Re: Windows externals and the imagePixmapID

[Thierry Arbellot]

Actually, you know Windows programming better than me.
When needed, I will ask you for help.
Regards.
Thierry
On 2005, Jan 20, , at 1:16, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Aha!  Turns out I was asking the wrong question, but that code 
certainly helped me to find a way to do it.

I ended up using a GDI "DIB Section" object as an intermediary between 
the screen-level DDB and the printer DC; it went something like this 
(slightly modified to simplify, though coded in an external I'm 
working on for Rev):

HDC printerDC;/* provided target DC */
HBITMAP screenDDB, sect, oldbits;/* screenDDB is the imagePixmapID 
from Rev */
BITMAP bmap;
int dx, dy, dw, dh;   /* provided position and size on printed page */

if (GetObject(screenDDB, sizeof(BITMAP), &bmap) != sizeof(BITMAP)) 
;

/* create a DIB Section version of the bitmap */
sect = CopyImage(screenDDB, IMAGE_BITMAP, 0, 0, LR_CREATEDIBSECTION);
/* select it into a memory region */
memDC = CreateCompatibleDC(printerDC);
oldbits = (HBITMAP)SelectObject(memDC, sect);
/* render onto printer page */
StretchBlt(printerDC, dx, dy, dw, dh,
  memDC, 0, 0, bmap.bmWidth, bmap.bmHeight, SRCCOPY);
/* clean up */
SelectObject(memDC, oldbits);
DeleteDC(memDC);
DeleteObject(sect);

Now I'll be able to sleep tonight (well, at least the chances of it 
are improved)!

Thank you.
On Jan 19, 2005, at 3:41 PM, Thierry Arbellot wrote:
I use the following code to create a screen HDC and attach the 
imagePixmapID to it.

longimagePixmapId;
HBITMAP screenImageBM;
HDC theHdc;
theHdc = CreateCompatibleDC(NULL);  // screen DC
screenImageBM = (HBITMAP) imagePixmapId;
SelectObject(theHdc,screenImageBM);
I hope it helps
Thierry
On 2005, Jan 19, , at 21:26, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Hmm, anyone know how I can use the Win32 API to obtain a HDC for 
that HBITMAP?  I'm looking for a way to render the bitmap into 
another device context (specifically, a printer device context).  
Using the imagePixmapID seemed to me the easiest way to get the 
image across from a Rev stack to Win32 api code in an external, but 
I am starting to wonder...

On Jan 19, 2005, at 9:31 AM, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Thank you!
On Jan 19, 2005, at 4:47 AM, Thierry Arbellot wrote:
imagePixmapID is an HBITMAP
Thierry.
On 2005, Jan 18, , at 19:44, Frank D. Engel, Jr. wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Does anyone know what form the imagePixmapID takes under the 
Windows engine for Rev?  Is it an HBITMAP or an HDC, or something 
else entirely?

Thank you!
- - ---
Frank D. Engel, Jr.  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
$ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual
$ true | cat /usr/manual | grep "John 3:16"
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only 
begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, 
but have everlasting life.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFB7VkN7aqtWrR9cZoRAqMYAJ4ooEuOcblOnUUz2LLwcl7OxvahyQCfaQrX
tHEgStdm/CnD1DLueFNoM2Y=
=wV7X
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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- ---
Frank D. Engel, Jr.  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
$ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual
$ true | cat /usr/manual | grep "John 3:16"
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only 
begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, 
but have everlasting life.
$
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFB7m9Y7aqtWrR9cZoRAlT3AJ4qXzEZz8rC3xovVx5tsVeF8uLJfwCffUHH
Ntbc+NXKQLO4GFuyHWu9URw=
=SBGG
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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- ---
Frank D. Engel, Jr.  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
$ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual
$ true | cat /usr/manual | grep "John 3:16"
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten 
Son, that w

Open from Context Menu

[D.Rothe]

Hi All,
I created a simple textpad type application it's simple and works well for my 
purposes, however I am having trouble loading a txt
file by using the right click 'Open with' method (win xp). Any ideas would 
be appreciated, it's certainly not a critical flaw but
it would finish off the app 100%.

Cheers Dwayne
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Crashing on PC side

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

My children's app Dada daVinci on the PC side has been
crashing after prolonged use.  Its usually played by
kids 1 to 3 yrs old.  I have a mode that allows the
game to go autopilot and usually after 1 hour of use,
Revolution and Metacard crashes.  It uses 24 bit
graphics, animation and midi music.  I think I am
overloading Revolution's memory, my guess.  Is there
any way to "clean out" the memory or reduce memory use
periodically?  No problems on the Mac side.  


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Re: export RTF as file?

[Klaus Major]

Hi all,
Just for the sake of completeness, this works fine on OS X with Word, 
TextEdit, and BBEdit.
But the formatting (bold, italic etc...) are lost!
Tried wioth "file:..." and "binfile..."
At least here on OS X 10.3.7 in TextEdit...
Dan
On Jan 19, 2005, at 5:47 PM, Chipp Walters wrote:
I'm having problems with my RTF export.
Can someone please try this and tell me if they get any results?
create a new stack
create a fld and type some text into it: "hello world"
create a button with the script:
on mouseUp
ask file "Save As:" with "Untitled.rtf"
if it is empty then exit to top
put it into tPath
put the rtfText of fld 1 into tContents
put tContents into URL ("file:" & tPath)
end mouseUp
Now, try and open the RTF file you just created. I'm getting nothing 
in WordPad on XP. I don't have Word on this machine (hate M$).

I've tried binfile as well. Anyone having success exporting RTF files?
thanks in advance,
Chipp
Regards
Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de
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Re: icon help

[Klaus Major]

Hi Ben,
Finally have found a good icon editor for win xp.
"Frontbase Image to Icon." 
http://www.make-icon.com/

It will support and automatically create these formats.
16 Color 16x16
16 color 32x32
16 color 48x48
256 color 16x16
256 color 32x32
256 color 48x48
Windows XP (32-bit color) 16x16
Windows XP (32-bit color) 32x32
Windows XP (32-bit color) 48x48
without having to do anything, the icon will be compatible with rev.
Axialis Icon Workshop does an excellent job, too :-)
You can download a trial version.
I tried exporting an icon, and then loading it in Revolution 
standalone settings and it worked!
I still don't see why rev has to be so picky about icos, though.
I think the new comaptibility with the XP look and feel requires the 
new icon format.

-Ben
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Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de
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Re: Open from Context Menu

[Klaus Major]

Hi Dwayne,
Hi All,
I created a simple textpad type application it's simple and works well 
for my purposes, however I am having trouble loading a txt
file by using the right click 'Open with' method (win xp). Any 
ideas would be appreciated, it's certainly not a critical flaw but
it would finish off the app 100%.
what exactly is your problem???
Does the import fail or what or the way HOW to do the import?
A tiny bit of info would help us to help you :-)
Cheers Dwayne
Regards
Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de
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Re: export RTF as file?

[Dave Cragg]

On 20 Jan 2005, at 01:47, Chipp Walters wrote:
I'm having problems with my RTF export.
Can someone please try this and tell me if they get any results?
create a new stack
create a fld and type some text into it: "hello world"
create a button with the script:
on mouseUp
ask file "Save As:" with "Untitled.rtf"
if it is empty then exit to top
put it into tPath
put the rtfText of fld 1 into tContents
put tContents into URL ("file:" & tPath)
end mouseUp
Now, try and open the RTF file you just created. I'm getting nothing 
in WordPad on XP. I don't have Word on this machine (hate M$).

I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as 
"untitled.rtf".)

It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf stuff 
(as expected).

This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word 
installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add resources 
that are used by WordPad?

I've seen other oddities with WordPad and rtf. For example, copying 
text from a Rev field and pasting into WordPad shows rtf formatting 
code. Pasting the same into other programs produces the plain text 
only.

Dave
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Re: export RTF as file?

[Alex Tweedly]

Dave Cragg wrote:

I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as 
"untitled.rtf".)

It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf stuff 
(as expected).

This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word 
installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add resources 
that are used by WordPad?
No, I don't have Word installed (heaven forfend !).
The Wordpad version I have is
 5.1 build 2600.xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158: Service Pack 2
in case that might be the difference.
Just to be sure I've said it right :
Run the script as in Chipp's original email
Wordpad shows "hello world" - no formatting or anything, just plain 
looking text
OO 1.1 shows the same
Pure text editors (emacs, notepad, etc. ) show
{\rtf\ansi
hello world
\par }

-- Alex.
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Re: export RTF as file?

[Dave Cragg]

On 20 Jan 2005, at 11:49, Alex Tweedly wrote:
Dave Cragg wrote:

I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as 
"untitled.rtf".)

It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf stuff 
(as expected).

This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word 
installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add 
resources that are used by WordPad?
No, I don't have Word installed (heaven forfend !).
The Wordpad version I have is
 5.1 build 2600.xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158: Service Pack 2
in case that might be the difference.
Running on XP SP1.
WordPad version here is 5.1 build 2600.xpsp2.040919-1003: Service pack 1
I wonder what that means. :-)
Just to be sure I've said it right :
Run the script as in Chipp's original email
Wordpad shows "hello world" - no formatting or anything, just plain 
looking text
OO 1.1 shows the same
Pure text editors (emacs, notepad, etc. ) show
{\rtf\ansi
hello world
\par }

Same here, *except* nothing shows when opened in WordPad. The WordPad 
wndow sets its title to the name of the file, but no contents show.

Dave
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Re: icon help

[Paul Salyers]

At 04:22 AM 1/20/2005, you wrote:
Axialis Icon Workshop does an excellent job, too :-)
You can download a trial version.
I tried exporting an icon, and then loading it in Revolution standalone 
settings and it worked!
I still don't see why rev has to be so picky about icos, though.
I think the new comaptibility with the XP look and feel requires the new 
icon format.

-Ben
http://www.axialis.com/
Works great.
Paul Salyers
PS1 - Senior Rep.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://ps1.SoftSeven.org 
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Re: export RTF as file?

[Chipp Walters]

Dave,
I'm using the same version of Wordpad as you. Alex is using a newer 
version. That's probably the reason why ours doesn't work and his does.

-Chipp
Dave Cragg wrote:
On 20 Jan 2005, at 11:49, Alex Tweedly wrote:
Dave Cragg wrote:

I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as 
"untitled.rtf".)

It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf stuff 
(as expected).

This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word 
installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add 
resources that are used by WordPad?

No, I don't have Word installed (heaven forfend !).
The Wordpad version I have is
 5.1 build 2600.xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158: Service Pack 2
in case that might be the difference.
Running on XP SP1.
WordPad version here is 5.1 build 2600.xpsp2.040919-1003: Service pack 1
I wonder what that means. :-)

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Re: export RTF as file?

[Dan Shafer]

I suspect all this OS X stuff I'm doing is useless because you seem to 
be more concerned about Wordpad but I thought I'd add this data point.

If I format the text in the field and then save it in an RTF file, Word 
recognizes the styling, it shows up in the raw RTF in BBEdit, but 
Apple's TextEdit, which is the default RTF reader in OS X) ignores the 
styling. The text shows up in the default RTF font but not styled.

Dan
On Jan 20, 2005, at 7:59 AM, Chipp Walters wrote:
Dave,
I'm using the same version of Wordpad as you. Alex is using a newer 
version. That's probably the reason why ours doesn't work and his 
does.

-Chipp
Dave Cragg wrote:
On 20 Jan 2005, at 11:49, Alex Tweedly wrote:
Dave Cragg wrote:

I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as 
"untitled.rtf".)

It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf 
stuff (as expected).

This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word 
installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add 
resources that are used by WordPad?

No, I don't have Word installed (heaven forfend !).
The Wordpad version I have is
 5.1 build 2600.xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158: Service Pack 2
in case that might be the difference.
Running on XP SP1.
WordPad version here is 5.1 build 2600.xpsp2.040919-1003: Service 
pack 1
I wonder what that means. :-)

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Image false or true

[Paul Salyers]

I have a program with 2 images.
Image & dImage
dImage = defaultImage
how do I make 1 true and the other false
I tried
set the visible of stack "dImage" to false
Didn't work.
Paul Salyers
PS1 - Senior Rep.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://ps1.SoftSeven.org
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RE: Image false or true

[Lynch, Jonathan]

Should you be saying

Hide image "dImage"

Or

Set the visible of image "dImage" to false



Is dImage a stack or an image?



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul
Salyers
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2005 1:14 PM
To: How to use Revolution
Subject: Image false or true




I have a program with 2 images.

Image & dImage

dImage = defaultImage

how do I make 1 true and the other false

I tried
set the visible of stack "dImage" to false


Didn't work.

Paul Salyers
PS1 - Senior Rep.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://ps1.SoftSeven.org

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Re: Crashing on PC side

[Mark Talluto]

On Jan 19, 2005, at 12:00 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My children's app Dada daVinci on the PC side has been
crashing after prolonged use.  Its usually played by
kids 1 to 3 yrs old.  I have a mode that allows the
game to go autopilot and usually after 1 hour of use,
Revolution and Metacard crashes.  It uses 24 bit
graphics, animation and midi music.  I think I am
overloading Revolution's memory, my guess.  Is there
any way to "clean out" the memory or reduce memory use
periodically?  No problems on the Mac side.

That is a great program.  Some time ago, you sent me a copy for my then 
unborn son.  He has played with it a lot.  It is fun to watch him use 
the Japanese module as neither my wife nor myself speak the language.

Anywayswe have not seen it crash yet.  I use it mainly in the 
classic mode.

--
Best regards,
Mark Talluto
http://www.canelasoftware.com
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Re: Image false or true

[Klaus Major]

Hello Mr. Salyers,
Am 20.01.2005 um 19:14 schrieb Paul Salyers:
I have a program with 2 images.
Image & dImage
dImage = defaultImage
how do I make 1 true and the other false
I tried
set the visible of stack "dImage" to false
Maybe you should try
set the visible of IMAGE "dImage" to false
instead?
Didn't work.
Not surprised...
Paul Salyers
PS1 - Senior Rep.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://ps1.SoftSeven.org
Regards
Klaus Major
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.major-k.de
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Re: Image false or true

[Frank D. Engel, Jr.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
You want to hide one image and show the other?
Try:
hide image "dImage"
show image "defaultImage"
and the like.
On Jan 20, 2005, at 1:14 PM, Paul Salyers wrote:

I have a program with 2 images.
Image & dImage
dImage = defaultImage
how do I make 1 true and the other false
I tried
set the visible of stack "dImage" to false
Didn't work.
Paul Salyers
PS1 - Senior Rep.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://ps1.SoftSeven.org
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- ---
Frank D. Engel, Jr.  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
$ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual
$ true | cat /usr/manual | grep "John 3:16"
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten 
Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have 
everlasting life.
$
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFB7/he7aqtWrR9cZoRAv+pAJ0ada6LfSN4ckqw1QPzeR8bz8O/jQCgirf7
Ht59ONlCXPQQDh/ga5156Pg=
=e0Gj
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: export RTF as file?

[James . Cass]

>  Apple's TextEdit, which is the default 
> RTF reader in OS X) ignores the styling.

What makes it even trickier, is that a user can turn on/off the TextEdit 
preferences to "ignore rich text commands in RTF files" (or HTML files). 
If you were giong to use TextEdit as a complementary app to a Rev app, you 
may want to look at the "com.apple.TextEdit.plist" file to see what those 
settings are.

-James






Dan Shafer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
01/20/05 12:45 PM
Please respond to How to use Revolution
 
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], How to use Revolution 

cc: 
Subject:Re: export RTF as file?


I suspect all this OS X stuff I'm doing is useless because you seem to
be more concerned about Wordpad but I thought I'd add this data point.

If I format the text in the field and then save it in an RTF file, Word
recognizes the styling, it shows up in the raw RTF in BBEdit, but
Apple's TextEdit, which is the default RTF reader in OS X) ignores the
styling. The text shows up in the default RTF font but not styled.

Dan

On Jan 20, 2005, at 7:59 AM, Chipp Walters wrote:

> Dave,
>
> I'm using the same version of Wordpad as you. Alex is using a newer
> version. That's probably the reason why ours doesn't work and his
> does.
>
> -Chipp
>
> Dave Cragg wrote:
>> On 20 Jan 2005, at 11:49, Alex Tweedly wrote:
>>> Dave Cragg wrote:
>>> 
>>>
 I get the same result as you in Wordpad. (And the same if saved as
 "untitled.rtf".)

 It opens fine in Open Office, and Notepad displays the full rtf
 stuff (as expected).
>>>
>>>
 This doesn't square with Alex's report. Alex, do you have Word
 installed? Like Chipp, I don't. Does a Word installation add
 resources that are used by WordPad?
>>>
>>>
>>> No, I don't have Word installed (heaven forfend !).
>>> The Wordpad version I have is
>>>  5.1 build 2600.xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158: Service Pack 2
>>> in case that might be the difference.
>>>
>> Running on XP SP1.
>> WordPad version here is 5.1 build 2600.xpsp2.040919-1003: Service
>> pack 1
>> I wonder what that means. :-)
>
>
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> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.7.0 - Release Date: 1/17/2005
>
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Re: living and learning

[Bob Hartley]

At 19:04 17/01/2005, you wrote:
Sure..., sorry but I forgot one critical step: name the cards the same as
the tabs.
It's on revOnline under the user 'kray' called "Cheesy Tab Example".

Hi Ken
I cant seem to get this downloaded.
I can see the description int revonline but it wont download.
Any ideas?
Cheers
Bob

:-)
Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Extra cr after every line?

[Glen Bojsza]

I have had some success in writing lines to a file from a Windows XP
machine to a Solaris machine.

Unfortunately, there is an additional blank line after every line I write.

The data in the field "test" on the Windows machine is:

hostname
address
user

once written to a file on the Solaris machine via serial connection it
appears as:

hostname

address

user

Is there a method to not have the additional returns? I

on mouseUp
put the fld "test" into theData
write theData to file theSerialPort
end mouseUp

thanks
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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[David Grogono]

Richard Gaskin wrote:

> We had a rather funny thread here last year in which an RB fan started a
> bake-off for speed on a parsing algorithm on a fairly large file.  True
> 'nuff, RB was faster -- but only by 3 milliseconds. And that was the
> overal score -- in the most common task, loading a file, Rev was nearly
> twice as fast.

A number of small clarifications on this.  The person who started the speed
comparison was not an "RB fan" but rather a SuperCard user evaluating both
REALbasic and Revolution.  His initial attempt found that REALbasic was
significantly faster than Revolution.  After both sets of code were further
optimized the speed differences were negligible.  The primary difference
after optimization is the readability and maintainability of the code.  The
guts of the routine in REALbasic is 6 lines of code but 37 lines of code in
Revolution.  As for the speed of the load, the results are probably
misleading for REALbasic because it includes the first step of string
processing.  Either way the load is extremely fast in both environments and
it's a tiny tiny fraction of the total task.  Here's the code for each
environment:  copied from 

REALbasic:
 x=uBound(STarray)
 For i = 0 to x
   If InStrB(TT,(STarray(i))) > 0 then
 Matches=Matches+STarray(i)+chr(13)
   End if
 Next

Revolution:
 replace quote with empty in stList
 put lower(tMatchList) into tLowerMatchList
 replace quote with empty in tLowerMatchList

 put md5Digest(tMatchList) into tDigest
 if (tDigest <> textDigest) then
 put empty into shortFindList
 repeat for each word w in tLowerMatchList
 put char 1 of w into c
 put c after shortFindList
 put TRUE into isWord[w]
 put TRUE into isWord[w0&w]
 put w into w0
 end repeat
 put tDigest into textDigest
 end if

 set the caseSensitive to TRUE

 repeat for each line inLine in stList
 put empty into shortFind
 put lower(inLine) into inLineLower
 put 0 into i
 put empty into w0
 repeat for each word w in inLineLower
 if not isWord[w0&w] then
 put empty into shortFind
 exit repeat
 end if
 put char 1 of w after shortFind
 put w into w0
 end repeat
 if (shortFind is empty) then next repeat
 put offset(shortFind, shortFindList) into x
 if (x > 0) then
 if (offset(inLineLower, tLowerMatchList, x*2-1) > 0) then
 put inLine & return after MatchList
 end if
 end if
 end repeat

--
David Grogono

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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Michael D Mays]

Yes 4000 times faster, once you take your shoes off.
One char, 4 char and 8 char replacement is fast.
on mouseUp
  repeat with i = 1 to 100
put "1234567890" after dd
  end repeat
  put 990 into a
  get the long seconds
  put "a" into char a of dd
  put "abcd" into char a to a+3 of dd
  put "abcdefgh" into char a to a+7 of dd
  put the long seconds - it
end mouseUp
Michael
On Jan 20, 2005, at 12:38 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
Richard Gaskin wrote:
Chipp Walters wrote:
 > Richard Gaskin wrote:
 >> I've been pondering this new speed enhancement to same-size
 >> chunk replacements, specifically in regard to image processing.
 >> Since much of what image processing involves is replacing a
 >> specific number of bytes, I wonder if any of the folks here
 >> have made any recent experiments with writing image filters
 >> in native Transcript.  With the sort of speed Dar reports we
 >> may find that some types of filters can run acceptably well
 >> in Transcript alone.
 >
 > I did write some compositing and blur/sharpen filters in
 > transcript some time ago, but I don't know the details of
 > the 'same-size chunk' replacements. Where can I find more info?
All I know is what Dar posted here, but it sounded really tasty. 
Apparently he made a suggestion to Scott Raney about ways to optimize 
operations in which a string of a given length is used to replace a 
substring of the same length within a larger chunk.
In previous versions a very generalized approach was used for all 
replacement operations, requiring that the data be copied during the 
replacement, which can be computationally expensive with large 
chunks.
Since the data being inserted is the same length as the data being 
removed the handle size doesn't change, allowing the operation to 
work in-place, without copying.
IIRC, Raney reported that the new method should improve speed by 
roughly 4000 times for those cases.
Dar - got the details for us?
Found the Bugzilla notes:

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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Richard Gaskin]

Michael D Mays wrote:
>>> All I know is what Dar posted here, but it sounded really tasty.
>>> Apparently he made a suggestion to Scott Raney about ways to
>>> optimize operations in which a string of a given length is used
>>> to replace a substring of the same length within a larger chunk.
>>> In previous versions a very generalized approach was used for all
>>> replacement operations, requiring that the data be copied during the
>>> replacement, which can be computationally expensive with large
>>> chunks.
>>> Since the data being inserted is the same length as the data being
>>> removed the handle size doesn't change, allowing the operation to
>>> work in-place, without copying.
>>> IIRC, Raney reported that the new method should improve speed by
>>> roughly 4000 times for those cases.
>>> Dar - got the details for us?
>>
>> Found the Bugzilla notes:
>> 
Yes 4000 times faster, once you take your shoes off.
One char, 4 char and 8 char replacement is fast.
on mouseUp
  repeat with i = 1 to 100
put "1234567890" after dd
  end repeat
  put 990 into a
  get the long seconds
  put "a" into char a of dd
  put "abcd" into char a to a+3 of dd
  put "abcdefgh" into char a to a+7 of dd
  put the long seconds - it
end mouseUp
For clarity, I should admit that I'd accidentally misquoted Scott 
Raney's claim from the Bugzilla report:  it's *only* 1000 times faster, 
not 4000 times.

What does "once you take your shoes off" mean in this context?
--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Media Corporation
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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Chipp Walters]

In fairness to Rev, there was no stipulation regarding how many lines of 
code it take to generate the results. In fact, one could concatenate all 
lines of the Rev code using ';' to solve the problem in only 1 line of 
code ;-)

Also, there are certainly different things going on in the two code 
snippets you posted. In RB, variables are not declared, but in Rev some 
are instantiated-- not to mention the MD5digest reset switch (only in 
the Rev code). Also, as I recall, this project was a 'moving target.' 
Once Rev posted a 'winning time', the challenge changed benefiting RB.

Assuming 'readability' and 'maintainability' were set as primary goals, 
it's hard to deny Xtalk languages excel in both areas.

All that said, it does look like either application can handle string 
parsing w/out problems.

-Chipp
David Grogono wrote:
A number of small clarifications on this.  The person who started the speed
comparison was not an "RB fan" but rather a SuperCard user evaluating both
REALbasic and Revolution.  His initial attempt found that REALbasic was
significantly faster than Revolution.  After both sets of code were further
optimized the speed differences were negligible.  The primary difference
after optimization is the readability and maintainability of the code.  The
guts of the routine in REALbasic is 6 lines of code but 37 lines of code in
Revolution.  As for the speed of the load, the results are probably
misleading for REALbasic because it includes the first step of string
processing.  Either way the load is extremely fast in both environments and
it's a tiny tiny fraction of the total task.  Here's the code for each
environment:  copied from 

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Same-size chunk replacements (was RunRev vs RealBasic)

[Dar Scott]

On Jan 19, 2005, at 11:33 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
> I did write some compositing and blur/sharpen filters in
> transcript some time ago, but I don't know the details of
> the 'same-size chunk' replacements. Where can I find more info?
All I know is what Dar posted here, but it sounded really tasty. 
Apparently he made a suggestion to Scott Raney about ways to optimize 
operations in which a string of a given length is used to replace a 
substring of the same length within a larger chunk.

In previous versions a very generalized approach was used for all 
replacement operations, requiring that the data be copied during the 
replacement, which can be computationally expensive with large chunks.

Since the data being inserted is the same length as the data being 
removed the handle size doesn't change, allowing the operation to work 
in-place, without copying.

IIRC, Raney reported that the new method should improve speed by 
roughly 4000 times for those cases.

Dar - got the details for us?
You got the important parts.
For building a large string such as an image, the put-after command is 
fastest (1 or 2 microseconds on my Mac).  So, if you are doing color 
shifting on an image, that is the best to go.

   put newPixel after imageSoFar
But if you are putting a small image over a large image or drawing onto 
an image or doing something that needs random access or a change to 
only part, then use same-size put-into (6 microseconds on my Mac).

   put newPixel into char p to p+3 of imageSoFar
This used to take very long on large images.  Now both of these are 
small fixed time.  (Well, there is a tiny growth time every once in a 
while for 'after' but it is only a microsecond on my computer, that is, 
it is fixed, too.)

Anyway, use 'after' if you can, and make sure the chunk sizes match if 
you can't.

This also very handy for binary arrays and matrices and such.
I thought I had entered that as an enhancement into bugzilla, but 
either I goofed or it was changed.

This is one of those things in which a fundamental enhancement or 
performance improvement might open the doors to a scripting solution to 
what is on folks' wish lists.

Dar
**
DSC (Dar Scott Consulting & Dar's Lab)
http://www.swcp.com/dsc/
Programming Services and Software
**
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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Richard Gaskin]

David Grogono wrote:
> Richard Gaskin wrote:
>
>> We had a rather funny thread here last year in which an RB
>> fan started a bake-off for speed on a parsing algorithm on
>> a fairly large file.  True 'nuff, RB was faster -- but only
>> by 3 milliseconds. And that was the overal score -- in the
>> most common task, loading a file, Rev was nearly twice as fast.
>
> A number of small clarifications on this.  The person who started
> the speed comparison was not an "RB fan" but rather a SuperCard
> user evaluating both REALbasic and Revolution.
Having once been the leading vendor of third-party components for 
SuperCard, I've known him for more than a decade.  Somewhere in the 
communications he mentioned that he'd felt so burned by the Allegiant 
experience that he was resistent to working with xTalks in general, and 
accordingly had a preference for RB.

> His initial attempt found that REALbasic was significantly faster than
> Revolution.
That was the second round.  The first round had Rev way in the lead 
(twice as fast IIRC), using nothing more than a half-dozen lines of code 
found in an old MetaCard example stack.

> After both sets of code were further optimized the speed differences
> were negligible.  The primary difference after optimization is the
> readability and maintainability of the code.  The guts of the routine
> in REALbasic is 6 lines of code but 37 lines of code in Revolution.
We could selectively compare subsets, but to get the job done the final 
published code listings have 74 lines for RB and 79 lines for Rev.

> As for the speed of the load, the results are probably misleading
> for REALbasic because it includes the first step of string processing.
It's odd that after so many RB'ers helped with that code they came up 
with an inefficient method.

But maybe it's not so bad -- his Rev code uses:
   put url ("file:"&fn) into tMatchList
That also does string processing, changing any line endings to match the 
Unix convention used internally within the engine.  "binfile" is often 
faster than "file", since it loads the file wholesale without modifying 
line endings.

> Either way the load is extremely fast in both environments and
> it's a tiny tiny fraction of the total task.  Here's the code for each
> environment:  copied from 
From that page:

RealBasic (5.5.1)   Revolution (2.2)
Load Data   28 ms   14 ms

Check Matches 1036 ms 1049 ms
Display All184 ms  188 ms

TOTAL1248 ms (78 ticks)   1251 ms (78 ticks)
What's interesting here is not RB vs. Rev, but RB vs. C.  One of the 
advantages RB personnel like to tout is that RB is "fully compiled", in 
contrast to what they characterize as Rev being "interpreted" (in truth 
Rev is a bit of both, like Java but with more efficient structure, but 
that's another hair-splitting story).

If RB were indeed "fully compiled", we should expect it to beat the 
pants off of any "interpreted" language by a very wide margin, and have 
speeds more in line with what one would expect from compiling C or 
anything else that outputs machine-specific object code.

That so many common tasks perform with nearly equivalent speed in an 
ultra-high-level language like Transcript speaks rather well for its 
inventor.  And given the many productivity advantages to typeless 
languages outlined by Osterhout and others 
(), Rev makes a very strong case 
for itself that more than compensates for the few specialized cases 
where RB may actually turn out to be significantly faster.

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Media Corporation
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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Michael D Mays]

see thread
 Bugzilla 586, the fast char replacement (was Revolution compilation)
I had a hard time counting to 4.
I get a 4000X improvement on my dual 2GHz PPC G5.
Michael
On Jan 20, 2005, at 4:43 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
For clarity, I should admit that I'd accidentally misquoted Scott 
Raney's claim from the Bugzilla report:  it's *only* 1000 times 
faster, not 4000 times.

What does "once you take your shoes off" mean in this context?
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Re: Same-size chunk replacements (was RunRev vs RealBasic)

[Richard Gaskin]

Dar Scott wrote:
On Jan 19, 2005, at 11:33 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
> I did write some compositing and blur/sharpen filters in
> transcript some time ago, but I don't know the details of
> the 'same-size chunk' replacements. Where can I find more info?
All I know is what Dar posted here, but it sounded really tasty. 
Apparently he made a suggestion to Scott Raney about ways to optimize 
operations in which a string of a given length is used to replace a 
substring of the same length within a larger chunk.

In previous versions a very generalized approach was used for all 
replacement operations, requiring that the data be copied during the 
replacement, which can be computationally expensive with large chunks.

Since the data being inserted is the same length as the data being 
removed the handle size doesn't change, allowing the operation to work 
in-place, without copying.

IIRC, Raney reported that the new method should improve speed by 
roughly 4000 times for those cases.

Dar - got the details for us?

You got the important parts.
For building a large string such as an image, the put-after command is 
fastest (1 or 2 microseconds on my Mac).  So, if you are doing color 
shifting on an image, that is the best to go.

   put newPixel after imageSoFar
But if you are putting a small image over a large image or drawing onto 
an image or doing something that needs random access or a change to only 
part, then use same-size put-into (6 microseconds on my Mac).

   put newPixel into char p to p+3 of imageSoFar
This used to take very long on large images.  Now both of these are 
small fixed time.  (Well, there is a tiny growth time every once in a 
while for 'after' but it is only a microsecond on my computer, that is, 
it is fixed, too.)

Anyway, use 'after' if you can, and make sure the chunk sizes match if 
you can't.

This also very handy for binary arrays and matrices and such.
I thought I had entered that as an enhancement into bugzilla, but either 
I goofed or it was changed.

This is one of those things in which a fundamental enhancement or 
performance improvement might open the doors to a scripting solution to 
what is on folks' wish lists.
Good info, thanks Dar.
Chipp, does any of this apply to your image processing routines?
Anyone else here interested in seeing if it's now feasible to write 
efficient image filters in native Transcript?

--
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Re: Optimization (was another comparison thread)

[Richard Gaskin]

Michael D Mays wrote:
On Jan 20, 2005, at 4:43 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
For clarity, I should admit that I'd accidentally misquoted Scott 
Raney's claim from the Bugzilla report:  it's *only* 1000 times 
faster, not 4000 times.
I get a 4000X improvement on my dual 2GHz PPC G5.
Hot dog!
Well, Raney always was conservative about such things, the 
quintessential underseller:

While other companies add 2 features to go from v2.0 to v3.0, when he 
was managing the engine he's add dozens of new features and call it a 
point-point release. :)

--
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Re: Extra cr after every line?

[Sarah Reichelt]

From the docs under "return":
The line feed character is the standard end-of-line delimiter on Unix 
systems. The end-of-line delimiter for Mac OS systems is a carriage 
return, and the end-of-line delimiter for Windows systems is a 
carriage return followed by a line feed. Internally, Revolution always 
uses a line feed to end lines.
I would guess that your Windows machine is ending each line with CRLF 
which translates to 2 linefeeds on Solaris.
Try:
put fld "test" into theData
replace numToChar(13) with empty in theData

Then send it and see what happens.
Cheers,
Sarah
On 21 Jan 2005, at 8:04 am, Glen Bojsza wrote:
I have had some success in writing lines to a file from a Windows XP
machine to a Solaris machine.
Unfortunately, there is an additional blank line after every line I 
write.

The data in the field "test" on the Windows machine is:
hostname
address
user
once written to a file on the Solaris machine via serial connection it
appears as:
hostname
address
user
Is there a method to not have the additional returns? I
on mouseUp
put the fld "test" into theData
write theData to file theSerialPort
end mouseUp
thanks
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Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[David Grogono]

Chipp Walters wrote:

> In fairness to Rev, there was no stipulation regarding how many lines of
> code it take to generate the results. In fact, one could concatenate all
> lines of the Rev code using ';' to solve the problem in only 1 line of
> code ;-)

True, there wasn't a line requirement.  However, since the speed was roughly
the same in both cases I'd be much happier maintaining the 6 lines of code.
I have a hard time believing that most people can look at this particular
Rev code and easily understand what it's doing.

> Also, there are certainly different things going on in the two code
> snippets you posted. In RB, variables are not declared, but in Rev some
> are instantiated-- not to mention the MD5digest reset switch (only in
> the Rev code).

Valid point, although the amount and readability of code would still be
quite different.

> Also, as I recall, this project was a 'moving target.'
> Once Rev posted a 'winning time', the challenge changed benefiting RB.

Not true.  At first no-one on the REALbasic list spent any time optimizing
the code since the initial post had found REALbasic to be 5 times faster.
Once there was some Rev code that appeared to be faster, those on the
REALbasic list took up the challenge.  During this process someone noticed
that the new Rev code was inadvertently ignoring duplicate matches.  Rev may
have been faster at this point but the code wasn't doing the full job.  It
was also pointed out that the Rev code had been optimized for 2 and 3 letter
searches and the original poster decided to update his data set to be more
representative of his needs.
 
> Assuming 'readability' and 'maintainability' were set as primary goals,
> it's hard to deny Xtalk languages excel in both areas.

Sure, but in order to get maximum performance in this particular case it
seems both of these things have been sacrificed.
 
> All that said, it does look like either application can handle string
> parsing w/out problems.

Agreed.
 

Richard Gaskin wrote:
 
>> A number of small clarifications on this.  The person who started
>> the speed comparison was not an "RB fan" but rather a SuperCard
>> user evaluating both REALbasic and Revolution.
> 
> Having once been the leading vendor of third-party components for
> SuperCard, I've known him for more than a decade.  Somewhere in the
> communications he mentioned that he'd felt so burned by the Allegiant
> experience that he was resistent to working with xTalks in general, and
> accordingly had a preference for RB.

He didn't have a preference for REALbasic, in fact very early during the
thread he mentioned that he was a REALbasic novice:

>>> You know more than most on this list that I will squeeze every
>>> millisecond out of my code, but SuperCard will only go just so fast.
>>> I'm just a novice with Revolotion and RealBasic, so I'm trying to
>>> figure out if RealBasic really is THAT fast and whether Revolution
>>> can't be coaxed to go a bit faster than I'm able to make it.

>> His initial attempt found that REALbasic was significantly faster than
>> Revolution.
> 
> That was the second round.  The first round had Rev way in the lead
> (twice as fast IIRC), using nothing more than a half-dozen lines of code
> found in an old MetaCard example stack.

I can't find any evidence of this assertion on either mailing list.  The
above quote seems to indicate he had found otherwise.

>> After both sets of code were further optimized the speed differences
>> were negligible.  The primary difference after optimization is the
>> readability and maintainability of the code.  The guts of the routine
>> in REALbasic is 6 lines of code but 37 lines of code in Revolution.
> 
> We could selectively compare subsets, but to get the job done the final
> published code listings have 74 lines for RB and 79 lines for Rev.

True, but the RB code will display appropriate error messages when the data
file is missing or locked.  It doesn't look like the Revolution code does
this.  Removing this code could save 20+ lines.  Alternatively the same
functionality could be accomplished with fewer lines if anyone cared.

>> As for the speed of the load, the results are probably misleading
>> for REALbasic because it includes the first step of string processing.
> 
> It's odd that after so many RB'ers helped with that code they came up
> with an inefficient method.

I never said the method was inefficient.  I was just pointing out that the
timing wasn't simply timing a file load.  You were using this one data point
to imply that Revolution loaded files twice as fast as REALbasic.
 
> But maybe it's not so bad -- his Rev code uses:
> 
>   put url ("file:"&fn) into tMatchList
> 
> That also does string processing, changing any line endings to match the
> Unix convention used internally within the engine.  "binfile" is often
> faster than "file", since it loads the file wholesale without modifying
> line endings.

This demonstrates my point.  The definition of "load" was peculiar 

Re: RunRev vs RealBasic (Richard Gaskin)

[Chipp Walters]

Hi David,
A quick Google shows you're the product manager for Real Basic. Guess 
that sorta slipped your sig ;-)

I certainly understand your desire to defend RB to the max.
I followed closely the previous RB-RR thread, and don't recall it as you 
do. Perhaps we should discuss over lunch? (I'm in Austin, too!)

-Chipp
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Re: Open from Context Menu

[D.Rothe]

Ok, When I start the app (as standalone) I can import/open and display a
.txt  file in a field by selecting it from a pulldown menu! Just like all
text editors..

The problem is getting the .txt file to display in the field by sending it
to my app via  the right click 'Open with' method.
Using this method starts the app but does not load the .txt file into the
field!

Cheers.Dwayne
>
> Hi Dwayne,
>
> > Hi All,
> > I created a simple textpad type application it's simple and works well
> > for my purposes, however I am having trouble loading a txt
> > file by using the right click 'Open with' method (win xp). Any
> > ideas would be appreciated, it's certainly not a critical flaw but
> > it would finish off the app 100%.
>
> what exactly is your problem???
> Does the import fail or what or the way HOW to do the import?
>
> A tiny bit of info would help us to help you :-)
>
> > Cheers Dwayne
>
> Regards
>
> Klaus Major
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.major-k.de
>
>
> --


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Re: Open from Context Menu

[Chipp Walters]

Hi Dwayne,
You need to check the environment variables when your app launches. Do a 
search for "$" in the docs and it will explain it.

-Chipp
D.Rothe wrote:
Ok, When I start the app (as standalone) I can import/open and display a
.txt  file in a field by selecting it from a pulldown menu! Just like all
text editors..
The problem is getting the .txt file to display in the field by sending it
to my app via  the right click 'Open with' method.
Using this method starts the app but does not load the .txt file into the
field!

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Mac Menubar Again...

[Chipp Walters]

OK, on Windows, I use a mouseDown handler to preset the checks for a 
menu. For instance, I can set a menu to put a checkmark next to the font 
for the currently selected text, before the menu is drawn. Nice and easy.

Since Mac menubars don't respond to mouseDown, how does one do this for 
Macs? Please don't tell me I have to change all the menus everytime 
someone selects text :-(

Any and all ideas welcome!
TIA,
Chipp
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Re: Extra cr after every line?

[Yves COPPE]

Le 20 janv. 05, à 23:02, Glen Bojsza a écrit :
I have had some success in writing lines to a file from a Windows XP
machine to a Solaris machine.
Unfortunately, there is an additional blank line after every line I 
write.

The data in the field "test" on the Windows machine is:
hostname
address
user
once written to a file on the Solaris machine via serial connection it
appears as:
hostname
address
user
Is there a method to not have the additional returns? I
on mouseUp
put the fld "test" into theData
write theData to file theSerialPort
end mouseUp

try this
this will remove all blank lines in your variable
on mouseUp
   put fld "test" into thedata
   filter thedata with "*?"
   write thedata to file theSerialPort
end mouseUp

Greetings.
Yves COPPE
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Same-size chunk replacements (was RunRev vs RealBasic)

[sims]

Dar Scott wrote:
On Jan 19, 2005, at 11:33 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

Good info, thanks Dar.
Chipp, does any of this apply to your image processing routines?
Anyone else here interested in seeing if it's now feasible to write 
efficient image filters in native Transcript?
I hope that you are referring to those image routines that I 
downloaded from Chipp
a while back (image sharpening was one of the tools I believe). They 
were very slow
but if this new wrinkle speeds them up by a factor of 1,000 then I would surely
pay Chipp for a set of them just as I recently paid for his FANTASTIC 
altBrowser.

sims
The European Revolution Conference 2006 - Be there!
News coming soon!
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Re: Mac Menubar Again...

[Sarah Reichelt]

The Mac menus DO respond to the mouseDown, but they don't know which 
menu has been selected.
If you have a mouseDown handler in the menubar's group, it will be 
triggered, but you will have to set ALL the menus at that point as you 
have no way of knowing which is going to be displayed. (In Mac's once 
the mouse button is clicked down in a menubar, it can be moved from 
side to side and will display any menus under the pointer.)

Cheers,
Sarah
On 21 Jan 2005, at 4:47 pm, Chipp Walters wrote:
OK, on Windows, I use a mouseDown handler to preset the checks for a 
menu. For instance, I can set a menu to put a checkmark next to the 
font for the currently selected text, before the menu is drawn. Nice 
and easy.

Since Mac menubars don't respond to mouseDown, how does one do this 
for Macs? Please don't tell me I have to change all the menus 
everytime someone selects text :-(

Any and all ideas welcome!
TIA,
Chipp
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