Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Steinhoff, Cindy]

Agree!!!  Getting funding to travel to conferences is becoming more difficult 
for many of us, especially those at smaller institutions.

Cindy Steinhoff
Anne Arundel Community College
Arnold, MD

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Sarah E. McCleskey
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 1:45 PM
To: 'videolib@lists.berkeley.edu'
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Yes, I agree that a WebEx or another remote conferencing tool would be great. 
Thanks for the feedback so far. I think this is something that we can do.

Sarah

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu> 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jodie Borgerding
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 1:20 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

I can’t make it to NMM either but my university has a WebEx license so I would 
be more than happy to “host” a discussion.

Jodie



Jodie L. Borgerding, M.L.S.
Instruction and Liaison Librarian
Emerson Library
Webster University
470 E. Lockwood
St. Louis, MO  63119
(314) 246-7819
jborgerdin...@webster.edu<mailto:jborgerdin...@webster.edu>
http://libguides.webster.edu/soc
http://libguides.webster.edu/english
http://libguides.webster.edu/zombies

“Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He stares them down until he gets the 
information he wants.”

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu> 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Hooper, Lisa K
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:12 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Yes! I can’t make it to NMM this year but would love to be a part of this 
discussion!
-lisa H.

Music & Media Librarian
Howard-Tilton Memorial Library
Tulane University
504.314.7822
@lkHMusLibrarian
www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenter<http://www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenter>
http://www.library.tulane.edu/libraries/mmc
http://bamboulanola.tumblr.com/



From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu> 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of scott spicer
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:07 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

I concur, an update to the Summit "5 years on" would be a great idea.  
Unfortunately, there are many like myself who are unable to attend.  If we do 
have this forum, my guidance would be to seek some kind of mechanism for remote 
live participation if at all possible (e.g., Hangout, Skype, WebEx, etc..) for 
at least part of the discussion.
Best,
Scott

--
Scott Spicer
Media Outreach and Learning Spaces Librarian
University of Minnesota Libraries - Twin Cities
341 Walter Library
spic0...@umn.edu<mailto:spic0...@umn.edu>612.626.0629
Media Services: lib.umn.edu/media<http://lib.umn.edu/media>
SMART Learning Commons: lib.umn.edu/smart<http://lib.umn.edu/smart>



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Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Jessica Rosner]

One final note, as if on cue there was a posting of ALA sponsored webinar
on impact of recent copyright cases to be run by someone from The
Electronic Frontier Foundation. EFF does many good things but they are not
the not exactly a unbiased source for copyright law. To me this just
continues the one sided and often inaccurate information in these type of
webinars, sessions etc. ALA and other groups really need to reach out to
rights holders, filmmakers and intellectual property lawyers with differing
views to get an honest assessment. I find it hard to believe a library
group would sponsor a session on say best streaming services and have it
run by Netflix and have no one from any other service but to me this seems
the same thing.

On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 9:32 AM, Threatt, Monique Louise <
mthre...@indiana.edu> wrote:

> I totally agree with you, Jessica.
> For those of us who were able to attend the various ALA sessions in the
> past (sponsored by VRT) with Carrie, Patricia, and their lawyer, it’s still
> amazes me that we find ourselves going around and around in circles about
> this very issue. Perhaps, there are no solutions to this dilemma.
>
>
>
> And, I’d like to stress that vendors have their hands tied in the types of
> films, and rights that they can legally license to academic institutions.
> Vendors are not the problem.
>
>
>
> If only institutions could legally partner with Amazon on Demand, Netflix,
> Hulu, iTunes, and other popular sites, then what a wonderful world this
> would be. J  Disney, are you listening? **sighs**
>
>
>
> On the other hand, this thread makes me want to explore other national
> conferences where *all *parties are represented and not just the usual
> suspects.
>
>
>
> Is anyone aware if these types of topics/panel discussions are held at
> independent film festivals where you are likely to engage in conversations
> with independent filmmakers?
>
>
>
> Mo
>
>
>
> *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
> videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Jessica Rosner
> *Sent:* Friday, August 28, 2015 7:41 AM
>
> *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
> question: American Playhouse Films
>
>
>
> Dennis does a great job covering copyright issues here  but I think in
> order to add real balance to the discussion of copyright, fair use &
> streaming issues the academic community (and here I am thinking more ALA
> than NMM) needs to reach out and include lawyers who can present the view
> of major rights holders. I agree with Dennis that many of them ( MPAA cough
> cough) are pretty clueless but it is essential they participate in these
> discussions be they webinars or sessions at ALA and NMM. I can think of one
> terrific intellectual property lawyer who did participate in the one
> conference  that did invite major rights holders ( the one at Columbia a
> few years ago). He has represented both non profits and major rights
> holders and knows more about the state of copyright , fair use etc than
> anyone I can think of. However his day job is at a very high end law film
> so I don't know if he could attend something like NMM but you never know.
> It is however crucial in my view that ALA  and the academic community
> outreach to large rights holders and invite them to participate in these
> ongoing copyright "events" because by an large you are still getting a very
> one sided opinion and it is somewhat shocking that the library community in
> particular would not make an effort to get differing opinions.
>
> PS I am happy to pass on whatever contacts I have to folks setting up any
> type of copyright on or offline session.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 3:37 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise <
> mthre...@indiana.edu> wrote:
>
> Yaaay!
>
>
>
> *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
> videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Dennis Doros
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 3:35 PM
>
>
> *To:* Video Library questions <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
> *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
> question: American Playhouse Films
>
>
>
> Thanks, Mo!
>
>
>
> Maureen and I slayed NMM back in Nevada. Well, not literally. I mean,
> that's possibly worse than copyright infringement. At best, it's impolite.
> But we had a good time presenting. :-)
>
>
> Best regards,
> Dennis Doros
> Milestone Film & Video
> PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
> Phone: 201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035 / Email: milefi...@gmail.com
>
>
>
> Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.com
>
> Visit our new websites!

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Jessica Rosner]

Dennis does a great job covering copyright issues here  but I think in
order to add real balance to the discussion of copyright, fair use 
streaming issues the academic community (and here I am thinking more ALA
than NMM) needs to reach out and include lawyers who can present the view
of major rights holders. I agree with Dennis that many of them ( MPAA cough
cough) are pretty clueless but it is essential they participate in these
discussions be they webinars or sessions at ALA and NMM. I can think of one
terrific intellectual property lawyer who did participate in the one
conference  that did invite major rights holders ( the one at Columbia a
few years ago). He has represented both non profits and major rights
holders and knows more about the state of copyright , fair use etc than
anyone I can think of. However his day job is at a very high end law film
so I don't know if he could attend something like NMM but you never know.
It is however crucial in my view that ALA  and the academic community
outreach to large rights holders and invite them to participate in these
ongoing copyright events because by an large you are still getting a very
one sided opinion and it is somewhat shocking that the library community in
particular would not make an effort to get differing opinions.

PS I am happy to pass on whatever contacts I have to folks setting up any
type of copyright on or offline session.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 3:37 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:

 Yaaay!



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Dennis Doros
 *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 3:35 PM

 *To:* Video Library questions videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 Thanks, Mo!



 Maureen and I slayed NMM back in Nevada. Well, not literally. I mean,
 that's possibly worse than copyright infringement. At best, it's impolite.
 But we had a good time presenting. :-)


 Best regards,
 Dennis Doros
 Milestone Film  Video
 PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
 Phone: 201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035 / Email: milefi...@gmail.com



 Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.com

 Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.com, www.portraitofjason.com,
 www.shirleyclarkefilms.com,

 To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click here
 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573
 !



 Support Milestone Film on Facebook
 http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and Twitter
 https://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!



 On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
 mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:

 Dennis,



 I hope the NMM Board will consider you to be its guest speaker, or at
 least panel presenter at the 2016 NMM! J



 I also look forward to seeing your film in the near future.



 Best,

 Mo



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Dennis Doros
 *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 11:23 AM
 *To:* Video Library questions videolib@lists.berkeley.edu


 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 And I too have to send my regrets, but as those on our mailing list know,
 Amy and I have produced our first feature film ever (
 http://filmbysamuelbeckett.com/) --ironically, some of it's based on fair
 use -- and it's having it's world premiere on October 17th. To be honest,
 my travel these days is mostly regarding the politics and laws to save
 films, the fight to preserve ALL materials (outtakes and unknown films
 along with digital-born works are being left behind), and any of my
 knowledge of copyright is just an outgrowth of those efforts. Distribution
 allows me to afford to do that.



 I do agree with Jessica that *most* of these meetings on fair use have
 been unbalanced without representatives of rights holders present and
 there's a lot of wringing of hands over the perceived strength of the
 copyright holders. The reality is that with the internet, copyright
 infringement is so vast that the rights holders have almost zero control of
 their materials these days. And most studios are afraid to sue over new
 technology uses because they are afraid of losing. And they're fairly
 ignorant on copyright as it turns out. (I hear about their meetings and
 it's not impressive.) The multitude of copyright laws across the world also
 create further confusion.



 BUT -- I've stayed with this listserv for many years and have waged
 battles, expressed sympathy and celebrated triumphs with many of you (
 *still* waiting for that Cubs miracle) because I do believe that this is
 the best forum for discussing our differences. I do have a life long love
 of librarians as the keepers of culture. (Though to be brutally honest, if
 you truly believe you

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Threatt, Monique Louise]

I totally agree with you, Jessica.
For those of us who were able to attend the various ALA sessions in the past 
(sponsored by VRT) with Carrie, Patricia, and their lawyer, it’s still amazes 
me that we find ourselves going around and around in circles about this very 
issue.
Perhaps, there are no solutions to this dilemma.

And, I’d like to stress that vendors have their hands tied in the types of 
films, and rights that they can legally license to academic institutions.  
Vendors are not the problem.

If only institutions could legally partner with Amazon on Demand, Netflix, 
Hulu, iTunes, and other popular sites, then what a wonderful world this would 
be. ☺  Disney, are you listening? *sighs*

On the other hand, this thread makes me want to explore other national 
conferences where all parties are represented and not just the usual suspects.

Is anyone aware if these types of topics/panel discussions are held at 
independent film festivals where you are likely to engage in conversations with 
independent filmmakers?

Mo

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jessica Rosner
Sent: Friday, August 28, 2015 7:41 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Dennis does a great job covering copyright issues here  but I think in order to 
add real balance to the discussion of copyright, fair use  streaming issues 
the academic community (and here I am thinking more ALA than NMM) needs to 
reach out and include lawyers who can present the view of major rights holders. 
I agree with Dennis that many of them ( MPAA cough cough) are pretty clueless 
but it is essential they participate in these discussions be they webinars or 
sessions at ALA and NMM. I can think of one terrific intellectual property 
lawyer who did participate in the one conference  that did invite major rights 
holders ( the one at Columbia a few years ago). He has represented both non 
profits and major rights holders and knows more about the state of copyright , 
fair use etc than anyone I can think of. However his day job is at a very high 
end law film so I don't know if he could attend something like NMM but you 
never know. It is however crucial in my view that ALA  and the academic 
community outreach to large rights holders and invite them to participate in 
these ongoing copyright events because by an large you are still getting a 
very one sided opinion and it is somewhat shocking that the library community 
in particular would not make an effort to get differing opinions.
PS I am happy to pass on whatever contacts I have to folks setting up any type 
of copyright on or offline session.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 3:37 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edumailto:mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:
Yaaay!

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu]
 On Behalf Of Dennis Doros
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 3:35 PM

To: Video Library questions 
videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Thanks, Mo!

Maureen and I slayed NMM back in Nevada. Well, not literally. I mean, that's 
possibly worse than copyright infringement. At best, it's impolite. But we had 
a good time presenting. :-)

Best regards,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film  Video
PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117tel:201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035tel:201-767-3035 / 
Email: milefi...@gmail.commailto:milefi...@gmail.com

Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.comhttp://www.milestonefilms.com/
Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.comhttp://www.mspresents.com, 
www.portraitofjason.comhttp://www.portraitofjason.com, 
www.shirleyclarkefilms.comhttp://www.shirleyclarkefilms.com/,
To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click 
herehttps://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573!

Support Milestone Film on 
Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and 
Twitterhttps://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edumailto:mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:
Dennis,

I hope the NMM Board will consider you to be its guest speaker, or at least 
panel presenter at the 2016 NMM! ☺

I also look forward to seeing your film in the near future.

Best,
Mo

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu]
 On Behalf Of Dennis Doros
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 11:23 AM
To: Video Library questions 
videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu

Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Threatt, Monique Louise]

Dennis,

I hope the NMM Board will consider you to be its guest speaker, or at least 
panel presenter at the 2016 NMM! ☺

I also look forward to seeing your film in the near future.

Best,
Mo

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Doros
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 11:23 AM
To: Video Library questions videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

And I too have to send my regrets, but as those on our mailing list know, Amy 
and I have produced our first feature film ever 
(http://filmbysamuelbeckett.com/) --ironically, some of it's based on fair use 
-- and it's having it's world premiere on October 17th. To be honest, my travel 
these days is mostly regarding the politics and laws to save films, the fight 
to preserve ALL materials (outtakes and unknown films along with digital-born 
works are being left behind), and any of my knowledge of copyright is just an 
outgrowth of those efforts. Distribution allows me to afford to do that.

I do agree with Jessica that most of these meetings on fair use have been 
unbalanced without representatives of rights holders present and there's a lot 
of wringing of hands over the perceived strength of the copyright holders. The 
reality is that with the internet, copyright infringement is so vast that the 
rights holders have almost zero control of their materials these days. And most 
studios are afraid to sue over new technology uses because they are afraid of 
losing. And they're fairly ignorant on copyright as it turns out. (I hear about 
their meetings and it's not impressive.) The multitude of copyright laws across 
the world also create further confusion.

BUT -- I've stayed with this listserv for many years and have waged battles, 
expressed sympathy and celebrated triumphs with many of you (still waiting for 
that Cubs miracle) because I do believe that this is the best forum for 
discussing our differences. I do have a life long love of librarians as the 
keepers of culture. (Though to be brutally honest, if you truly believe you are 
preservationists, you would be participating in AMIA and attend their events 
because the preservation world in regards to multimedia is changing rapidly. 
Did you know that polyester mag tracks are now threatened? That was last week's 
news at The Reel Thing.) So, if we could discuss a 2016 NMM meeting, I'd love 
to come out and work with you all on a platform where institutional budgets and 
rights holder interests can be debated and a statement of best practices can be 
made.


Best regards,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film  Video
PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117tel:201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035tel:201-767-3035 / 
Email: milefi...@gmail.commailto:milefi...@gmail.com

Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.comhttp://www.milestonefilms.com/
Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.comhttp://www.mspresents.com, 
www.portraitofjason.comhttp://www.portraitofjason.com, 
www.shirleyclarkefilms.comhttp://www.shirleyclarkefilms.com/,
To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click 
herehttps://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573!

Support Milestone Film on 
Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and 
Twitterhttps://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Jessica Rosner 
jessicapros...@gmail.commailto:jessicapros...@gmail.com wrote:
Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings up 
what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and streaming at 
educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on colib for webinars, 
sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only once did I see one which 
actually included a representative of a major\ rights holders. I am happy to be 
corrected as I don't follow every listing but it seems like the same experts 
from either universities or people from organizations often hostile to rights 
holders involved. Not my favorite group but has anyone from MPAA ever been 
involved. or from a major studio or company? Dennis and I poke our heads in 
here but without the participation of an intellectual property lawyer it 
strikes me that too much takes place in vacuum with only one view represented

The other huge problem is that the issue of what constitutes fair use in 
streaming is totally separate from tracking down the right holder. The plain 
fact is that there tens of thousands of films for which you simply can not 
obtain the streaming rights. There are massive numbers of film that have no 
current US distribution but the all except the small number of PD titles have 
rights holders. Those made outside the US may never have had US distribution , 
others may have in the past but the contract has expired and reverted back to 
someone outside the US

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Threatt, Monique Louise]

Good points, Jessica.

I would want to participate in a forum with all parties involved.

Another huge problem is, as you post, tracking down right holders for 
international films.  *sighs*

Best,
Mo

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jessica Rosner
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 10:46 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings up 
what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and streaming at 
educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on colib for webinars, 
sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only once did I see one which 
actually included a representative of a major\ rights holders. I am happy to be 
corrected as I don't follow every listing but it seems like the same experts 
from either universities or people from organizations often hostile to rights 
holders involved. Not my favorite group but has anyone from MPAA ever been 
involved. or from a major studio or company? Dennis and I poke our heads in 
here but without the participation of an intellectual property lawyer it 
strikes me that too much takes place in vacuum with only one view represented

The other huge problem is that the issue of what constitutes fair use in 
streaming is totally separate from tracking down the right holder. The plain 
fact is that there tens of thousands of films for which you simply can not 
obtain the streaming rights. There are massive numbers of film that have no 
current US distribution but the all except the small number of PD titles have 
rights holders. Those made outside the US may never have had US distribution , 
others may have in the past but the contract has expired and reverted back to 
someone outside the US. They are difficult but not impossible to track down but 
frankly in the majority of cases they are not interested in making a deal for 
one film for one institution. Its a bitch but it is their right. Likewise a lot 
of American indie films have expired contracts and have pretty much identical 
issues with the foreign films. Even if you find the rights holder there is 
reasonable chance especially with a film older than 10 years that they do not 
own those rights because the were not in the original contract and require 
getting permission and paying multiple parties. Fun stuff.
On the positive side streaming is something most rights holders want to offer 
so they are usually aggressively working on it but there can be all kinds of 
legal, financial and technical issues that they have to clear.
I think librarians need to make a concerted effort to fulfill a streaming 
request but at the same time they also have to accept and get the instructor to 
accept that not every film can be streamed and they might have to consider 
options like a different title or actually having students watch it on a DVD ( 
if you have a legal copy of that)
Librarians and rights holders should absolutely be working together on these 
issues. Clearly if a rights holder has to surmount  costly issues to make a 
film available for streaming then knowing libraries want to purchase it will 
help. I think accessing feature films at least through Hulu, Amazon, Fandor etc 
is honestly more practical in many cases at least for films that played in 
theaters not those made or focused on the educational market
Bottom line educational institutions and rights holders must work together but 
it needs to be broader group of rights holders  and instructors need to 
understand that they can't stream every film they might want.
Jessica

On Wed, Aug 26, 2015 at 1:45 PM, Sarah E. McCleskey 
sarah.e.mccles...@hofstra.edumailto:sarah.e.mccles...@hofstra.edu wrote:
Yes, I agree that a WebEx or another remote conferencing tool would be great. 
Thanks for the feedback so far. I think this is something that we can do.

Sarah

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu]
 On Behalf Of Jodie Borgerding
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 1:20 PM

To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

I can’t make it to NMM either but my university has a WebEx license so I would 
be more than happy to “host” a discussion.

Jodie



Jodie L. Borgerding, M.L.S.
Instruction and Liaison Librarian
Emerson Library
Webster University
470 E. Lockwood
St. Louis, MO  63119
(314) 246-7819tel:%28314%29%20246-7819
jborgerdin...@webster.edumailto:jborgerdin...@webster.edu
http://libguides.webster.edu/soc
http://libguides.webster.edu/english
http://libguides.webster.edu/zombies

“Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Dennis Doros]

 of legal, financial and technical issues that they have to clear.

 I think librarians need to make a concerted effort to fulfill a streaming
 request but at the same time they also have to accept and get the
 instructor to accept that not every film can be streamed and they might
 have to consider options like a different title or actually having students
 watch it on a DVD ( if you have a legal copy of that)

 Librarians and rights holders should absolutely be working together on
 these issues. Clearly if a rights holder has to surmount  costly issues to
 make a film available for streaming then knowing libraries want to purchase
 it will help. I think accessing feature films at least through Hulu,
 Amazon, Fandor etc is honestly more practical in many cases at least for
 films that played in theaters not those made or focused on the educational
 market

 Bottom line educational institutions and rights holders must work together
 but it needs to be broader group of rights holders  and instructors need to
 understand that they can't stream every film they might want.

 Jessica

 On Wed, Aug 26, 2015 at 1:45 PM, Sarah E. McCleskey 
 sarah.e.mccles...@hofstra.edu wrote:

 Yes, I agree that a WebEx or another remote conferencing tool would be
 great. Thanks for the feedback so far. I think this is something that we
 can do.



 Sarah



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Jodie Borgerding
 *Sent:* Wednesday, August 26, 2015 1:20 PM

 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 I can’t make it to NMM either but my university has a WebEx license so I
 would be more than happy to “host” a discussion.



 Jodie



 



 Jodie L. Borgerding, M.L.S.

 Instruction and Liaison Librarian

 Emerson Library

 Webster University

 470 E. Lockwood

 St. Louis, MO  63119

 (314) 246-7819

 jborgerdin...@webster.edu

 http://libguides.webster.edu/soc

 http://libguides.webster.edu/english

 http://libguides.webster.edu/zombies



 “Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He stares them down until he gets the
 information he wants.”



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [
 mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Hooper, Lisa K
 *Sent:* Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:12 PM
 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 Yes! I can’t make it to NMM this year but would *love* to be a part of
 this discussion!

 -lisa H.



 Music  Media Librarian

 Howard-Tilton Memorial Library

 Tulane University

 504.314.7822

 @lkHMusLibrarian

 www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenter

 http://www.library.tulane.edu/libraries/mmc

 http://bamboulanola.tumblr.com/







 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [
 mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *scott spicer
 *Sent:* Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:07 PM
 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 I concur, an update to the Summit 5 years on would be a great idea.
 Unfortunately, there are many like myself who are unable to attend.  If we
 do have this forum, my guidance would be to seek some kind of mechanism for
 remote live participation if at all possible (e.g., Hangout, Skype, WebEx,
 etc..) for at least part of the discussion.

 Best,

 Scott


 --

 Scott Spicer
 Media Outreach and Learning Spaces Librarian
 University of Minnesota Libraries - Twin Cities
 341 Walter Library
 spic0...@umn.edu612.626.0629
 Media Services: lib.umn.edu/media
 SMART Learning Commons: lib.umn.edu/smart

 VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
 issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
 control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
 libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as
 an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
 communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
 producers and distributors.




 --
 Jessica Rosner
 Media Consultant
 224-545-3897 (cell)
 212-627-1785 (land line)
 jessicapros...@gmail.com

 VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
 issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
 control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
 libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as
 an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
 communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
 producers and distributors.


VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Jessica Rosner]

ugh NO interest in licensing not KNOW

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Jessica Rosner maddux2...@gmail.com
wrote:

 It is very hard to track down international films but with a lot of work
 you can usually find rights holder. I honestly think the bigger problem is
 that even if you find the rights holder they are likely to have know
 interest in licensing the film to you as their goal is to have a US
 distributor.
 Many years ago on an utterly unrelated rights issue a major ( studio)
 rights holder told a small company wanting to license a film for VHS ( yes
 that long ago) that the studio was never going to put out itself that It
 will cost more money for our lawyers to read the contract than we will ever
 make . That sounds nasty but it happens to be true. Now every once in a
 while there is a happy story ( I remember putting someone in touch with the
 director of Quartier Mozart and he owned the rights himself and was happy
 to make a deal) but more often it is like the reaction above and again it
 is actually true that for a company like Gaumont,Bavaria or Universal it
 would be too expensive to license a single title to an institution and it
 gets worse for situations where you have made for TV, or indie older films
 or other types for which streaming is not even available unless the entire
 contract is redone

 Honestly I would just skip trying to get streaming rights and focus on
 seeing if you can find a legal DVD import to put on reserve and have the
 equipment to play it on.

 On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 11:22 AM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
 mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:

 Good points, Jessica.



 I would want to participate in a forum with all parties involved.



 Another huge problem is, as you post, tracking down right holders for
 international films.  **sighs**



 Best,

 Mo



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Jessica Rosner
 *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 10:46 AM

 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings
 up what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and
 streaming at educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on
 colib for webinars, sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only
 once did I see one which actually included a representative of a major\
 rights holders. I am happy to be corrected as I don't follow every listing
 but it seems like the same experts from either universities or people
 from organizations often hostile to rights holders involved. Not my
 favorite group but has anyone from MPAA ever been involved. or from a major
 studio or company? Dennis and I poke our heads in here but without the
 participation of an intellectual property lawyer it strikes me that too
 much takes place in vacuum with only one view represented



 The other huge problem is that the issue of what constitutes fair use
 in streaming is totally separate from tracking down the right holder. The
 plain fact is that there tens of thousands of films for which you simply
 can not obtain the streaming rights. There are massive numbers of film that
 have no current US distribution but the all except the small number of PD
 titles have rights holders. Those made outside the US may never have had US
 distribution , others may have in the past but the contract has expired and
 reverted back to someone outside the US. They are difficult but not
 impossible to track down but frankly in the majority of cases they are not
 interested in making a deal for one film for one institution. Its a bitch
 but it is their right. Likewise a lot of American indie films have expired
 contracts and have pretty much identical issues with the foreign films.
 Even if you find the rights holder there is reasonable chance especially
 with a film older than 10 years that they do not own those rights because
 the were not in the original contract and require getting permission and
 paying multiple parties. Fun stuff.

 On the positive side streaming is something most rights holders want to
 offer so they are usually aggressively working on it but there can be all
 kinds of legal, financial and technical issues that they have to clear.

 I think librarians need to make a concerted effort to fulfill a streaming
 request but at the same time they also have to accept and get the
 instructor to accept that not every film can be streamed and they might
 have to consider options like a different title or actually having students
 watch it on a DVD ( if you have a legal copy of that)

 Librarians and rights holders should absolutely be working together on
 these issues. Clearly if a rights holder has to surmount  costly issues to
 make a film available for streaming then knowing libraries want to purchase
 it will help. I think accessing feature films

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Jessica Rosner]

It is very hard to track down international films but with a lot of work
you can usually find rights holder. I honestly think the bigger problem is
that even if you find the rights holder they are likely to have know
interest in licensing the film to you as their goal is to have a US
distributor.
Many years ago on an utterly unrelated rights issue a major ( studio)
rights holder told a small company wanting to license a film for VHS ( yes
that long ago) that the studio was never going to put out itself that It
will cost more money for our lawyers to read the contract than we will ever
make . That sounds nasty but it happens to be true. Now every once in a
while there is a happy story ( I remember putting someone in touch with the
director of Quartier Mozart and he owned the rights himself and was happy
to make a deal) but more often it is like the reaction above and again it
is actually true that for a company like Gaumont,Bavaria or Universal it
would be too expensive to license a single title to an institution and it
gets worse for situations where you have made for TV, or indie older films
or other types for which streaming is not even available unless the entire
contract is redone

Honestly I would just skip trying to get streaming rights and focus on
seeing if you can find a legal DVD import to put on reserve and have the
equipment to play it on.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 11:22 AM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:

 Good points, Jessica.



 I would want to participate in a forum with all parties involved.



 Another huge problem is, as you post, tracking down right holders for
 international films.  **sighs**



 Best,

 Mo



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Jessica Rosner
 *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 10:46 AM

 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings
 up what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and
 streaming at educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on
 colib for webinars, sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only
 once did I see one which actually included a representative of a major\
 rights holders. I am happy to be corrected as I don't follow every listing
 but it seems like the same experts from either universities or people
 from organizations often hostile to rights holders involved. Not my
 favorite group but has anyone from MPAA ever been involved. or from a major
 studio or company? Dennis and I poke our heads in here but without the
 participation of an intellectual property lawyer it strikes me that too
 much takes place in vacuum with only one view represented



 The other huge problem is that the issue of what constitutes fair use in
 streaming is totally separate from tracking down the right holder. The
 plain fact is that there tens of thousands of films for which you simply
 can not obtain the streaming rights. There are massive numbers of film that
 have no current US distribution but the all except the small number of PD
 titles have rights holders. Those made outside the US may never have had US
 distribution , others may have in the past but the contract has expired and
 reverted back to someone outside the US. They are difficult but not
 impossible to track down but frankly in the majority of cases they are not
 interested in making a deal for one film for one institution. Its a bitch
 but it is their right. Likewise a lot of American indie films have expired
 contracts and have pretty much identical issues with the foreign films.
 Even if you find the rights holder there is reasonable chance especially
 with a film older than 10 years that they do not own those rights because
 the were not in the original contract and require getting permission and
 paying multiple parties. Fun stuff.

 On the positive side streaming is something most rights holders want to
 offer so they are usually aggressively working on it but there can be all
 kinds of legal, financial and technical issues that they have to clear.

 I think librarians need to make a concerted effort to fulfill a streaming
 request but at the same time they also have to accept and get the
 instructor to accept that not every film can be streamed and they might
 have to consider options like a different title or actually having students
 watch it on a DVD ( if you have a legal copy of that)

 Librarians and rights holders should absolutely be working together on
 these issues. Clearly if a rights holder has to surmount  costly issues to
 make a film available for streaming then knowing libraries want to purchase
 it will help. I think accessing feature films at least through Hulu,
 Amazon, Fandor etc is honestly more practical in many cases at least for
 films that played in theaters not those made

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Jessica Rosner]

Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings up
what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and streaming
at educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on colib for
webinars, sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only once did I
see one which actually included a representative of a major\ rights
holders. I am happy to be corrected as I don't follow every listing but it
seems like the same experts from either universities or people from
organizations often hostile to rights holders involved. Not my favorite
group but has anyone from MPAA ever been involved. or from a major studio
or company? Dennis and I poke our heads in here but without the
participation of an intellectual property lawyer it strikes me that too
much takes place in vacuum with only one view represented

The other huge problem is that the issue of what constitutes fair use in
streaming is totally separate from tracking down the right holder. The
plain fact is that there tens of thousands of films for which you simply
can not obtain the streaming rights. There are massive numbers of film that
have no current US distribution but the all except the small number of PD
titles have rights holders. Those made outside the US may never have had US
distribution , others may have in the past but the contract has expired and
reverted back to someone outside the US. They are difficult but not
impossible to track down but frankly in the majority of cases they are not
interested in making a deal for one film for one institution. Its a bitch
but it is their right. Likewise a lot of American indie films have expired
contracts and have pretty much identical issues with the foreign films.
Even if you find the rights holder there is reasonable chance especially
with a film older than 10 years that they do not own those rights because
the were not in the original contract and require getting permission and
paying multiple parties. Fun stuff.

On the positive side streaming is something most rights holders want to
offer so they are usually aggressively working on it but there can be all
kinds of legal, financial and technical issues that they have to clear.

I think librarians need to make a concerted effort to fulfill a streaming
request but at the same time they also have to accept and get the
instructor to accept that not every film can be streamed and they might
have to consider options like a different title or actually having students
watch it on a DVD ( if you have a legal copy of that)

Librarians and rights holders should absolutely be working together on
these issues. Clearly if a rights holder has to surmount  costly issues to
make a film available for streaming then knowing libraries want to purchase
it will help. I think accessing feature films at least through Hulu,
Amazon, Fandor etc is honestly more practical in many cases at least for
films that played in theaters not those made or focused on the educational
market

Bottom line educational institutions and rights holders must work together
but it needs to be broader group of rights holders  and instructors need to
understand that they can't stream every film they might want.

Jessica

On Wed, Aug 26, 2015 at 1:45 PM, Sarah E. McCleskey 
sarah.e.mccles...@hofstra.edu wrote:

 Yes, I agree that a WebEx or another remote conferencing tool would be
 great. Thanks for the feedback so far. I think this is something that we
 can do.



 Sarah



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Jodie Borgerding
 *Sent:* Wednesday, August 26, 2015 1:20 PM

 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 I can’t make it to NMM either but my university has a WebEx license so I
 would be more than happy to “host” a discussion.



 Jodie



 



 Jodie L. Borgerding, M.L.S.

 Instruction and Liaison Librarian

 Emerson Library

 Webster University

 470 E. Lockwood

 St. Louis, MO  63119

 (314) 246-7819

 jborgerdin...@webster.edu

 http://libguides.webster.edu/soc

 http://libguides.webster.edu/english

 http://libguides.webster.edu/zombies



 “Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He stares them down until he gets the
 information he wants.”



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [
 mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Hooper, Lisa K
 *Sent:* Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:12 PM
 *To:* videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 Yes! I can’t make it to NMM this year but would *love* to be a part of
 this discussion!

 -lisa H.



 Music  Media Librarian

 Howard-Tilton Memorial Library

 Tulane University

 504.314.7822

 @lkHMusLibrarian

 www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenter

 http

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Dennis Doros]

Thanks, Mo!

Maureen and I slayed NMM back in Nevada. Well, not literally. I mean,
that's possibly worse than copyright infringement. At best, it's impolite.
But we had a good time presenting. :-)

Best regards,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film  Video
PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035 / Email: milefi...@gmail.com

Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.com
Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.com, www.portraitofjason.com,
www.shirleyclarkefilms.com,
To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click here
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573
!


Support Milestone Film on Facebook
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and Twitter
https://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!


On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:

 Dennis,



 I hope the NMM Board will consider you to be its guest speaker, or at
 least panel presenter at the 2016 NMM! J



 I also look forward to seeing your film in the near future.



 Best,

 Mo



 *From:* videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:
 videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] *On Behalf Of *Dennis Doros
 *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2015 11:23 AM
 *To:* Video Library questions videolib@lists.berkeley.edu

 *Subject:* Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright
 question: American Playhouse Films



 And I too have to send my regrets, but as those on our mailing list know,
 Amy and I have produced our first feature film ever (
 http://filmbysamuelbeckett.com/) --ironically, some of it's based on fair
 use -- and it's having it's world premiere on October 17th. To be honest,
 my travel these days is mostly regarding the politics and laws to save
 films, the fight to preserve ALL materials (outtakes and unknown films
 along with digital-born works are being left behind), and any of my
 knowledge of copyright is just an outgrowth of those efforts. Distribution
 allows me to afford to do that.



 I do agree with Jessica that *most* of these meetings on fair use have
 been unbalanced without representatives of rights holders present and
 there's a lot of wringing of hands over the perceived strength of the
 copyright holders. The reality is that with the internet, copyright
 infringement is so vast that the rights holders have almost zero control of
 their materials these days. And most studios are afraid to sue over new
 technology uses because they are afraid of losing. And they're fairly
 ignorant on copyright as it turns out. (I hear about their meetings and
 it's not impressive.) The multitude of copyright laws across the world also
 create further confusion.



 BUT -- I've stayed with this listserv for many years and have waged
 battles, expressed sympathy and celebrated triumphs with many of you (
 *still* waiting for that Cubs miracle) because I do believe that this is
 the best forum for discussing our differences. I do have a life long love
 of librarians as the keepers of culture. (Though to be brutally honest, if
 you truly believe you are preservationists, you would be participating in
 AMIA and attend their events because the preservation world in regards to
 multimedia is changing rapidly. Did you know that polyester mag tracks are
 now threatened? That was last week's news at The Reel Thing.) So, if we
 could discuss a 2016 NMM meeting, I'd love to come out and work with you
 all on a platform where institutional budgets and rights holder interests
 can be debated and a statement of best practices can be made.




 Best regards,
 Dennis Doros
 Milestone Film  Video
 PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
 Phone: 201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035 / Email: milefi...@gmail.com



 Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.com

 Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.com, www.portraitofjason.com,
 www.shirleyclarkefilms.com,

 To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click here
 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573
 !



 Support Milestone Film on Facebook
 http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and Twitter
 https://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!



 On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Jessica Rosner jessicapros...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Alas I won't be at NMM and I doubt Dennis will be either and this brings
 up what I think is the biggest problem when discussing copyright and
 streaming at educational institutions. I see lots of posts here and on
 colib for webinars, sessions, conferences devoted to the issue but only
 once did I see one which actually included a representative of a major\
 rights holders. I am happy to be corrected as I don't follow every listing
 but it seems like the same experts from either universities or people
 from organizations often hostile to rights holders involved. Not my
 favorite group but has anyone from MPAA ever been involved. or from a major
 studio or company? Dennis

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Threatt, Monique Louise]

Yaaay!

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Doros
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 3:35 PM
To: Video Library questions videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Thanks, Mo!

Maureen and I slayed NMM back in Nevada. Well, not literally. I mean, that's 
possibly worse than copyright infringement. At best, it's impolite. But we had 
a good time presenting. :-)

Best regards,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film  Video
PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035 / Email: 
milefi...@gmail.commailto:milefi...@gmail.com

Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.comhttp://www.milestonefilms.com/
Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.comhttp://www.mspresents.com, 
www.portraitofjason.comhttp://www.portraitofjason.com, 
www.shirleyclarkefilms.comhttp://www.shirleyclarkefilms.com/,
To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click 
herehttps://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573!

Support Milestone Film on 
Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and 
Twitterhttps://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Threatt, Monique Louise 
mthre...@indiana.edumailto:mthre...@indiana.edu wrote:
Dennis,

I hope the NMM Board will consider you to be its guest speaker, or at least 
panel presenter at the 2016 NMM! ☺

I also look forward to seeing your film in the near future.

Best,
Mo

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu]
 On Behalf Of Dennis Doros
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2015 11:23 AM
To: Video Library questions 
videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu

Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

And I too have to send my regrets, but as those on our mailing list know, Amy 
and I have produced our first feature film ever 
(http://filmbysamuelbeckett.com/) --ironically, some of it's based on fair use 
-- and it's having it's world premiere on October 17th. To be honest, my travel 
these days is mostly regarding the politics and laws to save films, the fight 
to preserve ALL materials (outtakes and unknown films along with digital-born 
works are being left behind), and any of my knowledge of copyright is just an 
outgrowth of those efforts. Distribution allows me to afford to do that.

I do agree with Jessica that most of these meetings on fair use have been 
unbalanced without representatives of rights holders present and there's a lot 
of wringing of hands over the perceived strength of the copyright holders. The 
reality is that with the internet, copyright infringement is so vast that the 
rights holders have almost zero control of their materials these days. And most 
studios are afraid to sue over new technology uses because they are afraid of 
losing. And they're fairly ignorant on copyright as it turns out. (I hear about 
their meetings and it's not impressive.) The multitude of copyright laws across 
the world also create further confusion.

BUT -- I've stayed with this listserv for many years and have waged battles, 
expressed sympathy and celebrated triumphs with many of you (still waiting for 
that Cubs miracle) because I do believe that this is the best forum for 
discussing our differences. I do have a life long love of librarians as the 
keepers of culture. (Though to be brutally honest, if you truly believe you are 
preservationists, you would be participating in AMIA and attend their events 
because the preservation world in regards to multimedia is changing rapidly. 
Did you know that polyester mag tracks are now threatened? That was last week's 
news at The Reel Thing.) So, if we could discuss a 2016 NMM meeting, I'd love 
to come out and work with you all on a platform where institutional budgets and 
rights holder interests can be debated and a statement of best practices can be 
made.


Best regards,
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film  Video
PO Box 128 / Harrington Park, NJ 07640
Phone: 201-767-3117tel:201-767-3117 / Fax: 201-767-3035tel:201-767-3035 / 
Email: milefi...@gmail.commailto:milefi...@gmail.com

Visit our main website!  www.milestonefilms.comhttp://www.milestonefilms.com/
Visit our new websites!  www.mspresents.comhttp://www.mspresents.com, 
www.portraitofjason.comhttp://www.portraitofjason.com, 
www.shirleyclarkefilms.comhttp://www.shirleyclarkefilms.com/,
To see or download our 2014 Video Catalog, click 
herehttps://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0150/7896/files/2015MilestoneVideoCatalog.pdf?2223081985127089573!

Support Milestone Film on 
Facebookhttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Milestone-Film/22348485426 and 
Twitterhttps://twitter.com/#!/MilestoneFilms!

On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Jessica

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Bergman, Barbara J]

See you all at the hot air balloon fiesta, er, NMM in ABQ!

We did the librarian/vendor streaming video discussions (jokingly called cage 
matches) on Sunday afternoon before the Market officially started. Would a 
discussion at that time fit into the schedule?

~Barb

Barb Bergman | Media Services  Interlibrary Loan Librarian | Minnesota State 
University, Mankato | (507) 389-5945 | 
barbara.berg...@mnsu.edumailto:barbara.berg...@mnsu.edu

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Threatt, Monique Louise]

Hello,

Just my nickle’s worth.  This is indeed a wonderful post, and I would like to 
see a forum held in the near future either during Market, or at some other 
venue which could (re)address these issues.
Libraries across the board are suffering deeply with budget/travel cuts, so it 
would be interesting to know which conferences are most likely to attract the 
necessary participants for this discussion.

I think one of the underlying problems for most instructors is the “wait” 
game—that time between an instructor’s need to have immediate access to a 
streaming title versus the prolonged time it can take to track down, and obtain 
written permission from a rights holder.
This is a very frustrating process for instructors.  It would be helpful for 
someone to develop a white paper, or other form of correspondence with clear 
cut instructions and options for instructors to follow.  Right now, the search 
is a tedious process.
However, if an instructor is aware that it may take up to a month to receive an 
answer from a rights holder, then h/she may want to rethink which films they 
would want to add to their syllabus, etc.

Again, this topic has come up before at other conferences such as CCUMC – do we 
want instructor’s to have free will to dictate which films they would want to 
show in class, or do we leave it to vendors to say this is what we have, take 
it or leave it?

To sum up how I feel about those who take risks, and those who don’t.  I 
attended a copyright conference earlier this year, and what I took away from 
that conference is that you have some lawyers who are risk-takers, and some who 
are not.
Interpreting copyright and fair use laws/guidelines as they apply to media is a 
sticky subject and debatable topic.   I need only to read the posts here on the 
videolib listserv to see that we are a diverse group with diverse opinions.
As a rule, and as mentioned here, it is always advisable to consult with your 
academic Counsel.  However, some institutions may find themselves hiring 
Counsels over the years with differing opinions about copyright, etc.
I think there are exceptions to the rule, and nothing is clear-cut, black or 
white.

I will say that I love having the opportunity to be able to provide my patrons 
with access to various streaming models, and vendors.  However, there will 
never exist the “dream-team” or “magical” bundle package to meet the needs of 
my patrons.  Vendors need to take into account that instructors today are using 
current contemporary films, and we need to find a way to provide streaming 
access to those films.  Otherwise, the money is going to go more and more to 
Netflix, Hulu, etc.
It’s no secret that I wish to see better models offered and a better selection 
of films from commercial vendors.

Thanks,
Monique

Monique Threatt
Herman B Wells Library




From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Susan Albrecht
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 11:25 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Sarah, I couldn’t agree with you more – on all points!

The vast majority of video librarians with whom I communicate are in that same 
camp of working their butts off to do things right and to develop and maintain 
positive relationships with producers and distributors, and to do their best to 
educate members of their campus communities about what’s kosher and what’s not. 
 (Or at least what our college attorneys have indicated they’re willing to 
consider kosher and not.  Like Sarah, ours tend to be fairly risk-averse.)

I love this idea of an impromptu Video Digital Summit 2.0!

BTW, if you are a member of Videolib who DOESN’T typically attend NMM, I would 
strongly urge you to consider coming.  Not only are those professional 
development sessions wonderful, so are the relationships you will begin to 
create with the distributors… and so are the discounts you will realize.  
Besides that, it’s a bargain to attend, we have loads of fun (because, really, 
who is more fun than people who work with film?? ;)), and you almost certainly 
will more than cover the cost of your attendance with the accompanying 
discounts on post-Market purchases.  Really – there’s no reason not to go!

Spoken like an NMM board member, huh? ;)

Susan

Susan Albrecht
Library Media Acquisitions Manager
Graduate Fellowship Advisor
Wabash College Lilly Library
765-361-6216 (acquisitions)
765-361-6297 (fellowships)
765-361-6295 fax
albre...@wabash.edumailto:albre...@wabash.edu
www.facebook.com/wabashcollegelibrary.filmshttp://www.facebook.com/wabashcollegelibrary.films
http://pinterest.com/wabashcolllib/

***
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice. --Neil Peart
***

From: 
videolib-boun

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[scott spicer]

I concur, an update to the Summit 5 years on would be a great idea.
Unfortunately, there are many like myself who are unable to attend.  If we
do have this forum, my guidance would be to seek some kind of mechanism for
remote live participation if at all possible (e.g., Hangout, Skype, WebEx,
etc..) for at least part of the discussion.

Best,
Scott

-- 
Scott Spicer
Media Outreach and Learning Spaces Librarian
University of Minnesota Libraries - Twin Cities
341 Walter Library
spic0...@umn.edu612.626.0629
Media Services: lib.umn.edu/media
SMART Learning Commons: lib.umn.edu/smart
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Hooper, Lisa K]

Yes! I can’t make it to NMM this year but would love to be a part of this 
discussion!
-lisa H.

Music  Media Librarian
Howard-Tilton Memorial Library
Tulane University
504.314.7822
@lkHMusLibrarian
www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenterhttp://www.facebook.com/TulaneMusicAndMediaCenter
http://www.library.tulane.edu/libraries/mmc
http://bamboulanola.tumblr.com/



From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of scott spicer
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 12:07 PM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

I concur, an update to the Summit 5 years on would be a great idea.  
Unfortunately, there are many like myself who are unable to attend.  If we do 
have this forum, my guidance would be to seek some kind of mechanism for remote 
live participation if at all possible (e.g., Hangout, Skype, WebEx, etc..) for 
at least part of the discussion.
Best,
Scott

--
Scott Spicer
Media Outreach and Learning Spaces Librarian
University of Minnesota Libraries - Twin Cities
341 Walter Library
spic0...@umn.edumailto:spic0...@umn.edu612.626.0629
Media Services: lib.umn.edu/mediahttp://lib.umn.edu/media
SMART Learning Commons: lib.umn.edu/smarthttp://lib.umn.edu/smart
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues 
relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, 
preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and 
related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective 
working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication 
between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and 
distributors.

[Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Laura Jenemann]

Hi everyone,

I’m late to the conversation and have not read this whole thread, but I want to 
offer up something that I tried to get started as Chair of the Video Round 
Table last year:  getting filmmakers, distributors, and academic media users 
all in one room.

lorraine wochna curated a great program related to this theme at ALA San 
Francisco:

“PPR: Promoting and Programming in Academic Libraries”
More details here: http://alaac15.ala.org/node/28941

As the title implies, there was discussion of PPR here, but there was also 
discussion of the relationship building between educational users 
(non-individual, non-theatrical) and filmmakers.

This is what I would love to see in events that some of us attend like ALA, or 
the National Media Market.  Are there ways that we can make the process easier 
for us to get great content, often underrepresented perspectives in other 
media, to our users?  When, in trying to do the right thing, library staff are 
spending their days calling celebrities’ agents, digging for producers, and 
playing “hot potato” from distributor-to-distributor and coast-to-coast, that 
might indicate that we might need to rethink how we get getting streaming films 
in front of eyeballs – especially those old things that seem like they aren’t 
able to be monetized to individuals, but are in high demand in education.

I actually do sooo much of this research so that I can, in fact, do the right 
thing.

Just a brain-dump from me….

Regards,
Laura

Laura Jenemann
Media, Film Studies, and Dance Librarian
George Mason University
703-993-7593
ljene...@gmu.edu

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jessica Rosner
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2015 11:25 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

I want to thank Dennis for ably covering this while I have been dealing with a 
few ongoing crisis.
I assumed it was plain that I meant a case where the USE of entire work of 
length had been deemed fair use. As Dennis pointed out the Google Books 
decision makes it very clear that only small portions of works are in fact 
allowed to be accessible. Also there are without doubt instances where an 
entire very short work from an image to a 4 line poem to a one minute film ( 
These are for example, there would be many others ) could pass the test but as 
always each case is decided individually.
One very interesting thing is how no one at least in the academic community 
mentions the OTHER parts of the Google Books and GSU cases the ladder of which 
is directly on point to the issue of fair use being used to claim that an 
academic institution can use a entire work of length.
In fact GSU WAS scanning and posting entire books and articles before they were 
sued in 2008
They immediately removed the entire works and instituted a new policy which 
restricted material to portions. As they were a state school, the publishers 
could not sue for past damages and so that issue was dropped at GSU's request. 
The publishers in fact urged the judge to let it be litigated but GSU fought it 
and has above they had sovereign immunity it was removed from the case. I am 
not sure how clearer it could be that you can't use an entire work than this.
In the Google books case there was another major issue involving Google 
Hathitrust attempt to allow access to entire orphan works. With great fanfare 
they announced they would post whole books whose rights holder could not be 
found and a few days before their first posting they released the titles of the 
first small group  orphan works. Within 48 hours the Authors Guild had 
located the rights holders of the majority of the titles and it ended in a 
fiasco. While orphan works are a huge issue in film in particular this shows 
that a company with massive resources of google ( not to mention their library 
partners who presumable had a lot of research skills) did not do a remotely 
thorough job to locate rights holders.
Like Dennis I am  disappointed that instead of working with filmmakers, 
distributors and rights holders to
get streaming access for academic use ( and to be blunt compensate the people 
who made  these works) there seems to be an increasing movement to find ways to 
just claim no rights are needed.
As Dennis can tell you better than me in addition to cheating filmmakers of 
revenue it makes it nearly impossible to preserve and remaster films which are 
in desperate need of both.
I find some people  dancing around the issue a lot, picking up a sentence here 
or there but the bottom line is either you are claiming you can digitize and 
stream an entire film for a class without paying the right holder or you 
aren't. Not really a grey area.
Now back to my crisis of which thankfully the Cubs are not included.
Jessica


On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 8:04 PM, Dennis Doros 
milefi...@gmail.commailto:milefi...@gmail.com wrote:
Sorry, once again:

1) 

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Sarah E. McCleskey]

Thanks, Laura, that is a good suggestion.

Does anyone remember the Digital Video Summit a few of us put together in New 
York back in Spring of 2010? We followed it up with a similar type event that 
Fall at National Media Market.

I felt that there were lasting positive outcomes from those events, and now, 5 
years and many developments later, perhaps we should revisit the “state of the 
union.”

It is important, I think, for those of us on this list, distributors and 
librarians included, to continue to build relationships of trust. Most 
librarians that I know are striving (yes, through in-depth research and 
creative financing) to *not* rip off any 
rightsholders/filmmakers/distributors/etc. Most librarians I know are eager to 
comply with copyright law (while still exercising fair use, 108, and 110(2) 
rights), and to give credit where credit is due, and to pay a fair price for 
content.

Sure there are “outliers.” I’m not trying to say that no college/university has 
ever streamed a film in its entirety without seeking permission. Some 
institutions have adopted what I would call “riskier” policies for provision of 
audiovisual content through streaming. If those institutions have worked with 
their Legal counsel and feel comfortable with their policies, that’s really 
their business. It’s not how we do things at my institution, where we are in 
general pretty risk-averse.

So maybe we do need another summit, just to bring people together and let it be 
recognized that many of us are on the same wavelength, with similar goals of 
creating or providing excellent audiovisual content to our customers or 
constituents. This could also be a good forum for librarians to communicate to 
distributors about *how* we prefer to access and acquire content (EBA, PDA, 
licensing, purchase, subscription, etc.).

I am on the board of National Media Market. We have set our schedule and 
professional development sessions now for Fall 2015, but I wonder if attendees 
and Exhibiting Partners would want to give up a couple of hours of the 
Exhibitor walk-in sessions we enjoy at that conference, one morning or 
afternoon, for a Digital Video Summit 2.0?

Respond on list or off, and I will coordinate your responses and see if there 
is enough interest to make this happen.

Yours in solidarity,
Sarah @ Hofstra


From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Laura Jenemann
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 9:51 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Hi everyone,

I’m late to the conversation and have not read this whole thread, but I want to 
offer up something that I tried to get started as Chair of the Video Round 
Table last year:  getting filmmakers, distributors, and academic media users 
all in one room.

lorraine wochna curated a great program related to this theme at ALA San 
Francisco:

“PPR: Promoting and Programming in Academic Libraries”
More details here: http://alaac15.ala.org/node/28941

As the title implies, there was discussion of PPR here, but there was also 
discussion of the relationship building between educational users 
(non-individual, non-theatrical) and filmmakers.

This is what I would love to see in events that some of us attend like ALA, or 
the National Media Market.  Are there ways that we can make the process easier 
for us to get great content, often underrepresented perspectives in other 
media, to our users?  When, in trying to do the right thing, library staff are 
spending their days calling celebrities’ agents, digging for producers, and 
playing “hot potato” from distributor-to-distributor and coast-to-coast, that 
might indicate that we might need to rethink how we get getting streaming films 
in front of eyeballs – especially those old things that seem like they aren’t 
able to be monetized to individuals, but are in high demand in education.

I actually do sooo much of this research so that I can, in fact, do the right 
thing.

Just a brain-dump from me….

Regards,
Laura

Laura Jenemann
Media, Film Studies, and Dance Librarian
George Mason University
703-993-7593
ljene...@gmu.edumailto:ljene...@gmu.edu

From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jessica Rosner
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2015 11:25 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

I want to thank Dennis for ably covering this while I have been dealing with a 
few ongoing crisis.
I assumed it was plain that I meant a case where the USE of entire work of 
length had been deemed fair use. As Dennis pointed out the Google Books 
decision makes it very clear that only small portions of works are in fact 
allowed to be accessible. Also there are without doubt instances where an 
entire

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Susan Albrecht]

Sarah, I couldn’t agree with you more – on all points!

The vast majority of video librarians with whom I communicate are in that same 
camp of working their butts off to do things right and to develop and maintain 
positive relationships with producers and distributors, and to do their best to 
educate members of their campus communities about what’s kosher and what’s not. 
 (Or at least what our college attorneys have indicated they’re willing to 
consider kosher and not.  Like Sarah, ours tend to be fairly risk-averse.)

I love this idea of an impromptu Video Digital Summit 2.0!

BTW, if you are a member of Videolib who DOESN’T typically attend NMM, I would 
strongly urge you to consider coming.  Not only are those professional 
development sessions wonderful, so are the relationships you will begin to 
create with the distributors… and so are the discounts you will realize.  
Besides that, it’s a bargain to attend, we have loads of fun (because, really, 
who is more fun than people who work with film?? ;)), and you almost certainly 
will more than cover the cost of your attendance with the accompanying 
discounts on post-Market purchases.  Really – there’s no reason not to go!

Spoken like an NMM board member, huh? ;)

Susan

Susan Albrecht
Library Media Acquisitions Manager
Graduate Fellowship Advisor
Wabash College Lilly Library
765-361-6216 (acquisitions)
765-361-6297 (fellowships)
765-361-6295 fax
albre...@wabash.edumailto:albre...@wabash.edu
www.facebook.com/wabashcollegelibrary.filmshttp://www.facebook.com/wabashcollegelibrary.films
http://pinterest.com/wabashcolllib/

***
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice. --Neil Peart
***

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Sarah E. McCleskey
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 10:50 AM
To: 'videolib@lists.berkeley.edu' videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Thanks, Laura, that is a good suggestion.

Does anyone remember the Digital Video Summit a few of us put together in New 
York back in Spring of 2010? We followed it up with a similar type event that 
Fall at National Media Market.

I felt that there were lasting positive outcomes from those events, and now, 5 
years and many developments later, perhaps we should revisit the “state of the 
union.”

It is important, I think, for those of us on this list, distributors and 
librarians included, to continue to build relationships of trust. Most 
librarians that I know are striving (yes, through in-depth research and 
creative financing) to *not* rip off any 
rightsholders/filmmakers/distributors/etc. Most librarians I know are eager to 
comply with copyright law (while still exercising fair use, 108, and 110(2) 
rights), and to give credit where credit is due, and to pay a fair price for 
content.

Sure there are “outliers.” I’m not trying to say that no college/university has 
ever streamed a film in its entirety without seeking permission. Some 
institutions have adopted what I would call “riskier” policies for provision of 
audiovisual content through streaming. If those institutions have worked with 
their Legal counsel and feel comfortable with their policies, that’s really 
their business. It’s not how we do things at my institution, where we are in 
general pretty risk-averse.

So maybe we do need another summit, just to bring people together and let it be 
recognized that many of us are on the same wavelength, with similar goals of 
creating or providing excellent audiovisual content to our customers or 
constituents. This could also be a good forum for librarians to communicate to 
distributors about *how* we prefer to access and acquire content (EBA, PDA, 
licensing, purchase, subscription, etc.).

I am on the board of National Media Market. We have set our schedule and 
professional development sessions now for Fall 2015, but I wonder if attendees 
and Exhibiting Partners would want to give up a couple of hours of the 
Exhibitor walk-in sessions we enjoy at that conference, one morning or 
afternoon, for a Digital Video Summit 2.0?

Respond on list or off, and I will coordinate your responses and see if there 
is enough interest to make this happen.

Yours in solidarity,
Sarah @ Hofstra



From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Laura Jenemann
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 9:51 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Hi everyone,

I’m late to the conversation and have not read this whole thread, but I want to 
offer up something that I tried to get started as Chair

Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: American Playhouse Films

[Laura Jenemann]

Hi Sarah (and list),

I think the summit is a great idea!  If you get a critical mass and create a 
list of people interested, feel free to add me to it.

Regards,
Laura

Laura Jenemann
Media, Film Studies, and Dance Librarian
George Mason University
703-993-7593
ljene...@gmu.edu

From: videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Sarah E. McCleskey
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 10:50 AM
To: 'videolib@lists.berkeley.edu'
Subject: Re: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Thanks, Laura, that is a good suggestion.

Does anyone remember the Digital Video Summit a few of us put together in New 
York back in Spring of 2010? We followed it up with a similar type event that 
Fall at National Media Market.

I felt that there were lasting positive outcomes from those events, and now, 5 
years and many developments later, perhaps we should revisit the “state of the 
union.”

It is important, I think, for those of us on this list, distributors and 
librarians included, to continue to build relationships of trust. Most 
librarians that I know are striving (yes, through in-depth research and 
creative financing) to *not* rip off any 
rightsholders/filmmakers/distributors/etc. Most librarians I know are eager to 
comply with copyright law (while still exercising fair use, 108, and 110(2) 
rights), and to give credit where credit is due, and to pay a fair price for 
content.

Sure there are “outliers.” I’m not trying to say that no college/university has 
ever streamed a film in its entirety without seeking permission. Some 
institutions have adopted what I would call “riskier” policies for provision of 
audiovisual content through streaming. If those institutions have worked with 
their Legal counsel and feel comfortable with their policies, that’s really 
their business. It’s not how we do things at my institution, where we are in 
general pretty risk-averse.

So maybe we do need another summit, just to bring people together and let it be 
recognized that many of us are on the same wavelength, with similar goals of 
creating or providing excellent audiovisual content to our customers or 
constituents. This could also be a good forum for librarians to communicate to 
distributors about *how* we prefer to access and acquire content (EBA, PDA, 
licensing, purchase, subscription, etc.).

I am on the board of National Media Market. We have set our schedule and 
professional development sessions now for Fall 2015, but I wonder if attendees 
and Exhibiting Partners would want to give up a couple of hours of the 
Exhibitor walk-in sessions we enjoy at that conference, one morning or 
afternoon, for a Digital Video Summit 2.0?

Respond on list or off, and I will coordinate your responses and see if there 
is enough interest to make this happen.

Yours in solidarity,
Sarah @ Hofstra



From: 
videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu 
[mailto:videolib-boun...@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Laura Jenemann
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2015 9:51 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edumailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: [Videolib] Grassroots collaboration Was RE: Copyright question: 
American Playhouse Films

Hi everyone,

I’m late to the conversation and have not read this whole thread, but I want to 
offer up something that I tried to get started as Chair of the Video Round 
Table last year:  getting filmmakers, distributors, and academic media users 
all in one room.

lorraine wochna curated a great program related to this theme at ALA San 
Francisco:

“PPR: Promoting and Programming in Academic Libraries”
More details here: http://alaac15.ala.org/node/28941

As the title implies, there was discussion of PPR here, but there was also 
discussion of the relationship building between educational users 
(non-individual, non-theatrical) and filmmakers.

This is what I would love to see in events that some of us attend like ALA, or 
the National Media Market.  Are there ways that we can make the process easier 
for us to get great content, often underrepresented perspectives in other 
media, to our users?  When, in trying to do the right thing, library staff are 
spending their days calling celebrities’ agents, digging for producers, and 
playing “hot potato” from distributor-to-distributor and coast-to-coast, that 
might indicate that we might need to rethink how we get getting streaming films 
in front of eyeballs – especially those old things that seem like they aren’t 
able to be monetized to individuals, but are in high demand in education.

I actually do sooo much of this research so that I can, in fact, do the right 
thing.

Just a brain-dump from me….

Regards,
Laura

Laura Jenemann
Media, Film Studies, and Dance Librarian
George Mason University
703-993-7593
ljene...@gmu.edumailto:ljene...@gmu.edu

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