Have I not been paying attention or has no-one mentioned Alien yet!?
Looking for good shops in Edinburgh for techno - any shops with a good used
section are welcome too.
I'll be going to Glasgow too so a stop at Rub-A-Dub is in the plans
10 more days until I'm in London - can't wait to put some voices to faces
and names finally
MEK
Plus, if anyone knows of any decent upcoming shows of any sort of music in
Edinburgh (between 31st Aug and 4th Sept)
or generally cool places to hang
(staying in Leith so it's a plus if in the area)
please let me know
MEK
Re. that Bladerunner sample, you have to hear Markus Guentner's track Tears
In Rain (off his 'Audio Island' album on Ware, 2002). Sublime.
On 8/17/04 12:35 AM, Brendan Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Is it true that Rutger Hauer himself wrote that just before
the scene was shot? If so, that's
Underground Solush'n down the bottom of cockburn street [off the royal
mile] is where its @ MEK :)
peace,
marc
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 1:09 AM
Subject: (313) Edinburgh shops
Looking for good shops in Edinburgh
Tom Churchill wrote:
Have I not been paying attention or has no-one mentioned Alien yet!?
Ah yes, Ridley Scott's second film and the one he directed before Blade
Runner.
Excellent, but misses out, IMO, on the emotive angle of Blade Runner and
Impostor.
Love Giger, love Sigourney
Ha ha, it's 'cause of the Olympics that I am watching all these DVDs -
escape! I only enjoy sport when we beat the English. ;)
and as the 2nd and 3rd in his career! Andrew np American TV ignoring
the fact that their American Phelps is getting his ass kicked by Aussie
Thorpe.
Speaking of
i have a release 'club classics 6' (http://www.discogs.com/release/47657)
that has two fantastic proto electro tracks on it, one is:
Hypnosis - End Title Blade Runner
(the other is a john carpenter track'the end')
i've been confused by this: does it have any relation to blade runner or
shit- the you might as well say Groove
On Mon, 16 Aug 2004, matrix313 wrote:
on 8/16/04 5:21 PM, marina pure sonik at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
24 Hour Party People
okay. if youre gonna pull the 24 Hour... card I gotta trump you with the
movie Party Monster. Set during the heyday of the
no you don't
MEK
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
the book that party monster was based on, Disco Bloodbath by James St
James, is excellent. very well worth reading.
james
www.jbucknell.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Architettura - a very short documentary about music and architecture (well
it was done by Iara Lee so it would be) just wish it was longer and went
into more detail about the buildings. As it is, the film is only 15 minutes
long. Far too short.
La Voyage Dans la Lune (Voyage to the Moon/Trip to
The Matrix OST was deplorable.
Shocking.
Angelo Badalamenti's soundtrack to Mulholland Dve sounded very Mayday to me.
I guess that could pass as a techno film.
I would freaking love to know what that film is about. I love David Lynch
but he lost me with this one! I love subversive - but with
Which Techno Track do you think has the best noise on ever?. You know
the one that makes you rewind again and again.
Best opening noise for me has to be Chris McCormack's remix of AK-47
and the other is a new track by Richard H. Kirk called Who's afraid of
the red/white and blue - just a
jesus christ.
I'm losing control
_
- End of message text
This e-mail is sent by the above named in their
individual, non-business capacity and is not on
behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers.
either I drank a large bottle of acid last night instead of my cocoa, or
you lot are making no sense to me whatsoever.
am I the only one that doesn't understand?
24 Hour Party People, a techno film?
What? a bunch of gippo's from Manchester with a load of bands?
Suspiria, wasn't that a bw
24 Hour Party People, a techno film?
What? a bunch of gippo's from Manchester with a load of bands?
Well yeah, you know, they go to some parties and sometimes techno people go
to parties and they do drugs and sometimes techno people do drugs and Shaun
Ryder poisons a bunch of pigeons and
OK.
I'd like to talk about something Greg Earle said yesterday, and also
something Martin Dust posted about.
Greg said something along the lines of Nothing sounds new to my ears
anymore. (this could be a mis-quote btw)
This is something I think about alot. If you asked me, I'd probably tell
you
Seriously though, I agree. This thread seems to have become more about
some
films techno heads might like as opposed to films that somehow embody the
spirit, ideologies and essence of techno music.
True Stuart.
Don't get me wrong, you guys can talk about films all day, I don't mind. I
know
Words are a Virus, rub out the words to view the future and then cut up
the future.
Bill Burroughs
Dunt really matter, dunt matter.
Vic and Bob
Cheers
Martin
On 17 Aug 2004, at 08:59,
Don't forget:
REZ (Dreamcast, cause it felt much better than on PS)
Wipeout 1 (the reason why i bought a PS)
and my absolute oldschool alltime top favourite music related game (also
my first in this direction):
TO BE ON TOP (C64)
Ronny
ok, after/beside the movies
i drop my most
Dunt really matter, dunt matter.
Vic and Bob
Ha!
This quote is more my level.
You're right of course Martin I think.
I think about it too much sometimes, then other times I think exactly what
Vic and Bob say.
I just wonder what others think sometimes too. Like quite often Martin,
To me many things are Alex and I've always loved a slogan, WCIT is just
something me and Black Dog bang on about together, although he did call
my latest mix gay! To which you'll be able to find out for yourself
when we take two laptops, one sampler and a keyboard to Locked in
Manchester on
See you down the front?
Depends whether you want me throwing bottles at you or not.
; )
where is it, The Man Alive?
good little place for a techno party that.
it's up for sale btw, hope someone good buys it.
_
There's a beautiful ambient track on Monolake's Hong Kong LP that really
sounds like it's straight out of Blade Runner to me.
Can't actually remember the track title at the moment though !
s.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
speaking of which - I know loads of people have been influenced by
hey look!
some nice info on K.Tucker and Shake
http://deephousepage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=19;t=015593;p=2
_
- End of message text
This e-mail is sent by the above named in
I would freaking love to know what that film is about. I love David Lynch
but he lost me with this one!
Here you go:
http://dir.salon.com/ent/movies/feature/2001/10/23/mulholland_drive_analysis
/index.html
:)
Also, there's Phebes by Hallucinator, on Chain Reaction. Could be from either
Blade Runner or Solaris, I guess.
Brendan
-Original Message-
From: Pascoe Mr S M [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 17 August 2004 10:47
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) Vangelis influences in techno
When I was first getting into Detroit techno and similar
sorts of sounds, I had a Commodore Amiga and most of the
games I liked playing while listening to electronic music
were early 3D games. There was something cold, crisp and
sharply polygonal about 16-bit simulated realities that
tied in
When he goes into the club looking for the dancer with the snake (which don't
have scales BTW) there's a little disco track playing in the background which
didn't seem to make it onto the official soundtrack.
Anyone know what I'm talking about? Anyone have any more info on that?
Thanks!!
Games - lets talk then...
Stunt Car
Thing on a Spring
Monty Mole
School Days
Total techno programmers - Jeff Minter and Tony Crowther
Favourite OS - DOS 3.1
Tempest 2000 ate my life away...
Favourite OS - DOS 3.1
neeenannawneenaw.
post police.
no way am I sitting here while you lot discuss this kind of caper.
computers are pretty techno I reckon, full stop.
_
- End of message text
Monty Mole
Jet Set Willy was way more techno!
... The music for the first games in the 'Super Mario' series sounds like
early Transmat cast-offs plus of course, there's 'Out Run' and it's amazing
main theme.
k
-Original Message-
From: Martin Dust [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 11:45 AM
To: Brendan Nelson
True but I worked on Monty twisted laugh I still work with the guy
who owned Gremlin...
On 17 Aug 2004, at 11:51, Stewart Caig wrote:
Monty Mole
Jet Set Willy was way more techno!
Jeff Minter... there's a name I haven't heard in a few years. :)
Llamatron is still one of my favorite games of all time. I even built this
little box out of wood and two old Atari 2600 joysticks so I could play it
in proper dual-joystick style on my Atari ST. :)
Games - lets talk then...
someone do us a favour and ID this track for this head.
http://www.littledetroit.net/forums/viewtopic.php?p=75815#75815
I can't flipping remember and it's doing my bonce in now.
Like, quite badly, I hate it when that happens.
I'm sure it's Lil Louis, but I don't want to tell him the wrong
Suspiria : as with many Italian horror movies from the 70's, soundtrack by
Goblin - a must-check for everybody who's into early electronics.
Gwendal
-Original Message-
From: Matt MacQueen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 12:00 AM
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL
interesting questions: does techno have to move forward to still be
techno?
imo once a genre of music is established then it just goes through
phases of recycling and incrementally improving/evolving.
look at rock for example, a lot of the new bands now (say white stripes
etc) are just
Regarding Jodorowsky, he's also a lot into psychanalysis and zen ; most famous
for the Incal comic book, an amazing sci-fi series... very interesting guy. I
don't think you can say he runs a cult though, as far as I'm aware.
Gwendal
-Original Message-
From: Martin Dust [mailto:[EMAIL
greetings
m
y first time here. Just subscribed 313.
I'm very interested to know more about films/documentaries focused on a
futuristic approach to 'music vs architecture'. Any reference apart from
those would be greatly appreciated.
regards to all
rt
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL
Hello rt.
Welcome.
Martin would like to know what your favourite computer operating system is.
*that was a joke btw Martin before the boys come hurtling over the pennines
for me*
; )
_
- End of message text
Oh, and while we're at it, Forbidden Planet has been mentioned, but no word has
been said of its great soundtrack : Louis Bebe Barron were responsible for
it, they were also responsible, I think, for the samples of alien music we can
hear in the movie... other musicians who did a great deal of
Been out of town for a couple of weeks... Any new bits I should make
myself endure more overdraft hell for ?
p
Quoting robin [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
interesting questions: does techno have to move forward to still be
techno?
imo once a genre of music is established then it just goes through
phases of recycling and incrementally improving/evolving.
look at rock for example, a lot of the new bands now
loosefingers pt2 would be right up your street.
robin...
On 17 Aug 2004, at 15:27, placid wrote:
Been out of town for a couple of weeks... Any new bits I should make
myself endure more overdraft hell for ?
p
Moving forward strictly for the sake of moving forward often results in the
neglect of ideas that still have room for exploration.
Exactly!
If you are looking for a mix that is just a little bit different from the
others check this out:
http://www.pileoshite.tk/
Never heard of the fella before but here's the tracklisting:
tom baker introduction
thomas dolby - one of our submarines - hardfloor mix
chicks on speed - love life
the
John Coleman wrote:
Jeff Minter... there's a name I haven't heard in a few years. :)
I believe he's now working with Peter Molyneux - Lionhead (Black and
White) on some game called unity.
Has anyone mentioned elite? Always thought that was pretty techno.
Others,
speedball2,
xenon2 - bomb
Isn't that creed of moving forward what got drum bass into the crap
hole it's been in for so long now?
I'm not the most clued in when it comes to what's going on in db but it
seems like people were afraid of sitting still for even a second
just because you revisit an older sound doesn't make you
A mate of mine needs some help and I thought this might be a good place to
ask.
He's got a dj coming over from detroit for a gig in Manchester early
October and is looking for other dates for him around Europe.
Are there any promoters out there in London, France, Italy, Germany etc?
It's a
He's done a fair few mash ups before with Son (as in Frenchbloke Son),
including an EP of Boards of Canada's with Marvin Gaye, Ini Kamoze and
others. Oh and I he's not one bit French, I think he's from Glasgow.
Glenn
Yea, i had a A500.
Ooh.. 'Hunter'. Despite its was quite a dull game (you were spending your
time walking around), i used to play it for houuurs. So perfect with
background music, exactly when i really turned from house to techno, ive got
'waveform transmission #1' joined to this game in my mind.
spawn was a good one, IMO
comicbook, HBO animated series (rated R), and semi-cheese hollywood movie
the only comic book I ever considered buying
-Joe
From: matrix313 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 2004/08/16 Mon PM 12:58:42 EDT
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: (313) comic book movies
on
well, I can't explain the first two but since I said Das Boot then - well
yes, Das Boot
it's the visual texture, the pacing, the claustrophobic atmosphere
Seawolf? Submerge? every label of Surface records?
sonar radar blips, depth charges, a crew of men incased in a steel ship
underneath the
Vangelis is great, I'm a fan for a long time, I'm sure he influenced me a
lot in the studio...Its soulful music, He gave me so much emotions wich lots
of songs...and not only Blade runner.
;-)
I'm surprise than he is not more considered by electronic music as one of
the electronic Soul
ahhh, Mike.
I was looking for explanations too, I couldn't understand why pretty much
all those films were being quoted as techno films.
I still reckon you were all scraping the barrel though ; )
I was in a terrible mood at 7am this morning.
I blame Francis and his camping/rave trips.
===
saturday 11th September
Klakson vs. BlackLabel
Live:
Dexter
Comtron
Dj's
Steffi
Sturmey Archer
===
friday 22nd October
Delsin / Ann Aimee night
Dribs 154 album presentations
Live:
Dribs (Ann Aimee)
Dynarec (Delsin)
Dj's
154
Peel Seamus
m dexter live.. that would be/could be a sick, sick, sick show.
jealous but too broke to afford it even if it was on my block,
-Joe
From: Marsel // Nomorewords.net [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 2004/08/17 Tue AM 11:53:06 EDT
To: low [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313 313@hyperreal.org
Subject:
At 11:14 AM 8/17/2004, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Isn't that creed of moving forward what got drum bass into the crap
hole it's been in for so long now?
It also makes the ILM forum a rather wretched hive of scum and villainy.
--
unsigned short int to_yer_mama;
matt kane's brain
Only pawns move forward
~dust
On 17 Aug 2004, at 16:40, matt kane's brain wrote:
At 11:14 AM 8/17/2004, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Isn't that creed of moving forward what got drum bass into the
crap
hole it's been in for so long now?
It also makes the ILM forum a rather wretched hive
either the acid line in The Wipe or the opening bleep in All Exhale
(FC Kahuna Remix)
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Martin Dust wrote:
Which Techno Track do you think has the best noise on ever?. You know
the one that makes you rewind again and again.
Best opening noise for me has to be Chris
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
either the acid line in The Wipe or the opening bleep in All Exhale
(FC Kahuna Remix)
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Martin Dust wrote:
Which Techno Track do you think has the best noise on ever?. You know
the one that makes you rewind again and again.
Best opening noise
so question 1:
i think it's impossible to find something that sounds new once you've been
listening to music for a while. i garauntee that very musical revelation
that you had when you were younger had some old folks bemoaning there's
nothing new
Do you think striving to sound completely new
i'll tell you if you tell me what a bonce is
seriously
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
someone do us a favour and ID this track for this head.
http://www.littledetroit.net/forums/viewtopic.php?p=75815#75815
I can't flipping remember and it's doing my bonce in now.
Like,
jack dangers just redid the Forbidden Planet soundtrack
it's pretty good.
http://www.forcedexposure.com/bin/search.pl?search_string=forbidden+planet+exploredsearchfield=keyword
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Cobert, Gwendal wrote:
Oh, and while we're at it, Forbidden Planet has been mentioned, but no
shit- i didn't realize it was opening noise
then its definately the bleep in All Exhale
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Andrew Duke Cognition Audioworks wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
either the acid line in The Wipe or the opening bleep in All Exhale
(FC Kahuna Remix)
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004,
Mike Dearborn's Move starts with a particularly satisying noise
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 5:51 PM
To: Andrew Duke Cognition Audioworks
Cc: Martin Dust; 313 List
Subject: Re: (313) Which Techno Track
shit- i didn't
are you daft? can you not infer what he means by 'bonce'?
do you do this with everyone from outside the US that uses slang from their
own country?
seriously
MEK
you don't have to be a linguist to figure it out
MEK
matt kane's
It's the same thing as a heid, a nut or a garden shed
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 6:24 PM
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) track ID
you don't have to be a linguist to figure it out
MEK
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
are you daft? can you not infer what he means by 'bonce'?
do you do this with everyone from outside the US that uses slang from
their own country?
God, you're an ass.
--
:: atomly ::
[ [EMAIL PROTECTED] : www.atomly.com ...
[ atomiq records : po box 805319 chicago il
You mean an arse
-Original Message-
From: atomly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 6:31 PM
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) track ID
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
are you daft? can you not infer what he means by 'bonce'?
do you do this with everyone from outside
according to the Discogs entries for the original release (more properly
releaseS, at it appears to have been released on several different labels in
different countries), it and the original A-side Pulstar are both Vangelis
covers. I haven't seen the movie in years so I can't confirm this.
At 02:00 PM 8/17/2004, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
are you daft? can you not infer what he means by 'bonce'?
do you do this with everyone from outside the US that uses slang from their
own country?
seriously
It's not as easy as it appears!
go f*ck yourself atomly and while you're add it why don't you reach over
and finger yussel too
MEK
atomly
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
go f*ck yourself atomly and while you're add it why don't you reach
over and finger yussel too
Thank you for proving my point.
--
:: atomly ::
[ [EMAIL PROTECTED] : www.atomly.com ...
[ atomiq records : po box 805319 chicago il 60680 : 312.804.5389 ...
[ e-mail [EMAIL
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Martin Dust wrote:
Which Techno Track do you think has the best noise on ever?. You
know
the one that makes you rewind again and again.
Opening, highly reverbed static on Second Bad Vilbel.
That, and that bleep/bass tone right before the fade on Acid Eiffel
(about 13
yeah- i actually do ask people what words that i don't know the meaning of
mean. i suppose it's probably a 'head' but maybe there's a little
entertaining twist to it, that would make a person use the word bonce
instead of head.
always looking to learn something new.
its the only way to keep from
spoiler warning: don't read this if you haven't seen the movie.
http://dir.salon.com/ent/movies/feature/2001/10/23/mulholland_drive_analysis/index.html?pn=1
- Original Message -
From: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Monday, August 16, 2004 11:11 pm
Subject: Re: (313) TECHNO
now that the archives are up...i think it would be a worthwhile exercise to
check out exactly how many negative posts come from both atomly and
yussel...
good showing men
wow!
is there an actual filter for that?
that would be amazing
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
now that the archives are up...i think it would be a worthwhile exercise to
check out exactly how many negative posts come from both atomly and
yussel...
good showing men
since you asked.
- Forwarded message from atomly [EMAIL PROTECTED] -
Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 07:02:41 -0500
From: atomly [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [313] CARL CRAIG ASKED TO STEP DOWN
To: 313@hyperreal.org
X-URL: http://www.atomly.com/
[Roberto Ty [EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Carl Craig has
dare i imply a filter for any futher posts you two make
uh...snap?
was that a diss?
judges?
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
dare i imply a filter for any futher posts you two make
where are these archives anyways?
can anyone help?
not at all...if i diss someone i don't use sarcasm
i'll bring it to your door-step
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: atomly [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 11:51 AM
Subject: Re: (313) track ID
uh...snap?
was
On Aug 17, 2004, at 1:47 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
jack dangers just redid the Forbidden Planet soundtrack
it's pretty good.
Speaking of Jack Dangers and Techno films ...
And he's going to be at The Egyptian theater in Hollywood tonight -
Tuesday the 17th, that is (as Tino Corp., along
1628 S. Bundy Drive
Los Angeles, CA
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
not at all...if i diss someone i don't use sarcasm
i'll bring it to your door-step
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: atomly [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
gonna head up there after pj harvey at the knitting factory
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004, Greg Earle wrote:
On Aug 17, 2004, at 1:47 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
jack dangers just redid the Forbidden Planet soundtrack
it's pretty good.
Speaking of Jack Dangers and Techno films ...
And he's
http://www.phys.ufl.edu/~aardvark/shannajohannf.gif
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 7:09 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: atomly; 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) track ID
1628 S. Bundy Drive
Los Angeles, CA
On Tue,
i can drive there in 5 hours if you like...
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: atomly [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 12:09 PM
Subject: Re: (313) track ID
1628 S. Bundy Drive
Los Angeles, CA
On Tue, 17
who did this record again?
the land of dreams etc
from 1992 somewhere
pink label
playing it again
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
i can drive there in 5 hours if you like...
OK... Let's bring this back to 313...
What would you listen to on the way there to get yourself pumped up?
--
:: atomly ::
[ [EMAIL PROTECTED] : www.atomly.com ...
[ atomiq records : po box 805319 chicago il 60680 : 312.804.5389
At 03:23 PM 8/17/2004, atomly wrote:
What would you listen to on the way there to get yourself pumped up?
i would recommend sonic destroyer by x-101
--
unsigned short int to_yer_mama;
matt kane's brain
http://www.hydrogenproject.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Tuesday, August 17, 2004, at 01:44 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
either I drank a large bottle of acid last night instead of my cocoa,
or
you lot are making no sense to me whatsoever.
am I the only one that doesn't understand?
24 Hour Party People, a techno film?
What? a bunch of
Yep, its good ole Bleed from De-Bug again and his untranslatable reviews :)
But if someone fancies having a go for me Id be most greatful.
Funky wie immer legt hier Fabrice Lig mit einem dieser vor lauter Glück nur
so sprudelnden Remixe los und lässt die Rimshots snappen, die Synthesizer
tröten
Hey Marina.
I think it was me missing the point really.
when people explain, I understand.
section 25
an ex-listmembers uncle was in this band!
cool uncle.
_
- End of message text
This
bonce=head
I've been acting up today and talking rubbish so I apologise.
Been raving all weekend. (at a party Francis from the list did)
Last track at the rave?
Arthur Russell.
heh ehhehhehehehh. top one.
loads of 313 shiznizz inbetween too.
I think you should meet each other halfway, fight to the death, and then
someone should be onhand to finish off the survivor. I can't believe you two
have nothing better to do in the middle of north-american august (ie summer)
than sit online and CC a few hundred (maybe thousand even?) while
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