, report serious problems to seb128 and/or kenvandine
   * RESULT: New GDM is in Karmic, and mostly working
 * ACTION: ALL: provide feedback and help regarding Kubuntu browsers to
Riddel in #kubuntu-devel if desired
   * RESULT: No movement due to desktop summit, follow up next week
 * ACTION: All: run edgers until alpha 3, and then disable (if currently
running or otherwise interested)
   * RESULT: Still plan of record
 * ACTION: robert_ancell to discuss upstream of DXE FUSA applet wtih
seb128 and kenvandine
 * ACTION: ALL: install mozilla security update, report problems to
asac 
   * RESULT: Everyone should have done this by next week
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to review how paper cut effort is working for
the team next week
   * RESULT: while some tweaks to process might be valuable if done
again, the effort appears to be working fairly smoothly. 

== Partner Update ==

= Ubuntu One =
[[UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status|Status]]

 * desktop couchdb
   * being packaged
 * client records api
   * package ready, needs to go to REVU
 * evolution using couch for storage
   * evolution-couchdb and couchdb-glib are in REVU
 * file syncing
   * in universe, waiting MIR approval
 * generic contact picker UI
   * not started yet, might slip
 * screen sharing
   * might slip
 * firefox bookmarks syncing
   * being packaged

More MIRs coming this week, including couchdb and it's dependencies

= DX Team =
 * FUSA: basic features done but not ready to ship.  Ted said it was
pushed, but I haven't found it on LP yet.

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
 * A bit above the trend line:
http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png

== Empathy in Alpha 3 ==
Team agreed that Empathy should be moved in Karmic for alpha 3, and not
wait for butterfly (MSN). seb128 believes it works fine with libpurple.
Also discussed empathy being built with webkit. This supports theming,
but rickspencer3 is concerned about accessibility.

== Bluetooth ==
asac investigating whether to use gnome-bluetooth and blueman for
Bluetooth front end. Asks the team to try both and report back for next
team meeting.

== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===

 * network manager 0.8 + modemmanager in karmic evaluation and
discussion
 * xulrunner 1.9.1 porting /ffox35 spec
  * ported couchdb, miro, pcmanx-gtk2, virt-viewer, gnome-web-photo,
gtk-vnc
  * did liferea merge in order to use webkit
  * discuss future of epiphany with seb; waiting for upstream decision
on webkit; otherwise we need porting
 * bluetooth frontend discussion and evaluation
  * mail exchange with upstreams on roadmap etc.
  * discussing pros- and cons with superm
  * filing bugs on blueman
 * fix (at least all) segfaults in gwibber and commit upstream
 * more community support and discussion about ffox 3.5 branding
 * mentoring old mozillateam contributor (bluekuja)
 * submit a packaging training session.
 * MIR processing for UNR and llvm

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
 * langpack-o-matic test run with the first full-export for Karmic: some
minor tweaks needed for the Chinese langpack split
 * Rosetta: renaming/merging KDE translation templates
 * Rosetta: cleaning the import queue
 * hack language-selector to support the Chinese langpack split
 * finish the Main Inclusion Report for ibus and modules
 * check that the oo.o templates are all imported in Rosetta
 * discussing new Rosetta tarball export times: Karmic will be exported
on Saturdays and Wednesdays at 22:00 UTC

=== B

Desktop Team 20090728 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-07-28

== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Chris Cheney (calc) - conference
 * Martin Pitt (pitti) - holiday
== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting

=== Announcements ===

=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

=== Discussion ===
 * Sprint planning

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to add burndown chart to meeting template
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to check into getting some different wireless
access points for testing NM to Dublin
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to create list of design team inputs needed for
sprint
 * ACTION: everyone who can, do some sponsoring extra sponsoring this
week

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: asac to set up wiki page to track bluetooth devices for
desktop team
  * RESULT: will work on as a team in Dublin
 * ACTION: Riddell to report on current state of Blue Tooth in Kubuntu
Karmic
  * RESULT: Upstream Blue Tooth support is not active
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to update on gdm greeter skinning resources at
next meeting 
  * RESULT: will discuss in design/DXE meeting 2009-07-29

== Partner Update ==

UbuntuOne:

[[UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status|Status]]

 * desktop couchdb
   * Uploaded to ubuntuone beta ppa, REVU today or tomorrow
 * client records api
   * Uploaded to ubuntuone beta ppa, REVU today or tomorrow
 * evolution using couch for storage
   * evolution-couchdb is in REVU and couchdb-glib is in universe
 * file syncing
   * in main and on CD (DONE)
 * generic contact picker UI
   * no longer in scope for karmic
 * screen sharing
   * might punt for karmic
 * firefox bookmarks syncing
   * to be reviewed by asac   

 * MIR
   * couchdb
   * erlang

DX:
 * FUSA replacement work (SUS) 
   - Basic funcationality done
   - Design team is working on it now
   - should be ready to integrate during the Dublin sprint

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * Kopete protocol fix for Yahoo in jaunty-proposed unapproved
 * Qt 4.5.2 includes security fixes for QtWebkit

== Release Status ==
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
|| 401165 || build dependency on GCC-4.3 [armel] || asac || In Progress
|| High || thunderbird (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || karmic-alpha-5 ||
|| 392593 || [karmic regression] cannot connect to wireless network ||
jr || Confirmed || High || plasma-widget-network-manager (Ubuntu Karmic)
|| karmic ||  ||
|| 403581 || restart required notification and button not shown in ffox
3.5 || asac || Triaged || High || ubufox (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
ubuntu-9.10-beta ||
|| 396448 || inconsistent automounting on startup || pitti || Triaged ||
High || devicekit-disks (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||
|| 135548 || Action on critical battery isn't triggered || pitti ||
Triaged || Medium || gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
||
|| 386699 || Mistakes external USB flash disk for system-internal disk
|| pitti || Triaged || Medium || gvfs (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||
|| 388898 || Move Empathy Dependencies to Main and Update Desktop Seed
|| ken-vandine || New || Undecided || gupnp-igd (Ubuntu Karmic) ||
karmic || ||
|| 388898 || Move Empathy Dependencies to Main and Update Desktop Seed
|| ken-vandine || Incomplete || Undecided || telepathy-butterfly (Ubuntu
Karmic) || karmic || ||
|| 395299 || gdm 2.26 has no graphical configuration tool ||
robert-ancell || Triaged || Wishlist || gdm (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
||

== Sprint Planning ==
 * pitti would like to see fewer scheduled meetings this sprint
(compared to last), but rather focus on task list
 * rickspencer3 will try to have zero meetings schedule, but can't
promise other teams won't impose
 * Add agenda items here:
https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Sprints/Karmic/Desktop
 * One item is to get below the trend line for the burndown chart:
http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png
 * asac points out that we should bring some wireless access points to
the sprint so that we can test out different protocols and such

== Other Business ==
 * asac likes seeing the burndown chart on the meeting wiki page,
rickspencer3 to add to templa

Re: [Fwd: [Ayatana] Empathy is not in line with the much discussed guidelines]

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2009-08-04 at 18:19 +0200, Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote:
> Will Empathy be setup to allow presence to be set in the FUSA and if
Yes

> so, will it also allow you to set custom status messages?
No

Please see the spec at:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/KarmicFusa

or check out the image from it here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/KarmicFusa?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=fusa_2.png

Note that the spec could change, but this is the current designed
behavior.

Cheers, Rick


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Desktop Team 20090825 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-08-25

== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy
 * David Siegel

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)

== Agenda ==
 * Feature Freeze Readiness
 * Work Items

=== Feature Freeze Readiness ===
Focus of the meeting was on status of our specs wrt Feature Freeze.
Specs should be marked as "Beta Available" or "Implemented" by Thursday
2009-08-27.

The list of blueprints is available here:
https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+specs?searchtext=desktop-karmic-

We did not discuss specs already marked as Beta Available or
Implemented. The following specs were discussed becuase their status was
not set to Beta Available for Implemented at the time of the meeting:

 Not Beta Available for Implemented 
|| '''Blueprint''' || '''Status''' || '''Notes''' ||
|| desktop-karmic-bug-workflow || n/a || Outside of product, not Feature
freeze impacted ||
|| desktop-karmic-integrating-with-ubuntu-one || Started || blockers are
desktopcouch and evolution-couchdb, both should be in by 2009-08-26 ||
|| desktop-karmic-gnomescan || Started || ready for inclusion, but will
need to be tested and compared to x-scan next week ||
|| desktop-karmic-network-ui || Good Progress || Feature complete, but
some changes due for UI Freeze ||
|| desktop-karmic-compiz-bug-management || n/a || Outside of product,
not Feature freeze impacted ||
|| desktop-karmic-language-selector || Slow Progress || At risk, parts
may need to be postponed ||
|| desktop-karmic-browsers || Good Progress || Not clear how this
overlaps with Firefox 3.5 spec, will sort out when asac returns, not
blocking feature freeze ||
|| desktop-karmic-gnome-speech-replacement || Good Progress || Filing
MRI today - no blocking issues with hitting Feature Freeze||
|| desktop-karmic-social-from-the-start || Good Progress || Decided not
ship in main, as we have no room on the CD, it's coming in late, and
there are no dependencies on it ||
|| desktop-karmic-input-methods || Good Progress || ibus-anthy, -hangul
and -chewing need to be synced from debian, then the seeds can be
changed ||

 Now Beta Available for Implemented 
|| '''Blueprint''' || '''Status''' || '''Notes''' ||
|| destkop-karmic-quickly || Beta Available || v 0.2 due in universe
when desktopcouch is available ||
|| desktop-karmic-gnome-3 || Beta Available || zeitgeist and gnome-shell
are in universe, may continue to remove deprecated libraries as time
allows ||
|| desktop-karmic-evolution-couchdb || Implemented || feature complete||
|| desktop-karmic-gdmconfig || Implemented || Has been in the product
for about two weeks ||
|| desktop-karmic-bluetooth-stack || Beta Available ||  documentation
and testing are left ||
|| desktop-karmic-firefox-3.5 || Beta Available || Default in Karmic
since A5 ||

 Open Office 
 * 3.1.1 (final) release will be Thu Aug 27.
 * Still need new OOo images from kwwii

 Kubuntu 
 * Generally in good shape for feature freeze lots  of green on
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Todo
 * Plasma netbook needs FFe
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plasma-netbook/+bug/412101
 * Knetworkmanager is in reasonable shape but we'll need to keep
updating it from upstream
 * DX still have a patch due for Quassel for message indicator and
patches to tidy up other notifications
 * MIR still pending for gpsd and MIRs due for
plasma-widget-{facebook,kubuntu-qa-feedback,kimpanel,googlecalendar}
 * packagekit 0.5 due but waiting on policykit-kde 1.0 support from
upstream
 * xsplash equivalent needs doing
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuKarmicXsplash  

 OLS 
 * U1:
   * U1 client release due tomorrow which includes bandwidth throttling,
resumable upload and usage quotas 
 * Couch: 
   * CouchDB 0.10 snapshot uploaded, there will be one more patch needed
fixing an oauth bug
   * desktopcouch release today or tomorrow with replication
   * evolution-couchdb release today or tomorrow, then ready for CD 
 * This will bring desktopcouch and couchdb to the install CD

 DX 
 * xsplash:
   * release due today with the last of the features for karmic
 * indicator updates and session applet (fusa replacement) was uploaded
this morning.
 * notify-osd:
   * release due tomorrow morning, including the placement changes

 Gwibber 
 * Merging new

Desktop Team 20090901 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-01

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Pedro Villavicencio (pedro)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy (awe)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting

=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * X Status and Mesa 7.6
 * pulseaudio status
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
{{http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/karmic/burndown.png}}
 * Review activity reports

== Partner Update ==

= Online Services =
 [[UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status|Status]]
 * desktopcouch 0.3 is broken, fix is coming today

= DX =
 * notify-osd 0.9.19
   * moved notifications to near the center on the right, this is not a
bug.
   * [[https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#Outside%20the%20bubble|New
placement]]
 * Indicator applet and related libraries all uploaded
   * This includes the fusa replacement, indicator-applet-session
 * xsplash
   * Final artwork is in which will be ready for upload for Thursday

== X Status and Mesa 7.6 ==
 * Intel engineers worked over the weekend to fix a bug that manifested
itself by causing Compiz to consume 100% of the CPU.
 * The fix was confirmed fixed by the desktop team and kernel QA
(ogasawara)
 * The fix has been merged with the Ubuntu Kernel and upstream kernel as
well
 * Bryce expects this has fixed other X issues as well, and is reviewing
the bug database for this purpose
 * Bryce sees no reason not to continue with the current plan to ship
mesa 7.6

== pulseaudio ==
 * Last week rickspencer3 encountered significant stability issues with
pulseaudio
 * pedro did an analysis of the bug reports, and did not observe a spike
of new pulseaudio bugs during this time
 * rickspencer3's pulseaudio problems were resolved by a dist-upgrade
today
 * TheMuso is investigating

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * KDE 4.3.1 is uploaded and working well
 * Upstream Plasma Netbook has just decided to depend on KDE 4.4,
Kubuntu team is investigating what upstream components can work with
Karmic Kubuntu, using KDE 4.3
 * usb-creator-kde is fixed and working as well as the gtk version
 * quassel patch for message indicator has issues that need fixed before
upload.  aurelien has said he wants to create Ayatana style
notifications too as this is easier than he expected, would need FFe.
 * rickspencer3 encourages all netbook owners to try Kubuntu netbook
version and provide feedback after alpha 5. Good weekend project.

== Other Business ==
 * Open Office 3.1.1 final tested and uploaded today

== Activity reports ==

=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===

 * vacation
 * some network-manager and friends daily fix attempts

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
 * langpack-o-matic:
  * build new language packs for Karmic
  * updated all language-support metapackages
 * language-selector:
  * adding a combobox for choosing the Input Method
  * general debugging
 * misc:
  * testing ibus
  * booking flights for the launchpad-translations sprint in Belgrade

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===
 * Confcall with AMD about upcoming -fglrx release scheduling
 * Cherrypick some mesa bugfixes
 * Prepared and uploaded mesa and libdrm git snapshots
 * Updated several machines to latest karmic; reported bugs discovered
 * Studied CDROM use case, analyzed that all issues found are
   appropriately reported, and wrote blog summarizing situation.
 * Detailed review of recent xserver-xorg-video-ati changes upstream
 * Updated/bugfixed Arsenal cronjobs
 * Wrote a general purpose configurable lplib script to request bug
   reporters re-test when a video driver is updated
 * Reorganized test equipment
 * Assisted kees with -nvidia/-fglrx security improvement
 * Analysis/upstreaming of 100% compiz freeze bug.  Tested downgrading
   mesa.  Tested/verified kernel patch.

=== Chris Cheney (calc) ===
 * OEM work
 * Prepared openoffice.org 1:3.1.1-1ubuntu1 for karmic and jaunty ppa.
(Uploading)
 * Prepared openoffice.org-l10n 1:3.1.1-1ubuntu1 for karmic and jaunty
ppa. (Uploading)
 * OOo bug triage

=== Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) ===
done:
 * Package, test and upload KDE 4.3.1
 * Get remaining packages we want through MIR and on the CD into main
before FF
 * investigate kimpanel for CJK support, tidy up packaging and upload
 * fix Amarok packaging merge
 * Update low disk space patch from upstream
 * Patch kmail and Kopete for message indicator
 * Investigate quassel message indicator patch and report bugs
 * Day off on Friday

todo:
 * Next alpha

=== Ken VanDine (kenvandine) ===
 Last week: 
 * Pre

Desktop Team 20090908 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-08

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Tony Espy (awe)
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)

=== Discussion ===
 * Updating apps for message menu
 * pidgin versus empathy in Karmic

=== Status Updates ===
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

=== Any other business ===

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to disuss piddin/empathy with seb128 and pitti
and make call for Karmic
 * ACTION: all to review release targeted bugs and fix the milestoned
ones
 * ACTION: pitti to try to repro x freeze and log bug

== Partner Update ==
 * no update as kenvandine is away today

=== Discussion ===
 Modifying apps to work with Messaging Menu 
 *
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/indicator-messages/+milestone/ubuntu-9.10-beta-freeze
 * rickspencer3 asks that anyone who has knowledge about these apps,
please help out by assigning to themselves

 pidgin versus empathy 
The current Plan of Record is to install Empathy with Karmic, but to
leave Pidgin in place if the user is upgrading. Pidgin won't be
installed on new installs.

We've received feedback about this plan. Discussed at length. Pros and
cons summarized below. rickspencer3 will meet with seb128 and pitti to
make the final determination.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to disuss piddin/empathy with seb128 and pitti
and make call for Karmic

|| || '''Pro''' || '''Con''' ||
|| '''Empathy''' || Tracks Gnome Schedule<>Comes with
Telepathy<>Change before LTS || Still Crashing<>No OTR
support<> Still pending migration issues (logs not migrated, some
bugs, some features not available in empathy)<>Orca is not yet
modified to work easily with Empathy ||
|| '''Pidgin''' || Well tested<>Decent IRC client || Revert would
happen after feature freeze ||

 Release Bugs 
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' || '''Tags''' ||
|| 403581 || restart required notification and button not shown in ffox
3.5 || asac || Triaged || High || ubufox (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
ubuntu-9.10-beta ||  || 2009-07-23 15:38:59.556529+00:00 ||  ||
|| 422930 || after upgrade, CUPS refuses to use existing PSC-750 'usb'
config and creates a new PSC-750-2 'hp' config || pitti || Incomplete ||
High || cups (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  || None || amd64
apport-bug regression-potential ||
|| 402175 || gtk_tree_view_column_get_cell_renderers implicitly
converted to pointer || seb128 || Triaged || High || gnumeric (Ubuntu
Karmic) || karmic || karmic-alpha-6 ||  || 2009-07-22 04:48:59.782188
+00:00 ||  ||
|| 388898 || [MIR] empathy dependencies || ken-vandine || Incomplete ||
High || gupnp-igd (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  || None ||  ||
|| 388898 || [MIR] empathy dependencies || ken-vandine || Incomplete ||
High || telepathy-butterfly (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  || None ||
||
|| 417009 || all openoffice apps die in
'com::sun::star::ucb::InteractiveAugmentedIOException' on armel in
karmic || ccheney || Confirmed || High || openoffice.org (Ubuntu Karmic)
|| karmic || karmic-alpha-6 ||  || 2009-08-28 14:57:20.855069+00:00 ||
apport-bug armel ||
|| 422829 || mozilla-nss.pc is broken || asac || Fix Committed || High
|| xulrunner-1.9.1 (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10-beta ||  ||
2009-09-01 20:35:44.20+00:00 ||  ||
|| 425793 || No AppArmor restrictions in Karmic || pitti || Triaged ||
High || gdm-guest-session (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10-beta
||  || 2009-09-07 16:17:49.848292+00:00 || regression-potential ||
|| 400485 || Empathy sounds not in default ubuntu theme || seb128 ||
Confirmed || Low || ubuntu-sounds (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  ||
2009-07-17 15:39:17.308185+00:00 ||  ||
|| 135548 || Action on critical battery isn't triggered || pitti ||
Triaged || Medium || gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
||  ||

Desktop Team 20090915 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-15

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Tony Espy (awe)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting

=== Announcements ===

=== Status Updates ===
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

=== Discussion ===
 * What should be updated here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage

=== Any other business ===
 * asac: Please test the new NM with a 3G modem if you have one

== Actions from this meeting ==
All actions are to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage:
 * ACTION: TheMuso to check on how to call the audio symptom script and
update the wiki accordingly
 * ACTION: robert_ancell to check on Graphic Environment section
 * ACTION: pitti to add section about storage devices

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to disuss piddin/empathy with seb128 and pitti
and make call for Karmic
  * RESULT: we are sticking with the POR:
   * Empathy will be installed in new installs, pidgin won't be
   * Empathy will be installed on upgrade installs, pidgin won't be
removed
   * Empathy will offer to import pidgin settings on first run
 * ACTION: all to review release targeted bugs and fix the milestoned
ones
  * RESULT: Release bugs decreased
 * ACTION: pitti to try to repro x freeze and log bug
  * RESULT: patches for a potential fix are available
   * https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22336
   * Mesa and kernel update available for testing

== Partner Update ==
UbuntuOne:
 * desktopcouch
   * bug fix release with oauth enabled/required planned today
 * couchdb
   * New snapshot uploaded today, fixes issues that prevented enabling
oauth
 * couchdb-glib 
   * the latest release has oauth enabled
 * bindwood
   * bug fix release with oauth enabled is planned for this week
 * ubuntuone-client
   * There will likely be a UI freeze exception requested to deal with
the preferences dialog usability issue

DX:
 * [[DesktopExperienceTeam/KarmicWeeklyReleases|Weekly releases]]

== Kubuntu Update ==
 - KubuntuKarmicXsplash implemented
 * mostly set for alpha 6 but need to upload new python-qt4 to fix bug
428200
 * Launchpad bug 428200 in ubiquity "Installer crashed in set
timezone" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428200
 * jockey-kde doesn't seem to work until jockey-gtk is installed, need
to investigate more
 * kmail has been patched for a mail deletion bug, going through testing
 * netbook taking shape quite nicely but won't have everything we want
due to upstream change of plans and will have to be considered a tech
preview for marketing

== Release Status ==
{{http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/karmic/burndown.png}}

The team discussed the following release targeted bugs, as well as bugs
that are being tracked as part of the release status here:
http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/karmic/report.html

The summary of the discussion was to stay mindful of "must fix" bugs,
versus "want to fix" bugs.

|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' || '''Tags''' ||
|| 401823 || (firefox:24993): Gdk-WARNING **: XID collision, trouble
ahead - overeager XID caching || asac || Triaged || High || firefox-3.5
(Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||  ||  || 2009-07-29 12:37:13.696516+00:00 ||
apport-collected ||
|| 417009 || all openoffice apps die in
'com::sun::star::ucb::InteractiveAugmentedIOException' on armel in
karmic || ccheney || Confirmed || High || openoffice.org (Ubuntu Karmic)
|| karmic || karmic-alpha-6 ||  || 2009-08-28 14:57:20.855069+00:00 ||
apport-bug armel ||
|| 412601 || [MIR] indicator-session || ken-vandine || Incomplete ||
High || indicator-session (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||
|| None ||  ||
|| 425793 || No AppArmor restrictions in Karmic || pitti || In Progress
|| High || gdm-guest-session (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
ubuntu-9.10-beta ||  || 2009-09-07 16:17:49.848292+00:00 ||
regression-potential ||
|| 223212 || No

Desktop Team 20091006 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-10-06


= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy (awe)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Agenda ==
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports

== Partner Update ==
=== UbuntuOne: ===
 * couchdb
   * will have either a new snapshot (with only a couple revisions) or a
cherry picked patch ready by this evening
 * desktopcouch
   * needs a new release, will be ready by thursday.  Fixes a bug
syncing to other desktops where the target db doesn't exist.
 * ubuntuone-client
   * Remove the preferences launcher
 * tomboy 
   * client side has everything it needs for syncing, but there is
currently a utf-8 related bug on the server causing crashes when receive
some characters

=== DX: ===
 * [[DesktopExperienceTeam/KarmicWeeklyReleases|Weekly releases]]
 * sprinting this week
 * string change in the session applet, s/New Session/Switch User/,
which affects translations.  The translations team has been notified.
[[Bug:94]]
 * user list has been removed from the session applet, to be re-added
for Lucid
   * gdm doesn't provide all the interfaces we need
   * to be re-added for Lucid
 * libdbusmenu menu ordering bug has been fixed, please let us know if
you see problems with it

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * KDE 4.3.2 and Qt 4.5.3 in the archive, our final bugfix update before
release
 * KDM/ksmserver hangs on logout, we have a workaround though incase we
don't find the root cause
 * KPackageKit fixed, missing dependency at fault
 * some kcontrol translations broken, problem diagnosed, rosetta people
have been poked
 * microblog broken, still to investigate
 * "tech-preview" warning to be added to kubuntu netbook ubiquity,
should be easy though
 * hardy -> karmic upgrade now in dist upgrade tool, adept needs patched
in hardy-updates to make it work

== Release Status ==
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' || '''Tags''' ||
|| 401823 || (firefox:24993): Gdk-WARNING **: XID collision, trouble
ahead - overeager XID caching || asac || Triaged || High || firefox-3.5
(Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-07-29
12:37:13.696516+00:00 || apport-collected ||
|| 401823 || (firefox:24993): Gdk-WARNING **: XID collision, trouble
ahead - overeager XID caching || asac || Triaged || High || gtk+2.0
(Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-07-29
12:36:07.417016+00:00 || apport-collected ||
|| 430067 || ModemManager PUK-locks sim cards if the wrong PIN code is
entered once || asac || Triaged || High || modemmanager (Ubuntu Karmic)
|| karmic ||  ||  || 2009-09-15 14:51:53.237529+00:00 ||  ||
|| 429835 || [MASTER] chrome error when viewing untrusted https site
using firefox with non en-US locale on karmic || asac || Triaged || High
|| firefox-3.5 (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  ||
2009-09-15 09:10:08.653064+00:00 || i18n metabug xpipo ||
|| 396156 || Help→About does not function (abrowser-3.5,
jaunty-proposed) || asac || In Progress || High || firefox-3.5 (Ubuntu
Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-07-06 15:06:54.694398+00:00
||  ||
|| 435073 || NetworkManager 0.8 can not get IPv4 address for wired Auto
connections because IPv6 fails || asac || Triaged || High ||
network-manager (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  ||
2009-09-29 11:06:41.591934+00:00 || apport-bug i386 ||
|| 427734 || ubufox not loaded in Firefox 3.5 on karmic alpha 6 CD ||
asac || Triaged || High || ubufox (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-09-11 07:19:12.637671+00:00 ||  ||
|| 440987 || MASTER Firefox 3.5 Plugin Finder Service in Ubuntu Karmic
9.10 displays No suitable plugins were found for flash || asac ||
Triaged || High || ubufox (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||
|| 2009-10-03 11:05:39.695710+00:00 || apport-bug i386 ||
|| 439138 || [karmic] Xorg 100% CPU utilization -- only after first
login || bryceharrington || Incomplete || High || xorg-server (Ubuntu
Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  || None || ubuntu-boot ||
|| 423907 || FTBFS

Desktop Team 20091013 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Short Meeting today to focus on bug fixing

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-10-13


= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (calc)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Tony Espy (awe)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==

== Agenda ==
 * Last Karmic Gnome Release
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * What issues are we working on that are not on the list?
 * What issues do we need help on?

== Last Karmic Gnome Release ==
 * robert_ancell and seb128 will be working on uploading latest gnome
starting next Monday
 * refrain from assigning work to them during next week
 * pitch in and package and upload if available

== Release Bugs/Release Status ==
=== Release Targeted bugs ===
|| '''Id''' || '''Title''' || '''Assigned To''' || '''Status''' ||
'''Importance''' || '''Package''' || '''Release''' || '''Milestone''' ||
'''Team''' || '''Date Confirmed''' || '''Tags''' ||
|| 396156 || Help→About does not function (abrowser-3.5,
jaunty-proposed) || asac || In Progress || High || firefox-3.5 (Ubuntu
Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-07-06 15:06:54.694398+00:00
||  ||
|| 435073 || NetworkManager 0.8 can not get IPv4 address for wired Auto
connections because IPv6 fails || asac || Triaged || High ||
network-manager (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  ||
2009-09-29 11:06:41.591934+00:00 || apport-bug i386 ||
|| 435329 || Empathy is unusable if indicator applet is not on the panel
|| ken-vandine || Confirmed || High || empathy (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic
|| ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-10-02 07:50:57.731774+00:00 ||
regression-potential ||
|| 434878 || video calls fail frequently || ken-vandine || In Progress
|| Medium || empathy (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic || ubuntu-9.10 ||  ||
2009-09-22 21:00:53.841456+00:00 ||  ||
|| 440290 || iPod only being detected as Drive, not as iPod || pitti ||
Fix Committed || High || devicekit-disks (Ubuntu Karmic) || karmic ||
ubuntu-9.10 ||  || 2009-10-12 15:31:17.543230+00:00 ||  ||
 * bug 435073 is hard to reproduce and diagnose
 * bug 434878 is fixed enough to ship for karmic, removing from release
radar
 * bug 449589 in alsa-utils "Alsa mixer Master Front volume resets to
minimum on startup" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/449589

=== Other Targeted or Important Bugs ===
 * xserver-xorg-video-intel "kdm does not restart X server (that crashed
on logout)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/432521
 * 450692,openoffice.org-common dependencies changed, now pulling wrong
theme onto the CDs,ccheney,Triaged,High,openoffice.org (Ubuntu
Karmic),karmic,,,2009-10-13 20:14:30.384882+00:00,amd64 apport-bug
 * bug 424132 in openoffice.org "[kubuntu] OOo KDE file dialog is
utterly broken." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/424132
 * Launchpad bug 425952 in gdm-guest-session "gdm requiring password for
guest session" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/425952
 * bug 359975 in gtk+2.0 "evince sometimes yield error "Error printing:
Too many failed attempts"" [High,Triaged]
https://launchpad.net/bugs/359975
 * bug 419143 in evince "Printing from evince (and perhaps other GTK
apps) to PostScript printers is broken" [High,New]
https://launchpad.net/bugs/419143


-- 
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ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
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Desktop Team 20091110 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-11-10

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alexander Sack (asac)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  

=== Eastern Edition ===
'''Cancelled Due to Travel'''
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney) - swap day
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128) - sprinting

== Agenda ==
 * Reviews by eow
 * Blueprints blueprints blueprints

=== Reviews by eow ===
Next step in process is to do your self-eval. Please do that by eow this
week, so that I can write the manager part by the 20th.

 * Some people are reporting problems with the system. rickspencer3
requested they follow up directly with HR to resolve.

== Blueprints ==
 * Please make sure that your blueprints are tight:
  * Good summaries
  * Current status, links, etc... available on Whiteboard
  * The right people are subscribed
  * Ensure they are on the schedule
  * Tell pitti or rickspencer3 when you add a new one which needs
accepting for uds-l and scheduling

 * Blueprints for Dekstop Team are largely complete and scheduled:
https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu?searchtext=desktop-lucid
 * new blueprints are trickling in
 * Kubuntu team is scheduling today
 * robbiew to round up and rationalize boot related blueprints

== Activity reports ==
=== Alexander Sack (asac) ===
 * vacation
 * firefox 3.5.5 update prepared and uploaded (needs to be released
still)
 * prepared a fix for lp:432205 (dsl connection failures) to upstream
git; please test daily builds tomorrow
 * submitted evaluation and fixes for murrine and crux engine to
bugzilla fixing evolution hang (lp:460710)
 * gtk+2.0 SRU - fix the XID collision output which filled up /home dir
for some users; uploaded etc.

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
 * Blueprinting
 * Drafting performance review answers
 * Font testing for OEM team
 * Translations related discussions about LP translation tarball export
times for Ubuntu releases, Karmic updates enabled now, next
language-pack update will happen on Saturday and will get uploaded into
the PPA.
 * Cleaning up my bugmail
 * Answering lots of bugs

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===
 * Spent most of week investigating a bunch of -nvidia upgrade bugs.
Seems several different bugs are conspiring to make a really poor user
experience.  Posted summary to ubuntu-devel and ubuntu-x, followed up on
issue, summarized analysis here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Bugs/Nvidia
 * Fixed #474806 (thanks to slangasek) to finally sort out the issue due
to gdm dropping FailsafeXServer - now X has its own upstart script for
this.
 * Fixed #477149 by making failsafe-x use static xorg.conf instead of
using dexconf for this.  (dexconf no longer generates xorg.confs)
 * Update process-xorg-retargeting.py to make it reassign xorg bug
packages more reliably.  Leave bugs that appear to be workflow,
packaging, or failsafe-x issues.
 * Triaging of xorg, -intel, and -nvidia bugs.  Updated Arsenal scripts
to better handle checkbox bugs.
 * Added "Hierarchy of Bug Quality" section to page at
https://wiki.canonical.com/BryceHarrington/BetterBugs
 * Review Lucid blueprints in prep for UDS
 * Wrote blueprint for proprietary driver improvements
 * Performance review - drafted answers; web app broke when I tried to
submit them; will try again later.

=== Chris Cheney (ccheney) ===
 * Returning from Travel

=== Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) ===
done:
 * merging base KDE packages
 * reviewing merges done by others
 * discussing rosetta/KDE with rosetta and Kubuntu people
 * reviewing specs for UDS
 * discussing issues with gdb in karmic with Qt developers

 * Day off last Friday

todo:
 * merges
 * UDS

=== Ken VanDine (kenvandine) ===
 * Lucid planning
   * Porting empathy indicator patch to a service that uses
mission-control-5
   * Social from the start, looking at alternatives or ways to make
gwibber more robust and creating a plan
 * Desktop Integration planning, worked with OLS and DX teams
 * Led Ubuntu Open Week session on telepathy
 * performance review

=== Luke Yelavich (TheMuso) ===
=== Accessibility ===
 * Merged accessibility packages for lucid, gnome-orca, at-spi, brltty,
gnome-mag.
 * Discussion with upstream about various accessibility issues to do
with GNOME, like carrying assistive technology settings from the gdm
session to a user's session, and future developments of accessibility
for gnome shell,w ebkit etc.

=== Audio ===
 * Audio bug triaging, bugs in question are against pulseaudio, alsa
userspace, and the kernel for hardware enablement.
 * Updated alsa-driver, alsa-lib, alsa-utils, and alsa-plugins to
version 1.0.2

Desktop Team 20091202 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-01

== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) - holiday
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso) - moving house

== Agenda ==
 * some manager announcements
  * Welcome tselliot
  * 1-1 calls
  * UNE and didrocks
  * receipts and robert_ancell's scanning app
 * Blueprints, work items, milestones, specs (pitti)
 * Ideas for speeding up desktop startup time (seb128)

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to track down robert's scanning tool
  * RESULT: It's in his PPA:
https://launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/+archive/ppa
 * ACTION: seb128 to add initial work items to UNE session blueprint
  * RESULT: didrocks beat him to it:
https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-unr-session
 * ACTION: robert_ancell to do seed changes for new games
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to confirm robert_ancell commitment to GDM/GDM
Greeter refactor
  * RESULT: Based on current OEM commitment, documenting the current API
is in scope for A2, rest of the work may be done post A2
 * ACTION: kenvandine to investigate improving startup time of Messaging
Menu and related tasks
 * ACTION: ricspencer3 to set up call with pitti, bryce, and tselliot to
get tselliot on board
 * ACTION: all to try robert_ancell's new scanning tool

== some manager announcements ==
 * Welcome back tselliot here on OEM team rotation
  * bryce will be his "buddy"
  * will work on xorg drivers and packaging gnome initially
 * weekly 1-1 calls: please set these up with me if they are not on your
calendar
 * UNE and didrocks: UNE will be moved to desktop team, and didrocks
will be the maintainer
 * receipts and robert_ancell's scanning app: expenses coming up, please
give robert's app a try and file bugs

== Blueprints, work items, milestones, specs (pitti) ==
pitti covered A2 targeted blueprints that had no work items, or
otherwise seems risky:
 * desktop-lucid-unr-session has no work items (fixed)
 * desktop-lucid-powermanagement-tweaks has no work items (Michael Frey
to draft his part)
 * regarding
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-xorg-halsectomy, 
bryce plans merging 1.7.1 from experimental this week
 * regarding
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-default-apps, need 
to seed two new games
 * regarding
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-social-from-the-start,
 seems there is too much in alpha 2 from this blueprint, some work items have 
since been moved out of A2
 * regarding
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-gdm-custom-greeter-support,
 robert_ancell is on OEM rotation for this release, so may not have time to 
complete these items
 * regarding
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-empathy-indicator, 
will be difficult to fit this in along with Social From the Start work, as 
kenvandine owns both pieces

rickspencer3 closed this part of the meeting by stressing that it is
better to pull work items in from A3 than to postpone them from A2, so
encourages team members to be reasonably conservative in their work item
targeting for A2.

== Ideas for speeding up desktop startup time (seb128) ==
seb128 led a session on improving load time for the desktop.
* budget for desktop load time is 4 seconds from GDM
* a current boot chart is available here:
http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb128-dellmini-lucid-20091201-1.png
* with nautilus and xsession.d both not loaded at boot time, time is
still 8 seconds, so need to get back 4 seconds
* pitti is working on caching application data for application menu,
should buy some time
* other ideas for saving time were discussed, some at length. Example:
removing the desktop background image saves .5 seconds. xsplash takes .8
seconds
* Current plan is to remove many applets, and to load with only one
panel, and to use metacity rather than compiz by default

== Activity reports ==
=== Alberto Milone (tseliot) ===
 * foundations-lucid-boot-experience spec:
  * Write a Plymouth plugin which can replace Usplash features - In
progress
 * desktop-lucid-xorg-proprietary-drivers spec:
  * Start looking at the debian packages for nvidia for a first clean up
- TODO
 * desktop-lucid-touchscreen-handling spec
  * Identify one or more target touchscreen hardware platforms to focus
on - DONE
 * becoming core-dev - In progress:
  * recommendation from the MOTU council: DONE
  * approval from the Technical board: TODO

=== Ar

Desktop Team 20091208 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-08

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Alexander Sack (asac)  

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot) - National holiday
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce) - Holiday
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso) - Moving House

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Lucid blueprints
 * 2010 Events
 * UNE
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to track down robert's scanning tool
  * RESULT: It's in his PPA:
https://launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/+archive/simple-scan
 * ACTION: seb128 to add initial work items to UNE session blueprint
  * RESULT: didrocks beat him to it:
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-unr-session
 * ACTION: robert_ancell to do seed changes for new games
  * DONE (by pitti, needs core-dev)
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to confirm robert_ancell commitment to GDM/GDM
Greeter refactor
  * RESULT: Based on current OEM commitment, documenting the current API
is in scope for A2, rest of the work may be done post A2
 * ACTION: kenvandine to investigate improving startup time of Messaging
Menu and related tasks
  * RESULT: tedg added profiling code, next update of libindicate should
bring some speedup
 * ACTION: ricspencer3 to set up call with pitti, bryce, and tselliot to
get tselliot on board
  * RESULT: tseliot set up a weekly meeting with rickspencer3, we used
the first one to confer with pitti
 * ACTION: all to try robert_ancell's new scanning tool
  * RESULT: ArneGoetje tried, does not talk with his scanner (xsane
works); will contact Robert

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ArneGoetje to talk to Robert about scanner failure in simple-scan
 * Everyone to add their conference interests to list below
 * Martin to followup on UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-une-applications
drafting
 * Martin to followup on UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-desktop-cloud drafting

== Partner Update ==
 * DX [[DesktopExperienceTeam/LucidWeeklyReleases|Weekly releases]] to
start again this Thursday
 * Decorations and RGBA code was released into a PPA along with a call
for testing, results tracked here:
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/491521

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * 4.4 Beta is mostly in lucid
 * Colin Watson fixed Qt
 * Remaining kdelibs problems are now fixed
 * In a few hours: ready for alpha-1

== Release Status ==
{{http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/lucid-alpha2/burndown.png}}

No alpha-1 release blockers right now.

== Lucid blueprints ==

Most are drafted/approved now. Oustanding are 

 * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-une-applications : Was not discussed at UDS,
needs followup
 * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-desktop-cloud: No drafter, needs followup

== 2010 Events ==
We need to create a list of the events in which the Ubuntu Platform team
will be participating in 2010. Please indicate which ones you want to
attend in 2010, and add any events which are missing.

 * Camp KDE
 * linux.conf.au
  * robert-ancell
 * FOSDEM
 * Black Hat
 * Scale
 * Pycon
 * Cloud computing
 * CELF (USA)
 * CELF Europe
 * Linux Collaboration Summit
  * pitti (?)
 * Java One
 * Usenix 09
 * LinuxTag
 * Akademy - JonathanRiddell
 * Guadec
 * Ottawa Linux Symposium
 * Debcamp
 * Debconf
 * OSCON
 * USENIX Security
 * Atlanta Linux Fest
 * LDAP
 * LinuxCon
 * LinuxPlumbers
  * pitti (?)
 * X Developers
 * Maemo Summit
 * OOoCon

== UNE ==
 * Desktop team to deliver UNE going forward
 * didrocks will be the maintainer
 * Until didrocks starts, only goal is for SteveK to do UNR -> UNE
rename
 * mini-sprint in January to get first desktop owned UNE image built

== Other Business ==

== Activity reports ==

=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===

=== Chris Cheney (ccheney) ===
 * Sick Friday (Dec 4)
 * Worked on list of xulrunner for firefox conversion
 * Working on getting OOo 3.1.1 available for Hardy users
 * OOo bug triage

=== Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) ===

done:
 * Holiday all last week
 * Security updates for kdelibs, kdebase
 * Review status of KDE 4.4 beta packaging and uploaded
 * e-mail catchup

todo:
 * Get KDE 4.4 beta finished
 * Alpha 1

=== Ken VanDine (kenvandine) ===
 * Updated empathy to 2.29.3  
   * ported the libindicator patch
   * patched to always take focus when raised
   * patched to append notifications
 * Ported indicator-session from libempathy to telepathy-glib
 * added gtk-doc support to indicator-application (not quite complete)
 * worked on pull

Desktop Team 20100105 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-01-05


= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)

== Apologies ==
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter) - vacation
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell) - vacation
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Mozilla Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * RESULT: ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up on conference attendance
with randa and team
 * ACTION: pitti to create a proposed a3 work item list.

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION: Martin to create conference attendance wiki page and ask team
for adding themselves to it by mail
  * RESULT: ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up on this with randa and
team

== Partner Update ==
 * [[DesktopExperienceTeam/LucidWeeklyReleases|Weekly releases]]
 * This Thursday's release will be the last release of Dx bits that will
be in Alpha 2
 * OLS is finalizing their planning while also working, especially on
server side components

== Mozilla Update ==
ccheney is backporting epiphany-browser along with its dependencies:
libsoup2.4, webkit, etc... Because they use newer glib2.0 than what is
in hardy he plans to copy the needed functions over so we won't need a
full backport of glib as well.

== Release Status ==
{{http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/lucid-alpha2/burndown.png}}
 * Desktop team is considerably above the trend line, 27 active items,
but there should be about 13. Work items will be completed or postponed
until we are under the trend line by eow.
 * Discussed planning for a3 iteration. rickspencer3 proposes that the
desktop team pursue fewer total work items than were completed in a2 in
order to leave time for integration and bug fixing. rickspencer3 further
proposes that the desktop team bring few if any work items into the
final iteration. In this way, making the a3 milestone the last
development milestone for the desktop team, again to focus on bug fixing
and integration.
 * ACTION: pitti to create a proposed a3 work item list.

=== Bugs ===
Bug counts seem normal, but the team is still striving for more
efficient bug management. rickspencer3 generated a report of all bugs
assigned to a package that someone on the canonical-desktop-team is
subscribed to. This list is almost 15,000 bugs. rickspencer3 to analyze
for potential hot spots.
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to attach bug list to wiki.

 New Bugs 
[[/NewBugs|46 New bugs are assigned]]

=== High/Critical Bugs ===
[[/HighBugs|62 Critical or High bugs are assigned]]



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Desktop Team 20100119 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-01-05

== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Didier Roche (didrocks)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * X Update
 * Mozilla Update
 * Desktop Start Time
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Audio Update (Eastern Edition)
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

=== Discussion ===
== Partner Update ==
 * Online Services:
   * Ubuntu One Music store is progressing, expected to land in alpha-3
   * An early version of the rhythmbox plugin taking shape, more to come
soon.
   * libubuntuone, the gtk widgets for ubuntu one will be ready for
lucid soon, this includes the music store and contact picker gtk
widgets.
 * DX:
   * [[hDesktopExperienceTeam/LucidWeeklyReleases|Weekly Releases]].
== Kubuntu Update ==
 * alpha 2 done and in reasonable shape
 * KDE SC 4.4 RC 2 coming today
 * semantic desktop still blocked on virtuoso, kees promises soon
 * kubuntu-notifications-helper now on the CD

== X Update ==
 * The diversions -> alternatives change was bumpy but seems to be
working well now.
 * Our signal rethrowing patch for apport seems to be the cause of
recent xorg-server crashes.  We've disabled it for now.
 * Question from Intel: Lucid is still using 2.9.1. Intel already
released 2.10 in 09Q4. Does Ubuntu plan to upgrade -intel 2.10 in Lucid?
Yes, it is on todo list.
 * Intel graphics is having a lot of instability issues due to some
recent power saving changes to their code. This results in weird
flickering and then screen blanking after a resume/suspend. Turning off
the power saving feature restores stability. rickspencer3 to follow up
with Intel to ensure it is on their radar.

== Mozilla Update ==
 * libsoup2.4 working mostly working, except for one error that has not
been tracked down.
 * The porting project was expected to be further along by this point.
ccheney following up with asac to see if contractor resources can be
deployed to help move porting along faster.

== Release Status ==
{{http://macaroni.ubuntu.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-3.svg}}
 * RC bugs seem under control
 * No work items have been set to done in the last 5 days

== Desktop Start Time ==
 * rickspencer3 is concerned that speed improvements have flat-lined.
 * seb128 to produce detailed profiling chart of gnome-panel start time
be eow
 * didrocks to take over some gnome packaging to make more bandwidth for
seb128
 * rickspencer3 has requested that OEM team free robert_ancell for one
to work on gnome-panel start time

== Audio Update ==
 * "crack of the day" alsa-driver packages being in the ubuntu-audio-dev
PPA now
 * new bugfix snapshot of pulseaudio now in lucid bugfixes since 0.9.21
(contributed by crimsun)
  
== Activity reports ==
=== Alberto Milone (tseliot) ===
Blueprint work:
 * desktop-lucid-xorg-proprietary-drivers:
   * Further clean-up of nvidia-$flavours and mesa and increased
robustness of the alternatives system.
   * LP: #432172: further work to be compliant with the behaviour of
libvdpau, as described by Nvidia
   * LP: #506547 Some GL apps won't run: libGLU.so.1
   * Fixed issue about missing libglx.so and libdri.so in
xserver-xorg-core.
   * Working on ia32-libs (currently half broken) so that it can be
updated (LP: #506437) and adapted to the new alternatives system (LP:
#506435)
   * Bug fixing for the Alternatives class in nvidia-common.
   * Completed the release notes for Alpha 2 about Jockey and drivers in
general.
=== Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje) ===
Blueprint work:
 * community-lucid-community-participation-in-coordinating-translations:
  * Documenting language-pack generation process:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuTranslationsCoordinators/Actions/LanguagePackGeneration

Other work:
 * Fixing upstream Mozilla translations, so that they get imported into
Launchpad without problems
 * Langpack-o-matic got moved to another server; did a test run to test
if everything is still working like it should

=== Bryce Harrington (bryce) ===
 * US Holiday: MLK B-Day Jan 18
 * Triage recent xorg-server crashes
   * Is my rethrow-signals patch working?
   * Review ubuntu patches that touch os/log.c - 100 and 160 in
particular
   * Disable apport for xorg-server, since the enablement patch is
causing widespread X crashes
   * Fix crash logging into guest session on lucid
 * high karma report:  Exclude multiple X bugtasks against same bug
 * Install al

Re: Desktop Team 20100119 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-01-19 at 16:35 -0800, Rick Spencer wrote:
> Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
> them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-01-05
> 
Make that:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-01-19
> 


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Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

All -

I am writing to apprise you of two small but important changes coming to
Firefox in Lucid.  I have asked the desktop team to start preparing
these changes to make them available in Lucid as soon as reasonably
possible. Probably on the order of weeks.

Change #1
In Lucid, the default home page will respect the search provider
settings that you have set in the "Chrome". (The "Chrome" is Mozilla's
term for the little search box to the upper right, reachable by
control-K, for instance). For Lucid, this will definitely work for
switching between Google and Yahoo!, we don't yet know what other
providers will be in scope for Lucid. If a user has Google set as their
search provider,they will have exactly the experience they do today. If
they switch to Yahoo!, the default home page will switch to using a
Yahoo! search. If they switch back to Google, the default home page will
switch back to using the Google search, exactly like today. Searching
from Chrome will continue to work exactly as it does today.

Change #2
Change #2 is changing the default search provider in Firefox to Yahoo!
Note that this won't in any way effect the ability of a user to choose
and use the search provider of their choice. It's literally 2 easily
discoverable clicks to change this setting, a simple matter of switching
to that search provider in the chrome by clicking on the icon and
choosing the desired provider. Note also that Yahoo! does not share any
personally identifiable or usage information.

Why?
I am pursuing this change because Canonical has negotiated a revenue
sharing deal with Yahoo! and this revenue will help Canonical to provide
developers and resources to continue the open development of Ubuntu and
the Ubuntu Platform. This change will help provide these resources as
well as continuing to respect our user's default search across Firefox.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 15:14 -0500, Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:

> Since Google is the current default, will the switch to Yahoo only
> have an effect on new installs?
No, this will effect upgrades if the computer is currently set to
Google. This is not because of anything special for this particular
change. This is because Ubuntu always changes to new defaults for users
who are on old defaults.

However, if you are set to wikipedia as your search provider (for
example) then that means that you are no longer using the default, so
Ubuntu won't change you to the new default.

HTH

Cheers, Rick



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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 17:36 -0500, Dan Trevino wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 4:08 PM, Rick Spencer
>  wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 15:14 -0500, Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> 
> > Since Google is the current default, will the switch to
> Yahoo only
> > have an effect on new installs?
> 
> No, this will effect upgrades if the computer is currently set
> to
> Google. This is not because of anything special for this
> particular
> change. This is because Ubuntu always changes to new defaults
> for users
> who are on old defaults.
> 
> However, if you are set to wikipedia as your search provider
> (for
> example) then that means that you are no longer using the
> default, so
> Ubuntu won't change you to the new default.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Cheers, Rick
> 

> 
> During the upgrade, are users going to be notified about this change?

Outside of release notes, probably not. I don't think it will be much
different than other times that defaults are changed in Ubuntu.

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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 20:17 -0200, Carlos Ribeiro wrote:

> 
> Given the sensitivity of this change for many people, I would ask you
> to consider keeping the current setting whatever it is (Google or
> not). People tend to be very passionate about such issues. Also, keep
> in mind that for many people, Google (still) is the official partner
> of the Mozilla Foundation. For those folks it MAY seem that Canonical
> is cutting Mozilla's revenue. While I am sure that this was not the
> intention, this is the way things are. I think Canonical should do a
> better effort to coordinate the communication of this change with the
> community to avoid bad rep.
> 
Well, in terms of not changing to the new default, that would be a bit
of a departure for how Ubuntu handles changes to defaults, and I'm not
certain why this particular change would be special cased.

In terms of Mozilla, and cutting into their revenue stream, Mozilla has
been a really good partner to Ubuntu, definitely firmly in the "good
guy" camp as far as I am concerned with regard to Linux and FOSS. We
would certainly want to do anything to damage this relationship. Suffice
to say that Mozilla was not surprised by this change, and I am confident
that we will continue to have a good relationship.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 21:03 -0200, Carlos Ribeiro wrote:

> 
> Oops. Forgot to say that this change isn't being done for technical,
> security or aesthethical reasons; it's being done for marketing
> reasons. By changing the default (of a existing & running instalation)
> you are asking your users to accept whatever deal Canonical has made.
> Even if for me it doesn't make any difference, I think this is a
> strong enough reason to proceed with care.
Well, I would say "financial" reasons rather than "marketing" reasons,
but, of course, I understand your point.

Note that we are not in any way restricting users' choice. Users are
totally free to choose their search provider, and it is very easy to
change. In the meantime, support for Ubuntu is a *good thing*. So,
agreed, we should listen to reasonable and informed feedback, and I
firmly intend to.

Cheers, Rick



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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Wed, 2010-01-27 at 15:00 +0530, Vishnoo wrote:

> 
> Users are redirected to >
> http://in.mg4.mail.yahoo.com/dc/system_requirements?os=unsupported
> 
> This happens *every* time one tries to login.[attaching screenshot]
> 
> If we are considering moving Ubuntu to Yahoo! search as default.
> Atleast their sites could be tested in Ubuntu OS. Or are we still an OS
> that isnt supported by Yahoo! ;)
> 
> Is an awkward moment when we introduce new users to Ubuntu and we get
> such warnings.
> 
> BTW ,the Yahoo!Mail does work well if the user selects Continue
> anyway. :)
Vishnoo,

Thanks for the heads up. I've asked a couple of folks here to help me
get this fixed. I'll keep you posted.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Thu, 2010-01-28 at 11:24 -0500, Martin Owens wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-01-26 at 12:03 -0800, Rick Spencer wrote:
> > All -
> > 
> > I am writing to apprise you of two small but important changes coming to
> > Firefox in Lucid.  I have asked the desktop team to start preparing
> > these changes to make them available in Lucid as soon as reasonably
> > possible. Probably on the order of weeks.
> 
> I have a thought, does changing this default setting in Firefox break
> Mozilla's branding rules? I assume that the lawyers have gone over it
> already, but you know what Mozilla are like for trying to make sure that
> Firefox is exactly the same as the one their release.
Another good question.

The answer is "no". I don't know if lawyers went over it, but as I said
in a previous response, we work with the Mozilla team, and this was
discussed with them, they were not surprised. We would not do something
to Firefox that would violate Mozilla's rules, and we for sure wouldn't
make a change like this without discussing with them first.

In sum don't worry, all is fine with our relationship with Mozilla ;)

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Lucid changes to Firefox default search provider

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2010-02-05 at 19:16 +0100, petr bug wrote:
> On 5 February 2010 16:53, David A. Cobb  wrote:
> >
> > Above all, never never compromise the principle that the user is the one to
> > say what her experience should look like -- no matter what marketing choices
> > Canonical gets involved in.
> 
> In principle, user is in charge of ~1 million settings. Obviously user
> cannot set everything, distro or upstream has to decide a defaults.
> Why is this one an exception? Yahoo does searching, Google does
> searching. Some people prefer one, some the other, many do not care.
> The setting can be altered anyway on the usual place (Edit,
> Preferences, quite discoverable).
I agree with your point. To be totally clear, it's actually quite a bit
easier to change your default search provider. It's a simple matter of
pulling it from the drop down in the upper right of Firefox.

Thanks.

Cheers, rick


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Desktop Team 20100209 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-09

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Martin Pitt (pitti) - chair
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Didier Roche (didrocks)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)

== Apologies ==
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * pitivi
 * Post A3 Mindset
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Actions from this meeting ==

 * Martin to review post-alpha 3 desktop team blueprints and discuss
with Rick and Robbie what to drop
 * Martin to discuss remaining two WIs for
UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-compiz-effects with Rick
 * Bryce to BP/WIify new work assigned on the sprint
 * Alberto to add missing alpha-3 WIs to
UbuntuSpec:foundations-lucid-boot-experience

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==

None.

== Partner Update ==

 * Online Services:
   * libubuntuone, the gtk widgets will get uploaded to lucid this week
 - dependency for rhythmbox music store plugin and the new U1 config
tool.
   * rhythmbox plugin should follow closely behind libubuntuone, but I
expect next week.
   * U1 config tool, which replaces the current applet, is still on
track to land before feature freeze.
 * DX:
   * [[DesktopExperienceTeam/LucidWeeklyReleases|Weekly Releases]].
   * MeMenu landed in Lucid (with gwibber integration)
   * Large churn in indicator/dbusmenu packages last week, there are
known bugs but please don't hesitate to file new ones.  We need to
smooth this out ASAP.
   * ido (Indicator Disaplay Objects) was uploaded last week, this
contains the extra gtk widgets needed by indicators. Currently used for
Gwibber integration in the MeMenu and indicator-sound (also due to
upload this week).

== Release Status ==

 * We revisited
http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-3.html,
 since we are slightly over the trend line:
  * Bryce got some additional work at the sprint, will add WIs
  * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-startup-speed: We can't have Robert, drop
gnome-panel speed up
  * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-xorg-triaging-diagnosis: targets of
opportunity, but will benefit and ease X.org triaging work in the long
run; potentially deferrable/droppable
  * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-social-from-the-start: Potentially
droppable, targets of opportunity
  * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-xorg-proprietary-drivers: Some are done
now, Alberto to update WI status; he might need help with those for
alpha-3
  * UbuntuSpec:desktop-lucid-compiz-effects: Remaining two are a lot of
work, and highly questionable; should be dropped, but Martin to
confirm/discuss with Rick

== pitivi ==
 * please help as you can with bug triaging/fixing
 * Pedro will organize a [bh]ug day
 * since we'll be concentrating on bug fixes, it's not very likely that
we can keep this in the default install for lucid; however, revisiting
this is a beta-1 work item, so we did not discuss it further in the
meeting

== Post A3 Mindset ==
 * switch from feature work to quality work
 * Find and fix the worst bugs
 * Focus on upgrade experience, LTS -> LTS, Karmic -> Lucid

== Other Business ==

None



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Desktop Team 20100223 meeting minutes

[Rick Spencer]

Here are the minutes from the desktop team meeting. You can also find
them, the activity reports, and the irc log here:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-23

= Meeting Minutes =
== Present ==
=== Main Meeting ===
 * Rick Spencer (rickspencer3) - chair
 * Alberto Milone (tseliot)
 * Arne Goetje (ArneGoetje)
 * Bryce Harrington (bryce)
 * Chris Cheney (ccheney)
 * Didier Roche (didrocks)
 * Jonathan Riddell (Riddell)
 * Ken VanDine (kenvandine)
 * Martin Pitt (pitti)
 * Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
 * Till Kamppeter (tkamppeter)  

=== Eastern Edition ===
 * Luke Yelavich (TheMuso)
 * Robert Ancell (robert_ancell)

== Apologies ==

== Agenda ==
 * Outstanding actions from last meeting
 * Partner Update
 * Kubuntu Update
 * Release Bugs/Release Status
 * Featured Software
 * Review activity reports
 * Any other business

== Actions from this meeting ==
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to arrange call/meeting with ara, pitti, and
seb128 regarding upgrade testing
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to bring up stopping new work with statik
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to follow up with robbiew on startup time
targets
 * ACTION: rickspencer3 to start blueprint to define criteria and
associated wiki page to capture list of Featured apps
  * DONE:
https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-featured-applications

== Outstanding actions from last meeting ==
 * ACTION:rickspencer3 to engage QA wrt upgrade testings
  * Result: have received a draft upgrade plan from ara
  * Have discussed upgrade scenarios with pitti
  * Will work with ara to put them together
Ara joined the meeting and explained current upgrade testing plans and
how they relate to video driver testing as well. General agreement that
upgrade testing could be done a bit earlier, and certain scenarios
covered.

== Partner Update ==
= OLS =
 * libubuntuone and rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store has been uploaded,
still need to get them on the CD
   * the store isn't live yet, but we are told it will be in time for
alpha-3, no change to desktop required
 * new ubuntuone-client uploaded, the applet is gone
   * currently there is ubuntuone-preferences for configuring things
   * there is a control panel in the works, which will require a FFE.
that will be post alpha-3

rickspencer3 wonders if perhaps the OLS team can stop new features for
Lucid and focus on stabilization, citing specifically plans to introduce
the control panel. 

= DX =
 * Shifting gears to bug fix mode, not expecting uploads this week but
will start uploading bug fixes every Thursday

== Kubuntu Update ==
 * generally in a good position for feature freeze
 * Qt 4.6.2 now packaged, will be uploaded after alpha freeze
 * KOffice 2 also packaged, will be uploaded after alpha freeze
 * Mozilla approved the KDE integration patches to firefox, asac
reviewing for inclusion
 * Kubuntu Netbook Remix now in a working state for Lucid
 * CDs no longer oversized, yay
 * kdebindings not compiling on ARM (the important bits do compile so we
can just work around the unimportant bits)
 * ubiquity currently has some bugs, at least one blocking alpha 3
 * RC bugs http://tinyurl.com/yjybcx9
 * https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu/Todo

== Mozilla Status ==
 * libsoup and glib done
 * ccheney working on web kit currently
There was some discussion about whether the blueprint for the new
mozilla support model was on track. rickspencer3 to follow up with asac
to check status.

== Release Status ==
http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-3.html
 * Discussion of current boot time goals. Current boot charts are close
to 11 seconds, which is greater than 10 seconds. robbiew suggested that
the team finish existing boot work items, but postpone more invasive
changes to post-lucid.
 * About 2/3 of Beta 1 work items are Dx integration items. Remaining
work items should be considered low priority. rickspencer3 stresses that
work items are a direct trade for quality at this point. seb128 and
others press for doing some work on GDM settings.

== Featured Software ==
Proposed system:
 * rickspencer3 starts a blueprint
 * define ideal number of featured apps
 * define criteria for featured apps
  * Is a GUI app
  * Does not replace a default app
  * Does not replace another featured app
  * Is well designed for the task and robust - makes the platform look
good
 * solicit suggestions from blueprint
 * desktop team goes through list and picks



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Re: Review of featured applications

[Rick Spencer]

On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 14:02 +0100, Didier Roche wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 8:04 AM, Robert Ancell
>  wrote:

> >
> > I wanted to add one IDE to the list but it was very hard to choose one.  It
> > seemed the best candidates were monodevelop, geany, eclipse and anjuta
> > (omitting Eclipse because it is so big and as a "well known IDE" people
> > shouldn't have trouble finding it anyway).  I don't use an IDE so I don't
> > feel qualified to make a recommendation.  The important factors seemed to
> > be:
> >
> > Ability to work with popular languages
> > Fast and reliable
> > Access to debugging tools
> 
> The issue for anjuta is the lack of real support for python, which is
> one of the favorite language we advise in Ubuntu. geany maybe?
> 
I propose we don't include an IDE. I don't think any fit the criteria
really well.

> >
> > I also wanted to pick one FPS but they all seemed difficult to use.  The
> > problems seemed to be similar:
> >
> > Huge downloads
> > Opening and choosing first menu (e.g. "single player") often didn't work,
> > there were no bots
> > Very slow load times
> 
> Right, from my research (1 year and half ago), we don't have any FPS
> with bots by default. We should download some bots and install them
> manually we don't find the Featured goal. There are a lot of very good
> multiplayer FPS (even if I'm not fan of those games), so, if we want
> to include one of them, I'll go for Nexuiz or Tremulous.
What about Saurbraten? That seems to work well and has a good single
player mode. Though perhaps the download is a bit large?

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Review of featured applications

[Rick Spencer]

If a KDE app works great on Ubuntu and meets the goals and guidelines
laid out, then it is fine to include. However, for Lucid, "Featured"
will focus on Ubuntu, and not Kubuntu or other *buntus. We should
discuss at UDS if there is some way to extend the notion to Kubuntu,
Edubuntu, etc...

Cheers, Rick

On Sat, 2010-03-06 at 13:01 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
> That raises a good point - should the list be the same in Ubuntu and 
> Kubuntu?  Note that the list is stored in the software-center package 
> and could be different for each distribution.
> 
> KDE applications have not been excluded but it is worth noticing the 
> installation and integration experience is important.  And this 
> experience will be different for each distro.
> 
> Jeremy, could you please update the Wiki page with any suggestions:
> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Lucid/FeaturedApps
> 
> --Robert
> 
> On 05/03/10 05:48, Jeremy Bicha wrote:
> > * I recommend Marble, a desktop globe that is part of KDE's Education
> > Project. There is a basic offline map, but the online OpenStreetMap
> > map view is especially cool.
> >
> > It is worth mentioning that the Software Center is installed by
> > default for Kubuntu also, so there is no need to exclude KDE best-of
> > applications in my opinion.
> >
> > * I also recommend Lernid. Although relatively new, it's designed to
> > be easier to use for taking part in #ubuntu-classroom sessions.
> >
> > Jeremy Bicha
> >
> >
> 
> 



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Re: Beautiful awesomeness ---stupidity?---

[Rick Spencer]

On Sat, 2010-03-06 at 17:14 +0100, Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote:

> 
> I'm sorry if I come across as overly critical, but this really upsets
> me. It looks nice, but it's a pain to work with. Please prioritize
> functionality before aesthetics.
Please review the Ubuntu Code of Conduct and remember that it applies to
this list:
http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct

While I look forward to your continued contributions and support of
Ubuntu, note that using the word "stupidity" to describe the
contributions of people who dedicate so much effort and heart and soul
to Ubuntu is not appropriate or acceptable on this list.

In terms of the feedback that you requested for your communication
style, I can say that when I hear someone use a word like "stupidity" in
a public list or other forum, I assume the person fears change, or
worse, is simply a troll. You would have made your point more
effectively without insulting the contributions of others.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Gthumb as default image viewer?

[Rick Spencer]

On Sun, 2010-03-07 at 21:02 +0200, Otto Kekäläinen wrote:

> 
> The thread ended up in that F-Spots view one image in folder -mode
> should have basic editing capabilities included. Unfortunately in Lucid
> this does still not exist, and I really think that EOG should be
> replaced with GThumb to give users even the basic functions (that are
> even found in Windows XP).
It's coming. Please review the work items.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Gthumb as default image viewer?

[Rick Spencer]

On Sun, 2010-03-07 at 12:06 -0800, Rick Spencer wrote:
> On Sun, 2010-03-07 at 21:02 +0200, Otto Kekäläinen wrote:
> 
> > 
> > The thread ended up in that F-Spots view one image in folder -mode
> > should have basic editing capabilities included. Unfortunately in Lucid
> > this does still not exist, and I really think that EOG should be
> > replaced with GThumb to give users even the basic functions (that are
> > even found in Windows XP).
> It's coming. Please review the work items.

I suppose a link would have been helpful :/ oops, hit send just a tad
too soon.

Anyway, tou can peruse the blueprints and see what work is DONE,
POSTPONED, and TODO.

https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-default-apps

[raof] f-spot: provide save button and drop instant saving: DONE
[raof] f-spot: provide undo in edit mode: TODO
[raof] f-spot: provide next/prev buttons in view mode: TODO


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[Bug 517300] Re: [armel] likewise-open needs porting to ARM

[Rick Spencer]

** Changed in: likewise-open (Ubuntu Lucid)
 Assignee: Ubuntu Desktop (ubuntu-desktop) => Gerald Carter 
(coffeedude.jerry)

-- 
[armel] likewise-open needs porting to ARM
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/517300
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
Desktop, which is a bug assignee.

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Re: Review of featured applications

[Rick Spencer]

Shane, good thought, but I don't think any developer tools are
interesting for featured applications. The Featured section is not
geared to a developer user, so I think we should just pull out Eclipse
and leave it at that.

Cheers, Rick

On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:05 +, Shane Fagan wrote:
> > - Remove Eclipse
> >- Huge download
> >- Only supports Java out of the box
> >- The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
> Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,valaetc although require
> the user to install the support for each language. 
> 
> -Fagan
> 
> 



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Re: Review of featured applications

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:32 +, Shane Fagan wrote:
> On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 14:22 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
> > On 26/03/10 14:05, Shane Fagan wrote:
> > >> - Remove Eclipse
> > >> - Huge download
> > >> - Only supports Java out of the box
> > >> - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
> > >>  
> > > Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> > > Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,valaetc although require
> > > the user to install the support for each language.
> > >
> > My review of all the supplied IDEs showed MonoDevelop to appear to be 
> > the easiest to use, but:
> > - I've never used an IDE for any significant period of time
> > - I didn't use any of the proposed IDEs to do more that write a hello 
> > world program.
> > 
> > We need to consider what sort of user clicks on featured applications 
> > and which users would benefit from the suggested IDE.
> > My experience of IDE users is:
> >   - They're generally passionate users who have a preferred IDE (much 
> > like text editors for non-IDE programmers).  So by suggesting an IDE 
> > we're targeting people who haven't already chosen an IDE.
> >   - IDEs tend be a part of a developer package.  If we suggest 
> > MonoDevelop will users link well to documentation and the developer 
> > community?  Or will it just be a fancy text editor/compiler?
> > 
> > Saying it in a simpler way:
> > - Will an IDE encourage people to learn programming?
> > - Will opportunistic developers be able to use it to complete their 
> > desired project?
> > - Will experienced developers find the suggested IDE helpful or will 
> > they already use their existing IDE/do the research themselves?
> > 
> > 
> Well no it wouldnt encourage people to learn programming. 
> Hmmm I dont think there is any good python IDE for the opportunistic
> developer.
> I dont think many experienced developers use IDEs too much. The ones I
> know in development companies use eclipse (or different flavors of
> eclipse) or text editors. I use netbeans in college but for python I use
> gedit. 
Sorry Fagan, but this is really really wrong. Almost all developers use
Visual Studio. The rest use Eclipse or such. A few don't use IDES.

However, you are also really really right. We should make Ubuntu it's
own IDE. This is an old unix concept that I would like us to embrace and
bring to other programmers, new or IDE dependent.

Cheers, Rick



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Re: 10.10 plans for gnome-panel rollback

[Rick Spencer]

Shane,

This is a discussion we will have at UDS. At the moment, looking at the
Shell release schedule, and current state, I am doubtful that it will be
appropriate for use as a default in 10.10. Of course, we will continue
to deliver shell as an option, as we we have since 9.10. 

However, that is only my view and my view at this time. This is
fundamentally a discussion for UDS.

Cheers, Rick


On Fri, 2010-04-02 at 22:18 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote:
> Hi all, 
> 
> I was wondering if we are going to ship Gnome Shell as the default
> desktop UI what will we do for people who havent the hardware to run
> Shell. Going by my quick tests of Shell so far you need a computer at
> most 4 years old to run it. 
> So for people who have 4 years+ could we put a Gnome-Panel-Session
> package in the archive for a rollback? (I know its a little early to be
> talking about 10.10 but I thought id share the idea before I forgot
> it :) )
> 
> Regards
> Shane Fagan
> 
> 



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Re: 10.10 plans for gnome-panel rollback

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2010-04-02 at 23:21 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote:
> Hey Rick,
> 
> Well ill be missing this UDS because of college tests but ill more than
> likely be listening in so ill chat about it then. 
This is a bummer indeed. I was very much hoping to discuss this and
other issues with you there. Oh well. We'll make sure that we
collaborate on the blueprint for shell before and after UDS.

> 
> Oh and on the Shell appropriateness I think it will be ready in time but
> I dont expect it to be perfect but I still think it would be the right
> time to include it even if serious testing is needed. Anyhow I just
> thought id mention it anyway, cheers and congrats on 10.04 to all :)
"Ready" can be hard to define, but a definition we should discuss. And
congrats to you, Fagan. You were a really big part of 10.04. It's great
having you on the team.

Cheers, Rick 


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Follow up to Default Search Provider Changes for 10.04

[Rick Spencer]

Each release we determine the best default web browser and the best
default search engine for Ubuntu. When choosing the best default search
provider, we consider factors such as user experience, user preferences,
and costs and benefits for Ubuntu and the browsers and other projects
that make up Ubuntu. Up until Ubuntu 9.10 these defaults have always
been Firefox and Google. Earlier in the 10.04 cycle I announced that we
would be changing the default search provider to Yahoo!, and we
implemented that change for several milestones.

However, for the final release, we will use Google as the default
provider. I have asked the Ubuntu Desktop team to change the default
back to Google as soon as reasonably possible, but certainly by final
freeze on April 15th.

It was not our intention to "flap" between providers, but the underlying
circumstances can change unpredictably. In this case, choosing Google
will be familiar to everybody upgrading from 9.10 to 10.04 and the
change will only be visible to those who have been part of the
development cycle for 10.04. 

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Rhythmbox question.

[Rick Spencer]

On Tue, 2010-06-29 at 22:15 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote:
> Hey,
> 
> You would have to ask on the rhythmbox list
> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/rhythmbox-devel 
> The lossless wma files is a gstreamer thing but I thought it already
> works but I dont use those files so I wouldnt know myself. 
And don't forget to tell the upstream devs how awesome Rhtymbox is.
Ubuntu users are quite lucky indeed to have them upstream!

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Tweet Deck in the repo?

[Rick Spencer]

On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 15:47 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote:
> Interesting I knew the Air installer would have to be packaged like
> Flash is installed. 
> On the Tweetdeck what repo would it fit into or would it fit into that
> new cool apps repo(or whatever they are calling it)? 
If it's not FLOSS, then it has to come through partner.

Cheers, Rick

> 
> 
> --fagan
> 
> On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 3:30 PM, Jeremy Bicha 
> wrote:
> Well you'd first need to get Adobe Air into the partner
> repository.
> But I don't believe TweetDeck is open source either so it
> couldn't be
> in the normal repos either.
> 
> Jeremy Bicha
> 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Shane Fagan
>  wrote:
> > Hey all,
> > I was wondering if there is any way we can package Tweet
> Deck or any other
> > adobe air application for the repo?
> > Im just wondering if there is any licencing problems with
> having it in
> > there.
> > (It would be a really good addition IMO)
> > --fagan
> 
> > --
> > ubuntu-desktop mailing list
> > ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
> > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
> >
> >
> 
> 



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Re: Ubuntu Desktop weekly meetings

[Rick Spencer]

Removing the categories sounds like it optimizes writing, but categories
are useful for the reader. Also, having categories triggers some
progress to be reported (or lack of progress) in important areas. As a
reader I would want to keep the categories.

Cheers, Rick

On Thu, 2010-11-25 at 10:50 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
> 
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> There was a discussion about this email in the western edition and
> this continued into the eastern edition.  The decision was to trial a
> new weekly summary format, which we will use for the next meeting (30
> November).
> 
> The instructions:
>  * The summary is here:
> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-11-30
>  * Any Ubuntu desktop team member can update this list.
>  * You can add any item to the list that you consider useful to
> another team member or someone interested in what the desktop team is
> doing.
>  * Insert new items where you think the importance is, the list is
> sorted highest to lowest.
>  * You can update this list at any time during the week (and you are
> encouraged to).
>  * At the end of the week, before the meeting, this list will be
> "cleaned up" by Jason and I and emailed to this mailing list.
> 
> Notes:
>  * This should not take any more time than the current system.  Note
> if it does.
>  * There are no categories (e.g. USC, U1, X).  This is to keep the
> experiment simple and it will hopefully be clear if we need them.
>  * There are no per-person lists, add an attribution after the item if
> you want.
>  * Feedback, feedback, feedback!
> 
> - --Robert
> 
> On 18/11/10 11:11, Robert Ancell wrote:
> > 
> > And to follow up about technology etc...
> > 
> > In my opinion the current activity reports are more about proving 
> > you've done a weeks worth of work, than providing a good summary
> > of what's happened in a week. I'd like to see the summary more
> > like this:
> > 
> > * x new bugs were opened, y were closed * We completed x items in
> > the work tracker. We are ahead of the trend line. * x packages
> > were updated in natty. * The CD size grew by xMB to yMB. * The
> > FooBar app is now 10x more awesome! Thanks to the x for making 
> > this change. * Remmina has replaced tsclient on the CD, please try
> > it an let us know if it is an improvement. * We are behind in
> > updating GNOME, please have a look at 
> > http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html and
> > help out if you can * Compiz is delayed due to issues with the
> > packaging, please have a look at the
> > lp:~ubuntu-desktop/compiz/new_version branch for the current
> > progress * Intel users may have some issues with the updated video
> > driver, please report bugs to z.
> > 
> > Note that some of this information can be automatically pulled
> > from Launchpad etc.
> > 
> > We discussed how to produce the manual information. The options
> > seem to be: - The Wiki - Etherpad - status.net
> > 
> > If people are interested in producing the high-detail reports we
> > need to consider where/how to produce those, and then boil them
> > down to a good summary.
> > 
> > --Robert
> > 
> >> Today in the Eastern Edition
> > of the Desktop meeting we discussed
> > 
> >> the structure and purpose of the weekly Desktop meetings.
> > I'll try
> > 
> >> and summarise some of the points raised and propose some
> > ideas.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> While the current meetings are working well, some of the
> > 
> >> challenges raised were: * Participants being split across
> > 
> >> timezones * Most participants work in different domains so
> > 
> >> traditional meeting structure may not be appropriate * The
> > team is
> > 
> >> growing * How useful is the meeting summary? [1]
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> I propose we more tightly define what the meeting purpose
> > is, such
> > 
> >> as: * The meeting scope is the Ubuntu Desktop product * The
> > purpose
> > 
> >> of the meeting is to share information about
> > progress/issues * The
> > 
> >> meetings are open to everyone in the community * The
> > meetings
> > 
> >> should not take significant time * There will be more than
> > one
> > 
> >> meeting so participants from around the world can join in *
> > The
> > 
> >> output of the meetings will be a wiki page summarising the
> > weekly
> > 
> >> progress: * Actions to be taken * New work completed *
> > Issues
> > 
> >> raised
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> The summary should be useful to the following people: *
> > Ubuntu
> > 
> >> Desktop team members * Potential Desktop team members who
> > want to
> > 
> >> know what is going on / look for areas where they can
> > contribute *
> > 
> >> Media (e.g. OMG Ubuntu) who want an official record of what
> > is
> > 
> >> going on in the Desktop product
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> We also discussed some technology, but I'll leave that to
> > follow
> > 
> >> up emails to keep this email short.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> --Robert
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeti

invitation to participate in developer.ubuntu.com project

[Rick Spencer]

Hello all:

Following up from this moment at the Natty UDS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GT5fUcMUfYg#t=6m30s

Jono and I have been working on providing content to
developer.ubuntu.com[1], and we think it's reached a state that is
useful for discussion, participation, and feedback.

Aside from discussions at UDS, we've been basing the content off of the
ubuntu-developer-manual project[2].

Please note that we mean something specific by "developer" in this case,
and it may be a little different than how "developer" is used in other
contexts. The portal shares many of the goals of the
ubuntu-developer-manual project. It is meant for people who want to
write applications to run on Ubuntu, but are new to the Linux Desktop,
at least new to developing apps for a Linux Desktop.

The site strives to present a single reasonably unified "on ramp" for
application developers, by picking and promoting a set of technologies
to help developers go from blank slate to a working application.
However, it in no way is meant to limit developers, so we think the
portal will link to other useful documents and sites as well.

Currently the site has an overall Information Architecture in place, and
some start/draft content for many of the pages.

So, this email is essentially to let folks know what's up, and to invite
participation and contributions. For that purpose, we have set up a
launchpad project[3], with a team and mailing list[4].

Since we're only starting, we don't have any formal processes for the
project. However, we are envisioning suggested fixes coming in the form
of bug reports and discussion happening on the mailing list.

Cheers, Rick

[1] http://developer.ubuntu.com
[2] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-developer-manual
[3] https://launchpad.net/ubuntudeveloperportal
[4] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntudeveloperportal



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Re: invitation to participate in developer.ubuntu.com project

[Rick Spencer]

Hey David ...

On Wed, 2011-01-19 at 02:08 +0800, David Nelson wrote:
> Hi, :-)
> 
> After reading this, I headed on over to the website and immediately
> installed Quickly. I'm really keen to see this properly working. Any
> idea of a roll-out date?
Hi David! Glad to hear you are interested, and nice to hear from you.

Roll out date for Quickly for developer.ubuntu.com?

For Quickly, it's ben in universe for a few releases, and a few projects
have been created with it. 

For developer.ubuntu.com, we're thinking about having it be "ready"
around when natty ships.


> 
> And is the Ubuntu Developer’s Manual completely unwritten, or is there
> a draft available somewhere?
There's a lot of content already. It's in trunk, I think:
https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-developer-manual/ubuntu-developer-manual/trunk

HTH!

Cheers, Rick



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Re: GNOME session saving dropped in natty

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2011-01-21 at 16:16 +0100, Martin Pitt wrote:
> Vishnoo [2011-01-21 20:41 +0530]:
> > Is there a bug filed for this, which we could follow?
> 
> I don't think we should bother. Session saving can't ever be perfect.
> You won't ever get back things like your unsaved current documents,
> undo buffers, network connections (chat), etc, and those are much more
> interesting than the position of your windows (not that GNOME would or
> could ever get that right even). I think this has always been a
> half-baked misfeature.
> 
> For proper session saving/restoring there is suspend and hibernate.
Well, there is suspend. Hibernate does not exactly work perfectly for
many peole.

Cheers, Rick



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Shall we hide the GUI for Hibernate in Natty?

[Rick Spencer]

Hello all,

This email is to get some feedback and discussion about an idea under
consideration for Ubuntu in Natty.

Natty is currently NOT showing the Hibernate option in the list of
shutdown choices. This is currently an experiment, but I thought it
might be worth discussing the pros and cons on these lists as well.

The reasoning for hiding Hibernate includes:
1. It doesn't work well for many users on many machines.
2. It's very slow.
3. It's not as useful because users can just suspend.
4. The difference between hibernate and suspend is confusing.
5. There is a lot of work involved with verifying that Hibernates works
and fixing bugs to ensure that it works. This work is not always
completed, and the work that does get done can be channeled to other
useful areas. (In other words, fewer bugs through fewer features to
support).

However, Hibernate works well for some users, so this will be a painful
regression[1].

Please note that currently:
1. No decision has been taken, it's just an experiment and is very open
to discussion at this point.
2. The feature is hidden in the UI, but can be turned back on by
tweaking,
/var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla
3. The desktop team decided that session saving (in Gnome) is
unsalvagable, so removing hibernate would mean that there is no way to
save state across powerdowns/powerups.[2]

So, thoughts, discussion, feedback, options, suggestions, rants, raves,
etc... ?

Cheers, Rick

[1] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/710796
[2]
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2011-January/002734.html




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Re: OpenShot instead of PiTiVi

[Rick Spencer]

On Wed, 2011-02-16 at 01:18 -0600, Jonathan Thomas wrote:
> I know my opinions are biased towards OpenShot, but I suppose we all
> have our biases... =)  One of the reasons OpenShot has been so well
> received by people is our simple interface and stable foundation.
>  Just to play devil's advocate, PiTiVi could also be described as
> "crashy".  And so could many other applications that deal with
> decoding and encoding video.  To actually site some quantitative data,
> rather than just
> hearsay, http://www.webupd8.org/2010/03/best-linux-video-editor.html.
>  A review posted just the other
> day: 
> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/02/openshot-1-3-0-released-cements-place-as-the-best-video-editor-for-linux/.
> 
> 
> I also really like Timo's idea about a post-install welcome screen.
>  Even if OpenShot never gets included as the default video editor, it
> would be super helpful to many users to know that they have another
> great video editor choice, just 1 click away. =)
Sounds like a job for featured apps in the software-centered



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Default Desktop Experience for 11.04

[Rick Spencer]

Hello all,

Back at UDS for 11.04 in Orlando, Mark set the goal of using Unity by
default on the Ubutu desktop. Given the current course of development,
it appears that we are going to achieve this goal, and Unity will stay
the default for 11.04.

I'm following up on this list at the suggestion of the Tech Board to
give folks a chance to respond or escelate any concerns.

Note that there are some arguments for changing the default from Unity
to "classic' GNOME:
1. There are key feature regressions, for example, there is no systray
support for many important applications.
2. There are usability problems, for example, settings are hard to find,
the launcher icons behave differently when you click on the trash can
versus the home folder launcher, it's hard to find a categorized view of
applications, searches do not always turn up expected results.
3. We are coming in too hot, there are too many crashers on some
hardware and the final product will be buggy.

I won't rebut these points myself, as I am rather striving to represent
the viewpoints not argue against them.

Representing the desktop team, Jason Warner believes that Unity will
deliver the superior experience for most users in 11.04. I agree with
this position and support staying the course.

Cheers, Rick

PS - You can reference the recent and current bug fixing efforts of the
Unity team here:
https://launchpad.net/unity/+milestone/3.8.4
https://launchpad.net/unity/+milestone/3.8.6
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity



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Re: Default Desktop Experience for 11.04 - User testing results

[Rick Spencer]

First, thanks Usability Team! I know how much work goes into planning
and running a study like this, and how much agony is involved in
interpreting and writing up the results. It's clear that there are some
areas for improvement in 11.10, and these results will be instrumental
in helping to guide those investments.

On Thu, 2011-04-14 at 22:48 -0700, Bryce Harrington wrote:
> On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 03:00:31AM +0100, Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
> > *   8/10 people could find a window's menus, but 7/8 of them learned to
> > *   Only 4/11 worked out how to change the background picture.
> > *   6/10 could easily find and launch a game that wasn't in the
> > *   Only 1/9 (P4) easily added that game to the launcher.
> > *   9/11 people could easily close a window.
> > *   8/9 easily copied text from one document into another.
> > *   Only 5/10 could easily delete a document
> 
> These seven items in particular seem like really basic tasks that ought
> to be testing at >90%, so these stats seem a lot lower than I'd expect.
Well, think back to the last time you got a new device. For example, if
you have an Android phone. You are probably pretty facile with the
interface now, but if someone handed it to you and said "do this task
with it" you may have struggled to some basic things, like launching
apps. A lot of the fun for users in getting a new devices is learning
how to use it.

Given my experience, these numbers look they could be improved, but I
don't find them particularly concerning. For example, you can easily use
Unity quite productively before you learn that you can add items to the
launcher, or change the background picture, though I suspect many
Windows users would right-click and the desktop to set the background
picture and would do fine.

The only area here that is at all concerning to me regards launching
applications. I'd like to see some focus on the application lens in
11.10 (see what I did I did there? :) )

> 
> I'm curious whether these stats are higher/lower/same-as with Classic
> Desktop.  IOW this needs a control group so we can tell if the new
> design brings improvement or regression.
For brand new users? Some of the tasks aren't relevant. For others, like
finding installed applications, I presume this was dead easy in Classic
GNOME, but it's hard to say for a certain.

> 
> Also, these tests measure usability, but not their overall impression.
> Did they like it?  Find it frustrating/confusing?
This is actually a very important question. For me, when I go back to
Classic, it feels very old and mundane. Many theories hold that the
aesthetics trump usability, or at least strongly influence the
perception of the usability of a system. In other words, given 2
identically design systems that only differ in terms of theming, for
example, users will rate the system with the more pleasing design to be
more "usable" and are more likely to start using it. 

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Default Desktop Experience for 11.04 - User testing results

[Rick Spencer]

On Fri, 2011-04-15 at 23:29 +0100, Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Rick Spencer wrote on 15/04/11 15:08:
> >
> > First, thanks Usability Team! I know how much work goes into planning
> > and running a study like this, and how much agony is involved in
> > interpreting and writing up the results. It's clear that there are some
> > areas for improvement in 11.10, and these results will be instrumental
> > in helping to guide those investments.
> 
> Charline did all the planning and test moderation. I was just the
> stenographer afterwards.
> 
> Later on, Charline will publish a full report on the test. I just wanted
> to post a quick summary in time to be helpful for the default experience
> discussion.
> 
> > On Thu, 2011-04-14 at 22:48 -0700, Bryce Harrington wrote:
> >>
> >> On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 03:00:31AM +0100, Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
> >>>
> >>> *   8/10 people could find a window's menus, but 7/8 of them learned to
> >>> *   Only 4/11 worked out how to change the background picture.
> >>> *   6/10 could easily find and launch a game that wasn't in the
> >>> *   Only 1/9 (P4) easily added that game to the launcher.
> >>> *   9/11 people could easily close a window.
> >>> *   8/9 easily copied text from one document into another.
> >>> *   Only 5/10 could easily delete a document
> >>
> >> These seven items in particular seem like really basic tasks that
> >> ought to be testing at >90%, so these stats seem a lot lower than I'd
> >> expect.
> 
> > Well, think back to the last time you got a new device. For example, if
> > you have an Android phone. You are probably pretty facile with the
> > interface now, but if someone handed it to you and said "do this task
> > with it" you may have struggled to some basic things, like launching
> > apps. A lot of the fun for users in getting a new devices is learning
> > how to use it.
> 
> I didn't have anything close to that kind of trouble when trying out an
> Android phone. (Though like anyone on a developer mailing list, I'm not
> a representative sample.)
Oh? I recall learning many things on my phone. How to launch apps. How
to use the task manager to switch between running apps. How to enter
text in general and swype in particular. How to pull down the
notification area and how to push it up again, etc... If you were
watching over my shoulder you may have said "Fail Fail Fail" many times.
Perhaps you would have been correct, the usabliity could be better.
However, it's easy to forget the first few times you satisficed through
something compared to the hundreds of times you've done something after
you mastered it.

> 
> >...
> > For brand new users? Some of the tasks aren't relevant.
> 
> Which ones?
I believe the following are tasks indicative of repeated and experienced
usage, not first time usage:
 * Changing the background image and setting in general.
 * Adding a game to the launcher.
 * Rearranging items in the launcher.

And these were some that users had the most trouble with.

Cheers, Rick


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Re: Default Desktop Experience for 11.04 - User testing results

[Rick Spencer]

On Sun, 2011-04-17 at 09:17 +0100, Paul Sladen wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Apr 2011, Rick Spencer wrote:
> > > > For brand new users? Some of the tasks aren't relevant.
> > > Which ones?
> > Changing the background image and setting in general.
> 
> On the contrary.  Changing the wallpaper and screensaver are comforting
> personalisation steps that new users seem to undertake on their own.
That was my point. You don't personalize something until you *own* it.
Until you've used it enough that you know how you want to own it. It's
not something you do while you are carrying out other tasks.

In any case, it's a moot point, since changing the desktop background
was something that the study found users could do easily, they were
blocked by the usability engineer telling them not to do it in the
obvious manner.

Cheers, Rick




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Re: Language chooser at login (comment from an upset ubuntu user)

[Rick Spencer]

On Wed, 2011-08-24 at 15:35 +0200, Hadmut Danisch wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I was testing oneiric alpha releases, found several problems with
> keyboard maps and locale settings, tried to report them as bugs, and
> ran against a wall of ignorance, probably errected by
> ubuntu/canonical. I then came to bug #803858 and to this mailing list
> discussion. 
Hi Hadmut, thanks for testing oneiric and reporting bugs! I love being
in the Ubuntu community because I love getting to know and to work with
people from all different backgrounds from all over world, all
channeling positive energy to the same outcome.

> 
> Reading this discussion really upsets me. 
> 

> 
> Worst of all are the comments from Robert Ancell. It is more than
> obvious that this guy has an awful anglo-americo-centric view of the
> world, not knowing much about multilanguage environments, and
> rigorously enforces his wrong assumptions. 
I could tell you were upset and I am sorry for that. This vexed me, as I
have known Robert for a while now, and I never found him to be arrogant.
As Director of Engineering, it pained me to think that a Canonical
employee, and one who I know trust so well, was behaving this way.

I took the time to read through the attached thread, and for what it's
worth, I didn't read Robert's behavior the way you did. I read it as the
developer who is responsible taking a good decision, doing the work, and
then supporting the work in the future, making an earnest effort to
understand the pros and cons and all the sides of the situation.

Maybe it's because I know Robert, and could hear his distinctly
Australian accent in my head as a read it, though.

Design discussions can be tough, and sometimes design decisions get
taken that not everyone can agree with. I don't know how the "language
selector in the greeter" discussion will end up, but I hope this
experience doesn't dissuade you from continuing to use and contribute to
Ubuntu. Heck, I think one of the beauties of LightDM is that it's easy
to make a greater, maybe you could make a special one specifically
designed for users like you and share it!

Cheers, Rick


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Re: EOL for couchdb and desktopcouch

[Rick Spencer]

On 11/22/2011 04:45 PM, John Rowland Lenton wrote:


First you convince
developers to rely on your infrastructure for their apps, and then, out
of the blue, you remove key parts of it?


it wasn't working. That's the whole point.
I strongly agree with this. I think I've probably written more 
desktop-couch code than anyone outside the Online Services team.


DesktopCouch performance on the client, and failures to sync on the 
server have been have both major thorns in my side. Not to mention 
suffering through writing javascript map/reduce statements, ug!


I, therefore, welcome this move. I really want the ability to have a 
local but synced store with an easy API, but DesktopCouch was just not 
able to provide this. I am very grateful that the team is going to apply 
what's been learned to a new generation of such functionality, and I 
will be the first to write a DictionaryGrid that uses it! :)


Cheers, Rick





It's not the first time, either.


I don't think we've removed developer-facing features before. We've
removed services when they didn't work. I *might* be forgetting
something, but I think not. Obviously.


One thing is removing it from Ubuntu One. If you can't manage
the large amounts of users and data, then that means U1 shouldn't have
been taken out of beta and that it in no way is ready for general use.


A reasonable point. Which I disagree with, at several levels, but I
don't think this is the place to get into that.


This is another example of Canonical showing poor judgement in its
communication.


communication is hard. Again, I disagree that this particular instance
was an example of us struggling to communicate; I think you're reading
more and less from my email than what I thought I was putting into
it.


However, removing support for tools that apps depend upon to store and
retrieve data locally is something else entirely. It is incomprehensible
to me that you would even consider this.


I don't know where you got the impression I or we were proposing or
suggesting that the distribution do that.

Ubuntu One, as upstream of desktopcouch, is letting Ubuntu know that
we're not going to go on working on desktopcouch, and the service is
going away from our servers. This is the next step after letting the
more prominent stakeholders know in person at UDS.


We can't know
what's going on internally in Canonical, but we know for a fact that it
is willing to drop support without warning.


The email you responded to was the warning. Had you talked with the
Ubuntu One developers at UDS or since then, we would've told you. We
individually talked with the main stakeholders at or before UDS. We had
U1DB sessions at UDS, and we have openly talked about the status of
couchdb with developers since around that time.


You're not only making fools of developers, however. You're also making
fools out of advocates. As late as yesterday, I wrote about Ubuntu
becoming a very attracting platform with focus on phones, tablets, etc.
One of the things I wrote about, was the ability to sync databases
between your devices, enabling you to keep working even when you're
offline. Yesterday, that symbolised the strength and potential of
Ubuntu. Today, the same thing symbolises uncertainty and unreliability.


It's interesting that you mention this, because the drive to enable
Ubuntu to be that platform is one of the things that is pushing us to
fix things. CouchDB wasn't working for us to do what we and you want to
do with the platform, so we're swapping the component out for one that
*will* work.

Thank you for caring,





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Re: [Desktop 12.10 Topic] Quality, testability for the desktop components

[Rick Spencer]

Sebestien,

Are you looking for discussion on these topics on this list? If so, I would
suggest that Libre Office might be a good candidate for us to offer regular
integration tests. I know that Libre Office has a test suite, it might be
very useful to run these tests daily on Ubuntu (to discover when Ubuntu
breaks LO) and it might be useful to run tests on upstream changes (to
discover when LO breaks Ubuntu).

Thoughts?

Cheers, Rick

On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 10:39 AM, Sebastien Bacher wrote:

> Hey,
>
> The Canonical upstream teams did some good progresses on testing and
> quality this cycle, that's a good step for the Ubuntu Desktop quality, we
> still rely on quite some components from other upstreams though that didn't
> engage into a such process yet though (those who looked at
> gnome-settings-daemon, nautilus, gvfs, etc bugs on launchpad probably know
> what I mean there). I would like to see if we can work on our side and with
> upstream to get those automated tested in some ways.
>
> It would be also nice to see regular run and report of the testsuits for
> other components which already have one (i.e glib, gtk) and some testing of
> their rdepends before upload.
>
> Cheers,
> Sebastien Bacher
>
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Re: Default Browser Follow-up

[Rick Spencer]

On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Benjamin Kerensa  wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 11:23 AM, Jason Warner
>  wrote:
>> Hi All -
>>
>> Here's the latest follow-up on the default browser for 13.10 discussion.
>>
>> Some great points were raised about the historic pattern of updates around
>> Chromium.
>>
>> First, to get the formalities out the way, Firefox remains the default for
>> 13.10.
>>
>> Second, I'd like to talk about the Chromium issues raised. It was rightly
>> pointed out that there have been issues keeping up with Chromium changes.
>> The big issue was with Web Apps integration and some changing APIs. Since
>> we've introduced Web Apps changes like this have always caused us some
>> grief. Web Apps have always been an interim step until we were able to get a
>> more self contained web apps container. That work is planned for 13.10 and
>> progressing well[1]. This should be done for 13.10 and very much refined for
>> 14.04.
>>
>> Lastly, I do want to consider Chromium by default for 14.04 once the above
>> is no longer an issue. I sincerely believe Chromium is the better experience
>> for general users and should be strongly considered for our next LTS.
>
> You have not provided any criteria as to why Chromium would provide a
> better experience for general users. I think its important to note
> that so far there has been more opposition by developers and users to
> making Chromium the default.
Have these reasons not been discussed ad naseum? I think most
developers probably consider this a relatively minor decision that
Jason and the desktop team are well position to make. I don't believe
there will be any 100% consensus on this issue, and it's clear that
Jason has been very active in soliciting and considering input and
different points of view. At the end of the day, someone needs to make
a decision, and in Ubuntu, we must entrust the people doing the work
to make decisions.

>
> Without out any evidence of a greater experience I think it would be a
> poor decision to flip default on millions of users.
" Greater experience" is subjective so I don't think there will be a
lot of "evidence" that can't be counter pointed on either side.

I get that some people are passionate about Firefox. Some people are
passionate about Chromium. There were folks passionate about Banshee
and folks passionate about Rhythmbox. There were folks passionate
about Pdigin, and folks passionate about Empathy. The beauty of Ubuntu
is that a decision can be made about a default around which we can
rally for consistency and integration and low complexity for users,
but the default in no way limits anyone's freedom or their ability to
contribute to those projects that they care about. Deciding that
Chromium is the better browser for the default in Ubuntu is not saying
Firefox is a bad browser, or even that Firefox is not better for some
people in some situations.

>
> If you could provide some solid technical justifications that motivate
> this discussion having been started it might be helpful in understand
> why such a change is proposed. If there is something lacking in
> Firefox then perhaps a dialogue can be started upstream and I would be
> happy to help guide such a discussion.
I find that these kind of discussions are rarely effective and can
easily cause hard feelings. The problem when choosing between 2
similar pieces of upstream software is that it is rarely the case that
one of them stands still. So we've had situations where an upstream
implements requirements so that they can be default, but the
"competing" upstream meanwhile enhanced their product and so remained
the better choice. The first upstream then felt burned because playing
"catch up" did not work. So, when considering requirements, in my
epxerience it's generally better not to go down this road and rather
judge the products based on their current implementations, their
support models, and their road maps.

In terms of "why is the discussion started" we must acknowledge that
Chromium is a very popular browser, works very well, but did not exist
all those years ago when Firefox was included as default in Ubuntu.
The desktop team wouldn't be doing their job if they weren't asking
these questions.

Cheers, Rick

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