Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

In article <5effe248-6364-20f3-5ead-c5bb6a2a3...@tana.it> you write: >Can we say that? > >Would such kind of normative help to improve filters and trust indicators? No. As Dave has repeatedly reminded us, when we guess about user interface features, we invariably guess wrong. Please can we stop t

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On Wed 06/Jan/2021 13:52:33 +0100 Laura Atkins wrote: On 6 Jan 2021, at 12:29, Douglas Foster wrote: I am no fan of header rewrite, but... If you are going to talk about "Trust Indicators", we need to define terms, which has not been done. Here are my definitions: - The From header is an I

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

A previous attempt at this reply was sent prematurely. Sorry about that. I said: Forwarding hides information that the email filter needs to make a correct decision. Header rewrite hides the problem, but does not solve it. When we get the automation right, predicting user behavior will not be

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On this topic: Forwarding hides information that the email filter needs to make a correct decision. Header rewrite hides the problem, but does not solve it. When we get the automation right, predicting user behavior will not be necessary. You’re going to need to provide evidence this is the

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

I don't know how ESPs and From Rewrite ended up in the same sentence. ESPs do not need From rewrite because they can do DKIM signing.The incentives are all against them using or allowing From rewrite. Taking business from criminal clients does not include allowing one client to impersonate an

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

In article you write: >The header rewriting being proposed - that is header rewriting by the ESP so >that the messages that >go through their system are rewritten to point to the ESP and not the author >of the message - means >that the identity assertion is disconnected from the context of a mes

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On 1/6/21 7:20 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: On 6 Jan 2021, at 15:14, Michael Thomas > wrote: On 1/6/21 4:52 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: Most users may know who constantcontact are or mailchimp because they advertise widely. Some might have heard of GoDaddy but do you know w

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

> On 6 Jan 2021, at 15:14, Michael Thomas wrote: > > > On 1/6/21 4:52 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: >> >> Most users may know who constantcontact are or mailchimp because they >> advertise widely. Some might have heard of GoDaddy but do you know what the >> company name of the GoDaddy ESP is? I d

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On 1/6/21 4:52 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: Most users may know who constantcontact are or mailchimp because they advertise widely. Some might have heard of GoDaddy but do you know what the company name of the GoDaddy ESP is? I don’t off the top of my head. An extremely dubious assertion. Sourc

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On 1/6/21 2:10 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: 2. A single study is unlikely to be definitive about much of anything. Absolutely true. Anyone relying on a single piece of evidence to prove their point is wrong. I am absolutely sure there is a bigger body of research out there and more data. In fact

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

On 1/6/2021 2:10 AM, Laura Atkins wrote: When I first came back and saw the From rewriting I was very confused by what it was until I figured out what was going on. You think you are representative of end users? Try again. I think he’s representative of one kind of enduser. Each of us is,

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

> On 6 Jan 2021, at 12:29, Douglas Foster > wrote: > > I am no fan of header rewrite, but... > > If you are going to talk about "Trust Indicators", we need to define terms, > which has not been done. Here are my definitions: > - The From header is an Identity Assertion. > - DMARC is an Ide

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

I am no fan of header rewrite, but... If you are going to talk about "Trust Indicators", we need to define terms, which has not been done. Here are my definitions: - The From header is an Identity Assertion. - DMARC is an Identity Verification technique. - A text message saying, "This message ve

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Header Rewriting

Changed the subject line because this has nothing to do with failure reports. > On 5 Jan 2021, at 20:04, Dave Crocker wrote: > > On 1/5/2021 11:34 AM, Michael Thomas wrote: >> On 1/5/21 11:22 AM, Dave Crocker wrote: >>> From: header field rewriting demonstrates that DMARC is, indeed, trivial t