[Videolib] Statement on video streaming

[Carrie Russell]

Judy said: 


One interesting comment in this statement:

"Moreover, educational institutions are likely to use only lawfully made
and acquired copies"

Not if the item which they want to stream is a DVD with protective
encryption, any digitized-for-streaming version of which is illegal."
---
I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted, screen
capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
the last 1201 rulemaking.-Carrie Russell

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Statement on video streaming

[Dennis Doros]

Dear Carrie,

Just to clarify, by video, you mean VHS? That would make sense to me.

Best,
Dennis
Milestone F&V

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 10:41 AM, Carrie Russell wrote:

> Judy said:
>
> 
> One interesting comment in this statement:
>
> "Moreover, educational institutions are likely to use only lawfully made
> and acquired copies"
>
> Not if the item which they want to stream is a DVD with protective
> encryption, any digitized-for-streaming version of which is illegal."
> ---
> I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
> can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
> for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted, screen
> capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
> which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
> the last 1201 rulemaking.-Carrie Russell
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>



-- 
Best,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film & Video/Milliarium Zero
PO Box 128
Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117
Fax: 201-767-3035
email: milefi...@gmail.com
www.milestonefilms.com
www.arayafilm.com
www.exilesfilm.com
www.wordisoutmovie.com
www.killerofsheep.com
AMIA Philadelphia 2010: www.amianet.org
Join "Milestone Film" on Facebook!
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Pilar Miro films

[Karen Ketchaver]

A faculty member asked our library to acquire these films by the Spanish 
director Pilar Miro: "El Crimen de Cuenca," "Gary Cooper, Que Estas en los 
Cielos," "Hablamos Esta Noche," "Tu Nombre Envenena Mis Suenos," "El Pajaro de 
la Felicidad," "La Peticion," "Werther," and "Beltenebros." I found a PAL 
version of "Beltenebros" but have struck out with the others. They seem to have 
been released on VHS in Europe, not in the U.S. 

I'm ready to throw up my hands - anyone have any ideas? Thank you.

Karen G. Ketchaver
Acquisitions Unit Leader
Grasselli Library
John Carroll University
20700 North Park Blvd.
University Hts., Ohio 44118-4581
U.S.A.
(216)397-1622 phone/(216)397-1809 fax  


VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] QUE VIVA MEXICO in the public domain?

[Steffen, James M]

I'm curious about this one...



I came across Eisenstein's QUE VIVA MEXICO in the Internet Archive, listed as a 
"public domain" title:



http://www.archive.org/details/QuevivaMexico



Note that it's the Grigori Alexandrov reconstruction dating from the 1970s, and 
Kino is distributing it on DVD in the U.S. Needless to say, the Internet 
Archive's copy looks lousy compared to the DVD. Mainly, I'm curious as to how 
they could argue that it's in the public domain.



--James


--
James M. Steffen, PhD
Film Studies and Media Librarian
Theater and Dance Subject Liaison
Marian K. Heilbrun Music and Media Library
Emory University
540 Asbury Circle
Atlanta, GA 30322-2870

Phone: (404) 727-8107
FAX: (404) 727-2257
Email: jste...@emory.edu
Web: www.jamesmsteffen.net




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If you have received this message in error, please contact
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VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Digital Streaming

[Lawrence Daressa]

This is a technical question for the list - so please excuse me if I get some 
of the details a little wrong. Newsreel, as most of you know, sells password 
protected streaming rights for many of our titles. We leave it up to library IT 
people to encode a digital file from a DVD and then stream it from a licensor's 
local server its own authentication system and player. This like the best 
approach for now since no single standard for digital delivery exists and since 
many librarians prefer the content to reside on their local server. When 
Newsreel has its own remote server, it may be sufficient for a library simply 
to have a preservation and reference file but for now we rely on local servers.

I'm wondering what  measures you take to insure that content licensed for 
streaming is not being downloaded and then disseminated virally through the 
plethora of file-sharing sites. Already, Newsreel spends an inordinate amount 
of time issuing take-down orders to sites of varying degrees of legitimacy.

I'm especially interested in the solutions implemented by those of you using 
the current version of RealPlayer SP or who allow students to use it. As you 
know, this version offers viewer the option to download any video streaming at 
the time. In fact, this is the player's default setting which appears inside 
the player, so it almost seems to invite illicit downloading.

I realize any streamed video is hackable if a student has the skills, 
motivation and the right shareware - as Google and others found out recently. 
RealPlayer, however, goes out of its way to make it simple to pilfer digital 
content. It once represented itself as the optimal video player for the 
academic market and remains one of the four major digital video players in use 
today.

I know there are ways to encode video for streaming with protections against 
downloading; Flash has programming codes that can be added to video to prevent 
RealPlayer downloads and these are continually updated. Similarly, a short 
forced video clip (like the commercials that precede Hulu offerings) can 
"trick" the player into downloading the clip but not the content.

I'm wondering what methods you are using to insure that the digital content 
you've licensed for streaming isn't being downloaded onto student hard drives, 
IPods, DVDs, etc? Newsreel has compiled several simple techniques for making 
unlicensed downloading more difficult. But I wonder what ones you are currently 
using? Thanks.

Larry

Lawrence Daressa
California Newsreel
500 Third Street, #505
San Francisco, CA  94107
phone: 415.284.7800 x302
fax: 415.284.7801
l...@newsreel.org
www.newsreel.org 

-Original Message-
From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of 
videolib-requ...@lists.berkeley.edu
Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 9:04 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: videolib Digest, Vol 27, Issue 78

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Find me a photo of Jesus (Rubin, Nan)
   2. Re: The Google Book Settlement still isn't settled (Rubin, Nan)
   3. Statement on video streaming (Carrie Russell)
   4. Re: Statement on video streaming (Dennis Doros)
   5. Pilar Miro films (Karen Ketchaver)
   6. QUE VIVA MEXICO in the public domain? (Steffen, James M)


--

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2010 22:57:22 -0500
From: "Rubin, Nan" 
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Find me a photo of Jesus
To: "Association of Moving Image Archivists" ,

Message-ID:
<1f7d97f07e44474c8b2a3dd88e6a5aa00b832...@wnet-xch2.thirteen.org>
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset="us-ascii"



Sent along by Catherine Stimac at Oregon Public Broadcasting, who is
coordinating the American Archive Pilot Project.  On this thoroughly
entertaining short film, she sez "We owe a lot to the archivists,
researchers, producers, preservationists, and all of you! Check out this
NPR story.Brilliant!"

 
http://www.npr.org/blogs/pictureshow/2010/02/find_me_a_photo_of_jesus_an
d_o.html
.

And also from this week's edition of On the Media, a great story
celebrating librarians! 

Brooke Gladstone's interview called "Librarians Gone Wild

http://www.onthemedia.org/transcripts/2010/02/19/08

February 19, 2010

"In her new book, author Marilyn Johnson argues that, even in the Google
age, human beings, namely librarians, are still the best resource for
accurate answers. In fact,

Re: [Videolib] QUE VIVA MEXICO in the public domain?

[Dennis Doros]

Dear James,

First, I didn't find it in the Copyright Office's NIE (Notice of Intention
to Enforce) copyrights that were renewed under GATT. And I don't know
Russian copyright law anymore (it was changing monthly at one point) but
just a few years ago, at least everything up to 1929 was PD in Russia, so it
might include 1931 now.

HOWEVER, I have no proof either way, and a 1970 reconstruction might be
considered a legit "new" copyright under Russian law. And if you go
here
(and
I have only time for a brief look) it seems to say that copyright extends 70
years after the creator, or co-creator's death which would could be seen as
Alexandrov. So it's definitely possible the Internet Archive is wrong.


-- 
Best,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film & Video/Milliarium Zero
PO Box 128
Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117
Fax: 201-767-3035
email: milefi...@gmail.com
www.milestonefilms.com
www.arayafilm.com
www.exilesfilm.com
www.wordisoutmovie.com
www.killerofsheep.com
AMIA Philadelphia 2010: www.amianet.org
Join "Milestone Film" on Facebook!
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] advice please on PPR for PBS

[CROWLEY, CHRISTINE]

We purchased the home video version of a PBS title that is available, I
now find out, in an AV version for a little more money. It would allow
us to show it on Earth Day to a group of students. To whom should I
address a request to get PPR for our copy, to even pay for it? I seem to
recall speaking with someone at PBS years ago regarding this, but I
can't find any contact info now. 

 

Any ideas or suggestions?

 

Lesson learned-we will buy the AV version from now on! 

L

 

Christine Crowley

Dean of Learning Resources

Northwest Vista College

3535 N. Ellison Dr.

San Antonio, TX 78251

210.486.4572 voice

210.486.4504 fax

NEW NAME AND email--ccrowl...@alamo.edu

 

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Pilar Miro films

[Jesus Alonso-Regalado]

Dear Karen,

You can find all those titles in the following Spanish vendor web sites:

http://fnac.es/

http://www.dvdgo.com/

http://www.elcorteingles.es/

http://www.tatarana.net/

Hope this helps.

___
Jesús Alonso-Regalado, Bibliographer
Latin American, Caribbean, and U.S. Latino Studies
Romance Languages, Literatures, and Cultures
___
University Library, LI-204
University at Albany, SUNY
1400 Washington Avenue
Albany, NY 1
Email: jalo...@uamail.albany.edu
Phone: (518) 442-3554
Fax: (518) 442-3567



-Original Message-
From: Karen Ketchaver [mailto:kketcha...@jcu.edu] 
Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 11:54 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Pilar Miro films

A faculty member asked our library to acquire these films by the Spanish 
director Pilar Miro: "El Crimen de Cuenca," "Gary Cooper, Que Estas en los 
Cielos," "Hablamos Esta Noche," "Tu Nombre Envenena Mis Suenos," "El Pajaro de 
la Felicidad," "La Peticion," "Werther," and "Beltenebros." I found a PAL 
version of "Beltenebros" but have struck out with the others. They seem to have 
been released on VHS in Europe, not in the U.S. 

I'm ready to throw up my hands - anyone have any ideas? Thank you.

Karen G. Ketchaver
Acquisitions Unit Leader
Grasselli Library
John Carroll University
20700 North Park Blvd.
University Hts., Ohio 44118-4581
U.S.A.
(216)397-1622 phone/(216)397-1809 fax  




VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Pilar Miro films - STREAMING

[Jesus Alonso-Regalado]

Dear Karen,

You can also find three of them available as streaming in the website below. If 
you contact them, they would provide you with a quote for institutional 
streaming.

http://www.filmotech.com/

___
Jesús Alonso-Regalado, Bibliographer
Latin American, Caribbean, and U.S. Latino Studies 
Romance Languages, Literatures, and Cultures
 ___
University Library, LI-204
University at Albany, SUNY
1400 Washington Avenue
Albany, NY 1
Email: jalo...@uamail.albany.edu
Phone: (518) 442-3554
Fax: (518) 442-3567


-Original Message-
From: Karen Ketchaver [mailto:kketcha...@jcu.edu] 
Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 11:54 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Pilar Miro films

A faculty member asked our library to acquire these films by the Spanish 
director Pilar Miro: "El Crimen de Cuenca," "Gary Cooper, Que Estas en los 
Cielos," "Hablamos Esta Noche," "Tu Nombre Envenena Mis Suenos," "El Pajaro de 
la Felicidad," "La Peticion," "Werther," and "Beltenebros." I found a PAL 
version of "Beltenebros" but have struck out with the others. They seem to have 
been released on VHS in Europe, not in the U.S. 

I'm ready to throw up my hands - anyone have any ideas? Thank you.

Karen G. Ketchaver
Acquisitions Unit Leader
Grasselli Library
John Carroll University
20700 North Park Blvd.
University Hts., Ohio 44118-4581
U.S.A.
(216)397-1622 phone/(216)397-1809 fax  




VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Digital Streaming

[ghandman]

Hi Larry

Well, in the case of the loathsome Real Player, the obvious way to avoid
issues would be to encode in a format which Real can't handle...

As a general principle, however:  if the institution is licensing password
authentication rather than IP authentication (in other words, if the
stream is available to all institutionally validated users from
wherever...) it's virtually impossible to prevent digital shenanigans, if
shenanigans are gonna happen.  Libraries have historically indemnified
themselves by giving clear indication to users of copyright requirements
and restrictions (for example, the CONTU guidelines posted near copying
machines).  Policing copyright use beyond that is almost impossible.

While there are technical workaround to secure files for use by
authenticated users or locations, I've never seen or heard of a fix for
potential piracy...  One hopes that streaming, rather than allowing
downloading, will take care of many of problems, but, as you indicate,
there is no absolute solution at present.

Gary




> This is a technical question for the list - so please excuse me if I get
> some of the details a little wrong. Newsreel, as most of you know, sells
> password protected streaming rights for many of our titles. We leave it up
> to library IT people to encode a digital file from a DVD and then stream
> it from a licensor's local server its own authentication system and
> player. This like the best approach for now since no single standard for
> digital delivery exists and since many librarians prefer the content to
> reside on their local server. When Newsreel has its own remote server, it
> may be sufficient for a library simply to have a preservation and
> reference file but for now we rely on local servers.
>
> I'm wondering what  measures you take to insure that content licensed for
> streaming is not being downloaded and then disseminated virally through
> the plethora of file-sharing sites. Already, Newsreel spends an inordinate
> amount of time issuing take-down orders to sites of varying degrees of
> legitimacy.
>
> I'm especially interested in the solutions implemented by those of you
> using the current version of RealPlayer SP or who allow students to use
> it. As you know, this version offers viewer the option to download any
> video streaming at the time. In fact, this is the player's default setting
> which appears inside the player, so it almost seems to invite illicit
> downloading.
>
> I realize any streamed video is hackable if a student has the skills,
> motivation and the right shareware - as Google and others found out
> recently. RealPlayer, however, goes out of its way to make it simple to
> pilfer digital content. It once represented itself as the optimal video
> player for the academic market and remains one of the four major digital
> video players in use today.
>
> I know there are ways to encode video for streaming with protections
> against downloading; Flash has programming codes that can be added to
> video to prevent RealPlayer downloads and these are continually updated.
> Similarly, a short forced video clip (like the commercials that precede
> Hulu offerings) can "trick" the player into downloading the clip but not
> the content.
>
> I'm wondering what methods you are using to insure that the digital
> content you've licensed for streaming isn't being downloaded onto student
> hard drives, IPods, DVDs, etc? Newsreel has compiled several simple
> techniques for making unlicensed downloading more difficult. But I wonder
> what ones you are currently using? Thanks.
>
> Larry
>
> Lawrence Daressa
> California Newsreel
> 500 Third Street, #505
> San Francisco, CA�� 94107
> phone: 415.284.7800 x302
> fax: 415.284.7801
> l...@newsreel.org
> www.newsreel.org
>
> -Original Message-
> From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu
> [mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of
> videolib-requ...@lists.berkeley.edu
> Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 9:04 AM
> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> Subject: videolib Digest, Vol 27, Issue 78
>
> Send videolib mailing list submissions to
>   videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>   
> https://calmail.berkeley.edu/manage/list/listinfo/videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>   videolib-requ...@lists.berkeley.edu
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>   videolib-ow...@lists.berkeley.edu
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of videolib digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>1. Re: Find me a photo of Jesus (Rubin, Nan)
>2. Re: The Google Book Settlement still isn't settled (Rubin, Nan)
>3. Statement on video streaming (Carrie Russell)
>4. Re: Statement on video streaming (Dennis Doros)
>5. Pilar Miro films (Karen Ketchaver)
>6. QUE VIVA MEXICO in the public domain? (Steffen, James M)
>
>
> --

[Videolib] streaming

[Carrie Russell]

Hello Dennis:
Yes, I meant VHS. 
Cheers! -Carrie
--

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 10:48:44 -0500
From: Dennis Doros 
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Statement on video streaming
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Message-ID:
<2ad8b9eb1002220748h2e6597f7r99f66ee3d6436...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Dear Carrie,

Just to clarify, by video, you mean VHS? That would make sense to me.

Best,
Dennis
Milestone F&V

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 10:41 AM, Carrie Russell
wrote:

> Judy said:
>
> 
> One interesting comment in this statement:
>
> "Moreover, educational institutions are likely to use only lawfully
made
> and acquired copies"
>
> Not if the item which they want to stream is a DVD with protective
> encryption, any digitized-for-streaming version of which is illegal."
> ---
> I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
> can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
> for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted,
screen
> capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
> which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
> the last 1201 rulemaking.-Carrie Russell
>

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] streaming

[Jessica Rosner]

Cue Dennis to tell you really, really crappy that would look ( Beyond the
highly questionable concept of "fair use" allowing the streaming of an
entire copyrighted work).
Now just be my little evil devil's advocate self,f I have a question for
 you Carrie.
Since ALA believes it is legal (or maybe you believe it should be legal) to
stream an entire work to students outside of the actual classroom  does this
mean you will advice Georgia State & UCLA both of whom have backed down, to
NOT settle so this  view could in fact be tested in court?
I mean that is what we all want right? A clear cut legal ruling would
certainly end all this debate.

Jessica

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 1:55 PM, Carrie Russell wrote:

>
> Hello Dennis:
> Yes, I meant VHS.
> Cheers! -Carrie
> --
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 10:48:44 -0500
> From: Dennis Doros 
> Subject: Re: [Videolib] Statement on video streaming
> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> Message-ID:
><2ad8b9eb1002220748h2e6597f7r99f66ee3d6436...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Dear Carrie,
>
> Just to clarify, by video, you mean VHS? That would make sense to me.
>
> Best,
> Dennis
> Milestone F&V
>
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 10:41 AM, Carrie Russell
> wrote:
>
> > Judy said:
> >
> > 
> > One interesting comment in this statement:
> >
> > "Moreover, educational institutions are likely to use only lawfully
> made
> > and acquired copies"
> >
> > Not if the item which they want to stream is a DVD with protective
> > encryption, any digitized-for-streaming version of which is illegal."
> > ---
> > I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
> > can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
> > for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted,
> screen
> > capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
> > which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
> > the last 1201 rulemaking.-Carrie Russell
> >
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] streaming videos for reserves. . .

[Jane Sloan]

Thanks to you all, the brain trust, out there! Very impressive how you 
brought out the main points so quickly and concisely.

Clearly, purchasing rights is preferred -- we have a state portal, 
NJVid,  that is dedicated to serving just that; affordability is the 
issue there.  But I also appreciate those of you who attempt to respond 
reasonably to demand for titles where rights are not available for any 
price.  These are a great concern.  Especially when I think of all the 
feature films used here, it seems like it will be a long time before 
this legitimate demand is met.
I also appreciate those of you who made a clear distinction between 
online courses (yes, they deserve the same resources) and streaming 
reserves as supplements to regular face to face teaching (no, unless 
rights are purchased).

I can tell  you that my charge this year was to offer some kind of video 
streaming operation for course reserves, but now, with the UCLA 
development, my institution wants to wait until the case is settled.   
Too bad that  putting out complete versions has now inhibited even the 
possibility of streaming portions for a limited time.I don't know 
how effective offering up a portion would be;  on the other hand, even 
before the ucla case, there was not a precedent in my library for making 
a whole copy of anything anyway.

So. . .   the very good advice to pursue an internal institutional 
strategy to convince administrators to take a stand on asserting the 
rights of educational users, has, in fact, been set back by this ucla 
case.  I'm at square one again.  There's no doubt copyright law needs 
more attack. On the other  hand, the issue of 'transformative' uses is 
interestingly parlayed here in a new brief some of you may not have seen 
yet 
--http://www.librarycopyrightalliance.org/bm~doc/ibstreamingfilms_021810.pdf.

In the meantime, we and our users wait --

thanks again,
Jane

-- 

Jane Sloan

Media Librarian

732-932-9783 x37

Rutgers University Libraries

*/Please consider the environment before printing this email/*


VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] streaming

[Dennis Doros]

Actually, I just wanted to clarify for people who know that "video" means
everything and anything including DVD, that Carrie meant VHS since it's not
encrypted. As for the technology of streaming, I've written that educators
should be worried not about easy access but about the quality of
presentation so many times that like the great Lilly von Schtupp, well it's
illegal but it's still magnificent
...


Dennis

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 3:10 PM, Jessica Rosner wrote:

> Cue Dennis to tell you really, really crappy that would look ( Beyond the
> highly questionable concept of "fair use" allowing the streaming of an
> entire copyrighted work).
> Now just be my little evil devil's advocate self,f I have a question for
>  you Carrie.
> Since ALA believes it is legal (or maybe you believe it should be legal) to
> stream an entire work to students outside of the actual classroom  does this
> mean you will advice Georgia State & UCLA both of whom have backed down, to
> NOT settle so this  view could in fact be tested in court?
> I mean that is what we all want right? A clear cut legal ruling would
> certainly end all this debate.
>
> Jessica
>
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 1:55 PM, Carrie Russell wrote:
>
>>
>> Hello Dennis:
>> Yes, I meant VHS.
>> Cheers! -Carrie
>> --
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 10:48:44 -0500
>> From: Dennis Doros 
>> Subject: Re: [Videolib] Statement on video streaming
>> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>> Message-ID:
>><2ad8b9eb1002220748h2e6597f7r99f66ee3d6436...@mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> Dear Carrie,
>>
>> Just to clarify, by video, you mean VHS? That would make sense to me.
>>
>> Best,
>> Dennis
>> Milestone F&V
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 10:41 AM, Carrie Russell
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Judy said:
>> >
>> > 
>> > One interesting comment in this statement:
>> >
>> > "Moreover, educational institutions are likely to use only lawfully
>> made
>> > and acquired copies"
>> >
>> > Not if the item which they want to stream is a DVD with protective
>> > encryption, any digitized-for-streaming version of which is illegal."
>> > ---
>> > I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
>> > can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
>> > for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted,
>> screen
>> > capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
>> > which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
>> > the last 1201 rulemaking.-Carrie Russell
>>
>> >
>>
>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>> issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
>> control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
>> libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as
>> an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
>> communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
>> producers and distributors.
>>
>
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>
>


-- 
Best,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film & Video/Milliarium Zero
PO Box 128
Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117
Fax: 201-767-3035
email: milefi...@gmail.com
www.milestonefilms.com
www.arayafilm.com
www.exilesfilm.com
www.wordisoutmovie.com
www.killerofsheep.com
AMIA Philadelphia 2010: www.amianet.org
Join "Milestone Film" on Facebook!
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Jessica's devil's advocate question

[Carrie Russell]

Jessica said: Now just be my little evil devil's advocate self,f I have
a question for
 you Carrie.
Since ALA believes it is legal (or maybe you believe it should be legal)
to
stream an entire work to students outside of the actual classroom  does
this
mean you will advice Georgia State & UCLA both of whom have backed down,
to
NOT settle so this  view could in fact be tested in court?

Carrie says: I will not advise Georgia State, UCLA, or anyone how to
handle their legal situation.  ALA won't either.  What we are saying in
the issue brief is that we believe fair use could apply to the full
screening of films, including screenings that are conducted by
technological means depending on the situation.  The brief describes
that reasoning. 

Jessica said: I mean that is what we all want right? A clear cut legal
ruling would
certainly end all this debate.

Carrie says: I don't think a court ruling would end this debate, in
part, because this is a political debate. Courts don't create rules;
they provide interpretations to guide us. Universities, schools,
librarians and vendors can establish rules if they so choose.

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Jessica's devil's advocate question

[Jessica Rosner]

The court's don't make rules? That is a new one. There is a long history of
law on "fair use" and how it can and  cannot be used. If either UCLA or
Georgia State decided to pursue their case ( my current understanding is
that the publishers are trying to pursue Georgia State which wants the court
to rule that whatever they did before in streaming whole works is irrelevant
because they are not doing it now and won't do it again) and a court rules
that "Fair Use" ( along with claims involving either
"face to face" or the TEACH ACT  do not allow you to stream an entire work,
are you saying that would not be definitive?
If courts don't make rules why are schools buying books or videos at all.
Can't they just download them from bit torrent? There is no doubt that
technology is making it very hard to ENFORCE copyright laws that does not
mean they don't exist.

The idea of "fair use" covering for instance the digitizing and streaming of
an entire feature film is pretty breathtaking in its scope and despite all
sorts of technology questions, I don't think it is really that complicated
of a legal question.

On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Carrie Russell wrote:

> Jessica said: Now just be my little evil devil's advocate self,f I have
> a question for
>  you Carrie.
> Since ALA believes it is legal (or maybe you believe it should be legal)
> to
> stream an entire work to students outside of the actual classroom  does
> this
> mean you will advice Georgia State & UCLA both of whom have backed down,
> to
> NOT settle so this  view could in fact be tested in court?
>
> Carrie says: I will not advise Georgia State, UCLA, or anyone how to
> handle their legal situation.  ALA won't either.  What we are saying in
> the issue brief is that we believe fair use could apply to the full
> screening of films, including screenings that are conducted by
> technological means depending on the situation.  The brief describes
> that reasoning.
>
> Jessica said: I mean that is what we all want right? A clear cut legal
> ruling would
> certainly end all this debate.
>
> Carrie says: I don't think a court ruling would end this debate, in
> part, because this is a political debate. Courts don't create rules;
> they provide interpretations to guide us. Universities, schools,
> librarians and vendors can establish rules if they so choose.
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Fair Use Hockey: NetFlicks 10, Team Education 0

[Randal Baier]

Let's see .. in addition to cell phones, ATMs and iTunes downloads, we 
have managed to get students used to add-on technology fees, extra CDs  
in their textbooks for an extra price, value added enhancements to 
textbooks, at an extra price, special fees for "hybrid courses," which 
meet less often and are basically all web page, all the time, for an 
extra price  so ... why don't we just stop spending so much 
intellectual capital and "what ifs" about fair use and simply have each 
student buy a $36 semester pass to NetFlicks and simply watch whatever 
they want On Demand.


I could probably get the aforementioned fetishized original Metropolis 
if I needed it.


We could even add it to the gym fee and get a gened requirement out of 
the way.


Randal Baier
Eastern Michigan University

The court's don't make rules? That is a new one. There is a long 
history of law on "fair use" and how it can and  cannot be used. If 
either UCLA or Georgia State decided to pursue their case ( my current 
understanding is that the publishers are trying to pursue Georgia 
State which wants the court to rule that whatever they did before in 
streaming whole works is irrelevant because they are not doing it now 
and won't do it again) and a court rules that "Fair Use" ( along with 
claims involving either
"face to face" or the TEACH ACT  do not allow you to stream an entire 
work, are you saying that would not be definitive?
If courts don't make rules why are schools buying books or videos at 
all. Can't they just download them from bit torrent? There is no doubt 
that technology is making it very hard to ENFORCE copyright laws that 
does not mean they don't exist.


The idea of "fair use" covering for instance the digitizing and 
streaming of an entire feature film is pretty breathtaking in its 
scope and despite all sorts of technology questions, I don't think it 
is really that complicated of a legal question.


On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Carrie Russell > wrote:


Jessica said: Now just be my little evil devil's advocate self,f I
have
a question for
 you Carrie.
Since ALA believes it is legal (or maybe you believe it should be
legal)
to
stream an entire work to students outside of the actual classroom
 does
this
mean you will advice Georgia State & UCLA both of whom have backed
down,
to
NOT settle so this  view could in fact be tested in court?

Carrie says: I will not advise Georgia State, UCLA, or anyone how to
handle their legal situation.  ALA won't either.  What we are
saying in
the issue brief is that we believe fair use could apply to the full
screening of films, including screenings that are conducted by
technological means depending on the situation.  The brief describes
that reasoning.

Jessica said: I mean that is what we all want right? A clear cut legal
ruling would
certainly end all this debate.

Carrie says: I don't think a court ruling would end this debate, in
part, because this is a political debate. Courts don't create rules;
they provide interpretations to guide us. Universities, schools,
librarians and vendors can establish rules if they so choose.

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion
of issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of
current and evolving video formats in libraries and related
institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
communication between libraries,educational institutions, and
video producers and distributors.




VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.
  


VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Streaming Entire Films

[Carl Johnson]

>From another list...


Below is a link to a document ARL released on Friday analyzing the copyright 
implications of streaming entire films to students outside of the classroom. 
The document was prompted by the well-publicized dispute between UCLA and AIME, 
but it discusses the issue at a higher level of generality, explaining some of 
the factors that could make a variety of uses more or less likely to fall under 
one of three exceptions in the Copyright Act. The authors (Jonathan Band, Peter 
Jaszi, Kenneth Crews, and I) conclude that fair use provides the strongest 
protection for streaming, with Sections 110(1) and 110(2) (the TEACH Act) also 
arguably providing protection, depending on the circumstances.

The document can be found here: 
http://www.arl.org/news/pr/Streaming-Films-19feb10.shtml

We hope this guidance will help institutions to explore their rights and assert 
them strongly where possible, as actual practice can have a significant impact 
on the shape of evolving rights, especially fair use. We hope you all will find 
this document interesting and useful as you consider these very thorny 
questions!

Best,
Brandon

Brandon Butler | Law & Policy Fellow | Association of Research Libraries | 
bran...@arl.org | w: 202.296.2296 x156 | m: 202.684.6030 | 21 Dupont Circle, DC

-Original Message-
From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of 
videolib-requ...@lists.berkeley.edu
Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 1:53 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: videolib Digest, Vol 27, Issue 81

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: streaming videos for reserves. . . (Jane Sloan)
   2. Re: streaming (Dennis Doros)
   3. Jessica's devil's advocate question (Carrie Russell)
   4. Re: Jessica's devil's advocate question (Jessica Rosner)
   5. Fair Use Hockey: NetFlicks 10, Team Education 0 (Randal Baier)


--

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 15:09:17 -0500
From: Jane Sloan 
Subject: Re: [Videolib] streaming videos for reserves. . .
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Message-ID: <4b82e46d.1060...@rci.rutgers.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Thanks to you all, the brain trust, out there! Very impressive how you
brought out the main points so quickly and concisely.

Clearly, purchasing rights is preferred -- we have a state portal,
NJVid,  that is dedicated to serving just that; affordability is the
issue there.  But I also appreciate those of you who attempt to respond
reasonably to demand for titles where rights are not available for any
price.  These are a great concern.  Especially when I think of all the
feature films used here, it seems like it will be a long time before
this legitimate demand is met.
I also appreciate those of you who made a clear distinction between
online courses (yes, they deserve the same resources) and streaming
reserves as supplements to regular face to face teaching (no, unless
rights are purchased).

I can tell  you that my charge this year was to offer some kind of video
streaming operation for course reserves, but now, with the UCLA
development, my institution wants to wait until the case is settled.
Too bad that  putting out complete versions has now inhibited even the
possibility of streaming portions for a limited time.I don't know
how effective offering up a portion would be;  on the other hand, even
before the ucla case, there was not a precedent in my library for making
a whole copy of anything anyway.

So. . .   the very good advice to pursue an internal institutional
strategy to convince administrators to take a stand on asserting the
rights of educational users, has, in fact, been set back by this ucla
case.  I'm at square one again.  There's no doubt copyright law needs
more attack. On the other  hand, the issue of 'transformative' uses is
interestingly parlayed here in a new brief some of you may not have seen
yet
--http://www.librarycopyrightalliance.org/bm~doc/ibstreamingfilms_021810.pdf.

In the meantime, we and our users wait --

thanks again,
Jane

--

Jane Sloan

Media Librarian

732-932-9783 x37

Rutgers University Libraries

*/Please consider the environment before printing this email/*




--

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 15:24:30 -0500
From: Dennis Doros 
Subject: Re: [Videolib] streaming
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Message-ID:
<

Re: [Videolib] Streaming Entire Films

[Heather Cleary]

I've come up with a _hypothetical situation_ where it would be
beneficial to stream an entire film:

5 instructors teach a common course with a common syllabus. One week
they are supposed to show a clip from the same documentary. The
instructors, however, can choose which scene(s) to show in class. None
of them are going to show the entire video. 

Using snippets in the classroom would fall under fair use and the TEACH
Act. We could provide a streaming video of each scene, which would take
a lot of time and energy and possibly result in duplication of effort
and frustration in the classroom. Or, we could stream the entire film
and let each instructor "queue" their preferred clip during class. 

Granted, the latter action would be geared to make _my_ workload less
onerous as well as to make it less confusing for the instructors. Note
that we are not streaming videos at Otis, but I am investigating how to
implement it effectively in the future. 

Now I have to go read the report mentioned below...

Heather Cleary
Digital Projects and Metadata Librarian
Otis College of Art and Design
9045 Lincoln Boulevard, Los Angeles, California 90045
Phone 310 665 6926 
Website http://blogs.otis.edu/vrclib/   
Email hcle...@otis.edu 

-Original Message-
From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Carl Johnson
Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 1:47 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Streaming Entire Films


>From another list...


Below is a link to a document ARL released on Friday analyzing the
copyright implications of streaming entire films to students outside of
the classroom. The document was prompted by the well-publicized dispute
between UCLA and AIME, but it discusses the issue at a higher level of
generality, explaining some of the factors that could make a variety of
uses more or less likely to fall under one of three exceptions in the
Copyright Act. The authors (Jonathan Band, Peter Jaszi, Kenneth Crews,
and I) conclude that fair use provides the strongest protection for
streaming, with Sections 110(1) and 110(2) (the TEACH Act) also arguably
providing protection, depending on the circumstances.

The document can be found here:
http://www.arl.org/news/pr/Streaming-Films-19feb10.shtml

We hope this guidance will help institutions to explore their rights and
assert them strongly where possible, as actual practice can have a
significant impact on the shape of evolving rights, especially fair use.
We hope you all will find this document interesting and useful as you
consider these very thorny questions!

Best,
Brandon

Brandon Butler | Law & Policy Fellow | Association of Research Libraries
| bran...@arl.org | w: 202.296.2296 x156 | m: 202.684.6030 | 21 Dupont
Circle, DC

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Statement on video streaming

[Shoaf,Judith P]

"I say: This is true only to an extent. If a DVD is encrypted, the user
can use the video version of the title (if available), and digitize it
for the classroom stream.  In addition, if the DVD is encrypted, screen
capture software could be used (although the quality would suffer)
which the Copyright Office offered as a lawful alternative to DeCSS at
the last 1201 rulemaking."-Carrie Russell


Oh, yeah, there might be legal alternatives to an encrypted DVD version. I just 
don't think this position paper even begins to consider them. Its spirit seems 
to be, if we can show this particular DVD in the classroom, then it is legal to 
show it, by whatever means necessary, online. I don't like the statement 
because it ignores both the words of the rule and the technological details. 
--Judy Shoaf
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.