RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Kent Fredric
If you grep CPAN you'll find a lot of ad-hoc ways of asking usespace if network testing is permitted. http://grep.cpan.me/?q=%28if|unless%29\s.%2BENV.*NET It seems wide spread enough that we may as well establish a common way of doing it, document it, and then enhance the available tooling to mak

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread David Golden
Kent, I'm not sold on this. The existing author/release/automated test environment variables define categories of tests that testers opt into. What you're describing is a variable to detect a capability. It's closer to NONINTERACTIVE_TESTING, but note which way the defaults go -- the assumption

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Kent Fredric
On 12 June 2014 02:29, David Golden wrote: > And the reason for the variable in the first place is that prompting > can hang. Avoiding hangs is a higher priority for me than avoiding > failure. > > I'd be more interested in seeing a standard way to probe the > capability rather than rely on test

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread David Golden
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 11:52 AM, Kent Fredric wrote: > "Has the user in question granted permission to use the internet". I disagree with the premise that one needs to ask. Users are already running arbitrary Perl code and must take responsibility for anything that it might do and not run it i

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Jens Rehsack
Am 11.06.2014 um 19:08 schrieb David Golden : > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 11:52 AM, Kent Fredric wrote: >> "Has the user in question granted permission to use the internet". > > I disagree with the premise that one needs to ask. Users are already > running arbitrary Perl code and must take respo

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread David Golden
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 1:37 PM, Jens Rehsack wrote: > I think there're setups where smoke tests run in a private. not routed > network segment. While this is uncommon, probably an envvar is the right > approach, but it should be one like LOCALTESTS_ONLY instead of > NETWORK_IS_AVAILABLE. This all

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Jens Rehsack
Am 11.06.2014 um 19:48 schrieb David Golden : > [...] > I still think it's better for tests to check rather than rely on > testers to set such variables. You never know whether a test fails because of failure or insufficient capabilities. So a restricting envvar isn't worse at all. Cheers -- J

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Kent Fredric
On 12 June 2014 05:58, Jens Rehsack wrote: > You never know whether a test fails because of failure or insufficient > capabilities. So a restricting envvar isn't worse at all. > I think he was more saying that he'd prefer: set NO_NETWORK_TESTING=1 over set NETWORK_TESTING=1 Where net

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-11 Thread Jens Rehsack
Am 11.06.2014 um 20:24 schrieb Kent Fredric : > > On 12 June 2014 05:58, Jens Rehsack wrote: > You never know whether a test fails because of failure or insufficient > capabilities. So a restricting envvar isn't worse at all. > > I think he was more saying that he'd prefer: > > set NO_NE

Re: RFC Consensus on Network testing ENV?

2014-06-12 Thread Kent Fredric
On 12 June 2014 06:37, Jens Rehsack wrote: > > 1. begin test > > 2. load test networking module module > > 3. is NO_NETWORK_TESTING? SKIP! > > 4. can access specified resources? yes -> run tests > > no -> SKIP! > > In that case I suggest to