Re: 回复: 回复: [1003.1(2024)/Issue8 0001857]: Several problems with the new "lazy" regex quantifier.

2024-09-14 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
According to 792 the primary referenced implementations were just on the mailing list, he didn't copy them to the bug. Somebody might be able to search 2013 posts for them. BSD mentioned, so may be one of them. On Sun, Sep 15, 2024 at 12:29 AM, Niu Danny via austin-group-l at The Open Grou

Re: Thread queue position after unlocking PRIO_PROTECT mutex

2022-10-11 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
Re: the last bitI think that's to account for the case where an implementation may asynchronously allow an app thread to modify the base priority while another thread is blocked on it, not that the example sched_setparam() has to be in the same thread. While just adding it to the tail of the new

Re: Can struct sockaddr_un.sun_path be a flexible array member?

2022-07-16 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
Short answer, no. It was erroneously specified as such in the header because there wasn't an agreed upon symbolic constant for the size and I believe this notation was the convention before the C standard adopted flexible arrays. While an implementation should declare a symbolic constant, some

Re: POSIX msgfmt: effect of LC_CTYPE on PO file parsing

2022-05-11 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
This is for files that do not specify a separate codeset at all, and for interpreting a file that does specify one before it gets to the line with the codeset directive, is my understanding, so needs to be there (for now, maybe not in future). It maybe should be more explicit codeset changes sta

Re: When can shells remove "known" process IDs from the list?

2022-04-29 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
It appears to me the set -b wording needs updating, to clarify "may remove the job's process ID" is intended to exclude the blocking circumstances listed, and since it's a "may", not "shall", whether those exclusions are handled properly now is more a quality of implementation than conformance i

Re: how do to cmd subst with trailing newlines portable

2022-02-21 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The compliance factor for locales is more of documentation than exclusionary, so Thorsten is correct, the standard allows what he does. Just the fact localedef can use any encoding model via suitable charmap data makes this somewhat obvious. An implementation may provide locales using any charac

Re: POSIX gettext() and uselocale()

2022-01-16 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
Historically, gettext domains are process wide, making use in multi-threaded apps problematic to begin with. The *_l versions only partially address this. The uselocale() interface is included there for the cases where a locale is used by both a uselocale() and one or more of the *_l versions, i

Re: Future of locale, will there be POSIX.utf-8, what will it bring?

2022-01-07 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
scope of the C standard, I think a lot has been left out so implementations, or standards like POSIX, aren't locked into having to provide things that their end users will rarely, if ever, need. On Fri, Jan 7, 2022 at 1:46 PM, Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: Hello. shwa

Re: Future of locale, will there be POSIX.utf-8, what will it bring?

2022-01-07 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The first Issue 8 draft is focusing, afaik, on adding the C1x changes and Mantis Issue 8 tagged items. The changes to XBD 6, 7, etc., that will formally add a POSIX UTF8 locale are to be part of the second, maybe third, draft. This is why you don't see them yet. For maximum compatibility with ex

Re: cut -DF

2021-12-04 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
Yes, there's a path; file an Enhancement Request in Mantis. However, if toybox wants to be more POSIX conforming it'll have to add an awk implementation anyways, eventually, so not sure such a request would get much traction for sponsorship. Those with awk already might not want to add it to the

Re: Interpretation starting for a 30 day review (1440)

2021-10-29 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
This is felt required to get POSIX accurately describing what the C standard version of system() requires, taking into account where sh differs from the minimal requirements of the command shell in that standard. POSIX is as it is because it was assumed no programmer would use a option switch ch

Re: What string representations of "zero" expr should consider as "zero"?

2021-07-02 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
To the extent XBD 11.1, #6 applies and 2's complement notation is the internal representation required, the standard is pretty clear. The first 3 cases all evaluate to numeric 0, whether specified in paired quotes or not since the shell does quote removal, the +0 case is always a string since +

Re: Minutes of the 14th June 2021 Teleconference

2021-06-15 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
That was a typo, it looks, 723 for 713. Correct link is: https://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=713 On Tue, Jun 15, 2021 at 4:45 PM, Fred J. Tydeman via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 18:13:35 +0100 Andrew Josey via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: >

Re: behavior of printf '\x61'

2021-04-15 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
It is covered in Item 7 of those 11 exceptions, 'x' falling under the blanket "every character not specified is unspecified". Portable code is expected to use the work alike octal escape, not hex codes. On Fri, Apr 16, 2021 at 12:05 AM, Philip Guenther via austin-group-l at The Open Group w

Re: [Shell Command Language][shortcomings of command utlity][improving robustness of POSIX shells]

2021-04-12 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
, Joerg Schilling via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: "shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group" wrote: > No, it's not nonsense. The definition of comment has all characters, > including '!', shall be ignored until newline or end-of-file being

Re: [Shell Command Language][shortcomings of command utlity][improving robustness of POSIX shells]

2021-04-11 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
here in a script, at the expense of a few extra characters for the here delimiter and set commands, without any other changes to tokenizing or the grammar. On Sun, Apr 11, 2021 at 12:15 PM, Harald van Dijk wrote: On 11/04/2021 17:09, shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group w

Re: [Shell Command Language][shortcomings of command utlity][improving robustness of POSIX shells]

2021-04-11 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
any of those. There is NO allowance for '!' being the second character as reserved for implementation extensions. On Sun, Apr 11, 2021 at 11:37 AM, Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Sun, 11 Apr 2021 10:46:48 +0000 (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <14131279

Re: [Shell Command Language][shortcomings of command utlity][improving robustness of POSIX shells]

2021-04-11 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
That's bugs in those shells for POSIX mode then, that I see. The conforming behavior is /usr/gcc is found and succeeds at doing nothing, since it contains just a comment line. Other elements of path never get checked. Even in non-POSIX mode, trying to process it as a shebang with "/bad" as a ENO

Re: SIGSTKSZ is now a run-time variable

2021-03-09 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
simple check of VERSION at the top of a source C file suffices now to indicate those constants shall be available. On Tuesday, March 9, 2021 Eric Blake wrote: On 3/9/21 10:14 AM, shwaresyst wrote: > > To me that looks like a conformance violation and should be reverted. There > is no

Re: SIGSTKSZ is now a run-time variable

2021-03-09 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
To me that looks like a conformance violation and should be reverted. There is no _SC_SIGSTKSZ defined in by the standard, to begin with, so that use of sysconf() is a non-portable extension on its own. I could see the definition of SIGSTKSZ being changed to the static minimum a particular pr

Re: [1003.1(2016/18)/Issue7+TC2 0001454]: Conflict between "case" description and grammar

2021-02-19 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
At that point in the grammar TOKEN is "esac)" or "(esac)", from which the WORD "esac" is extracted, not converted to Esac, as right paren is not an operator character that terminates token recognition. Rule 4 applies to "esac ;" or "esac" linebreak, no right paren discovered on lookahead, that

RE: clarification needed: shell 'exec' + function (builtin, …)

2020-12-09 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
I agree more clarification is desirable. The reason I see as why the function isn't executed is it may be treating it as an invoke of "sh -c ls", because ls is a function, but this new sh does not inherit that definition so it looks on path instead and finds the utility. On Wednesday, December

Re: [1003.1(2016/18)/Issue7+TC2 0001346]: Require support for CLOCK_MONOTONIC

2020-12-03 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
e versions of the standard with one runtime and set of headers. On Thursday, December 3, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Thu, 3 Dec 2020 18:11:51 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <684426419.4103424.1607019111...@mail.yahoo.com>   | The 20yymmL shall be replaced wi

Re: [1003.1(2016/18)/Issue7+TC2 0001346]: Require support for CLOCK_MONOTONIC

2020-12-03 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The 20yymmL shall be replaced with the value specific to Issue 8 when that is finalized, not that an implementation may choose an arbitrary value after 2000. It's a placeholder to indicate this for the bug report only. The other 200809L values all get a blanket change eventually too, consistent

Re: make(1) parallelization, but especially .WAITing

2020-11-03 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
is specified. On Tuesday, November 3, 2020 Paul Smith via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: On Mon, 2020-11-02 at 15:44 +, shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: > With that phrasing is also reserved, since it > is not " followed ONLY by uppercase". Using "

Re: make(1) parallelization, but especially .WAITing

2020-11-02 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
With that phrasing is also reserved, since it is not " followed ONLY by uppercase". Using ".NO_parallel" would be similarly conforming, it could be argued. On Monday, November 2, 2020 Geoff Clare via austin-group-l at The Open Group wrote: Joerg Schilling wrote, on 31 Oct 2020: > > Well this

Re: printf (the utility) expected range of integer values

2020-10-24 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
t 2's comp. internal format as an actual value. On Saturday, October 24, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Sat, 24 Oct 2020 16:47:41 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <160402159.2963847.1603558061...@mail.yahoo.com>   | The text relevant to all this I s

RE: printf (the utility) expected range of integer values

2020-10-24 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The text relevant to all this I see is the paragraph at line 104150, page 3114, c181.pdf, which limits outputs to the internal representation range of the format characters used, converted back to text. This should probably be explicit that the conversion shall detect overflows, positive or neg

RE: Overflow conditions for read() and fread() (was: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function)

2020-10-07 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The C standard leaves it undefined for fread() because it doesn't require EOVERFLOW in , that I see, or presumes size_t will always be a short or int type. Since POSIX does have it and does not presume a limited width I feel this is a place where a CX extension is warranted as a portability co

RE: [1003.1(2016/18)/Issue7+TC2 0001406]: clarification of SEEK_END when current pointer doesn't match buffer size

2020-09-28 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
As I read it, file size and *seek(SEEK_END, 0) will still be 16, reflecting how many bytes were written to the buffer and which had to be malloc'd. The rewind overwrites the first bytes and a flush, close reflects the size of data considered to be valid after the rewind, since there is no guara

Re: Proposal to update reference to POSIX in the ISO C++ standard

2020-09-28 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
It's my understanding ISO/IEC was to bump their distribution also, to keep in synch. Nick S. would be more conversant with the details of thay, though. On Monday, September 28, 2020 Jonathan Wakely wrote: On 28/09/20 14:36 +0000, shwaresyst wrote: > >The 2018 edition is the latest I

Re: Proposal to update reference to POSIX in the ISO C++ standard

2020-09-28 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The 2018 edition is the latest ISO/IEC/IEEE version, in that it was balloted and approved to keep the IEEE "current standard" clock from timing out. The 2008 edition plus TCs is now the prior version, in the formal sense. On Thursday, September 24, 2020 Jonathan Wakely via austin-group-l at The

Re: behaviour of pthread_attr_[sg]etguardsize with thread maintained stack

2020-09-22 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
application. On Tuesday, September 22, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Tue, 22 Sep 2020 14:38:07 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <32911555.5186984.1600785487...@mail.yahoo.com>   | Yes, it is no longer a factor, I would have guessed that is what "not

Re: behaviour of pthread_attr_[sg]etguardsize with thread maintained stack

2020-09-22 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
pointer to the attr object. On Tuesday, September 22, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:05:05 + (UTC)     From:        "shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group"     Message-ID:  <1248402378.5117076.1600772705...@mail.yahoo.com>   | Once p

RE: behaviour of pthread_attr_[sg]etguardsize with thread maintained stack

2020-09-22 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
Once pthread_attr_init() successfully completes the guardsize should be set to the default value and may be examined by pthread_attr_getguardsize(), that I see. A call to setguardsize() should store the value and be returned by subsequent getguardsize() calls, even though it is not used after

RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-02 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
nd the need to page-align data structures in some situations, I still don’t see its relevance to a discussion of the C standard’s requirements regarding padding in struct types and how it’s affected by flexible arrays.   From: shwaresyst Sent: September 2, 2020 1:58 PM To: Wojtek Lerch

RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-02 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
n a VLA.  A flexible array is not a VLA, in the sense C uses the term.   From: shwaresyst Sent: September 1, 2020 4:55 PM To: Wojtek Lerch ; austin-group-l@opengroup.org Subject: RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function   What that refers to, it looks,

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-01 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
hing still needs to be implemented to be wrapped. On Tuesday, September 1, 2020 Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: shwaresyst wrote in <1739483391.1543785.1598977118...@mail.yahoo.com>: |No, it couldn't introduce such a macro, because such would have to \ |assume all d_name entries are the s

RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-01 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
. Furthermore, requiring these existing implementations to change their layout would break binary backwards compatibility with previous versions.   See DR282 for more details:http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg14/www/docs/dr_282.htm     From: shwaresyst Sent: September 1, 2020 2:27 PM

RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-01 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
I agree some additional clarity might be useful there, in the C standard. I'm reading it as the intent being sizeof is equivalent to offsetof the VLA in accordance with the restrictions placed on it by use of the . or -> operators, which may not need extra bytes (so &s->vla == (&s + sizeof(s))

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-01 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
No, it couldn't introduce such a macro, because such would have to assume all d_name entries are the same length. Adding an option to the interface to do a count, as a vararg parameter, and directly malloc the necessary space, returned via my suggested change to buf as a **, is plausible. Since

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000697]: Adding of a getdirentries() function

2020-09-01 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
It's my understanding, by C11 6.7.2.1p18, sizeof on a struct with a variable array works as if the variable member was not present, but does count any bytes added for alignment padding, as this will be a fixed amount for each use of the struct. It is up to the application, like with variable ar

Re: Pseudoterminal terminology in POSIX

2020-08-05 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
e Open Group wrote: shwaresyst wrote, on 05 Aug 2020: > > On Wednesday, August 5, 2020 Geoff Clare via austin-group-l at The Open Group > wrote: > >> My own thoughts up to now had been that, since the slave side is the >> side that is intended to be used as a terminal in the n

Re: Pseudoterminal terminology in POSIX

2020-08-05 Thread shwaresyst via austin-group-l at The Open Group
The slave side is ancillary to the master, sorry, as physical terminals are ancillary to the processor hardware, imo. Inverting the relationship makes it look like it is the intent of the slave side to source the majority of the data, when more often it is only monitoring output data sourced by

Re: ${unset_var=~:~user} (was: A question about interpretation)

2020-07-31 Thread shwaresyst
Robert has a point that assignments, as represented by the ASSIGNMENT_WORD token in the grammar, should be represented by a production of the form: ASSIGNMENT_WORD :: name EQ WORD For 2.6.1 that is the assignment form referenced where word expansion, of the WORD in that production, is relevant

Re: Status of $'...' addition (was: ksh93 job control behaviour)

2020-07-31 Thread shwaresyst
uence conversions are plausible, it's just how has no portable specification currently, it is left as unspecified. On Friday, July 31, 2020 Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: shwaresyst wrote in <1371185781.9853799.1596158030...@mail.yahoo.com>: |It is not "some sensible \u sequences" alone.

Re: Status of $'...' addition (was: ksh93 job control behaviour)

2020-07-30 Thread shwaresyst
ere are interfaces for the utilities to be written in that understand left-associative combining sequences, and these interfaces are portable because requirements in XBD add that support. On Thursday, July 30, 2020 Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: shwaresyst wrote in <1127836834.9524758.1596121054.

Re: Status of $'...' addition (was: ksh93 job control behaviour)

2020-07-30 Thread shwaresyst
to be written, or published if some have been. On Thursday, July 30, 2020 Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: shwaresyst wrote in <311169368.9432836.1596108598...@mail.yahoo.com>: |On Thursday, July 30, 2020 Geoff Clare wrote: |Robert Elz wrote, on 29 Jul 2020: |> |> Speaking of which,

RE: Status of $'...' addition (was: ksh93 job control behaviour)

2020-07-30 Thread shwaresyst
Also, as something new, its inclusion is part of a later draft of Issue 8. Additional issues it depends on need to be addressed first, specified fully, and incorporated. This is more why it went on the back burner, that I recall. Various other bugs are in similar state; the prerequisites to fin

RE: Should POSIX/SUS advise against MSG_OOB in recognition of RFC 6093?

2020-07-25 Thread shwaresyst
That the semantics are unspecified already disqualifies them from use by portable applications. If it was implementation-defined then such an addition might be warranted, that I see. On Saturday, July 25, 2020 Danny Niu wrote: RFC 6093 "On the Implementation of the TCP Urgent Mechanism" surveys

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001345]: date(1) default format

2020-07-21 Thread shwaresyst
C", and by extension "POSIX", locale is unchanged from C99, and has not added %Z. This would apply to its usage both by strftime() and strptime(), to  maintain symmetry, I would think. On Tuesday, July 21, 2020 J William Piggott wrote: On Sun, 12 Jul 2020, shwaresyst wrote: Thank

Re: [Issue 8 drafts 0001349]: Where to obtain ISO/IEC standards (footnote)

2020-07-19 Thread shwaresyst
That reference was left as-is because the Issue 8 draft targets C17 (or 18), but there's a chance c2x may get ratified first so that may affect later drafts. On Sunday, July 19, 2020 Quentin Rameau wrote: Hello, > == > Summary

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001345]: date(1) default format

2020-07-12 Thread shwaresyst
The reason for the disconnect, that I see, is because the %Z modifier references the TZ environment variable, not a value in a struct tm, adding it to d_t_fmt would disqualify the definition from being __STD_C__ conforming. This is one of the areas where the C standard can be considered broken,

Re: [Issue 8 drafts] Error in XCU 2.9.4.5

2020-07-08 Thread shwaresyst
That still has some_other_command never getting executed, so I think just adding the printf sufficient. On Wednesday, July 8, 2020 Nick Stoughton wrote: The whole point of this example is to show that the exit status *of the while loop* will be zero if the loop does not execute, and if you care

RE: Why does %#x omit the 0x prefix for a zero value?

2020-07-06 Thread shwaresyst
.yiv9332244889MsoChpDefault {font-family:sans-serif;} _filtered {}#yiv9332244889 div.yiv9332244889WordSection1 {}#yiv9332244889 Yes, but the same logic (0 being unambiguous in all radices) equally applies to 1.   From: shwaresyst Sent: Monday, July 6, 2020 18:35 To: Schwarz, Konrad (CT RDA IOT SES

RE: Why does %#x omit the 0x prefix for a zero value?

2020-07-06 Thread shwaresyst
The necessity for "0x" is to disambiguate from octal numbers with their leading '0', or decimal for a context allowing leading zeroes, but since a 0 is the same in all radices I suspect the decision was not to require it to keep field width minimal for delimited formats like CSV. As to 2nd, "

Re: LC_CTYPE=UTF-8

2020-06-25 Thread shwaresyst
There are plans for this, having a POSIX.UTF-8 locale as an XSI base requirement. There may be POSIX.UTF-E and UTF-I locales too; same features, simply the different charmaps. As options there may even be, albeit this is unlikely as no platform I'm aware of fully supports ISO-6429 now, a POSIX.

Re: LC_CTYPE=UTF-8

2020-06-25 Thread shwaresyst
The locale requirements specified in the C standard are what is applicable for implementations that limit their character encoding to the basic source and execution character sets. POSIX requires implementations to support, in at least one provided charmap, the superset of the basic sets repres

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001345]: date(1) default format

2020-06-21 Thread shwaresyst
Re: Are not the examples demonstrating relevant date utility specification requirments as follows: No, they are examples of how the various specified elements can produce output reflecting various locale LC_TIME settings, that's all. The actual format string is still an unspecified implementati

RE: Is ksh93's default alias command='command ' POSIX compliant?

2020-06-14 Thread shwaresyst
The command alias is nominally conforming, I believe, in that recursive alias expansion isn't permitted so looking for a utility named command still occurs. However, the implementation of various utilities as aliases changes the reporting of 'command -v', or '-V',  to that they are aliases and

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001345]: date(1) default format

2020-06-10 Thread shwaresyst
There is also the POSIX locale is a superset of the C locale as defined by the C standard, because it requires support of the Portable Character Set, which has more chars than C requires, and has the LC_MESSAGES category; as primary differences. On Wednesday, June 10, 2020 Joerg Schilling wro

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001347]: stderr access mode - "is expected to be" is not defined

2020-05-29 Thread shwaresyst
No, I did have the "respectively" in there, for 3 separate possible file descriptions. It is also, near as I can tell, a requirement of the C standard those FILE records exist and be usable at program startup, whether included or not, for referencing either an already open stream or be in a c

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001347]: stderr access mode - "is expected to be" is not defined

2020-05-29 Thread shwaresyst
equire this. On Friday, May 29, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Fri, 29 May 2020 14:59:48 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <58121613.1659567.1590764388...@mail.yahoo.com>   | Isn't there something about stdin, stdout, and stderr being required to   | re

RE: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001347]: stderr access mode - "is expected to be" is not defined

2020-05-29 Thread shwaresyst
Re: matter in connection with C's stderr but only for file descriptor 2 (as inherited by the login shell). Isn't there something about stdin, stdout, and stderr being required to reference the same open file descriptions as fd's 0, 1, and 2, respectively, with inheritance? An application can c

Re: Help request and introduction

2020-05-18 Thread shwaresyst
Personally, the offer is appreciated, but I would not find scans of the documents wrapped as a pdf all that useful, if this is intent. Using the original troff, if this is still available, to generate copy and searchable versions, with TOC and xrefs, would be nicer. On Monday, May 18, 2020 J Wi

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001341]: The resolution of bugid:1208 as amended by bugnote:4830 is incorrect

2020-05-09 Thread shwaresyst
Just floating this out there... While a posix_spawnp() kernel imp doing PATH searches relative to the parent's pwd is a well defined behavior, should there be an additional file_action that search for the executable happens after the chdir action; for the case where PATH, as inherited by the chi

Re: [1003.1(2016)/Issue7+TC2 0001341]: The resolution of bugid:1208 as amended by bugnote:4830 is incorrect

2020-05-09 Thread shwaresyst
aturday, May 9, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Sat, 9 May 2020 13:00:54 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <600759678.614717.1589029254...@mail.yahoo.com>   | Just floating this out there... While a posix_spawnp() kernel imp doing   | PATH searches relative to

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-22 Thread shwaresyst
indicate end of pattern, not ')', but these don't become part of the base PCS until Issue 9. On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 Joerg Schilling wrote: shwaresyst wrote: > No, you only lex up to the newline or EOF in the first pass, whether the > ending ')' or other co

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-22 Thread shwaresyst
mmand in addition to cmd-name that specified alias names were to be checked for first lexically, then you'd have a stronger case, but it never has that I've seen. On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 Joerg Schilling wrote: shwaresyst wrote: > When you are evaluating substitutions, yes, ex

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-21 Thread shwaresyst
trying to claim it is impossible to have an interpreter that expands alias bodies first, simply that sh does not do it that way due to the possible ambiguities. On Tuesday, April 21, 2020 Joerg Schilling wrote: shwaresyst wrote: > No, those are attempts at speed optimizations; the descript

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-20 Thread shwaresyst
bert Elz wrote:     Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 2020 21:17:12 +0000 (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <1050536090.3716059.1587417432...@mail.yahoo.com>   | No, those are attempts at speed optimizations; I'm sad to have to reply like this, but do you have any idea at all

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-20 Thread shwaresyst
holds an actual name until recognition of the line as a whole has been completed. On Monday, April 20, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 2020 18:01:49 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <1837359500.1041757.1587405709...@mail.yahoo.com>   | It seems

Re: sh: aliases in command substitutions

2020-04-20 Thread shwaresyst
It seems to me that what is missing, in XCU 2.3.1, is a statement that use of keywords in alias bodies is unspecified behavior. Even outside double quotes an initial scan collecting tokens to form a logical line distinct from a potential io-here body will have to treat an alias name as a comm

RE: Bug 1016: is anybody working on adding O_NOCLOBBER?

2020-04-16 Thread shwaresyst
yes, it is being worked on but not as a high priority, so Option 2 appears to be a no go. It may be better to revisit the bug and add a test for its availability to sysconf()/getconf as a formal option, in a Coming Attractions sense, so code can be written portably now based on using Option 1 o

Re: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000871]: Missing potential error code, EOVERFLOW

2020-04-02 Thread shwaresyst
ce. On Thursday, April 2, 2020 Geoff Clare wrote: shwaresyst wrote, on 02 Apr 2020: > > This is not a duplicate, bug 315 covers only one case, this points out it > applies to other places. If anything it is a child, not duplicate, that's why > it was Accepted. It was not

RE: [1003.1(2013)/Issue7+TC1 0000871]: Missing potential error code, EOVERFLOW

2020-04-02 Thread shwaresyst
This is not a duplicate, bug 315 covers only one case, this points out it applies to other places. If anything it is a child, not duplicate, that's why it was Accepted. On Thursday, April 2, 2020 Austin Group Bug Tracker wrote: The following issue has been set as DUPLICATE OF issue 315.

Re: Mantis project for Issue8 bug reports?

2020-03-29 Thread shwaresyst
Um, I did not say that people should get a draft whenever they want one, simply that the other list is being underutilized for discussion of issues arising from Mantis, not any drafts, until we have a release we feel is ready for public review. I wholly agree trying to reference non-releases wo

RE: Mantis project for Issue8 bug reports?

2020-03-29 Thread shwaresyst
This has been suggested, but the ORs feel the time for such is when Issue 8 is formally released, not before. The austin-futures-l list is more the intended vehicle for issues of that nature, as to what's in place already, but it does not have its own Mantis, or other browser based, interface.

Re: sed '\n\nnd'

2020-03-26 Thread shwaresyst
it likely was. On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 Harald van Dijk wrote: On 25/03/2020 23:30, shwaresyst wrote: > yes, without them the argument would be "nnnd", after quote removal by > the shell. The reasoning in first reply was meant to show that the > non-GNU versions might be er

Re: sed '\n\nnd'

2020-03-25 Thread shwaresyst
se as delimeter overrides that interpretation, to get the results observed. On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 Harald van Dijk wrote: On 25/03/2020 21:09, shwaresyst wrote: > If it wasn't in single quotes, then that might be plausible, but I don't > see it as the intent since no other alia

Re: sed '\n\nnd'

2020-03-25 Thread shwaresyst
se as delimeter overrides that interpretation, to get the results observed. On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 Harald van Dijk wrote: On 25/03/2020 21:09, shwaresyst wrote: > If it wasn't in single quotes, then that might be plausible, but I don't > see it as the intent since no other alia

Re: sed '\n\nnd'

2020-03-25 Thread shwaresyst
terminator, and the following 'n' is the terminator, before the 'd' command. Should there be something explicit about aliases not being usable when repurposed as delimiter, maybe. On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 Harald van Dijk wrote: On 25/03/2020 19:44, shwaresyst wrote: > The GNU

RE: sed '\n\nnd'

2020-03-25 Thread shwaresyst
The GNU version is more correct, in my opinion, in that the use of n as a delimiter should take precedence over its use as control character alias with the wording as is. The other versions appear to consider the BRE as so does not match 'n'. On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 Oğuz wrote:     echo

Re: [1003.1(2008)/Issue 7 0000518]: Allow make's "include" to include multiple files

2020-03-19 Thread shwaresyst
I can't reopen the bug to add a note, so like we did 1318 on top of 411, it probably should be reopened and discussed. Straightforward or not, what you put in is not what is marked as to be put in. On Thursday, March 19, 2020 Geoff Clare wrote: shwaresyst wrote, on 18 Mar

RE: [1003.1(2008)/Issue 7 0000518]: Allow make's "include" to include multiple files

2020-03-18 Thread shwaresyst
Note 1190 does not include mention of -include, so imo a separate note should be added showing what was committed. As example, the text about "file not found" always invoking unspecified behavior is not true for -include, it is now explicit these are ignored as the specified behavior. On Wednes

Re: XCU: 'exit' trap condition

2020-03-16 Thread shwaresyst
The wording can be construed the intent is the EXIT trap is always expected to be called, with a SIGEXIT delivered to the context of the subshell and not the parent, and otherwise to the parent for performing the trap in its context and terminating the parent. While a subshell context is create

RE: Weird possibility with async processes, $!, and long running scripts

2020-03-15 Thread shwaresyst
For the example provided I think you are right it is a potential issue in that the shell only specifies that commands will be in a separate execution environment, without being explicit the requirement of fork() to keep process IDs unique applies to these environments. It just has that the envi

Re: [1003.1(2008)/Issue 7 0000411]: adding atomic FD_CLOEXEC support

2020-03-12 Thread shwaresyst
Yw... Also, while change is minor, just putting out for next meeting, we probably want to take a look at the Related: bugs with Interpretations, see if any those need a timer restart to reflect the change properly. On Thursday, March 12, 2020 Eric Blake wrote: On 3/12/20 1:02 PM, shwaresyst

RE: [1003.1(2008)/Issue 7 0000411]: adding atomic FD_CLOEXEC support

2020-03-12 Thread shwaresyst
Fyi,  the Last updated: date at top wasn't changed. On Thursday, March 12, 2020 Austin Group Bug Tracker wrote: A NOTE has been added to this issue. == https://www.austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=411

Re: XCU: 'return' from subshell

2020-03-11 Thread shwaresyst
I agree this is something suitable for a TC type resolution. However, given the amount of existing practice, I do not see we should leave anything unspecified for Issue 8, even if some implementations break as a result. Either it always stops function execution or dot file processing, which ca

Re: XCU: 'return' from subshell

2020-03-10 Thread shwaresyst
ase. On Tuesday, March 10, 2020 Dirk Fieldhouse wrote: On 10/03/20 18:25, shwaresyst wrote: > > I basically agree this is an issue - I see return as more for being interpreted as a lexical scope abort, whatever the execution context, and exit an execution scope abort, such as a subshell or s

RE: XCU: 'return' from subshell

2020-03-10 Thread shwaresyst
I basically agree this is an issue - I see return as more for being interpreted as a lexical scope abort, whatever the execution context, and exit an execution scope abort, such as a subshell or separate script utility environment, as their basic intent. Further complicating things, I don't see

Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-25 Thread shwaresyst
backwards compatibility or needing any new keywords. On Tuesday, February 25, 2020 Robert Elz wrote:     Date:        Tue, 25 Feb 2020 17:47:23 + (UTC)     From:        shwaresyst     Message-ID:  <1701159045.321204.1582652843...@mail.yahoo.com>   | The thing is, various shells have imp

Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-25 Thread shwaresyst
The thing is, various shells have implemented time as keyword, so this bug is trying to get the standard to reflect actual practice that ignored that Rationale. The debate is more some things allowed to utilities aren't allowed for keywords, and vice versa, so there are advantages to both. As

Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-24 Thread shwaresyst
I disagree with the notion of using names with colons, especially for new utilities, mainly because colon is the character used as path separator in PATH and there may be usage ambiguities resulting from this overload. I'd be more in favor of implementing labels with another character entirely

Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-24 Thread shwaresyst
If you're going to go with 'z' suffix, "statz" is an option too; for session/process statistics or "state of the machine". On Monday, February 24, 2020 Scott Lurndal wrote: On Mon, Feb 24, 2020 at 09:23:16AM +, Geoff Clare wrote: > Chet Ramey wrote, on 16 Feb 2020: > > > > On 2/15/20 9:42 P

RE: [Online Pubs 0001326]: Superfluous punctuations

2020-02-23 Thread shwaresyst
The parentheses are there to indicate all those are interfaces, without the wordier "last msgsnd interface call", or similar, in those lines. On Sunday, February 23, 2020 Austin Group Bug Tracker wrote: The following issue has been SUBMITTED. ==

Re: Re: Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-18 Thread shwaresyst
7;t require this so silently storing the definition, and confusing the user, are more the conforming behavior. -Original Message----- From: Joerg Schilling To: shwaresyst ; kre Cc: gwc ; austin-group-l Sent: Tue, Feb 18, 2020 12:08 PM Subject: Re: Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 267]: time (k

Re: Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-18 Thread shwaresyst
riginal Message- From: Robert Elz To: shwaresyst Cc: Joerg.Schilling ; gwc ; austin-group-l Sent: Tue, Feb 18, 2020 11:34 AM Subject: Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 267]: time (keyword) Date:Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:26:43 + (UTC) From: shwaresyst

Re: [1003.1(2004)/Issue 6 0000267]: time (keyword)

2020-02-18 Thread shwaresyst
It shouldn't matter whether a token prefix matches a reserved word or not; because the lparen is not separated by a function definition should be the "best, longest" match production that it is interpreted as, and so wouldn't be a syntax error. It's on use that keyword recognition would hide w

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