Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[laurent.bellegarde]

Hi all tonight here in France,

I've finished my tests on my netbook.

So with last low-latency kernel coming from Alessio PPA, i can run jackd 
+ hydrogen + ardour at 11,4ms, 256 frames /3 periods with an small intel 
onboard sound card on my modest netbook asus eeepc celeron 900 MHz, 2Go 
with natty and unity desktop without any xruns. I'm using 17% of Jackd 
RT power.


on the generic kernel, i've got many xruns as soon as i'm moving a 
window of any program...


Compare to lucid RT kernel running under the same computer, the level of 
performance is quite the same and low-latency kernel could be use for 
production.


An another info, the graphic controller is an old onboard intel i810.

Complete demo and official conference about multimedia with 
ubuntu/ubuntu studio in Paris next saturday in La Villette sciences city 
if the island volcanoe let me fly to Paris ;-)


Some news coming soon.

Bye

Laurent

Le 07/05/2011 08:05, bart deruyter a écrit :

Hi all,

I've got the same result as Brian David. The generic kernel works 
quite well, but has xruns, strangely enough, mostly when doing 
'nothing'. So far I had no xruns because of recording, mixing, using 
rakarrack etc... The xruns seem to happen at random.


I do use Unity though, maybe there is something in there that asks 
some processes which cause the xruns.


My soundcard is an external one, Audiofire 12. jackd is setup at 
48000, 256 frames/period and 3 periods/buffer, at a latency of 16 msec.


Running the low-latency kernel eliminates all xruns... I'll definatly 
keep using it, and I do recommend it too.



http://www.bartart3d.be/


2011/5/7 Brian David mailto:beej...@gmail.com>>

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 3:46 AM, Victor henri mailto:nada...@hotmail.com>> wrote:
>
> My personal experience is, since 2.6.33, many improvements have
been done in
> the low latency kernel; I, as several other people, have
reported excellent
> performances of the 2.6.37 and 2.6.38 low latency kernel, that
seemed to get
> much closer closer to the rt performance then before. That
allows me, most
> of the time to not use anymore the RT kernel and all its related
problems...
>

I just installed Natty for the first time tonight.  This time around,
I went with Xubuntu and installed the Ubuntu Studio packages on top of
that.  As Scott mentioned, I needed to add myself to the audio group,
but after this my equipment immediately worked.  Unlike previous
versions, there was no need to change any configuration files to get
access to my firewire device, which means that Ubuntu Studio is
basically working out of the box for me now (or, it would be if I had
installed from an Ubuntu Studio disc).  Yay!

For a test run, I did some mixing on a recording I'm working on right
now.  I started out using the generic kernel, and performance was
surprisingly solid.  There were a few x-runs when starting up or
switching between applications, but otherwise it was usable.

I then installed Allessio's low latency kernel, and proceeded to mix
for an hour and half without a single x-run, even when starting up
applications and switching between them.  Rock on!  So, I can say
definitively that the low latency kernel gives me better performance
over generic.

This test was run at 44.1 khz / 512 frames / 3 periods - getting about
34.9 msec latency.  The next time I get the chance, I'll set up some
mics and do a recording test at lower latencies (I'll push it to 128
frames, which will take it down to 8.71 msec latency.  This is
something I have been able to do previously using rt kernels) and see
how it performs.

So far so good.  Thanks for the work, everyone!


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Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[bart deruyter]

Hi all,

I've got the same result as Brian David. The generic kernel works quite
well, but has xruns, strangely enough, mostly when doing 'nothing'. So far I
had no xruns because of recording, mixing, using rakarrack etc... The xruns
seem to happen at random.

I do use Unity though, maybe there is something in there that asks some
processes which cause the xruns.

My soundcard is an external one, Audiofire 12. jackd is setup at 48000, 256
frames/period and 3 periods/buffer, at a latency of 16 msec.

Running the low-latency kernel eliminates all xruns... I'll definatly keep
using it, and I do recommend it too.


http://www.bartart3d.be/


2011/5/7 Brian David 

> On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 3:46 AM, Victor henri  wrote:
> >
> > My personal experience is, since 2.6.33, many improvements have been done
> in
> > the low latency kernel; I, as several other people, have reported
> excellent
> > performances of the 2.6.37 and 2.6.38 low latency kernel, that seemed to
> get
> > much closer closer to the rt performance then before. That allows me,
> most
> > of the time to not use anymore the RT kernel and all its related
> problems...
> >
>
> I just installed Natty for the first time tonight.  This time around,
> I went with Xubuntu and installed the Ubuntu Studio packages on top of
> that.  As Scott mentioned, I needed to add myself to the audio group,
> but after this my equipment immediately worked.  Unlike previous
> versions, there was no need to change any configuration files to get
> access to my firewire device, which means that Ubuntu Studio is
> basically working out of the box for me now (or, it would be if I had
> installed from an Ubuntu Studio disc).  Yay!
>
> For a test run, I did some mixing on a recording I'm working on right
> now.  I started out using the generic kernel, and performance was
> surprisingly solid.  There were a few x-runs when starting up or
> switching between applications, but otherwise it was usable.
>
> I then installed Allessio's low latency kernel, and proceeded to mix
> for an hour and half without a single x-run, even when starting up
> applications and switching between them.  Rock on!  So, I can say
> definitively that the low latency kernel gives me better performance
> over generic.
>
> This test was run at 44.1 khz / 512 frames / 3 periods - getting about
> 34.9 msec latency.  The next time I get the chance, I'll set up some
> mics and do a recording test at lower latencies (I'll push it to 128
> frames, which will take it down to 8.71 msec latency.  This is
> something I have been able to do previously using rt kernels) and see
> how it performs.
>
> So far so good.  Thanks for the work, everyone!
>
>
> --
> -Brian David
>
> --
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> Ubuntu-Studio-users@lists.ubuntu.com
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-studio-users
>
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Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[Brian David]

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 3:46 AM, Victor henri  wrote:
>
> My personal experience is, since 2.6.33, many improvements have been done in
> the low latency kernel; I, as several other people, have reported excellent
> performances of the 2.6.37 and 2.6.38 low latency kernel, that seemed to get
> much closer closer to the rt performance then before. That allows me, most
> of the time to not use anymore the RT kernel and all its related problems...
>

I just installed Natty for the first time tonight.  This time around,
I went with Xubuntu and installed the Ubuntu Studio packages on top of
that.  As Scott mentioned, I needed to add myself to the audio group,
but after this my equipment immediately worked.  Unlike previous
versions, there was no need to change any configuration files to get
access to my firewire device, which means that Ubuntu Studio is
basically working out of the box for me now (or, it would be if I had
installed from an Ubuntu Studio disc).  Yay!

For a test run, I did some mixing on a recording I'm working on right
now.  I started out using the generic kernel, and performance was
surprisingly solid.  There were a few x-runs when starting up or
switching between applications, but otherwise it was usable.

I then installed Allessio's low latency kernel, and proceeded to mix
for an hour and half without a single x-run, even when starting up
applications and switching between them.  Rock on!  So, I can say
definitively that the low latency kernel gives me better performance
over generic.

This test was run at 44.1 khz / 512 frames / 3 periods - getting about
34.9 msec latency.  The next time I get the chance, I'll set up some
mics and do a recording test at lower latencies (I'll push it to 128
frames, which will take it down to 8.71 msec latency.  This is
something I have been able to do previously using rt kernels) and see
how it performs.

So far so good.  Thanks for the work, everyone!


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RE: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[Victor henri]

Hello


> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm starting testing natty i386 on a netbook celeron 900 2Go Asus eeepc 900
> which is running with lucid i386 RT kernel fine (RT kernel is Alessio's one).
> 
> For natty, which kernel should I test ? Alessio's one, or FaltX' one ?

Hello both (rt from Falk's and low latency from Alessio's) are probably fine

My personal experience is, since 2.6.33, many improvements have been done in 
the low latency kernel; I, as several other people, have reported excellent 
performances of the 2.6.37 and 2.6.38 low latency kernel, that seemed to get 
much closer closer to the rt performance then before. That allows me, most of 
the time to not use anymore the RT kernel and all its related problems...

Victor


> 
> My wish is to test if natty low latency or RT kernel is stable and as 
> performant
> as lucid one before talking about it at Ubuntu Party in Paris the 28-29 may
> 2011...
> 
> Thanks for answers.
> 
> 
> Bellegarde Laurent
> free video : lprod.org
> 

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Re: Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[Bellegarde Laurent]

Selon scottalaven...@gmail.com:

> On May 4, 2011 9:32am, Giuliano Braglia  wrote:
>
>
>
> > There are PPA's available with real time kernels available and I would
> > expect even for Natty. I believe Falktx's PPA is one of these and well
> > maintained at that.
>
>
>
>

Hi all,

I'm starting testing natty i386 on a netbook celeron 900 2Go Asus eeepc 900
which is running with lucid i386 RT kernel fine (RT kernel is Alessio's one).

For natty, which kernel should I test ? Alessio's one, or FaltX' one ?

My wish is to test if natty low latency or RT kernel is stable and as performant
as lucid one before talking about it at Ubuntu Party in Paris the 28-29 may
2011...

Thanks for answers.


Bellegarde Laurent
free video : lprod.org

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Re: Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[ScottALavender]

On May 4, 2011 9:32am, Giuliano Braglia  wrote:



There are PPA's available with real time kernels available and I would  
expect even for Natty. I believe Falktx's PPA is one of these and well  
maintained at that.






I don't know what a PPA is :p



PPA is an acronym for Personal Package Archive. This lets people package  
and build applications in their own personal repositories. These are very  
similar to the official repositories (like Main, Restricted, Universe,  
Multiverse) in Ubuntu.


You can add PPA's to your sources.list file and install applications from  
there. It is suggested that you should use caution and only use trusted  
PPA's as not all will have functioning applications or will be maintained  
well.


Here is a link that you can read more about PPA's:  
https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA



>
> Would they work even without it? In Lucid I tried to start without  
rtkernel and I had a lot of Xruns in Jack.



>
>




Additionally, you did not specify how you installed your audio packages,  
ie if you did a fresh install from a Ubuntu Studio DVD or just added the  
packages to a vanilla Ubuntu install. If you did the later you will still  
need to add your user to the audio group and you should have installed  
JACK so that it could use real time privileges. Without these you would  
suffer performance degradation.





Actually I'm on a Ubuntu properly modified following a guide made by an  
italian guy, do you think that, in future, I should install a complete  
Ubuntu Studio?









I have found that some people feel very passionate about this questions. I  
personally appreciate the complete Ubuntu Studio install as it reduces the  
amount that I have to tinker with my system. Others prefer to add their  
packages as required because it allows them to moderate their system to  
better serve their needs.


If you have a system that works for you then I would suggest staying with  
it. But you may try a full install once and see if it works better for you.


In some instances there are people that choose to start with a Ubuntu  
install first for technical reasons that might have been resolved in later  
Ubuntu Studio releases. I am specifically thinking about networking and  
wifi. In past Ubuntu Studio releases we shipped gnome-network-admin which  
had difficulty with setting wifi, therefore some might have started with a  
vanilla Ubuntu install before it shipped with network-manager which worked  
brilliantly for wiki. Ubuntu Studio has recently moved to using  
network-manager as well, so the reasoning for their installation process  
may not exists anymore.


Again, it's still a personal decision.

Regards,
ScottL
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Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[Giuliano Braglia]

>
>
>
> There are PPA's available with real time kernels available and I would
> expect even for Natty. I believe Falktx's PPA is one of these and well
> maintained at that.
>
>
I don't know what a PPA is :p

>
> >
> > Would they work even without it? In Lucid I tried to start without
> rtkernel and I had a lot of Xruns in Jack.
> >
> >
>
>
> Additionally, you did not specify how you installed your audio packages,
> i.e. if you did a fresh install from a Ubuntu Studio DVD or just added the
> packages to a vanilla Ubuntu install. If you did the later you will still
> need to add your user to the audio group and you should have installed JACK
> so that it could use real time privileges. Without these you would suffer
> performance degradation.
>
>
Actually I'm on a Ubuntu properly modified following a guide made by an
italian guy, do you think that, in future, I should install a complete
Ubuntu Studio?
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Re: Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[ScottALavender]

Hi Giuliano,

On May 4, 2011 7:40am, Giuliano Braglia  wrote:
I've been browsing through old threads but i haven't been able to  
understand...


In natty (but also in maeverik, and I guess also in future upgrades)  
there is no rt kernel available.



There are PPA's available with real time kernels available and I would  
expect even for Natty. I believe Falktx's PPA is one of these and well  
maintained at that.



Would they work even without it? In Lucid I tried to start without  
rtkernel and I had a lot of Xruns in Jack.




Absolutely you can start and run JACK well without a real time kernel.

I want to point out that a real time kernel is not a panacea, simply  
installing it will not make every system run perfectly. You still need to  
need to adjust your settings in JACK to accommodate your hardware. This  
might mean increasing your latency from 2.9msecs (for example) to 11.2msecs  
(for example) to find a stable latency without xruns.


Additionally, you did not specify how you installed your audio packages, ie  
if you did a fresh install from a Ubuntu Studio DVD or just added the  
packages to a vanilla Ubuntu install. If you did the later you will still  
need to add your user to the audio group and you should have installed JACK  
so that it could use real time privileges. Without these you would suffer  
performance degradation.


I should point out that using a -generic kernel does not preclude  
installing JACK with real time privileges. As noted above, I would advise  
that JACK have these privileges, even with the -generic kernel, or it will  
suffer poor performance and additional xruns.


I have found that the -generic kernel provides very acceptable stable  
latencies.


Regards,
ScottL
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Natty and the Real Time Kernel

[Giuliano Braglia]

I've been browsing through old threads but i haven't been able to
understand...

In natty (but also in maeverik, and I guess also in future upgrades) there
is no rt kernel available.

Would they work even without it? In Lucid I tried to start without rtkernel
and I had a lot of Xruns in Jack.
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