Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Mark, you're quite right, I cannot find it either. Thought I'd filed it as a bug, but maybe it was only raised in correspondence with development in connection with the others. I will first check it out in detail on Mandriva as well as Debian, and then file it. I'm not completely sure, thinking about it again, if its a bug with revPrintField or with the Rev print setup dialogues. Roughly what happens is that revPrintField, when it brings up the Rev print dialogues, any changes you make to sizings have no effect on the output. Now since I don't have the system print dialogues available here on Debian, I don't know if this is just Rev's dialogue, or it is also applies when you have the system dialogues available, so will check this out properly before posting. Peter Mark Schonewille-3 wrote: Hi Peter, Under which number have you entered your revPrintField bug in the QCC? I searched for revPrintField, but all bugs that show up are fixed, except for one enhancement and one that is actually a menubar bug. Best, Mark -- Economy-x-Talk Consultancy and Software Engineering http://economy-x-talk.com http://www.salery.biz Get your store on-line within minutes with Salery Web Store software. Download at http://www.salery.biz Op 20-apr-2008, om 22:24 heeft Peter Alcibiades het volgende geschreven: snip Quite a bit of very useful stuff. sqlite is great to have in Linux. revPrintField howeverthat still doesn't work. And I seem to be the only one who notices! This is rather a pity. I had hoped and expected to get all printing working properly out of 2.9 and the beta program. But, I did get 85% of what I was hoping for. Maybe it will be fixed one of these days. Meanwhile, there is a workaround at least. snip ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Getting-things-the-wrong-way-round-.-.-.-tp16781961p16845633.html Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
On 19/4/08 19:02, Petrides, M.D. Marian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If we already have a Rev Enterprise license, will we order our renewals through Amazon or continue to renew through Run Rev? If we can do either--and a the same cost, which is more beneficial to the folks at RunRev? (See my comment about motivation behind continuing to do annual renewals even while use of Rev was/is dormant). Apologies for the delay, I have been on holiday for a few days and just spotted this thread just now. The goal of Mirye is to broaden Revolution's reach and appeal, predominantly by getting it in front of new resellers and partners. Obviously we're keen that this operation is a success and generates results as quickly as possible for everyone. The more that Mirye is able to build up its sales and presence the more we will all benefit. But at the same time, given the goal is primarily new customers and given that Runtime depends completely on our loyal users keeping licenses current, I would have to say that users who have been with us for years can benefit us the most by continuing to purchase directly from us. Kind regards, Kevin Kevin Miller ~ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ http://www.runrev.com/ Runtime Revolution - User-Centric Development Tools ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Richmond, scrubbed Bill Marriott's message as sent to Richmond Mathewson off-list. Let us just say that the nub of the message was that my initial posting under this heading was inflammatory. Here's the text of the message: === Richmond, A number of people, including myself, got a very bad impression about the end-result of Beta testing. I'm a little confused. You received your complimentary Rev Media license within a day of Rev Media being built and posted to the web site. The people who were entitled to a free copy of Studio or Enterprise were mailed their keys within a similar timeframe of those editions being ready. Your posts on this topic had no impact whatsoever on the timetable of the notifications... They were sent out as soon as logistics permitted. May be we were ill-informed insofar as 2.9 was announced as finished with great fanfare (which it deserved) before the Beta testers were made aware that they would be rewarded. [...] My motivation was clear; help improve RR and get my hands on the newer version. Except that we had made the pledge about 2.9 being free for 2.7 purchasers several times in several different venues throughout the cycle. I looked through all previous beta-related communications and could not find where we promised anything additional/special for beta testers. Nevertheless, we *will* be doing something for those who were active. We're going to announce it when it's ready, and it won't be much longer. Hopefully this attempt to recognize people and express appreciation won't become yet another opportunity for complaints. Somebody round here is at fault; it could be me, or it could be the people at RR, or it could be both of us [...] So, I suppose that everybody should learn something about this. [...] It is in your interests not to alienate [loyal users] and the best way to avoid this is to anticipate the sort of thing that happened recently and, as a preventive measure, keep them extremely well-informed and reassured. When we post a version late in the day and then notify people about their free copy before noon the next day, I don't see where there is a case to be made about a lapse in communication. However, perhaps we should anticipate that some people won't be happy no matter what we do, that they will shout it from the mountain top instead of writing an inquiry to support, and that the tone of their comments will be needlessly inflammatory. - Bill ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
I've found two things to be true in this world of software: 1. If you publicly post that you are working on a new version, sales of the current version take a nosedive. People hold off purchasing, waiting for the new version. When it comes out, you do not get all the lost sales back. (There's a name for this phenomenon... I do not recall the name, but it was named after a company that actually went out of business after announcing that a new version was in the works. The company had been previously very successful.) 2. One of my favorite authors is James Herriott, the country vet from England who wrote All Creatures Great and Small and several related works. James Herriott wrote of both his successes and failures as a country vet. Sometimes his patient would die. Other times the recovery would be truly miraculous. He would often encounter the farmers in the local pub or marketplace. And his experiences with happy farmers and unhappy farmers is a familiar one. If he treated a cow and the cow promptly died, the next time he saw the farmer at the marketplace the farmer would be LOUDLY regaling the story of the dead cow to everybody who would listen. And he would add juicy details of his own flavour to the story as it got bigger and bigger with each new listener. The cow was alive, James came to see about him, the cow dropped dead. But the farmer whose cow James literally pulled from the brink of death, that farmer would inevitably be the quiet sort of man, who spoke in barely a whisper. And he might share the story at the marketplace, but with all the hustle and bustle, his whisper would be lost in the crowd. I can relate to this aspect of human nature. As a game developer, I've seen it, too. The unhappy folks yell the loudest, while the happy folks whisper in your ear. something about this. [...] It is in your interests not to alienate [loyal users] and the best way to avoid this is to anticipate the sort of thing that happened recently and, as a preventive measure, keep them extremely well-informed and reassured. When we post a version late in the day and then notify people about their free copy before noon the next day, I don't see where there is a case to be made about a lapse in communication. However, perhaps we should anticipate that some people won't be happy no matter what we do, that they will shout it from the mountain top instead of writing an inquiry to support, and that the tone of their comments will be needlessly inflammatory. - Bill -- Humorous sports t-shirts http://www.villagetshirts.com WlND0WS and MAClNT0SH shareware games http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Well, then I'd better start whispering because I am one happy camper. :-) On Apr 20, 2008, at 2:03 PM, Shari wrote: The unhappy folks yell the loudest, while the happy folks whisper in your ear. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
I am happy too, with one smallish reservation. Participating in the beta was fine - one ought to do that, its the only way to get it done fast enough and well enough. If Rev wants to make gestures to active participants, that's fine, but I certainly didn't expect it, and would participate regardless. Rev has always been very fair with upgrades, so one ought to respond in the same spirit when one can help. I thought the responses from Development were rapid and competent and quite thorough. 2.9 is a great step forward. Native file dialogues is nice. Print Card works properly now. Quite a bit of very useful stuff. sqlite is great to have in Linux. revPrintField howeverthat still doesn't work. And I seem to be the only one who notices! This is rather a pity. I had hoped and expected to get all printing working properly out of 2.9 and the beta program. But, I did get 85% of what I was hoping for. Maybe it will be fixed one of these days. Meanwhile, there is a workaround at least. All in all, the beta was fine, and 2.9 a great step forward for Linux. Peter -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Getting-things-the-wrong-way-round-.-.-.-tp16781961p16798174.html Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Hi Peter, Under which number have you entered your revPrintField bug in the QCC? I searched for revPrintField, but all bugs that show up are fixed, except for one enhancement and one that is actually a menubar bug. Best, Mark -- Economy-x-Talk Consultancy and Software Engineering http://economy-x-talk.com http://www.salery.biz Get your store on-line within minutes with Salery Web Store software. Download at http://www.salery.biz Op 20-apr-2008, om 22:24 heeft Peter Alcibiades het volgende geschreven: snip Quite a bit of very useful stuff. sqlite is great to have in Linux. revPrintField howeverthat still doesn't work. And I seem to be the only one who notices! This is rather a pity. I had hoped and expected to get all printing working properly out of 2.9 and the beta program. But, I did get 85% of what I was hoping for. Maybe it will be fixed one of these days. Meanwhile, there is a workaround at least. snip ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Hi Shari, If you publicly post that you are working on a new version, sales of the current version take a nosedive. People hold off purchasing, waiting for the new version. When it comes out, you do not get all the lost sales back. (There's a name for this phenomenon... I do not recall the name, but it was named after a company that actually went out of business after announcing that a new version was in the works. The company had been previously very successful.) It's called the Osborne Effect. And like every legend out there it has a kernel of truth but is largely exaggerated. A string of poor decisions, and not merely the pre-announce of a computer model, led to Osborne's demise. Pre-announcements have been used to powerful strategic advantage by other companies many times. In this case, the promise of 2.75 (later renamed to 2.9) did not have any discernable negative impact on sales, since we acquired more new customers over the period than at any time in the company's history. We have also been able to expand the number of developers working on the software. Might have something to do with the way we did it. - Bill ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Bill, The Osborne Effect! Yes, that was it! I am happy to hear that many new customers are flowing into Revolution. As others have said, your success means my beloved programming tool will continue to flourish, so I absolutely wish you great success! You are right about making business decisions. I do not know about the Osborne Effect regarding their decision making, but I have friends who have the Midas Touch, no matter what they do, it prospers. They always seem to know what decisions to make. Not many people possess this ability. I've seen a lot of businesses start up and fail. Even the best idea in the world will fail if you don't make the right decisions. And the best software in the world won't sell unless you market the dickens out of it :-) It sounds like Revolution has revved up the marketing with this Mirye collaberation. May it bring great prosperity! Shari It's called the Osborne Effect. And like every legend out there it has a kernel of truth but is largely exaggerated. A string of poor decisions, and not merely the pre-announce of a computer model, led to Osborne's demise. Pre-announcements have been used to powerful strategic advantage by other companies many times. In this case, the promise of 2.75 (later renamed to 2.9) did not have any discernable negative impact on sales, since we acquired more new customers over the period than at any time in the company's history. We have also been able to expand the number of developers working on the software. Might have something to do with the way we did it. - Bill -- Humorous sports t-shirts http://www.villagetshirts.com WlND0WS and MAClNT0SH shareware games http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Getting things the wrong way round . . .
A BIG THANK YOU to Runtime Revolution for my copy of RevMedia 2.9 that arrived yesterday. Somebody round here is at fault; it could be me, or it could be the people at RR, or it could be both of us: BUT A number of people, including myself, got a very bad impression about the end-result of Beta testing. May be we were ill-informed insofar as 2.9 was announced as finished with great fanfare (which it deserved) before the Beta testers were made aware that they would be rewarded. Now I don't know what motivated the other Beta testers; however I am always suspicious at protestations of disinterested service. My motivation was clear; help improve RR and get my hands on the newer version. I have no pretensions as to altruism. So, I suppose that everybody should learn something about this. The most important message (as far as I am concerned) should go to Runtime Revolution: You have a loyal body of people from all sorts of different backgrounds, with all sorts of temperaments. It is in your interests not to alienate them; and the best way to avoid this is to anticipate the sort of thing that happened recently and, as a preventive measure, keep them extremely well-informed and reassured. Having given that fairly pompous message, I would like to reiterate my congratulations on having produced an extremely good version of Runtime Revolution. sincerely, Richmond Mathewson. A Thorn in the flesh is better than a failed Systems Development Life Cycle. __ Sent from Yahoo! Mail. A Smarter Email http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Now I don't know what motivated the other Beta testers; however I am always suspicious at protestations of disinterested service. I would suppose this to refer to my earlier email in this thread. My motivation for wanting Runtime to prosper is completely selfish. To that end I am prepared to put my time into helping without any expectation of direct material reward. I have a current license and renew it every time it comes due (or in advance), so the frequently stared offer to upgrade nearly everyone to 2.9 was no great incentive to me. My reward is in having a better Revolution that I can use to earn my living. You must have missed the numerous posts, emails and newsletter articles telling us all that 2.9 would be supplied to various existing license holders and so your first reaction was to assume the worst and start complaining. Even your letter of thanks when you realised you were wrong is just criticism worded in a different way. In future, could you do us all the favour of delaying your negative reactions until you are sure they are based on fact. Thank you, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Richmond wrote: Now I don't know what motivated the other Beta testers; however I am always suspicious at protestations of disinterested service. I need to second Sarah's statement: My motivation for wanting Runtime to prosper is completely selfish. Even though my use of Rev was in a prolonged hiatus between 2004 and 2007 (I had other things I needed to be working on), I gladly continued to renew my license yearly. Why? Because I wanted RunRev to be around when I was finally ready to get back into creating software. And, I was rewarded by having a version 2.9 that is far better than the 2.1.2 I had been using. Worth every penny IMHO. Face it, this is a community. Each of us who values it contributes what he can afford to to that community, be it time, money, or simply devoted evangelism--not because we HAVE to, but because we all want the Rev community to prosper. I'll step off my soapbox now Marian ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
May be we were ill-informed insofar as 2.9 was announced as finished with great fanfare (which it deserved) before the Beta testers were made aware that they would be rewarded. The 2.9 beta had a very long cycle, and it should have shipped much, much sooner than it did. That perhaps confused some people because if it had shipped according to its original schedule, there wouldn't be much in the way of confusion. However the product that was released is a far superior product than what you would have gotten then, and likely the schedule would have just needed to be repeated - again. I have to seriously plan product shipments - we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. What goes to retail can't be something that's full of issues, since if it is, its more likely to be shipped back from distribution after a lot of customer complaints. There's a huge cost associated with getting returns of bum product. A lot of companies only allow active (you have a current license that will entitle you to an upgrade during X amount of time) customers to participate in a beta with no actual upgrade assured. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Mirye [was Getting things the wrong way round]
I have to seriously plan product shipments - we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. What goes to retail can't be something that's full of issues, since if it is, its more likely to be shipped back from distribution after a lot of customer complaints. There's a huge cost associated with getting returns of bum product. What is Mirye Runtime Revolution? Shari -- Humorous sports t-shirts http://www.villagetshirts.com WlND0WS and MAClNT0SH shareware games http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Mirye [was Getting things the wrong way round]
Shari, I was wondering the same thing. Lynn probably can give a better answer, but here's what I found on Mirye's website (www.mirye.com): Mirye Software Publishing is the North American publisher of Runtime Revolution, the leading application and multimedia development environment based on the English-like, object language Revolution. It is the only software that builds native applications on all three major operating systems, Solaris and build native CGIs. M On Apr 19, 2008, at 10:06 AM, Shari wrote: I have to seriously plan product shipments - we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. What goes to retail can't be something that's full of issues, since if it is, its more likely to be shipped back from distribution after a lot of customer complaints. There's a huge cost associated with getting returns of bum product. What is Mirye Runtime Revolution? Shari -- Humorous sports t-shirts http://www.villagetshirts.com WlND0WS and MAClNT0SH shareware games http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Mirye [was Getting things the wrong way round]
I have to seriously plan product shipments - we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. What goes to retail can't be something that's full of issues, since if it is, its more likely to be shipped back from distribution after a lot of customer complaints. There's a huge cost associated with getting returns of bum product. What is Mirye Runtime Revolution? It is the co-branded version of Runtime Revolution sold through resellers, partners and directly from Mirye - http://www.mirye.com. Anything that's going through SHI, Academic SuperStore, Content Paradise, Renderosity, etc comes through us. We have a publishing agreement with Runtime. This doesn't preclude you buying directly from Runtime if you want. A major upside though is that, if you are in the Americas or Asia (we have an office in Japan), we can take care of order issues, special orders or the like more easily because we are in a more compatible time zone. Sales through us are all done in $USD. Our bundles, cross sells and special offers will differ a bit from Runtime's. We also have separate affiliate and publishing programs (quite different from RevSelect). Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Lynn Fredricks wrote: ...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. I'm glad to hear RR will have a presence at Amazon, but is Mirye going to be tacked onto the product name like that? Revolution is a fine name by itself, and with all due respect I'm wary of the usefulness of trade names that require a pronunciation guide (BTW, how *does* one pronounce Mirye? I've asked a dozen or so people and none can guess with any confidence). -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge: Publish any database on any Web site ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Mirye [was Getting things the wrong way round]
Hoping I'm not treading where I shouldn't, but I can't help but ask? Wasn't Revolution itself somewhat of a co-branded version of Metacard? How does this differ? As far as I can tell from the website, Mirye is dedicated almost exclusively to Revolution. The other question would be, does Mirye take on other products? Is it a way for a developer to take their products to store shelves rather than internet download only? Shari It is the co-branded version of Runtime Revolution sold through resellers, partners and directly from Mirye - http://www.mirye.com. Anything that's going through SHI, Academic SuperStore, Content Paradise, Renderosity, etc comes through us. We have a publishing agreement with Runtime. This doesn't preclude you buying directly from Runtime if you want. A major upside though is that, if you are in the Americas or Asia (we have an office in Japan), we can take care of order issues, special orders or the like more easily because we are in a more compatible time zone. Sales through us are all done in $USD. Our bundles, cross sells and special offers will differ a bit from Runtime's. We also have separate affiliate and publishing programs (quite different from RevSelect). Best regards, Lynn Fredricks -- Humorous sports t-shirts http://www.villagetshirts.com WlND0WS and MAClNT0SH shareware games http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Mirye [was Getting things the wrong way round]
Hoping I'm not treading where I shouldn't, but I can't help but ask? Wasn't Revolution itself somewhat of a co-branded version of Metacard? How does this differ? As far as I can tell from the website, Mirye is dedicated almost exclusively to Revolution. Revolution differs from MetaCard in a number of technological ways, plus, RR Ltd acquired MetaCard from MetaCard Corporation. RR Ltd develops and owns the code base which is Revolution. Mirye is a totally different entity - not a RR company. We don't own Revolution but we do publish it. Publishing involves selling and marketing (and in varying degrees, supporting) products that may or may not be made by the publisher itself. We've been concentrating mostly on Revolution and secondarily on Valentina (new Valentina products are on their way which are much better channel players), but we've also added a broad range of graphical and audio content to our store. I wanted to make sure we get the formula right, first. Plus, I also wanted to get 2.9 out - Revolution Media 2.9 was the last piece :-) The other question would be, does Mirye take on other products? Is it a way for a developer to take their products to store shelves rather than internet download only? That's exactly it. My core team in North America and Japan have been actively involved in channel development for the last 11 years (much more for me personally) - that is, creating new venues or participating in existing venues to reach new customers. In that time, we've brought on team members who are very good at more logistical things like package design, web site development and branding. The internet as a commerce venue continues to evolve and become more profitable, as technology product customers have become accustomed to buying by direct download. However just putting something on a website doesn't mean its going to sell, or that its possible to stay competitive in the marketplace. It is true you can point out many successes that are internet only - a lot of Mac oriented companies after all didn't have, or don't have much other choice. In the end its all about expanding your customer base and reaching out to new customers, and what is considered a success is a matter of opinion. Internet sales themselves are now even more so typically the result of hybrid strategies involving cross-selling, partnerships, direct email, combined with print...the list goes on. Mirye does take on other products - what we are looking for primarily are products that are of interest in the digital production market. That includes cross-platform RIA type tools like Revolution, db back ends like Valentina, plus anything else that fits with the digital design/digital development marketspace. By partnering with community/commerce partners like Content Paradise, it has increased the pool of folks we can market to by about a million sets of eyeballs - very attractive indeed :-) The more a product fits with that target market, the more interested we are. If you have a product you'd like to get published, feel free to contact me directly. I am also setting aside some time at Revolution Live for a Birds of a Feather session on how to work with Mirye, what the various options are and the like. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. I'm glad to hear RR will have a presence at Amazon, but is Mirye going to be tacked onto the product name like that? In any marketing we do, yes. We have to differentiate something someone buys from us from what they get from Runtime if they order directly from Runtime. Revolution is a fine name by itself, and with all due respect I'm wary of the usefulness of trade names that require a pronunciation guide (BTW, how *does* one pronounce Mirye? I've asked a dozen or so people and none can guess with any confidence). There's a pronounciation blurb on the very top page of the website. It is Me as in you and me + Rye as in Catcher in the Rye. It's a play on multiple languages. Mirai is very meaningful in Japanese and roughly refers to the future. Mir means peace in Russian. And our Eye is looking towards the future. Soon, we will be on the dollar bill, and the nefarious plans of Mirye Illuminati towards world domination will be fully realized, if not thwarted by some meddling teens or Nicholas Cage :-)) Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Lynn Fredricks wrote: ...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. I'm glad to hear RR will have a presence at Amazon, but is Mirye going to be tacked onto the product name like that? In any marketing we do, yes. We have to differentiate something someone buys from us from what they get from Runtime if they order directly from Runtime. I can understand the desire to boost branding on a new site, but there are other ways to do that, like SEO and traditional marketing, without changing the name of the product. The last thing I bought from Amazon was this pad for backpacking: http://www.amazon.com/Big-Agnes-Insulated-Sleeping-20x72/dp/B0013MY5S2 Note that even though it's sold and shipped from SunDog Outfitters and not Big Agnes directly, the product name is still Big Agnes Air Core, not SunDog Outfitter Air Core. Big Agnes has worked hard to build their reputation, and SunDog is a newer and relatively unknown entity. It certainly wouldn't boost sales of this excellent product if customers had to wonder who actually made it. Same goes for buying Adobe Illustrator from TigerDirect. They don't rename it TigerDirect Illustrator. That would be confusing to the prospective customer. The name is Revolution. Unless you're altering it to be a different product, why should one product have multiple names? While changing the product name may boost Mirye I fear it would dilute the Runtime Revolution brand they've worked hard for a decade to build, ultimately benefiting neither while raising unnecessary questions in an already-challenging market. If indeed you are changing the product to warrant the name change, I'd be interested to hear what you're doing with it. Mirai is very meaningful in Japanese ...but not in English. It sounds like an excellent name for the Japanese market, but I have misgivings about using it domestically. 20 years ago Japanese-sounding names had a certain cache, but tides have long since changed. Today English names resonate more strongly with US consumers. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Well, I do not insist anyone looking through all the world languages for possible associations of the new worlds we create to be used in marketing, but by chance it just happened so that the correct pronunciation of Myrie [mirai] at least in Lithuanian (now one of the official languages of the EU) looks like it is directly associated with death [mirti, mire, mirei]... But due to nature of our language most people will tend to pronounce it as [Miri:e], which sounds different. B.t.w. this is just a funny fact, not a complaint. Lithuanian market is comparatively very small - there are more people living in Athens then speaking our language. I know of only 2 programmers using Revolution here (though likely there are more), and we do not pay too much attention to funny associations in names of foreign companies and products unless it is a direct match :-). So just relax and go on... All the best! Viktoras Richard Gaskin wrote: Lynn Fredricks wrote: Mirai is very meaningful in Japanese ...but not in English. It sounds like an excellent name for the Japanese market, but I have misgivings about using it domestically. 20 years ago Japanese-sounding names had a certain cache, but tides have long since changed. Today English names resonate more strongly with US consumers. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
I can understand the desire to boost branding on a new site, but there are other ways to do that, like SEO and traditional marketing, without changing the name of the product. Yes, SEO plays a role, but its an and not an or part of the total marketing of a product. The last thing I bought from Amazon was this pad for backpacking: http://www.amazon.com/Big-Agnes-Insulated-Sleeping-20x72/dp/B 0013MY5S2 Note that even though it's sold and shipped from SunDog Outfitters and not Big Agnes directly, the product name is still Big Agnes Air Core, not SunDog Outfitter Air Core. Big Agnes has worked hard to build their reputation, and SunDog is a newer and relatively unknown entity. It certainly wouldn't boost sales of this excellent product if customers had to wonder who actually made it. Same goes for buying Adobe Illustrator from TigerDirect. They don't rename it TigerDirect Illustrator. That would be confusing to the prospective customer. TigerDirect is a reseller, not a publisher. Before the product gets to the customer, it can be touched by: Developer - engineers of the product Publisher/Republisher - those that package, market, sell, etc (often but not always the same as developer) Distributor - pick and pack entities that aggregate products and offer special terms to resellers Reseller - bricks and mortar, catalog or online Partner - bundling/etc, can basically sit in as a reseller or distributor on cross-, competitive-, complementary- type offers. Then there are plenty of enablers out there that arent quite one thing or the other. Resellers rarely get involved in branding or logistics, though there have been some interesting exceptions. For example, Best Buy packaging special/exclusive additional disks with certain DVD offerings. My Star Trek Season 1, for example, came with a special Best Buy disk of goodies. That's five - depending on your particular market, you'll find more or less. It is often more complex the more mass market you go; complexity doesn't necessarily mean worse, because that complexity can also bring in new customers that would otherwise be inaccessible. Also, with the changing ways of our industry, you see new types of channel conflict arise that rebalances how it all works. There have been many times when Ive sat down with a developer, they've scratched their heads and said Damn, I don't want this complexity! Why can't I just do what I've been doing? Why do I have to give a piece of the action to someone else? In those situations, they already realize something is wrong, they arent growing, their business isnt seeing new horizons - so they have a reason to sit down to begin with. Maybe they hit a high spot after about 2-3 years of solid sales, then plateau'd. This happens because they don't have either the infrastructure or the inside industry knowledge to know what they should be doing and how to work with the systems that are in place. And even with a new system in place, it has to be constantly nurtured. For example, Ive dealt with companies that acquire new channels, then view those same channels as competitors instead of enablers. This is the sort of thing maybe you and I need to discuss over a half dozen pints at Revolution Live :-) The name is Revolution. Unless you're altering it to be a different product, why should one product have multiple names? You can be assured that the installer is the same, and the program associated with it is under the same EULA. But that's where the similarity ends. The notion here is not to provide a completely different name, but a way to differentiate enough to reduce confusion about this thing I have in my hands or see on a website. You'll find Runtime Revolution in more places this way - it would confuse matters terribly if we did an actual rename and made a Mirye Cross-Platform 'Card Thingy and it just so happens to really, really resemble something else. Dilution is a non-issue; you rarely hear about it except in context where corporate lawyers have too much time on their hands and need to justify their existence. If you do a search on Runtime Revolution on Amazon after the product is there, you'll still find it. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Lynn If we already have a Rev Enterprise license, will we order our renewals through Amazon or continue to renew through Run Rev? If we can do either--and a the same cost, which is more beneficial to the folks at RunRev? (See my comment about motivation behind continuing to do annual renewals even while use of Rev was/is dormant). M ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Richard, FWIW, I agree with you 100% . TigerDirect Illustrator, indeed. Anything that confuses Revolution's product identity is not a good thing. Revolution's lineup is already confusing enough with Media, Studio, Enterprise options. I've always found the Runtime Revolution moniker itself to be a bit odd. To tack another name in front, which is unpronounceable and basically an insider's multilingual play on words and meaningless outside the marketing team, doesn't make sense to me. Unsolicted opinion, but oh well... Mark (who thought Mirye was a Gaelic word meaning stuck in a peat bog without a paddle.) On Apr 19, 2008, at 9:54 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Lynn Fredricks wrote: ...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. I'm glad to hear RR will have a presence at Amazon, but is Mirye going to be tacked onto the product name like that? In any marketing we do, yes. We have to differentiate something someone buys from us from what they get from Runtime if they order directly from Runtime. I can understand the desire to boost branding on a new site, but there are other ways to do that, like SEO and traditional marketing, without changing the name of the product. The last thing I bought from Amazon was this pad for backpacking: http://www.amazon.com/Big-Agnes-Insulated-Sleeping-20x72/dp/B0013MY5S2 Note that even though it's sold and shipped from SunDog Outfitters and not Big Agnes directly, the product name is still Big Agnes Air Core, not SunDog Outfitter Air Core. Big Agnes has worked hard to build their reputation, and SunDog is a newer and relatively unknown entity. It certainly wouldn't boost sales of this excellent product if customers had to wonder who actually made it. Same goes for buying Adobe Illustrator from TigerDirect. They don't rename it TigerDirect Illustrator. That would be confusing to the prospective customer. The name is Revolution. Unless you're altering it to be a different product, why should one product have multiple names? While changing the product name may boost Mirye I fear it would dilute the Runtime Revolution brand they've worked hard for a decade to build, ultimately benefiting neither while raising unnecessary questions in an already-challenging market. If indeed you are changing the product to warrant the name change, I'd be interested to hear what you're doing with it. Mirai is very meaningful in Japanese ...but not in English. It sounds like an excellent name for the Japanese market, but I have misgivings about using it domestically. 20 years ago Japanese-sounding names had a certain cache, but tides have long since changed. Today English names resonate more strongly with US consumers. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution Thanks, Mark ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. The name is Revolution. Unless you're altering it to be a different product, why should one product have multiple names? Right, so even if Mirye is being added on, it would be Mirye Revolution, not Mirye Runtime Revolution (since Runtime Revolution is the company). BTW, that confusion is all over the Mirye website as well, with some references to Revolution (as in Mirye Revolution 2.9 Released With Over 500 Improvements), but mostly as Runtime Revolution (as in Mirye Software Releases Runtime Revolution 2.9), or event mixed (as in Mirye Software, publishers of the cross-platform application development system Runtime Revolution, announces the release of Revolution 2.9 Studio and Enterprise...) I don't mean to be nit-picky, but the topic of confusing company for product for language which has been brought up on this list before is only exacerbated when things like this occur. I can't tell you how many times I've had to clarify/correct people asking me about Revolution. Of course, if the *intent* by RunRev and Mirye is to make these things all merge and become indistinguishable, then all that needs to happen is that it officially be made known and then I (for one) will shut up about this. ;-) Just my 2 cents, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
If we already have a Rev Enterprise license, will we order our renewals through Amazon or continue to renew through Run Rev? You can renew through RR or through Mirye Online Store. It isnt always a good thing to put upgrades into the channel. An upgrade package often has a very short life span, then it just takes up space. That being said, special promotions can be put into place. Where it really makes the most difference is in the sales of new seats or units. If we can do either--and a the same cost, which is more beneficial to the folks at RunRev? (See my comment about motivation behind continuing to do annual renewals even while use of Rev was/is dormant). Id like to bring up an analogy - feeding kids fresh vegetables vs feeding them a Big Mac. This is to explain a rather complex issue with channel development. Just like the calories consumed, either one is going to power the kid. RR gets $$ in the publisher-developer relationship, and they also get $$ if you buy from their online store. I can only trade on my good looks and personality so far :-) The Big Mac gives instant calories, which are always welcome to kids, especially active ones that need to kick the soccer ball right now. Building up a channel is like feeding fresh vegetables - its building sustainability. If sales are being passed through the channel, those channel partners take a share. Those partners, in turn, know this is a winning product if they sell enough of them. They then reorder more product, promote the product more, validate it more. Instead of ordering 1 or 2 units, they order 10-20 units. When a reseller interacts with their distributor's order system, they see there are units in stock of something, they ask questions about it, etc, see if there are any special promotion programs and the like. Parallel to this, you make other marketing efforts that stoke up validation of the product in the market. Increased validation plus increased accessibility in the channel means you can take your business to the next level. More conservative buyers buy. And you can sell more, new products to these new conservative buyers. If there is no channel growth, you can freshen things up - and you can also improve conversions from those that already know about you and your product. But there are limits to just how far that will take you. The ideal situation is you have a plate that represents all food groups, with some sugar now + the fresh veggies. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Richmond- Points well taken. In RR's defense, I do have to say (and you are no doubt well aware) that this is the first large-scale beta program they have undertaken, and as such there will necessarily be some rough edges. One of those, of course, is that beta-tester expectations should be clear from the start to avoid end-game ambiguities. I'm sure the next beta program will have this resolved beforehand. It's very rare in the software industry to see a beta program run this long (that isn't a slight to the RR team, but rather kudos for giving it the time it deserved), this widespread, or this public a process. (and props again to Bill for overseeing the effort. -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
On Apr 19, 2008, at 2:31 PM, Lynn Fredricks wrote: Id like to bring up an analogy - feeding kids fresh vegetables vs feeding them a Big Mac. I see you have a web site all about this: http://starchefs.com/kids/index.shtml ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
BTW, that confusion is all over the Mirye website as well, with some references to Revolution (as in Mirye Revolution 2.9 Released With Over 500 Improvements), but mostly as Runtime Revolution (as in Mirye Software Releases Runtime Revolution 2.9), or event mixed (as in Mirye Software, publishers of the cross-platform application development system Runtime Revolution, announces the release of Revolution 2.9 Studio and Enterprise...) I don't mean to be nit-picky, but the topic of confusing company for product for language which has been brought up on this list before is only exacerbated when things like this occur. I can't tell you how many times I've had to clarify/correct people asking me about Revolution. Some by error, some by design :-) Some headlines of press releases get compressed because of the destination, and some combinations are there to improve types of searches and keywords. There haven't been any confused questions by customers through the new channels we've developed since last October that havent been handled easily and quickly enough (same or close time zone, after all), or those that were set up prior to that. There are three types of installs: Media/Studio/Enterprise, and you can get it through even more venues, with or without some extras and differences in packages. When refering anyone to buy, it should only make a difference how they need that base product you are intimately familiar with - unless there's a special bit we are including at the time. Chances are, if they need it tommorrow in the USA, getting it fedex'd from Oregon will make a difference. Or if they need to order using a school account through one of several school approved venues, they can get it that way. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Id like to bring up an analogy - feeding kids fresh vegetables vs feeding them a Big Mac. I see you have a web site all about this: http://starchefs.com/kids/index.shtml That's funny :-) There's no e in the middle of Fredricks, though many have tried to insert one. A dodgy ancestor chopped off the son off of Fredrickson. The worst for me has always been Lynn - as a man, I have received many a merchandise or freebie in the mail from companies that cater to women. Plus, when I lived in Japan (six years), noone could pronounce my name correctly. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Still, the combined branding title of Mirye Runtime Revolution pales next to: Kirkland Signature Martha Stewart Favorite Holiday Hams -Scott Morrow Elementary Software (Now with 20% less chalk dust !) web http://elementarysoftware.com/ email [EMAIL PROTECTED] - On Apr 19, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Ken Ray wrote: ...we are preparing Mirye Runtime Revolution for shipment to Amazon. The name is Revolution. Unless you're altering it to be a different product, why should one product have multiple names? Right, so even if Mirye is being added on, it would be Mirye Revolution, not Mirye Runtime Revolution (since Runtime Revolution is the company). BTW, that confusion is all over the Mirye website as well, with some references to Revolution (as in Mirye Revolution 2.9 Released With Over 500 Improvements), but mostly as Runtime Revolution (as in Mirye Software Releases Runtime Revolution 2.9), or event mixed (as in Mirye Software, publishers of the cross-platform application development system Runtime Revolution, announces the release of Revolution 2.9 Studio and Enterprise...) I don't mean to be nit-picky, but the topic of confusing company for product for language which has been brought up on this list before is only exacerbated when things like this occur. I can't tell you how many times I've had to clarify/correct people asking me about Revolution. Of course, if the *intent* by RunRev and Mirye is to make these things all merge and become indistinguishable, then all that needs to happen is that it officially be made known and then I (for one) will shut up about this. ;-) Just my 2 cents, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
I think I understand Lynn's response in this. To his mind everything is great. His new service/company/whatever gets cool publicity, can piggyback on an existing brand, and it's even legal. To him there's no dilution of anything, just additions to his stick. Personally, normally I do hear of publisher vs creator issues only from the gaming and music industry. Based on that I'm quite worried about this. When I see Paramounts best artist special edition, or Vivendi puzzle game collection I seldom get the impression that these best artists and puzzle coders where very successful in their respective businesses. Because of that, I'm not really interested in Lynn's take on re- branding Rev to Myrrh Rev (only in selected markets, as long as supplies last). What I really am interested in, is: Why does RunRev agree to be the mount in this deal? Normally publishers who omit names or change the product of a programmer do pay him/her to create work for them, did Lynn pay RunRev anything? Why is it always only Lynn who reacts to any PR related issue? Who is responsible for public relation and advertising strategy at RunRev? Who is responsible for any communication strategy at RunRev? Obviously most of these question will never be answered, because that's not how RunRev does it's business. Too bad. have fun Bjoernke -- official ChatRev page: http://chatrev.bjoernke.com Chat with other RunRev developers: go stack URL http://homepage.mac.com/bvg/chatrev1.3.rev; ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Still, the combined branding title of Mirye Runtime Revolution pales next to: Kirkland Signature Martha Stewart Favorite Holiday Hams Costco Revolution - it has a sort of visual appeal, like the big tray of muffins - we could attach an OS' name to each muffin for a promotional package :-) Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Dear Bill, You are about 90% correct. And I really did not mean my posting to be inflammatory. However I would quote Mark Wieder's message to you (a sort of backhanded defence of Runtime Revolution that actually supports some of what I said and generally levels things out): In RR's defense, I do have to say (and you are no doubt well aware) that this is the first large-scale beta program they have undertaken, and as such there will necessarily be some rough edges. One of those, of course, is that beta-tester expectations should be clear from the start to avoid end-game ambiguities. I'm sure the next beta program will have this resolved beforehand. It's very rare in the software industry to see a beta program run this long (that isn't a slight to the RR team, but rather kudos for giving it the time it deserved), this widespread, or this public a process. (and props again to Bill for overseeing the effort. I will reiterate that I have only admiration for 2.9, and admiration that you were able to sustain such a long Beta-testing period without people demanding an earlier upgrade - and a real systems development cycle should be fairly long; especially when deliverables constitute lots of bugs that in their ironing out may, in turn, throw up other problems or conflict with other parts of a complex system. My criticism is, and has been for about 6 years, that Runtime Revolution's handling of its relations with a loyal customer/user base is not as good as it could be. I was not the only one who did not understand when (and if) Beta testers who had valid licences as of Christmas 2007 would receive copies of 2.9. I have supported Runtime Revolution (admittedly in a way that has sometimes rubbed some people up the wrong way) ever since I downloaded Runtime Revolution 1.0 in 2001, by uploading stacks that were by-products of a CD for Music Education I developed, some stacks for self-help with Phonetics I developed for the University of St Andrews, a commercial package for 13 year olds to further their knowledge of Bulgarian Literature, and from EFL stacks for my language school in Plovdiv. I also did some work which was later incorporated into a program/UI that was developed at the University of Copenhagen. I also provided redesigned toolbars for RunRev 2 which, I believe, were used for teaching purposes in Germany and California. I will not stop supporting Runtime Revolution in the way that I do. But I will also not stop criticising Runtime Revolution when I feel things are wrong. I believe that a healthy use-list can cope with both of these. At present I would be far more concerned about Mirye's apparent attempt to steal Runtime Revolution's thunder by tacking its name onto the front of Runtime Revolution in a way that gives an impression that it is somehow responsible for RR's development. Earlier this year Mirye offered me the chance to transfer my RevWiki (which is, frankly, very low on my list of priorities, although I have sporadic bursts of, largely misplaced, enthusiasm) to their website with offers of money. Another party, whose opinion I greatly respect. warned me off, stating that Mirye's goal was empire building and I would eventually forfeit content control of the Wiki. I may be a bl**dy-minded undividual, but I have what I believe are perfectly valid reasons for being so. I respect, Bill, what you have managed to effect at Runtime Revolution (one could make slightly weak jokes about Palace Coups, teaching Revolutionaries to be revolutionary, and so on); however that does not stop me from believing that on the whole there is an unspoken antagonism between RR and its loyal user-base; and I do not mean only on the materialistic level of handing out free versions of the RAD. I have taken Sarah Reichalt's comments into consideration here too. sincerely, Richmond Mathewson. --- Bill Marriott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: scrubbed Bill Marriott's message as sent to Richmond Mathewson off-list. Let us just say that the nub of the message was that my initial posting under this heading was inflammatory. A Thorn in the flesh is better than a failed Systems Development Life Cycle. __ Sent from Yahoo! Mail. A Smarter Email http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
Obviously most of these question will never be answered, because that's not how RunRev does it's business. Too bad. I don't think anyone publishes their strategic plans to an open list for review. You might get an overview of it if you are a shareholder in the company. If you are interested in that, you should give Runtime a call. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
I am having trouble seeing the problem with Mirye marketing Revolution. It is obvious this is done in total agreement with the management at Rev. How they go about marketing the product is important for everyone. The management at Rev feel this is good or they would not allow it. In the long run if Rev gets purchased by more people no matter what store it is bought from we all benefit. If they don't properly market Revolution we will all suffer it could fall by the wayside like HyperCard. I would also like to point out Valentina is a perfect match for Rev. So once again having Mirye involved will only benefit users of Rev. -=JB=- On Apr 19, 2008, at 3:14 PM, Lynn Fredricks wrote: Obviously most of these question will never be answered, because that's not how RunRev does it's business. Too bad. I don't think anyone publishes their strategic plans to an open list for review. You might get an overview of it if you are a shareholder in the company. If you are interested in that, you should give Runtime a call. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Mirye Software Publishing http://www.mirye.com Mirye Community NING http://miryesoftware.ning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 7:52 AM, -= JB =- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If they don't properly market Revolution we will all suffer it could fall by the wayside like HyperCard. Ummm, I don't think marketing of any sort, be it good, bad or indifferent, had anything to do with the demise of HyperCard. IMHO I believe that was very heavily driven by one individuals take on 'Apples Universe' at the time. Maybe a better comparison would have been the Newton? Not really sure though, I never owned one but I've read that many thought it was ahead of it's time, better than many PDAs that followed. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Getting things the wrong way round . . .
The point was not marketing was the failure of HyperCard but that without proper marketing it will fall like HypeCard. Apple did not even need to market HyperCard since they could have given it away forever and continued to invest in its research and development. It would have cost them pennies in the long run and had they made it crossplatform it would have brought in enough new users to pay for itself. -=JB=- On Apr 19, 2008, at 7:03 PM, Kay C Lan wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 7:52 AM, -= JB =- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If they don't properly market Revolution we will all suffer it could fall by the wayside like HyperCard. Ummm, I don't think marketing of any sort, be it good, bad or indifferent, had anything to do with the demise of HyperCard. IMHO I believe that was very heavily driven by one individuals take on 'Apples Universe' at the time. Maybe a better comparison would have been the Newton? Not really sure though, I never owned one but I've read that many thought it was ahead of it's time, better than many PDAs that followed. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
