DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: > Also > add in a new paragraph "Rules and Contracts notwithstanding, no > Announcer may ever bid on an Auction they are Announcing". This is a massive disadvantage: It's unfair to ask an officer to completely stay out of a subgame, especially because people

DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-04 Thread Aris Merchant
Several comments: For the sake of consistency with the exiting ruleset, crimes should be in the opposite order. So "Auction announcers SHALL NOT fail to correctly ...; doing so constitutes the Class-9 Crime of Auction Obfuscation". I would appreciate it if you added "willfully". You can't acciden

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Rebecca
yes because it's the one case where lying is perfectly doable and intentional lying could almost never be distinguished by anyone. class 9 isn't even huge. it's one above intending to ratify without objection incorrect information. fair point on the first one. I would have simplicity reign and say

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Kerim Aydin
Oh, and on the flip side, better make it a crime for the announcer to reveal bids to anyone before the auction is over! On Sun, 1 Jul 2018, Kerim Aydin wrote: > On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: > > Also > > add in a new paragraph "Rules and Contracts notwithstanding, no > > Announcer may eve

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Rebecca
very good call. On Mon, Jul 2, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > Oh, and on the flip side, better make it a crime for the announcer to > reveal bids to anyone before the auction is over! > > On Sun, 1 Jul 2018, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: >> > Also >> > add i

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Rebecca
I guess the announcer can't privately email anyone before the auction because they could clearly use such information. I would prefer a non SHA system though for reasons of agoran technical agnosticism/i don't know how to use technlogy. On Mon, Jul 2, 2018 at 10:14 AM, Rebecca wrote: > very good

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Kerim Aydin
Hmm, it's a problem. If you're worried that emails can't be proven, you have to be equally worried that a bidder may lie versus the announcer lying. If we get to the point that a bidder says "I sent you a bid" and the announcer says "no you didn't", where should the burden of proof be? (As an

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Rebecca
Burden of proof is with the bidder to prove it is wrong but criminal penalty is higher: class 9 crime v general "no faking". On Mon, Jul 2, 2018 at 10:15 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > Hmm, it's a problem. If you're worried that emails can't be proven, > you have to be equally worried that a bidde

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-01 Thread Rebecca
I guess instead of SHA hash we could make it "reasonably verifiable method" which could include that or eg, posting a private youtube video of yourself bidding etc. On Mon, Jul 2, 2018 at 10:20 AM, Rebecca wrote: > Burden of proof is with the bidder to prove it is wrong but criminal > penalty is

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread ATMunn
On 7/1/2018 8:04 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: Also add in a new paragraph "Rules and Contracts notwithstanding, no Announcer may ever bid on an Auction they are Announcing". This is a massive disadvantage: It's unfair to ask an officer to completely stay out o

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread ATMunn
I'd stick to one defined thing such as the SHA hash. I get that just saying "reasonably verifiable method" allows people to be creative, but really what we need is not creativity, it's verifiability. (is that a word?) People can push the limits of "reasonably verifiable", which could become a h

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread ATMunn
There are plenty of hashers online. You can just google "sha hash online" or something like that and there will be a bunch to choose from. Just put in the original text and they should spit out the hash at you, which you can then copy and paste. On 7/1/2018 8:15 PM, Rebecca wrote: I guess the

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018, ATMunn wrote: > On 7/1/2018 8:04 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: > > > Also > > > add in a new paragraph "Rules and Contracts notwithstanding, no > > > Announcer may ever bid on an Auction they are Announcing". > > > > This is a massive disadva

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread Reuben Staley
Obviously, it is ess-aych-ay-five-twelve. On Tue, Jul 3, 2018, 08:11 ATMunn wrote: > > On 7/1/2018 8:04 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > > > > > On Mon, 2 Jul 2018, Rebecca wrote: > >> Also > >> add in a new paragraph "Rules and Contracts notwithstanding, no > >> Announcer may ever bid on an Aucti

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread Timon Walshe-Grey
It's weird, I can't imagine how I would pronounce "SHA". I suspect the cause is just that I've only ever seen it written down and never actually spoken about it, so I've never _needed_ to pronounce it, but it's actually quite disturbing not being able to sound it in my head like with other words

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposals] Feasible Victory & Better Auctions

2018-07-03 Thread Kerim Aydin
I've been overly paranoid sometimes and used stuff like "I bid X coins and here's some tasty salt: F71FEC2C0685313F98D883EFFFC36F" On Tue, 3 Jul 2018, Timon Walshe-Grey wrote: > It's weird, I can't imagine how I would pronounce "SHA". I suspect the cause > is just that I've only ever seen it w