Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities

2019-03-30 Thread Owen Rubel
My ethics teacher in high school summed it up well I thought in stating your rights end where mine begin. Owen Rubel oru...@gmail.com On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 1:14 PM Eric Covener wrote: > On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 2:32 PM Daniel Gruno wrote: > > > > On 30/03/2019 13.23, Jim Jagielski wrote: > >

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities

2019-03-30 Thread Naomi Slater
Jim, you have correctly identified that context is important when interpreting someone's words On Sat 30. Mar 2019 at 22:43, Jim Jagielski wrote: > If you heard on the TV that the Mayor was charged with > discrimination, your first reaction would not be to > assume that she is choosy about her g

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities

2019-03-30 Thread Jim Jagielski
If you heard on the TV that the Mayor was charged with discrimination, your first reaction would not be to assume that she is choosy about her golden mustard. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For addi

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities

2019-03-30 Thread Eric Covener
On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 2:32 PM Daniel Gruno wrote: > > On 30/03/2019 13.23, Jim Jagielski wrote: > > > > > >> On Mar 30, 2019, at 1:32 PM, Eric Covener wrote: > >> > >>> I'm not going to (intentionally) actively discriminate for or against > >>> anyone. But I will protect your right, as an indi

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Jim Jagielski
> On Mar 30, 2019, at 2:50 PM, Naomi Slater wrote: > > On Sat, 30 Mar 2019 at 19:23, Jim Jagielski wrote: > >> >> Discrimination, by definition, is unjust, unwarranted or prejudicial. >> > > simplistic and incorrect > > discrimination, *by definition*, means you discriminate, i.e., tell a

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Eric Covener
On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 2:17 PM Ross Gardler wrote: > I think the problem is that *I* used the term "positive discrimination". That > has led to an interpretation of someone elses words through a cloudy lens. > Before making assumptions about that other persons intent you should listen > to the

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Ross Gardler
se the term "affirmative action" from now on... > > > From: Naomi Slater > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2019 11:50 AM > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on > "meritocracy") > > On Sat, 30 Mar 2019 at

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Jim Jagielski
; From: Naomi Slater > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2019 11:50 AM > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on > "meritocracy") > > On Sat, 30 Mar 2019 at 19:23, Jim Jagielski wrote: > >> >> Discrimi

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Ross Gardler
Let use the term "affirmative action" from now on... From: Naomi Slater Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2019 11:50 AM To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy") On Sat,

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Naomi Slater
On Sat, 30 Mar 2019 at 19:23, Jim Jagielski wrote: > > Discrimination, by definition, is unjust, unwarranted or prejudicial. > simplistic and incorrect discrimination, *by definition*, means you discriminate, i.e., tell apart we discriminate when we determine who "has merit". but most people a

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities

2019-03-30 Thread Daniel Gruno
On 30/03/2019 13.23, Jim Jagielski wrote: On Mar 30, 2019, at 1:32 PM, Eric Covener wrote: I'm not going to (intentionally) actively discriminate for or against anyone. But I will protect your right, as an individual, to do so as long as you protect my right to help you achieve the right

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Ross Gardler
ore making assumptions about that other persons intent you should listen to their words. Have you watched Joan's presentation? Ross From: Eric Covener Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2019 10:32 AM To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Re: Building and Susta

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Jim Jagielski
> On Mar 30, 2019, at 1:32 PM, Eric Covener wrote: > >> I'm not going to (intentionally) actively discriminate for or against >> anyone. But I will protect your right, as an individual, to do so as long as >> you protect my right to help you achieve the >> right balance in our broader commun

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Sam Ruby
On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 1:33 PM Eric Covener wrote: > > > I'm not going to (intentionally) actively discriminate for or against > > anyone. But I will protect your right, as an individual, to do so as long > > as you protect my right to help you achieve the > > right balance in our broader commu

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Eric Covener
> I'm not going to (intentionally) actively discriminate for or against anyone. > But I will protect your right, as an individual, to do so as long as you > protect my right to help you achieve the > right balance in our broader communities by stamping out the existence of any > discrimination (

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Joan Touzet
Thanks for this post, Shane. You share a number of my concerns. I am absolutely not blind to opposition to some of the things I've suggested, but I would argue that the thread on the topic has become so negative and heated that informed discussion isn't useful. Again I encourage others to listen

Re: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Ross Gardler
ka.ms/ghei36> From: Shane Curcuru Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2019 8:43:08 AM To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy") Joan Touzet wrote on 3/30/19 12:52 AM: ...snip... > Precisely t

Building and Sustaining Inclusive Communities (was: on "meritocracy")

2019-03-30 Thread Shane Curcuru
a wide variety of sources; I encourage you to > listen to the full recording and read my slides before passing > judgement. For the benefit of list readers: https://speakerdeck.com/wohali/building-and-sustaining-inclusive-communities?slide=10 https://feathercast.apache.org/2018/09/29/building-a