sockets post to url
Hi I have an app that accepts connections on a socket to sync to an iOS version. post to url works before and after: accept connections on port lPort with message newConnection -- lPort is 8009 as default but user settable until the connections start coming in from the server. To avoid socket timeouts while the user does some licensing stuff the phone repeatedly asks if it's ok to sync and the app either responds with an accept, reject or pending message. While these connections are coming in post to url does not return although it doesn't block the UI either so you can click the button that sends the post again and then it returns immediately with error Previous request not completed as result. The docs say url commands block each other but no mention of other socket connections blocking them too. When the connections stop coming in from the phone (no open sockets but still listening) then post works again but not if you have tried to post to a url while the connections are coming in in which case you still get the error in the result. resetAll (libURLresetAll) does nothing for me. Is this a known bug? Is there a workaround? Cheers Monte___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets post to url
ah... scratch that, nothing to see here On 02/09/2010, at 5:14 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: Hi I have an app that accepts connections on a socket to sync to an iOS version. post to url works before and after: accept connections on port lPort with message newConnection -- lPort is 8009 as default but user settable until the connections start coming in from the server. To avoid socket timeouts while the user does some licensing stuff the phone repeatedly asks if it's ok to sync and the app either responds with an accept, reject or pending message. While these connections are coming in post to url does not return although it doesn't block the UI either so you can click the button that sends the post again and then it returns immediately with error Previous request not completed as result. The docs say url commands block each other but no mention of other socket connections blocking them too. When the connections stop coming in from the phone (no open sockets but still listening) then post works again but not if you have tried to post to a url while the connections are coming in in which case you still get the error in the result. resetAll (libURLresetAll) does nothing for me. Is this a known bug? Is there a workaround? Cheers Monte___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets post to url
Monte, can you detail how you solved this for future mail list search abilities! :D On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 4:27 AM, Monte Goulding mo...@sweattechnologies.comwrote: ah... scratch that, nothing to see here On 02/09/2010, at 5:14 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: Hi I have an app that accepts connections on a socket to sync to an iOS version. post to url works before and after: accept connections on port lPort with message newConnection -- lPort is 8009 as default but user settable until the connections start coming in from the server. To avoid socket timeouts while the user does some licensing stuff the phone repeatedly asks if it's ok to sync and the app either responds with an accept, reject or pending message. While these connections are coming in post to url does not return although it doesn't block the UI either so you can click the button that sends the post again and then it returns immediately with error Previous request not completed as result. The docs say url commands block each other but no mention of other socket connections blocking them too. When the connections stop coming in from the phone (no open sockets but still listening) then post works again but not if you have tried to post to a url while the connections are coming in in which case you still get the error in the result. resetAll (libURLresetAll) does nothing for me. Is this a known bug? Is there a workaround? Cheers Monte___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets post to url
LOL, just a bug in my code mate. Was closing line 1 of the opensockets which was fine when the licensing stuff was happening in a separate process but not when I put it back in the main app ;-) On 03/09/2010, at 12:45 AM, Andre Garzia wrote: Monte, can you detail how you solved this for future mail list search abilities! :D On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 4:27 AM, Monte Goulding mo...@sweattechnologies.comwrote: ah... scratch that, nothing to see here On 02/09/2010, at 5:14 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: Hi I have an app that accepts connections on a socket to sync to an iOS version. post to url works before and after: accept connections on port lPort with message newConnection -- lPort is 8009 as default but user settable until the connections start coming in from the server. To avoid socket timeouts while the user does some licensing stuff the phone repeatedly asks if it's ok to sync and the app either responds with an accept, reject or pending message. While these connections are coming in post to url does not return although it doesn't block the UI either so you can click the button that sends the post again and then it returns immediately with error Previous request not completed as result. The docs say url commands block each other but no mention of other socket connections blocking them too. When the connections stop coming in from the phone (no open sockets but still listening) then post works again but not if you have tried to post to a url while the connections are coming in in which case you still get the error in the result. resetAll (libURLresetAll) does nothing for me. Is this a known bug? Is there a workaround? Cheers Monte___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets post to url
Once I built a web server in Rev... for a while, I tried testing it by building a client also in Rev. Now, when everything is running at the same time inside Rev IDE, things can get messy... On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 7:03 PM, Monte Goulding mo...@sweattechnologies.comwrote: LOL, just a bug in my code mate. Was closing line 1 of the opensockets which was fine when the licensing stuff was happening in a separate process but not when I put it back in the main app ;-) On 03/09/2010, at 12:45 AM, Andre Garzia wrote: Monte, can you detail how you solved this for future mail list search abilities! :D On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 4:27 AM, Monte Goulding mo...@sweattechnologies.comwrote: ah... scratch that, nothing to see here On 02/09/2010, at 5:14 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: Hi I have an app that accepts connections on a socket to sync to an iOS version. post to url works before and after: accept connections on port lPort with message newConnection -- lPort is 8009 as default but user settable until the connections start coming in from the server. To avoid socket timeouts while the user does some licensing stuff the phone repeatedly asks if it's ok to sync and the app either responds with an accept, reject or pending message. While these connections are coming in post to url does not return although it doesn't block the UI either so you can click the button that sends the post again and then it returns immediately with error Previous request not completed as result. The docs say url commands block each other but no mention of other socket connections blocking them too. When the connections stop coming in from the phone (no open sockets but still listening) then post works again but not if you have tried to post to a url while the connections are coming in in which case you still get the error in the result. resetAll (libURLresetAll) does nothing for me. Is this a known bug? Is there a workaround? Cheers Monte___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Ewan, Revolution does it for you! :D On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Ewan Richardson e...@supremis.co.ukwrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Ewan, TCP creates the headers for you. If you mean HTML headers, yes you have to create those yourself when using sockets, but not when using the put/get URL commands. If you want to connect to a server that requires special headers, then you have to do this yourself and you will need to get a copy of the protocol documentation for that server. Why do you ask? Are you having a problem with datagram sockets? -- Best regards, Mark Schonewille Economy-x-Talk Consulting and Software Engineering Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer KvK: 50277553 Download the Installer Maker plugin for Runtime Revolution at http://qurl.tk/ce On 25 jul 2010, at 16:17, Ewan Richardson wrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
I think the inquire was related to UDP which is unreliable by default, so while the checksums and headers guarantee the integrity of a single datagram, the nature of UDP itself is unreliable by design, still, I like unreliable things, it adds to the adventurous fellings, you should see my own personal tools... On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:05 PM, Mark Schonewille m.schonewi...@economy-x-talk.com wrote: Ewan, TCP creates the headers for you. If you mean HTML headers, yes you have to create those yourself when using sockets, but not when using the put/get URL commands. If you want to connect to a server that requires special headers, then you have to do this yourself and you will need to get a copy of the protocol documentation for that server. Why do you ask? Are you having a problem with datagram sockets? -- Best regards, Mark Schonewille Economy-x-Talk Consulting and Software Engineering Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer KvK: 50277553 Download the Installer Maker plugin for Runtime Revolution at http://qurl.tk/ce On 25 jul 2010, at 16:17, Ewan Richardson wrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Im in the process of writing some tools for ASTERIX radar data (air traffic control stuff). The most basic form of this can be UDP over a network. So I can safely assume that there will be a header of around 28 bytes on the beginning of the message generated by rev. That's fairly good news for me, as I have enough to do without checksums! Have also run the output through wireshark, which answered my own question! Already had limited success today with the protocol, so ill keep working though it. Thanks for your time. Ewan -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Andre Garzia Sent: 25 July 2010 16:12 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV I think the inquire was related to UDP which is unreliable by default, so while the checksums and headers guarantee the integrity of a single datagram, the nature of UDP itself is unreliable by design, still, I like unreliable things, it adds to the adventurous fellings, you should see my own personal tools... On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:05 PM, Mark Schonewille m.schonewi...@economy-x-talk.com wrote: Ewan, TCP creates the headers for you. If you mean HTML headers, yes you have to create those yourself when using sockets, but not when using the put/get URL commands. If you want to connect to a server that requires special headers, then you have to do this yourself and you will need to get a copy of the protocol documentation for that server. Why do you ask? Are you having a problem with datagram sockets? -- Best regards, Mark Schonewille Economy-x-Talk Consulting and Software Engineering Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer KvK: 50277553 Download the Installer Maker plugin for Runtime Revolution at http://qurl.tk/ce On 25 jul 2010, at 16:17, Ewan Richardson wrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Ewan, If you could keep us posted or consider writing a post document about your experience interfacing with ATC stuff. It is always good to hear about those developments. If you need any network help, send us a note. Cheers andre On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 3:40 PM, Ewan Richardson e...@supremis.co.ukwrote: Im in the process of writing some tools for ASTERIX radar data (air traffic control stuff). The most basic form of this can be UDP over a network. So I can safely assume that there will be a header of around 28 bytes on the beginning of the message generated by rev. That's fairly good news for me, as I have enough to do without checksums! Have also run the output through wireshark, which answered my own question! Already had limited success today with the protocol, so ill keep working though it. Thanks for your time. Ewan -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Andre Garzia Sent: 25 July 2010 16:12 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV I think the inquire was related to UDP which is unreliable by default, so while the checksums and headers guarantee the integrity of a single datagram, the nature of UDP itself is unreliable by design, still, I like unreliable things, it adds to the adventurous fellings, you should see my own personal tools... On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:05 PM, Mark Schonewille m.schonewi...@economy-x-talk.com wrote: Ewan, TCP creates the headers for you. If you mean HTML headers, yes you have to create those yourself when using sockets, but not when using the put/get URL commands. If you want to connect to a server that requires special headers, then you have to do this yourself and you will need to get a copy of the protocol documentation for that server. Why do you ask? Are you having a problem with datagram sockets? -- Best regards, Mark Schonewille Economy-x-Talk Consulting and Software Engineering Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer KvK: 50277553 Download the Installer Maker plugin for Runtime Revolution at http://qurl.tk/ce On 25 jul 2010, at 16:17, Ewan Richardson wrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Ewan- Sunday, July 25, 2010, 11:40:16 AM, you wrote: Have also run the output through wireshark, which answered my own question! Cool. Nothing like WireShark for figuring out what's really going on. -- -Mark Wieder mwie...@ahsoftware.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: IP/UDP Sockets in REV
Hi Andre Not a problem, I can do that. Im basically using rev to translate data from our simulator to a wider group of asterix native clients. At the moment im implementing CAT62, which is basically used for Sending SDPS track messages. The Asterix protocol is all publicly published by eurocontrol. The actual asterix protocol is quite diverse, allowing for multiple systems to track targets and supply the data to radar screens. (im oversimplifying here but it is the gereral principle. Another tool im using, which may or may not be of interest is albatross. This is an open source air traffic radar screen, for linux. Although there are a few bugs in there, is a good tool for testing against asterix and seeing targets painting on screen. Some of the code could be release for flight sim heads, taking data from a flight simulator and drawing it on a real atc display. So far the project is developing pretty quickly (compared to other languages), and looks like it might be quite a rapid development. The biggest head-ache so far has been translating latitude and longitude to binary using two's compliment in a 32bit block. I think that using binaryEncode(f*,thedata) is giving the correct results, although I have yet to test this part. The whole thing is a bit of a learning curve on the binary front with revolution!. -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Andre Garzia Sent: 25 July 2010 20:12 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV Ewan, If you could keep us posted or consider writing a post document about your experience interfacing with ATC stuff. It is always good to hear about those developments. If you need any network help, send us a note. Cheers andre On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 3:40 PM, Ewan Richardson e...@supremis.co.ukwrote: Im in the process of writing some tools for ASTERIX radar data (air traffic control stuff). The most basic form of this can be UDP over a network. So I can safely assume that there will be a header of around 28 bytes on the beginning of the message generated by rev. That's fairly good news for me, as I have enough to do without checksums! Have also run the output through wireshark, which answered my own question! Already had limited success today with the protocol, so ill keep working though it. Thanks for your time. Ewan -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Andre Garzia Sent: 25 July 2010 16:12 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: IP/UDP Sockets in REV I think the inquire was related to UDP which is unreliable by default, so while the checksums and headers guarantee the integrity of a single datagram, the nature of UDP itself is unreliable by design, still, I like unreliable things, it adds to the adventurous fellings, you should see my own personal tools... On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:05 PM, Mark Schonewille m.schonewi...@economy-x-talk.com wrote: Ewan, TCP creates the headers for you. If you mean HTML headers, yes you have to create those yourself when using sockets, but not when using the put/get URL commands. If you want to connect to a server that requires special headers, then you have to do this yourself and you will need to get a copy of the protocol documentation for that server. Why do you ask? Are you having a problem with datagram sockets? -- Best regards, Mark Schonewille Economy-x-Talk Consulting and Software Engineering Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer KvK: 50277553 Download the Installer Maker plugin for Runtime Revolution at http://qurl.tk/ce On 25 jul 2010, at 16:17, Ewan Richardson wrote: Hi there, wondering if someone could help clarify something for me. When creating socket connections using the socket datagram connection, do you have to create the IP header and UDP header (and related checksums) within revolution, or does revolution take care of this for you? Thanks for your time. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences
Re: Sockets
Shouldn't you put it AFTER fld f1 if you are tracing it? Bob On May 5, 2010, at 3:19 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, I checked it out, I did realize that there are 2 ports being used 1 form client to server and 1 from server to client. Though I don't know how to make use of it in my case. Also I think there is a typo in tnhe example script (sSocket instead of pSocket) or something doesn't work properly. I did get some info from it. NOW, This what I wrote; on mouseUp put 192.168.1.199:4559 into pSocket open socket to pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f1 -to trace results write USER admin linefeed PASS xx to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f2 of this stack write /usr/local/sbin/hfaxd help linefeed to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f3 of this stack looks like it reenters the same command twice close socket pSocket Now if I repeat the second write twice then this is what I get... 500 /USR/LOCAL/SBIN/HFAXD: Command not recognized. end mouseUp Any help would be highly appreciated. Thanks, Hershel On 4/29/10 3:24 PM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Thanks, I'll check it out. Hershel On 4/28/10 9:04 AM, Trevor DeVore li...@mangomultimedia.com wrote: On Apr 27, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Perhaps this lesson will help: http://lessons.runrev.com/spaces/lessons/buckets/784/lessons/12924-How-to-com m unicate-with-other-applications-using-sockets ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On 5/6/10 12:28 PM, Bob Sneidar b...@twft.com wrote: Shouldn't you put it AFTER fld f1 if you are tracing it? That's the reason every read I put into another fld., and also to see what read returns what. As I saw that the second write repeated the same as the first. Bob On May 5, 2010, at 3:19 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, I checked it out, I did realize that there are 2 ports being used 1 form client to server and 1 from server to client. Though I don't know how to make use of it in my case. Also I think there is a typo in tnhe example script (sSocket instead of pSocket) or something doesn't work properly. I did get some info from it. NOW, This what I wrote; on mouseUp put 192.168.1.199:4559 into pSocket open socket to pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f1 -to trace results write USER admin linefeed PASS xx to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f2 of this stack write /usr/local/sbin/hfaxd help linefeed to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f3 of this stack looks like it reenters the same command twice close socket pSocket Now if I repeat the second write twice then this is what I get... 500 /USR/LOCAL/SBIN/HFAXD: Command not recognized. end mouseUp Any help would be highly appreciated. Thanks, Hershel On 4/29/10 3:24 PM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Thanks, I'll check it out. Hershel On 4/28/10 9:04 AM, Trevor DeVore li...@mangomultimedia.com wrote: On Apr 27, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Perhaps this lesson will help: http://lessons.runrev.com/spaces/lessons/buckets/784/lessons/12924-How-to-com m unicate-with-other-applications-using-sockets ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
Hi, I checked it out, I did realize that there are 2 ports being used 1 form client to server and 1 from server to client. Though I don't know how to make use of it in my case. Also I think there is a typo in tnhe example script (sSocket instead of pSocket) or something doesn't work properly. I did get some info from it. NOW, This what I wrote; on mouseUp put 192.168.1.199:4559 into pSocket open socket to pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f1 -to trace results write USER admin linefeed PASS xx to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f2 of this stack write /usr/local/sbin/hfaxd help linefeed to socket pSocket read from socket pSocket until return put it into fld f3 of this stack looks like it reenters the same command twice close socket pSocket Now if I repeat the second write twice then this is what I get... 500 /USR/LOCAL/SBIN/HFAXD: Command not recognized. end mouseUp Any help would be highly appreciated. Thanks, Hershel On 4/29/10 3:24 PM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Thanks, I'll check it out. Hershel On 4/28/10 9:04 AM, Trevor DeVore li...@mangomultimedia.com wrote: On Apr 27, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Perhaps this lesson will help: http://lessons.runrev.com/spaces/lessons/buckets/784/lessons/12924-How-to-com m unicate-with-other-applications-using-sockets ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
Thanks, I'll check it out. Hershel On 4/28/10 9:04 AM, Trevor DeVore li...@mangomultimedia.com wrote: On Apr 27, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Perhaps this lesson will help: http://lessons.runrev.com/spaces/lessons/buckets/784/lessons/12924-How-to-comm unicate-with-other-applications-using-sockets ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On Apr 27, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Hershel Fisch wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Perhaps this lesson will help: http://lessons.runrev.com/spaces/lessons/buckets/784/lessons/12924-How-to-communicate-with-other-applications-using-sockets -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems ScreenSteps: http://www.screensteps.com Releasable Revolution Resources for Developers: http://revolution.bluemangolearning.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
To communicate with Hylafax (fax) server On 4/27/10 7:19 PM, Shani shani.run...@gmail.com wrote: HI, http://docs.runrev.com/Command/open-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/write-to-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/read-from-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/close-socket for what purpose you need socket session? Regards, SHANI -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Sarah Reichelt Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:59 AM To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: Sockets On Wed, Apr 28, 2010 at 6:23 AM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Check out either of my email libraries: http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/POP_library_demo.rev http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/SMTP_library_demo.rev They both use sockets to communicate to the relevant servers. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Sockets
Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Thanks, Hershel ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On Wed, Apr 28, 2010 at 6:23 AM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Check out either of my email libraries: http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/POP_library_demo.rev http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/SMTP_library_demo.rev They both use sockets to communicate to the relevant servers. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Sockets
HI, http://docs.runrev.com/Command/open-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/write-to-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/read-from-socket http://docs.runrev.com/Command/close-socket for what purpose you need socket session? Regards, SHANI -Original Message- From: use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Sarah Reichelt Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:59 AM To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: Sockets On Wed, Apr 28, 2010 at 6:23 AM, Hershel Fisch hersh...@syp2u4c.com wrote: Hi, could any help me out with a full socket session ? Please! Check out either of my email libraries: http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/POP_library_demo.rev http://www.troz.net/rev/stacks/SMTP_library_demo.rev They both use sockets to communicate to the relevant servers. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi, I made some progress on this topic and I think I Rev+CGI can do the job. While waiting for revServer, I decided to try CGI with Rev to see if it fits my needs. Of course, I had to use the 3.5 standalone engine, as v4.0.0 does not include the standalone engine anymore. First of all, I searched for a multiplatform, tiny, easy-to-install-and-configure web server on the market. Of course there is Apache, but I found Abyss Web Server by aprelium (http://www.aprelium.com/abyssws/). There is a free version for personal use and for commercial use it's only $59. It supports Windows, Linux, Mac, FreeBSD. The web server setup is easy and done with the browser, I just had to add a new interpreter, set the executable to the Rev standalone, set the -ui argument and the irev extension for the RevLets and now I can access the RevLets with the irev extension direct from the browser. I didn't have to set any permission for the file. I needed database access to PostgreSQL, so I just had to point the directory where revdb.bundle and dbpostgresql.bundle (Mac files) are located in the set the externals of this stack clause. I built a Rev Stack for common functions and used the start using clause in the RevLet and now I can create the logic all in the Rev Stack, with source code protected! I was using vi to edit my files and I was not happy with it, of course... Then, last night Stephen Barncard (thank you!!!) released the Rev colour syntax for coda, now my work seems to be complete! All seems to be working fine, I can move on and try the connections on the PDAs, then rewrite my application logic on the PDA to communicate through HTTP and see what happens. When revServer comes up, I think I can move without deep changes, as the RevLets are Rev!!! Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype: marcioalexandroni Brazil -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Seems realy cool and as long as a dedicated server will be used, Abyss httpd will be realy usefull ! Best Regards, P. Le 1 mars 10 à 12:18, Marcio Alexandroni a écrit : Hi, I made some progress on this topic and I think I Rev+CGI can do the job. While waiting for revServer, I decided to try CGI with Rev to see if it fits my needs. Of course, I had to use the 3.5 standalone engine, as v4.0.0 does not include the standalone engine anymore. First of all, I searched for a multiplatform, tiny, easy-to-install-and-configure web server on the market. Of course there is Apache, but I found Abyss Web Server by aprelium (http://www.aprelium.com/abyssws/). There is a free version for personal use and for commercial use it's only $59. It supports Windows, Linux, Mac, FreeBSD. The web server setup is easy and done with the browser, I just had to add a new interpreter, set the executable to the Rev standalone, set the - ui argument and the irev extension for the RevLets and now I can access the RevLets with the irev extension direct from the browser. I didn't have to set any permission for the file. I needed database access to PostgreSQL, so I just had to point the directory where revdb.bundle and dbpostgresql.bundle (Mac files) are located in the set the externals of this stack clause. I built a Rev Stack for common functions and used the start using clause in the RevLet and now I can create the logic all in the Rev Stack, with source code protected! I was using vi to edit my files and I was not happy with it, of course... Then, last night Stephen Barncard (thank you!!!) released the Rev colour syntax for coda, now my work seems to be complete! All seems to be working fine, I can move on and try the connections on the PDAs, then rewrite my application logic on the PDA to communicate through HTTP and see what happens. When revServer comes up, I think I can move without deep changes, as the RevLets are Rev!!! Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype: marcioalexandroni Brazil -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: The applications runs pure TCP/IP with a custom protocol to exchange data and it handles dozens of simultaneous calls at the same time, this is why it must be multithreaded, the queuing will not work in this case because of the time it would need to respond to the last caller. Hello Marcio, your fellow Brazilian is one of the experts on rev-built http servers, so I'm sure he'll answer your question in detail soon. However, whilst he's sleeping, let me just point you to this mechanism: http://www2.sahores-conseil.com/insead/index_en.html . Pierre used that mechanism deployed (I believe) to the French Ministry of Education, and it was a system used by students across France. Since you need raw TCP/IP it doesn't sound like it will meet your needs. Whilst Rev is not multi-threaded, can I just ask if you are using the following format in your code: accept [datagram] connections on port number with message callbackMessage If so, then elsewhere in your code you may be able use the following structure at places where you can accept potential interruptions: wait 10 milliseconds with messages When an existing connection's processing gets temporarily suspended by the wait, it means that a new connection can be accepted and processing for that new connection can begin. These two together can provide a kind of message-passing concurrency. For example, that is similar to the way that 'concurrent' processing is done in Tcl (http://www.stanford.edu/~ouster/cgi-bin/papers/threads.pdf) , Regards, Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Bernard, Thanks very much for your suggestions. I've been reading about Rev and CGI, but I read on rev Forums that the necessary standalone engine necessary for the cgi-bin support is available only on Rev = 3.5, the new versions do not have the standalone engine anymore. Do you know if it's true? On the other side, I'll test your suggestion on waiting with messages where it could take longer to answer, I'll do it right now. Regards, Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype: marcioalexandroni Brazil -- From: Bernard Devlin bdrun...@gmail.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 09:43:17 + To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: The applications runs pure TCP/IP with a custom protocol to exchange data and it handles dozens of simultaneous calls at the same time, this is why it must be multithreaded, the queuing will not work in this case because of the time it would need to respond to the last caller. Hello Marcio, your fellow Brazilian is one of the experts on rev-built http servers, so I'm sure he'll answer your question in detail soon. However, whilst he's sleeping, let me just point you to this mechanism: http://www2.sahores-conseil.com/insead/index_en.html . Pierre used that mechanism deployed (I believe) to the French Ministry of Education, and it was a system used by students across France. Since you need raw TCP/IP it doesn't sound like it will meet your needs. Whilst Rev is not multi-threaded, can I just ask if you are using the following format in your code: accept [datagram] connections on port number with message callbackMessage If so, then elsewhere in your code you may be able use the following structure at places where you can accept potential interruptions: wait 10 milliseconds with messages When an existing connection's processing gets temporarily suspended by the wait, it means that a new connection can be accepted and processing for that new connection can begin. These two together can provide a kind of message-passing concurrency. For example, that is similar to the way that 'concurrent' processing is done in Tcl (http://www.stanford.edu/~ouster/cgi-bin/papers/threads.pdf) , Regards, Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Bernard, I visited the page about the mechanism you pointed, but in that case it has an Apache/PHP server that handles multiple concurrent connections but it ends up passing the request to a Rev application using Sockets that will cause the same queuing on message processing. In fact, the requests to the server are multithreaded but the processing is not, as I could understand. Did I understand it right? Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (11) 9989-8316 marcioalexandroni -- From: Bernard Devlin bdrun...@gmail.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 09:43:17 + To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: The applications runs pure TCP/IP with a custom protocol to exchange data and it handles dozens of simultaneous calls at the same time, this is why it must be multithreaded, the queuing will not work in this case because of the time it would need to respond to the last caller. Hello Marcio, your fellow Brazilian is one of the experts on rev-built http servers, so I'm sure he'll answer your question in detail soon. However, whilst he's sleeping, let me just point you to this mechanism: http://www2.sahores-conseil.com/insead/index_en.html . Pierre used that mechanism deployed (I believe) to the French Ministry of Education, and it was a system used by students across France. Since you need raw TCP/IP it doesn't sound like it will meet your needs. Whilst Rev is not multi-threaded, can I just ask if you are using the following format in your code: accept [datagram] connections on port number with message callbackMessage If so, then elsewhere in your code you may be able use the following structure at places where you can accept potential interruptions: wait 10 milliseconds with messages When an existing connection's processing gets temporarily suspended by the wait, it means that a new connection can be accepted and processing for that new connection can begin. These two together can provide a kind of message-passing concurrency. For example, that is similar to the way that 'concurrent' processing is done in Tcl (http://www.stanford.edu/~ouster/cgi-bin/papers/threads.pdf) , Regards, Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Marcio, Did you have an eye to the on-rev / irev technology. It's definitively the most usable way to go, from yet. Even if CGI and PHP/Rev Stacks went good underground ways to use, over the 15 past yahrs, the revServer witch will be made public and free available in the forecoming months by RunRev is a very stable et fast running engine from yet. About your multi-threading need, i can't help, for yet, as long as we can't see how the revServer is / is'nt able for yet (it could be, at least with a adapted xinetd config under linux - i did so for metacard/ suse, yahrs ago) to handle multi-thread. Instead of devlopping your own framework first, why would you not try to test your project design in using the on-rev platform ? I use it for my own (two projects up and running, the thirst is on desk) with great satisfaction. Kind regards, P. Le 27 févr. 10 à 12:31, Marcio Alexandroni a écrit : Hi Bernard, I visited the page about the mechanism you pointed, but in that case it has an Apache/PHP server that handles multiple concurrent connections but it ends up passing the request to a Rev application using Sockets that will cause the same queuing on message processing. In fact, the requests to the server are multithreaded but the processing is not, as I could understand. Did I understand it right? Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (11) 9989-8316 marcioalexandroni -- From: Bernard Devlin bdrun...@gmail.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 09:43:17 + To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: The applications runs pure TCP/IP with a custom protocol to exchange data and it handles dozens of simultaneous calls at the same time, this is why it must be multithreaded, the queuing will not work in this case because of the time it would need to respond to the last caller. Hello Marcio, your fellow Brazilian is one of the experts on rev- built http servers, so I'm sure he'll answer your question in detail soon. However, whilst he's sleeping, let me just point you to this mechanism: http://www2.sahores-conseil.com/insead/index_en.html . Pierre used that mechanism deployed (I believe) to the French Ministry of Education, and it was a system used by students across France. Since you need raw TCP/IP it doesn't sound like it will meet your needs. Whilst Rev is not multi-threaded, can I just ask if you are using the following format in your code: accept [datagram] connections on port number with message callbackMessage If so, then elsewhere in your code you may be able use the following structure at places where you can accept potential interruptions: wait 10 milliseconds with messages When an existing connection's processing gets temporarily suspended by the wait, it means that a new connection can be accepted and processing for that new connection can begin. These two together can provide a kind of message-passing concurrency. For example, that is similar to the way that 'concurrent' processing is done in Tcl (http://www.stanford.edu/~ouster/cgi-bin/papers/threads.pdf ) , Regards, Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Marcio, Le 27 févr. 10 à 12:31, Marcio Alexandroni a écrit : I visited the page about the mechanism you pointed, but in that case it has an Apache/PHP server that handles multiple concurrent connections but it ends up passing the request to a Rev application using Sockets that will cause the same queuing on message processing. No under the linux platform if the rev app is launched in root mode without GUI front-end. In this case, each new Apache/PHP request to the rev process launches its own sub-thread witch appears as a separate httpd thread line in the Top controller window. In other words, it's not the rev process witch handle the multi-thtrading safty but the HTTPd / xinetd one, just in the same way it works for MySQL, as an other example. Best Regards, -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Pierre, Thanks for the clarification, I forgot the Linux core forks the process creating other instances of the application, great. What I'm looking for is a way to have an easy-to-install and portable server that I can deploy to Linux, Windows and Mac with the same protocol. Today I have a server written in Delphi, but that I can only deploy to Windows. Today I have a custom protocol built with TCP/IP that I can rewrite for the PDAs when I find the right technology for the server. I just moved to on-rev hosting, so I have access to the irev technology. Do you have any information on what platforms revServer will be available (Linux, Windows, Mac?) and how and if it will integrate with web servers (apache, others?). Your suggestion on irev is great, I'll start testing on my on-rev host and wait for the revServer. Regards, Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype marcioalexandroni Brasil -- From: Pierre Sahores psaho...@free.fr Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 13:21:13 +0100 To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server Marcio, Le 27 févr. 10 à 12:31, Marcio Alexandroni a écrit : I visited the page about the mechanism you pointed, but in that case it has an Apache/PHP server that handles multiple concurrent connections but it ends up passing the request to a Rev application using Sockets that will cause the same queuing on message processing. No under the linux platform if the rev app is launched in root mode without GUI front-end. In this case, each new Apache/PHP request to the rev process launches its own sub-thread witch appears as a separate httpd thread line in the Top controller window. In other words, it's not the rev process witch handle the multi-thtrading safty but the HTTPd / xinetd one, just in the same way it works for MySQL, as an other example. Best Regards, -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Rebonjour Marcio, Hi Pierre, Thanks for the clarification, I forgot the Linux core forks the process creating other instances of the application, great. Always so usefull, in practice ;-) What I'm looking for is a way to have an easy-to-install and portable server that I can deploy to Linux, Windows and Mac with the same protocol. Today I have a server written in Delphi, but that I can only deploy to Windows. RevServer will feet this need as you expect. Today I have a custom protocol built with TCP/IP that I can rewrite for the PDAs when I find the right technology for the server. If the PDA part relies on a web browser client and the server part on on-rev, the onest need is to use an authentication model able to suit the PDA while its IP changes, some times minute after minute. If you own such a PDA or iPhone, you can test the way i handle such authentication model in visiting and creating your iDesk acount at http://www.wrds.com . Be carefull about the fact that the site is'nt in itself yet optimised for mobile device displays, only the authentication one is, at this point. All the server code relies entierly on a .irev lib + js. No AJAX at this point because i wanted to learn all about irev before. I just moved to on-rev hosting, so I have access to the irev technology. Very good tech, full usable in production mode from yet and i hope to deliver my first ASP solution relying on on-rev in the forecoming weeks. Do you have any information on what platforms revServer will be available (Linux, Windows, Mac?) RunRev has decided to make the RevServer available under those three platforms. I would prefer to see each one available after an other (1. Linux, 2. OSX or Windows, 3. the last one of OSX or Windows) in the sense of such a one delivry after an other would probably help RunRev to delivry - a strong message to the Linux world n-tier devloppers community - a strong message to the .NET world n-tier devloppers community - a well incremented marketing message about the RunRev devlop once, deploy anyware policy and how and if it will integrate with web servers (apache, others?). Can tell, at this point. Your suggestion on irev is great, I'll start testing on my on-rev host and wait for the revServer. You're welcome :D Best Regards, P. Regards, Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype marcioalexandroni Brasil -- From: Pierre Sahores psaho...@free.fr Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 13:21:13 +0100 To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server Marcio, Le 27 févr. 10 à 12:31, Marcio Alexandroni a écrit : I visited the page about the mechanism you pointed, but in that case it has an Apache/PHP server that handles multiple concurrent connections but it ends up passing the request to a Rev application using Sockets that will cause the same queuing on message processing. No under the linux platform if the rev app is launched in root mode without GUI front-end. In this case, each new Apache/PHP request to the rev process launches its own sub-thread witch appears as a separate httpd thread line in the Top controller window. In other words, it's not the rev process witch handle the multi-thtrading safty but the HTTPd / xinetd one, just in the same way it works for MySQL, as an other example. Best Regards, -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- Pierre Sahores mobile : (33) 6 03 95 77 70 www.wrds.com www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: I've been reading about Rev and CGI, but I read on rev Forums that the necessary standalone engine necessary for the cgi-bin support is available only on Rev = 3.5, the new versions do not have the standalone engine anymore. Do you know if it's true? Yes this is true. It is a great pity and I do not find the reasons for this move entirely convincing. If you are a licensed user, it might be possible to get the 3.5 engine from Runrev (actually, I think you just need the RevStudio 3.5 for your platform,and I think the standalone engine is bundled comes in there). There is supposed to be a rev-server released. I had thought it was going to be an apache module to get beyond the problem of any delays with a fork from CGI. However, no information has been forthcoming, and it seems no one outside RunRev knows what was offered and what will actually be delivered, or when. I seem to remember that within on-rev it is not possible to open sockets. I think there was a talk at the Rev2009 conference by BvG who developed the Rev chat server. I am not so interested in on-rev, so I didn't pay that much attention, but I thought he said that sockets could not be opened with on-rev, and that was the reason why he switch to a HTTP based protocol. I'm sure someone else will comment on this soon if I'm mistaken. BTW you still did not mention if you are using sockets and with message. Unless there is some reason why that will not work, your concerns about threading may prove unnecessary. Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Bernard, Pierre has posted here RevServer may support all the features I need in full. In fact I have moved to the on-rev hosting, so I'll start testing the connection from the PDAs using Sockets from my applications, I think I can rewrite the protocol to use HTTP. I tried your suggestion on wait with messages but it causes problems in the message processing, I couldn't find the exact reason, but as the message handler deals with databases and deals with encrypted packages, I think something was not handled quite well when two clients connect at the same time. Again, thanks for your ideas on it. Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Skype: marcioalexandroni Brasil -- From: Bernard Devlin bdrun...@gmail.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 14:04:50 + To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: I've been reading about Rev and CGI, but I read on rev Forums that the necessary standalone engine necessary for the cgi-bin support is available only on Rev = 3.5, the new versions do not have the standalone engine anymore. Do you know if it's true? Yes this is true. It is a great pity and I do not find the reasons for this move entirely convincing. If you are a licensed user, it might be possible to get the 3.5 engine from Runrev (actually, I think you just need the RevStudio 3.5 for your platform,and I think the standalone engine is bundled comes in there). There is supposed to be a rev-server released. I had thought it was going to be an apache module to get beyond the problem of any delays with a fork from CGI. However, no information has been forthcoming, and it seems no one outside RunRev knows what was offered and what will actually be delivered, or when. I seem to remember that within on-rev it is not possible to open sockets. I think there was a talk at the Rev2009 conference by BvG who developed the Rev chat server. I am not so interested in on-rev, so I didn't pay that much attention, but I thought he said that sockets could not be opened with on-rev, and that was the reason why he switch to a HTTP based protocol. I'm sure someone else will comment on this soon if I'm mistaken. BTW you still did not mention if you are using sockets and with message. Unless there is some reason why that will not work, your concerns about threading may prove unnecessary. Bernard ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Yes, opening your own sockets is not possible with on-rev. If you're not using on-rev: Using accept ... with message is the first (and most important) step to get rev handle several connections concurrently. the second step is to always use read/write with message, because otherwise it'd be blocking. Note that there's nothing in Rev that will make with message not work, but there's several traps that you can step into, which will make it not work. Maybe the wait command can produce problems, but I almost never use wait, and haven't tested it much. If you have computational heavy tasks to do for every connection (several seconds for each), then you can't do it with a single rev installation. A way around that is to launch command line versions of rev (using the 3.5 cgi engine as command line app), and do calculations there. The command line app then connects to your server and gives back the result that way. This will introduce various other kinds if latencies, and is hugely complex to implement (basically adds another server to code and manage). If you're below that limit, send message in time is a very important tool to divide larger tasks up so that they do not block your server. If you have large files for each connection (large datasets to transfer, then you need chunking and bandwidth controlling. Chunking means to divide the one big file into several pieces, and send those after each other. This is needed because as long as a script is running, other scripts are blocked, so a single large file transfer will block your server for a too long time. Bandwidth control means to reduce the speed at which you do things, so as to not send too many data at once, which gives the server breathing room for accepting other tasks. Things that won't work: Giving a connection to another instance of rev: You said you'd like to distribute the workload that way. However, the _connection_ is always bound to whomever has accepted the socket communication, and there are security rules forbidding giving away a socket. Not using send in time in the read/write to socket commands: Every such command will wait and block the _whole_ app until it is done. With network latency, this will be a problem for a very busy server (example: chatrev, with it's usually 5-6 chatters and less then a message per second does use blocking read/writes on the server, and never had a problem with that, not even when there where 25 chatters (max amount ever on chatrev)). On-Rev: This runs within apache, and can only accept http traffic. no custom socket, no custom protocols (unless on top of http). CGI only work with some caveats: cgi's normally run within apache, and can only accept http traffic. However they can use custom sockets, and they can be used as command line app without apache, where they are more similar to a normal standalone sans gui. High traffic or high bandwidth servers: you will run into high end boundaries, with several connections per millisecond, and with big bandwidth demands. I have never reached these boundaries, and as long as you're not Word of Warcraft, or Google, you won't either. Bjoernke On 27 Feb 2010, at 15:11, Marcio Alexandroni wrote: Hi Bernard, Pierre has posted here RevServer may support all the features I need in full. In fact I have moved to the on-rev hosting, so I'll start testing the connection from the PDAs using Sockets from my applications, I think I can rewrite the protocol to use HTTP. I tried your suggestion on wait with messages but it causes problems in the message processing, I couldn't find the exact reason, but as the message handler deals with databases and deals with encrypted packages, I think something was not handled quite well when two clients connect at the same time. From: Bernard Devlin bdrun...@gmail.com On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: I've been reading about Rev and CGI, but I read on rev Forums that the necessary standalone engine necessary for the cgi-bin support is available only on Rev = 3.5, the new versions do not have the standalone engine anymore. Do you know if it's true? Yes this is true. It is a great pity and I do not find the reasons for this move entirely convincing. If you are a licensed user, it might be possible to get the 3.5 engine from Runrev (actually, I think you just need the RevStudio 3.5 for your platform,and I think the standalone engine is bundled comes in there). There is supposed to be a rev-server released. I had thought it was going to be an apache module to get beyond the problem of any delays with a fork from CGI. However, no information has been forthcoming, and it seems no one outside RunRev knows what was offered and what will actually be delivered, or when. I seem to remember that within on-rev it is not possible to open sockets. I think there was a talk at the Rev2009 conference by BvG who
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi Bjoernke, As I could understand, even using accept with message, read with message, the processing will not be concurrent but queued. If there are 3 connections, it will accept ConnA and queue, ConnB and queue, ConnC and queue, then will process the queue in line. If I have some reads in depth, it will be queueing the messages generated after the read. Did I understood it right? Thinkig about on-rev and to be able to deploy it, thinkig about RevServer, I could reimplement my communication protocol over HTTP, with full multithreading and concurrent support from the Apache and the RevServer message processing, then I could be handling the messaging system like I do today, all requests processed immediately. Thanks for your ideas. Regards, Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (11) 9989-8316 marcioalexandroni -- From: Björnke von Gierke b...@mac.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 17:04:05 +0100 To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server Hi Yes, opening your own sockets is not possible with on-rev. If you're not using on-rev: Using accept ... with message is the first (and most important) step to get rev handle several connections concurrently. the second step is to always use read/write with message, because otherwise it'd be blocking. Note that there's nothing in Rev that will make with message not work, but there's several traps that you can step into, which will make it not work. Maybe the wait command can produce problems, but I almost never use wait, and haven't tested it much. If you have computational heavy tasks to do for every connection (several seconds for each), then you can't do it with a single rev installation. A way around that is to launch command line versions of rev (using the 3.5 cgi engine as command line app), and do calculations there. The command line app then connects to your server and gives back the result that way. This will introduce various other kinds if latencies, and is hugely complex to implement (basically adds another server to code and manage). If you're below that limit, send message in time is a very important tool to divide larger tasks up so that they do not block your server. If you have large files for each connection (large datasets to transfer, then you need chunking and bandwidth controlling. Chunking means to divide the one big file into several pieces, and send those after each other. This is needed because as long as a script is running, other scripts are blocked, so a single large file transfer will block your server for a too long time. Bandwidth control means to reduce the speed at which you do things, so as to not send too many data at once, which gives the server breathing room for accepting other tasks. Things that won't work: Giving a connection to another instance of rev: You said you'd like to distribute the workload that way. However, the _connection_ is always bound to whomever has accepted the socket communication, and there are security rules forbidding giving away a socket. Not using send in time in the read/write to socket commands: Every such command will wait and block the _whole_ app until it is done. With network latency, this will be a problem for a very busy server (example: chatrev, with it's usually 5-6 chatters and less then a message per second does use blocking read/writes on the server, and never had a problem with that, not even when there where 25 chatters (max amount ever on chatrev)). On-Rev: This runs within apache, and can only accept http traffic. no custom socket, no custom protocols (unless on top of http). CGI only work with some caveats: cgi's normally run within apache, and can only accept http traffic. However they can use custom sockets, and they can be used as command line app without apache, where they are more similar to a normal standalone sans gui. High traffic or high bandwidth servers: you will run into high end boundaries, with several connections per millisecond, and with big bandwidth demands. I have never reached these boundaries, and as long as you're not Word of Warcraft, or Google, you won't either. Bjoernke On 27 Feb 2010, at 15:11, Marcio Alexandroni wrote: Hi Bernard, Pierre has posted here RevServer may support all the features I need in full. In fact I have moved to the on-rev hosting, so I'll start testing the connection from the PDAs using Sockets from my applications, I think I can rewrite the protocol to use HTTP. I tried your suggestion on wait with messages but it causes problems in the message processing, I couldn't find the exact reason, but as the message handler deals with databases and deals with encrypted packages, I think something was not handled quite well when two clients connect at the same time. From: Bernard Devlin bdrun
Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hi, I'm currently building a new version of a product that has 3 modules: * A sockets server that operates the application logic. * The administration module which communicates with the server using sockets to set properties. * The PDA module that is actually what users interact and that also communicates with the server using sockets. Today I have the server and administration modules written in Delphi and Palm/WinMo solutions on the PDAs. It would be very, very interesting if I could have a server that I could deploy on Windows, Linux or Mac machines, so I built a test version in Rev, but I found it does not handle multiple requests, but queues and process one at a time, which is not suitable for this solution. I've been thinking if there is any way to overcome this situation, perhaps launching a separate process for each connection, passing the client address to this new process, this way I could return immediately from the handler, letting it process the queue, while the process actually handles the request and feedback to the client. Does anyone have any idea if starting multiple Rev subprocesses is possible or perhaps any other idea on how to do this concurrent handling in Rev? Thanks in advance. Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Brazil Skype: marcioalexandroni -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Oi Marcio, I think you're now officially the second Brazilian using Revolution. Right now Rev is single threaded and that is all. What you could build is a pool of Rev processes coordinated by a master process. So you could have a Linux standalone launch multiple socket servers and then play the role of proxy relaying the connection to them. This would involve changing your protocol since we can't really delegate a connection to another process, you'd need to reply to the client with something like: hey connect again on port something and it would reconnect using one of the socket servers. I don't know your application logic, but if your socket server acts fast enough then some queueing is not that bad. In the meanwhile, if you're doing your logic on top of HTTP, why not use a simple portable server and Rev based CGI, this would solve the problem (and propose new ones as you'd need to handle the statelessness) Cheers andre PS: Você é de sampa né? On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 2:44 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: Hi, I'm currently building a new version of a product that has 3 modules: * A sockets server that operates the application logic. * The administration module which communicates with the server using sockets to set properties. * The PDA module that is actually what users interact and that also communicates with the server using sockets. Today I have the server and administration modules written in Delphi and Palm/WinMo solutions on the PDAs. It would be very, very interesting if I could have a server that I could deploy on Windows, Linux or Mac machines, so I built a test version in Rev, but I found it does not handle multiple requests, but queues and process one at a time, which is not suitable for this solution. I've been thinking if there is any way to overcome this situation, perhaps launching a separate process for each connection, passing the client address to this new process, this way I could return immediately from the handler, letting it process the queue, while the process actually handles the request and feedback to the client. Does anyone have any idea if starting multiple Rev subprocesses is possible or perhaps any other idea on how to do this concurrent handling in Rev? Thanks in advance. Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Brazil Skype: marcioalexandroni -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server
Hello Andre, Thank you for your ideas. It's good to know there are more Brazilians here... The applications runs pure TCP/IP with a custom protocol to exchange data and it handles dozens of simultaneous calls at the same time, this is why it must be multithreaded, the queuing will not work in this case because of the time it would need to respond to the last caller. Anyway, can you explain a little bit more about the CGI idea and the portable server? Thank you. PS: moro em Bragança Paulista/SP. Assisti a um video seu, acho que foi da conferência 08. Abraço. Marcio Alexandroni www.cialogica.com.br ( (11) 9989-8316 marcioalexandroni -- From: Andre Garzia an...@andregarzia.com Reply-To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 15:15:39 -0300 To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Ideas to simulate a multithreaded sockets server Oi Marcio, I think you're now officially the second Brazilian using Revolution. Right now Rev is single threaded and that is all. What you could build is a pool of Rev processes coordinated by a master process. So you could have a Linux standalone launch multiple socket servers and then play the role of proxy relaying the connection to them. This would involve changing your protocol since we can't really delegate a connection to another process, you'd need to reply to the client with something like: hey connect again on port something and it would reconnect using one of the socket servers. I don't know your application logic, but if your socket server acts fast enough then some queueing is not that bad. In the meanwhile, if you're doing your logic on top of HTTP, why not use a simple portable server and Rev based CGI, this would solve the problem (and propose new ones as you'd need to handle the statelessness) Cheers andre PS: Você é de sampa né? On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 2:44 PM, Marcio Alexandroni mar...@cialogica.com.br wrote: Hi, I'm currently building a new version of a product that has 3 modules: * A sockets server that operates the application logic. * The administration module which communicates with the server using sockets to set properties. * The PDA module that is actually what users interact and that also communicates with the server using sockets. Today I have the server and administration modules written in Delphi and Palm/WinMo solutions on the PDAs. It would be very, very interesting if I could have a server that I could deploy on Windows, Linux or Mac machines, so I built a test version in Rev, but I found it does not handle multiple requests, but queues and process one at a time, which is not suitable for this solution. I've been thinking if there is any way to overcome this situation, perhaps launching a separate process for each connection, passing the client address to this new process, this way I could return immediately from the handler, letting it process the queue, while the process actually handles the request and feedback to the client. Does anyone have any idea if starting multiple Rev subprocesses is possible or perhaps any other idea on how to do this concurrent handling in Rev? Thanks in advance. Marcio Alexandroni ( (+55 11) 9989-8316 Brazil Skype: marcioalexandroni -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
My initial thought on seeing Phil's posting was that it might be a server setting and thus not something one can control at the client. I thought this because a couple of weeks ago I stumbled upon a discussion where SSH (for some user) was creating a new connection for each command sent to the server. It was fixed by changing a server setting so that SSH re-used connections. At least that's how my memory of the discussion. Bernard On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 4:23 AM, Sarah Reichelt sarah.reich...@gmail.com wrote: While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. I had this problem with a particular server. I always get the new connection with every command, but not all servers mind this. My solution was to use libURLSetFTPStopTime and set it to a very small number. This supposedly allows re-use of an existing connection, but in my experience all it does it keep one open while still opening another. If you set it to a very low number, then connections will close more rapidly, so you should not reach the maximum number of connections allowed. HTH, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
Hi Sarah, Rather than gambling and waiting for a timeout to occur and, assuming there aren't any other sockets open for other purposes, couldn't Phil just issue a resetAll in his uploadEnded command? This forces the close of all sockets and a reset of everything in liburl. Otherwise, a close of the specific socket used for the upload could be used, which socket could be determined by checking the openSockets prior to and immediately after the libUrlFtpUploadFile command. I've never run into this limits problem personally but have used resetAll and close socket. Aloha from Hawaii, Jim Bufalini I had this problem with a particular server. I always get the new connection with every command, but not all servers mind this. My solution was to use libURLSetFTPStopTime and set it to a very small number. This supposedly allows re-use of an existing connection, but in my experience all it does it keep one open while still opening another. If you set it to a very low number, then connections will close more rapidly, so you should not reach the maximum number of connections allowed. HTH, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
Howdy - While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. So... I want to know: 1) Does FTP require a new socket for each upload? 2) If not, how do I tell libUrlFtpUploadFile to reuse an existing open socket for the next upload? 3) Is there something else I'm missing? Am I making things more complicated than they need to be? I have a nagging suspicion along this line... Here's how my code is structured: on uploadMyFile pLocalFile, pServerPath libUrlFtpUploadFile pLocalFile,pServerPath,uploadEnded end uploadMyFile on uploadEnded pUrl, pStatus put pUrl tab pStatus cr after fld callbackParams put nextFileFromList() into p1 put nextServerPath() into p2 send (uploadMyFile p1 comma p2) to me in 6 ticks end uploadEnded Many thanks for your help. -- Phil Davis PDS Labs Professional Software Development http://pdslabs.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
Hi Phil, While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. So... I want to know: 1) Does FTP require a new socket for each upload? 2) If not, how do I tell libUrlFtpUploadFile to reuse an existing open socket for the next upload? 3) Is there something else I'm missing? Am I making things more complicated than they need to be? I have a nagging suspicion along this line... Here's how my code is structured: on uploadMyFile pLocalFile, pServerPath libUrlFtpUploadFile pLocalFile,pServerPath,uploadEnded end uploadMyFile on uploadEnded pUrl, pStatus put pUrl tab pStatus cr after fld callbackParams put nextFileFromList() into p1 put nextServerPath() into p2 send (uploadMyFile p1 comma p2) to me in 6 ticks end uploadEnded Since it doesn't appear that you are using the callback except to know the upload ended and assuming these files are not huge and you don't need to do anything else during the upload like show a progress bar or other processing, you can just use: Put binfile: before pLocalFile Put URL pLocalFile into URL pServerPath Unlike libUrlFtpUploadFile, a put URL is blocking, which means your upLoadMyFile command is paused until the upload completes. If there is an error, it will be returned in *the result* and you can handle your next logic in the same handler. I believe that because it's blocking, the socket is closed after the upload, but someone else can/will correct me on this if I am wrong. ;-) Aloha from Hawaii, Jim Bufalini ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
I think that using a callback handler you can detect the 100% complete message from the server, then issue a 'QUIT' to close the connection immediately, then after getting the 'GOODBYE', start the next upload. I have not done this in practice that I know of (accidents do happen and things work without you knowing why). Jim Ault Las Veagas On Apr 14, 2009, at 3:34 PM, Phil Davis wrote: Howdy - While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. So... I want to know: 1) Does FTP require a new socket for each upload? 2) If not, how do I tell libUrlFtpUploadFile to reuse an existing open socket for the next upload? 3) Is there something else I'm missing? Am I making things more complicated than they need to be? I have a nagging suspicion along this line... Here's how my code is structured: on uploadMyFile pLocalFile, pServerPath libUrlFtpUploadFile pLocalFile,pServerPath,uploadEnded end uploadMyFile on uploadEnded pUrl, pStatus put pUrl tab pStatus cr after fld callbackParams put nextFileFromList() into p1 put nextServerPath() into p2 send (uploadMyFile p1 comma p2) to me in 6 ticks end uploadEnded Many thanks for your help. -- Phil Davis PDS Labs Professional Software Development http://pdslabs.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
Hi Jim B Jim A, Thanks for the replies. Actually I'm using libUrlFtpUploadFile because some of the files are movies (some 100mb), so I don't want to use a blocking command. The more I think about this, the more I believe it's a libUrl bug. If socket reuse works for download (which I believe it does), it should work for upload... Of course my argument is from a desire for the beauty of symmetry without regard to what's possible - which is how many good things come into being ;o) I have a 2-part workaround: on mouseUp ### WORKAROUND PART 1 put 10 into xServerMax -- I know the above number from experience; -- would rather ask FTP server for max -- but don't know an FTP command for it libUrlSetFTPStopTime 1 -- set the socket timeout to 1 sec ### WORKAROUND PART1 - end uploadMyFile tFirstLocalFile, tFirstServerPath end mouseUp on uploadMyFile pLocalFile, pServerPath libUrlFtpUploadFile pLocalFile,pServerPath,uploadEnded end uploadMyFile on uploadEnded pUrl, pStatus put pUrl tab pStatus cr after fld callbackParams put nextFileFromList() into p1 put nextServerPath() into p2 ### WORKAROUND PART 2 repeat until (the number of lines in the openSockets xServerMax) wait 1 tick with messages end repeat ### WORKAROUND PART 2 - end send (uploadMyFile p1 comma p2) to me in 1 ticks end uploadEnded Phil Jim Bufalini wrote: Hi Phil, While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. So... I want to know: 1) Does FTP require a new socket for each upload? 2) If not, how do I tell libUrlFtpUploadFile to reuse an existing open socket for the next upload? 3) Is there something else I'm missing? Am I making things more complicated than they need to be? I have a nagging suspicion along this line... Here's how my code is structured: on uploadMyFile pLocalFile, pServerPath libUrlFtpUploadFile pLocalFile,pServerPath,uploadEnded end uploadMyFile on uploadEnded pUrl, pStatus put pUrl tab pStatus cr after fld callbackParams put nextFileFromList() into p1 put nextServerPath() into p2 send (uploadMyFile p1 comma p2) to me in 6 ticks end uploadEnded Since it doesn't appear that you are using the callback except to know the upload ended and assuming these files are not huge and you don't need to do anything else during the upload like show a progress bar or other processing, you can just use: Put binfile: before pLocalFile Put URL pLocalFile into URL pServerPath Unlike libUrlFtpUploadFile, a put URL is blocking, which means your upLoadMyFile command is paused until the upload completes. If there is an error, it will be returned in *the result* and you can handle your next logic in the same handler. I believe that because it's blocking, the socket is closed after the upload, but someone else can/will correct me on this if I am wrong. ;-) Aloha from Hawaii, Jim Bufalini ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- Phil Davis PDS Labs Professional Software Development http://pdslabs.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. I had this problem with a particular server. I always get the new connection with every command, but not all servers mind this. My solution was to use libURLSetFTPStopTime and set it to a very small number. This supposedly allows re-use of an existing connection, but in my experience all it does it keep one open while still opening another. If you set it to a very low number, then connections will close more rapidly, so you should not reach the maximum number of connections allowed. HTH, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: libUrlFtpUploadFile - reuse open sockets?
Thanks Sarah. Sarah Reichelt wrote: While using libUrlFtpUploadFile to upload a bunch of files to a server, I find that libUrlFtpUploadFile opens a new socket for each upload. Even using a callback message to start a new one when the current one finishes, I get a max number of connections message back from the server when the server's max number is reached. After this, the next few upload attempts fail due to max number of connections; then as the open connections time out, new files can successfully upload again. I had this problem with a particular server. I always get the new connection with every command, but not all servers mind this. My solution was to use libURLSetFTPStopTime and set it to a very small number. This supposedly allows re-use of an existing connection, but in my experience all it does it keep one open while still opening another. If you set it to a very low number, then connections will close more rapidly, so you should not reach the maximum number of connections allowed. HTH, Sarah -- Phil Davis PDS Labs Professional Software Development http://pdslabs.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Reading from Sockets
If I have a webpage that has a link like this: a href=127.0.0.1:77Talk to Rev/a and while that webpage in Safari has that link clicked, I'd like to have Revolution lurking in the background waiting for that click, can someone tell me what I'd need to add to this script? on openCard ? open socket 127.0.0.1:77 ? read from socket 127.0.0.1:77 with message gotdata end openCard on gotdata ? answer got data from the Safari webpage! ? close socket 127.0.0.1:77 end gotdata I'm just a little confused about whether I need to _continually_ do the read socket in a timer-loop, or if I can give it an infinite timeout. Right now, I don't get this to work at all, even when I click the link within 5 seconds, so I'm obviously missing something important.? -Original Message- From: Bill Marriott [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Sent: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 8:33 am Subject: Re: way to listen to port 127.0.0.1 You're on the right track. If what you really need to do is to communicate with Rev from your web page, you could set up Revolution as a very simple web server on a *different* port -- Safari will use port 80 by default -- and send it a command in the form of a URL or POST command. You don't want to have the two applications (Safari and Rev) stepping on each other, trying to use the same port. Andre Garzia's RevOnRockets has a basic web server implementation, but I don't know if you'd even need that fully-featured of a solution. http://www.andregarzia.com/RevOnRockets/ So, that puts me to Plan B: Since this is a touch-screen kiosk environment and I have full-control over the hardware/software, I'd like to just use SAFT, which is software that makes Safari run in full-screen mode, and then have a silent version of Rev running in the background waiting for it's cue.? When it receives the cue, it needs to print some data to a thermal-label printer attached to the kiosk. I am was hoping that I could have a javascript on a web-page that passes data to 127.0.0.1:80, and then have my Rev app ready to receive that data. I'm not suceeding, however, and I could use some assistance with the scripting.? Something like: open socket 127.0.0.1:80 read from socket 127.0.0.1:80 with message gotdata and then on the web-page: a href=127.0.0.1:80Click me to test sending a message to Revolution/a ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Reading from Sockets
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I have a webpage that has a link like this: a href=127.0.0.1:77Talk to Rev/a and while that webpage in Safari has that link clicked, I'd like to have Revolution lurking in the background waiting for that click, can someone tell me what I'd need to add to this script? on openCard ? open socket 127.0.0.1:77 ? read from socket 127.0.0.1:77 with message gotdata end openCard on gotdata ? answer got data from the Safari webpage! ? close socket 127.0.0.1:77 end gotdata I'm just a little confused about whether I need to _continually_ do the read socket in a timer-loop, or if I can give it an infinite timeout. Right now, I don't get this to work at all, even when I click the link within 5 seconds, so I'm obviously missing something important.? You can find the old MetaCard HTTP server example at: http://futura.disca.upv.es/~smm/public_xml/Software/MetaCard/metacard.com-mirror-2.5/mchttpd.zip While it only supports the 'GET' method, it's a great start for loearning how any socket-based server should be built. RevOnRockets was inspired by it, as well as several custom embedded web servers (I've built a few myself) Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. Quartam Reports PDF Library for Revolution http://www.quartam.com = As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time. (La Rochefoucauld) Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Stephen Barncard wrote: Look at IP tunnelling. This allows a computer on a LAN to get a port or range of ports of various protocols through a router from the outside world. Stephen, Thank you for the guidance! I spent a little time this morning looking up IP Forwarding on the site you suggested as well as Wikipedia and a few others. I'm still formulating how I handle this, but so far I'm assuming that handling IP Forwarding within Revolution can be achieved by simply using a port that is pre-registered with the Router? If this is the case, and my program is designed to function behind most routers, I should probably go with a common (but appropriate) port. *Keeping my fingers crossed* Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Could it be as simple as your router does not have the right configuration to forward the port to your computer (or you have a firewall that prevents it since it thinks its from a non-trusted network? Neal Campbell K3NC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Devoted to Dogs: How to be your dog's best owner Great Dog Book at www.abrohamneal.com On Feb 2, 2007, at 12:33 AM, Derek Bump wrote: I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
The basic idea of a LAN behind a router is that the router assigns IP addresses dynamically therefore each cpu can have a different IP address every time it is booted. Inexpensive routers can only forward one port to one LAN IP address (internal network) thus using 9454 as the port number, for example 1 set a cpu firewall open for 2-way traffic on port 9454 2 set the router to forward incoming packets from the outside world on port 9454 to cpu at IP address 192.168.1.201 (this is a fixed setting by the admin) 3 cpu at (201) address is running an app that tells the operating system to open port 9454 on the cpu, then the app sends and receives on port 9454, and at some point could close the port. Rebooting the router or the computer can change the cpu's assigned address of (201), thus forwarding is thwarted. Network printers have to have their router-assigned IP address fixed when installed, or they may not be reachable. Rebooting the router will not change the port forwarding. Resetting the router will indeed clear the port forwarding. The broadcasting source specifies a port number and the user must match that port. The broadcasting source specifies a computer address (IP address) which is usually the static address of the router. In the case of DSL service, I believe each user is assigned a static IP address to make that system work. This is based on my experience and may not be entirely correct. This should be accurate for most home or small office systems. Hope this helps. Jim Ault Las Vegas On 2/2/07 11:35 AM, Neal Campbell K3NC [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Could it be as simple as your router does not have the right configuration to forward the port to your computer (or you have a firewall that prevents it since it thinks its from a non-trusted network? Neal Campbell K3NC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Devoted to Dogs: How to be your dog's best owner Great Dog Book at www.abrohamneal.com On Feb 2, 2007, at 12:33 AM, Derek Bump wrote: I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Stephen Barncard wrote: Look at IP tunnelling. This allows a computer on a LAN to get a port or range of ports of various protocols through a router from the outside world. All routers will have this. http://www.linuxvirtualserver.org/VS-IPTunneling.html Unfortunately, this scheme described here uses IP Tunnelling *direct* to the real server - and hence requires that the real server be directly addressable from the external Internet - which is not the case in the scenario of the original question. There are also other problems that the article skates over 1. This scheme has the real server send its reply direct to the client. This raises (or rather, doesn't raise :-) the question of what the form of these reply packets will be. There are two choices for the Source IP address - the real server's own IP address (the obvious choice). This can (will) result in the packets being dropped if the client is behind a secure NAT/firewall, because the src-ip of the packets will not match the dest-ip address of the established connection. - the Virtual IP address. This can (though only rarely will) result in the packets being dropped because they have spoofed IP addresses, and any ISP using Reverse Path Filtering will drop it for security reasons. Sadly, not enough ISPs run RPF (if they did, spam and other attacks would drop significantly), so you might get away with this. 2. the tunnelling is all the way to the server - so you need IP tunnelling support on the server, not on the router. Most users (i.e. Windows and Macs) will either not have this support, or will need privileged access to configure it. 3. MTU issues - probably not as serious now as they were a few years ago, since many people are configured with slightly smaller MTUs to allow use over VPN, but still might catch out some users. then one can use dynDNS or other service to get the IP when it inevitably will change. But knowing the new IP address on the server still leaves you vulnerable to the problem of changing the port forwarding on the router (and related issues, which Jim's email covers better than I could). Note you could run this IP tunnelling via the router - having the router decapsulate the packet and forward to the relevant local machine (but that's no easier than configuring port forwarding, and not all routers will support GRE with configured output ports). I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Don't be confused by the term P2P. Many of these (e.g. BitTorrent) will function OK with only outbound connections, and the majority of users work this way. Those users who need (or want) higher speed access must either be not behind a NAT, or the use port forwarding to allow inbound connections. One other hurdle to watch out for - even if you have port forwarding on the router, you also need to check for software firewall on the server machine; if the user is running one of these, it will need to have the relevant port opened up. -- Alex Tweedly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] www.tweedly.net ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Neal Campbell K3NC wrote: Could it be as simple as your router does not have the right configuration to forward the port to your computer (or you have a firewall that prevents it since it thinks its from a non-trusted network? That very well could be. I'm figuring that there will inevitably be some users out there who are behind an improperly configured router or firewall, but for the most part I would like to help to ensure that my program will be usable by any user. I have been doing a little research and it appears that there is really nothing much that I can do to forward a port on my own, but instead I have to rely on the user figuring out how to do it on their own... which does not help me at all. I do have one question (and please don't throw me to the wolves if I've proposed to break the network law), but where is the harm in my program utilizing a port that is most likely being forwarded? If I utilize port 110 (POP3) behind a router, will the outside world still be able to communicate with me? I'm not on a router right now so I can't try it out on my own. Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Jim Ault wrote: This is based on my experience and may not be entirely correct. This should be accurate for most home or small office systems. Thanks Jim, your information does help. Ultimately the program I'm developing will fail simply because the target audience is not technical enough to even understand how to forward a port, nor do they even understand what a Port is. Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
So I have an idea to help resolve the issue of port forwarding. I did some testing with a friend overseas (Japan) and my computer (USA). He's behind a router and I am not, but it's apparent that his router supports Port Triggering. I know this because the Port that his computer supplied to me during the socket connection (that he initiated) was like 324 or 243. The model of my program is that of a program that acts as a client and server, and occasionally updates it's information with a central server. So could I do this to overcome the Port Forwarding issue: 1. Client A opens a socket to the Primary Server. 2. Primary Server stores the IP Address Port. 3. Client B gets Client A's IP Address Port from the Primary Server. 4. Client B opens a socket to Client A with the IP Address Port that it just received. Would this work? The reason Client A connects to the Primary Server is because Client B has no idea what the IP of Client A is, and I want to eliminate the need for Static IP's and services for such. Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ Derek Bump wrote: I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Receiving data with Sockets when behind a Router
Look at IP tunnelling. This allows a computer on a LAN to get a port or range of ports of various protocols through a router from the outside world. All routers will have this. http://www.linuxvirtualserver.org/VS-IPTunneling.html then one can use dynDNS or other service to get the IP when it inevitably will change. sqb I'm in need of some guidance. How do you resolve an IP address when it's behind a router or a firewall? I'm trying to build a simple communications device in Revolution, and I have been looking at some of the demo stacks that are out there. They all work wonderfully, but I occasionally run into the problem of being behind a Wireless Router. My IP address when connected through the router is 192.168.0.7, while the outside world see my IP as 69.179.91.117. Attempting to connect to the public IP address results in nothing. I mean I'm figuring with all the Instant Messengers and P2P programs out there that there's a way to do this. Help! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software http://www.dreamscapesoftware.com/ -- stephen barncard s a n f r a n c i s c o - - - - - - - - - - - - ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: rev sockets driven apps...
Hi Troy, Le 23 mars 06 à 03:26, Troy Rollins a écrit : On Mar 15, 2006, at 4:41 PM, Pierre Sahores wrote: Gohead and don't hesite about more details, if that can help ;-) Perhaps could you have a look at this link and binded example app material : it's a short resume of the way i'm running Rev TCP sockets application's servers under Linux and OSX since 1998. Don't hesite to ask for more closely explaintions. http://istream.homeunix.com/insead/index_en.html Hi Pierre, I've finally had a chance to review the documents above. That is very cool stuff, but leaves me wondering... if what I want is a socket server, why do I need apache and php? I don't have any need of web pages or html, strictly socket communications. Is there some other advantage that I am missing, or are we really talking about two different things? Yes ;) Because Apache, PHP or PostgreSQL are natively working in multiprocessing mode, any time you stick a Rev application in betwin them, this Rev app will be coached by those three other components in multiprocess mode even if Rev (monoprocess able only) will not have to deal by it-self about multiprocessing. In practice, Rev just have to care about replying to the Apache-PHP requests it receive and the queries order is fully managed by Apache-PHP when Rev is acting as the httpd client app and by PostgreSQL when Rev is acting as the PostgreSQL application server app. The main advantage is that this way make us sure that Rev has just to do its own job (run transcript code) without having to manage any multiprocessing or multithreading queue tasks. On both sides of the Rev app, Apache-PHP and the SQL deamon are full handling this for Rev. So, even if you just want to use Rev to run text containts (instead of html) trough TCP sockets, it's always a rock-solid solution to have Apache running in front in your Rev server. Second : with the PHP sockets listener running in betwin Apache and Rev, the socket translation betwin Apache:80 and Rev:what you want is always a very good solution to make sure that your Rev app is 100% unbindable from the intenet outside world. Only Apache is authorised to speak to it : in about the task of the security of your n-tier app, this can realy do matter... Best, Thanks. -- Troy RPSystems, Ltd. http://www.rpsystems.net -- Pierre Sahores www.sahores-conseil.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
This is just a quick 'thank you' to Alex Tweedly and Dave Cragg for their very educational mails. I will experiment shortly and get back to the list when (not if) I get into a muddle. Graham --- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK and France ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
Like Graham, I too would like to thank Alex and Dave for their detailed discussion of sockets. I tried Dave's small handler and it worked well, but only once. I went into the script to insert a break point so that I could step through it to see how it works, but it wouldn't work a second time. Even after I took the break point out, it still wouldn't work. Looks like it got all wore out after one use. Jim ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On 13 Dec 2005, at 01:40, Jim Hurley wrote: Like Graham, I too would like to thank Alex and Dave for their detailed discussion of sockets. I tried Dave's small handler and it worked well, but only once. I went into the script to insert a break point so that I could step through it to see how it works, but it wouldn't work a second time. Even after I took the break point out, it still wouldn't work. Looks like it got all wore out after one use. I hope not. People will want their money back. :-) The server script appears to be still running here, but I'm connecting over an internal network, and so use a different IP address from the one in the script I posted. You'll have noticed a complete lack of error checking in the script I posted, and also on the server script if you managed to retrieve it. Error checking is lesson 2. :-) Unfortunately, I have to go Christmas shopping shortly (I promised), so I can't do much right now. You could add a socketError handler to the script. The sample handler in the Rev docs (under socketError) should be fine. Setting a breakpoint may not be so useful. I haven't tried this recently, but in the past I found it difficult (impossible) to use the debugger with asynchronous behavior like this. Instead, you might want to add lines to the script that record values to another field. For example, add the following log handler on logit pData put pData return after field log end logit and then add log sttaements wherever you want to inspect something. For example: on readLineOne pS logit readLineOne pS ##DEBUG read from socket pS for one line with message readmore end readLineOne Cheers Dave ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Sockets
I'm learning something about testing for an Internet connection from the last couple of posts of the list digest. I used to use the old method of testing for a connection to Google. Now all I need to do is find out was a socket is. I know it must have something to do with light bulbs. Searched the dictionary for socket and came up with the single Using URLs, uploading, and downloading, 18 pages (copied to Word) which don't appear to contain the word socket. Is there a secret RR society which is privy to this sort of thing? Can I join? Sock it to me. Jim ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On Dec 11 2005, at 17:32, Jim Hurley wrote: ... Searched the dictionary for socket and came up with the single Using URLs, uploading, and downloading, 18 pages (copied to Word) which don't appear to contain the word socket. Is there a secret RR society which is privy to this sort of thing? Can I join? Sock it to me. ... Of course there is a secret Socket society! But it's easy to join: Our required readings are: Open Socket command Close Socket command Accept command If these don't help you, then you need to ask either on the use list or in chatrev :) socket society member Björnke -- official ChatRev page: http://chatrev.bjoernke.com Chat with other RunRev developers: go stack URL http://homepage.mac.com/bvg/chatrev1.3.rev; ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
Björnke- Sunday, December 11, 2005, 8:49:42 AM, you wrote: Of course there is a secret Socket society! But it's easy to join: Our required readings are: Open Socket command Close Socket command Accept command You got off easy. I had to stay after school and read write to socket read from socket -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On 11 Dec 2005, at 16:49, Björnke von Gierke wrote: Of course there is a secret Socket society! But it's easy to join: Our required readings are: Open Socket command Close Socket command Accept command If these don't help you, then you need to ask either on the use list or in chatrev :) You forgot to mention the secret handshake. :-) Dave___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
On Sun, 11 Dec 2005 08:32:55 -0800, Jim Hurley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now all I need to do is find out was a socket is. I know it must have something to do with light bulbs. Searched the dictionary for socket and came up with the single Using URLs, uploading, and downloading, 18 pages (copied to Word) which don't appear to contain the word socket. Is there a secret RR society which is privy to this sort of thing? Can I join? Sock it to me. I can't answer the question but I would very much like to be around when it is answered. When I was younger (**much** younger), I used to kind of absorb technical stuff without consciously learning about it, but nowadays stuff suddenly comes up and bites me in the rear and I wonder where it came from: for me, XML is like that, and so is most Internet stuff. Sockets, do we need them and is the term just a token or does it carry some metaphorical meaning? And that great forest of non-mnemonic clusters of letters like say DHCP - just look at the Network Control Panel on a Mac or PC and despair... I've tried to read my way into the subject, but it hasn't helped me much. For example, I noticed the following in the RR documentation for 'OpenSockets': For technical information about the numbers used to designate standard ports, see the list of port numbers at http:// www.iana.org/assignments/port-numbers, in particular the section titled Well Known Port Numbers. Following that link led to something surreal as far as I could see: what are all those individuals doing in there? And who or what is IANA? OK, I know I'm out of my depth. Let's hope Andre can help us (on sockets, not the other stuff). Graham --- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK and France ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
Graham Samuel wrote: I can't answer the question but I would very much like to be around when it is answered. When I was younger (**much** younger), I used to kind of absorb technical stuff without consciously learning about it, but nowadays stuff suddenly comes up and bites me in the rear and I wonder where it came from: for me, XML is like that, and so is most Internet stuff. :-) Sockets, do we need them and is the term just a token or does it carry some metaphorical meaning? It does carry some meaning - the idea was that you could plug together different programs. You make connections between sockets And that great forest of non-mnemonic clusters of letters like say DHCP - just look at the Network Control Panel on a Mac or PC and despair... I've tried to read my way into the subject, but it hasn't helped me much. For example, I noticed the following in the RR documentation for 'OpenSockets': DHCP - Dynamic Host Config ProtocolCan't think of a more mnemonic acronym for it. For technical information about the numbers used to designate standard ports, see the list of port numbers at http:// www.iana.org/assignments/port-numbers, in particular the section titled Well Known Port Numbers. Following that link led to something surreal as far as I could see: what are all those individuals doing in there? And who or what is IANA? OK, I know I'm out of my depth. IANA is the co-ordinating body for various numbers (protocol number, port numbers, etc.) If you need, e.g. a port to be assigned, you need to apply to IANA, with a description of why you need a port, what it will be used for, where the appropriate documents can be found, etc. (the process is much more rigorous nowadays than it used to be). The individuals listed along with *some* of the assigned ports are the individuals who sent in the application. Let's hope Andre can help us (on sockets, not the other stuff). -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.13/197 - Release Date: 09/12/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
BvG, Also, to become a member of the House Of The Sockets And Ports, one should learn the write to socket read from socket commands. I'll publish a little draft today on sockets. The Socket Society meets on ChatRev... :-p cheers andre On Dec 11, 2005, at 2:49 PM, Björnke von Gierke wrote: On Dec 11 2005, at 17:32, Jim Hurley wrote: ... Searched the dictionary for socket and came up with the single Using URLs, uploading, and downloading, 18 pages (copied to Word) which don't appear to contain the word socket. Is there a secret RR society which is privy to this sort of thing? Can I join? Sock it to me. ... Of course there is a secret Socket society! But it's easy to join: Our required readings are: Open Socket command Close Socket command Accept command If these don't help you, then you need to ask either on the use list or in chatrev :) socket society member Björnke -- official ChatRev page: http://chatrev.bjoernke.com Chat with other RunRev developers: go stack URL http://homepage.mac.com/bvg/chatrev1.3.rev; ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sockets
This time I'll try to be more helpful. On 11 Dec 2005, at 21:34, Graham Samuel wrote: Sockets, do we need them If you just need to connect to internet URLs, you can use the get URL, load URL, etc, calls, and not have to know anything about sockets. But if you want to do something more fancy, such as build your own web server, mail client, or completely new internet protocol (see below), then you probably need to know a little. (But I can tell you from my involvement with libUrl, you don't really need to know that much, at least if you're doing these kind of things in Rev.) and is the term just a token or does it carry some metaphorical meaning? Both of those I guess. The term socket is not just a Rev expression, but is used in all computer development environments. A socket is part of the connection that computers use to communicate with each other on TCP/IP networks such as the internet and on intranets too. The following description/analogy may not be strictly accurate, but I've found it quite helpful. Remember those old-fashioned telephone switchbords where the operator stuck wires into various holes on the board. Well, imagine your computer has a similar board inside with a lot of holes numbered from 1 to 65000 or thereabouts. And the computer you want to connect to (for example, the computer that hosts www.runrev.com) has a similar set of holes. To connect your computer to the runrev computer, you can imagine connecting a wire in one of the 65000 holes in your computer and connecting it one of the holes in the RunRev computer. The sockets are the endpoints of the connection. However, with Rev, we don't really need to think about the endpoints too much, and it is often easier just to think about the connection itself. However, much as I'd prefer to script this: open connection to www.runrev.com you have to script this: open socket to www.runrev.com #(not quite correct, but see later) Now remember those 65000 or so holes on the board in your computer, and the other 65000 holes on the renRev computer. Well those holes are called ports, which is easy enough to understand. So are sockets and ports the same? Not exactly as you can open many sockets to a single port (Many wires to one hole). But from a Rev perspective, they're pretty similar. Unfortunately, when you want to connect to the runrev computer, you can't just connect to any old port (numbered hole) on the runrev computer. Many of the ports have specific functions, and you have to connect to the right one. For example, if there is a web server running on the runrev computer, it is most likely linked to port (hole) number 80, as that's the default for web servers. So when you do something like this: get url http://www.runrev.com/index.html; libUrl assumes that the htpp server is running on port 80, and so does the following as part of its stuff: open socket to www.runrev.com:80 (You *must* include the port number when you open a socket, which is why the example earlier was wrong.) OK. So once you open a socket, what do you do? Well, you write data to the socket, and read data from it. (That's about all you can do.) If your connecting to a standard server such as a web server, mail server, or ftp server, there are protocols which dictate exactly what you have to write and read. These protocols are described in documents called RFCs which are no fun to read but will help send you to sleep when you're on a long flight. (Threaten the kids with one for Christmas!) So rather than wrestling with an established protocol, it's probably easier to learn sockets by inventing a brand new protocol. (Really.) But to do this, you have to build the server part of the connection too. However, this is amazingly easy. The key syntax to running a server, is the following script: accept connections on port port number with message some handler But if you want to see how simple this can be to get started, you can try running the following client script. I have a Rev server running here right now that implements a simple protocol I invented while writing this mail. :-) To run the client, you need to make a stack with two fields and one button. Name the fields in and out. Put some text in field in (keep it below 10K to save my bandwidth). Put the following script in the button: on mouseUp put 193.109.51.205:8081 into tS open socket to tS with message connected end mouseUp on connected pS put field in into tData ##uncomment following line to see server script ## write script cr to socket pS write length(tData) cr to socket pS write tData to socket pS with message readLineOne end connected on readLineOne pS read from socket pS for one line with message readmore end readLineOne on readmore pS, pData if word 1 of pData is a integer then repeat until length(tRD) = word 1 of pData read from socket
Re: What gives with Sockets?
What port are you using? All ports below a certain threshold need root access on mac os x and win nt upwards... On Jun 15 2005, at 04:47, Thomas McCarthy wrote: Hi, builiding a simple server and client. Simple stuff--open a port on the server and listen. Write to the server from the client. I had it working at home (mac OS 8.6 and win98). then I brought it to work (OSX and NT4) no good. It failed both ways (mac as server/win client and vice versa) This shouldn't be rocket science. I did something like this about 4 years ago in MetaCard and vaguely remember pulling out some hairs then, too. could there be some Ethernet-hub thing going on? I think I've got the addresses all right. Ar! tom ___ Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web! ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://contest.wecode.org Now running: the first ChatRev coding contest! sponsors: Altuit Andre Garzia Karl Becker Runtime Revolution TidBITS in cooperation with eHUG ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
What gives with Sockets?
Hi, builiding a simple server and client. Simple stuff--open a port on the server and listen. Write to the server from the client. I had it working at home (mac OS 8.6 and win98). then I brought it to work (OSX and NT4) no good. It failed both ways (mac as server/win client and vice versa) This shouldn't be rocket science. I did something like this about 4 years ago in MetaCard and vaguely remember pulling out some hairs then, too. could there be some Ethernet-hub thing going on? I think I've got the addresses all right. Ar! tom ___ Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web! ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Rev, sockets, IP Multicast Part II
In part one, I briefly explained one reason why it would be native to have support for IP multicast in Rev - it provides very clean, easy solutions for certain types of problems. But how can we use IP Multicast when Rev doesn't support it ? [Remember - we can send multicast packets - it's only receiving them that is unsupported.] First obvious answer is to submit a Bugzilla request for multicast support - but quite honestly I don't see it as being a top priority for RR to do. Even as a multicast enthusiast and advocate, I can't see adding this feature as a high priority for RunRev. Second obvious solution is to write an external - but that sounds hard; I've barely written my first trivial external, and this one would need to generate asynchronous callbacks, etc. - so I decided it was the wrong thing to try for my first real external. Then the recent discussion about the possibility of solving a problem using multiple tools, with sockets to communicate between them gave me the third obvious solution. I've now written a multicast bridge - a program which can be run as a server, accepts commands (on a UDP socket) to listen to a multicast group/port, and forwards everything each packet it receives to a specified UDP unicast port. You'd need only a single copy of this running on each machine - and any or all Rev apps which wanted to receive multicast packets could make use of it. I wrote this in Python - though it could easily be translated to C or C++ - but life really is too short for that; the Python version works just fine, and will handle reasonable packet rates. The application (in Rev, or any other language without native multicast support) sends commands to the bridge requesting that any packets it (the bridge) receives on a particular IP multicast group / port combination should be forwarded to the (unicast) IP address / port specified by the app. Normally, the app and bridge should be on the same machine - in fact, the default mode in the bridge is to only allow this case. Caveats: 1. IP Multicast is not universally supported on networks - so check that it is available everywhere you need it before committing to using it in a project. 2. The multicast bridge is a potential security hole if used carelessly - keep to the default Secure mode or if you need the flexibility. implement some real security such as md5 shared secrets (this is pretty simple - if you want to do it, let me know and I'll post the extended version of the bridge code and client stack). I'll try to post the sample client stack to RevOnline (as soon as I figure out how to do that without overwriting one of my existing stacks). I can't post the Python code for the multicast bridge there - so it is available from my web site, as is the Rev stack. The bridge code is at www.tweedly.net/RunRev/mcast-bridge.pyt A very simple python test program is at www.tweedly.net/RunRev/mcast-client.pyt A similarly simple test stack is at www.tweedly.net/RunRev/mcastclient.rev If you've never used Python - download a (free) copy (www.python.org), it's easy enough to use. Feel free to email me (on- or off-list) if you run into any problems, or have any questions. -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.6 - Release Date: 30/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Rev, sockets, IP Multicast Part II
On Apr 2, 2005, at 12:17 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote: But how can we use IP Multicast when Rev doesn't support it ? I have a vague memory of the other Alex writing an external. I have made a mock multicast using UDP. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Rev, sockets, IP Multicast.
Woooaw ! What an usefull post, you share with all of us ! Many thanks for that, Alex. I'm waiting for reading your next posts with great interest :-) All the best, Le 31 mars 05, à 03:16, Alex Tweedly a écrit : A while ago (around 2nd March), in a thread about UDP sockets, I bemoaned the fact that Rev didn't allow for receiving IP multicast packets. About the same time (around 9th March), Richard Miller asked for suggestions on how to tackle his problem for client status reporting and monitoring. Various solutions were suggested - but at the time, I thought how much easier the problem would be if multicast was supported; and it kept bothering me. This is the result. In a subsequent email, I'll describe what I've been doing to make it possible to use IP Multicast from Rev. But first, a quick reminder of Richard's problem description, and then the simplest multicast solution (to show just how simple this problem would be if we did have multicast available). Problem Statement. There are a number (on the order of 100) clients, which need to report their status (status being things like - online, offline, back shortly, ).They will update their status relatively frequently (say every 30 seconds). We have available a dedicated server to collect these status reports, and to send the collected status report to the monitors. There are a similar number of monitors (~100), and each monitor wants to get the status info for all clients, again roughly every 30 seconds. IP Multicast solution. Use UDP sockets over IP multicast; each client sends its status report to the multicast group every 30 seconds, each monitor listens to the multicast group and so receives all the status reports. (All variable beginning with g are assumed to be global, and to have the values we need in them ) CLIENT CODE initialization: open datagram socket to 225.1.1.1:5678 -- no need for a callback handler send every30secs to me timed event: on every30secs write gMyName comma gMystatus to socket 225.1.1.1:5678 send every30secs to me in 30 seconds end every30secs SERVER: There is no server needed. MONITOR Each monitor listens to the multicast group. MONITOR CODE: initialization listen to multicast group 225.1.1.1-- if only we could do this in Rev !!! accept datagram connections on port 5678 with message gotStatusReport on gotStatusReport p, pData put item 1 of pData into tName put seconds() comma pData into gStatus[tName] end gotStatusReport to get status of a user / machine function getStatus pName if item 1 of gStatus[pName] - seconds() 75 then return timed outreturn item 3 to -1 of gStatus[tName] end getStatus There now, couldn't be much easier - could it ? Note that before using this for real, we would want to add a little bit of security to protect against impostor clients - but that's only the same protection as we'd want in any other solution. FAQ: 1. What is this IP multicast ? A mechanism where a single transmitted packet can be received by any number of machines that want to hear it. There are a number of introductions to IP multicast around, better than I would write here. One example is http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Multicast-HOWTO-1.html but many others can be found via Google ... 2. Isn't UDP unreliable ? What if packets get lost ? Or are delivered out of order ? Yes. It will be OK - from the problem definition, it is clear that the monitor does not require to have the absolutely current status of the client - it can lag behind by up to 30+30 seconds. In this solution, the client repeats its status report frequently, so if a packet gets lost on the way to one (or more) monitors, that monitor's view of the client's status will lag behind for one additional time period. It's possible we'd want to change the client reporting period from 30 secs to maybe 20. We might also want to adjust the 75 seconds - the time at which we decide that it's been so long since we heard from a particular client that we wish to assume it is dead or disconnected - down to maybe 50 secs. Since every transaction in our protocol is a single packet being sent one way, we will not get out of order packets unless the network is delaying some packets by 30 (or 20) seconds, while allowing others through. If your network delivers packets out of order by tens of seconds, you will have so many other problems, you won't notice this one :-) 3. Sounds good - but how can we use IP multicast from Rev ? This is only the teaser - I'll give my (current) solution to that in tomorrow's email - this is just to whet your appetite. (And also to provide me with a deadline so I will complete the other email :-) -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 27/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use
Rev, sockets, IP Multicast.
A while ago (around 2nd March), in a thread about UDP sockets, I bemoaned the fact that Rev didn't allow for receiving IP multicast packets. About the same time (around 9th March), Richard Miller asked for suggestions on how to tackle his problem for client status reporting and monitoring. Various solutions were suggested - but at the time, I thought how much easier the problem would be if multicast was supported; and it kept bothering me. This is the result. In a subsequent email, I'll describe what I've been doing to make it possible to use IP Multicast from Rev. But first, a quick reminder of Richard's problem description, and then the simplest multicast solution (to show just how simple this problem would be if we did have multicast available). Problem Statement. There are a number (on the order of 100) clients, which need to report their status (status being things like - online, offline, back shortly, ).They will update their status relatively frequently (say every 30 seconds). We have available a dedicated server to collect these status reports, and to send the collected status report to the monitors. There are a similar number of monitors (~100), and each monitor wants to get the status info for all clients, again roughly every 30 seconds. IP Multicast solution. Use UDP sockets over IP multicast; each client sends its status report to the multicast group every 30 seconds, each monitor listens to the multicast group and so receives all the status reports. (All variable beginning with g are assumed to be global, and to have the values we need in them ) CLIENT CODE initialization: open datagram socket to 225.1.1.1:5678 -- no need for a callback handler send every30secs to me timed event: on every30secs write gMyName comma gMystatus to socket 225.1.1.1:5678 send every30secs to me in 30 seconds end every30secs SERVER: There is no server needed. MONITOR Each monitor listens to the multicast group. MONITOR CODE: initialization listen to multicast group 225.1.1.1-- if only we could do this in Rev !!! accept datagram connections on port 5678 with message gotStatusReport on gotStatusReport p, pData put item 1 of pData into tName put seconds() comma pData into gStatus[tName] end gotStatusReport to get status of a user / machine function getStatus pName if item 1 of gStatus[pName] - seconds() 75 then return timed out return item 3 to -1 of gStatus[tName] end getStatus There now, couldn't be much easier - could it ? Note that before using this for real, we would want to add a little bit of security to protect against impostor clients - but that's only the same protection as we'd want in any other solution. FAQ: 1. What is this IP multicast ? A mechanism where a single transmitted packet can be received by any number of machines that want to hear it. There are a number of introductions to IP multicast around, better than I would write here. One example is http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Multicast-HOWTO-1.html but many others can be found via Google ... 2. Isn't UDP unreliable ? What if packets get lost ? Or are delivered out of order ? Yes. It will be OK - from the problem definition, it is clear that the monitor does not require to have the absolutely current status of the client - it can lag behind by up to 30+30 seconds. In this solution, the client repeats its status report frequently, so if a packet gets lost on the way to one (or more) monitors, that monitor's view of the client's status will lag behind for one additional time period. It's possible we'd want to change the client reporting period from 30 secs to maybe 20. We might also want to adjust the 75 seconds - the time at which we decide that it's been so long since we heard from a particular client that we wish to assume it is dead or disconnected - down to maybe 50 secs. Since every transaction in our protocol is a single packet being sent one way, we will not get out of order packets unless the network is delaying some packets by 30 (or 20) seconds, while allowing others through. If your network delivers packets out of order by tens of seconds, you will have so many other problems, you won't notice this one :-) 3. Sounds good - but how can we use IP multicast from Rev ? This is only the teaser - I'll give my (current) solution to that in tomorrow's email - this is just to whet your appetite. (And also to provide me with a deadline so I will complete the other email :-) -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 27/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev and sockets.
Keith- Tuesday, March 22, 2005, 4:35:53 PM, you wrote: KH Did you have hassles with MSAccess handling dead tcpip connections? Dead in what way? I can certainly catch sockets that aren't open. Timeouts may be a problem, but this hasn't come up for me yet. I'm using Access as a client for a runrev server app, and timeouts shouldn't happen unless the server disappears after a client request and before the server response. Sockets are a pain to use in basic, though. -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RunRev and sockets.
Hi Mark, KH I am really interested in exploring the idea of having RunRev stacks talking KH to RealBasic compiled apps, via tcpip. Shouldn't be a problem. I've got runrev stacks talking with MSAccess apps over sockets. Did you have hassles with MSAccess handling dead tcpip connections? Keith Hutchison Balance-Infosystems.Com postgresql - mysql - dbf Foxpro - Delphi - MS Access - REALbasic - Java http://balance-infosystems.com http://realopen.org ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Opening Sockets on localhost
so Dan, don't forget, that is one of the subjects we are waiting for good explanations from someone that can well explain (and some of us - I think - even already paid for it?) ;-) Till Am 16.03.2005 um 12:13 schrieb Alex Tweedly: Dan Shafer wrote: Alex. I got it. IOW, opening a socket doesn't work unilaterally. The server has to have a listener on that port first. Right? Right. When you open a TCP socket (i.e. open socket to host:port), a TCP connection is formed. A packet is sent from your machine's TCP stack to his, and he sends a reply (assuming some application has done accept connection on the correct port). If there is no-one listening on that port, the remote machine will either ignore the incoming packet, or send back a reject packet. When (if) your host receives a positive acknowledgment, then the connection is successful (from your point of view); your TCP stack then sends him back a third packet - and only when he receives it does he consider the connection complete. (He can't consider it complete until then, because there could be a problem getting his packets to you - the only way he knows that has succeeded is when you reply). You may hear this referred to as TCP's three-way handshake. Note that when you open a UDP socket (i.e. open datagram socket to host:port), things are completely different. UDP (datagram) is connectionless, so the open socket does not cause any network activity, and will generally succeed provided the host:port have valid values. I'm going to figure out this server stuff one of these days. And once you do, you'll realize how simple it all was to begin with, and wonder why no-one ever wrote a decent explanation of it in the first place. It's because most of us can't write decent explanations of anything :-) -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.3 - Release Date: 15/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Opening Sockets on localhost
Also, socket behavior is generally well-understood and well-explained elsewhere on the net. Don't forget, if your're using a packet sniffer and examining the traffic you're sending to yourself you won't see anything on Windows. That's because on Windows if the traffic doesn't hit the NIC the sniffers can't see it. -- On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth On the second day, God created the oceans. On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours, and did a little diving. And God said, This is good. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Opening Sockets on localhost
Dan Shafer wrote: Alex. I got it. IOW, opening a socket doesn't work unilaterally. The server has to have a listener on that port first. Right? Right. When you open a TCP socket (i.e. open socket to host:port), a TCP connection is formed. A packet is sent from your machine's TCP stack to his, and he sends a reply (assuming some application has done accept connection on the correct port). If there is no-one listening on that port, the remote machine will either ignore the incoming packet, or send back a reject packet. When (if) your host receives a positive acknowledgment, then the connection is successful (from your point of view); your TCP stack then sends him back a third packet - and only when he receives it does he consider the connection complete. (He can't consider it complete until then, because there could be a problem getting his packets to you - the only way he knows that has succeeded is when you reply). You may hear this referred to as TCP's three-way handshake. Note that when you open a UDP socket (i.e. open datagram socket to host:port), things are completely different. UDP (datagram) is connectionless, so the open socket does not cause any network activity, and will generally succeed provided the host:port have valid values. I'm going to figure out this server stuff one of these days. And once you do, you'll realize how simple it all was to begin with, and wonder why no-one ever wrote a decent explanation of it in the first place. It's because most of us can't write decent explanations of anything :-) -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.3 - Release Date: 15/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
Kevin, note that I create a new variable 'nVar' in the loop, so you shouldn't be doubling anything up. My repeat loop obviously assumes that the extra char is at the beginning of every line, not just some of them. An alternative would be to use the replace function, as others have noted, but if you don't know what the square is, then you'd have to find out, which you could do by pasting one of them from your field into this line in the message box: put charToNum(paste the char here) - remember to put the character in quotes This will give you a number which you can then use: replace numToChar(the number you got) with empty in tVar Cheers, Mark On 15 Mar 2005, at 02:45, Kevin J wrote: Not only that it repeats the entire page but it does get rid of he box thing the second time around. On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:36:00 -0500, Frank D. Engel, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Won't that delete the first character you retrieve? On Mar 14, 2005, at 7:08 PM, Mark Smith wrote: on mouseUp open socket theseahaven.com:5500 read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 put it into tvar repeat for each line L in tVar put char 2 to -1 of L cr after nVar end repeat delete last char of nVar --- clear trailing cr put nVar in to field 1 end mouseUp ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Opening Sockets on localhost
Dan Shafer wrote: If I open socket to localhost and look at the result, it's empty, which means the socket got created. If I subsequently use close socket localhost, that works, too. If, before I close the socket I try to open it again, I get the expected error indicating the socket is already open. So far, so good. However, if I append a port to the open socket command, nothing happens. open socket to localhost:8080 followed immediately by cloe socket localhost:8080 returns socket is not open. OS X 10.3.8, Rev 2.5.1. Is this broken or am I misunderstanding something or...??? Possibly neither. open socket localhost is equivalent toopen socket localhost:80 the default port is 80, which is generally used for HTTP connections. This should succeed if your machine is able (willing) to accept http connections, and otherwise it should fail. Sounds like it succeeds on your machine. open socket localhost:8080should fail, unless you have some process on your machine accepting connections on port 8080 - fairly unlikely, so I'd expect it to fail. -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.3 - Release Date: 15/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Opening Sockets on localhost
Alex. I got it. IOW, opening a socket doesn't work unilaterally. The server has to have a listener on that port first. Right? I'm going to figure out this server stuff one of these days. Dan On Mar 15, 2005, at 5:05 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote: Dan Shafer wrote: If I open socket to localhost and look at the result, it's empty, which means the socket got created. If I subsequently use close socket localhost, that works, too. If, before I close the socket I try to open it again, I get the expected error indicating the socket is already open. So far, so good. However, if I append a port to the open socket command, nothing happens. open socket to localhost:8080 followed immediately by cloe socket localhost:8080 returns socket is not open. OS X 10.3.8, Rev 2.5.1. Is this broken or am I misunderstanding something or...??? Possibly neither. open socket localhost is equivalent toopen socket localhost:80 the default port is 80, which is generally used for HTTP connections. This should succeed if your machine is able (willing) to accept http connections, and otherwise it should fail. Sounds like it succeeds on your machine. open socket localhost:8080should fail, unless you have some process on your machine accepting connections on port 8080 - fairly unlikely, so I'd expect it to fail. -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.3 - Release Date: 15/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Using sockets
Well I have taken a break from working on my text editor. So I decided to play around with the socket functions. I was trying to open a socket to a text game so that I could read the login page I can get it in to the text field and the page will show up in the field but it will have a little square box at the left hand side of the field on every line. How would I get rid of that? This is what I did to connect to the socket on mouseUp open socket theseahaven.com:5500 read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 put it into tvar put tvar into fieldfield1 end mouseUp ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
On Mar 14, 2005, at 1:01 PM, Kevin J wrote: I was trying to open a socket to a text game so that I could read the login page I can get it in to the text field and the page will show up in the field but it will have a little square box at the left hand side of the field on every line. How would I get rid of that? The game might be using lf cr at the end of each line. ASCII CR is numToChar(13); get rid of those. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
Kevin- Monday, March 14, 2005, 12:01:47 PM, you wrote: KJ Well I have taken a break from working on my text editor. So I decided KJ to play around with the socket functions. I was trying to open a KJ socket to a text game so that I could read the login page I can get it KJ in to the text field and the page will show up in the field but it KJ will have a little square box at the left hand side of the field on KJ every line. How would I get rid of that? This is what I did to connect KJ to the socket KJ on mouseUp KJ open socket theseahaven.com:5500 KJ read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 KJ put it into tvar KJ put tvar into fieldfield1 KJ end mouseUp You're seeing crlf conversion problems. Runrev uses linefeeds as line delimiters and you're probably seeing crlf pairs coming over the line. You might try the replace command on the incoming stream to replace crlf with lf in tvar -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
On 14 Mar 2005, at 20:15, Kevin J wrote: Well I have taken a break from working on my text editor. So I decided to play around with the socket functions. I was trying to open a socket to a text game so that I could read the login page I can get it in to the text field and the page will show up in the field but it will have a little square box at the left hand side of the field on every line. How would I get rid of that? This is what I did to connect to the socket I think the little square is an ASCII number that doesn't actually have a corresponding alpha numeric character. When getting data from different systems that have different line delimiters and such-like, you get this sort of thing. Probably the easiest solution would be to insert a loop to remove them after put it into tVar: on mouseUp open socket theseahaven.com:5500 read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 put it into tvar repeat for each line L in tVar put char 2 to -1 of L cr after nVar end repeat delete last char of nVar --- clear trailing cr put nVar in to field 1 end mouseUp ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Won't that delete the first character you retrieve? On Mar 14, 2005, at 7:08 PM, Mark Smith wrote: on mouseUp open socket theseahaven.com:5500 read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 put it into tvar repeat for each line L in tVar put char 2 to -1 of L cr after nVar end repeat delete last char of nVar --- clear trailing cr put nVar in to field 1 end mouseUp - --- Frank D. Engel, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] $ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual $ true | cat /usr/manual | grep John 3:16 John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. $ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin) iD8DBQFCNi3w7aqtWrR9cZoRAhEoAJ9hfH94f7agikO70ow2Id2erXmYbACdHGdn gvWFlnMqorwXqVOlBMcMqpc= =zKT5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ $0 Web Hosting with up to 120MB web space, 1000 MB Transfer 10 Personalized POP and Web E-mail Accounts, and much more. Signup at www.doteasy.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using sockets
Not only that it repeats the entire page but it does get rid of he box thing the second time around. On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:36:00 -0500, Frank D. Engel, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Won't that delete the first character you retrieve? On Mar 14, 2005, at 7:08 PM, Mark Smith wrote: on mouseUp open socket theseahaven.com:5500 read from socket theseahaven.com:5500 for -1 put it into tvar repeat for each line L in tVar put char 2 to -1 of L cr after nVar end repeat delete last char of nVar --- clear trailing cr put nVar in to field 1 end mouseUp - --- Frank D. Engel, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] $ ln -s /usr/share/kjvbible /usr/manual $ true | cat /usr/manual | grep John 3:16 John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. $ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin) iD8DBQFCNi3w7aqtWrR9cZoRAhEoAJ9hfH94f7agikO70ow2Id2erXmYbACdHGdn gvWFlnMqorwXqVOlBMcMqpc= =zKT5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ $0 Web Hosting with up to 120MB web space, 1000 MB Transfer 10 Personalized POP and Web E-mail Accounts, and much more. Signup at www.doteasy.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
Alex- Tuesday, March 1, 2005, 5:17:54 PM, you wrote: AT There are a few other circumstances where you might want to choose UDP AT rather than TCP, apart from the speed and low overhead cases. Thanks. I wasn't aware that VOIP used UDP. AT (And unfortunately, Rev doesn't support either multicast or PGM). AT (Actually, I think Rev doesn't fully handle broadcast - I can get it to AT send to a local-broadcast address and they are received by other devices AT - but I can't get Rev to receive them ... will experiment some more with AT that later) This explains a lot. I had tried multicasting and decided there was some problem with the network configuration. Tell me about PGM - preferably off-list, since this is starting to get very OT, but I'm posting the request here in case there's other interest. AT 4. Low frequency (or very low frequency) packet exchange. I think I'd still set up a tcp handler for this. In fact, I have. I've worked with remote data collection devices that would send a few packets every hour or so and we've used tcp for the connection. Of course, in that case data loss was very important. AT In general, my advice would be - always use TCP except when you can't. Agreed. -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
On Mar 1, 2005, at 6:17 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote: (Actually, I think Rev doesn't fully handle broadcast - I can get it to send to a local-broadcast address and they are received by other devices - but I can't get Rev to receive them ... will experiment some more with that later) I created a poorman's resource finder in Rev. One of the problems that I found was that on some OSes the broadcast destinations included the sender's computer (Windows and Mac 9.2) but on others it did not (OS X). I assumed this was a unix goof and not Revolution, but I could be wrong. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
Mark Wieder wrote: AT (And unfortunately, Rev doesn't support either multicast or PGM). AT (Actually, I think Rev doesn't fully handle broadcast - I can get it to AT send to a local-broadcast address and they are received by other devices AT - but I can't get Rev to receive them ... will experiment some more with AT that later) This explains a lot. I had tried multicasting and decided there was some problem with the network configuration. Tell me about PGM - preferably off-list, since this is starting to get very OT, but I'm posting the request here in case there's other interest. Rev does support sending either broadcast or multicast - I can send UDP packets to 192.168.0.255 and also to 224.0.0.251 and receive them on my (on-Rev) echo server. But it doesn't support receiving them - there's no access to raw sockets or to setsocketopt(). Thus, there is no way to let the system know which multicast groups are to be received (necessary both to get the system to send / respond to IGMP packets as well as to set the correct bits in the Ethernet driver to receive the packets). (Not sure yet about receiving broadcast) If there's anyone overhearing this and wondering what on earth multicast is, and wanting a techie intro http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/cc/pd/iosw/prodlit/ipimt_ov.htm I'll send you PGM info off-list. -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.3 - Release Date: 01/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
On Mar 2, 2005, at 3:19 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote: (Not sure yet about receiving broadcast) You can receive broadcast. You can't control what IP address you are listening on, though, if you are multihomed. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
Mark Wieder wrote: I normally tend to shy away from using udp, but there are areas where you really need it (working with existing protocols for other apps, etc.). Using udp can also bring up firewall issues. I think of it this way: udp is packet-oriented while tcp is stream-oriented. Udp gives you speed and low overhead but packets aren't guaranteed to arrive. Tcp guarantees that the packets arrive at the destination and arrive in order, but the message can be broken up into an arbitrary number of packets (Elvi shasle ftt hebuil ding). With udp the entire message (if it arrives) is in a single packet. With tcp you have to parse the incoming stream to determine where the information ends. There are a few other circumstances where you might want to choose UDP rather than TCP, apart from the speed and low overhead cases. 1. Data is time-sensitive (or delay-, or jitter-sensitive), but not loss-sensitive Obvious example is streaming audio or video, particularly in real-time or conversational mode. Most audio codecs are designed to be robust in the face of packet loss (e.g. audio samples spread over adjacent packets), but delays (which would be enforced by TCP NAKs and retransmits) are audible (visible) to the users. The most common example of this today is VOIP, and that mostly uses RTP over UDP, rather than over TCP; however, the commercial streaming audio formats are often run over TCP (with bigger buffering to handle TCP-induced delays) because of firewall problems. 2. High bandwidth high latency networks. If you need to deliver large files over high-latency networks such as satellite, the effects of the very high round-trip times can be dramatic, preventing TCP connections from using the full bandwidth in many cases. It may be easier to use UDP in conjunction with a delayed re-transmit mechanism (if you can ensure that the received data isn't used until the retransmit happens later), or with FEC (Forward Error Correction) to allow complete data reception even when some packets are lost. 3. Multicast or Broadcast. TCP can't be used in either multicast or broadcast cases - but UDP can. In most cases where you have multiple receivers, it's clear that TCP is the wrong style of transport, and UDP is more natural. If you really wanted something like TCP but sending to multiple receivers, I'd reckon you want to use PGM rather than rolling your own in UDP (but as a co-author of PGM, I'm biased :-) (And unfortunately, Rev doesn't support either multicast or PGM). (Actually, I think Rev doesn't fully handle broadcast - I can get it to send to a local-broadcast address and they are received by other devices - but I can't get Rev to receive them ... will experiment some more with that later) 4. Low frequency (or very low frequency) packet exchange. For example, if you want to send one packet of info every hour (or every day), then you wouldn't want to keep a TCP connection open (in many cases, you couldn't keep the connection open because of transient problems), and wouldn't want the overhead of opening a TCP connection, sending one packet, and closing the connection again. (Maybe this is just a special case of the low-overhead advantage - but is different in that a single, persistent TCP connection isn't a viable option at all). 5,6,7 . There are others, but we're starting to get into the esoteric cases now. In general, my advice would be - always use TCP except when you can't. -- Alex Tweedly http://www.tweedly.net -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.3 - Release Date: 01/03/2005 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
UDP sockets - again
I think the inconsistency lies in the lack of documentation regarding 'when' to use the 'with message' and 'how' RunRev is calling these (or possibly this is a bug). For example: ## Some of these examples assume an open datagram socket... Write STATUS to socket udpSocket with message getData Or Read from socket udpSocket with message getData Write STATUS to socket udpSocket Or Open datagram socket to udpSocket with message getData Write STATUS to socket udpSocket Or Accept connections on port udpPort with message getData Write STATUS to socket udpSocket The handler getData is not called everytime, and the parameters only have data 'sometimes', but my 'sniffer' shows that my device is ALWAYS responding. What is the appropriate sequence, and WHEN does RunRev call these 'with message' handlers?! I am getting unreliable results using ANYTHING! Logically, you would think that once I instruct the handler to 'read' from a UDP socket whenever it gets data (i.e. I have set the callback handler), it should ALWAYS call this handler when data is received on that open udp socket. Or, when I write data to an open udp socket with a handler message, if the destination socket responds with data, the handler should be called immediately. It does not ALWAYS work this way, but it is close, so I believe there is a problem. I do not have issues with regular sockets, just datagram sockets... Here are my questions that I cannot find an answer to in the documentation: - Once the getData handler is set, how often is it called? - If I write to an open UPD socket with a handler message, is the handler called 'anytime' data is received, or only for that call (i.e. am I setting some internal function pointer)? - Is the data stored somewhere when it is received for retrieval using 'read from socket'? - Is the data accumulated? How large is the buffer? Can I set this? - How many parameters are there for the handlers? - Once I set the callback handler, is it 'always' set? Is it reset when the socket is closed? - If I set a callback handler for ANY call (i.e. open 'with', write 'with', read 'with', accept 'with') is this handler going to be called for ANY data received? I feel like I am shooting in the dark, and I am disappointed that this information is not somewhere in the docs. Withholding this info (for 'Enterprise' or 'RevList' users) does not make me want to upgrade...it makes me want to look somewhere else for solutions. Thanks for any info, John Rule ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: UDP sockets - again
John Rule wrote: I think the inconsistency lies in the lack of documentation regarding 'when' to use the 'with message' and 'how' RunRev is calling these (or possibly this is a bug). For example: The documentation for UDP sockets is pretty sparse (or indeed, totally missing, and trying to use the existing docs is near impossible, because the differences between TCP and UDP sockets are quite significant). Dar Scott provided me with lots of help a while ago - you may find more useful info in the email archives (around September). Summary (of what worked for me - may be other ways) 1.To accept packets from others (i.e. be a server), then you do : -- note this command name is misleading -- for UDP, the accept simply registers this object to receive packets on this port -- and sets up the callback function to call when such a packet arrives repeat for each word W in lPorts accept datagram connections on port W with message gotPacket end repeat and then the handler gotPacket will be called with each arriving packet. In this case here, I simply reply to it .. -- Server mode handlers on gotPacket pHostPort, pData, pSock local tHostPort mylog Packet arrived from pHostPort on my socket pSock mylogcontents: pData open datagram socket to pHostPort write reply with pData to socket pHostPort close socket pHostPort end gotPacket 2. To be a client: -- open datagram socket: UDP is connectionless, so no network activity -- is required for this open - hence it will complete immediately. -- the message callback is used to receive any replies to packets sent over this socket open datagram socket to lHostPort with message gotReplyPacket and then this gotReplyPacket will be called for any packets replied to as above; in my case -- Client mode handlers on gotReplyPacket pOtherOne mylog Packet arrived paramCount() repeat with i=1 to paramCount() mylog i : param(i) end repeat end gotReplyPacket That works for me - though I haven't tested it in any high-stress environment - it's been PC to PC, for chat-like apps, nothing that would send, for instance, a stream of back-to-back packets. The handler getData is not called everytime, and the parameters only have data 'sometimes', but my 'sniffer' shows that my device is ALWAYS responding. What is the appropriate sequence, and WHEN does RunRev call these 'with message' handlers?! I am getting unreliable results using ANYTHING! Logically, you would think that once I instruct the handler to 'read' from a UDP socket whenever it gets data (i.e. I have set the callback handler), it should ALWAYS call this handler when data is received on that open udp socket. I don't have any code that reads from a UDP socket (that's not to say it can't be done - but all my code uses handles as in my examples above). Or, when I write data to an open udp socket with a handler message, if the destination socket responds with data, the handler should be called immediately. It does not ALWAYS work this way, but it is close, so I believe there is a problem. There is no need (and probably no point in having) a with callback on UDP writes. TCP sockets can be blocked because we've reached the maximum number of outstanding bytes, and cannot send any more until the remote system has received (and ACKed) some of what we've already sent; hence there may be a significant delay before the data can be sent - so rather than wait for that, you can pass in the callback handler, continue working and later be told when the data has gone. UDP has no such issues - so the only delay possible would be network buffering (e.g. if you were sending to a very slow line). The call back function in the write should be called immediately - it has nothing to do with the remote system, and nothing to do with any response having been received. I do not have issues with regular sockets, just datagram sockets... Here are my questions that I cannot find an answer to in the documentation: - Once the getData handler is set, how often is it called? Should be called every time a packet is received for that socket - If I write to an open UPD socket with a handler message, is the handler called 'anytime' data is received, or only for that call (i.e. am I setting some internal function pointer)? question doesn't compute data received is passed to the handler specified in either a accept connections or an open datagram socket - Is the data stored somewhere when it is received for retrieval using 'read from socket'? Don't use read from socket :-) - Is the data accumulated? How large is the buffer? Can I set this? No. Presumably, max packet size. No (UDP is datagram oriented - so you send and/or receive single data packets) - How many parameters are there for the handlers? For the getpacket handlers, 3 - host, port, data For the write handler (which I suggest you don't use) - 1 - Once I set the callback handler
Re: UDP sockets - again
On Feb 28, 2005, at 8:29 AM, John Rule wrote: I think the inconsistency lies in the lack of documentation regarding 'when' to use the 'with message' and 'how' RunRev is calling these (or possibly this is a bug). Yes. The docs are wrong for UDP. There is no in-crowd except those who happen to catch the info on lists or find it in responses to bug reports in bugzilla. Or who happened to stumble on it in tinkering. It is also possible to overload a system with UDP datagrams. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets and Windows behavior
On Feb 12, 2005, at 8:36 AM, John Rule wrote: Maybe the problem is in doing broadcast messages in general on Windows (this same code works fine on OSX...Linux is another issue altogether). It doesn't work consistently (I do not always get the callback to my 'with' message, the average is 6 out of 10). Using a 'sniffer', I am ALWAYS getting my response from the devices. It seems like it is just that the messages are not always finding their way back to my callback handler (in Windows XP). Is this a problem, or is there a better way? If the devices are responding to the ip address and port that sent the query, then this might be your problem: The doc is lacking on using UDP. The callback for 'open datagram socket' is not for open. (It would be sent immediately, if it was.) It is for read. Scott Raney says to use that instead of read. If the devices are not responding to the port that sent the broadcast, but to some specific port then I guess the above does not apply; you would be using accept. If the messages are very large or a very large number comes in at once, then Windows will lose some. There are some system parameters that can be tweeked, but I forgot what they are. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets and Windows behavior
On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 15:56:33 -0200, Andre Garzia [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] PS: hum... I think a little network foundations primer would be good... shall we write one? If you do, I'd like to be your first customer! I could not even reliably describe what a socket is (not really even what kind of a concept it is), let alone a datagram... Graham --- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK and France ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: sockets and Windows behavior
On Feb 11, 2005, at 10:48 AM, John Rule wrote: I noticed that when a socket (regular or datagram) is opened to Windows (via my app that is listening on port 1901), an 'alias' port is given instead of the 'real' one. For example, if my external device (computer, PDA, etc.) connects to socket 192.168.77.10:1901 for communications, the actual socket reported is a random number (like 1407), and it changes each time the device connects (incrementally..1408, 1409, 1410). In TCP/IP both TCP and UDP uses the notion of ports. TCP uses connections and might be easier to explain. When computer or device 10.0.0.1 makes a TCP connection to port 1901 on 192.168.77.10, it needs to assign a port on 10.0.0.1. In most socket APIs the program requesting the connection may specify the port to use on 10.0.0.1, however in most cases it does not and the communications system assigns it. The connection if fully specified by the two address-port pairs. Typical socket implementations exploit that and allow multiple connections to a passive (listening) end. Those are all distinct. So a connection (from the view of 10.0.0.1) is specified by this: Remote IP address = 192.168.77.10 Remote port = 1901 Local IP = 10.0.0.1 Local port= 1407 Every IP packet has similar information in the header In Revolution when a connection callback (message) comes in, the IP address and the port of the other end are provided. If the connection is broken (or not, actually) and the other end makes another connection it is likely to be using another port. Ports must wait a short time before they can be reused, so typically systems just go to the next one if a port is not specified. There are cases in which the process opening the port needs to specify the port or at least find out what it is. Unfortunately there is no way to do that in Revolution. For most protocols this is not needed. Since Revolution hides the local port number, if you make multiple connections to the same listener, you need to specify an socket id name or number in the open. On the other hand, Revolution accept has no way to specify the IP address on a multihomed system. If you are listening on both TCP and UDP on the same port number, they can be confused in Revolution. UDP is connectionless, but is often handled as though it is a connection in sockets implementations and especially the view in Revolution. The same concepts apply roughly. (UDP is sort of a stepchild so folks don't worry about getting it right. Windows XP handles UDP errors poorly. Most Unix systems don't broadcast in a way consistent with the intent of UDP; I argue it is wrong.) If I missed what you are getting at, I apologize and will try to target that. Dar -- ** DSC (Dar Scott Consulting Dar's Lab) http://www.swcp.com/dsc/ Programming Services and Software ** ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
